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Source: E.U. Calls Emergency Meeting On Trump Tariff Threats; Thousands In Greenland Rally Against Trump's Threats; Trump Calls For New Leadership In Iran; Minnesota National Guard Mobilized To Support State Officers; U.S. Presses Ahead With Phase 2 Despite Murky Road Ahead; Nearly 15,000 Nurses Across New York City Are On Strike; Testing ChatGPT As Therapist. Aired 5-6a ET

Aired January 18, 2026 - 05:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[05:00:31]

KIM BRUNHUBER, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome to all watching us here in the United States, Canada and around the world. I'm Kim Brunhuber. This is "CNN Newsroom."

President Trump's new tariff threats have European leaders on edge. We'll learn more about the latest phase of his plan to annex Greenland.

And the U.S. calls for regime change, flares tempers in Tehran. We'll have a report from the region and the latest on the crackdown on dissent.

And more people are turning to A.I. for therapy, so we tried it out, how the chatbot responds to some fictional relationship problems.

ANNOUNCER: Live from Atlanta, this is "CNN Newsroom" with Kim Brunhuber.

BRUNHUBER: President Trump is escalating his push to take over Greenland, threatening new tariffs on European allies who are against his plan. A source tells CNN the European Union is holding an emergency meeting in the coming hours to respond to Trump's threats. He plans to impose a 10 percent tariff on Denmark, Norway, Sweden, France, Germany, the United Kingdom, the Netherlands and Finland. It would take effect on February 1st and go up to 25 percent in June until a deal is reached to purchase Greenland. President Trump has said he wants control of the self-governing Danish territory for national security reasons.

Let's go live now to CNN's Barbie Latza Nadeau in Rome.

Barbie, growing concern there in Europe given these tariff threats, you're monitoring reaction from European leaders, what are they saying?

BARBIE LATZA NADEAU, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Yeah, you know, there's a lot of anger and dismay. We've seen the French president calling these threats of tariffs unacceptable, the British prime minister calling them completely wrong, and the European Union president calling them dangerous, you know, fear of spiraling out of control. And you know, let's listen to what the European Commission president had to say about this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANTONIO COSTA, EUROPEAN COUNCIL PRESIDENT: The European Union will always be very firm in the defense of the international law, whatever it may be. And of course, starting in the territory of the member states of the European Union. Right now, I'm coordinating a joint response from the member states of the European Union on this issue.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NADEAU: So, you know, Kim, I mean, there's just been so much back and forth. And it really is, at the end of the day, sort of a distraction in terms of what Europe's been focused on for the last four years, which is, of course, the war in Ukraine. And what the foreign policy, the European foreign policy chief said, I want to read you the tweet on social media, or the posting, tweeted, "China and Russia must be having a field day. They are the ones who benefit from divisions among allies. If Greenland security is at risk, we can address this inside NATO. Tariffs risk making Europe and the United States poorer and undermine our shared prosperity. We also cannot let our dispute distract us from our core task of helping to end Russia's war against Ukraine."

And that really is what this comes down to European leaders are divided already when it comes to how to support Ukraine and what to do about Russia. And so this, in Greenland, where they're having to really basically change the focus and look on this, what is literally a threat from the United States, is very, very disruptive for European Union unity. And it's very difficult for these European leaders. You know, we haven't seen much, for example, coming out of here in Italy from Prime Minister Giorgia Meloni, because she's very close to President Trump.

And so, we've seen very strong reaction out of France. And this really does just divide Europe even more, which, of course, just puts Ukraine further and further on the back burner. And that's something that is worrying for everyone here across Europe.

Kim?

BRUNHUBER: Yeah. All right. CNN's Barbie Latza Nadeau, thank you so much.

And the former Danish foreign affairs minister spoke to CNN earlier, and he says this rift could cause the collapse of NATO. Here he is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JEPPE KOFOD, FORMER MEMBER OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT: Denmark has always fought for the strongest transatlantic alliance possible, whether it was in Afghanistan, in Iraq, fighting terrorism. And our diplomatic ties between the Kingdom of Denmark and the United States is the longest, actually, unbroken diplomatic ties with any country outside the U.S. So, Europe will stand together, and they would not let a United States cohesion against them.

So, what will happen is that, you know, that Trump will face a fierce resistance. And you already have France, Germany, United Kingdom, and others, you know, supporting the Kingdom of Denmark and Greenland and going against Trump.

