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Steve Witkoff Calls Vladimir Putin A "Humanitarian" After American Freed; Israel Gears Up For High-Stakes Election Next Week; Russia's New Jet-Powered Drones Pose Challenge for Ukraine; U.S. Could Deploy Heat Ray Weapon at the Southern Border; Officials Say the Toledo Tank Has Cooled Down, Almost Done Venting. Aired 2-3a ET
Aired October 22, 2026 - 02:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[02:00:32]
ROSEMARY CHURCH, CNN ANCHOR: Hello and welcome to our viewers joining us from all around the world. I'm Rosemary Church.
Just ahead on CNN NEWSROOM, new strikes hit Kyiv just a day after Vladimir Putin agrees to three-way peace talks. What's next for Russia's war on Ukraine?
Plus, Israelis will head to the polls next week. Details on the candidate challenging Netanyahu's government in the pivotal elections.
And CNN speaks to Americans who are revolting against data centers, swaying some MAGA supporters away from Trump's party.
ANNOUNCER: Live from Atlanta. This is CNN NEWSROOM with Rosemary Church.
CHURCH: Russia and Ukraine are trading strikes just hours after U.S. Special Envoy Steve Witkoff sat down for talks with Russian President Vladimir Putin. In Kyiv, at least one person was killed and 22 others wounded in Russian attacks, while Ukraine launched hundreds of drones towards the Moscow region overnight. This all coming after Witkoff held what he described as a constructive meeting with Putin in talks aimed at advancing peace efforts in Ukraine. The two sat down for about three hours in St. Petersburg on Wednesday, at Witkoff's request, Putin said he'd be ready to resume trilateral talks between Russia, Ukraine, and the U.S. after November 10th.
Ukraine's president said he'd like to meet by the beginning of next month. He also pointed out that Russia has previously said it was ready to meet only for plans to be canceled. A key outcome of Wednesday's meeting was Witkoff announcing that Russia had released American Stephen Hubbard. The U.S. envoy had this to say to Putin after Hubbard was freed.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEVE WITKOFF, U.S. SPECIAL ENVOY FOR PEACE MISSIONS: You talk so much about my president, President Trump, being a humanitarian. You are a humanitarian also, sir, and I salute that, I commend you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHURCH: Witkoff's description of Putin as a humanitarian drew swift backlash, but President Trump suggested that Witkoff's use of that term could have helped in Hubbard's release. The 74-year-old was freed after being detained in Russia for more than four years, and came after a direct plea from Trump.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You said you didn't give Russia anything in exchange for this release.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: If I would have done that, you would not have Mr. Hubbard coming back right now -- right now. And you don't know anything. I mean, you're fake news, CNN.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So, you did give him something in exchange for the release?
TRUMP: Look, right now, you have a man that's beautifully flying from Russia to wherever he's landing in the United States. That I got out because I had a very good and very fast negotiation with President Putin. If you would have put those sanctions on, or whatever you want to call them, you could forget about him. You'd never see him again. He'd be back in jail for 25 years.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHURCH: The president there appearing to tie the waiving of Russia- related sanctions to the release of Stephen Hubbard, despite stating earlier that the U.S. gave Moscow nothing in exchange. CNN's Matthew Chance has more now on Hubbard's release.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CHIEF GLOBAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, hey. This is an important prisoner release -- a huge relief obviously for the family of 74-year-old Stephen Hubbard who is originally from Michigan. He was detained by Russian forces in Ukraine early on in the full-scale invasion -- I think it was in April 2022 -- as Russian forces pushed into the country towards the Ukrainian capital.
They captured Mr. Hubbard and took him into detention. They then accused him of having joined the Ukrainian security forces and fighting in the self-defense forces there, something he pleaded guilty to in court, but which his family has categorically denied and said he would never do that sort of thing. That he was more of a pacifist than a war fighter.
