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The Far Reaching Implications Of Qasem Soleimani's Death; Qassem Soleimani On Route To Be Buried In Kerman, Iran; International Calls For Restraint Following U.S. Strike. Aired 11a-12p ET
Aired January 06, 2020 - 11:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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[11:00:28]
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Iran continues to be in a state of mourning but the same time as vowing retaliation.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If he says 52 sites, we say 300.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The President threatened to hit Iranian cultural sites if Iran struck any American or any American asset.
SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER (D-NY): I really worry that the actions the President took will get us into what he calls another endless war.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: Live from CNN Abu Dhabi, this is CONNECT THE WORLD with Becky Anderson.
BECKY ANDERSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: And this hour, huge crowds turned out to more on Qassem Soleimani in Iran. The U.S. Secretary of
State makes with a key Gulf ally and European leaders. Calling for restraint as Tehran vows to retaliate. And Washington promises to fight
back. It is a busy hour. Let's get started. The ripple effect from Qassem Soleimani's death is wide reaching and seemingly growing with each
passing hour.
The Saudi defense minister now calling for restraint ahead of his meeting today with U.S. Secretary of State Mike Pompeo. That comes after Iran
announced it is further rejecting the JCPOA nuclear deal saying it will enrich as much uranium as it wants. On top of that, the military advisor
to Iran's supreme leader says U.S. military targets will be struck as Iran vows revenge for Soleimani's death.
Meanwhile, President Donald Trump responding with a seemingly nonchalant attitude, referring to possible retaliation from Iran or Iraq. He says if
it happens it happens, but warns the U.S. would hit back. Qassem Soleimani's body is on the way to come in Iran. That is -- will be his
final resting place. And it's the city where he was born.
Iranian state media says millions have turned out to say goodbye to the Islamic Revolutionary Guard general. CNN of course can't confirm that
number, but we can confirm great masses of people have been scrambling it seems to see or touch his coffin. Here is Secretary of State Mike Pompeo.
Meanwhile, his meeting with Saudi Arabia's Deputy Defense Minister, they are trying to figure out what can be done to come the Iran issue in
Washington.
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi is introducing a resolution to limit President Trump's war powers, it would that limit his ability to take military action
without congressional approval and to get you bang up to date on exactly what we know now, Europe is doing what it can deescalate the situation
holding emergency talks and NATO's council meeting in Brussels to figure out its response.
Stephen Collinson is in Washington, Fred Pleitgen is in Tehran where the streets are still packed. Sam Kiley, our CNN international correspondent
base here with me in Abu Dhabi joining us and Nic Robertson is in Riyadh in Saudi Arabia, finally Arwa Damon standing by in Baghdad and I'm going to
get to Tehran in a moment. But I do want to get to Washington first. And Stephen, the President just tweeting in all caps, Iran will never have a
nuclear weapon, exclamation mark.
That is the latest from the U.S. president. Before that, as I described, a relatively nonchalant, responsive, it happens. It happens, he says,
referring to possible retaliation from Iran. Where are we at at this point?
STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: I think that's the latest inflammatory statement from the president. That tweet about the Iranian
nuclear situation over the last 24 hours or so we've had a number of statements by the president, including him doubling down on his threat to
strike cultural sites in Iran and of course quite a lot of alarm. And I think that is what is fueling this concern on Capitol Hill.
This democratic effort to try and constrain the President's powers to wage war potentially in Iran. We're going to see that resolution, as you
mentioned, introduced in the House. We're also I think, going to see a similar debate in the Senate. In effect, I think it's going to be an
interesting test of public opinion and of the President's handling of this situation which has seen -- which has seemed escalatory and inflammatory
tests of public opinion and of the presence handling of this situation which has seen -- which has seemed escalatory and inflammatory.
[11:05:10]
COLLINSON: And it's going to be an interesting vote when those votes come up. I would say, however, that over the last 20 years since 911,
Democratic and Republican lawmakers have (INAUDIBLE) and an expansion of the President's power to wage war. Think about it. This strike against
Soleimani was justified partly by the administration under the 2002 resolution, allowing the President of that time George W. Bush to wage war
in Iraq.
So you can see the expansive nature of the President's power, effectively the power to wage war and to escalate this crisis lies with Donald Trump
himself. That's one of the reasons why there's so much concern given his temperamental behavior I think you can say over the last few days.
ANDERSON: Before we get to --- thank you, Stephen. Before we get to these extraordinary images of crowds, mourning the loss of Iran's top military
leader in Iran. Arwa, Soleimani's influence in Iraq, the country of course where he lost his life, absolutely clear and we cannot understate that.
