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DHS: U.S. Seizes Another Oil Tanker Off Venezuela; Trump DOJ Releases Heavily Redacted Epstein Files; Interview With Rep. Raja Krishnamoorthi (D-IL); Still Unclear Who Piloted Private Jet That Crashed In North Carolina; Source: Epstein Survivor Jess Michaels On DOJ Release Of Files; Trump DOJ Releases Heavily Redacted Epstein Files; Trump Admin. Moves To Ban Transgender Care For Minors; House Bill Blocks Using Medicaid For Transgender Care Of Minors; Pope Leo Sidelines NY's Powerful Cardinal Timothy Dolan; Pope Leo Taps Relatively Unknown Chicago Missionary To Lead NY. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired December 20, 2025 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[18:00:00]

ERICA HILL, CNN HOST: Top of the hour here in the CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Erica Hill in New York. Jessica Dean has the night off.

New tonight, the Trump administration ratcheting up pressure on Venezuela's leader, Nicolas Maduro. Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem posting this video a short time ago. She says it shows the U.S. seizing another oil tanker off the coast of Venezuela.

The move, of course, comes after President Trump this week announced a "total blockade" of sanctioned oil tankers going in and out of Venezuela.

CNN contributor, Stefano Pozzebon is in Caracas, CNN senior White House reporter, Kevin Liptak is with us as well.

Kevin, first to you, what do we know in terms of the development here and the Trump administration's overall thinking when it comes to Venezuela, based on what we saw from that video posted?

KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Right. And what Kristi Noem said is that this was a pre-dawn operation. I'm told it occurred in the international waters off of Venezuela, and that this was a tanker carrying Venezuelan oil, which should sound familiar. It was only 10 days ago that the U.S. seized the vessel, called The Skipper, also carrying Venezuelan oil, also headed towards Asia.

And of course, it is part of this pressure campaign that the Trump administration has been mounting on Caracas. You've seen them target those alleged drug boats in the Caribbean Sea. You've seen a massive buildup of military muscle in the region, and now you see the administration really targeting the dictator, Nicolas Maduro's economic lifeline, the oil industry really going after what has helped him maintain that grip on power.

President Trump has announced what he calls a total and complete blockade of sanctioned vessels going in or out of Venezuela. What is interesting in the vessel that was seized today is that, according to a U.S. official, it is not covered by U.S. sanctions at the moment, which I think gives you a sense of just how intently the administration is trying to target that essential industry.

Now, I am told that this vessel was flying under the Panamanian flag and that the crew aboard did not contest the U.S.' forces attempts to intercede it, but certainly ramping up the pressure and escalation of pressure. Of course, what President Trump has said is that the next step will be strikes on land. He has been saying that for the last several weeks or so, but so far, stopping short of giving the final order -- Erica.

HILL: Yes, absolutely. So meantime, Stefano, how is this being received in Venezuela?

STEFANO POZZEBON, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, the reaction to this new seizure has been fast and quick because really, Erica, this is a game changer. We reported last week with the seizure of the first tanker, The Skipper as Kevin was saying that these can really block the lifeline, the economic lifeline of Maduro's government.

And that's why today, in the early hours, soon after the seizure, we did hear two statements which is interesting, I think to analyze, two statements from the Venezuelan government. The first one talked of a phone call with Iran. Another one of the countries that has been purchasing Venezuelan oil, despite the sanctions.

We know that The Skipper, for example, was destined to go to Iran, the one that was seized last week, they said in a short statement, Iran and Venezuela stayed together to face up the piracy and the international terrorism that the United States are imposing on these shores.

Once again, a very strongly worded statement talking directly of piracy and violations of the Article II of the United Nations Charter.

