Return to Transcripts main page

CNN This Morning

Trump and Putin to Discuss Peace; Moody's Downgrades U.S. Credit Rating; Donna Rice Hughes is Interviewed about the Take It Down Act; Audio Released of Biden's Interview. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired May 19, 2025 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:31:02]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, man, it's a tornado, man. We're in a tornado. Oh (EXPLETIVE DELETED)!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR: Extensive damage this morning from Colorado to Kentucky after violent storms spawned massive twisters.

Good morning, everybody. I'm Audie Cornish. And thank you for joining me on CNN THIS MORNING.

It is half past the hour. Here's what's happening right now.

At least two tornadoes were reported in Colorado Sunday. They flipped mobile homes, snapped large trees in half, and dozens of buildings are damaged this morning. And here's what storms left behind in Kansas. The Midwest is in the crosshairs today, and it could see more tornadoes and baseball-sized hail.

Today, Dawn Richard, former member of the musical group Danity Kane, will be back on the stand to testify in the case against Sean Combs. She began working with Diddy in 2004 while competing on the show, "Making the Band." On Friday, she testified that she saw Combs attack his former girlfriend, Cassie Ventura, in 2009.

And former President Joe Biden is resting at his new home in Delaware following a prostate cancer diagnosis. His office says it's an aggressive form, which has now spread to his bones. The 82-year-old and his family are now weighing treatment options.

And in just a few hours, President Trump expected to speak with Russian President Vladimir Putin on the phone. President Trump says the focus will be how to stop the war and on trade.

Here's his top negotiator, Steve Witkoff.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) STEVE WITKOFF, U.S. SPECIAL ENVOY: The president has a force of personality that is unmatched. I think it's important, his sensibilities are, that he's got to get on the phone with President Putin. And that is going to clear up some of the logjam and get us to the place that we need to get to.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Now, these talks come as Russia unleashed its largest drone attack against Ukraine since the war began. Ukraine's air force says Russia launched more than 270 drones Saturday night alone. Last week, Ukrainian and Russian officials met for the first time since the beginning of the war. A meeting which Putin skipped, leading Ukraine's President Zelenskyy not to go as well.

I'm going to bring in CNN national security analyst and vice president for global studies and fellows at New America, Peter Bergen.

Peter, thanks for being here this morning.

PETER BERGEN, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Thank you, Audie.

CORNISH: So, we're watching Putin basically put in place this kind of negotiate while escalate strategy, right? This is a record drone attack. How does that set the stage going into this phone call?

BERGEN: Well, I think Putin has pretty much indicated that he doesn't really particularly want to negotiate. You know, we'll see how this phone call goes. But 273 drone strikes overnight, as you point out, speaks for itself. A no show in the Istanbul peace conference, the first time that Russia and Ukraine had got to the negotiating table in years also speaks for itself.

The Russians actually continue to, you know, push in eastern Ukraine. They have pushed the Ukrainian military pretty much out of all the -- part of Russia they once had. So, he has the military advantage. It's not a surprise the Ukrainians are seeking a ceasefire. And he's basically ignoring them. I don't think it's, you know, from Putin's point of view, he has no particular interest in stopping when he appears to be, at least not maybe winning, but certainly the Ukrainians are not winning. And so, you know, Trump, of course, is a, you know, a force of personality. He does have his close relationship with Putin. It seems to be mostly the relationship of somebody who is prepared to take Putin's word. You know, he famously told his -- his own intelligence agencies were wrong about the interference in the 2016 presidential election, which the Russians did interfere with.

[06:35:02]

So -- so, it remains to be seen. But there's -- or as you probably know, there was discussions over the weekend with European allies, with President Trump. Clearly the Europeans want to try and solve this. We're now at almost a million casualties on the Russian side, which Russia does have some kind of constraints. He can't -- he can't wage this war forever unless he's going to go, you know, go into conscription, which he's proven that he doesn't want to do. So, you know, I'm glad -- it's good -- good that they're speaking.

