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CNN This Morning
Trump Defends East Wing Demo, Ballroom Price Tag; Gucci Mane Reveals Schizophrenia Diagnosis. Aired 6-6:30a ET
Aired October 23, 2025 - 06:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DANNY FREEMAN, CNN ANCHOR/CORRESPONDENT: -- policies and has promoted LGBTQ policies.
[06:00:04]
Now, some critics in the U.S. have painted him as a Trump hater and anti-American, even though he is, of course, an American citizen.
Super Bowl LX will take place on Sunday, February 8.
All right. Thank you so much for joining us here this morning on EARLY START. I'm Danny Freeman in New York. CNN THIS MORNING will start in a moment.
AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR: The people's house or Trump's new palace. CNN THIS MORNING starts right now.
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DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: It will be one of the great ballrooms anywhere in the world. It's about 300 million.
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CORNISH: The East Wing of the White House demolished, making way for a new ballroom with a ballooning price tag.
And new sanctions against Russia. Is President Trump finally losing his patience with Vladimir Putin?
A warning sign for -- from hundreds of rabbis as Zohran Mamdani and his rivals clash in New York's final mayoral debate.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you a secret Nazi?
GRAHAM PLATNER (D), MAINE SENATE CANDIDATE: I am not a secret Nazi.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: No shirt, no problem. A Senate candidate sits for a bare- chested interview to show everyone how he covered up a Nazi tattoo.
And different oceans, same deadly result. The Pentagon strikes so- called narco boats in the Pacific, this time as the war on drugs widens.
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GUCCI MANE, RAPPER: If I have an episode I can't come back from. You know what I'm saying?
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CORNISH: OK. Gucci speaking out about his very personal struggle with schizophrenia.
OK. It is 6 a.m. here on the East Coast. Here's a live look at the White House, or what's left of it.
Good morning, everybody. It's Thursday, October 23rd. I want to thank you for waking up with me.
I'm Audie Cornish, and here's where we start.
Because while the government remains shut down, the White House is going through an expensive renovation, and it's coming with a price tag of at lEast $300 million.
The demolition is of the East Wing should be complete by the end of the week. Construction crews have been essentially working around the clock to make room for President Trump's newly planned ballroom.
Historic preservation groups are calling for an immediate halt to the demolition. The president defended the project in the Oval Office, bringing out models and renderings. He says the current East Wing isn't worth saving.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We determined that, after, really, a tremendous amount of study with some of the best architects in the world, we determined that really knocking it down, trying to use a little section, you know, the East Wing was not much. There was not much left from the original.
It was a very small building. And rather than allowing that to hurt a very expensive, beautiful building that, frankly, they've been after for years.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: Here's what the president said when he actually first announced this project this past summer.
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TRUMP: It will be built over on the East side, and it will be beautiful. It will be views of the Washington Monument. It won't interfere with the current building. It won't be -- it will be near it, but not touching it. And pays total respect to the existing building, which I'm the biggest fan of. It's my favorite.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: Joining me now in the group chat, Evan McMorris-Santoro, national political reporter at "NOTUS"; Mike Dubke, former Trump White House communications director; and Meghan Hays, former Biden White House director of message planning.
Evan, I will come to you in a second, but I want to talk to Mike, because you worked in the building.
MIKE DUBKE, FORMER TRUMP WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: I did. I even went to a movie in the East Wing.
CORNISH: You did?
DUBKE: It was very exciting. Yes.'
CORNISH: And feeling nostalgic at all?
DUBKE: It was "King Kong." It was a terrible, terrible film.
CORNISH: Is that who was involved in construction?
DUBKE: It sounds like it. Ripping it off the back.
Look, I think this is much to do about nothing for -- for the mere fact that almost every president has done something to the White House. And we only -- the East Wing is only from 1942.
I mean, preservationists are saying that this is this big deal. This was a Franklin Roosevelt addition to the building. Truman actually ripped the entire building out, all the interior out at a -- at a cost of $1.7 million back then, late '40s.
CORNISH: OK. So, you looked this up. You're ready for this conversation.
DUBKE: I am. I am ready for this, because I think this is much to do about nothing.
