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Trump Administration Tells Agencies To Carry Out Widespread Layoffs; Vance To WSJ: Sending U.S. Troops To Ukraine Is "On The Table"; Jets Moving On From Rodgers. Aired 5:30-6a ET
Aired February 14, 2025 - 05:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL)
[05:32:00]
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Just after 5:30 a.m. on the East Coast. A live look there at the Capitol Hill. Good morning, everyone. I'm Jim Sciutto in this week for Kasie Hunt. It's great to have you with us.
Scores of federal workers' jobs on the chopping block as the Trump administration instructs federal agencies to move forward with layoffs. Probationary workers who have been employed for less than a year or two taking the brunt of this hit. Officials targeting their positions because they have fewer job protections than other federal employees and are not able to appeal the decision. According to recent data there are more than 200,000 employees who fall into that category.
Come of the agencies hit hardest this week, the Department of Education, the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, the Department of Veterans Affairs, the Small Business Administration, and the Department of Energy.
Those firings come as President Trump, with the help of Elon Musk and his so-called Department of Government Efficiency, or DOGE, swiftly moved to shrink the size of the federal workforce and restructure the very workings of the federal government.
Democrats are trying to push back against the changes. It's proven an uphill battle as they have little leverage in Republican-controlled Washington.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. VERONICA ESCOBAR (D-TX): There are public servants across the nation who go to work every single day to fulfill their duties and their obligations to the American people, and all of them are at risk.
REP. JOSH BRECHEEN (R-OK): Excess federal employment and liberal ideology go hand in hand. We, again, need an efficient government; not one -- not a government creating jobs for the sake of creating government jobs.
(END VIDEO CLIP) SCIUTTO: Joining me now CNN senior political analyst and senior editor at The Atlanta, Ron Brownstein. Ron, thanks so much for joining this morning.
RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST, SENIOR EDITOR, THE ATLANTIC (via Webex by Cisco): Good morning.
SCIUTTO: So set aside policy for a moment here and let's talk purely politics. Axios has a story out this morning about focus groups in Arizona where folks there -- swing voters saying keep at it. Keep chopping government. And I just wonder from a purely political standpoint do Trump and Musk have the politics right for now?
BROWNSTEIN: Yeah. Well look, first, I think this -- what we're watching is less about reducing the deficit than it is about changing the federal government's role in U.S. society. You know, the federal workforce is a lot of people, and it seems like a lot of money but it's kind of -- kind of small change next to the big entitlement programs -- Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid --
SCIUTTO: Right.
BROWNSTEIN: -- that drive the federal budget. So this is really about changing what the federal government does, I think, under the guise of efficiency more than it is about trying to control federal spending.
And yeah -- look, I don't think this is going to be the central front of how the public reacts to Trump. I do think the question of whether they are following the law in all of these cases and certainly with the resignation of the Southern District of New York attorney yesterday kind of crystalizing that issue --
[05:35:10]
SCIUTTO: Um-hum.
BROWNSTEIN: -- I think that is -- that is the question.
But really, Jim, I think that the central argument is going to be about whether Trump is delivering on his promise to make life more affordable for average families or whether he is, in fact -- his agenda making things harder for average families and further enriching his rich buddies.
The budget fight, which is kind of heading down the tracks after last night's approval in the -- in the House budget committee which essentially will pit tax cuts that mostly benefit --
SCIUTTO: Right.
BROWNSTEIN: -- people at the top against spending cuts on programs for people in the middle and below -- I think that is going to be a more central front in defining the political terms of this than the reductions in the federal workforce.
SCIUTTO: Well, I want to get to that budget plan. Before we do, you mentioned entitlements, and Medicaid being one of them. It seems to be one of the biggest targets of coming --
BROWNSTEIN: Yeah.
SCIUTTO: -- cuts.
Notably, former Trump adviser Steve Bannon -- he issued a warning about cutting Medicaid. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEVE BANNON, FORMER TRUMP WHITE HOUSE CHIEF STRATEGIST: Stop warning about entitlements. Get into that discretionary spending. Get into the Pentagon.
Get into Medicaid. Medicaid -- you've got to be careful because a lot of MAGAs on Medicaid. I'm telling you, if you don't think so you are dead wrong. Medicaid is going to be a complicated one. You just can't take a meat axe to it, although I would love to.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: He'd love to. He's been attacking the administrative --
BROWNSTEIN: Well, why would he want to (PH)?
SCIUTTO: -- state for ages.
BROWNSTEIN: Yeah.
SCIUTTO: Is he onto something -- they are right?
BROWNSTEIN: Well, I would love to.
SCIUTTO: Because a lot of red states depend -- they don't like to advertise it --
BROWNSTEIN: No.
