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Democrats Face Arrest after Leaving Texas; Marjorie Taylor Greene's Breaks with Trump; Cardiff Garcia is Interviewed about the Trump Economy; Netanyahu Urges Conquest of Gaza; Bondi Says They're Ending the Weaponization of the Government. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired August 05, 2025 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[06:30:00]

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR: Happening right now.

House Speaker Mike Johnson is in Israel today after a surprise visit Monday. He visited a settlement in the occupied West Bank with a group of Republican lawmakers. The delegation placed personal notes between the stones on the Western Wall in support of America's standing with Israel.

More than a thousand fire crews are battling the Gifford Fire in central California. It has exploded in size since sparking on Friday. It's now burned more than 72,000 acres and is only 3 percent contained. It's the state's second largest wildfire this year.

And the Texas house speaker has signed civil arrest warrants for the Democrats who did not show up for a special session on Monday. The Dems fled the state Sunday to avoid a vote on the redrawing of the state's congressional maps.

And in a matter of hours, the state house will actually try to vote again on those maps. The eventual outcome could tilt control of the U.S. Congress in 2026. So, if Republicans prevail with their redistricting plan, five seats, currently held by Democrats, would simply vanish. Those lawmakers could lose their jobs.

The move has governors in several blue states threatening to retaliate by gerrymandering their own congressional maps. And the head of the Democratic National Committee says his party is ready for the fight.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEN MARTIN, DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL COMMITTEE CHAIR: Donald Trump, Greg Abbott, Ken Paxton, they said they wanted a showdown. And, guess what? That's exactly what they're getting, a showdown. This is not the Democratic Party of your grandfather, right? Which would bring a pencil to a knife fight. We're bringing a knife to a knife fight. We're going to fight fire with fire. And we're going to do everything we can right now to stand up against this unconstitutional power grab by the Republicans.

(END VIDEO CLIP) CORNISH: I want to bring in Gabby Birenbaum to the group chat. You're the Washington correspondent for "The Texas Tribune." So, we needed some Texas detail here.

JERUSALEM DEMSAS, CONTRIBUTING WRITER, "THE ATLANTIC": Absolutely. Besides Chuck.

CORNISH: Yes, because this is not the first time that Texas Democrats have fled the state to try and put a stop to something. And I -- the last time it happened, a couple of Democrats snuck back home and cut a deal. What's different this time?

GABBY BIRENBAUM, WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, "TEXAS TRIBUNE": Well, I mean, I think we're going to see how long it lasts. This has gotten enormous national attention. And it did in 2021 as well. But because this affects control of the U.S. House, because it's about redistricting, you're seeing so many national Democrats, Democrats with presidential ambitions in 2028 getting involved, talking about this, hosting, right, these Texas Democrats in their states.

And so, I think as long as there's national attention on this, you know, there's support from the DNC and other groups, we'll see how that is able to keep Texas Democrats out of the state and see how long they can make this quorum break last.

CORNISH: The flip side is, for Republicans in the state, they're still holding these votes. There's this civil arrest, kind of, I don't know if it's symbolic. You can tell me. What are they doing in the face of all this attention?

BIRENBAUM: Yes. I mean, for right now, you know, the floor is frozen, right? Those arrest warrants are largely symbolic. They're not -- they don't carry criminal penalties. They're not enforceable outside of Texas, right? But for the Republicans, they're going to try to make the case that there's further business to attend to in this special session, flood relief, right, being the main one. And so, you're going to see a lot of messaging back and forth I think between both parties in Texas on who is holding up flood relief.

CORNISH: But is this kind of all over, but the shouting? Like, can Democrats prevent this from happening?

BIRENBAUM: That's right. I mean the last time, in 2003, the Republicans pursued a mid-decade redistricting in Texas. Same thing, Democrats left the state. They eventually did come back. In 2021, over voting rights, right, as you mentioned, they eventually did come back. So, you know, this is an effort to delay, but almost always a deal does get cut (INAUDIBLE).