CORNISH: All right. Meghan, let me come to you, because Mike brought -- Mike brought up something here. And I will play for you a former White House historical association chief, who was asked about what's going on.
And what he had to say is that the administration's talking point, that this is just like any other change, is absolutely disingenuous, especially saying that anybody who criticizes this is just a stick in the mud. And it says the issue is this addition turns the White House and the executive mansion into something it is not. It is no longer the people's house.
Can you talk about that idea? You laugh at the people.
DUBKE: No, no. I am not, no.
CORNISH: OK, Mike. Hold on. No, you hold on. Let me let Meghan jump in here, or the Internet will catch you.
DUBKE: I've got so much more on this. OK.
MEGHAN HAYS, FORMER BIDEN WHITE HOUSE DIRECTOR OF MESSAGE PLANNING: So, the -- just for context, the East Wing is where people enter when they go on holiday tours, when they visit tours to do -- go into the mansion.
[06:05:04]
The East Wing and the West Wing are very separate from the mansion, which is actually preserved by the historical -- The White House Historical Association.
I definitely agree that there should be a ballroom. There is not a space large enough to host big events, where it definitely needs to happen. It did not -- it could hav -- the White House complex is 18 acres. It could have happened anywhere on that complex. They did not need to tear down the East Wing.
I think the optics of this is terrible. Spending this kind of money when the government is shut -- and I understand it's privately funded, but when the government is shut down and people can't pay for food and groceries and the cost of housing. And we're spending $300 million to redo something that did not need to be redone.
And no one is talking about that this is almost twice the size of the actual White House mansion. And no one is talking about who is going to fund the upkeep. Who's funding the lights being on? Who's funding the staff and the furniture? They're talking --
CORNISH: We've been focused on them raising private money to build it, and not about the long term -- yes.
HAYS: And the taxpayers are going to end up paying that, and it's going to be an extremely expensive endeavor.
CORNISH: Let me add to what you're saying here, because Senator Thom Tillis, not in your party, I don't think, was asked about this yesterday. Let's see if we have this.
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SEN. THOM TILLIS (R-NC): We're talking about building a ballroom when we're trying to get the economy squared away. Timing is bad.
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CORNISH: Evan, when you -- we have people here saying this government shutdown thing is not working out the way we thought it would. It's not landing on Democrats the way we thought it would.
What do you think of Tillis being a voice here saying, this is bad? Timing is bad here?
EVAN MCMORRIS-SANTORO, NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER, "NOTUS": Well, this whole thing speaks to the remarkable fearlessness of this administration, OK? Because if you think about any other White House, any other measures that we've ever covered before, you know, they're always talking about, oh, my -- my threadbare old chair, I keep. I would never want to change that. Keep my old helicopter.
This administration is like, yes, sure, we're tearing it down. We're building a new White House. We want it. We're going to have it.
CORNISH: Yes.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: And there is something that, like, what Tillis is saying sounds a lot like how politicians generally sound in Washington.
But what Trump is doing, it sounds like what the Trump administration sounds like. We want a new ballroom. Everybody wants a new ballroom. We're getting it. That's it.
And we don't really know what the impact of that is down the road politically. Right? Because Tillis isn't running again.
CORNISH: Right.
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: But other Republicans do have to run again. And we're not sure, you know, how this sort of -- this project will land with voters in 2026 or whatever.
CORNISH: Yes. And we should --
MCMORRIS-SANTORO: But in terms of this general concept that we're talking about, this is -- this is Trump through and through. The -- the old rules do not apply to this guy, and he just does what he wants to do. And this is one of those times.
CORNISH: OK. We're going to talk a lot this hour. And I'm sure, Mike, you'll be able to get more thoughts out as these images go viral, frankly, from the Treasury Department staffers who are across the street.
But coming up on CNN THIS MORNING, UVA struck a deal with the Trump administration. So, I'm going to speak with the president of Wesleyan about why he says he is not going to bend the knee to this administration.
Plus, the NFL not changing its plans for the Super Bowl halftime show.