SCIUTTO: -- depend on Medicaid funds.
BROWNSTEIN: Well, you know, the Affordable Care Act fundamentally changed the politics of Medicaid, as I wrote a couple of weeks ago on cnn.com. You know, cutting Medicaid was one of the cornerstones of the Republican budget plan in '95'-'96, which was the last time that they explicitly tied together spending cuts and tax cuts. They didn't do that in '01, '03, and 2017. They did the sugar -- the tax cuts.
This reverts back to the strategy of Gingrich who had one bill that cut taxes and cut spending. And ultimately, Bill Clinton turned around his presidency by arguing that Republicans were cutting these programs that benefit the middle class to fund tax cuts for the rich.
Seventy-two million people on Medicaid, post the Affordable Care Act. That includes people -- a lot more people who work. People between 100 and 138 percent of poverty. The Medicaid expansion that was approved in the ACA. Between the coasts, especially, most of those people who are -- who are people -- very low income working people. They're mostly non-college whites in these -- you know, in these interior states who are Republican voters.
Rural communities are more dependent on Medicaid --
SCIUTTO: Um-hum.
BROWNSTEIN: -- than urban ones because fewer people have employer- provided health care. And rural hospitals will struggle if the kind of cuts that are now moving down the track, based on the House budget committee vote yesterday, actually do go forward.
SCIUTTO: Right.
BROWNSTEIN: So this is going to be, you know -- don't forget on the other side you have the freedom caucus basically saying we are not going to let you cut taxes as much as you need if you don't pair it with -- explicitly pair it with spending cuts -- which, as I've said, reverts to a strategy that really didn't work out very well for Republicans 30 years ago and that they've avoided ever since.
SCIUTTO: All right. Now, of course, another target of the administration has been DEI or -- including many things that identifies as DEI aren't actually DEI.
Regardless, I want to ask you about your --
BROWNSTEIN: Yeah.
SCIUTTO: -- new piece.
You write this: "This diversity counteroffensive is advancing precisely as kids of color have become a solid majority of the nation's youth. Since the start of the 21st century, young whites have been rapidly declining not only as a share of the overall youth population, but also in their absolute numbers -- to an extent possibly unprecedented in American history. This tectonic reshaping of the American population means that demography, not Democrats, will likely emerge as the biggest obstacle to Trump's campaign to uproot DEI."
Let me ask you because there has been some reporting and some polling that indicates that some members of minority groups actually support --
BROWNSTEIN: Yeah.
SCIUTTO: -- the limitations on DEI.
Where do you think the politics are, and is it clear?
BROWNSTEIN: Yeah. Well look -- I mean, any -- the public has always had resistance to anything that seems like it raises racial considerations over abstract kind of notions of merit. That is a kind of longstanding --
SCIUTTO: Yeah.
BROWNSTEIN: -- reality in public opinion.
But the underlying reality that we face is that we -- the administration and red states are on this tremendous offensive to uproot any kind of programs to promote more diversity and educational employment opportunities precisely as the economies need to lift more non-white young people is probably greater than ever.
[05:40:00]
As you note in what I wrote, the economy -- the demographer Bill Frey points out that not only is the share of white kids declining in the last quarter-century, but the absolute numbers. There are 8.8 million --
SCIUTTO: Yeah.
BROWNSTEIN: -- fewer white kids under 18 today than there were in 2000. In 47 of the 50 states there are -- not only are white kids a smaller share of the total, there are a smaller absolute number. And that means we kind of -- and yet, if you look at educational opportunity and you look at economic opportunity Black and Latino kids are still significantly underrepresented in the most elite colleges --
SCIUTTO: Yeah.
BROWNSTEIN: -- the highest paying jobs, et cetera.
And so you're left with one of two possibilities. Either we don't have enough skilled workers going forward unless we move more of these non- white young kids into the -- you know, into higher skills and middle- class jobs, or we have a more expressly stratified two-tier almost --
SCIUTTO: Yeah.
BROWNSTEIN: -- almost caste-like society in which non-white young people are a majority of our future workers, taxpayers, but the best -- you know, the people at the top are still predominantly white. Either one is a pretty ominous future.
SCIUTTO: Well, and we're already seeing the effects of the Supreme Court decision on affirmative action in terms of the makeup of top universities.
Ron Brownstein, thanks so much.
BROWNSTEIN: Thanks for having me.
SCIUTTO: Coming up, President Trump says Vladimir Putin wants peace. How a new threat from Vice President J.D. Vance could impact those discussions.
Plus, after a short but disappointing time with the New York Jets -- boy, for real -- Aaron Rodgers is now out of a job. So where, if anywhere, will he land next? (COMMERCIAL)
[05:45:50]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETE HEGSETH, SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: These negotiations are led by President Trump. Everything is on the table in his conversations with Vladimir Putin and Zelenskyy.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Everything's on the table -- there, Pete Hegseth saying that.