CORNISH: You know, throwing this to the group. Jerusalem, I want to ask you. Democrats, for the last couple of years, have been like, we should have independent redistricting commissions. This should be done by bureaucrats somewhere. It will be more fair. And it seems like, is that the pencil that Paxton was talking about being brought to the knife fight? DEMSAS: Yes, I think that's the pencil he's referencing. And it's kind

of hard to -- because from the Democrats' perspective it feels like unilateral disarmament, right? If you -- if the other side is -- is choosing to engage in gerrymandering or in redistricting that's going to benefit their -- their party, then if you are doing these independent redistricting commissions, you're not actually providing for equal rights across the whole country.

CORNISH: Well, it makes it harder now, right, because now you have to go over your own laws that you pushed.

DEMSAS: Yes.

CORNISH: Am I right?

CHUCK ROCHA, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Yes.

CORNISH: Like, you got to now say, as a -- as -- yes.

ROCHA: I went back and looked at all of the states and their redistricting laws. In all the states Democrats have the governor, the state house, and all of the power, they've all created these commissions because we're the party of do right and have good governance and do the right thing. When they're the party of, let's go in here and break things, let's throw out our elbows and make sure people know that we're in charge. And guess what? They've won elections being that way. And that --

CORNISH: Yes, but what do you say to your commission that you launched? Bye, bye, everyone go home.

ROCHA: Look, are we going to be the party that stands back, when we're at 29 percent popularity, because we won't fight back? I think this is Democrats sick and tired of being sick and tired.

CORNISH: OK, you guys, stay with me. There's something else I want to talk about.

Ashley.

ASHLEY DAVIS, FORMER HOMELAND SECURITY OFFICIAL: I have a lot to say about (INAUDIBLE) --

[06:35:01]

CORNISH: Yes, he did. He did. But I've got something for you.

Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene, who's been a supporter of the president on Capitol Hill. But she has recently broken with Trump on some key issues. So, here we go.

Back in June, she took to X to criticize the president's big, beautiful bill, noting that she wouldn't have voted for it if she hadn't seen a key provision on A.I. She also defended Tucker Carlson from the president's rage on Iran. And she's also been one of the MAGA Republicans very vocal about the call for transparency on the Epstein files.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE (R-GA): You know, I think it's just a red line that it crosses for many people.

This is something that's been talked about by many people serving in the administration, myself and many others on the right and the left of --of there needing to be transparency of the rich and powerful elites.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: So, is this a genuine shift for Greene or an attempt to reposition herself within MAGA? "Vanity Fair" puts it like this, "her sudden willingness to break with Trump on issues close to the president's heart is curious. Is she simply choosing to speak her mind and occasionally say things that's reasonable while still maintaining her unique brand of what the f lady? Only time will tell."

Group chat is back on that very important piece of punditry that we just heard from "Vanity Fair."

The thing that intrigued me is, she actually spoke to "The Daily Mail," and she gave a pretty specific list of the things she was upset about. And one was involvement in foreign wars. She has come out and said that she believes Israel is conducting a genocide. She's using language other Republicans are not using. Can you -- can you talk about that part of it?

DAVIS: Yes. But I also think that, Audie, this is about two things. One, 2028, who are going -- who's going to get the MAGA voters that no one but Trump can get to this point in the Republican Party. So, those voters care about foreign wars, about government spending. And so, I think she's 100 percent talking to those people. Or she is interviewing for the American party, which is going to be even -- is more going to be the MAGA movement, which is the Elon party. So that's where I think she is.

CORNISH: So, you think that's a thing? I just -- you think he's -- Elon's going to follow through with that?

DAVIS: I think so. I mean, I think he'll try. I don't -- how many times have we tried to create another party. It's really hard to do. But, listen, as a Republican, I'm like OK if Marjorie leaves the Republican Party.

CORNISH: OK.