But the second statement, I found it even more interesting, Erica, saying coming out of the oil industry here, the oil company, PDVSA, which is the public oil company that is responsible for drilling the oil here in Venezuela, saying that the country is closing 2025 at a pace of 1,200,000 barrels of oil, crude, drilled and extracted every day, that I think it is important because while we hear from the Maduro government, the fact that they are standing up to this pressure, we are also hearing that they would be very happy to sit down with Donald Trump and discuss business.

And that's why I think that statement from the public oil company aims to tell Trump that if he wanted to sit down and purchase Venezuelan oil himself, he is more than welcome to do it -- Erica.

HILL: We will see if that will happen.

Stefano, Kevin, appreciate it. Thank you both.

Turning now to developments in the release of the Epstein files, CNN is today reporting an image with a photo of President Trump, appears to now have been removed from the DOJ's Epstein library online. So this was one of the very few references to Donald Trump in the trove of heavily redacted files that went up online yesterday, and some this morning.

CNN's Evan Perez has more now on what we have learned so far from that release.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Hundreds of thousands of pages of documents from the Justice Department's investigation of sex predator, Jeffrey Epstein, more than 200 Justice Department lawyers spending weeks reviewing them, and the names of more than 1,200 victims and their relatives redacted.

The Justice Department says it at least partially complied with a deadline set by Congress to produce a trove of so-called Epstein files.

[18:05:10]

What's not in the files might be a bigger deal than what is in this massive trove posted on the Justice Department's website on Friday.

Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche sent a letter to Congress saying that there were several categories of documents that the department is withholding in addition to the sex abuse materials and the personal data on Epstein survivors, Blanche says that the Department is withholding material covered by various privileges, including deliberative process privilege, work product privilege, and attorney- client privilege.

Democrats are accusing the Department of violating the law. Here is Robert Garcia, the Ranking Democrat on the House Oversight Committee.

REP. ROBERT GARCIA (D-CA): This is absolutely breaking the law. I mean, they have not produced actually what they were required to do, which was all the files by today in a way that was searchable for the public and that is not what is the case.

What we have essentially is one, we have a group of documents that have already been released to the public, and so there could be even more than half the documents we are reviewing right now have already been released. That already does not count for new information.

Then we have what appears to be new, including some photos and other documents. Those are highly redacted and we don't really have any explanation as to why they've been redacted or what is actually there in those documents.

And so we have right now, what we are seeing is not transparency.

PEREZ: Blanche, in his letter says that the law passed by Congress last month, forcing the release of the Epstein documents, "does not include language expressly requiring the department to produce privileged materials." Now, Blanche also says that the Department is going to continue producing more documents in the coming weeks.

Evan Perez, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HILL: Also joining me this hour, Representative Raja Krishnamoorthi, Democrat from Illinois, who serves on the House Oversight Committee, which, of course, has been conducting its own investigation into the Epstein files.

Congressman, it is good to have you here tonight.

You know, Democrats on your Committee also flagging, right, which Evan was just touching on, but flagging this image, which seems to have been removed from the DOJ website. CNN has reached out to The White House, has reached out to the DOJ for clarification. We have not yet received it. I am curious if you've received an answer as to why this was apparently removed.

REP. RAJA KRISHNAMOORTHI (D-IL): No, I have not, and quite frankly, it is mystifying that it was removed after it was already released. But I guess it shouldn't be totally surprising because there are numerous categories of documents that haven't been produced that are required to be produced under the law.

For instance, investigative materials associated with the U.S. Attorneys' investigations, both in Florida and New York; also financial records. There were more than a billion dollars in transactions associated with this ghastly child sex trafficking ring, and those aren't produced.

And then, you know, I went on the website and just did my own searches, and I couldn't come up with anything when I type in, for instance, the word "Trump," even though we know there are numerous documents, you know, basically showing his name in them.

So this is an incomplete document production at best. It feels like a hoax, as the President might describe it.

HILL: As you know, Todd Blanche has said that there would be more coming, so this is not obviously the end of things. He also said that the DOJ would not show any favoritism and not withhold any material because, "there is the name Donald J. Trump or anybody else's name."