What's the latest where you are?
ARWA DAMON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Becky here, it's not just about the loss of Soleimani. It's also very focused on the loss of
Abu Mahdi al-Muhandis, the other leader that was killed alongside him. There are still wakes for both of them that are ongoing. We were at one in
Baghdad just a short while ago where if you look at who has turned out, you really begin to get an understanding of the significance and the impact of
this.
These two individuals were believed to be very instrumental when it comes to Iraq's fight against ISIS. But this is a country that is still reeling
from the impact of all of this to the point where yesterday in Parliament, it was the caretaker Prime Minister himself who was building the case for
Parliament to vote to end the foreign troop presence in Iraq. So this is a nation that is still very much in many ways in unchartered territory.
ANDERSON: Fred is in Tehran where we have witnessed now for hours, Fred, these extraordinary scenes on the streets and morning, the military leader
there this was a man Qassem Soleimani who was at the core of the Revolutionary Guard, which of course, is at the core of the Iranian regime.
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. You're absolutely right. I mean, he's certainly someone who in that power
structure was right at the center. He was the head of the foreign operations wing of the Revolutionary Guard Corps, the al-Quds Force. And
so was extremely important and really became ever more important since 2003, since the U.S. invasion of Iraq, he was obviously very active there
has the blood, as the U.S. says of several hundred American troops, so on his hands, as they say.
But one of the things that he's revered for actually here in Iraq -- here in Iran, sorry, was the fact that Qassem Soleimani also put together some
of those Shiite militias in Iraq to fight against ISIS. Here he's known as the man who saved Baghdad from an ISIS invasion. So certainly someone who
does -- who did carry a lot of clout and who was revered by a lot of folks here in Iran.
And that's one of the reasons why you're seeing that massive turnout, not just in Tehran today but in the past two days. We've been talking about
the fact that of course, the Iranian government, the Iranian power center, there able to put together a big demonstrations and get large turnout, but
nothing on the scale of what we've seen over the past shows and certainly nothing on the scale of what we've seen today.
There were literally hundreds of thousands of people on the street. Iranians are saying by some estimates that it was several million, it's
impossible to verify that, but I was right in the middle of those crowds, Becky, and they certainly were obviously very much in a state of grief, but
also extremely angry, more angry than I've ever seen protesters at Iranian rallies in the past. And the one thing that we kept hearing from them is
that they want revenge.
In fact, some of them were carrying placards that had two words written on them, harsh revenge, and many of them say they want to see that as fast as
possible. Of course, we know from speaking from a top advisor to Iran supreme leader that the Iranians are saying that they will retaliate and
they say will retaliate against military sites as they put it, but they're also saying they don't want an additional escalation.
They don't want a full on war with the United States, which course would have grave and catastrophic consequences potentially for the entire Middle
Eastern region, Becky.
[11:10:07]
ANDERSON: Fred is in Iran as we consider today scenes out of Tehran. And we mustn't forget these contrasting images on the right-hand side of your
screen when thousands of demonstrators took to the streets back in November protesting against the government and what was the deadliest political
unrest Iran had experienced since the Islamic Revolution 40 years, almost to the day. Sam's with me here. Our CNN international correspondent, my
colleague here in the UAE.
Donald Trump's advisors have argued for months now that that that their maximum pressure campaign was working on what we saw on the streets just a
month or so ago, was significant protest against a government that was under such economic pressure as a result of the sanctions that the U.S.
have been wielding. We are not seeing those same images, not today, and certainly possibly not tomorrow.
Are we suggesting that those antigovernment protesters or protests are all over but the shouting as it were?
SAM KILEY, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I think you'd be naive to think that there's been an absolute -
(CROSSTALK)
KILEY: -- the critics of the Trump administration would love to make that point. But the reality is that whatever that manifestation of people's
anger and frustrations within Iran, the reasons for their anger and frustration remain political incompetence, external activities that are
draining the central government's coffers, they are not comfortable with Iran's foreign policy, they don't see why they should be backing the Yemeni
rebels and Houthis or the Asad regime, even less so.
So in that case, context, problems over pensions and so on the everyday issues remain. Now, there may be some time before they're prepared to take
back to the streets because their anger has now been refocused on the traditional enemy of the United States by this this recent killing, but
they are also part of a movement that is picked up right across the Middle East. We saw the same thing in Iraq.
We've seen demonstrations and morning for Soleimani that have replaced the -- not entirely replaced, actually, the demonstrations that were against
the government there. Similarly, in the Lebanon, the extent to which those are temporary outbursts, I think remains to be seen because the underlying
truth, the realities of life in Iran are not going to change indeed, and the risk of war means that they could change very radically for the worse.