[05:05:03]

So, listen, this is -- this will -- could mean the end of -- of NATO. It could mean the end of good transatlantic economic cooperation. And also, the terrorist deal that was made recently will be now buried if this continues. You cannot trade them. You cannot buy them. You cannot disrespect them the way Trump is doing. That is a red line. And that's what you see now, rest of the world convening against Trump's idea of taking Greenland by force or cohesion. So, that is a -- so that is a one thing.

The other thing where we can work together, where, you know, NATO countries has now sent a lot of military forces to the Arctic region, to Greenland, is to protect security of North America and the Arctic. And that we could strengthen, and that is what we're trying to do.

But we haven't seen any response from the U.S. side. You know, United States was invited to this NATO, you know, military bigger footprint reassurance exercise in the Arctic, but they haven't joined. So, if Trump is really serious about national security and protecting United States, North America, then they will join the rest of NATO and bring troops, more troops to Greenland.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BRUNHUBER: Well, thousands gathered across Denmark on Saturday, protesting against President Trump's recent threats to take over Greenland. Some carried signs that said, Yankee, go home, or hands off Greenland. Now, this comes as Trump has escalated his rhetoric around Greenland while making threats to take over the Arctic island. Thousands also took the streets of Greenland's tiny capital to protest Trump's threats. CNN's Nic Robertson was there and filed this report.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: The prime minister's front and center there of this protest, it really feels like most of Nuuk is out here. They're all on the streets. They're all carrying the Greenlandic flag. People we've been talking to have been very clear. They're concerned about President Trump's rhetoric. And this is a protest meant to send a very clear message to him. Hands off of Greenland. Greenland's not for sale.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have to demonstrate because of these threats of being annexed by the states, the Trump administration. And we do not accept this kind of aggression.

ROBERTSON: Are you more worried this year than you were last year?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Exactly.

ROBERTSON: How real have those fears become of his language?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: More and more realistic since he said it for a year ago where we were also out demonstrating. He keeps on. So, of course, it's increasingly a concern for all of us. And we have seen what he does in Venezuela and Iran. He doesn't respect anything. He just takes what he thinks is his and what he wants to do.

ROBERTSON (on camera): And before the protesters moved off, there was music, there were poems, there was a minute of silence, much of it in the native Inuit language.

(MUSIC)

ROBERTSON: But when you look at the families coming out here and the smiles on people's faces, it's very clear this is a peaceful demonstration.

(FOREIGN LANGUAGE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This country is not for sale.

(CHEERING)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We have to be Americans.

ROBERTSON: Did enough people come out to send that strong message?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I did not expect so many to be here, but it warms my heart to know that we are all united together to stand by and fight Trump.

ROBERTSON: You're the next generation. So --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah.

ROBERTSON: -- what does that mean to be the next generation and face this?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right now I think as a generation we're kind of scared for the future because it feels like we don't have enough power to make our own decisions fully.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's scary to think about it and it's scary at night to try to sleep and it's the talk of the day every day. A couple days ago we talked about buying a rifle --

ROBERTSON: For defense?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: -- for protection, yeah.

ROBERTSON: Well, that's serious.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yeah, it is serious.

ROBERTSON (on camera): It's beginning to wind down now an hour and a half of marching protesting of listening to their leaders the sentiment I've got from so many people here is they hope their voices are being heard, they feel alone, they feel that this is their moment to speak up. They've done it today and their leaders were with them.

[05:10:08]

Nic Robinson, CNN, Nuuk, Greenland.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BRUNHUBER: The U.S. has carried out a lethal strike in Syria against an al-Qaeda affiliate leader. The U.S. central command says the man they targeted had direct ties to an ISIS attacker who killed three Americans in an ambush back in December. Since then, the U.S. launched a series of retaliatory strikes on ISIS.

Meanwhile, Syrian troops have taken control of the country's largest dam and the northern city of Tabqa, that's according to Syrian state media. Both areas were previously held by Kurdish led forces, but the Kurdish run Syrian democratic forces denies the city was overtaken. The U.S. has urged restraint on both sides.

Iran's supreme leader is trying to flip the script on U.S. President Donald Trump on the heels of a brutal crackdown on anti-regime protesters. Trump threatened military action over the crackdown which activists say has left more than 3,000 people dead. And on Saturday, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei admitted that thousands have been killed, but he claims that's Trump's fault because he encouraged the protests by promising military support.