Vice President J.D. Vance told The Wall Street Journal that sending U.S. troops to Ukraine is a possibility if Moscow fails to negotiate in good faith to end the war in Ukraine. But the vice president added he thinks there will be a deal that "will shock a lot of people."
That interview came after President Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin had a conversation about negotiations.
This is a live picture, by the way, of the Ukrainian president in Munich.
Notably, they left out Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy.
Joining us now is Jasmine El-Gamal. She's a former Middle East adviser to the Pentagon. She is now in Munich for the security conference there. Jasmine, thanks so much for joining.
JASMINE EL-GAMAL, FORMER PENTAGON MIDDLE EAST ADVISER (via Webex by Cisco): Thank you for having me, Jim.
SCIUTTO: I wonder who people in Munich believe, right? Because the vice president says sending troops is on the table. We're going to ratchet up pressure. The defense secretary said prior to that no -- U.S. troops were off the table. The president, who really is the only one who matters here, is saying things like we should bring Russia back into the G7 and is repeating Kremlin talking points for how this war started, and says he trusts Putin.
Who do people in Europe believe are actually going to lead these negotiations? What do they believe are the actual U.S. positions going into these negotiations?
EL-GAMAL: Well, I want to point out, Jim, a couple of statements that we've heard from the Americans and the Europeans over the last couple of days that really tell us a lot about the way things are going at the moment and the daylight between the Europeans and the Americans.
Now, as you said, I'm here in Munich not for the security conference itself but for events around the security conference. But, of course, this is where a lot of these conversations are going to be taking place. Now, the U.S. Defense Sec. Pete Hegseth said at the Ukraine defense contact group in Brussels a couple of days ago something that was really -- it couldn't be clearer in terms of the U.S. position.
He said, "We are also here today to directly and unambiguously express that stark strategic realities prevent the United States from being primarily focused on the security of Europe." He just laid that out very clearly. He said, "Europeans will have to take the lead for security in their own neighborhood."
And that is the way that you're going to see these talks playing out and that's the way that these conversations with Putin and with Zelenskyy are playing out. The U.S. is basically saying we have to face the realities and we're going to operate based on those realities.
And now the Europeans are quite nervous about that because what they are saying is wait a minute -- you can't make any deal above our heads because any deal will actually have to be implemented by Europeans and by the Ukrainians.
SCIUTTO: The thing is Trump appears quite ready to make a deal above their heads. I mean, he directly called Putin and only later had a discussion with the Ukrainian president. He hasn't made clear what central role, if any, European will play in these negotiations even though Ukraine, of course, is part of Europe.
So how do European leaders say they're going to respond to this? Do they have a credible defense plan to replace what the U.S. would be taking away in terms of being a guarantor in effect or -- of their security?
EL-GAMAL: Well, that's the really big question is what can they do now given that Trump has already set the talks kind of way ahead of where they wanted to be.
So Kaja Kallas, the foreign policy chief of the EU, said that you can't offer everything upfront before even starting negotiations.
[05:50:00]
So the Americans have already said no to NATO enlargement. They said no --
SCIUTTO: Yeah.
EL-GAMAL: -- to U.S. security guarantees in the form of troops in Europe.
And so the Europeans are saying well, how do you even negotiate now that you've basically given Putin everything that he wants?
So it's going to be really difficult to see how the Europeans try to walk that back with the Americans today and say --
SCIUTTO: Yeah. EL-GAMAL: -- OK, if you're not going to provide NATO enlargement or agree to NATO enlargement -- which is, as the Europeans say, the cheapest and strongest security guaranty -- how can we come up with other ideas? But the Europeans, to be very clear, are very, very uncomfortable --
SCIUTTO: Yeah.
EL-GAMAL: -- and very, very nervous right now, Jim.
SCIUTTO: Yeah. They have to deal with Ukraine's security going forward but also their own.
Jasmine El-Gamal --
EL-GAMAL: Yeah.
SCIUTTO: -- thanks so much for joining.
EL-GAMAL: Thanks for having me.
SCIUTTO: All right, time now for a little break -- sports.
After two really disappointing seasons, the Aaron Rodgers era with the New York Jets is officially over.
Coy Wire has this morning's CNN sports update. Listen, as a -- as a New York sports fan it didn't work, right? I mean, I've got to say when I read this headline I had some relief.
COY WIRE, CNN SPORTS ANCHOR: Hey -- you know, Buffalo is in New York, Jim. Come on over to the Bills, baby.
SCIUTTO: I will -- I might take them at this point.
WIRE: There we go.
