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DHS Shutdown Talks Show Little Movement As Dems Seek ICE Reform; Interview With Representative Eric Swalwell (D-CA); Search For Nancy Guthrie Continues After Two Weeks; U.S. Looks To Keep Improving Relations With Venezuela. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired February 15, 2026 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[18:00:00]

COY WIRE, CNN SPORT HOST: An incredible game so far for Norway. The nation with the population of just over five and a half million people continues to dominate the ice and snow, sitting at the top of the medal table.

Back to you.

PAULA REID, CNN HOST: Coy Wire, thank you.

And the next hour of CNN NEWSROOM starts right now.

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Paula Reid in Washington. Jessica Dean has the night off.

We begin this hour with Congress at an impasse. We're now in day two of the partial government shutdown with little signs of progress in the negotiations. Democrats are seeking major changes to immigration enforcement policy in exchange for the funding of the Department of Homeland Security. And this comes after the fatal shooting of two U.S. citizens by federal agents in Minneapolis last month.

Today, Republican Senator Markwayne Mullin telling CNN Democrats are negotiating in bad faith.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MARKWAYNE MULLIN (R-OK): This isn't about actually opening DHS back. This is about waiting until the president is done giving the State of the Union which is a week from Tuesday, which is why I said this is nothing but political theater, because what they're saying, they can't even do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

REID: CNN's Camila DeChalus is following the story.

What do we know tonight about where negotiations stand?

CAMILA DECHALUS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Paula, we're hearing from more Democratic and Republican lawmakers that they both want to see this partial government shutdown end. But both sides are still having a hard time ironing out details on how exactly to move forward with passing a spending bill that would fund the Department of Homeland Security, that would realistically pass both the House and the Senate.

Now, as you know, the big point of contention here is really around the Department of Homeland Security. Democratic lawmakers have outlined a list of reforms that they want to see made around immigration enforcement in exchange for supporting a bill, a funding bill to fund the Department of Homeland Security. And they really say it's about holding this administration accountable and also these federal agencies.

Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER (D-NY): There's a simple answer to this. Republicans go along with this common sense, these common sense proposals, and we'll fund the whole DHS bill, the whole Department of Homeland Security bill. Just go along. Again, I cannot repeat enough. These are common sense police departments across America. Use them. We have a rogue agency. Why don't we rein them in?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DECHALUS: Now, Paula, several Republican lawmakers have spoken to have really pushed back on this notion and saying that they feel like this is a moot point right now because they think that the top priority should just be passing funding for the Department of Homeland Security and then later talking about reforms being made to certain federal agencies.

But what we're hearing at this point in time is that there are still bipartisan talks happening behind the scenes in order to try to end this government shutdown. But the really big picture here is that if this shutdown continues, it means that this will negatively impact critical federal agencies like the Coast Guard, FEMA and TSA. And really the big picture here is that hundreds and thousands of federal employees under DHS will have to stay on the job, and many of them will go without pay.

And so we're seeing a real sense of urgency for lawmakers to get something done. But what we know right now is that the House and the Senate side, they're not expected to return back to Capitol Hill until February 23rd. And so what we're hearing is that GOP leaders in both the House and Senate are saying that they're going to possibly call back members of Congress to come back if a deal is reached. But at this point in time, there's no deal on the table

REID: Camila DeChalus, thank you so much.

And we're joined now by Democratic Representative Eric Swalwell of California. He serves on the House Judiciary and Homeland Security Committees. He's also running to be the next governor of California.

Congressman, thanks for your time tonight. I want to start with the partial government shutdown. What are you hearing from party leadership on how long they're willing to keep this going?

REP. ERIC SWALWELL (D-CA): Democrats are not willing to fund another public execution. And if we fund ICE as is, the bodies will pile up. And so, yes, we are seeking to stop the community terror and to put in place a no mask requirement, to have identification come out, to stop the roving patrols. And they have admitted in court, ICE has, that they target people based on the color of their skin and the accents that they speak.

So our friends and neighbors are running through the fields and factories where they work. If they stop doing that and go back, you know, to what their mission is to remove the most violent and dangerous people, they'll find support. But absent that, it's not going to be there.

REID: But I want to ask you, if ICE officers aren't getting paid, but operations are not expected to be impacted, so then how does a shutdown achieve Democrats' goal here?

SWALWELL: Well, it's also about not validating or co-signing on their conduct. You know, Americans were loud and clear the last election. They want to make sure that we get rid of the most violent individuals inside the United States.