DEMSAS: That's (INAUDIBLE), like, if you build your movement on individuals who are anti-establishment, once you become the establishment, it's hard to retain those people because their entire like framework for viewing politics is, there's something wrong with the state, there's something wrong with how we're engaging in politics, the way things are done in Washington are bad. And so now that, you know, the Trump coalition has really taken over, not just, you know, won one election in 2016, but has won twice, has really made itself integrated into the, you know, into the arms of the federal government, into different agencies, like, it's hard to be like, we're not the establishment anymore, you know?

CORNISH: Yes, I know. It was also interesting because we just yesterday talked about Charlamagne Tha God going on Fox News with Lara Trump and saying, hey, I think this could cause problems, this Epstein thing. And then the very next day, Marjorie Taylor Greene comes out to be like, yes, actually, I'm pretty upset about this.

There's one other thing she mentioned. She's calling for the Trump administration to pardon George Santos. He's the disgraced former -- your head just shook. I felt the whole studio shake.

So, he's serving a prison sentence for wire fraud, aggravated identity theft. This guy, you know, defrauded voters. And here is what Trump said when he kind of acknowledged the extent of Santos' crimes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And what about George Santos?

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Boy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He just went away. Seven years.

TRUMP: You know, he was -- he lied like hell. I mean I have to tell you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

TRUMP: And I didn't know him, but he was 100 percent for Trump. But I didn't, you know, I didn't -- I don't -- I might have met him. Maybe. Maybe not. I don't know.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right.

TRUMP: But he was a congressman and his vote was solid.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROCHA: Look, I think that there's something here that's worrisome for Democrats when Marjorie Taylor Greene starts sounding like Dick Gephardt from 1996, that bothers me. But there's also a piece of this that she's not being, I don't want to say dumb, but not being smart about, which is, she makes a business off of being provocative online. She -- she makes money off of that, not for herself, but for --

CORNISH: Well, this was provocative.

ROCHA: Sure. Sure. But I'm making the point of that, she needs that attention to differentiate herself between the party. If she's going to be the standard bearer, if I'm using that right, in a presidential election or whatever it is, it could be about a meme online, but she's keeping -- and I'll go back to the original thing I said, is that, and she's doing it around a populist movement of folks that are just aggravated. It could be Epstein. It could be the common working man. It could be watching starving children in Gaza. She's staying in front of all of those things, which is not a dumb thing.

DAVIS: The reason why, money.

CORNISH: One other thing, Gabby, because I have you here.

[06:40:02]

She also, at the end of her interview, said, look, Trump didn't elect me. I'm not worried. Is she powerful without him?

BIRENBAUM: I mean, I think part of the subtext here, right, is she wanted to run for higher office in Georgia, and reportedly he discouraged her, right? I mean, I'm sure that has to sting if you're her.

And I think what Jerusalem said is true as well, it's more difficult to be in unified Washington as a member of the majority to constantly defend your party, as Democrats, right? That can be more difficult than being in the minority, where it's clarifying to constantly say, this is wrong, this is wrong, this is wrong.

CORNISH: Thank you so much for being here. Gabby Birenbaum with "The Texas Tribune."

The rest of the group chat, stick around.

On CNN THIS MORNING, we're going to bring you new details about the Justice Department's request in the Jeffrey Epstein case. The specific testimony they want to make public.

And it's the Trump economy, but does the firing of a -- of a job stats chief shake confidence in it?

We want to know what's in your group chat as well. Send it to us now on X. I'm also @audiecornish. We're going to talk about ours after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:45:23]

CORNISH: It's 44 minutes past the hour. And here's your morning roundup.

The Justice Department wants five days of grand jury testimonies released against Jeffrey Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell. That's according to a new overnight court filing. The testimonies include two days of the Epstein grand jury and three days Maxwell's.

And a request to get Sean "Diddy" Combs released on bail denied again. Last week his team asked to get him out on a $50 million bond as he waits for his sentencing. The judge ruled that his team failed to prove Combs isn't a flight risk or a danger to the public, so he'll stay locked up until the sentencing on October 3rd.

