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Outrage in Minneapolis After Man Killed by Federal Agents; Key Questions Unanswered in Alex Pretti Shooting in Minneapolis; Massive U.S. Winter Storm Brings Ice, Snow, and Bitter Cold; New York Battling Freezing Temps Amid Winter Storm; Gun Rights Groups Concerned Over Minnesota Shooting; Interview with Representative Pete Sessions (R- TX). Aired 11p-12a ET

Aired January 25, 2026 - 23:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[23:02:13]

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Breaking News.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, and welcome to our viewers joining us in the U.S. and all around the world. I'm Pamela Brown.

And we are tracking two major stories this hour. The first, a massive winter storm now pushing across the U.S. East Coast after dropping heavy snow and ice across a large part of the U.S. Brutal cold is pushing in with nearly 900,000 customers without power. Travel snarled on the road and Sunday is marking the worst day for flight cancellations since the pandemic.

Also, outrage is growing in Minnesota after a federal immigration agent shot and killed Alex Pretti, a U.S. citizen. The death of the 37-year-old, who was an ICU nurse at the V.A., and the false narrative from top Homeland Security officials and others in the administration that is directly contradicted by video evidence, is fueling new protests and calls for ICE to get out of the state.

Crowds of anti-ICE protesters are braving the frigid temperatures in Minneapolis. As you see right here, they are marching through the city with signs reading, "It was murder" and "Stop killing our neighbor." They're outraged by Alex Pretti's death and by the way federal officials are leaving him -- labeling him a domestic terrorist, just as they did with another U.S. citizen that was shot and killed by ICE, Renee Good.

The Department of Homeland Security claims federal agents fired out of self-defense. And they alleged, without providing evidence, that Pretti, quote, "brandished a firearm and attacked officers." Minneapolis officials say Pretti was a registered and lawful gun owner. And crucially, his death was captured on cell phone video by several witnesses. And at no point in any video reviewed by CNN is Pretti seen wielding a weapon.

This next video shows one angle of the deadly encounter, and a warning for you, it is graphic and it is disturbing. It shows Pretti in a baseball hat, moving between an agent and a woman federal officers had shoved onto the ground. Pretti is sprayed with a chemical irritant and dragged down. Officers later opened fire at least 10 times.

Minnesota's governor says Pretti's killing and the federal government, quote, "sullying his name" is an inflection point in history.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. TIM WALZ (D), MINNESOTA: I've got a question for all of you. What side do you want to be on? This side of an all-powerful federal government that can kill, injure, menace and kidnap its citizens off the streets, or on the side of a nurse at the VA hospital who died bearing witness to such government?

We have got children in Minnesota hiding in their houses, afraid to go outside. Many of us grew up reading that story of Anne Frank. Somebody is going to write that children's story about Minnesota, and there's one person who can end this now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[23:05:09]

BROWN: CNN's Shimon Prokupecz brings us this report from Minneapolis.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME AND JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: People continue to gather here through the night despite the really frigid temperatures. A lot of candles being lit and flowers, people leaving notes in remembrance of Alex Pretti. Many of the people who have been coming here to this makeshift memorial, this is the site where it all happened. This is where he was killed.

And the community members have been gathering here because they want to have some unity. They want to get together and talk about what happened and how unhappy obviously they are about what's been happening here. The fear that they face. Of course, there's a lot of questions that are still remained and need to be answered by federal officials as to exactly what happened here.

You have a local law enforcement, which is completely unhappy with the federal authorities. The police chief here in Minneapolis speaking out, saying that some of what they're doing, their tactics, some of the other things that they're doing are unconstitutional. And many of the people here are just tired and they want to see this come to an end. And in the days ahead, there's going to be legal battles and other certainly political battles.

Everyone here right now is saying that the federal authorities need to go and things truly just need to de-escalate and calm down. People here just want to move on and get going with their lives and get back to the way things were.

Shimon Prokupecz, CNN, Minneapolis.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: And our thanks to Shimon there.