Nevertheless, he was sentenced to a pretty lengthy prison sentence, and he was designated as, you know, somebody in the United States as somebody who was held. I forget the phrase right now, but somebody was, you know, held without proper justification. And so, all of that has resulted in a series of negotiations, which has led now to today Stephen Hubbard finally being released from his detention. He was being held a long distance from Moscow in Mordovia, in fact, where -- you know, out in the provinces of Russia, where he's been suffering, apparently, some very bad health problems. And so, that may have played a part in the release as well.
[02:05:03]
What we do know right now is that Steve Witkoff, who's in the same room right now as Vladimir Putin, meeting him, I think, for the eighth time, has thanked Putin for that release and that Stephen Hubbard has been -- is said to be at the airport in St. Petersburg. Presumably, he'll fly back, if not with Steve Witkoff, then sort of on a plane shortly before or shortly afterwards.
It seems to have been, you know, the highlight so far of this meeting between Steve Witkoff, the chief or one of the top U.S. negotiators, and the Russian President Vladimir Putin. There was nothing more substantial than that, though, at the moment in the -- in these first moments that have come out.
Witkoff went in saying he's got new proposals to present to President Putin about the possibility of ending the war in Ukraine. Putin essentially sidestepped talking about any of that. Instead, he emphasized the economic deals between the United States and Russia, praising the recent diesel deal, which was agreed with President Trump to provide the U.S. or provide the international markets with, you know, large amounts of diesel from Russian refineries. He talked about how in the future Russia could provide and supply fertilizers to the United States as well. And generally said he was looking forward to restoring economic cooperation between Russia and the United States.
And so, you know, a real sign of how Putin sees this kind of meeting with that U.S. negotiator not as an opportunity necessarily to make concessions on the Ukraine war, but more to offer what one European official told me earlier today were baubles to dazzle and distract the White House so it didn't have to make the kind of hard concessions on the Ukraine war that the White House is looking for.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHURCH: Joining me now from London is Orysia Lutsevych, head of the Ukraine Forum at Chatham House, and deputy director of the Russia and Eurasia program. Appreciate you joining us.
ORYSIA LUTSEVYCH, HEAD, UKRAINE FORUM AT CHATHAM HOUSE: Good to be with you back.
CHURCH: Of course. So, let's start with the big news of the day. President Trump's special envoy Steve Witkoff calling President Vladimir Putin, a humanitarian, after the Russian leader released the 74-year-old American Stephen Hubbard from four years of imprisonment in that country, the use of that word is causing considerable backlash, including from some Republican lawmakers. What was your response when you heard it? LUTSEVYCH: Well, it's obviously a mission on flattery of a dictator
that is killing hundreds of thousands of people in Ukraine at the time, as Steve Witkoff is in the capital. It's duplicity. I think it's a mission to please and get what actually President Trump wants ahead of the midterm elections that are not going so well for him, ironically, as badly as Putin's war is going for him.
So, I think each of them is trying to show that they can be helpful to each other's political aims, and that is why we are seeing this release as a humanitarian gesture, and nothing asking in exchange, as President Trump said.
In fact, Putin is asking something in exchange, and that is a trilateral meeting between Xi, Trump and himself in China in November.
CHURCH: Now, Witkoff was in St. Petersburg Wednesday, of course, for talks with Putin on ending the war in Ukraine, and after nearly three hours, Putin agreed to resume trilateral talks with the U.S. and Ukraine after November 10th. But as Ukraine's President Zelenskyy points out, we've heard this before. How likely is it, do you think, the trilateral talks will indeed take place after the midterms?
LUTSEVYCH: Not only we have heard it before, they have already taken place in Riyadh several months ago. There were a series round of conversations at a so-called technical level, not the heads of states, but the heads of delegations representing Ukraine, Russia, and United States discussing how the conflict could end. The news back then was that they have reached an agreement, but that it was the top political level, such as mainly Putin, who keeps pushing for maximalist demands at that time. For example, demanding that Ukraine retreats from its sovereign territory, whereas Ukraine was insisting that the war should stop along the current front line.
So, to be honest, there is nothing new that was announced after these conversations.