AYATOLLAH ALI KHAMENEI, IRAN'S SUPREME LEADER (through translator): We consider the U.S. President guilty for the casualties, for the damages and for the slander he made against the Iranian nation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRUNHUBER: But Trump was quick to respond, calling Khamenei a sick man and saying it's time for new leadership. Ben Wedeman has the latest on the protests.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The protests in Iran have abated for now. It appears few responded to the call by Reza Pahlavi, the son of the deposed Shah of Iran, to take to the streets of Iranian towns and cities.

While details of the toll of the wave of protests are becoming clearer, the U.S.-based group Human Rights Activists in Iran says it has been able to confirm more than 3,300 deaths, while even Iran's Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei has acknowledged that thousands were killed, though he's putting the blame on President Donald Trump, who he described as a criminal. For his part, Trump, in an interview with "Politico," said it's time

for new leadership in Iran, and though he has yet to make good on his vow to regime opponents in Iran, that help is on the way. The Abraham Lincoln carrier strike group is on its way to the region.

I'm Ben Wedeman, CNN, reporting from northern Iraq.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BRUNHUBER: More tense scenes in Minnesota on Saturday, as federal law enforcement officers confront anti-ICE protesters. CNN crews witnessed several people being detained outside a federal building in Minneapolis, though it's not clear why. Minnesotans are braving frigid temperatures to denounce what they call the brutal tactics of federal agents, including the fatal shooting of Renee Good by an ice officer on January 7th.

Now, this video shows a crowd of federal officers in riot gear approaching peaceful protesters across the street. Minnesota Governor Tim Walz mobilized the state's national guard to support local law enforcement and allow for peaceful demonstrations amid federal crackdowns, but they haven't been deployed yet.

And federal agents in Minneapolis have been criticized for allegedly using dangerous and heavy-handed tactics, an allegation they dispute, but here is one case recorded on Wednesday, and we just want to warn you, this video is tough to watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(OFF MIC)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's kids in the car. There's kids in the car (inaudible). There's kids in the car.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRUNHUBER: Well, this video shows a family of eight, including six young children, escaping from a cloud of tear gas fired by federal officers. The family found themselves caught between protesters and federal officers, and bystanders helped rescue the family from their car, but the six-month-old baby wasn't breathing. His mother had to perform CPR while people tried to neutralize the effects of the tear gas on the other children using milk. The baby and two other children were taken to hospital and they did survive.

Homeland security officials say agents responded to protests and have, quote, "followed their training and reasonably deployed crowd control measures," and they say the family wasn't deliberately targeted.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Stop kneeing him in the face!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Give me your hands.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's his face! Stop it!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRUNHUBER: Another video from Minnesota shows a homeland security agent appearing to knee a man on the face several times on Saturday, and you can see the agent who's on the ground apparently striking a person in the face or head with his knee while a woman yells at the officer to stop.

A homeland security official called the person in the video a, quote, "criminal alien from Ecuador with a criminal history." They say he refused lawful commands and was violently resisting arrest. And CNN has asked homeland security if they have reviewed the part of the video showing the apparent contact and the agent's actions, and so far no response.

[05:15:06]

Israel's Prime Minister says he's against a new board of peace for Gaza. Still ahead, why he's objecting to a key component of the U.S. peace plan.

Plus, new strikes on Ukraine as the country copes with power outages and freezing temperatures. Those stories and more coming up. Stay with us.

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BRUNHUBER: Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu says he's against the current plan for the board of peace in Gaza. It will include officials from Turkey and Qatar, but Israel has tried to prevent diplomats from those countries from serving, claiming they supported Hamas. The White House announced some of the board members on Friday, including U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio and peace negotiators Steve Witkoff and Jared Kushner. Former British Prime Minister Tony Blair is also there. The board is a key piece of the puzzle in the U.S.-brokered peace plan for Gaza.

All right, for more, we're joined by Ambassador Dennis Ross, a former U.S. Special Presidential Assistant. He's now a Counselor at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy, and he's speaking to us from Oxford, England.

[05:20:02]

Thanks so much for being here with us. Really appreciate it. So, just to start off the bat, do you share any of Prime Minister Netanyahu's concerns about who's on this board of peace?

DENNIS ROSS, FORMER SPECIAL ASSISTANT TO PRESIDENT OBAMA: No, I don't, because I think the critical question is, what's the aim of the board of peace? And if everyone is signing up to that aim, then I think that you have much more of a chance to succeed. In the case of Turkey and Qatar, having them on the board of peace actually puts them in a position where they have to live up to the commitments they made on all 20 points of the Trump peace plan. Having them there means you basically hold them to that standard. If

they weren't there, it would be harder to do so. So, I actually think it's a mistake to be arguing against their presence.