CORNISH: Now that Trump has his minerals deal, right, more or less, what is it that, do you think, the U.S. is trying to get out of this situation? What does it mean for sort of the position of the government in this negotiation?

BERGEN: One thing I do think that Trump sincerely does not like war. I mean, there's something about him that does not -- he -- I think he does want to make peace. And he famously said he could solve this in 24 hours. Obviously, that didn't happen.

On the minerals deal, you know, I mean, it's one thing to have a minerals deal on paper. You know, that could take years, if not decades to actually produce. You've got to -- you've got to basically locate the minerals. You've got to mine them. You've got to have the deals. You've got to have the transportation. You've got to -- you know, that's not going to happen overnight. It's good that the Ukrainians have been able to offer something to President Trump, who is, after all, very transactional. And it clearly -- Trump -- Trump's patience with Putin has begun to evaporate. After Trump met with Zelenskyy back -- in Rome, you know, he made some comments about Putin, which were, for the first time, somewhat negative. And I, you know, I don't think Trump -- Trump would like to do this. The question is, what is it? And the Russians have made it pretty clear that they -- their red lines are not red lines that the Crimeans are going to go along with, which is basically, you know, take much of eastern Ukraine, retain Crimea, and -- and make sure that Ukraine could never become part of NATO.

On the other hand, you know, Zelenskyy himself, you know, he is -- they're taking huge -- huge casualties. The public mood in Ukraine is, you know, that -- that peace would be a good thing. So, you know, both sides are -- you know, in any peace negotiation, Audie, there's something called a -- a mutually hurting stalemate. And that is the point where people will begin to say, OK, maybe peace makes sense.

And we are -- you know, the Russians have a slight advantage, but this is ground out on that for so many -- for so long. And both sides have taken so many casualties. Hopefully that the time is ripe for some kind of peace agreement. And, actually, it doesn't need to be a peace agreement. It could be an armistice.

CORNISH: Yes.

BERGEN: I mean think about the situation in Korea right now. There's -- there was never a formal peace agreement. There was just a cessation of hostilities in which -- and that, you know, may be the best we can get.

CORNISH: Peter Bergen, CNN national security analyst. He's also the host of the podcast "In the Room with Peter Bergen."

OK, we want to move on to President Trump's plans to cut taxes and move forward with his tariffs, because that could face a new complication. The U.S. lost its last perfect credit rating over the weekend when Moody's downgraded it a notch, and not because of tariffs, but because of the growing deficit.

Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent is saying that a downgrade doesn't really matter.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SCOTT BESSENT, TREASURY SECRETARY: In the history of rating agencies, by the time they get to a downgrade, everything's already in the market. Larry Summers and I don't agree on everything. But in 2011, the last time -- or two times ago when we had a downgrade, you know, he -- he pooh-poohed it. You know, what I -- what I think is important is that President Trump has just come back from this historic Mideast trip, and there's trillions of dollars coming into the U.S. So, we are seeing confidence from investors. So, I -- I don't put much credence in the Moody's.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: It's worth noting that stock futures are down ahead of the market opening this morning.

So, what does this all mean for you? The group chat is back.

I feel like every week I'm showing downward arrows potentially. But credit rating is significant. I don't know if it's politically significant the way it used to be. I remember us, coming up as reporters, it was very, like, oh, my gosh, what's going on with the credit rating? And it feels like their stature is diminished. How are you guys sort of thinking about this moment for our economy?

KEVIN FREY, WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, SPECTRUM NEWS NY1: I mean I think -- I will say on the political front, as we are watching over the next week, not to go back to the topic we were talking about before, but --

CORNISH: No. No, it's -- it is. It's about money and spending.

FREY: Like -- like we are -- part of what they're citing is one, the big, beautiful bill, and the trillions it's expected to add to the national debt, and then you add on --

CORNISH: Wait, to underscore that, it's expected to add.

FREY: Right.

CORNISH: So, you're saying the credit rating agency is looking at that bill and not seeing less spending.