And the last debate and a surprise guest. Zohran Mamdani's final blow to Andrew Cuomo. But did it work?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ZOHRAN MAMDANI (D), NEW YORK MAYORAL CANDIDATE: Mr. Cuomo, in 2021, 13 different women who worked in your administration credibly accused you of sexual harassment. One of those women, Charlotte Bennett, is here in the audience this evening.
What do you say to the 13 women that you sexually harassed?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[06:12:54]
CORNISH: It's almost 15 minutes past the hour, and here is your morning round-up.
The Pentagon has new -- has a new press corps. Last week, dozens of reporters from outlets including "The New York Times," A.P., FOX News, and here at CNN, actually turned in their Pentagon press badges, because they refused to sign a new pledge policy.
Several conservative outlets will take their place. The new press corps includes "The Gateway Pundit," "Front Lines" by Turning Point USA, and Lindell TV, run by MyPillow CEO Mike Lindell.
The Pentagon is calling the new group the next generation.
And the NFL commissioner has a message for anyone who wants Bad Bunny replaced at the Super Bowl halftime show: It's not happening.
The announcement from the Puerto Rican superstar's halftime show was met with backlash. Roger Goodell says there are no plans to change it.
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ROGER GOODELL, NFL COMMISSIONER: He's one of the leading and most popular entertainers in the world. That's -- that's what we try to achieve. It's an important stage for us. It's an important element to the entertainment value. It's carefully thought through.
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CORNISH: President Trump was one of the critics speaking out against the choice, calling it absolutely ridiculous.
OK, this is unreal. This is happening during a surgery in London. A patient with Parkinson's disease playing the clarinet during brain surgery so doctors could see and hear immediate results. The procedure was to help manage her symptoms.
And after the break on CNN THIS MORNING, Gucci Mane reveals a shocking diagnosis. How he's helping shift the narrative for black men and mental health.
Plus, why did a Senate candidate in Maine do an interview shirtless?
And someone is waking up in Vegas. Or maybe they never went to sleep. But either way, here's a live look at the lights on the strip.
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[06:19:14] (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MANE: I keep hearing these voices. Ripping me up, saying, "Buy Rolls- Royces." And I keep hearing these voices.
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CORNISH: He goes by the East Atlanta Santa. He defined what it means to be so icy. But now Gucci Mane is opening up about another layer of his story: his schizophrenia diagnosis.
He's talking about it in a new memoir, which is called "Episodes," where he also shares he has bipolar disorder and psychosis. His wife joined him in an interview on "The Breakfast Club." Hear how she explains how, over the years, she learned how to catch an episode before it began.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MANE: I was like, man, I got to really just hold myself accountable and take care of my health. I don't ever want to have an episode again.
What if I have an episode I can't come back from? You know what I'm saying? So, I just like, started to do the work and like, started seeking the help.
KEYSHIA KA'OIR, GUCCI MANE'S WIFE: He wants to be left alone. He don't eat. He does not sleep. Text messages, there's a period after each word. And I'm like, you're going through an episode. You're sick.
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[06:20:04]
CORNISH: Research shows black men face higher rates of mental health issues and lower rates of getting help.
Gucci joins Kendrick Lamar, Kid Cudi, Lil Wayne. There's a growing list of rappers who are speaking out about mental health issues.
And joining me now is Lisa Respers France, CNN entertainment reporter, to talk more about it. Welcome back, Lisa.
LISA RESPERS FRANCE, CNN ENTERTAINMENT CORRESPONDENT: Thank you, Audie. Good morning.
CORNISH: So, what makes this a tipping point from the usual conversation we might hear in the hip-hop community about the need for mental health or depression?
FRANCE: I think the timing is very interesting here, Audie, because at the same time that we have this interview, we also had Kim Kardashian on the "Call Her Daddy" podcast talking about dealing with Kanye and some of his mental health issues. Now, Kanye has since said that he was misdiagnosed with bipolar
disorder, and he actually is autistic. But the important thing here is we see the similarities.
Like Kim talked about how Kanye would give their cars away. And Keyshia and Gucci talked about how he would give money and jewelry away.
So, it's very important for Gucci Mane to come forward, because what we're seeing here are two things that are happening. No. 1, he's being very transparent and very vulnerable about what he's dealing with, and also talking about how he has to do the work. He has to see his therapist. He has to take medication.