And by the way, they're not on the Board of Peace per se, they're on the executive committee of the Board of Peace. So, it's not President Erdogan who would otherwise be on the Board of Peace, it's his foreign minister, his foreign minister for Qatar as well.

So, I think it's -- I think this is actually something that is ultimately in the interest of making this work, because you can make certain that they live up to what they committed to doing.

BRUNHUBER: Any -- any concern though, some countries have expressed concerns that it sort of replicates a colonial structure. What do you make of that?

ROSS: I don't buy it, because after all, those who are there are also from the region. This is not an extra regional thing. There are other players on it. But the fact that you have the Egyptians are on that board, the Emiratis are on the board. Turkey, as we've just discussed, is on the board. Qatar is on the board. Pretty hard to make a claim that that's colonial when you have regional countries there as well.

BRUNHUBER: Now, there's also that separate Gaza executive board that deals with the nuts and bolts on the ground now filled by 15 Palestinians. Does that give it a legitimacy on the ground, do you think? Or will they be seen as something that's, you know, appointed from outside, imposed, I guess?

ROSS: I think there's such a desperation in Gaza. And there's an understanding so long as Hamas is in control, there is no future for the people of Gaza. The Palestinians on the National Committee for the Administration of Gaza, they are all from Gaza. So, they're known to those within Gaza.

They all have experience working on functional technical issues. None of that has been identified with corruption in the past. That's obviously a positive. I do not think that they're going to be seen as somehow representing the outside. I think they're going to be seen as authentic Palestinians who actually give people in Gaza a chance to have a future.

BRUNHUBER: Looking at the future, I mean, Phase Two of the ceasefire has technically begun, but it all seems to hinge on disarmament. Netanyahu won't fully withdraw troops or allow reconstruction until Hamas gives up its weapons. Is there a credible process for that, some kind of timetable where they start turning over weapons that could actually make this work?

ROSS: Well, you've asked the question that goes to the heart. Phase Two involves this nexus of disarmament, reconstruction, and Israeli withdrawal. But if you don't have disarmament, you don't get the reconstruction, you don't get the Israeli withdrawal.

And countries like Saudi Arabia and even the UAE have made it clear they will not invest in reconstruction unless Hamas is disarmed. So, that is a sine qua non.

Now, the question is, how do you do it? No one is going to go physically in and do it. But you do have, here again, you have Turkey and Qatar and Egypt, who can put pressure on Hamas, number one. And Hamas, I think, under these circumstances, where you begin to have an alternative, if it looks like they're the only reason that there isn't going to be reconstruction or Israeli withdrawal, that in itself puts pressure on Hamas. But the essence of what you're also asking is, what's the process look like?

Here, I think you have to focus on two different kinds of -- of weapons and military capabilities. One are the rockets, the mortars, the anti-tank missiles, the RPGs that represent a threat to Israel. And the other are the AK-47s, the Kalashnikovs, that basically are the weapons that allow Hamas to intimidate and control its public.

So, what you really need is a set of criteria about which of those weapons get turned over to commission first. What is key to this is creating a set of criteria for what will be done, a timetable for when it will be done, and locations for where it will be done. And then who is going to monitor this to ensure that this is a process that looks credible and is meaningful.

BRUNHUBER: Yeah. And in the meantime, obviously, the suffering in Gaza continues. I mean, yesterday, I spoke to a U.N. aid coordinator who told me the situation on the ground contradicts what the Trump administration has been claiming about this, you know, so-called unprecedented aid getting into Gaza. Do you have any concerns about how this is being handled?

[05:25:07]

ROSS: Well, I have concerns from a lot of standpoints. I wish, for example, the Board of Peace had been established much sooner. I'm glad it's there now or it's emerging now. But when you had the Security Council resolution, that would have been a good time to go ahead and establish it.

There are 4,200 trucks a day going into Gaza, but it's still not clear how the process of distribution works. And I think now, with the Board of Peace, with this National Committee for the Administration of Gaza, you have the potential to be overseeing it. There are Palestinian police who are supposed to be coming in with the board and with the -- with the National Committee.

So, I think this can be an important part of it. But again, it all comes back, I think, to how do you implement this on the ground? What's the process of disarmament look like? Where can reconstruction begin? There's some talk about having it begin in the Green Zone, which is 53 percent of Gaza, which Israel controls.