But that makes it all the more likely, frankly, now that this is the central government of Iran has committed itself to a revenge attack. The
longer it externalizes its problems the longer it can maintain support on the streets are longer as it's particularly in the form of a rebel.
ANDERSON: What the U.S. has been hoping is that when they certainly won't admit that they are looking for regime change in Iran, not regime change at
their hands. What the U.S. administration under Trump will tell you is that they have been looking for a change in the regime sought by Iranians
themselves. And they continue to suggest that that is their strategy. But these calls for targeting cultural sites by Donald Trump and he is -- not
just said it once you said it a number of times.
That goes against the entire ethos of Iranians, doesn't it? They predict - - protected these cultural sites through invasions and changes of regimes over tens of years now, if not -- if not hundreds of years. If you seeking
the support Washington of the Iranian men and women on the street, this isn't the way to go about it.
KILEY: No, don't blow up a Zoroastrian shrine, top tip for the Trump administration. It goes back 5000 -
ANDERSON: And don't even threaten to do it.
KILEY: Don't even threat to do it. First it was a war crime. There's no question about that. So he's doubled down on his request to commit war
crimes. It will be interesting to see how he would can communicate that to his generals, will be asking to commit crimes on their behalf. But if
there -- there's one thing that when I've been speaking to lots of Iranian, expatriate friends who are under threat from the Iranian regime in London,
and in particular, they are beside themselves over this kind of threat, it undermines all of the Democratic activity -
(CROSSTALK)
ANDERSON: And deprives the U.S. of any sort of moral upperhand, right?
KILEY: Was quite mad. I mean, you've also got a -- this is, you know, one of the most ancient, almost contiguous civilizations on Earth, they get,
you know, monotheism has its roots in that ancient, ancient culture and they're very quick to lampooning and sneer at Donald Trump for this kind of
activity.
[11:15:05]
KILEY: But I don't think there's any belief that they would start -- the Americans will start blowing up shrines. But there is a crudity and a
clumsiness, which again, is unlikely to suit the long-term agenda of the United States in Iran, which is at the very least a softening of the
position of the regime should we say.
ANDERSON: Nic Robertson is in Riyadh for us. Thank you, Sam. The Iranian Foreign Minister Nic, tweeting recently to stoke the fires. Do you still
want to listen to the clowns advising you on our region? Khalid bin Salman, the Saudi Deputy Defense Minister meeting with the U.S. Secretary
of State Mike Pompeo this hour to try and defuse the tension. What can we expect from that meeting?
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: You know, defuse, deescalate. This is going to be the message coming from Khalid bin Salman.
The brother of the Crown Prince, effectively the third most powerful man in the country, it is on a mission for the Crown Prince. And it is to bring
that message to Washington of restraint. And it's going to be a very simple message.
And I don't think it will be any surprise to Secretary State Mike Pompeo to hear it, but it's how it lands with him. And that message is going to be
look, we don't want chaos and war in our region. We live there. This is happening around us. We've seen it before. We've been a target of the
Iranians before. We believe we could be a target of them again, so restraint, deescalate.
But you know, as you say, President Trump's message on Twitter has been a complete variance with that.
So it's difficult to see quite what Khalid bin Salman will be able to bring to bear on a Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, that will give him something
substantial enough to take to President Trump to turn that around. The Saudis are in lockstep with the United States. No doubt on their attitudes
towards Iran on their beliefs that Iran is, you know, trying to expand its power and influence in the region at the detriment of its neighbors,
including Saudi Arabia.
So they're happy to see constraints, like the killing of Qassem Soleimani put on the Iranaians but they don't want this to escalate further. And it
was very interesting today as well, when I talked with a source of the Saudi government about the question that the Iraqi Prime Minister had
raised, saying that Soleimani had been bringing a message from Tehran to him responding to a message that the Saudis, according to Iraqi Prime
Minister had passed to them to pass the Tehran.
The source I spoke to in the Saudi government said they had no knowledge of a message from Soleimani. So, I -- that said -- that if you will throw a
shadow of doubt over what the Iraqi Prime Minister was saying that certainly from a Saudi perspective that really giving the impression that
they weren't having some major back channel conversation through the Iraqis with the Iranians at this time.
But it all, you know, it's what happens in Washington. And I think when Khalid bin Salman comes back and it's going to come back via Europe,
they'll have these conversations in London with the British -- well, with British officials, their foreign secretary, potentially the Prime Minister
there, you know, the Saudis are also looking beyond Washington to try to get others to influence, you know, their key ally and partner to, you know,
tamp down the tensions.