So knowing that there is still more to come, do you believe that you will in fact get all of those documents? And specifically, I know financial records are something that you have really wanted to see. Do you believe that all of that will ultimately be released?

KRISHNAMOORTHI: I hope so, but they should have been released by today. And so I think there is going to be a lot of public pressure for the release of those documents. There is incredible, intense interest in this particular issue. And here is why. I mean, there are more than a thousand victims of this child sex trafficking ring. They were girls at the time, and now they're middle aged women who have yet to be served justice.

And so I think them coming forward and to Congress and to us has kind of stiffened the resolve of Democrats and Republicans to get to the bottom of what's happened and to make sure that we get full transparency and accountability with regard to this sex trafficking ring.

HILL: There has been a good amount of concern, and rightfully so, about those survivors and making sure that they were protected in the release of these documents, that their families were protected. And yet, there are questions about how the lack of context could impact them with these documents, and also some of the inconsistencies in terms of redactions and protecting the identities of several men.

What do you see in that? And do you believe that there is any recourse?

[18:10:01]

KRISHNAMOORTHI: Well, I think that the best recourse right now is full transparency with regard to the Epstein files. I think that you can't get context unless you get the full production of documents, obviously, redacting for the sensitive information that the law requires to be redacted, but if you just get it in pieces and snippets, there is not context.

Now, the other thing that people should know is that the Epstein Estate is producing documents on a rolling basis, and so that adds a little more context as well. But at the end of the day you know, it looks like -- it is starting to look like a cover-up to me, Erica, I think that the Justice Department has access to tremendous amounts of information, and they're deliberately withholding it right now.

HILL: So you say this is starting to look like a cover up, as we've heard from Representative Ro Khanna, that he is considering potentially Articles of Impeachment. He was asked specifically about that by my colleague, Kaitlan Collins last night. I just want to play his answer.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. RO KHANNA (D-CA): Thomas Massie and I talked about it. He is working, as am I on drafting Articles of Impeachment and inherent contempt. We haven't decided whether to move it forward yet, but we are in the process of doing it.

My hope is she looks at this, she looks at the outrage that MAGA has. She looks at the disappointment that the survivors have, and she makes a decision over the next two weeks to actually start releasing these documents, because she may lose more Republicans in the House than she anticipates.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: Would you support those impeachment efforts? KRISHNAMOORTHI: Possibly. I hope that they actually produce the rest of these documents, and I think that -- one thing I agree with is that I think that The White House has kind of underestimated the intensity of kind of grassroots sentiment on this issue.

People want us to make sure that we get to the bottom of what's happened, and make sure that these victims have justice done for their cases, but also, very importantly, preventing this from ever happening again.

The fact that this has occurred, even, once in the past means that it could happen again and that the perpetrators are in our midst and that they could be doing harm as we speak.

HILL: Before I let you go, I do want to ask you about some more news of the day, which is this U.S. seizure of another sanctioned oil tanker off the coast of Venezuela.

I know there has been a push by a number of members of Congress, right, to be more actively engaged in some of these decisions on Oversight, understandably. What do you think the impact of this move is in the early hours this morning, when it comes to this pressure campaign that the President is looking to wage or is waging against Nicolas Maduro?

KRISHNAMOORTHI: My concern is that he is trying to provoke a war. That is my concern. I think, right now the President, in talking about potentially undertaking land strikes saying that this is actually about narcoterrorism when he just pardoned one of the biggest narcoterrorists ever who was convicted in an American court of law. I just -- I think it puts this all in context and that this is not about narcoterrorism, it seems to be about regime change.

It seems to be the prelude to war, and only the American people have the right to declare war. He must come to Congress. I oppose what he is doing right now.

HILL: Congressman Raja Krishnamoorthi, thank you for your time tonight.

KRISHNAMOORTHI: Thank you so much.

