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Top Medical Expert: Remdesivir Drug Shows "Positive Effect"; Analysts Expect Another 3.5 Million Jobless Claims; U.K. Revises Death Toll, Now Second Highest in Europe; Critics: Trump Didn't Act Soon Enough; Dubai Mall Reopens; Pandemic Threatens Refugee Camps; World War II Veteran Promoted to Colonel on His Birthday. Aired 10-11a ET
Aired April 30, 2020 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[10:00:00]
HALA GORANI, CNN HOST (voice-over): Hello and welcome, everybody. I'm Hala Gorani.
This hour, we're going to cover two very different sides of the coronavirus pandemic. First, the reality: 30 million Americans are now asking for
unemployment benefits as economies across Europe and the world shrink dramatically.
Also this hour, the hope: senior medical officials say there is evidence that an experimental drug might help coronavirus patients recover more
quickly.
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GORANI: Well, and we start with these very grim, very sobering economic numbers. The economies of countries around the world coming effectively to
a screeching halt. Just released U.S. jobless numbers reveal another 3.8 million Americans filed for unemployment benefits last week, bringing the
total to more than 30 million over six weeks, 3-0.
Today we got first quarter GDP numbers from some of Europe's biggest economies. France is down almost 6 percent, officially throwing the country
into recession; Italy also in recession after a nearly 5 percent drop in economic growth.
Spain plunged more than 5 percent, double its worst drop during the 2008 financial crisis. And the U.S. reported similar numbers yesterday.
Now remember these economies were at worst stable over the first two months of the year. And the early part of March, the huge drops reflect only a few
weeks of shutdowns. Julia Chatterley joins me now live.
The latest numbers, latest jobless claims figures plus 3.84 million, bringing the virus total over the last six weeks to over 30 million. All of
the job gains since the financial crisis of '08-'09 wiped out, Julia.
JULIA CHATTERLEY, CNN ANCHOR: Long since, Hala. These are devastating numbers; we're talking one in five workers now in the United States either
having lost their job, been furloughed or afraid for their jobs.
And this is not just individuals, they're not just numbers. These are families, too, that are now in a situation where they're not sure what the
future looks like. We are starting to see -- by the end of this week we'll see 31 different states beginning the process of reopening but even trying
to add these jobs back or going back to work will be frightening because of the health crisis for many of these workers.
It is tough to gauge the economic impact and how long I think the aftereffects of this will last. Mark Zandi, Moody's Analytics, said to me
today, it is not just about 30 million people asking for help; another 30 million, he estimates, are in some ways seeing their pay cut, even if they
are working.
I'm throwing around numbers here, liberally. But it is -- you're talking about half the U.S. workforce that have been impacted here. And it is just
in the space of six weeks. We have seen nothing like this.
GORANI: Right. And Paul Krugman was saying this was much worse than '08- '09. The question is how long will it last and how long will it take for the people who lost their jobs to get them back because, let's assume a
best case scenario.
Someone has a switch, flips the economy back on. It is not a guarantee that 100 percent of those who have been laid off or furloughed will get their
jobs back right away. There is a lingering effect here that it goes very far into the future, potentially.
CHATTERLEY: This is such a great point. To your point, there is no switch. We don't know what this looks like. We're battling the whole reason for
creating this economic damage in the first place. We're still fighting the virus all around the world.
There is a shortage of tests when you look at Europe and the aftereffects of the shutdown measures that we have seen; in the United States, it is the
case, too. So Jason Furman, I'll go back to him at the council of economic advisers under President Obama said he thinks half the jobs will come back.
I got the message again today from Mark Zandi of Moody's Analytics, half will come back quite quickly. It is the rest. It is the fact that we're
going to have the damage of people having burnt savings, businesses failing as a result of this period of time.
It is going to take a long while and we're not talking months, I think we're talking years to get back to where we started. And that's the honest
truth, Hala.
GORANI: All right. Yes, it is -- it is depressing when you look forward.
[10:05:00]
GORANI: Also there is no switch. Thank you very much, Julia Chatterley, for bringing us up to date there on the new numbers out of the U.S.
Joe Johns is at the White House.
And, of course, as an election year, the president, Donald Trump, is probably getting nervous about what this means in terms of his re-election
prospect and in terms of when a recovery might take place to kind of counteract the damage that all these lockdowns have caused.
JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: There is a public message and private message on that, Hala. The public message essentially from the
president is he's not worried about it at all.
Joe Biden, who is the presumptive Democratic nominee, is not going to beat him, the president says. But privately aides do express a lot of concern
about the numbers. This is just the position a president doesn't want to be in, going into an election.