ANDERSON: Tamp down the tensions, deescalate. These are all words that you will hear increasingly from a region which is quite frankly all edged.
Nic is in Riyadh. Nic, thank you. Still ahead on show, Connect Your World with Becky Anderson. There are still many outstanding questions behind the
killing of Qassem Soleimani. We get answers from the spokeswoman or at least we seek them for the U.S. Secretary of State Mike Pompeo.
Plus, it's a story that is defining our times. One time high-powered Hollywood mogul falls from grace and lands in a courtroom for a sexual
assault trial facing the possibility of life in prison. The latest is up next.
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[11:22:02]
ANDERSON: Only moments ago, a man whose alleged crimes sparked the Me Too movement sat before a judge in a New York courtroom. The sex crimes trial
of disgrace movie mogul Harvey Weinstein got underway earlier today with some pretrial administrative business. Now the 67-year-old walks into the
courthouse using a walker. He is facing charges that include predatory sex assault and rape for reportedly assaulting two women in New York.
But more than 80 other women are accusing Weinstein of sexual abuse. And some of them will testify as witnesses in this trial. That is expected to
last until March. Well, CNN entertainment writer Chloe Melas towards me now from New York. And Chloe, get us up to speed firstly, on the very
latest today, if you will.
CHLOE MELAS, CNN ENTERTAINMENT WRITER: Yes. Well, as you said, you saw him walking in into the courthouse using a walker. Very different looking
than he looked just a few years ago, as I know from members of his inner circle and even speaking to Harvey Weinstein, myself, you know, preparing
for this trial has definitely taken a physical and emotional toll on him. Look, I actually did an e-mail interview with him.
I asked him eight questions this weekend. I'd love to give you a little bit of insight into his current emotional state. This is what he tells me.
He says the past two years have been grueling, and have presented me with a great opportunity for self-reflection. I realized now that I was consumed
with my work, my company and my drive for success. This caused me to neglect my family, my relationships, and to lash out at the people around
me.
He goes on to talk about being in rehab since the allegations first broke in 2017. His need to give up control doing meditation. I did ask him,
though, if he has empathy for any of the accusers over the past two years and he said that he would not answer that on the advice of his lawyers. If
you read his answers, which you can read on CNN.com, you realize that he's adamant that he has done nothing wrong.
He won't even admit that he has abused his power in any way. And he actually says he wants to make movies again, he wants to rebuild The
Weinstein Company here in the United States.
ANDERSON: He also spoke to his attorney, I know. What did you learn?
MELAS: Yes. So I spoke to his criminal defense attorney, Donna Rotunno. And she talked a little bit about their strategy, take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONNA ROTUNNO, HARVEY WEINSTEIN'S ATTORNEY: Nobody is trying to claim that he's a saint and that he never did anything wrong or that he wasn't, you
know, bombastic at work or didn't treat assistance poorly or - but, you know, as we've talked about, as the defense team, there's a lot of room
between treating someone poorly, cheating on your wife and being a rapist. And that's a large leap to take and I don't believe Harvey's a rapist.
I don't believe the evidence will show Harvey's a rapist. And so my fear about this case is that what is attempting to happen in this courtroom is
that the government is trying to criminalize morality.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[11:25:11]
MELAS: We also know that as part of their defense strategy that they are going to be showing a lot of e-mails that they have -- that they have
gotten over the past two year of Harvey talking to some of these accusers, that are a part of these criminal charges because they want to display that
these women continued to talk to Harvey after these alleged incidents, whether that will backfire, we just don't know.
We also know that his team is very concerned about whether or not they're going to be able to find 12 impartial jurors That is why they have tried
previously to move the trial upstate, maybe to a place where people don't know as much about Harvey Weinstein but those motions to move the trial
have been denied.
ANDERSON: Thank you, Chloe. And a quick note few viewers, last month that Weinstein reached a tentative multimillion dollar settlement with more than
30 women who have accused him of sexual misconduct on the proposed settlement terms. The Hollywood producer will not have to admit to
wrongdoing. Watching CONNECT THE WORLD. I'm Becky Anderson for you. It's 25 past 8:00 here in the UAE.
Still to come, well, Qassem Soleimani's killing deter or encourage more aggression from Iran? Two people with two very different opinions. Give
us their views, up next.