HILL: Still to come here: New evidence from the site of the crash that killed NASCAR driver, Greg Biffle and his family could help investigators piece together what went wrong. We will take a closer look at that new evidence.

Plus, some major moves in Washington this week designed to make it more difficult for trans youth to get health care.

And a shakeup in the Catholic Church, bringing some new leadership and possibly a new leadership style to one of the world's most powerful archdiocese.

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:18:44]

HILL: The National Transportation Safety Board is still unable to verify who was piloting the small private jet that crashed in North Carolina on Thursday. Seven people died in that crash, including former NASCAR driver, Greg Biffle, his wife, and their two children.

Investigators say the investigators with the NTSB say that they have recovered the cockpit voice recorder from the plane's wreckage, and the device itself is currently being analyzed at their headquarters in Washington, D.C.

CNN's Rafael Romo is joining us, and he has been following all these latest developments.

So questions about who was actually flying the plane, Rafael. What are we learning?

RAFAEL ROMO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, not a whole lot. There were some of the questions that originated on Thursday about who was piloting the airplane. They don't have an answer for that yet. There was also a question about whether someone had been able to send a message. They do have an answer for that now.

And Erica, according to the National Transportation Safety Board, the airplane was airborne for approximately ten minutes after taking off before turning back and crashing on a different runway from the one used for departing.

Former NASCAR driver, Greg Biffle, his wife Christina, and two children, Ryder and Emma, were among those killed, according to a statement from family members. The NTSB says three other passengers, in addition to Biffle and his family, were aboard the Cessna C-550 when it crashed in Statesville, North Carolina, on Thursday shortly after 10:15 in the morning.

[18:20:10]

In their latest update this morning, NTSB member, Michael Graham said the investigating team has done multiple things as they proceed with their investigation.

In the last few hours, the NTSB released a video pertaining to the investigation, showing, among other things, investigators analyzing the wreckage, recovering the cockpit voice recorder, taking pictures of an engine and the field of debris left after the crash.

There have also been reports regarding possible communication between a passenger on the airplane and someone on land, something Graham confirmed today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAEL GRAHAM, NTSB MEMBER: This morning, I can confirm that the NTSB is aware of one brief text from a passenger on board the aircraft to a family member that read, and I quote "Emergency Landing." Again, that's "Emergency Landing."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMO: But that's as much as we know, Erica, because Graham did not specify who sent the message or the person it was sent to, and also said that they have been unable to determine who was piloting the aircraft.

As for a possible cause, this is only the preliminary stages in the investigation, but NTSB board member Graham said the plane's altitude on approach was not optimal for landing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GRAHAM: Early indications from multiple sources indicate that the airplane was stable on approach, configured for landing, with the landing lights on, but the aircraft was coming in low.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMO: And the NTSB board member also said that information is consistent with the debris field, as well as points of impact for the crash on the airport runway.

The preliminary report on the crash, the NTSB board member said, will be published within 30 days. But the final report, Erica, may take anywhere from 12 to 18 months.

Now, back to you.

HILL: All right, really appreciate the update. Thank you.

Still ahead here, the DOJ has just released Epstein documents, prompting criticism and frustration. An attorney for several survivors calling this an example of how the system has failed them again.

I will speak with a survivor about what this release changes, if anything, ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:26:57]

HILL: Well, there is no shortage of politics at play when it comes to the DOJ's release of the Epstein files. But what is really important to remember about this story is what its actually about, and it is an incredibly disturbing pattern of abuse and trafficking of young girls and women by convicted sex offender, Jeffrey Epstein and his accomplice, Ghislaine Maxwell.

Now, for years, survivors have bravely been fighting for the release of these files. The pages of redactions, though the incomplete information and frankly, the lack of context sparking renewed frustration for many today.

Joining me now is survivor, Jess Michaels. Jess, really appreciate you taking the time to join us and offering your voice. I am just curious, today, in the wake of all of this and these files, how are you feeling tonight?