[18:05:05]

But what they found is overwhelmingly the people who are being deported are people who have been here for a long time, have families, have worked jobs, have paid taxes in their communities. And so no one asked for this. And if the president was to focus on lowering costs rather than funding the public executions that we saw when we lost a mom named Good and a nurse named Pretti, he would find support.

Until he does that -- I applaud, you know, the Senate Democrats, you know, for standing with House Democrats to say, don't come for us to sign off on this, not for funding, not for sanctioning it.

REID: Now, I also want to switch gears here talk about this letter that the Justice Department sent to Congress with a list of, quote, "politically exposed persons, names in the Epstein files." The letter doesn't specify the degree to which people were linked to or in contact with Epstein. Simply anyone whose name shows up in the document, it could be something like a news clipping, but they released this letter with this list.

I'll point out to say, you know, you said that your name is on this list. What do you make of this letter?

SWALWELL: Yes. It's totally absurd. And we went through the files and there are 14 news clippings where my name is referenced. And that's the only reference that my name comes up in those files. But to try and put people like me and Adam Schiff and Barack Obama in the same drawer as Donald Trump, give me a break. He is mentioned over a million times in the files, and he is the only person that is mentioned in the files that Jeffrey Epstein describes as his best friend. But let me just tell you and walk you through what Republicans have

been willing to do since the summer on this. They sent Congress home early so they didn't have to deal with this. They refused to swear in Adelita Grijalva so that they didn't have to deal with this. I even came -- I was grieving my mother's passing late this summer, and when I saw we were reaching peak level of discharge petitions, I left my family to come back to Congress to sign the discharge petition.

That's the kind of commitment that members have right now to get transparency. And then they shut down the government because they didn't want the Epstein files to come out. They're willing to do anything to protect this president. Thankfully there's just enough of them, like Thomas Massie and a few others, that are pushing forward for transparency. I'm not giving up on it. And the commitment I've seen from others in our party and a few Republicans is that they're not going to let it go away either.

REID: Now, I want to go back to the hearing earlier this week with Attorney General Pam Bondi. I covered this. I think objectively speaking, it was a wild hearing. But you had probably one of the only moments of Zen and bipartisanship with the attorney general. I want to play the clip. Let's take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SWALWELL: In June 2025, an individual left 11 voicemails at my district office. On the voicemails, they said, get the message to him. I'm going to hunt him down, that mother (EXPLETIVE DELETED), and toss his (EXPLETIVE DELETED) over the Golden Gate Bridge by my (EXPLETIVE DELETED) self.

Donald Trump's Department of Justice and the Northern District of California declined to prosecute. On May 14th, 2025, on Twitter responding to something I posted, an individual said, no, it wasn't, Eric, and now I'm going to kill you. The Department of Justice from the Southern District of Texas declined to prosecute.

I'm just asking for your help to protect life because life is at risk with the environment we're in right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

REID: Now the list of threats you detailed was actually even longer than that. What was your reaction to Bondi's response? Because up until that point, no matter what you asked her about, you know, she was lobbing insults. She was firing back at people. What was your reaction?

SWALWELL: Well, I just want the Department of Justice to go back to its mission of protecting the public. And I also had laid out that the president has gone after me and his opponents for the last 10 years and he's put us under investigation. He's had leaks come out of his department to try and embarrass people who criticize him. And I've said, look I priced that in. I get that the president is going to do this. I don't think it's right. But what's worse is that on one hand, you're investigating your

critics and those investigations spin up death threats against your critics, and then you won't protect them from the death threats, because I laid out that all of those cases I referenced were declined to be prosecuted by the Department of Justice. So it just feels like they want to threaten and intimidate you in every way.

And whether you're a Republican or a Democrat in this country, if you're a critic of the president, you shouldn't have to see your family at risk, because the Department of Justice doesn't want to protect you.

REID: I mean, in that moment, she said that this is serious and that she wanted to work with you. Do you believe her?

SWALWELL: I want to believe her and I need to see action. And again, it's not just about me. There are other critics of the president and again, put me under investigation. That's what you guys do.

[18:10:02]

It's nonsense. I'll beat your investigations. But don't equally put our families at risk for standing up to you. And it's not going to make me break. I'm not going to hide under the bed. I'm going to keep doing what I'm doing, and I'll protect my family at the same time. But that's where we are right now with this president, and that's why it's so important to find, you know, as many allies as possible, people to rise up in the streets peacefully and for Democrats to show strength where we can and leverage votes where we have them to hold them accountable.