Earlier, I spoke with the Minnesota Secretary of State Steve Simon. I asked him what the Trump administration should do about the shooting to support Minnesotans. Here's what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVE SIMON, MINNESOTA SECRETARY OF STATE: Well, one is to let state and local folks from Minnesota, in the city of Minneapolis, in on the investigation. That's what typically happens. And there's been a long and successful history of that kind of collaboration between our U.S. attorney's office and local law enforcement. For whatever reason, during this ICE surge that has been severed, completely severed when it comes to investigations of this kind.

So reinstate the kind of cooperation that we've always enjoyed where there can be joint investigations. That's one thing. Another thing is on the federal level to make sure that it really is on the up and up. It really is an independent investigation where all the facts can come in and people can assess wrongdoing and we can get a straight answer out of the federal government, and something that the public deserves. I think those are two things that we can start with.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: And the videos taken by residents Saturday as Pretti was shot paint a very different picture of what happened than the explanation given by Homeland Security.

CNN's Gianna Toboni walks us through the events that unfolded.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GIANNA TOBONI, CNN SENIOR VIDEO PRODUCER (voice-over): Federal immigration officers fatally shot a man Saturday in Minneapolis. He was an ICU nurse who worked at a local Veteran Affairs Hospital. Another controversial killing by U.S. immigration agents and the second U.S. citizen killed this month.

CNN analyzed cell phone footage from multiple angles. Taken together, they appear at odds with the Department of Homeland Security's initial claims about the lead up to officers firing on Alex Pretti. Around 9:00 a.m. Central, video captures two people approaching a federal immigration officer in front of an unidentified vehicle. The sound of whistles is blaring in the background.

Alex Pretti enters the frame here. He's filming an officer interacting with protesters and waving a car through. Fifteen seconds later, Pretti yells --

ALEX PRETTI, SHOT BY ICE AGENTS: Do not push them into the traffic.

TOBONI: In their statement, DHS said that an individual approached officers with, quote, "a nine-millimeter semi-automatic handgun." This video seems to show officers approaching Pretti instead of the other way around. We'll see later that Pretti does appear to have had a gun in his waistband, but this video shows he didn't have a gun in his hand, only a phone.

Video from this white car shows an up close angle of a federal immigration officer pushing one protester, then three seconds later, he pushes Pretti. And then, as the camera comes into focus, you see the same federal officer push a third protester with the orange backpack. Pretti raises his hand and turns away just as the officer sprays him with a chemical irritant. You see Pretti and the other protester trying to help the person with the orange backpack.

You can see here an officer pulling Pretti off of this person. Three more officers join and then two more. Pretti is on the ground under them. One officer in a tan beanie can be seen repeatedly striking Pretti's head with a metal can. You can see an officer in a gray jacket walk into the frame. There isn't a gun in his hand. Seconds later, officers shout --

[23:10:03]

The officer removes the gun from Pretti's belt. The officer steps away from the scene, carrying a firearm seen here in his right hand. Then gunfire.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The (EXPLETIVE DELETED) you do this?

TOBONI: At least 10 shots rang out. We looked back at the scene from different angles and slowed down the footage. This officer wearing a black beanie can be seen drawing his firearm and pointing it in Pretti's direction. We can't see his gun when the first shot is fired, but we can see that this officer fired the second shot.

In this angle, you see a second officer also had his gun drawn, and here he's pointing his weapon at Pretti as we hear gunshots, though it isn't clear if he's the one firing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What the (EXPLETIVE DELETED)? Did they (EXPLETIVE DELETED) kill that guy?

TOBONI: Pretti collapses onto the ground as the officers scattered backwards from around him. The same agent in the black beanie from earlier can be seen firing five final shots as Pretti lies there motionless. Nobody approached his body for 24 seconds. When officers do return to Pretti, they appear to begin searching his body.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where's the gun?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, my god.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He had a gun.

TOBONI: Video shows that about a minute after Pretti collapsed, immigration officers asked for medical support.

When CNN asked DHS about the officer removing the gun before the shooting, DHS repeated their earlier statement, quote, "Officers attempted to disarm the suspect, but the armed suspect violently resisted." (END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[23:15:39]

BROWN: A private jet carrying eight people crashed on takeoff just a few hours ago in Bangor, Maine, and it comes amid the major winter storm thrashing the region. A source tells CNN the extent of injuries to those on board is not known at this time. Federal records show the plane is registered to a business in Houston. Minutes before the crash, controllers and pilots can be heard talking about low visibility and deicing, but it's not immediately clear who was talking to whom.