And Republican Congressman Mike Flood faces off with angry constituents in a town hall Monday night. He faced questions over the big, beautiful bill, immigration and the Epstein files. The crowd booed, chanted "tax the rich," while Flood defended his stance.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How much does it cost for fascism? How much do the taxpayers have to pay?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why are you covering up the Epstein files?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Now, Flood said he wants to sponsor a resolution to release the files.

President Trump, on Monday, once again declared, without evidence, that last week's jobs report was rigged. So, what in the report made him so mad? Well, he pointed at the revisions made to earlier jobs reports as proof for fake political numbers. Not only was the jobs report for July lower than expected, but May and June turned out to be much lower than first thought as well.

The data show only a total of 33,000 jobs were added over those two months, compared to an earlier estimate of about 286,000.

Now, the president's top economic advisor has spent the last few days defending the decision to fire the top economist at the Bureau of Labor Statistics.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEVIN HASSETT, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL ECONOMIC COUNCIL: They could be politically manipulated because they're so untransparent. There's a black box system out there making the jobs numbers that needs to be improved.

All over the U.S. government there have been people who have been resisting Trump everywhere they can. And so, to make sure that that's not going to happen in the data agencies, to make sure that the data are as transparent and as reliable as possible, we're going to get highly qualified people in there that have a fresh start.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Joining me now to talk about this is Cardiff Garcia, editorial director at The Economic Innovation Group.

Cardiff, I've been down the economist rabbit hole on social media where they are all bickering about these numbers. Harvard economist Jason Furman wrote this, "this is closer to what one expects from a banana republic than from a major democratic financial center. This is even more senseless than," he refers to Trump's other threats "to fire officials like Jerome Powell, the chairman of the Federal Reserve." Can you kind of make sense of their frustration?

CARDIFF GARCIA, HOST AND CO-CREATOR, "THE NEW BAZZAR" PODCAST: Yes, of course. I mean these revisions that the Trump administration is complaining about are part of a, frankly, quite straightforward and banal process. It takes some businesses a little longer to respond to the government survey that's used to construct the jobs report than others. And so, as we collect more information, the report becomes a little bit more accurate over time, we get these revisions.

What the Trump administration is saying is that it just doesn't like the economy that's being reflected there. And I got to say, it is just deeply, deeply irresponsible on the part of the president and his administration to allege that there's been any kind of partisan tampering or bias. And I think they should be challenged to present any such evidence of that. But I, you know, let's be honest, that's not going to happen because they don't have it.

So, this is a little bit of a farce. Unfortunately, it's a deeply irresponsible farce. And if it continues, it's going to have real effects on the way that people interact with government data. And that's going to be a problem for the economy.

CORNISH: And then the flip side is, this was sort of a report card on the liberation day, the Trump economy, the answer of, like, do tariffs work? Are they -- we know he's changing the global political economic world's order. But how is it working economically for us? What did you see in that?

GARCIA: Yes, the BLS controversy kind of obscured, you know, something that we learned last week about the economy itself and -- and having resolved the mystery of why is it, given the profound uncertainty of the tariff strategy that's been pursued this year, are we not seeing the effects on the economy?

[06:50:08]

Well, now we are seeing the effects on the economy. We've seen the pace of jobs growth, as you just pointed out, has slowed sharply in the last few months. We've seen inflation start to tick ever so slightly back up and in exactly the kinds of goods you'd expect to be affected by the tariffs, right? And we've seen the consumer spending this year has been a lot flatter than people expected going into the year. That's a problem given the importance of the consumer to the American economy. We can see that people are getting a little bit more nervous.

So, the economy, I think it's fair to say, is in a more fragile place than was understood even a week ago. And so fragile doesn't mean that, you know, that it's bad necessarily. Unemployment is still low. The economy is still growing. But it's a little bit more vulnerable to, I think, a deeper slowdown and a downturn than we'd realized.

CORNISH: The Trump administration, when they launched these tariffs, talked about two things. One, manufacturing, bringing those jobs back. They also talked about their concerns about immigration, for example, and having leverage over other countries and that conversation and jobs here at home. Does the data give any indication on where they are making progress on those issues?