REID: Speaking of votes, I want to quickly ask you about voter I.D. President Trump said there will be voter I.D. laws for the midterm elections, whether approved by Congress or not. So he's suggesting that he could do this by executive action. The House passed the bill this week. Now it heads to the Senate.

I asked Republican Congressman Tim Burchett about this last night. Let's take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. TIM BURCHETT (R-TN): And when the Democrats say it's racist or whatever, ma'am, it's just a complete opposite of that. 85 percent of black folks think that this is needed. The minority community fully endorses this. This is about power. This is about allowing illegals to vote. And that's all it really is. There's nothing more than that. And to say that our minority community cannot produce an identification to me that is racist.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

REID: Now, Pew Research Center shows a voter I.D. is broadly popular. How do you respond to the congressman there?

SWALWELL: Well, we have seen, you know, fraud at the ballot box just on the Republican side. You know, they recently tried to overturn a redistricting decision in Utah. And many Republican signatures were thrown out because they were proved to be fraudulent. But they're attacking a problem that doesn't exist. It's a felony to try and fraudulently vote. And it's a low, low, low percentage occurrence.

And so what I would prefer is to see Republicans and Democrats focused on increasing turnout at the ballot box. Thankfully, in California, we max out democracy. Everyone is mailed a ballot after they approved that they are who they say they are when they sign up. Ballots are verified when they are sent back in. We have an open voting window where you can drop off your ballot at a postal office, where you can go in person for a couple of weeks, and blue state Democrats have to do all they can to max out democracy right now as the president tries to do everything he can to run another January 6th, where he won't honor the outcome of an election.

REID: Congressman Swalwell, thank you.

And I want to note --

SWALWELL: My pleasure.

REID: I want to note the congressman mentioned other names in that DOJ letter. CNN doesn't have the context around each individual mentioned in this list, just does not specify the degree, if any, to which people were linked to or in contact with Epstein. That could be harmless, like news clips, which I discussed with the congressman.

Still to come, a significant development in the search for Nancy Guthrie. The DNA evidence found at not one, but two locations that could help investigators narrow their search for a suspect.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:17:40]

REID: The search for 84-year-old Nancy Guthrie, the mother of "Today" show host Savannah Guthrie, has been missing for two weeks. But law enforcement is getting some new information. Earlier today, the FBI announced it was awaiting DNA results from a glove discovered near Guthrie's home. The agency says the glove appears to match those worn by the suspect in surveillance footage captured by Guthrie's doorbell camera on the morning she went missing.

Investigators are also analyzing DNA that was found at her property, which officials say does not match Guthrie or anyone close to her.

CNN correspondent Ivan Rodriguez is on the ground in Tucson. He joins us now.

Ivan, what more are we learning about where the investigation currently stands?

IVAN RODRIGUEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Paula, good afternoon. Over the course of the last couple of weeks, we've had what's felt like a few breakthroughs in this investigation. First, you have the FBI releasing those surveillance camera footage, video, images. You can see that man approaching Nancy Guthrie's front door captured on her doorbell camera. You can see him wearing a mask. You can see him having a backpack on him.

You can see a holster in front of him around his waist as well, trying to obscure that camera with some plants or weeds at one moment in that video, too. At that point, officials had hoped that people could recognize him based on the way that he moved, the way that he walked. That's something that's helped identify past suspects in other different investigations.

And then shortly after that video was released, you began to see investigators following up on a lot of leads based on the thousands of tips that had been received. In Southern Arizona you saw a man detained and then released. Here closer to Nancy Guthrie's home you saw another person detained. A federal search warrant issued. None of that has necessarily resulted in anything. All those people were eventually released.

But now we have the news of this glove that was found near Nancy Guthrie's home, which the FBI says visually matches the glove seen worn by this man in that doorbell footage. Now the sheriff's department here in this area of Pima County has also asked people who live within two miles of Nancy Guthrie's home to continue searching for any other surveillance footage that they may have, whether it be from a doorbell or anything in front of their home, just to get more video in.

[18:20:01]

That video could be of people walking on the road, cars driving by, specifically between the dates of January 1st and February 2nd. But, Paula, a big, big real obstacle that officials have been facing here is the fact that a lot of these homes are not close to the road. There's a lot of trees, there's a lot of plants in front of these homes, which adds a lot of privacy for people in this neighborhood. But at the same time, it has made surveillance footage very difficult to come by now for the last couple of weeks.