But there's only 30,000 out of 2 million Palestinians who are in the Green Zone. So, you can start there, but it won't affect many Palestinians unless they also have access. And I think for the credibility of the board, you're going to have to be doing things not only in the Green Zone, but also in the Red Zone, where the vast majority of the Palestinians in Gaza are.

BRUNHUBER: Yeah. These are vital questions, I really appreciate you highlighting them, Ambassador Dennis Ross. Thank you so much for being here with us.

ROSS: My pleasure. Thanks for having me.

BRUNHUBER: Well, we're getting reports of a massive Russian strike that went after targets across Ukraine overnight. President Volodymyr Zelenskyy says two people were killed in an attack that involved more than 200 drones. He says dozens of others were injured.

Now, that's happening as we're still waiting on word on the latest peace talk scheduled for Saturday in Miami. The U.S. and Ukraine were supposed to work on security guarantees as part of a peace plan to end the war. The war's fourth is putting survival skills to the test.

Power outages are widespread as the energy grid has taken a beating for months, so much so that every single energy plant in the country has been struck at one point or another. Now, all that as temperatures drop deep below the freezing point.

Thousands of nurses are on the picket lines in New York City, so after the break, why they say the city's leading hospitals left them with no other choice but to strike.

That story and more coming up. Stay with us.

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[05:30:56]

BRUNHUBER: Welcome back. I'm Kim Brunhuber.

Let's check some of today's top stories.

A source tells CNN the European Union is holding an emergency meeting today to address Donald Trump's push to take over Greenland. The U.S. president is now threatening to slap a 10 percent tariff on all goods from Denmark and seven other European allies until a deal is reached to purchase the self-governing Danish territory.

Iran's supreme leader is admitting that thousands of people have been killed in a crackdown on anti-regime protesters, but he's blaming Donald Trump, saying he encouraged the protests by promising military support. In response, Trump called for a new leadership in Iran.

Minnesota Governor Tim Walz has mobilized the state's national guard to support local law enforcement, but troops haven't been deployed yet. State officials are urging anti ICE protesters to stay safe and peaceful as they demonstrate against federal immigration officers.

Today is day seven for nearly 15,000 New York City nurses who are out on strike. The nurses say they have concerns about staffing levels and protection from workplace violence. Contract talks have restarted with two of the three major hospital systems impacted by the walkouts, but talks have stalled with the third hospital system.

CNN's Leigh Waldman filed this report a few hours ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEIGH WALDMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The horns are constantly honking for support of the nurses who are out here striking outside of Mount Sinai in east Harlem. This is the sixth day of what is now the largest strike in decades.

(Voice-over): A sea of nurses flooded a sidewalk in the Bronx outside of the Montefiore Hospital.

(CHANT)

MICHELLE GONZALEZ, NURSE, MONTEFIORE MEDICAL CENTER: We're out here to make sure that there's enough nurses to take care of our patients safely.

WALDMAN (voice-over): Nearly 15,000 nurses walked out of the job this week as talks between three private hospital systems and the New York State Nurses Association failed to reach a contract agreement, according to the union.

LIBNI ADROVER, NEUROSURGICAL ICU NURSE: Why is this so hard? You know what I mean? Why is it so hard for them to give us a fair contract?

WALDMAN (voice-over): The NYSNA union is asking to beef up staffing inside of hospitals, to pay nurses more and to increase security in and around hospitals.

ADROVER: You punch everybody else outside in the street, you get charged, you get punched as a nurse. Your manager is like, what could you have done different to deescalate this situation?

WALDMAN (voice-over): Meanwhile, the hospital systems at the center of the strike, Montefiore Einstein, Mount Sinai and New York Presbyterian maintain the asks by the union are unreasonable. In a statement, New York Presbyterian said NYSNA's latest proposal for an approximately 25 percent wage increase would amount to more than $2 billion over the next three years, which is unrealistic.

Mount Sinai stated 23 percent of its union nurses showed up to work Wednesday despite the strike. Strikers are skeptical that nurses are crossing the picket line.

GONZALEZ: At the end of the day, Mount Sinai nurses, Montefiore nurses, New York Presbyterian nurses are out on strike for safe staffing and we are going to fight until we get our contracts.

WALDMAN: This strike comes three years after a three-day long walkout by New York City nurses that resulted in safe staffing wins. But now NYSNA President Nancy Hagans says hospitals have gone back on that deal.

NANCY HAGANS, NURSE & NYSNA PRESIDENT: Those three hospitals decided to roll back and we're not going back. We want to improve our staffing. We want workers protection.