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[11:30:02]
ANDERSON: Welcome back. You're watching CONNECT THE WORLD with me Becky Anderson. And our top story for you. Reaction to the killing of Iran's
top general Qassem Soleimani by a U.S. drone strike on Friday has been swift and emotional Iranians today packing the streets of Tehran to pay
their final respects to the revered general of Iran's Islamic Revolutionary Guards in Tehran.
It seems is clear it will abandon the JCPOA nuclear deal and Iran will enrich as much uranium going forward as it wants to. Just perhaps one
fallout from this targeted killing of Iran's top military commander Friday. That of course is a cause for concern for the international community. But
what does Iran enriching uranium on its terms actually mean? A quick look at how it all works for you.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A brilliance of 500 Suns lights hundreds of miles of the Pacific.
ANDERSON: To unleash this, you start with this. Raw uranium. Fresh out of the ground, it's not useful for much. It means enriching. To do that,
you need these centrifuges, thousands of them. They spin that uranium around superfast speed, about a thousand times a second. Shaking up stuff
you don't want and leaving the powerful stuff you do.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For the next 15 years, no uranium will be enriched beyond 3.67 percent.
ANDERSON: Iran though has gone beyond that reaching levels as high as 20 percent in the past, and that's important, because while there is still
technical challenges to going even higher, once you hit 20, you're well on the way to weapons grade enrichment. That's 90 percent. And that is what
that little phrase uranium enrichment really means.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: Was a bit of context for you. Let's bring in some experts now with very different views of how Iran might respond to Soleimani's death.
Ellie Geranmayeh is deputy director of the Middle East and North Africa program at the European Council on Foreign Relations joining us from
London. I hope we'll get some European perspective from you, Ellie, as well as the sort of wider context of how you believe things might play out
here.
And Mohammed Khalid Alyahya is editor-in-chief at AlArabiya English and joining us from Dubai. Let me start with you. So, you say you were
shocked by the nature of this killing, this targeted killing by the U.S. Qassem Soleimani losing his life along -- alongside others. Why?
MOHAMMED KHALID ALYAHYA, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, ALARABIYA ENGLISH: Thanks, Becky. I was shocked because what we've seen so far during the "maximum
pressure campaign," is, you know, calculated incremental escalation by the Iranians and not by the Americans. The Iranians took over ships in the -
in the Arabian Gulf. They bombed oil pipelines. They downed a U.S. drone, they attacked oil facilities in Saudi Arabia.
And they several times attacked U.S. targets in Iraq. And the U.S. Embassy compound in the Green Zone, U.S. targets in U.S. bases in Iraq with mortars
and with missiles. They just happened to kill anybody yet. And the response by regional actors and by United States has been largely muted.
You know, after the attack on Aramco, there were sanctions placed on Iran Central Bank, but there was no real kinetic response.
And I think that was understood by the Iranians, as you know, a policy of not responding by the Trump administration that he was viewed probably a
quitter tiger and it was -- it was a huge shock to see that not only did he respond, it was not a tit for tat response, he took out the engine of
Iran's command and control structure in its regional expansion network. You know, Qassem Soleimani -
(CROSSTALK)
ANDERSON: OK. Mohammed, let me stop you there.
(CROSSTALK)
ANDERSON: So I want to bring in, Ellie, at this point. Ellie, so, we're suggesting here that this was a this was a shock, perhaps because the
Iranians didn't expect it. Was it a? Was it the right move by the Americans is clearly a monumental gamble. What what's your perspective?
ELLIE GERANMAYEH, SENIOR POLICY FELLOW, EUROPEAN COUNCIL ON FOREIGN RELATIONS: Well, if you're sitting in Tehran, Becky, right now, you've
gone from enduring almost a year of crippling sanctions which the Iranians labeled as economic warfare. They're now being in a scenario where the
U.S. has in your view declared war. And so the paradigms and the goalposts of the rules of engagement in the United States and Iran, I think, will
dramatically shift after this U.S. decision.
The United States has repeatedly claim that they are after de-escalation or negotiation pathway, but this has really left folks in the region and in
Europe and in Tehran really stand as to exactly how President Trump aims to get to that negotiated path by taking such a drastic move.
[11:35:20]
ANDERSON: So what do you make then, Ellie, of the words of former CIA Director General David Petraeus, who has said in a foreign policy article
in the past 24 hours or so, and I quote, "This is a very significant effort to reestablish deterrence, which obviously had not been showed up by the
relatively insignificant responses up until now."
GERANMAYEH: Well, I think if you're trying to get at the tyrants, what we've actually done is to create a lot of popular support inside Iran and
across the political establishment for revenge acts now which is undoubtedly going to escalate the situation for a potential tip for tat,
that could actually create and more heated conflict, perhaps not of conventional conflict but a more asymmetric conflict that Iran is much more
comfortable at.