Now, in terms of the Guthrie family, tomorrow will mark one week since we got to hear face to face from Savannah Guthrie in a video. She posted the last one asking the public for help, saying that they will not give up on searching for her mother. We've also seen other videos posted by Savannah since then mentioning the FBI images, the videos, also a memorial that was posted of her mom with home videos as well. But to hear directly from the family tomorrow will mark one week of that as well.

The sheriff's department has said that no press conferences were scheduled for today here in Tucson. We're now approaching 5:00 p.m. here local time, so that's probably going to stay the case here as well. Throughout the day, we've also seen people approaching Nancy Guthrie's home, dropping off more yellow flowers, which show just the hope that this community still has, that Nancy Guthrie will be returned safely here.

REID: Ivan Rodriguez, thank you.

And here with me now is former FBI profiler and host of "Killer Psyche" podcast, Candice DeLong.

Candice, what, if anything, stands out to you about this investigation from what we've seen so far?

CANDICE DELONG, FORMER FBI PROFILER: Well, one of the things that concerns me is there has been no confirmed by the FBI, confirmed ransom note, that's one thing. Today, let's address what was found today. Another glove. If it is a match to the glove they think or that the perpetrator appeared to be wearing, and the DNA is the same as the DNA they found on the house, I can only ask myself, why did he lose or throw his glove away out in that area? What was he doing there?

And that gives me pause. I imagine, I could be wrong about this, that they have -- they are utilizing dogs that are trained to track, tracking dogs. We haven't heard anything about that, but I imagine that they are. And of course, the most concerning thing is, it's been over two weeks and there has been no confirmed ransom demand, as I mentioned. And to our knowledge, there has been no ransom payment.

That does not mean, and I want to make it clear, that does not mean things are not happening that the FBI is not sharing with the public because if the public knows something, it could interfere with a plan that has been developed. And so there's that to consider.

REID: As a former FBI profiler, I want to ask you, this surveillance video really seems to be the most significant thing they've gotten so far. I mean, talk about the kind of evidence that they can pull from a clip like this.

DELONG: Well, as we know, they've already determined the offender, which is what I'm going to call him. The offender's height and weight. One thing that occurs to me about that video is he's nowhere near as sophisticated as I initially thought he was before this video came out. And of course, there may be more than one person. I suspect that there is.

The -- one of the cameras, he takes off, he pulls off, and the other one, he's shoving twigs and leaves at the timberlands. What the heck is that? Hardly what I call a sophisticated, well, what is in profiling terms, criminally sophisticated individual. And that worries me, too. If somebody doesn't know what they're doing, how are they going to pull off a crime like this?

REID: Yes. Talk a little bit more about that. I mean, as a profiler, do you hope for someone who's more sophisticated, might be harder to catch, but might -- maybe be less sloppy or less likely to panic? How do you -- how do you assess this?

DELONG: Well, to do a crime like this which is huge, or to try to get away with murder, and I'm not saying that has anything to do with this, but crimes of that magnitude are extremely difficult to pull off these days.

[18:25:19]

Maybe not 50 years ago, maybe not 20 years ago, but these days with surveillance everywhere and all the sophisticated techniques that laboratories have, it's pretty hard. Therefore, for somebody to think they can pull off a crime like this, they have to be enormously confident in themselves. And the term narcissistic psychopath comes to mind. Psychopath being a clinical term, someone that has no empathy for others, no guilt for what they do to other people.

That makes it easy for them to commit crimes. And the narcissism, the I am great, whatever I say will be believed, whatever I do will work the way I want it to. They do not see themselves as fallible in any way. And when you think about it, to try to pull off a crime of this magnitude, you kind of need to be narcissistic. And where the psychopath part comes in, he just doesn't care. Doesn't care about the pain and suffering he's causing the victim or the victim's family.

REID: Candice DeLong, thank you so much for joining us. Obviously the entire nation, a large part of the world is watching. Thank you.

And be sure to tune in tonight for a new episode of "THE WHOLE STORY." Ed Lavandera is in Tucson with the latest on the unanswered questions in the search for Nancy Guthrie. "THE WHOLE STORY WITH ANDERSON COOPER" airs tonight at 8:00 Eastern and streaming the next day on the CNN app.