Earlier, I spoke with CNN transportation analyst Mary Schiavo, a former inspector general of the U.S. Department of Transportation, and she explained how planes deal with these icy conditions.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARY SCHIAVO, CNN TRANSPORTATION ANALYST: You have anti-ice and you have de-ice on some planes. And here they would have had their anti- ice on before ever taking off. But, you know, even on, as I mentioned, even on a jumbo jet weather can overcome that equipment. You literally can't. Every plane is rated for what kind of conditions they can fly in. Some can fly into known icing, some can't. But literally the systems on board can only do so much. It depends on how heavy that snow is coming down.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: Well, nearly 900,000 customers, meantime, across the mid- Atlantic and south remain without power after that massive winter storm swept through much of the U.S., dropping snow and ice. And right now, the system is making its way across the East Coast. Behind it, bitter cold temperatures. At least seven people have died as temperatures dropped to their coldest so far this winter. Layers of ice remain on the ground and on power lines.

And in Mississippi, the governor said there has been catastrophic damage to at least one power distribution line. This winter storm is causing dangerous road conditions across much of the country. State officials from Texas to the Carolinas are urging folks to stay home and off roads as accidents mount on those slick highways. And in North Carolina, Highway 51 right near Charlotte briefly closed after a water main break added additional ice to already frozen roads.

CNN's Dianne Gallagher has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DIANNA GALLAGHER, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The big concern in the Carolinas right now is whether this late band of freezing rain is going to cause the same kind of catastrophic damage that we've seen in other states like Mississippi and Tennessee. Earlier in the day all of this was kind of a slushy mess mixed with sleet and other snow. Now, since the freezing rain began in the late evening on Sunday, I can't even make foot prints anymore.

It's frozen over and you can see an example here of that where it melted and it's re-frozen over this drain. Now there are people out in Charlotte right now sort of trying to get ahead of things by doing some shoveling because they do want to avoid this freezing rain, sort of creating an icy glaze and sealing all of this in. That is what we've seen in other southern states like Mississippi and Tennessee.

They're in some places they have seen catastrophic ice totals that have brought down power poles and trees. Nashville alone, they were looking at more than 200,000 power outages. In Mississippi, the images don't look anything like the Deep South. The governor saying they haven't seen anything like this in 30 plus years, where entire communities appear to just be coated in ice.

Now, the governor of North Carolina telling people here that they are not out of the woods yet. And the major concern is this late freezing rain in addition with these prolonged cold temperatures and winds and what the effect might be on travel and power outages, because it's going to be very cold for the coming days. Duke Energy says that they have 18,000 workers in the Carolinas on standby, ready to roll once it is safe to try and get power back on if there are widespread outages. But they warn that if your power goes out, you might be without it for days on end.

Now, even though it is freezing here today, that did not stop people from showing up in North Carolina to give support to the Buddhist monks and their furry companion, Aloka the Peace Dog on day 92 of their Walk for Peace. They left Raleigh on an icy morning and still had plenty of support along their route before stopping for the night in North Carolina.

[23:20:03]

They intend to continue their walk, spreading compassion and peace even throughout this winter storm.

Dianne Gallagher, CNN. Back to you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: Our thanks to Dianne.

And joining us now is Jeff Brooks, a spokesperson for Duke Energy out of North Carolina.

I know you've been very busy. We just heard CNN's Dianne Gallagher's report that you have 18,000 workers, I believe, in the Carolinas on standby, ready to roll once it's safe. Have any of them been deployed yet? And what do you expect to be the biggest challenges?

JEFF BROOKS, SPOKESPERSON, DUKE ENERGY: Yes, it's been an interesting day. The freezing rain has been falling all day, so we've been accumulating outages throughout the afternoon and evening, even as our crews have been out working to restore them. We've had some opportunities to get these crews out. They're here from about 40 different states in Canada, come down to help our native crews here.