But we're also seeing what's being modeled with his wife, Keyshia, because she talks about how she stays on it.
CORNISH: Yes.
FRANCE: Like she does not let him slip. And it's been interesting, Audie, because there's been some backlash about that. People are like --
CORNISH: Wait, before you get into that, I want to play for you a clip.
FRANCE: OK.
CORNISH: Because I think people will better understand the backlash when they hear this.
FRANCE: Sure.
CORNISH: Here's how she talks about how she's had to deal with some episodes.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KA'OIR: I called some bodyguards, and I just planned the whole kidnap. And we kidnapped him and took him to the hospital, because we could not get him to the hospital.
And he was trying to fight them and everything, but it was six of them. He couldn't handle it. And we threw him in the car. He would try to jump out the car, so we put him in the center of the car. You know?
Like, I have to get gangsta with him because he -- and I'm like, all right, we're going to see.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: I want to talk about the backlash to this: people talking about how she's handled it. Because the flip side is people criticizing other kinds of spouses for saying, well, why won't you take their phone away? Why won't you do something about what is clearly a mental health issue?
FRANCE; Exactly. But with Keyshia Ka'oir, what's interesting about her is she's got this very much ride-or-die attitude when it comes to her husband, like, and people think of her as a very strong woman. She's an entrepreneur, former model. When he went to prison, he left her a couple million dollars. She tripled what he -- what he had left her with.
And so, when she started talking about what she does to handle his episodes and when he's in crisis, some people said, that's too controlling. You're his wife, not his nurse.
So, it's been interesting to see the backlash because, like you said, there have been many spouses of other celebrities who have had mental health crises; and they've said, why don't you do more?
Here, this woman is stepping up to do more. And some people are saying she's simply doing too much, Audie.
CORNISH: You know, it's funny. I think in the world of hip-hop with mainstream music, we commodify people's antics, right? Even now, I'm rethinking my East -- East Atlanta Santa comment, thinking about maybe it was an episode, right, that you're giving away stuff.
So, the balance here is really interesting: trying to figure out how do you run a business where interaction with the public is paramount, and that same interaction can bring danger to your health?
FRANCE: It can bring danger to your health. And I think that what we're seeing here, why this conversation is so important, is that Gucci Mane has been like, you know what? This is not -- nothing I want to deal with. So, I have to do and take the steps necessary to make sure I don't have an episode.
And his wife is saying, I have to pay attention to his behavior. So, if he does have an episode, we catch it early.
And these types of conversations, especially, as you pointed out in the black community, when it comes to black men. Men, period, who are very difficult. I have one at home. Very difficult to get him to go to the doctors.
So, when you have someone who is as respected in the industry as Gucci is stepping up, saying, not only is it important that we recognize it, but that we also talk about it. I think, you know, we can't say enough about how important these conversations are.
And I hope we keep going. I'm seeing a lot on social media with a lot of people thanking him for coming forward, because he really didn't have to talk about it as in-depth as he has.
CORNISH: No.
FRANCE: He's been extremely open.
CORNISH: He has, and there are so many families out there that don't have the time, money or resources to do what he and his wife are doing.
Lisa Respers France, thank you as always. Love talking to you.
FRANCE: Thank you. Love talking to you too, Audie.
CORNISH: Straight ahead on CNN THIS MORNING, no more patience. The U.S. announces new sanctions against Russia. Is it tough enough?
Plus, the immigration crackdown and the next target. Today, federal agents will flood into San Francisco.
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[06:29:35]
CORNISH: Good morning, everyone I'm Audie Cornish. I want to thank you for joining me on CNN THIS MORNING. It's half past the hour, and here's what's happening right now.
The North Carolina legislature has just passed a new congressional map. It will help Republicans get an additional congressional seat after next year's midterm elections.
State law does not give the governor, who is a Democrat, the power to veto it. Democrats are expected to sue.
Today, the Trump administration planning to send dozens of federal agents to San Francisco. Part of the administration's immigration crackdown. Border Patrol agents will be staging at a Coast Guard -
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