And coming up, the U.S. military intercepts and boards another oil tanker in the Indian Ocean as the Trump administration seeks to take control of Venezuela's oil. Details next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:31:38]

REID: The U.S. military says it has apprehended another oil tanker linked to Venezuela in the Indian Ocean. The Pentagon says the ship was trying to defy President Trump's quarantine on Venezuelan oil being brought out of the country. The seizure comes days after President Trump praised Venezuela's acting president, Delcy Rodriguez, saying their relationship is now a 10.

CNN's Stefan Pozzebon has more on the increasingly cordial ties between the two countries.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

STEFANO POZZEBON, CNN CONTRIBUTOR (voice-over): The threats, the pressure, the daring night raid, it all led to this. United States is getting what it wants from Venezuela but it wants more of it. And this visit by Energy Secretary Chris Wright is conveying that message.

Now all of the oil that is stored in this massive tank already goes directly to the United States. It goes to Houston. But that is just a tiny fraction of what this country could produce.

(Voice-over): Wright and acting president Delcy Rodriguez touring this facility, a partnership between U.S. major Chevron and Venezuela's PDVSA. It pumps out 40,000 barrels a day and it could produce seven and a half times more. But obstacles remain.

CHRIS WRIGHT, U.S. ENERGY SECRETARY: Oh, it's just to get the political and economic arrangements as smooth as possible between our countries.

POZZEBON (voice-over): The arrangements the U.S. wants don't seem to align with those of student protesters in Caracas.

Oil is secondary here. They want the Trump administration to finish what he started and to see hundreds of political prisoners being released.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): They can't release one, two, three. They must all be freed immediately.

POZZEBON (voice-over): Six weeks since the U.S. forces stormed Caracas, capturing and taking President Nicolas Maduro, things have changed in Venezuela. Relations with the U.S. are on the mend and the new hydrocarbon law was passed to attract investment. Prices are dropping and the country's national assembly is discussing an amnesty bill for political prisoners.

At Miraflores, where Maduro used to live, another sign of change. The Stars and Stripes now hoisted on the doorstep.

WRIGHT: We want to set the Venezuelan people and the economy free.

POZZEBON (voice-over): But as time goes by, many wonder if the U.S. is actually interested in change or just wanted a more cooperative leader in Caracas.

Stefano Pozzebon, CNN, Caracas.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

REID: And what may be the world's largest street party is happening right now in Brazil. The Rio Carnival is the country's biggest celebration of the year. It's a five-day party leading up to the Catholic celebration of Lent. It's filled with lavish parades, glitzy balls, samba dancing and dramatic costumes. Carnival is expected to draw six million people to Brazil this year, bringing in nearly $200 million into the country's economy.

And still to come, President Obama responding publicly for the first time to a racist A.I. video shared by President Trump depicting him and former first lady Michelle Obama as apes.

[18:35:04]

You're in the CNN NEWSROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

REID: The top House Democrat is vowing to continue fighting Republican efforts to redraw congressional maps. Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries spoke with CNN's Manu Raju, saying he's willing to do whatever it takes to make sure that Democrats end up on top in this year's midterm elections as control of the House is on the line.

[18:40:06]

Jeffries is promising to spend tens of millions of dollars on an April ballot initiative in Virginia potentially giving Democrats four more seats.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D-NY): Republicans started this redistricting war, and Democrats have made clear we're going to finish it. We're forcefully making sure that the overall national map is free and fair. And so whatever advantage Republicans thought they were going to obtain by gerrymandering in red states across the country, we are making sure those advantages are completely and totally wiped out.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

REID: Democratic strategist Antjuan Seawright joins us now, along with Republican strategist Katie Frost.

All right, Antjuan, I want to start with you. How important is this redistricting fight in the midterm elections?

ANTJUAN SEAWRIGHT, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I think this is going to be the most consequential midterm election of our lifetime. And I think Leader Jeffries is right that we cannot fight fire with fire. We have to fight fire with water hoses. And I think you see that around the country, starting in California, which was a response to Texas. And you're going to see Democrats where we have an opportunity continue to fight that fight.

The Republicans have adopted this strategy, if you cannot beat them, you try to cheat them. And we know pound for pound, issue by issue, we have the best candidates. We have the best message, and we will defeat them at the ballot box if the system does not allow for us to be cheated.

REID: All right, Katie, your thoughts?