CHURCH: And Orysia, in recent days and weeks, of course, we have seen the U.S. back away from Ukraine, even reportedly withholding critical intel on Russian attacks and Patriot missiles. President Trump recently signed an executive order waiving new sanctions on Russia to allow that country's diesel fuel to be sold in accordance with a deal made between Trump and Putin.
So, if trilateral talks do go ahead, what all can be achieved, and will Ukraine be forced to accept a deal that favors Russia?
[02:10:07]
LUTSEVYCH: Well, I think all of this shuttle diplomacy should be set in the context of midterm elections in the United States. It's very much for Trump's voters and this segment of Republican Party to demonstrate that actually he can make deals. He promised to end the war in one day, in 24 hours. He didn't.
So, here, the news will be that he achieved a diesel deal and he has achieved the release of an American citizen. But he is not achieving to compel Russia to agree to a reasonable terms of the end of the war.
Ukraine is not standing alone. Ukraine is standing with Europe, as we have seen. President Zelenskyy was recently in London, in Oslo, together with the Finnish president and Norwegian prime minister, and they all are keeping a united front. That it does matter for Europe how this war ends, and that deals about Ukraine should not be negotiated between the three powers like China, Russia, and United States, who want to carve out world for the spheres of dominance.
So, this is what we are talking about: United States actually pushing for the outcome that will threaten not only Ukraine but wider Europe.
CHURCH: Orysia Lutsevych, appreciate you joining us and sharing your perspective on this issue. Thank you.
LUTSEVYCH: Thank you.
CHURCH: Well, yet another international airport in Saudi Arabia has come under attack. Authorities say at least one person was killed in Dammam and eight others wounded. Damage assessments are still underway. No claim of responsibility yet, but Yemen's Houthi rebels have vowed to keep striking prominent Saudi targets.
And that was the U.S. State Department issuing new security alerts warning Americans to be aware of potential attacks on airports. Non- essential embassy staff have also been ordered out of the Saudi capital, the Iran-backed Houthis have launched a series of deadly strikes on the Riyadh International Airport in recent days.
President Trump is calling the war with Iran, "One of the greatest things we've done." He said the decision to attack took a lot of courage and stopped Iran from having a nuclear weapon. A new CNN poll shows just 30 percent of Americans approve of his handling of foreign affairs.
Well, now to the U.S. midterm elections. President Trump is adding the Republican stronghold of Mississippi to his campaign blitz next week. He was in South Carolina supporting incumbent Senator Darline Graham on Wednesday. Campaign filings show the president's political machine still has more than $180 million in reserves to boost Republicans' chances.
A new CNN poll shows President Trump with a record low approval rating of just 32 percent. Economic concerns are the number one issue for voters, and respondents rate the president very poorly. Only 27 percent approve, 73 percent disapprove.
Voters in Michigan are getting a closer look at the candidates for U.S. Senate. Republican Mike Rogers and Democrat Abdul El-Sayed clashed in a debate Wednesday night in Detroit. Rogers claimed El- Sayed was aligned with Democratic Socialists and was bought off by the Muslim Brotherhood.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MIKE ROGERS (R), SENATORIAL NOMINEE OF MICHIGAN: If you are going to go to the United States Senate, we need to know: Are you for America or are you for these terrorist groups overseas? You can grin and you can smile and you can talk real pretty, but I'm going to tell you what, that is a risk to our national security.
ABDUL EL-SAYED (D), SENATORIAL NOMINEE OF MICHIGAN: To bring into question my commitment to the Constitution is really beneath you. I am proud of America. I'm proud to be an American. I'm proud of our constitution that guarantees all of us the right to pray as we choose to pray.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHURCH: Kansas incumbent Republican Senator Roger Marshall squared off with Democratic challenger Adam Hamilton. Marshall continued to align himself with President Trump on issues including taxes and the war with Iran. Hamilton tried to claim the middle ground, saying he doesn't support socialism, Medicare for All, or the Green New Deal.