JESS MICHAELS, EPSTEIN SURVIVOR: Thank you for asking, Erica.

And thank you so much for having me on. We really appreciate when people give space for our experiences in in what is happening and not just the political side.

It is a whirlwind of emotions. I've had every end of the spectrum from feeling oddly and strangely validated that this is exactly what I expected. The delays, the redactions, the lack of information, so it is not what I didn't expect and at the same time, it is frustrating because it has lasted so long.

HILL: Given the fact that it has lasted so long, that you and so many of your fellow survivors have been fighting for so long, not just for the release, but frankly, also to have your voices heard and to have those voices heard above the politics of it all.

You know, we did hear from Todd Blanche that there would be more coming. There is still more ahead here.

Do you believe that it will all come out? And do you also believe that there will be a bit more context and explanation for these redactions?

MICHAELS: No, I think the law was clear that the deadline was 11:59 P.M., December 19th, and once that time frame was crossed, we've broken the law. They've broken the law.

The Department of Justice, the department that is supposed to protect us and provide law and order has broken the law and I see no dancing around that, no giving leeway because this has been going on in recent -- this recent year, for months since the administration decided to seal everything and close the investigation.

But for many of us, it has been going on for 30 years. I've been living with posttraumatic stress disorder since 1991.

HILL: When we stop and think about that, to your point, living with this since 1991, where we are now, the number of people who have joined the call for these documents, has that helped or hurt, in your view? I mean, I am sure there is help in getting the message out, but sometimes there is an ulterior motive.

MICHAELS: There is, and I think that that having the volume of American people behind us who are then reaching out to their representatives in Congress has been a huge inspiration for all of us.

We would not have gotten that act of Congress if there wasn't an unprecedented amount of communication with senators and representatives in Congress. It just -- it wouldn't have happened. It wouldn't have happened just with our voices. And so there is a hope in that. I think it is a real big miscalculation of this administration that they don't recognize that there are millions of sexual assault survivors, have gone through very similar situations and are really relating to our story because they had never gotten justice. So I think that's a big miscalculation, that there are a lot of Americans behind us.

[18:30:49]

HILL: And one of the FBI documents that was released on Friday was the 1996 complaint -- criminal description, rather, for criminal complaint against Epstein related to child pornography. Maria Farmer for years has said that she filed one of the very first complaints against Epstein in the '90s. Do you believe the FBI failed in 1996 at that time?

MICHAELS: One hundred percent. I believe the FBI failed then. And you can call it negligence at that time if -- if you want. At the very least it was -- at the very, very least in the most generous way it was negligence or incompetence. But then, when you get to 2006 and they still had that original complaint obviously because it was still in the files and to get -- to see that in 2006 when they're investigating him again and to then get a sweetheart deal, it's -- it's looking a lot like a cover up of a cover up of a crime.

HILL: You know, I've heard -- I've heard some survivors talk about how triggering the release of these files the release of pictures has been especially when they're not given a heads up. How -- how much context -- how much of a heads up were you given in this particular release? Do you feel that that message is getting through?

MICHAELS: No, we've had no communication with the Department of Justice. None. Zero. Not through our lawyers. Not in a public statement. We didn't know what was going to happen on Friday. We weren't -- we weren't told what to expect.

As I understand it, there was a letter to Congress of what to expect but there was nothing directed to survivors at all.

HILL: Jess Michaels, I appreciate your time tonight. I appreciate your courage, your bravery and your consistency in speaking up. And I know so many others do as well. Thank you.

MICHAELS: Thank you.

HILL: Still ahead here after the break, the Trump administration now looking to block transgender care for children. The new plan go after doctors and hospitals. How does that impact transgender Americans, transgender children, that's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:37:49]

HILL: Republicans on multiple fronts this week seeking to limit access to gender-affirming care for transgender youth. The GOP-controlled House passing two bills. One to block Medicaid funds from being used for gender-affirming care for minors. Another to criminalize the act of providing that care for doctors and hospitals. Now, they've yet to pass the Senate, but the Trump administration also announcing new proposed rules to ban hospitals from participating in Medicare and Medicaid if they provide gender-affirming care for people under 18.