And so I don't see this as creating the deterrence, that the U.S. administration is claiming to create when Iran in an interview that CNN has
had has clearly said that there will be a military response to this action.
ANDERSON: Let's be very clear, Mohammed, I want to get a sort of sense as to what is going on and what the thinking is in this part of the world. It
has been quite clear for months now that the term de-escalation has been the word of the hour as it were from the UAE, from Saudi and from others,
which is difficult as we said, I think from many to stomach when we had four years had nothing but sort of narratives of escalation and outright
war at times from -- for example Riyadh when it comes to Iran, what is the position now?
What -- how do you read the Saudi position here? We have the Deputy Defense Minister in Washington State to talk to Pompeo to try and tamp down
what is going on.
ALYAHYA: It's very simple I think. These are very risky times, maximum pressure comes with its own set of risks. And conventional war is
something that the United States, that Saudi Arabia, that the United Arab Emirates, that other countries in the region, hopefully Iran want to avoid
at all costs. You know, nobody wins in a war, you have a set of losers, some people lose more than others.
But that also, you know, distracts us from another point here, which is that, you know, Iran has been escalating for the past 40 years, it's been
escalating after the maximum pressure campaign. Iran is largely in control of Iraq, which is by all measures a failed state, Syria as a failed state,
Iran is behind the genocide of almost 500,000 people there. Lebanon is a failed state with impending economic collapse in that country right now.
And it says, well as Iran's proxy Hezbollah that exercise is the monopoly of view on the use of force in that country and control over that country's
borders. So wherever we see Iran expanded outside of its borders, and Arab countries, those countries have become failed states, have become
incubators for terrorism have become incubators for instability in the region. So that has to be put into perspective, when we are discussing the
recent increase and the risk of conventional conflict. You know, the problem -
(CROSSTALK)
ANDERSON: So very briefly, I want to bring Ellie in at this point. The very briefly, Mohammed, are you suggesting this is -- this is actually
complicated things for the likes of Riyadh and for example, the UAE?
ALYAHYA: Of course, but I mean, the region has always been complicated. Iraq's issues have been complicated since the U.S. invasion of Iraq in
2003. Since 2011, Syria has been extremely complicated.
ANDERSON: Right.
ALYAHYA: Lebanon has been complicated. Yemen to say the least has been complicated. What we're seeing today -
ANDERSON: So, Ellie -
(CROSSTALK)
ALYAHYA: -- is a priority on containing - yes, on containing Iran's ability to conduct a term policy in the region. And that means depriving
it of the cash it requires to cultivate a bloated regional proxy network. A terrorist network, so maximum pressure -
(CROSSTALK)
ANDERSON: And it's Iran's foreign policy in the region. Sorry, Mohammed, I've got to push you on just too early. It's Iran's foreign policy in the
region that here in the Gulf people will say others have ignored, Ellie, particularly the Europeans who have been determined to keep this JCPOA
alive. Quite frankly, that's all over now. Isn't it?
GERANMAYEH: Becky, there were definitely problems in the region before the U.S. began its maximum pressure campaign.
[11:40:10]
GERANMAYEH: But one of only has to look at what we've seen happen from May of last year to now, we've gone from Iran and the U.S. targeting one
another's infrastructure or drones. Iran has been held responsible for attacking all installations, seizing tankers, to now we're at a stage where
the two sides are killing military personnel targeting contractors. So the escalation pathway is clearly ramping up.
And for folks in the region, this should come with a huge warning because they are going to all be the first up pay for a cost of any increased
tension between the U.S. and Iran. And if indeed Iran has been behind these attacks in Saudi Arabia and the UAE. Well, if they made their point
very loud and clear that if they have to pay an economic cost because of the U.S. sanctions, that the whole region is going to pay for -- pay for it
as well.
The Europeans have looked at the nuclear deal as one area where there might still be some degree of stability through having some restrictions on
Iran's nuclear program. So that in parallel to this U.S.-Iran tension on the regional issues, we don't also open up a Pandora's box of nuclear
problems with Iran. They tried very, very hard to do that over the past year and a half. And of course, the U.S. administration has done
everything to try and block their efforts.
And we're now at a stage where we are looking at restrictions on Iran that are much less stringent than what we had on the nuclear deal. But still I
think (INAUDIBLE) you're going to look at ways where they can at least way to compromise with Iran and not to expand its nuclear program, the full-
fledged level that it was before 2014.