FREY: Right. And the credit agency took into account both Democratic and Republican administrations across the board.

CORNISH: Yes.

FREY: But -- but they're dealing with the here and the now with this bill. And then, on top of that, you have these conservatives, these hard

right conservatives in the House that have been saying, we need to cut spending, cut spending, cut spending.

[06:40:06]

This will give them more fodder as they make this argument over the next couple days as negotiations play out.

CORNISH: Yes.

EVAN MCMORRIS-SANTORO, REPORTER, "NOTUS": You know, I'll tell you, I -- the most interesting -- interesting thing to me since January that we've learned is that the only people with shorter memories than political people are finance people, right? Like, we have seen the market go all over the place, right, and then kind of stabilize. We still have a president who is very sort of uncertainty building when it comes to anything having to do with the economy.

CORNISH: Yes.

MCMORRIS-SANTORO: And political people are the same, right? They, you know, they look back and they're like, oh, well, you know, that was the last administration. Prices, you know, supposedly destroyed Biden's presidency. We're looking at prices still going up now.

All the kind of core things to make a really tough economy still exist there. But we're seeing now sort of the economic pressure kind of back off a bit from the president. We've seen the markets --

CORNISH: Yes.

MCMORRIS-SANTORO: I mean you have those numbers down, but they kind of have shifted back, right? We've even seen the president's poll numbers shift up a little bit.

It's a very interesting moment in terms of the politics of all this. How the economy is going to shake out, I don't know.

CORNISH: No, we don't.

MCMORRIS-SANTORO: If I did know, I'd have a much better, you know, balanced budget or whatever.

CORNISH: But we do -- yes, we would.

MCMORRIS-SANTORO: But I will say that what -- what you're looking at, and I -- I've spoken to a lot of folks who, you know, who do this stuff for a living, you know, deal with, you know, economic stuff, obviously with politics stuff, and you don't hear them talking right now the same way they were like tariff week or the week after those tariff week came out.

CORNISH: OK, but here's the thing, speaking --

MCMORRIS-SANTORO: And that, to me, is a really fascinating change. CORNISH: Speaking of tariffs, there might be more to come because now

there's this conversation about pharma tariffs, right, on drug companies. Help me understand why, in this moment, or -- or what's significant about approaching that industry in particular.

SABRINA RODRIGUEZ, NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER, "THE WASHINGTON POST": Yes. As a former trade reporter, the second I hear Trump and tariffs, I'm like transported back to the first term.

CORNISH: Yes, thoughts and prayers.

RODRIGUEZ: And the reality is, Trump has always wanted to pursue tariffs. So, it is interesting that, you know, there's -- the vibes have shifted to, OK, actually there's, you know, more -- we're -- we're -- you know --

CORNISH: But we're all more used to it now. We're hearing such insane numbers.

RODRIGUEZ: Now we're more used to it. But the reality is, he still wants to pursue more tariffs. You know, he backed off on that, you know, liberation day at the beginning of April that he had talked about, you know, the sweeping tariff.

CORNISH: Yes.

RODRIGUEZ: He backed off. But it's supposed to be a 90 day pause. And it's supposed to be all these negotiations with different countries. And I --

CORNISH: But isn't the average person more price sensitive to something like their drugs?

RODRIGUEZ: Absolutely. When it comes to the pharmaceutical tariffs and the discussion around it, Trump has talked for a long time about wanting to bring drug production back to the United States. He talks about it as sort of a national security issue. If the United States were to go to war with China, and China makes the majority of pharmaceuticals, what that could do to the United States.

Most people, you know, you go out and you talk to voters, and I've talked to folks that agree with the concept of tariffs. Oh, yes, let's bring production back to the United States, but those aren't things that happen overnight. So, if you put -- shoot up tariffs, you continue to fight with the countries that are producing this drug -- these drugs, you risk shortages. And that's where we see pharmacists today stockpiling in the event and the fear of that happening.

CORNISH: OK, guys, I want you to stick around. We've got more to talk about.