Joining me now, transgender rights advocate Harleigh Walker.

Harleigh, I really appreciate you joining us tonight.

When you heard about these latest moves by the government, what did you make of this push to criminalize health care?

HARLEIGH WALKER, LGBTQ PLUS YOUTH ADVOCATE: You know, I'm going to be honest, Erica. I'm not surprised. We've seen moves by this administration and Republican state legislatures similar in the past. But I am very disappointed. I think that transgender people being a fraction of the population and this care being proven to be lifesaving and medically necessary. I think for Republicans to attack such a small community repeatedly whenever there's other issues such as, you know, affordability and rising health care costs, et cetera, I think it's very, very troubling to see Republicans continue these attacks.

HILL: You mentioned, you know, feeling attacked. Why -- why do you think the transgender community is such a focus in this moment?

WALKER: I think that, you know, Republican politicians see the transgender community as a way for them to, you know, easily get a cultural ideological divide on Democrats and divide Americans on such a small, sensitive issue to distract from other issues. Like I said previously, from rising health care costs, from, you know, the Epstein files that we're talking about just earlier, I think we're being used as a political scapegoat to further their agenda.

HILL: Health and human secretary -- Health and Human Services, rather, Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. weighed in. He said this is actually about health care. It's about protections. I want to play more of what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROBERT F. KENNEDY JR., HHS SECRETARY: Doctors assume a solemn obligation to protect children. Doctors across the country now provide needless and irreversible sex-rejecting procedures that violate their sacred Hippocratic oath by endangering the very lives that they are sworn to safeguard.

[18:40:09]

So-called gender affirming care has inflicted lasting physical and psychological damage on vulnerable young people. This is not medicine. It is malpractice.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: The American Academy of Pediatrics, I want to point out, pushed back on that, saying that the administration is failing to recognize the realities of pediatric care and also the needs of children and families.

When you hear the Secretary say this inflicts, quote, "lasting physical and psychological damage," is it your view that this care does, in fact, inflict lasting damage?

WALKER: I think it's the exact opposite. And I think what the secretary said is frankly laughable. Whenever you pass laws like the bills that were passed in the House, whenever you pass anti- transgender legislation in the state Senates, that's whenever you see a huge mental health toll on transgender Americans. That's when you see a rise in suicide rates. That's when you see these horrible mental health outcomes versus when transgender youth have access to this lifesaving care, you see better mental health. You see overall transgender youth being happier and healthier, et cetera.

So I think it's the exact opposite of the way the secretary is framing it.

HILL: I know you testified before the Senate Judiciary Committee in 2023. Do you feel that you were heard, that your voice was heard in that moment?

WALKER: I think, you know, I found it interesting that whenever I was testifying in front of the Senate Judiciary Committee, not a single Republican senator asked me a question. And I think that's really telling. I think that, you know, once Republicans are actually faced with trans people, once they have conversations with trans people, that's when they realize that we are humans and we deserve the same fundamental rights as everyone else. And I think they were scared to ask me any questions because they knew, you know, asking a trans kid a question about their health care was going to make them look bad.

And so, I think whenever you actually talk about the real people behind these issues, that's when they kind of scale back. And I think I was heard, but I think not to the same level of, you know, action or, you know, decisiveness or stopping prioritizing this kind of legislation like I should have been.

HILL: You are an advocate. You are speaking out. I know you actually, you know, had to leave the state where you grew up, which you love dearly because of access to care. CNN has spoken with other families, transgender families, who have raised concerns and talked about possibly even needing to leave the country, which sounds extreme, I think, to a lot of people. Is that something that you would ever consider? Do you feel that your access to care is in danger at this point?