ANDERSON: Very briefly, Mohammed, I do want you to have a listen to what the Iraqi Prime Minister had to say at a Parliament session on Sunday, have
a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ADIL ABDUL MAHDI, IRAQI PRIME MINISTER (through translator): I had an appointment with the martyr Soleimani at 8:30 on the morning of his
martyrdom, where he was to be carrying a letter for me from the Iranian side in response to a Saudi letter, which we had sent to the Iranian side
to come to agreements and important breakthroughs regarding the situation in Iraq and the region.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: What do you make of this, Mohammed? The implication here being that the Trump administration's actions on Friday hampered efforts to
reduce tensions between Iran and Saudi Arabia. Do you -- do you believe or do you know, certainly there any sort of back channels have been denied by
Riyadh to -- by sources -- Saudi sources to us here at CNN. Are there backchannels at this point?
ALYAHYA: I mean, frankly, I think that's ridiculous. The idea that Qassem Soleimani suddenly became a dove after slaughtering hundreds of thousands
of Arabs one day before he was killed by the Trump administration. That just doesn't make any sense. Also Qassem Soleimani was coming from Beirut
-
(CROSSTALK)
ANDERSON: So why would the Iraqi Prime Minister say that then?
ALYAHYA: Why would they have a letter from Iran if he's coming from Beirut? Because, you know, if I were to speculate, I would say the
Iranians pushed for that narrative to come out. It's the perfect narrative that implicates the Trump administration, paints it as administration that
acted as a hindrance towards peace. And if they want to implicate the Saudis, one way or another, they can make Saudis -- the Saudis look like
the agents of the United States in the region and not to be trusted. You know, it's -- I think, a very laughable scenario that makes very little
sense.
ANDERSON: Mohammed, Ellie, your insight is extremely valuable. Thank you very much indeed for making the time to join us on CONNECT THE WORLD.
Well, we will have you both back. Thank you.
President Trump talks about possibly striking Iranian cultural sites. We will ask a U.S. State Department spokesman. What would justify that action
that many say would be a war crime? That is up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[11:46:00]
ANDERSON: Let's get you up to speed with the latest developments following the killing of the Iranian general Qassem Soleimani. His remains now in
the holy city of Qom in Iran where massive crowds, massive crowds. I'm going to repeat that. Are paying him respect. That followed similar
scenes in Tehran where people flooded the streets for his procession. Soleimani will later be laid to rest in his hometown of Kerman.
President Trump tweeted about three hours ago that Iran will never have nuclear weapons. He said that in capital letters, the tweet came off to
Iran said it will no longer stick to the nuclear deal it signed with world powers. Well, last night, President Trump also contradicted Secretary Mike
Pompeo and double down on his threat to target Iranian cultural sites. So what is going on? Well, Morgan Ortagus is a spokeswoman for the U.S. State
Department.
Morgan, thank you for joining us. How can the U.S. justify even the threat of such strikes, which could be war crimes?
MORGAN ORTAGUS, SPOKESPERSON FOR THE UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF STATE: Yes. I think the -- what President Trump and Secretary Pompeo and the
President's entire national security team will do. What we have said is that we will do anything within our power to protect American citizens, to
protect American lives. And we have consistently told the Iranian regime that any attack on Americans, any attack that will put Americans in harm's
way, whether it is from the militias that we saw in Iraq, or whether it's from the regime itself would not go unaccounted for.
So we will defend ourselves. We will defend our allies, we will defend our people and will do anything in our -- and that's obviously legally possible
for us to do so.
ANDERSON: So that includes acts considered war crimes, correct?
ORTAGUS: No, that's not. You're just playing with semantics here. What we've seen is that the terrorist custom Soleimani killed more Americans
than any other terrorist except for some of them lot and we've seen attacks against Americans. I mean, we could go through the last two decades of
attacks against Americans were Americans were killed.
ANDERSON: Right.
ORTAGUS: And then of course, within the last week, we saw an American killed. We saw our service members injured, and then we saw additional
attacks on the American Embassy. And that is something that President Trump and Secretary Pompeo have said repeatedly to the regime in Iran that
they would be held accountable for those actions. And so we have always abided by the Geneva Conventions and acted within the law of armed
conflict, and we will continue to do so. But we will defend ourselves.
ANDERSON: With respect, I wasn't playing with semantics. I was asking, you know, would you be -- is the U.S. prepared to conduct what is
considered a war crime? Were they to believe -
(CROSSTALK)
ORTAGUS: Everything within the law to defend ourselves. We'll do everything within the law to defend ourselves.
ANDERSON: Including war crimes?
ORTAGUS: That's not what I said. I just said we'll do everything within the law to defend ourselves.