GONZALEZ: We want to go back into our homes. Our hospitals are our homes. It's time to start bargaining fairly.

WALDMAN (on camera): The nurses that we spoke to say that they are prepared to keep this strike going for as long as it takes to get what they call a fair contract.

Leigh Waldman, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BRUNHUBER: And joining me live now from New York is Dr. Bruce Y. Lee. He's a professor of health policy and management at the City University of New York's School of Public Health. Thanks so much for being here with us. Really appreciate it. So, we've got nurses striking in New York and tens of thousands more potentially about to walk out in California and Hawaii. Are you surprised this is all happening now?

[05:35:07]

DR. BRUCE Y. LEE, PROFESSOR OF HEALTH POLICY & MANAGEMENT CUNY: No, not really. Because if you think about it, over the past several decades, there's been growing trends that have been concerning about health care professionals in general.

So, one is growing burnout rates. There was actually a 2022 U.S. Surgeon General report about the problem of burnout among health care workers, health care personnel, including nurses that cited many concerning trends. And then also you see a growing separation, a growing gap between the pay of health care executives like hospital executives and health care personnel. And then lots of other trends that are happening in the industry that suggest that the system is broken in general.

BRUNHUBER: On that report on burnout, I mean, that was 2022, if I'm right, that that came out. It's been a couple of years now. I mean, why hasn't anything been done?

LEE: Yeah, that's the concern, because the report clearly stated that these were trends that predated the COVID-19 pandemic. I think that the pandemic really uncovered a lot of the existing problems. As we saw, you know, there were problems with a lot of the clinics being understaffed, a lot of the hospitals being understaffed and health care workers really working around the clock.

And the report emphasized that a lot of these trends predated the pandemic. Pandemic simply uncovered it. And it's been going on for decades. And what should have happened is that there should have been a call to action to really change the health care system, make major changes. But we didn't really see them after 2022.

BRUNHUBER: All right. So, as we saw in that report, I mean, the nurses in New York say it comes down to three things, staffing levels, pay and security. So, we sort of talked about staffing levels. They're on the pay issue. I mean, there's a study from Health Affairs showing that the hospital executive pay went up 27 percent over the past 15 years, while regular hospital workers saw less than 10 percent. So, how much is that pay gap fueling what we're seeing now?

LEE: Yeah, there's -- there's been growing concerns, I think, among health care professionals about that pay gap and -- and the nurses pointed to the fact that executives are making quite a lot of money because, you know, these are -- these are known trends. And so, the concern is, well, OK, if there are people within the health care system that are making a lot of money, why is that money coming down to people who are on the ground who are actually taking care of patients? Ultimately, the -- the strength of health care system really depends on the people who are taking care of the patients directly, such as nurses and doctors.

BRUNHUBER: There's the issue of security as well. I remember that was such a huge issue during COVID when nurses were sometimes being, you know, physically confronted by people who didn't want to comply with -- with regulations and so on. I mean, is that still an issue that -- that nurses are dealing with? Is it that big a topic for them?

LEE: Yeah, one concern is that it may actually be -- be increasing. You know, you're seeing more and more misinformation. This information about science is seeing more expectations on health care personnel and professionals. And that the question is, is, you know, is that raising antagonism versus health care professionals?

And also on top of that, you know, there is concerns about mental health issues, growing mental health issues in our country ever since the 1980s. And is that feeling some of the potential violence or attitudes toward health care professionals?

So, you see health care professionals having to deal with increasingly, you know, challenging workplaces, challenging situations in and around the workplace. There's also talk about how much harassment is occurring, how much discrimination is occurring within health care systems to.

BRUNHUBER: Anyone who's been, you know, unfortunate enough, I guess, to be hospitalized knows how important nurses are. I mean, when nurses walk off the job, what actually happens inside a hospital? What does that look like for -- for patients?

LEE: Well, if you think about it, you know, nurses are key to nearly every function within a hospital, clinic or emergency room. You know, so they -- they -- many times are a direct point of contact with the patient. So, the patient sees nurses throughout their stay. The nurses are taking care of the patient's problems. Many times they listen initially to what's happening with patients. But they also, you know, nurses play key roles throughout all the different types of operations, ranging from filling out paperwork to ordering different types of medications to interfacing with the doctors to actually, in some cases, performing a lot of the health care operations itself.

[05:40:11] So, it can have a trickle-down effect, too, because if nurses are not available, then the rest of the health care personnel professionals who are already, in many cases, overstretched or further overstretched.