And I was just looking at the numbers before I came on. We were over 50,000 a little while ago. We dropped back down to about 45,000, 46,000. So we're seeing some progress and that's a good sign. The challenge is we've got about a thousand of these outages, locations all across western North Carolina and the upstate of South Carolina. Even portions of Central. So these are all going to have to be visited, worked and repaired. So they're going to have a busy day tomorrow.

BROWN: They certainly will. Tell us a little bit more about just how widespread these power outages are.

BROOKS: Well, you know, they started to really ramp up late this afternoon as a second wave of freezing rain came into the Carolinas. We've also got some heavy wind gusts, 30 to 40 mile per hour in the mountains and moving into the Piedmont. And so we've started to see those outages creep out of the mountains into the central part of the state. That's going to level off at some point.

But the thing with ice is, is it can actually continue to create outages even after the storm has passed. And we're not going to really get above freezing for any extended period much this week. So it's going to be a challenging workspace to be in. But we've got the resources and they're very eager to get out and work and get this power restored.

BROWN: And how do you plan to deal with those remote areas that can be really hard to get to when you have weather like this, and all the ice in the snow? And what is your message to people in those areas?

BROOKS: Well, first of all, we are here for you. We know you're there. We understand how frustrating and hard it is to be without power. It's very cold. So we take this job very seriously and importantly and we're going to get to you. We've brought in addition to these crews lots of innovative tools, tracked vehicles, drones, helicopters, all the things we need to be able to get these parts and equipment where it needs to go.

Some of these areas are the same places that were impacted in Helene, so they're no stranger to these types of storms. But, you know, we want to get out there as safely when we can do that, work safely and get power restored. And, you know, these are going to be small outages. You work five and six hours to get them back on. You move to the next one. It's the grind. And that's why it takes so many crews to be able to do this important, difficult work. But we are committed and we're going to get everybody back up.

BROWN: Well, we appreciate all that hard work.

Jeff Brooks, thank you so much.

BROOKS: Thank you.

BROWN: Well, New York City Mayor Zohran Mamdani is urging all residents to stay indoors amid this brutal winter weather. He says this is set to be the coldest period the city has seen in the last eight years. But as our Gloria Pazmino reports, not everyone is listening to officials.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GLORIA PAZMINO, CN CORRESPONDENT: Well, at least eight inches of snow inside Central Park so far. New York City Mayor Zohran Mamdani asking New Yorkers to stay out of the streets as much as possible throughout Sunday and going into Monday because there are thousands of city workers out there now trying to clear the snow and trying to keep the roadways clear.

Despite that, there were thousands of New Yorkers that were streaming into Central Park throughout the day today trying to take advantage of the conditions here, trying to enjoy and have fun. We saw everything from cardboard to snowboards to skis to sleds being used. A lot of very happy children here today, going for a sled in the hills of Central Park.

We spoke to many of them today. All of them said that they were enjoying the conditions despite the wind and despite the cold. Take a listen.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, we tried to get sleds and we couldn't find any, so we Googled how to sled without a sled. And these came up. My son thought the shallow ones would be best. And then we'll try the lid as well.

PAZMINO: OK. So do you go in the sled or -- how do you go?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. You go in, you sit in the sled and then.

PAZMINO: OK. And hope for the best.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sure.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We've never skied Central Park. I live, you know, like six blocks from here. I've always wanted to do it.

PAZMINO: How many times did you go down?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't know, like 20. Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. Feels like 10.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. Like a lot. Yes.

PAZMINO: Now tell me, like, did you have a technique? What was like --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sometimes we dove face first, sometimes we just went on our butt.

[23:25:01]

PAZMINO: Now New York City schools will be closed on Monday, but students will be learning remotely. New York City public libraries, cultural institutions also closed down on Monday. The mayor again reminding New Yorkers to try and stay off the streets as long as they possibly can so that cleanup efforts can so that cleanup efforts can get underway. That massive cleanup effort surely expected to continue in the early morning hours of Monday.

Gloria Pazmino, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: All right, thanks to Gloria.