The Jets -- they hoped Aaron Rodgers would help end their 14-season playoff drought -- the longest active streak among America's four biggest pro sports leagues -- but no. Rodgers' debut with the Jets two seasons ago ended with a season-ending Achilles injury just a few minutes into the first game. And last season he and his Jets only won five games.
Owner Woody Johnson said in a statement, "His arrival in 2023 was met with unbridled excitement and I will forever be grateful that he chose to join us to continue his Hall of Fame career." He went on to say, "He will always be welcome, and I wish him only the best in whatever he chooses to do next."
Now, Rodgers is 41 years old. He played 20 seasons in the league, and he became a legend with the Packers -- Super Bowl champ, four-time MVP.
So what's next? He said after this season he needed some time to decide on whether he will play another season. The NHL's 4 Nations Face-Off featured Team USA taking on Finland.
And brothers Matthew and Brady Tkachuk were playing on the same team for the first time in their careers, and they made the most of it. Brady scoring in the first period. He'd add another goal later, Jim.
Then in the third, U.S. up 2-1. Matthew said hold my beer, bro. A wicked long-range wrister on a power play. He'd score another goal later, too. It sets up a monster matchup of world hockey powers. Team USA and Canada on Saturday. Two Tkachuks, two goals apiece.
Here's Brady on the unforgettable family moment.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRADY TKACHUK, WINGER, TEAM USA: My first thought was my parents, my sister, and then all of our family that -- how happy they must be and how excited they must be. But I was like, all right, I forget here that we've got to play good and stick together. So it was a lot of fun. It's -- honestly, it's a dream come true, and it really hasn't hit me yet.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WIRE: Incredible women's college hoops clash last night, Jim. Number six USC hosting number one UCLA who are the only remaining undefeated team in the nation -- a perfect 23-0 -- until they weren't.
Nineteen-year-old phenom JuJu Watkins, lights out. Six of nine from behind the arc. She had 25 points in the first half, Jim. The rest of her team had 13 combined. The reigning first team All-American ended up dropping 38 on the night with eight blocks in a 71-60 win. Afterward she said I'm just like a kid out there living out my dreams.
The NBA All-Star Game in San Francisco this weekend has a new format. Four teams led by Shaq, Kenny Smith, Charles Barkley, and Candace Parker playing in the tournament.
Our Andy Scholes caught up with some of the team GMs.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDY SCHOLES, CNN SPORTS ANCHOR: Why is your team going to win on Sunday?
CHARLES BARKLEY, BASKETBALL HALL OF FAMER: Well, we've got -- probably got the two best players in the world. Well, Giannis got hurt. We've got Joker. Shai Gilgeous is the MVP right now. So I want -- I know one thing about basketball. It's probably best to have the best players.
SHAQUILLE O'NEAL, 4-TIME NBA CHAMPION: I picked my team because in three or four years a lot of those names won't be here anymore and they going to be doing what we're doing, talking about the game and talking about what they used to do. So, you know, it's going to be a sad moment in time even though we have a lot of great young superstars that could continue to carry the mantle.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WIRE: You can catch all of the All-Star action this weekend on our sister channel TNT beginning with the Rising Stars tonight at 9:00 Eastern.
Jim, did you see how big Shaq was compared to Andy? You know, Andy does CrossFit, so --
SCIUTTO: Yeah, yeah. I mean -- well, he's big, plus he had the hat, right, you know?
WIRE: Yeah, yeah.
SCIUTTO: That's a little -- it gives him a couple of inches.
Coy Wire, thanks so much.
WIRE: You got it.
SCIUTTO: In our next hour on CNN THIS MORNING, refusing to drop the case. Several federal prosecutors hand in their resignations after the DOJ told them to drop the case against Mayor Eric Adams.
Plus, revenge tour? Unincumbered by leadership responsibilities, Sen. Mitch McConnell stands up against President Trump.
[05:55:00]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We have -- we have a very strong party and he's almost not even really a very powerful member in it. I'd say he's not a -- he's lost his power, and it's affected his vote.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL)
SCIUTTO: It's Friday, February 14, Valentine's Day. Right now on CNN THIS MORNING --
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. KATHY HOCHUL, (D) NEW YORK: This is unbelievably unprecedented. The Bondi administration in that Department of Justice is already showing they're corrupt.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Calling it quits. A top prosecutor and DOJ officials step down over orders to drop the federal corruption case against New York City Mayor Eric Adams.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I know him very well. Yeah, I think he wants peace, and I trust him on this subject.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Trust Putin. President Trump believes Vladimir Putin when he says he wants peace. The vice president, however, has issued a warning to Moscow if it does not work in good faith.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I love to fire people. You didn't do your job. I'm sorry. Say hello to your family. You're fired. Get out!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