Serbia's student movement is rallying supporters ahead of Sunday's elections. Thousands of people marched through the streets of Belgrade Wednesday. The movement has grown over the past two years to become one of the most powerful groups in the country. It has published a list of candidates from a variety of backgrounds in this election as it challenges Serbia's long ruling leader.
[02:15:06]
Well, there is much more to come here on CNN NEWSROOM, including Israel's prime minister fights for his political survival as voters prepare to head to the polls. We have a political observer from Israel, we'll look into his chances for keeping his job.
Plus, residents in a deeply red Kentucky district are fighting plans for a massive data center in their town, and they know exactly who should pay the political price.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN SENIOR CORRESPONDENT: Do you think this issue is going to hurt Republicans in the midterms?
DELSIA BARE, KENTUCKY FARM OWNER: I hope it hurts them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
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[02:20:05]
CHURCH: Welcome back, everyone.
A U.S. congressional candidate is pushing back against a claim that he posed a security risk when he was detained by the Israeli military in the West Bank. Brad Lander was taken into custody along with dozens of other volunteers helping Palestinians harvest olives. The IDF says the group was a security risk because the harvest had not been coordinated with Israeli officials. But Lander calls that claim a lie, saying Palestinians don't need permission to harvest their own crops. He has since been released and is calling for the release of other volunteers still in custody. Lander is running for Congress in New York.
Israeli voters are headed to the polls next week in the first national election since the October 7th Hamas attack. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is facing an uphill battle to keep his seat, while also facing a corruption trial at home and an arrest warrant by the International Criminal Court.
His main challenger is Gadi Eisenkot, a former military chief and a relative newcomer to politics. Analysts say part of his appeal is that he is the polar opposite of Mr. Netanyahu, understated and undramatic. Voters can also relate to his personal story, which includes losing his son and two nephews in combat during this war.
But Netanyahu is known as a political survivor who has outplayed multiple challenges over the years.
Joining me now is Dahlia Scheindlin, political analyst and senior columnist at Haaretz. Appreciate you joining us.
DAHLIA SCHEINDLIN, POLITICAL ANALYST AND SENIOR COLUMNIST, HAARETZ: Thank you for having me.
CHURCH: So, with the Israeli election just days away on October 27th, you recently wrote a piece in the New York Times about Israelis feeling abandoned by Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and his government, and you say they may decide to replace him with retired general and grieving father Gadi Eisenkot, who represents a serious challenge to Netanyahu.
So, how likely is it really that Eisenkot and his party could topple Netanyahu and form a viable government?
SCHEINDLIN: Well, thank you. I'm only asking -- I'm only smiling because it's a very hard call. Nobody can really predict. And you know, the Israelis I was talking about, who have expressed such a profound level of abandonment, it's a word that comes up over and over, feel it so strongly that it's practically, in their words, in the words of these voters, something like a breach between the citizens and the government, or even between the citizens and the state for the failures of October 7th, for the failure for the government to take accountability for October 7th through a commission of inquiry. These are very deep issues.
However, that represents only a portion of the voters. Now, at present, the majority of voters in almost all polls are voting for parties of the opposition, which makes it look more likely that the opposition will win rather than the government, the parties of the coalition of the current government led by Mr. Netanyahu, who are polling very, very steadily at about 50 or 51 parliamentary seats out of 120. Meaning, Netanyahu's government so far is, you know, looking very unlikely to have anything like a majority of the -- of the seats in parliament.
CHURCH: How different would Eisenkot be to Netanyahu when it comes to leadership style and policy? What does he stand for?
SCHEINDLIN: Well, this is a very good question. In terms of leadership style, he is fundamentally different. Many Israelis also see him as you know the anti-Netanyahu in the sense that he has somebody who he was a former chief of staff. He spent his life, you know, in the army, and so for many Israelis they view that as somebody who has put his entire his investment his career in something that is above politics, and I think they hope that he will bring that to the premiership if he is elected, and that they believe that he will work on behalf of Israelis in a way that Netanyahu, again, supporters of Eisenkot have come to believe that Netanyahu and his government have are working only on behalf of their core constituencies, or even their personal, you know, families and cronies, and so they feel that's among the reasons why they feel so left behind by this government.