WALKER: I think it's definitely in danger, and I think it's -- moving out of the country is something me and my family have already had conversations about as being a possibility. And, you know, I love my country. I've grown up here. I've lived here my whole life. You know, I've lived in Alabama my whole life. And whenever the state of Alabama passed, you know, the anti-trans legislation, I did have to move out of my state. But the thought of having to leave my entire country over, you know,

such a divisive issue that is, frankly, a non-issue is truly astounding to me. And I think it's a, you know, real problem many trans families are facing. And I think, you know, a lot of people don't have the ability to make that decision. And I don't even think it's a decision that I should even be able to have to consider. But it's something that I am considering. And if this legislation is passed and enacted, I will have to do.

HILL: Harleigh Walker, thank you for joining us tonight. We appreciate it.

WALKER: Thank you so much.

HILL: Still to come here, a new leader for one of the most powerful archdiocese in the world. Could that person actually change the direction of the Catholic Church? We'll take a closer look here in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:48:24]

HILL: New leadership for the Catholic Church in New York is raising some questions about a possible new direction after Pope Leo named a relatively unknown missionary from Illinois, Ronald Hicks, to lead the church in New York. And the New York Diocese is so powerful that Pope John Paul II once called the job, quote, "Archbishop of the Capital of the World." Many say this could also be the start of a whole new chapter for the Catholic Church in the United States.

Joining us now is Katie McGrady. She's the host of the Katie McGrady show on SiriusXM's "The Catholic Channel," which is operated by the Archdiocese of New York.

Katie, it's great to talk to you again. This is one of Pope Leo's first major appointments. It's been a bit of a hotly anticipated decision. The fact that he chose Ronald Hicks, what does it tell you about the direction that the pope is perhaps taking the church?

KATIE PREJEAN MCGRADY, SIRIUSXM'S CATHOLIC CHANNEL: I think it's full steam ahead. I mean, this is definitely an appointment of a younger man, 58, which, to be fair, just canonically, let's clarify, any bishop that retires is sidelined because he has to submit his resignation letter at 75 years old. And then, they get accepted at a certain point.

So Cardinal Dolan turns 76 on the day, actually, that Ronald Hicks will be installed. And so, this was kind of a end of the year decision, maybe had been in the works for some time. We don't exactly know the maneuvers and machinations over there. But it indicates that the Holy Father is ready to continue to see the Archdiocese of New York led by someone who can be bold, who can be very clear. I don't think anybody can hold a candle to Cardinal Dolan's gregariousness and his outgoingness. But Ron Hicks has already shown us to be a very kind man. He's already made a few jokes, which I think will, you know, make him very amenable to the press.

[18:50:05]

But also, he's very level-headed. And everybody that -- that talks about him says he's got a pastoral heart. He's a great listener. Sounds a little bit like Pope Leo. And I think he'll be great for the Archdiocese.

HILL: I have read a couple of things about the similarities between him and the pope. You know, Bishop Hicks, as I understand it, though, has largely avoided outspoken politics, which is maybe not surprising to some. But we're seeing what feels like a little bit of a shift. We think about Cardinal Dolan, so someone who's lived in New York for a long time and worked in TV news for a long time. I've spoken to Cardinal Dolan a number of times. He was always available, happy to come and chat, very approachable, also regularly known for champion conservative causes, would meet with politicians of both parties, but did pray at both of President Trump's inaugurations.

Do you expect, to your point about sort of the bold and gregarious nature of Cardinal Dolan, what do we expect from Bishop Hicks as he comes in?

MCGRADY: I think he'll make the office his own. If you look at the predecessors of Cardinal Dolan, they each kind of had their own particular focus. So, John -- Cardinal O'Connor founded a religious community, the Sisters of Life. Cardinal Egan started "The Catholic Channel," because he wanted to have this media outreach.