KATIE FROST, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Well, I have to respectfully disagree because what we're looking at with these maps that are merging is basically red states are just trying to get their maps to the level that blue states have long been. I always thought it was hilarious when the representatives in Texas fled Texas and they went to Illinois to protest gerrymandering, and they went to the home of gerrymandering.

If you look at some of those districts in Chicago, it looks like Pac- Man eating up other pieces. Now we see this map in Virginia, we have a lobster shaped district in Northern Virginia. It's absolutely absurd. But, look, this is where it's going to happen. If we see all this aggressive back and forth, what we're ultimately going to see is there will only be a handful of swing districts left in the country and then those are all going to feel like many Senate races when it comes to what's going to be spent to win those.

REID: Earlier this week the House --

SEAWRIGHT: Paula --

REID: Yes, Antjuan?

SEAWRIGHT: Paula, respectfully, this is a long-term effort, ongoing effort to suffocate and silence black and brown political power in this country. We've seen this throughout the history of this country. We certainly saw it happen in Texas. We've seen it happen in North Carolina. We've seen it play out in many other places.

If the Republicans felt so good about their messaging, their methodology and their candidates, then why do we have to deal with the maps in any way, shape or form? This is simply a favor to the president, who by the way wants to nationalize the elections and doing everything he can to slow down the effort because he knows they're going to lose in November.

REID: Katie, would you like to respond to the historical note about gerrymandering?

FROST: I would say that you actually have a nationalizing elections. That was actually something the Democrats were trying to push through when they were in power. So this is not unheard of. This is something we've seen from both sides when they're in power. But ultimately, I believe that each state should have a right to determine their maps, how they want to. But if we're going to talk about representation, I mean, the fact that there isn't a single Republican congressman from the entire New England and what 35 percent of people in New England vote Republican? There's not a lot of representation there either.

REID: All right. I want to move on. Now, let's talk about this partial government shutdown. Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer called ICE a, quote, "rogue force" and said that Democratic reforms are common sense proposals.

All right, Katie, I want to start with you. What's your response to that?

FROST: Well, my response is everyone is talking about ICE, but very few people are noting that ICE is going to be funded even with this shutdown that is currently ongoing. So you have to ask if you are protesting ICE, what is the purpose of this shutdown if ICE is actually funded? What we're going to see impacted instead are different aspects of Department of Homeland Security. We're going to see TSA workers having to show up at the airport when they're not being paid, and having to wait for their back pay.

What is the point here? The Democrats shut the government down in September and October and what happened? Absolutely nothing. They ultimately had to cave because, respectfully, I have to disagree with Antjuan here, they don't have a good message. They don't have a good messenger. They don't have a united strategy and that's why the last shutdown was a failure for them. I believe this shutdown will also be a failure.

REID: Antjuan, do you think Democrats will be willing to compromise on these reforms?

SEAWRIGHT: Well, Katie, no disrespect, but the president upside down, inside out on the issue of immigration. The conservative Cato Institute has declared the fact that since October, 73 percent of ICE arrests have no criminal conviction. We know 12 people have been shot. We know a 5-year-old has been arrested. We also know two people have been killed on camera, execution style.

[18:45:04]

We also know by way of DHS' own reporting, by way of the agency, the 400,000 arrests, less than 14 percent have a criminal conviction. So I think it's very unserious for you to act as if ICE does not need some sort of reform and put in place. But you are right. There is a $70 billion slush fund thanks to the big nasty bill for ICE to operate instead of using $59 million to put in place those Affordable Care Act subsidies that 18.2 million Americans in red states would have enjoyed. So technically, you are right. That does not mean that ICE should not be reformed.

REID: All right. We're going to come back after the break. Katie, I do want to give you the last word here, though. He did call you unserious. Do you want to respond to any of what he just said?

FROST: I'm a southerner. I think I should just say bless your heart. But the idea that you say you're going to reform ICE by shutting down the government when ICE is already funded is laughable. That's not going to happen. And I think we all know it. It's just political posturing.

REID: All right. Let's pause right there. Both of you, please stick around. We've got a lot more to talk about, including high profile Democrats taking on the international stage and testing their foreign policy chops at the Munich Security Conference. A preview of what to expect from 2028 hopefuls, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:50:57]

REID: All right. Our panel is back.

Antjuan, several prominent Democrats appeared at the Munich Security Conference this week outlining their foreign policy decisions. Is this just a preview of who we could see running in 2028?