In the meantime, still to come on CNN THIS MORNING, we're going to talk about deepfakes and revenge porn. We're going to take a look at how AI is fueling the problem. There's actually a new bill that's going to be signed into law. And there's a transit strike affecting thousands of commuters in New

Jersey. That is now over. But it could still take some time to get the trains back on track. More from the group chat after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:47:58]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MELANIA TRUMP, FIRST LADY: Every young person deserves a safe, online space to express themselves freely without the looming threat of exploitation or harm.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: That was First Lady Melania Trump with her first comments in her husband's second term, calling for Congress to pass the Take It Down Act.

Now, in just a few hours, President Trump will actually sign that bill into law after it got bipartisan support.

The legislation protects victims of deepfake and revenge pornography that gets posted online. One victim spoke out at the White House in March about her struggle to get any help when it happened to her.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BREEZE LIU, FOUNDER, ALECTO AI: I was humiliated, dehumanized and overwhelmed with shame. But when I sought help, the system failed me. I was victim blamed and (INAUDIBLE) shamed while the perpetrator faced zero consequences. As more videos spread to hundreds of malicious websites, I nearly lost everything, my dignity, my reputation, and I almost lost my life.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Joining me now to talk about this is Donna Rice Hughes, president and CEO of Enough is Enough.

Donna Rice Hughes, thank you for being here.

DONNA RICE HUGHES, PRESIDENT AND CEO, ENOUGH IS ENOUGH: Thank you, Audie.

CORNISH: Now, I should note, people probably know you from the Gary Hart scandal, late '80s. And the reason why I bring that up is because women live with scandal differently than men.

HUGHES: Yes.

CORNISH: Especially anything that has to do with sex and relationships. So, for you, how significant is it to be at this bill signing?

HUGHES: Oh, this is huge. I mean this is so historic what has happened here. I mean this bill passed unanimously out of the Senate.

CORNISH: Yes, doing anything bipartisan is sort of shocking, yes.

HUGHES: Anything bipartisan. And actually protecting kids on the internet is a nonpartisan, unifying issue that has wide bipartisan support at the federal and at the local level. So, yes, we do process as females any type of abuse and anything that has to do with -- with basically being humiliated publicly.

[06:50:06]

CORNISH: Yes.

HUGHES: And what we've seen with young people, and, by the way, deepfakes circulating now since 2019 has increased over 500 percent. Ninety-nine percent of these are of females. And this is happening to our young people. Even kids themselves, Audie, are actually bullying other youth by creating deepfakes.

CORNISH: Right.

HUGHES: And it doesn't even have to be AI generated. It can just be nonconsensual.

CORNISH: Right. When you start -- yes, when you started Enough is Enough, it was in the mid-90s, right?

HUGHES: Right.

CORNISH: You're talking about internet safety. And at the time, I feel like at best it would be about someone sends a nude to someone else. That leaks all over.

HUGHES: Right.

CORNISH: With deepfakes, you can be completely not involved in this and be humiliated in the exact same way.

HUGHES: Yes.

CORNISH: How does this legislation force internet companies to act? What's the mechanism?

HUGHES: Well, first of all, it has two key parts. It criminalizes the publication, right, at the federal level. Even though there are a lot of state laws, this is going to be the umbrella law, all right. Then, these companies, internet -- internet services, platforms, social media, wherever, even a porn site, they've got 48 hours to take it down. And hence the name "Take it Down."

CORNISH: One of the things that people talk about is the fact that the Federal Trade Commission is going to be enforcing this. And, of course, all the federal agencies are dealing with major cuts with this reduction in government. Just last week the FTC commissioner told Congress that he was looking to cut the headcount by 10 percent. And so, they're going to have the smallest staff in a decade. Do you think that even with this law on the books it's going to be

hard to enforce just given government resources up against these huge companies?

HUGHES: Well, you know, I hope with the DOGE effect, this is about government efficiency. So, Lord willing, that the cuts will actually be the fat. And what is left is effective, efficient operating of these agencies.