So, there is a sense that Eisenkot may get back to a government that looks something like the changed government from 2021, which had a number of different parties representing different ideological issues, but tried to advance policies that they felt were for the benefit of most of the state.
CHURCH: And of course, we have seen many tight Israeli elections in the recent past, and they've all ended in Netanyahu winning. We also know he has a lot to lose if he doesn't win the election, and given the corruption charges he faces. So, how is Netanyahu fighting back against this serious challenge from Eisenkot, and how dirty is it getting?
[02:25:07]
SCHEINDLIN: The World Health Organization will hold a briefing in the coming hours to address the Ebola outbreak in Africa. The WHO says it's the fastest-growing outbreak of the disease in history, spreading farther across Africa than any previous outbreak.
Nigeria has become the latest country affected, with cases also recorded in Uganda and Kenya, and one recorded case in France. The outbreak was first declared in eastern Congo in mid-May, and has killed at least 4,600 people there.
We have an encouraging update on Pope Leo's health. The Vatican says he will not need any more treatment for lung cancer after a successful surgery last week. Doctors say the cancer was localized, and the all clear arrives ahead of the pontiff's planned South America trip next month.
Well, Pope Leo held his first general audience on Wednesday at the Vatican since his surgery. The 71-year-old pontiff waved to crowds and blessed babies while riding in the popemobile through St. Peter's Square. Here's his message to the crowd.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
POPE LEO, HEAD OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH (through translator): The first thing I would like to say to you is thank you. Thank you for the support of your press. Thanks be to God for His generosity. Let us all renew our trust in the goodness and mercy of God.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHURCH: And still ahead here on this hour of CNN NEWSROOM, the U.S. Department of Homeland Security has been given the green light to test a controversial military weapon for possible use along the southern border. We'll have details after the break.
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[02:33:00]
CHURCH: Welcome back, everyone. I'm Rosemary Church. More now on the war in Ukraine, where a new generation of Russian jet-powered drones are wreaking havoc across the country.
They're much faster and more difficult to intercept. CNN's Nick Paton Walsh gets a rare look at a captured drone and the Western-made components inside.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL SECURITY EDITOR (voice-over): It's that roar, terrifying and new. The jet engines of the latest Russian drone horror in Ukrainian skies, faster, more precise and deadlier.
Here, causing students to flee in Kyiv. CNN got a rare glimpse of what makes the Geran-4 jet-powered Russian drone so terrifying. Defense Intelligence Ukraine sent us video of one of their experts dismantling a trophy model, one that didn't blow up when it was downed.
They're fast, up to 375 miles an hour because of these jet engines.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The difference is that this engine is more powerful. It is produced in China by Telefly. But now, Russia is capable of making a full copy. They show us the brains, components they say were made in China, the labeling of which the Russians have scratched off to hide their origins. And what's key, this so-called mesh modem, which bounces signals off other drones in the sky to make a network, that means they can send video and radio live feeds back to Russian operators.
Horrific precision like this in Kyiv, possible because the Russian operators can see live feeds of where they're going and what they will hit. The Geran-4 are fast, you have to be lucky to hit them, and they still come tumbling down.
[02:35:00]
Russian video gloats at this new capability, their new toy, mass- produced in their enormous Alabuga factory in the east and the Kyiv bridges that it hit. But this is not a Russian-only creation. We're shown how it relies on lots of western parts bought anywhere and anyhow on the open global market. UNIDENTIFIED MALE, UKRAINE DEFENSE INTELLIGENCE OFFICIAL: This is a flight control unit. This one, they have different boards. This is a Texas Instruments, U.S.-made component. And you can see --
PATON WALSH: Every single --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- all boards.
PATON WALSH: How would you know they're Texas Instruments if they've scratched off the markings?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can see here, it is in the right angle you can see the true marking.