And in the wake of the Alex Pretti shooting in Minneapolis, some of the Trump administration are now claiming it's illegal to carry a gun to a protest. But the NRA and other gun rights groups, they are pushing back against that argument. We're going to have more on that straight ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: And welcome back to our breaking coverage of the growing unrest in Minneapolis following the fatal shooting of Alex Pretti by Border Patrol agents. Despite the city's frigid weather, large crowds are out there and they're on the streets calling for the removal of federal agents from their communities.

This comes as the Trump administration doubles down on its aggressive immigration enforcement tactics. Top White House officials are still defending the officers' actions during the deadly encounter, and they're blaming Minnesota officials for escalating the crisis.

CNN anchor Anderson Cooper spoke with some demonstrators in Minneapolis on Sunday, and here's why they say they're marching in subfreezing temperatures.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: (INAUDIBLE) you out today?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I just want to be with the community. It's so moving. It's so beautiful to be a part of this. And I'm just so proud to be a part of this community, and I just want to be here in support people who can't --

[23:30:03]

COOPER: Does it make you feel better to be with others in this?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, I think it's time to stop living on social media. Stop -- just I think it's time to be here. It's time to show up.

COOPER: Well, thank you. I appreciate it. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you.

COOPER: You hear that a lot from people here. This idea of community. Everybody I have talked to today talks about that. They feel the community rising up. They feel the community voicing, and they feel that there's power in that community.

Excuse me. I'm with the CNN. Can I ask you some questions?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How you doing?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

COOPER: OK. Hey.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Hi.

COOPER: My name is Anderson.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

COOPER: OK. So why did you come out today?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because what's happening here is completely wrong. It's completely wrong. And it's -- we couldn't stomach ourselves if we stayed home.

COOPER: Yes. Do you feel -- does it help to come out and be with others?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, yes. It -- you know that you're not alone, and you know that other people are as mad as you are and are willing to fight. Being with people makes a huge difference.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: Well, the Border Patrol's commander-at-large is still blaming Alex Pretti for the deadly shooting, faulting him for approaching federal agents. During an interview with CNN, Gregory Bovino insists the officers who shot Pretti are the victims here, but repeatedly declined to provide evidence to back his claims.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GREG BOVINO, BORDER PATROL COMMANDER-AT-LARGE: The victim, the victims are the Border Patrol agents. I'm not blaming the Border Patrol agents. The victim are the Border Patrol agents. The suspect put himself in that situation. The victims are the Border Patrol agents there.

Follow directions of law enforcement, follow directions of law enforcement in an active crime scene. It was very evident he didn't want to do that. Very evident that the other individuals didn't want to do that. And, you know, it's too bad the consequences had to be paid because he injected himself into that crime scene.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: Joining us now live for more on what's happening in Minneapolis is the local reporter Casey Marble.

Casey, you've been covering these protests and community gatherings in recent weeks. Tell us what the mood has been like, especially now in the wake of Alex Pretti death.

CASEY MARBLE, VIDEO REPORTER, MINNEAPOLIS DAILY: Yes. Thank you for having me. I mean, after covering several protests over the past couple of months for, you know, school work and for the "Minnesota Daily," who I report for, there's been a very angry mood towards ICE. People are very upset about sort of what federal operations, how they're conducting federal operations in Minneapolis.

And yesterday felt I would say more sad than anything. A lot of that -- it still felt hopeful in the community that maybe there could be a good way out of this current situation we're in, but it feels like people, although they're hanging on and determined, are still feeling just sad and devastated over another loss of a community member, friend, ICU nurse. I mean, people were just a level of devastation that I hadn't seen as of yet in sort of this entire saga that's been going on in the Twin Cities.

BROWN: And the people you're speaking with in the wake of that, are they more determined to make their voices heard, or are they increasingly fearing for their own lives?

MARBLE: I mean, I think it's a little of both. People are more scared to come out after every incident, after every video that comes out of how we see federal agents act with the public and with protesters, people become more scared. They become more fearful of engaging with federal authorities, especially immigration officers. But I think that makes people more determined. Like I was at the vigil last night and I spoke with a man who was dropping off donations for people like water, food. And he had told me that he had been vocal online, but he had not actually come out to anything until he saw what happened to Alex Pretti earlier on Saturday.