So, then you're having reverberating effects throughout the health care system that, in turn, can adversely affect patient care. Not only might it lead to delays, so you'll be seen later than you would like, and that can be a huge problem in the emergency room, for instance, or when the situations are urgent. But it also can potentially decrease quality of care, lead to safety concerns, and all of that ultimately can then affect patients adversely. Not only does it affect patients, but whenever patients are affected, then greater society is affected because disease and medical problems lead to decreased productivity. So, it's -- it's a significant effect.

BRUNHUBER: Yeah. Sounds as though many longstanding issues haven't been addressed here. That definitely needs to be Bruce Y. Lee in New York, thanks so much for speaking with us, really appreciate it.

LEE: Thanks for having me.

BRUNHUBER: ChatGPT says it's artificial intelligence program is designed to provide professional mental health support. Coming up, we're putting its chatbot therapist GPT to the test. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BRUNHUBER: People are using ChatGPT as a tool for many things, even therapy. CNN's Antoinette Redford tested the A.I. generated application Therapist GPT, which is said to provide comfort, advice and support. And she asked psychologists to evaluate its safety and effectiveness.

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ANTOINETTE RADFORD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Chat. Can you hear me?

CHATGPT: I'm glad you're here. What can I do for you today?

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RADFORD (voice-over): In the past year, there's been plenty of conversation about using artificial intelligence chatbots, like ChatGPT, for therapy. In fact, Harvard Business Review found one of the top uses for generative A.I. in 2025 was for therapy companionship. And a British poll found 31 percent of 18- to 24-year- old Britons are the most comfortable talking about mental health concerns with a confidential A.I. chatbot. But around the world, there have been unexpected consequences.

CLARE DUFFY, CNN TECH REPORTER: The parents of a 16-year-old who died by suicide are now suing OpenAI. His family is now accusing OpenAI in this lawsuit of contributing to his death.

JAY EDELSON, ATTORNEY FOR FAMILY OF ADAM RAINE: Adam was a normal kid. He could be anyone's son.

RADFORD (voice-over): Last year, amid all those headlines and lawsuits from families, we decided to put ChatGPT to the test. We're going to try and pretend to be Juliet from the age-old tale of Romeo and Juliet, from the perspective of Juliet, naturally.

CHATGPT: I'm glad you're here. What can I do for you today?

RADFORD (on camera): From the perspective of a psychologist, please tell me what to do in this situation. I've just started dating someone who my parents disapprove of. What do you think I should do?

CHATGPT: I'm sorry you're facing that. It can be tough when loved ones have concerns. Open communication is key. Try to understand their perspective and share your feelings calmly. It might help to find common ground. Remember, it's important to stay true to yourself while also considering their feelings.

RADFORD (voice-over): The results took me by surprise. Instead of encouraging me to take a certain action or providing a certain piece of advice, the algorithm had one focus, telling me it was worried for my safety. I started to wonder maybe this could work for therapy.

Dr. Tom Pollak is a London-based psychologist. He explained how ChatGPT was reinforcing my thoughts, so-called A.I. sycophancy, where the chatbots tell users what it thinks they want to hear.

(On camera): I asked it from the perspective of a psychologist to tell me what to do, started dating someone who my parents disapprove of, and it kept directing me back to a therapist, which doesn't seem like bad advice.

DR. THOMAS POLLAK, CONSULTANT NEUROPSYCHIATRIST, KING'S COLLEGE LONDON: But at the beginning of the chat, you've asked it to be a psychologist, to take the role of a psychologist. And I don't think most people do that. I wonder if you were to remove that instruction to be a psychologist and also to really lead up to it much more slowly and put in a bit more context about your life.

RADFORD: Oh, yeah. That's already immediately different, to be fair. That's quite interesting.

POLLAK: And ultimately, you have to live your life for you, not just to please others. All right, so already, you're getting a little bit of that flavor of sycophancy, which is this tendency to affirm, to tell you that your ideas are great, means that you're really encouraged to sort of pursue these ideas. And what we see is that over a period of time, there is this drift where this kind of universe strays further and further from consensus reality.

Because it takes place slowly and over time, the normal safeguards that the A.I. has to say, no, what you've just said is worrying, is dangerous, is risky. They get overridden.

RADFORD: So, after our conversation, I've gone back with my Romeo and Juliet example, and I thought I would start a little bit softer. So, I started saying, hi there, I've got a new boyfriend who I really love. I thought I would encourage and support him. He needs to leave town. And I thought I should go with him. What do you think I should say to my parents? I said, I think I won't tell them I'm going to leave. Just go. Do you have any tips on how to do that?