ANDERSON: Mike Pompeo has talked to your bosses, talked about deescalating the situation. But Donald Trump continues to contradict his secretary of
state and says that the U.S. targeting Iranian cultural sites is what he is prepared to do. Why is the Donald Trump national security team not on the
same page here?
ORTAGUS: That's just completely and totally inaccurate. The President talks a lot about America first. And what does that mean in our foreign
policy? America First means that we're going to protect American citizens. That means we're going to defend ourselves. We're going to defend our
allies and our interests. There is no closer relationship in the cabinet than that between Secretary Pompeo and the president.
He works incredibly closely with Secretary Esper, Mike Millie and Gina Haspel, Robert O'Brien. This is a very close knit, cohesive national
security team that brought a decision to the President. It was a decision which they were all uniformly supportive of, for a myriad of reasons, most
recently, the attacks against the United States and our people and our allies and our interests.
[11:50:00]
ANDERSON: The United States does seem to be almost completely isolated when it comes to its position on Iran at present. U.S. allies in the -- in
Europe, in the Middle East where I am, and in Asia are either calling for de-escalation or are virtually silent. There is almost no support for U.S.
actions. Morgan, where are America's allies at this point?
ORTAGUS: With all due the respect that's just another completely inaccurate observation. You could look at the E3 statement this morning
that were put up by the Germans, the British and the French, the British, the Italians, you could go through the list of people who have said that
the world is a better place that Soleimani is dead.
ANDERSON: You talked about need for de-escalation with respect.
ORTAGUS: Ever we have talked about the need of de-escalation. We have called for a peaceful resolution. The President has consistently said that
he does not want to work, that we believe that we can solve our differences bilaterally. There's two things that this President has consistently said
since the beginning of this administration, and that is that he wants peace, that he doesn't want war and that Iran were not good in nuclear
weapon.
And those two things are not mutually inconsistent. And may I add, Brian Hook, our special envoy for Iran was just with NATO this morning briefing
them. We are incredibly confident in this public statements. Your audience should know and should go and read the E3 statement put up by the
Germans, the British that contradict what you just said to me, it completely contradicts you.
ANDERSON: What - hang on a minute, hang on a minute. Mike Pompeo said he was disappointed with the Europeans reaction. What did he mean by that?
ORTAGUS: He said that on Friday night, and there's a brand spanking new statement this morning from the E3 that were quite pleased with it. You
can go Google right now.
ANDERSON: Now that Iran has said it is going to no longer abide by the nuclear deal. There will be -
(CROSSTALK)
ANDERSON: Hang on. I haven't -- with respect, I haven't finished. There will be those watching this show tonight who say that the United States has
actually brought the world closer to a nuclear Iran to which you say what?
ORTAGUS: The - Iran has been saying for a long time they would -- that they wouldn't abide by the JCPOA. In fact, it has been the E3 and our
European partners. If you go back to September to the U.N. General Assembly in New York and look at that statement in the beginning of the
week that the E3 put out. Again, the E3 called for Iran to come back to the new negotiating table for a new and better deal.
The Europeans have also said very publicly that they were -- they have expressed their displeasure at the Iranian regime. Consistently saying
over the past -- I think it's been at least six months that they're going to defy the JCPOA. So you don't have to take America's word for it. Take
the Europeans word for it.
ANDERSON: That, we will leave it there. We thank you very much indeed for joining us. That is the spokeswoman for the U.S. State Department. Do
stay with us. We are right back after what will be a very, very short break. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[11:55:02]
ANDERSON: All right. Celebrities have been throwing their force behind this climate crisis including Russell Crowe. Winning best actor in the
Showtime series, The Loudest Voice. Crowe said he couldn't attend the ceremony because he was at home in Australia fighting those deadly
bushfires, but it did send a message read by actress Jennifer Aniston.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JENNIFER ANISTON, AMERICAN ACTRESS: Make no mistake, the tragedy unfolding in Australia is climate change based. We need to act based on science,
move our global workforce to renewable energy and respect our planet for the unique and amazing place it is.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: Well, the night had more than its fair share of political moments as well. Have a listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PATRICIA ARQUETTE, AMERICAN ACTRESS: We're not going to look back on this night. In the history books, we will see a country on the brink of war,
the United States of America, a president tweeting out a threat of 52 bombs, including cultural size.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: And it wasn't just the nominees and presenters speaking out on political issues, the Golden Globe organizers made the decision to serve a
vegan meal at the ceremony out of concern for climate change. I'm Becky Anderson. That was CONNECTED The WORLD. Thank you for watching.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
END
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