PATON WALSH: Doesn't it shock you that this is still available to them?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's not shocking because it's not a military component. It's a common use. You can buy it everywhere. We're living in a free, open world. And it's very difficult to broke these chains, world chains of markets.
PATON WALSH (voice-over): There's no suggestion Texas Instruments has any role in supply. And they told us they strongly oppose Russian use and all shipments to Russia are illicit and unauthorized.
What's new today will tomorrow be old in a horrific race to learn, improve, kill, and then repeat it all over again.
Nick Paton Walsh, CNN, Kyiv.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHURCH: An advanced U.S. weapon that shoots heat rays could soon be deployed in border patrol operations. The Pentagon has authorized the U.S. Homeland Security to begin testing the weapon. It creates an intense burning sensation on the skin, similar to the blast of heat from opening a hot oven. We get more from CNN's Zachary Cohen.
ZACHARY COHEN, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER: The Pentagon has authorized the Department of Homeland Security to test a military- grade heat ray and develop tactics for potentially using it at the U.S. southern border. Now, this is a controversial system known as an Active Denial System. And it's developed primarily for crowd control purposes.
It is something that is capable of firing an energy beam more than a mile and a half away. And it's intended to be used against humans. And it inflicts a very specific effect when it touches the human skin. Military officials have characterized it as a burning sensation that also generates an instinctive and irresistible urge to run from the effect.
Now, this has been a system that the Department of Homeland Security and Customs and Border Patrol have discussed using at the U.S. southern border in the past. But ultimately, top officials, including those working under the first Trump administration, opted against using it at that location due to concerns about its legality and morality.
This is a system that was developed primarily to be used overseas in combat operations. It was briefly deployed to Afghanistan back in the early 2000s, but was never used and actually sent back to the United States without any sort of use or function.
Now, US officials have also considered using this system against U.S. citizens, including at the end of the Trump administration, in response to protests after the shooting of George Floyd. And it was then that U.S. officials again denied requests from then the National Guard to acquire the system and potentially use it against those Americans.
Now, this all comes as Defense Secretary, Pete Hegseth has really emphasized the need to test directed energy weapons in the context of the U.S. southern border. His deputy chief of staff, after our reporting published, wrote on X, quote, "The border is now a military installation and a battle lab for testing new systems to include directed energy weapons."
The Customs and Border Patrol also providing CNN with a statement in response to our reporting, saying, quote, "CBP is continually evaluating new technologies, especially those that enhance operational effectiveness and strengthen mission capabilities. But again, those pervasive concerns have been raised in the past by CBP officials, including if it's used against migrants who are trying to illegally cross into the United States, particularly if it's used as they're trying to cross the river, it could potentially create a scenario where it would increase the amount of rescues that Border Patrol agents would have to perform to prevent those individuals from potentially drowning.
So all of these questions, concerns will have to be addressed as the Department of Homeland Security and CBP continue to test and develop new ways of potentially using this system. I mean, it's one that has decades of history and information about the concerns themselves. Ultimately, we'll have to see if it is ultimately deployed to the U.S. southern border or used against migrants.
Zachary Cohen, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
[02:40:00]
CHURCH: Officials in Toledo, Ohio, say a tank that leaked a hazardous chemical has cooled down. The leak forced hundreds of residents to evacuate or shelter in place on Wednesday. Health officials say about 30 people were treated for symptoms potentially related to the leak, like a burning sensation in the eyes, nose, mouth and on the skin.
Officials had feared the leak may cause an explosion and the incident is being investigated. We have much more coming up here on the show including a technology originally designed to detect sharks now being used to spot one of Australia's most iconic animals.
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[02:45:19]
CHURCH: Australia's koala population is under threat. Koalas now face multiple risks from deforestation, bushfires and climate change. Today on Call to Earth, we look at how drone technology is being used to help keep track of one of Australia's most beloved species.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LYNDA KINKADE, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): In Australia's northeast on Magnetic Island, a team of drone pilots take to the sky as part of a pioneering initiative. They're searching for one of the country's most iconic and elusive species.