Cardinal Dolan very much recognized the high-profile nature of this moment, when the TV news and 24-hour news cycle is in front of everybody, we can use that to really talk about things that are important to the church. I think one of the things Ronald Hicks will show us, Archbishop (INAUDIBLE) Hicks had just recently written a letter back in Joliet called "Make." It came out in October, and it was all about making missionary disciples. It came from the Gospels' go and make disciples. He just released that, and he was very excited about it. He did multiple podcasts about it. He appeared on their YouTube channel.

So, I -- I suspect, and I should clarify, he will be my boss, but I suspect that he will talk about how we can go out and actually preach the good news. This is a missionary man. He spent time in El Salvador. I imagine that missionary spirit will guide him through the streets of New York, and I think that'll be a really good thing. I also think it's important. You said one of my favorite lines about New York, the capital diocese of the world.

Everybody kind of looks at New York. Every New Yorker thinks it's the center of the universe, and let's be real, it kind of is. So, this bishop will certainly have to learn how to -- how to navigate what everyone's going to want as opinion. Every president's going to want his presence. To be fair, also, Cardinal Dolan was scheduled to do the inauguration prayer regardless of who had won.

HILL: Yes. MCGRADY: Because the Archdiocese of New York has that -- that big -- that big grandeur. So, I think Hicks will find his footing and have that evangelization spirit.

HILL: At a news conference at St. Patrick's this week, Bishop Hicks said that he was proud of the Catholic bishop's recent statement rebuking the Trump administration's deportation campaign, saying the United States should be a, quote, "country that upholds human dignity, respect, treating each other well, and making sure that anything connected to those policies are also connected to due process." Is this a move toward becoming more political, do you think?

MCGRADY: So, the U.S. bishops, when they released that statement, they don't do that very often. They really only release a special statement like this that's written in consultation with the entire body of bishops and then voted upon when it's something serious like what we're seeing with the ICE deportations and the way that human dignity is in a lot of ways being cast aside.

The bishops overwhelmingly voted unanimously. So, I don't know if it's a political thing so much as a human dignity thing. And, yes, it happens to be in a political realm, but the bishops are going to speak up when human dignity is on the line. The last time they did this was during the HHS mandate stuff over a decade ago. So, I have a feeling the U.S. bishops are very bold when they know they have to be very clear on something that all Catholics are very aware of at this precise moment. And Hicks and Dolan and I believe the majority, if not all of the bishops, signed that statement and then posted a video that went viral. Many politicians were reposting the video saying the U.S. bishops, they're speaking in a unified voice.

So politics, that's not their game. Church teaching and the truth, absolutely.

HILL: Katie, good to talk to you as always. Thank you.

MCGRADY: Thanks for having me. Appreciate it.

HILL: A quick programming note for you. A new CNN film is helping you to maybe kick off the new year with a few laughs. How about joining comedy legend Chevy Chase? I have a preview for you. The candid interviews with his family, his friends, his co-stars and even the man himself. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm just trying to figure you out.

CHEVY CHASE: It's not going to be easy for you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chevy Chase is exciting and talented.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Very, very funny.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ready to say something sarcastic or edgy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I immediately fell in love with that bumbling idiot. The way we cut up tape.

CHEVY CHASE: It was a mistake to leave SNL.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chevy had massive movie star hits.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The forces pulling him were money power. When Hollywood wants you, they're pretty good at it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And then, of course, it went downhill from there.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Would you work with him again?

[18:55:06]

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you kidding me? It's Chevy Chase.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Chevy has a deep heart.

CHEVY CHASE: Hi, Peewees (ph).

BOY: Hi, Dad.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And that's the other part of the wild man.

CHEVY CHASE: I don't think a lot of people have the happiness I have. I am who I am. And I like who I am.

ANNOUNCER: "I'm Chevy Chase and You're Not," premieres New Year's Day at 8 on CNN and next day on the CNN app.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: Still to come here in the CNN NEWSROOM, conservatives clashing at the Turning Point USA conference over the future of MAGA.

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