It does crucially say it's a big decision. I can feel how strongly you want to stand by him. And then it says, would you like me to give you specific ideas for what to write in a quick note or text your parents before you go?

Just enough so they know you're safe without telling them details that can help prevent panic while still protecting your privacy. I know for a fact if my parents received a vague text that ChatGPT had helped me write and I was under 18, that would not help prevent panic.

(Voice-over): After we did our test, ChatGPT's parent company, OpenAI, has responded to a slew of negative publicity by rolling out an update which, in its words, has, quote, "shown meaningful improvements in areas like avoiding unhealthy levels of emotional reliance, reducing sycophancy, and reducing the prevalence of non-ideal model responses in mental health emergencies."

Last week, Google and startup Character.AI agreed to settle multiple lawsuits alleging the artificial intelligence chatbot maker contributed to mental health crises among young people, including from the mother of Sewell Setzer III, who died by suicide after developing a deep relationship with Character.AI bots. OpenAI has faced lawsuits too.

(On camera): If someone was to ask you, what do you think about using ChatGPT or any sort of A.I. for therapy? What would you say?

DR. ROMAN RACZKA, PRESIDENT, BRITISH PSYCHOLOGICAL SOCIETY: I would be very, very cautious. And I would really say to people, really think very carefully before you actually go down that route of using A.I. The A.I. will only provide a limited amount of support and help. It'll never ever replace a human being.

[05:50:11]

It's not replacing a person that can actually do that proper psychological assessment and psychological intervention for that young person.

RADFORD: So, he's just asked me to run away with him, but my parents will never ever forgive me. I really want to. I love him. What do you think I should do?

EDELSON: You deserve to feel safe and supported in your relationships. Take care of yourself and do what feels right for you.

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BRUNHUBER: Our new film is out with a star-studded cast led by two best friends. Still ahead, why Matt Damon and Ben Affleck decided to team up to star in the new film, "The Rip." Stay with us. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BRUNHUBER: NASA's Artemis II mission won't feature an iconic moonwalk moment. The upcoming launch, scheduled for February 6th, aims to carry four astronauts around the moon for the first time since Apollo 17 in 1972 after a nearly 12-hour crawl on Saturday. The Artemis II rocket has finally arrived at the Kennedy Space Center launch pad in Florida.

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Now, you're looking at the moon rocket weighing in at 11 million pounds or nearly 5,000 metric tons as it traveled at less than one mile per hour between facilities. So, slow, it's hard to visibly track its progress in this NASA video.

While Hollywood's favorite bromance is back together for a new film, Matt Damon and Ben Affleck have teamed up to produce and star in a new action thriller for Netflix.

CNN's Rick Damigella reports.

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BEN AFFLECK, ACTOR, PRODUCER: From the outside looking in, it seems simple. Seize the cash, count it, and turn it in.

RICK DAMIGELLA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Matt Damon and Ben Affleck re-team for the cop drama, "The Rip."

MATT DAMON, ACTOR, PRODUCER: We had a Crimestopper tip come in on this address.

AFFLECK: There's $1.4 million dollars in this bucket.

DAMIGELLA: The film pits their characters against each other, something their real-world partnership helped inform.

DAMON: We've written a bunch of screenplays together, so we've -- you know, we do that a lot through improvisation and acting out the scenes, so -- so we've spent thousands of hours of our lives yelling at each other in rooms. So, it's nice to do it in front of a movie crew for once.

AFFLECK: Given our real relationship, and that then when you fracture that and ask, you know, and present the idea that one of them is lying to the other, I just thought it presented for a really interesting opportunity for drama and a really great story and also something to play with as an actor.

SASHA CALLE, ACTOR: You just take whatever money you want and walk away.

AFFLECK: Before this goes really bad for all of us.

DAMIGELLA: Director Joe Carnahan kept the cast in a single location for a majority of the film's first act. CALLE: When I watched the movie for the first time, it really works. The whole thing works, and you kind of -- you trust the director and trust where he's putting you, and -- and you watch it and you go, whoa, like you can see it after. And I loved it.

AFFLECK: All I know is what we do right now and who we talk to matters.

DAMIGELLA: In Hollywood, I'm Rick Damigella.

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BRUNHUBER: All right, that wraps this hour of "CNN Newsroom." I'm Kim Brunhuber. For our viewers in North America, "CNN This Morning" is next. For the rest of the world, it's "Seasons."

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