JASON YOUNG, MANAGING DIRECTOR, RIPPER CORPORATION: So that didn't take long. Yeah, wow.
KINKADE (voice-over): Using drones equipped with cutting-edge imaging technology, the Great Magnetic Island Koala Count aims to complete the most comprehensive survey of the island's koala population ever undertaken.
YOUNG: We've now completed Phase I of that project and detected 46 koalas in a specific area, and a really important area for the research.
KINKADE (voice-over): Ripper Corp. originally designed their drones for identifying threats to swimmers as well as for search and rescue efforts at sea. As their technology advanced, so too did their opportunity to aid conservation efforts.
YOUNG: We started out in looking for sharks and crocodiles, and used that technology to move into the bush. So looking for endangered species, especially koalas.
KINKADE (voice-over): In Queensland, the Australian government has listed koalas as endangered since 2022.
YOUNG: Oh wow, a little joey on its back.
KINKADE (voice-over): The koalas that roam these canopies were introduced to the island back in the early 20th century to protect them from threats on the mainland. But the island's terrain, combined with the difficulty in spotting individuals from the ground, can make population counts challenging and expensive.
YOUNG: People often say, oh, there's a couple of koalas up in the hill or there's a few koalas there. But yeah, with our drones, we're able to really count how many are there, provide their exact GPS location and take some great imagery of the koalas without disturbing them in any way.
KINKADE (voice-over): Dr. Ali Bee of the Magnetic Island Koala Hospital, which is a partner of the survey initiative, rescues sick or injured koalas.
DR. ALI BEE, HEAD VETERINARIAN, MAGNETIC ISLAND KOALA HOSPITAL: This is Axel (ph) when he first started having difficulty breathing.
KINKADE (voice-over): She sees promise in the drone's capability to also monitor and track the population after treatment, especially the joeys.
BEE: For me, when we release the hand-raised babies or releasing any of them, it's good to track them where they go after that. It's watching that they can also disperse properly into safe areas.
KINKADE (voice-over): Working alongside her daughter Izzy, they're also collecting genetic information to provide crucial insight about the island's koala population. And they believe the drone surveys will be critical to their research.
BEE: To track the genetic health, we need to know the numbers.
KINKADE (voice-over): A previous ground survey taken more than 10 years ago placed the population between 600 to 800. But after more than 20 years working here, Ali believes the total today is much higher.
BEE: We've had an awful lot of them in if that's the case. We've had nearly 500 in care and a lot of those aren't repeat offenders. So yeah, I think there's a far more accurate way of doing it and I think the drone is the way to go.
YOUNG: I think truly knowing how many are there to begin with and then providing that information beyond universities and research groups and getting it out to government agencies so they can make better decisions, certainly around development sites or adjustments to roads.
And again, that research and the data around where the koalas or other animals are feeding or are living can make better choices around the rehabilitation programs as well. And there's another koala just relaxing, having a sleep in the tree.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHURCH: Gorgeous. Well, so let us know what you're doing to ask the call with the hashtag #calltoearth and we'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[02:52:09]
CHURCH: Welcome back, everyone. Well, Meta has been hit with a $25 billion fine in New Mexico for misleading Facebook users about their privacy. A state judge announced the penalty on Wednesday, saying deception was central to the company's business model.
The case dates back to 2018, when the political consulting firm, Cambridge Analytica obtained private information from up to 87 million Facebook users. Meta says it plans to appeal.
A mother and daughter team is pushing back against plans to build a massive data center in Kentucky. That's happening deep in Trump country, where Meta wants to build a so-called hyperscale data center. But as Donie O'Sullivan reports, residents are rallying against the facility and second-guessing Trump's A.I. policies.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BROOKE MCGOWAN, HUMANS FIRST ACTIVIST: We are responding to this huge data center overreach, what looks like an invasion across our country, this explosion.
DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN SENIOR CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Here in Maysville, Kentucky, a Trump stronghold, activists and locals have gathered to protest the building of a massive A.I. data center by Mark Zuckerberg's Meta.
MCGOWAN: Not all progress is good. All right?