GARCIA: Yes, that's a good question. To separate them out a little bit. You know, the decline of manufacturing jobs is part of a longer- term trend and quite a normal one because the sector keeps getting more and more productive over time. But manufacturing jobs had essentially flatlined, you know, for about a half a year going into liberation day. And since then, they've actually resumed their slide. So, the explicit call for more manufacturing jobs is a basis as a rationale for the tariffs. That simply hasn't worked out. I think the sector has lost some 30,000 or 40,000 jobs, roughly, in the last four months.

In terms of immigration, this is -- this is interesting because it's worth noting that for all the attention that's been given to deportations and undocumented immigration, it's also the case that we're putting up barriers to legal immigration. And so, preliminary, and everything is preliminary at this point, estimates are that net immigration levels are going to fall this year and possibly next year. And that does have an effect on the economy. It means that the labor force isn't going to be as big as it otherwise would have been. And eventually that also strains the capacity of the overall economy to grow as well. So, that is absolutely something that I think, you know, requires a little bit more attention, and it's going to be worth following in the coming years.

CORNISH: All right, Cardiff, thank you so much for speaking with us.

GARCIA: Thanks, Audie. A pleasure.

CORNISH: I'm going to turn now to Israel, because with ceasefire talks stalled, Israel's Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is expected to call on his cabinet later today to support his goal of full conquest over the Gaza Strip.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER (through translator): We must continue to stand together and fight together to achieve all our war objectives, the defeat of the enemy, the release of our hostages, and the assurance that Gaza will no longer pose a threat to Israel. Later this week, I will convene the cabinet to instruct the IDF on how to achieve these three objectives, all of them, without exception.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: There's growing outrage in Israel after Hamas released propaganda videos of emaciated hostages. Tens of thousands of Israelis jammed the streets of Tel Aviv over the weekend with a unified message. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We are asking for this war to end, for the suffering to end for everybody. We don't want anybody to be hungry. We don't want anybody to suffer.

(END VIDEO CLIP) CORNISH: And end for the suffering.

CNN global affairs analyst Kim Dozier joins the group chat.

To be clear, these hostage families very much want Hamas gone, but they are also furious about the idea of military expansion, right, in that campaign. And then I understand there's even the IDF. Like, there's some people in the IDF that are like, hey, the troops are exhausted. Can you talk about more of this coalition of people who are sort of against military expansion?

KIM DOZIER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: Yes, the majority of hostage families, because there is a minority group that's for military expansion. But the majority of them say, all you're going to do by opening new fronts up in Gaza City, places that haven't been touched as much before across The Strip, is endanger the lives of the hostages. Even many in the national security establishment in Israel are saying, you know what, you have defanged Hamas, their leadership is decimated, all you're doing now is fighting an insurgency, that doesn't get you anything. Why not implement what Israel calls the Lebanon protocol, where right now, you know, they don't have Israeli troops in Lebanon, but they've hit something like 200 Hezbollah operatives since pulling troops out. You could do the same thing in Gaza without endangering hostages who are -- you know, every time Israel has sent a hostage raid to try to rescue some of these people, their captors kill them before the raiders reach them, just as a matter of principle.

[06:55:11]

So, there are about 20 left, and that's why there's this sort of outrage, you know, that the troops are tired, the hostage families are scared, why are you doing this?

CORNISH: So, let's talk about why he is doing it, because he does have a cabinet and coalition held together by voices with a very different opinion. What is he dealing with in terms of pressure?

DOZIER: Yes, part of the argument goes that this is what Netanyahu wants. But his coalition right now is a minority coalition. He already lost his two major religious -- ultra-religious parties over a dispute over drafting religious students into the army. But his ultra nationalist party members remain. They want to annex all of Gaza. They want to annex the West Bank. They want to build the Gaza riviera that Trump sort of threw out there and then hasn't followed up with many concrete plans. And so, if Netanyahu stops the fighting in Gaza, he faces losing those two parties, and that would basically give him such a small piece of government that he wouldn't be able to pass any legislation. He would be ineffectual.