And I think that's the sentiment that most of the city is feeling right now, that they are feeling another call to action at this point.

BROWN: So much of what we know about what's happening on the ground there is because these everyday citizens are documenting it all on video, on their phone. Alex Pretti had his phone out documenting what was going on. Tell us more about how important that has been and showing the country in the world about what's really going on in Minneapolis.

[23:35:03]

MARBLE: I mean, the way I like to think about it right now is everybody on the streets in the Twin Cities is pretty much a documentarian. Everybody, regardless of if you're a professional journalist or if you are just somebody going to shop at a store on a random afternoon, you have the opportunity to become somebody to document one of these incidents because everybody has a phone on them.

So, I mean, the point of yesterday's shooting was the fact that so many people were around filming allowed for so many different angles to piece together a much more intricate description of what happened yesterday. I mean, you saw different angles. There were people online and in group chats that I've seen that were talking about wanting certain videos that they saw of people in different videos, trying to get those angles to see how much closer they could get, what other perspectives they could see.

So the importance of these videos is that they are sort of helping get these forensics that the state authorities seem to have trouble with now that the federal authorities are not letting state agencies investigate on their own.

BROWN: All right, Casey Marble, thank you so much for coming on and just for all of your important work right now as a reporter there on the ground in Minneapolis. We appreciate it. And we'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: The scene in Minneapolis where federal agents shot and killed 37-year-old Alex Pretti is now a makeshift memorial with people laying flowers and lighting candles. Earlier, hundreds protested on the plaza across from city hall in single digit weather. They demanded that federal immigration agents leave the city after the second fatal shooting of a U.S. citizen in Minneapolis in just over two weeks.

Gun rights advocates are weighing in on the administration's claims about the shooting death of Alex Pretti. The Trump administration says that Pretti posed a threat when he scuffled with agents, although agents approached him per the videos we've seen.

[23:40:06]

Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem claims he brandished a weapon, but she hasn't provided any evidence of that. According to Minneapolis Police, Pretti was a lawful gun owner with a permit. But FBI director Kash Patel told FOX News it was illegal to bring it to that protest.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KASH PATEL, FBI DIRECTOR: You cannot bring a firearm loaded with multiple magazines to any sort of protest that you want. It's that simple. You don't have that right to break the law and incite violence.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: Border Patrol official Greg Bovino says Pretti's Second Amendment rights didn't apply in this shooting.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BOVINO: Good afternoon. My name is Greg Bovino -- that Second Amendment right but those rights don't -- those rights don't count when you riot and assault, delay, obstruct and impede law enforcement officers and most especially when you mean to do that beforehand.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: Bill Essayli, the top federal prosecutor in Los Angeles, posted on X, quote, "If you approach law enforcement with a gun, there is a high likelihood they will be legally justified in shooting you. Don't do it."

First of all, there is no evidence in any of the videos we've seen that Pretti approached law enforcement brandishing a gun. But in response to what he said, the NRA wrote that Essayli's comments are, quote, "dangerous and wrong," adding, quote, "Responsible public voices should be awaiting a full investigation, not making generalizations and demonizing law abiding citizens."

But let's back up for a second to what FBI director Kash Patel said about people not being permitted to bring a firearm loaded with multiple magazines to any sort of protest that they want. You might recall in 2020, Kyle Rittenhouse shot three people during protests over racial violence in Wisconsin, killing two of them. Kash Patel went on a podcast the following year and offered to help pay for Rittenhouse's legal fees if he wanted to file a defamation case. Rittenhouse was tried and acquitted back in November of 2021.

And then, of course, there was the attack against the Capitol on January 6th. That's where multiple individuals were convicted of carrying a loaded gun onto the U.S. Capitol grounds, interacting with police officers there, including Christopher Alberts and Lonnie Leroy Kaufman. Well, these individuals were pardoned by President Trump en masse on his second day in office, and the president had called them patriots on various occasions. Senior reporters out in the field have also seen Trump supporters carrying weapons, including automatic rifles for all to see at gatherings outside events like the RNC back in 2016.

So there's a lot to discuss here and to get an important perspective, I want to bring in Republican Representative Pete Sessions of Texas.