O'SULLIVAN: President Trump recently, I think he said, you know, communities that don't want A.I. centers want to stay backward or something like that.
MCGOWAN: I did hear that.
(LAUGH)
O'SULLIVAN: When you hear that, how did you feel?
MCGOWAN: I said, well, I guess I'm going to be backwards and poor.
(LAUGH)
MCGOWAN: But I also want to reiterate that not everything the president does do I agree with, but not everything my husband does do I agree with.
MAX MORAN, MASON COUNTY RESIDENT: I'm Republican, but due to his stance, I feel he's going to cost the Republicans the House and the Senate, maybe not big margins. It might be very slim margins, but he needs to reverse his stance.
O'SULLIVAN (voice-over): Max Moran is among the locals who have organized to oppose the data center.
MORAN: So that is Delsia Bare. She's actually nearly blind in her eyes. She's one of the landowners we've been helping since last year. They felt coerced into signing these contracts to sell their land.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Zuckerberg and Meta should have never walked out of that courtroom with a dime left in their damn pockets. (APPLAUSE)
O'SULLIVAN (voice-over): Delsia and her mother, Ida, live on a 1,200- acre farm a few miles outside of town. The pair made headlines around the world when it was reported they turned down $26 million to sell their land.
IDA HUDDLESTON, KENTUCKY FARM OWNER: They come through the door around May the 2nd, 2025, and said, we want to buy your land for $35,000 an acre.
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O'SULLIVAN: Technically, on the contract, you don't know who's trying to buy your land.
DELSIA BARE, KENTUCKY FARM OWNER: Nope, it's a non-disclosure agreement.
O'SULLIVAN: But people here believe it's Mark Zuckerberg, it's Meta?
BARE: Mom goes through the contracts, really, with fine-tooth comb. She says, I don't care what you do, but get out of this.
O'SULLIVAN: What does the land mean to both of you?
BARE: Freedom.
HUDDLESTON: Yeah, life and freedom.
BARE: Should I choose to live totally off of this land that we've got, I could. I wouldn't have to be beholden to anything out there.
O'SULLIVAN: Did they tell you what they wanted to do with the land?
BARE: No, they did not tell us what they wanted to do with the land. They were just in a very big hurry to get it off of you as fast as possible.
O'SULLIVAN (voice-over): Trump won this Kentucky county in the last election by a 44-point margin.
HUDDLESTON: I voted for Trump. I have every time he's run. I would go questioning it now.
O'SULLIVAN: Trump said if you're against data centers, you're going to end up backward and poor.
BARE: And that sort of pisses you off when you're from Appalachia anyway, you've always been backward and poor.
O'SULLIVAN: Do you think this issue is going to hurt Republicans in the midterms?
BARE: I hope it hurts them. They need to be voted out.
HUDDLESTON: Voted out.
O'SULLIVAN (voice-over): In this Bible Belt household, this fight is spiritual.
O'SULLIVAN: For you, it's about more than land.
BARE: It's about humanity. If we don't stop this, there's not going to be a future for humanity. That's anti-human. That's what A.I. is. Oh, let's let it make the decision. But it doesn't have any morals. And it can't be held to God's standards.
O'SULLIVAN: Is there any amount of money Zuckerberg can give you to get the hell out of here?
BARE: Nope.
HUDDLESTON: No.
O'SULLIVAN: Really?
BARE: Really. Her last words to him was, you may get it, but you have brought (ph) me out of your feet first. You can bring the bulldozers if you want to. You'll have to bulldoze it down around my head.
O'SULLIVAN: You're really going up against -- it's David and Goliath here.
BARE: But I'll remind you, it only took one stone to bring down a Philistine. One itty bitty little stone in the right place can bring down any giant that there is on this planet.
O'SULLIVAN (voice-over): Donie O'Sullivan, CNN, Kentucky.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHURCH: And thanks so much for your company this hour. I'm Rosemary Church. "CNN Newsroom" with Christina Macfarlane in London is next. Do stay with us.
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