CORNISH: What is your concern going forward for young women? I mean this is one piece of legislation.

HUGHES: Yes.

CORNISH: But for young people, they're going to be coming up in a different age of this potential kind of humiliation.

HUGHES: Right.

CORNISH: What are you going to be keeping an eye on now at Enough is Enough?

HUGHES: Well, we're keeping an eye on everything. There are dozens of pieces -- pieces of legislation that tackle different parts of protecting kids online and preventing online exploitation. So, it's not just this type of exploitation. It's protecting kids from child pornography. There are millions of images out there of children being sexually abused and raped. This is a huge issue. It's a huge law enforcement issue. So, we're looking at "Earn It," that will actually begin to remove Section 230 immunity and require these platforms to take that content down.

CORNISH: Yes.

HUGHES: You know, and to be accountable and responsible. So, we -- we're looking to rein in big tech. This is really, really key.

And I also just want to give a shout out to the effort of the first lady here for elevating this issue. She has used her Be Best platform to do this. And we're just really excited because without that leadership, it may not have -- this bill may not have been passed as quickly as it has been.

CORNISH: For sure.

HUGHES: This is a great first step.

CORNISH: All right. Well, Donna Rice Hughes, congratulations on your work on this bill.

HUGHES: Thank you.

CORNISH: Appreciate your time this morning.

HUGHES: Thank you.

CORNISH: All right, it is now 53 minutes past the hour. I want to give you your morning roundup.

An NTSB -- the FBI identified a 25-year-old man as a suspect in the explosion. It was an explosion at a fertility clinic in California. He was the only person killed. The FBI says they are treating this as an act of terrorism. Investigators say they're looking through his social media posts, where he criticized IVF and referred to himself as anti- life.

And the search underway now for seven escaped inmates who broke out of a New Orleans jail. Police just increased the reward for information. Friday, ten of them escaped by busting through a wall behind a toilet when the person watching them stepped away to get food. Some of them are accused of murder.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COL. ROBERT HODGES, SUPERINTENDENT OF LOUISIANA STATE POLICE: These are violent criminals and they escaped. And they have consequences for their actions.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: The inmates also left this message, saying "to easy, lol," and an arrow above the hole they use to get out. Three inmates have been captured so far.

And the New Jersey Transit strike may be over, but the morning commute could still be impacted. Negotiators reached a tentative agreement, and engineers will return to work today. But the New Jersey Transit CEO says they need a day to get things back to normal.

[06:55:02]

And now that former President Joe Biden is diagnosed with an aggressive form of prostate cancer, this is all adding to what could be a difficult week for his political legacy as a new book dives into his physical and mental state going into last year's election. Over the weekend, "Axios" published new audio from Biden's interview with Special Counsel Robert Hur in 2023, the time he was investigating the discovery of documents at Biden's home from his time as vice president. The special counsel later described then-President Biden as, quote, "an elderly man with a poor memory." The audio shows him struggling with dates. For instance, the first election of Donald Trump.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: Trump gets elected in November of 2017.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was actually 2016.

BIDEN: 2016.

(INAUDIBLE)

BIDEN: So -- what about 2017.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's when you left office. So that was in January of 2017.

BIDEN: Yes. OK.

(INAUDIBLE).

BIDEN: But that's when Trump gets sworn in --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right.

BIDEN: In January.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right. Correct.

BIDEN: OK.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Group chat is back.

You guys, I want to talk about this because Biden has tried to get ahead of this conversation. He's dealing with his legacy in real time. But when I heard that audio, I actually thought back to when Biden came out at the time, and he gave a press conference kind of disputing this description. I want to play that for people before we continue.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: How in the hell dare he raise that. Frankly, when I was asked the question, I thought to myself it wasn't any of their business.

I don't need anyone. I don't need anyone to remind me when he passed away or passed away.

I am well-meaning and I'm an elderly man and I know what the hell I'm doing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: So, when we talk about the people around him kind of protecting him, I mean he came out, right, at the time to be, like, no, no, no, this is wrong, this depiction of me.

MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Well, and he also -- didn't he mispronounce like a world leader in that press conference as well.

CORNISH: In that same press conference, yes.

MCMORRIS-SANTORO: I mean this really is a story about the people who were around Joe Biden, right? He was old when he was elected. He was old when he ran for president. And he was old when he decided to run again. A lot of these questions are sort of like, OK, a president wants to stay president, right? We're not surprised at that. But we are seeing a conversation now among people, you know, this book, we've seen this book coming out by Alex Thompson and Jake Tapper, and you're seeing so many people who said publicly, he's fine, now saying, actually, we feel terrible about what we did and what we said.

This is a very important conversation for Democrats to have. A painful conversation, probably.

CORNISH: Yes.

MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Made more painful now with the news about Joe Biden and -- and his -- and his personal life. But the actual conversation itself about whether or not this party wants to keep doing this sort of notorious RBG thing where they just stick by these people who are really maybe fading and not where they were when they first started, risking the -- you know, the party's actual legacy, that conversation needs to be -- you know, they need to have that conversation, figure out what they want to do.

CORNISH: Well, it's not going away.

RODRIGUEZ: I also think something that we can't lose sight of here is the fact that, you know, when we talk about, oh, the Democrats miss this or that Democrats were saying this, voters weren't. And that is something that I think Democrats have to grapple with.

Poll after poll at the time showed that people were concerned that Biden was too old to run for president. People were concerned that -- saying that they didn't want him to run for re-election. And Democrats were offering full-throated support before that June 27th. So, it's interesting that June 27th is sort of this inflection point for the Democratic Party.

CORNISH: Yes.

RODRIGUEZ: But for Americans being out on the campaign trail last year, I remember people repeatedly saying, it's really going to be the two of them running in a rematch.

CORNISH: Yes, I remember that. And also to your point about the people around him, it seems to be there is also this question of like when people were reporting on it, how hard the White House would push back. And in light of what we know now, questioning that pushback.

FREY: Right. And I mean, one of the other dynamics to keep an eye on here is -- is the leaders on Capitol Hill and kind of what role they played in either insulating him or trying to prop him up and back him up, particularly when it comes to Senator Chuck Schumer. He's come under, obviously, his own scrutiny over the last couple of months over his handling of just -- of things on Capitol Hill and how much to push back on Trump. But at the time he was saying, even just weeks before that debate, that -- that Biden was, quote, "in command."

Now, the new talking point from Senator Schumer and Congressman Jeffries is essentially, we're looking forward. Whether or not this will still resonate in 2028 is another question.

CORNISH: Yes, we're looking forward is not addressing the thing.

FREY: Correct. Not at all.

CORNISH: Yes.

FREY: Whether it will still resonate in 2028 is a different conversation altogether.

MCMORRIS-SANTORO: If it changes the way the party actually operates when it comes to their leaders, it's standing by a person versus a principle. That's the looking forward they have to figure out.

CORNISH: A person versus a principle. I think that is a very -- oh, see, you're into that too. I mean, I think that's an interesting thing that we're going to be talking about.

The book is actually not officially out yet.

FREY: Right.

CORNISH: Just, you know, causing all this conversation. So, I feel like we're going to be talking about this --

RODRIGUEZ: Look, we're already talking about it.

FREY: There have been drips.

CORNISH: For -- yes, I think we've heard about it. But I like the fact that, as you're saying, people are now having to have a real honest conversation about what it means to them and what does it mean to be in power.

[07:00:06]

So, it'll be interesting to see how Biden talks about this in the coming days and weeks.

You guys, thank you so much for waking up with me. We talked about a lot of things today. And it's just Monday. I want to thank you --

MCMORRIS-SANTORO: To easy, lol.

CORNISH: Yes, to easy, lol.

I want to thank you for waking up with us very serious people. I'm Audie Cornish. And "CNN NEWS CENTRAL" is going to start right now.