And I really appreciate you making the time and staying up late to come on the show. By now, I know you've seen all the video evidence, or at least some of the video evidence that's out there of the killing of Alex Pretti. From what you have seen, the evidence that you have seen, does it make any sense to you as to why Alex Pretti is now dead, Congressman?

REP. PETE SESSIONS (R-TX): It is a sad set of events. It is something that you and I and the world now have seen. That is a tense circumstance, a tense situation. It is one where evidently there's a report that before he left, his parents said, come on now, be careful. Everyone who is anywhere near this circumstance and in other places where ICE is, they need to keep their heads about themselves.

You have a concerted desire by people to thwart federal law enforcement. You have a concerted attempt to make sure that they are distracted, that they are literally taken advantage of by these people who yell and scream at them when they are attempting to do their job. Their job is to come and take people many times who are sexual offenders, been assaulted women, assaulted children, drug cartel members, the people who we have seen who have caused real problems in our cities.

So I would like to know that -- I would like to know that just like prior presidents have taken them out of the country. When they become criminal, it is a criminal behavior that must be stopped. And I'm glad we have law enforcement that's there to do that. The issue that we need to understand, and we've talked about it here in Waco, Texas, is that the police department needs to be on the scene and separating the two people.

[23:45:14]

I think it's in the best interest of the local citizens and the communities to have someone who will stand in between ICE and the protesters.

BROWN: OK. I just want to back up a little bit because no one is disputing or the issue at hand here is not the mission, targeted missions of taking those who are in the country illegally with criminal records off the streets. Right? I mean, that's been done for years. I've gone on ICE ride-alongs. The majority of the American people support that.

In all the videos I have seen, law enforcement approached him. He was out on the road. He had his cell phone up. His other hand up, and then we see the law enforcement agents push a woman to the ground. He appears to be trying to help her. He's pepper-sprayed. He goes on the ground. One of the agents hits him with a tin can of some sort. Another agent grabs the gun that from every video we have seen was not brandished and walks away.

And then it was after that that he was shot multiple times on the back. And when he was lifeless, he was shot five more times. And how do you justify that when he was out there exercising his First Amendment right to free speech and his Second Amendment right to legally carry a weapon? Did he not have the right to do both?

SESSIONS: Well, I would vigorously argue he had both, except the circumstances we would recognize are being placed upon this community by themselves and by law enforcement. And it is a bad, bad combination. And this is where I'm saying there are some cooler heads that are looking at this, like here, at least in Waco, Texas, where at least the sheriff or the police would be in between the protesters or people that were there to harass law enforcement.

They need to do their job. And it is a terrible combination when these protesters are intentionally inflicting with whistles, cars following, and yelling and screaming at these police officers. It just makes for a combative circumstance. I in no way condone anything that went on, but I would also tell you this is where I think the local people have to say, instead of leave, let's please go get these criminals.

We will help you to get the criminals, legitimate criminals. And beyond that, we would like for you to get them. We will help protect the community. And because they were preying on children and women. And there's no way to justify that. But it's a combination of activity. And I'm sorry.

BROWN: Of course. There is no way. No one is saying they want them on the streets. Criminals who are in the country illegally. That's not an issue here, but are you willing to consider that it would be provocative?

SESSIONS: Well, it may be. It may be, and that's why if they had a closer working relationship rather than adversarial, they would understand what they're trying to accomplish. And that's what I hope will happen if and when they come to Texas. And evidently the word is, is that they're in Austin, Texas.

BROWN: Because has a higher undocumented --

SESSIONS: And so I hope that local --

BROWN: I'm sorry, we're remote so it's hard to know when -- so I apologize for that. But because Texas does have a higher rate of undocumented immigrants, when you look at per capita as compared to Minnesota, I would like to hear more about what you're learning about ICE presence in Austin, but are you willing to consider that, to the residents there, why this would be troubling for them?

Because, again, I've done ICE ride-alongs. There's a few of them. They usually go in the dark of night. There's not, you know, these sweeps with thousands of officers going through streets. Right? And you've now had two U.S. citizens killed by these law enforcement agents. And when you look at the videos, it's hard to see the justification, when you look at what is out there publicly, particularly with Alex Pretti, this latest one, as we're focused on. Are you willing to consider why that might be provocative to people in the community? And again, not excusing any attacks or violence against law enforcement. That should never happen.