SEAWRIGHT: Well, it could be. This is almost like the Masters, a tradition like no other. So certainly it's not some unreasonable expectation for candidates to allow themselves to be on the world stage. But at the end of the day I would caution all of my potential 2028 friends to not worry about 2028, but focus on 2026. I also think this is about trying to gain gravity and attention early

on in the process because it will be a very crowded primary, but I will remind all my 2028 friends the road to heaven and the White House runs through my home state of South Carolina.

REID: Katie, how is the White House presenting their policies differently this year than how the vice president did last year?

FROST: It definitely was a difference in tone between the speeches you heard from Secretary Rubio and the speech you heard from Vice President Vance. Vice President Vance went in a lot more hard charging, kind of critiquing what he saw as the failures of Europe. And then you listen to Secretary Rubio and he's talking about the importance of our transatlantic partnership and how we basically bring it back what he sees needs to be done to help Europe be stronger and the United States remain strong.

But if this is a preview of 2028 for the Democrats, I have to say I feel like a coach watching real film on the opposing team. I'm feeling really good right now.

REID: Well, on a really serious matter, we finally heard from former President Obama. He commented on President Trump's social media account. The video that was eventually taken down, this racist video. I want to listen to what he said. Here you go.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: Well, first of all, I think it's important to recognize that the majority of the American people find this behavior deeply troubling. You know, it is true that it gets attention. It's true that it's a distraction. But, you know, as I'm traveling around the country, as you're traveling around the country, you meet people, they still believe in decency, courtesy, kindness.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

REID: Antjuan, what is your reaction to what he just said there?

SEAWRIGHT: He handled it very well because I would have adopted this model. When they go low, you go with the flow, and responded a little different. But I'm reminded as we celebrate and uplift African- American History Month in this country, every time we've seen progress in this country, it's been met with extreme backlash. Donald Trump and the MAGA movement, who not only thrives but survives off racism, bigotry and hate, is a response to Barack Obama.

This is a candidate who started his political career with the birther movement that later evolved into the MAGA movement, and he continues in times of crisis for him, lean on racism, bigotry, hate, uplift white nationalism and Christian white nationalism. So we should not be surprised about the distraction because of the affordability crisis they have created and the do-nothing Congress that supports his efforts.

REID: Katy, do you think that voters have accepted the White House's response to that specific video?

FROST: I would say most part they have. It was a video that never should have been put up. They said it was an intern and it was the tail end of another video about the election. It was not actually that video at the beginning portion happened at the very tail end of a video that was posted.

What I would say, though, is that the Trump presidency was not a reaction to -- it was a reaction to President Obama, but because of his policies. When the Affordable Care Act was passed and then it turned out it wasn't affordable and people saw their health care costs going up because of the Democratic policies, when they felt overlooked and left behind, and when President Obama went out there and said that people who disagreed with him bitterly clung to guns and religion with antipathy towards those who were not like them, people felt that they were being overlooked.

And that was a perfect window for President Trump to come in as the blue-collar billionaire and say, you're sick and tired of what's happening in this country, let's make it great again.

[18:55:05]

And that was the opening President Obama provided for President Trump.

REID: There were certainly a lot of factors that fed into the 2016 election but I do think, guys, I think we're about to touch on something, a bipartisan interest. The former president also spoke about something else in this interview that I think people from all walks of life, all parties are interested in. Let's take a listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIAN TYLER COHEN, HOST, "NO LIE" PODCAST: Are aliens real?

OBAMA: They're real but I haven't seen them. And they're not being kept in, what is it?

COHEN: Area 51?

OBAMA: Area 51.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

REID: Katie, is this the confirmation we've all been waiting for? Is this the bridge between Republicans and Democrats?

FROST: I mean, it's definitely something that everybody wants answers on, and everyone will be fascinated by. I just feel like I have to now go apologize to all my Trekkie friends that I was telling them they were ridiculous when I talk about aliens. So now I have to go apologize.

REID: Antjuan, you want to weigh in? SEAWRIGHT: It's the scariest thing ever to think that they actually

exist. And to hear that from a former president who has access, who had access to all the information in the world, I think that makes me a little fearful, and I hope that I'm able to sleep at night after you've asked this question on this segment, Paula.

REID: I will say it was one of the things that got the most traction from that interview, which is why they decided to ask.

Antjuan Seawright and Katie Frost, thank you.

And stay with CNN. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)