CORNISH: Where are U.S. Republicans on this? We saw the House speaker, Mike Johnson, visiting with settler families. Witkoff met with hostage families.

DOZIER: Yes.

CORNISH: And as you said, this riviera plan, we've not heard much more about it.

DOZIER: Yes.

CORNISH: So, what are we looking at in terms of the U.S.?

DOZIER: Well, Mike Johnson just did something very controversial in Israel. He visited the settlement of Ariel in the West Bank. And that is one of the most hardline settlements. It represents those ultra- nationalists who want to take back all of the West Bank. And he was quoted by those settlers as having said things like Judea and Samaria belong to the Israeli people.

Former U.S. officials who worked in Israel have said, you know, this makes it that much harder when we try to tell them, you've got to stop these settlers from attacking Palestinians. There have been 2,000- some-odd attacks, 700 attacks by settlers on Palestinians since January, according to the U.N., and this is a green light from one of these top U.S. officials, that's OK, keep going with your fight to take this whole territory.

CORNISH: All right, Kim, I actually want you to stick around for our next discussion. We're going to get into some domestic politics here in terms of the Justice Department, the attorney general. Pam Bondi wants a formal grand jury investigation into the Obama administration because she says she wants to find out whether Democrats manufactured intelligence about Russia's election interference in 2016.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PAM BONDI, ATTORNEY GENERAL: When we say we're ending the weaponization, we're ending it. People will be held accountable. Who weaponized our government? You know, there were a lot of pardons out there, but there were a lot of people who were not pardoned. And if you targeted someone, if you went after someone because of their political affiliation, we will be investigating you. We will be looking at you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: So, when are Americans going to catch a break from the weaponization of government that lawmakers have complained about? Former Attorney General Eric Holder says the Bondi DOJ is making it worse.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ERIC HOLDER, FORMER ATTORNEY GENERAL: This is a weaponization of the Justice Department and the law enforcement capacities of the federal government. It's also an attempt to deflect attention from that which really afflicts the president and his administration right now, which is the release of the Epstein files.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: The group chat is back.

I did describe Bondi as embattled, but is she?

DAVIS: No, but I just can't believe Eric Holder, first of all, is saying that because what happened under the Biden administration, wasn't the president -- how many times was he investigated by DOJ? Current President Trump. So, that -- it's been politicized for a long time, not by just this administration.

The number one thing I'm watching, and the most important part, the American people should see, which is happening right now, is where this grand jury is going to be impaneled. Is it going to be in Washington, D.C., or is it going to be in Florida or another Republican-led state that has conservative views?

CORNISH: I think I can answer that one. Yes, pretty sure it's going to be in a Republican state.

DAVIS: And that's where it's going to get funky in regards to who can be caught up.

CORNISH: Yes.

DOZIER: I'm worried about the message this sends to Moscow. They are -- they're going to be cheering that once again Republicans and Democrats are going to be attacking each other over interference, that Republicans and Democrats previously had agreed upon, that they said Russia did try to run influence operations, not hacking, but influence operations to get people to vote against Hillary. Not necessarily pro- Trump, but Putin didn't want Clinton in office. And that was settled. And now it's going to get all opened up again.

[07:00:02]

CORNISH: Do they pay attention to stuff like that?

DOZIER: The American public?

CORNISH: No, Moscow.

DOZIER: Moscow. Absolutely. One of Moscow's main goals with influence ops is to create chaos in your enemy, turn people against each other just to weaken the nation. That's exactly what these influence ops have done to the U.S.

CORNISH: All right.

DEMSAS: I think they're only going to get worse as the technological frontier shifts dramatically. I mean -- I mean, already, if you're on -- spending any time on Twitter, you'll see that, like, fully half of your replies are just bots, and many of them are repeating controversial claims about top issues and politics.

CORNISH: OK, with that, I want to end the group chat.

Thank you guys for being with me and for waking up with us.

And "CNN NEWS CENTRAL" starts now.