[23:50:02]

But people do have a First Amendment right, and they do have a Second Amendment right in this country. And they do have a Fourth Amendment right. And I think that -- do you see how this could be testing those bounds?

SESSIONS: Well, I don't think there's any question it's a test a lot for the country. And a lot of the test is we watched some 13 million or 14 million people come in long lines thousands at a time into this country, knowing they were breaking the law. We watched New York City and lots of other jurisdictions spend millions and millions of dollars to put these people up against the best interests of American citizens.

I think that this has exacerbated because of the fraud that occurred, the $9 billion. And quite honestly, the way the federal government is looking at it is they're trying to clear out criminals who they believe could have engaged in this $9 billion theft of the government. But the most important thing is they're going after criminals that have harmed people. And so I'm simply saying that I think before tomorrow starts, I think it would be better to have a buffer, a buffer zone that would be there where they would work to protect law enforcement and there to protect their own citizens.

BROWN: I understand that point.

SESSIONS: And that is what works best with local people.

BROWN: That's what you want to see.

SESSIONS: And it's my hope. That's what -- it's my hope that cooler heads could prevail.

BROWN: Well, that's what we all want. But is it helpful for the DHS secretary to come out and call Pretti a domestic terrorist? And for Stephen Miller at the White House calling him an assassin? Is that cooler heads prevailing in this administration?

SESSIONS: Well, you know, they're -- both sides are attempting to prove their point. I in no way once again think that it's wise or prudent for hundreds of people to show up with whistles to defer law enforcement. That is a crime in and of itself, to get in the way of someone doing their job.

BROWN: But, Congressman, I have to -- I'm sorry, I have to -- I don't like to interrupt you, but that's a First Amendment right. You may not like it. They may not like it. But we all have the right to observe what law enforcement is doing on public streets. And if you want to blow a whistle, that might be distracting and it might be, you know, considered not great behavior, but it's protected under the First Amendment, is it not?

SESSIONS: Well, this goes back to now that we know that we have a circumstance the way we have it, and I would like to see communities with law enforcement, local law enforcement that is there to protect the law enforcement officers and the people. They are driving around all over town. They're following people. It's obvious they're trying to harass them. And it's obvious that that they want to see ICE make mistakes, do bad things, take force against them.

And all I can tell you is, is that these people are committed, and I'm committed, too, to deporting people who are criminals. And this is a huge problem and somebody has to find a way --

BROWN: But what accountability do you want to see for law enforcement and ICE? And Secretary Noem of DHS, do you still have confidence in her leading the agency? And what accountability would you like to see, if any? I know you're very pro-law enforcement, and law enforcement has a tough job, no doubt, but what do you want to see here?

SESSIONS: Well, let me go back to this. I'd like to see the federal government have a closer relationship with local law enforcement, where local law enforcement saw that part of their duty is to come and stand between the --

BROWN: And does that mean you want local law enforcement to also investigate with them, with the federal -- because they blocked, they blocked state officials from investigating. Would you like to see the joint investigation?

SESSIONS: Well, of course I would. The joint investigation stopped because this is a sanctuary community. They don't want to.

BROWN: No.

SESSIONS: And so they would --

BROWN: Well, I'm talking about the joint investigation of these shootings, not on the -- not on the handing over of the undocumented immigrants. On the shootings, would you like to see a joint investigation?

SESSIONS: Well, I don't think there's any question that if it's going to be successful, it's got to be where we see things based upon the facts of the case. And I do admit right now I've watched the video a number of times. I did not have a real sense of the entire issue, and somebody has got to -- we have to figure out how we're going to avoid this happening again.

[23:55:08]

BROWN: All right, Congressman Pete Sessions, we'll have to leave it there. We appreciate your time. And we'll be right back

SESSIONS: Yes.

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BROWN: Well, thank you for watching this hour of our breaking news coverage. I'm Pamela Brown. Stay with CNN. The news continues after a quick break.

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