Of course, that's coming up this November. The public face of what has been going on here today, those numbers with employment, the president's
counselor Kellyanne Conway was on the driveway a while ago, expressing empathy and sympathy, also indicating in her view this thing is going to
turn around.
There are a lot of interventions that the government has put in place, including trillions of dollars spent to try to help people. The question is
whether those interventions are working.
If you listen to the president's son-in-law and adviser, Jared Kushner, he was out here yesterday saying, in his view, everything is going to be all
right, we'll be back to normal in June, he says. In July, the economy will be rocking.
But if you listen to other people like the chairman of the Fed, Jay Powell, he's certainly made it clear he thinks this is a terrible economy, a
terrible place for the country to be in right now.
What to do about it, at least everybody agrees on one thing: there has to be a measure of confidence for the economy to get back on track, for jobs
to get back on track. And what that confidence means is different to different people.
Over here at the White House, they say companies need liability limitations and protection against lawsuits when they get going again so that when
people catch coronavirus as a result of doing business, the companies won't be affected at least so bad.
On the other side of it, the Speaker of the House, Nancy Pelosi, has essentially said there is one thing this economy needs, one thing we need
to get back to normal: that is testing, testing, testing. That's where we stand, Hala. Back to you.
GORANI: All right. Thank you very much for that, Joe Johns, with an update from the White House.
The U.S. Democratic House Speaker, Nancy Pelosi, says that testing is key to getting Americans back to work. She spoke with CNN just a short time
ago. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA), HOUSE SPEAKER: I believe we have to have a path that is about testing so that there is confidence for people when certain
opportunities open up, are there, that they have the confidence that they can join the workforce because other people there have been tested as well.
You cannot -- you cannot turn the economy around without the scientific leadership on it. And, again, testing, testing, testing; contact tracing,
isolation, treatment and the rest, so that people will go forward.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: All right. That is the hope. That has always been talked about from the beginning of this pandemic, that testing is needed.
But many countries, not just the United States, have failed at implementing and carrying out the number of tests promised, including the United
Kingdom. And we'll be discussing that a little bit later. Boris Johnson will be holding his first briefing today.
Now everyone around the world is wondering, when will this all end?
You need a vaccine but you also, in the shorter term, need treatment for people who contract COVID-19. And there is new hope. It is a glimmer but
there is new hope in a drug originally devised to treat Ebola. Senior medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SR. MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Finally, after months of illnesses, deaths connected to the scourge that is COVID-19, we have some
good news. Doctors have found a medicine that seems to work. It is called remdesivir.
DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: The data shows that remdesivir has a clear-cut, significant positive effect
in diminishing the time to recover.
COHEN (voice-over): Remdesivir was a drug developed for Ebola but it didn't work very well for that virus. It never actually has been on the
market for any illness.
[10:10:00]
COHEN: In preliminary results of this new study, sponsored by the National Institutes of Health, more than a thousand patients were randomly assigned
to take either remdesivir or a placebo.
It took the placebo patients 15 days to recover. It took the remdesivir patients 11 days to recover, a 31 percent improvement.
FAUCI: Although a 31 percent improvement doesn't seem like a knockout 100 percent, it is a very important proof of concept because what it has proven
is that a drug can block this virus.
COHEN (voice-over): Specifically the drug blocks an enzyme the virus needs to replicate. Researchers can use that knowledge to create other drugs.
FAUCI: There are a lot of other enzymes that the virus uses that are now going to be targets for this.
COHEN: Plus four fewer days in the hospital means less time for something to go wrong, like a hospital acquired infection.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you stay four more days in a hospital, intubate, ventilator, you increase dramatically the chance that you will have
infections and a chance you're going to die.
COHEN (voice-over): Another advantage, it is thought that the drug has few side effects.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Through the data we had in our trials, in Ebola patients, we knew that the side effects were pretty minimal and were easily
reversed when the medication was stopped.
COHEN (voice-over): But researchers are clear this is not by any means a cure for coronavirus.
DR. JEREMY FAUST, HARVARD MEDICAL SCHOOL: I think that we are seeing a slight glimmer of hope here but I worry that the exuberance is related to
an old saying, that there is no sauce better than hunger.
COHEN (voice-over): They'll forge on, they'll keep looking at remdesivir and also find another drug or a combination of drugs that will be even more
powerful against COVID-19 -- Elizabeth Cohen, CNN, reporting.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GORANI: We're also moving closer to finding out the effectiveness of a coronavirus vaccine, which is being tested by Oxford University and
AstraZeneca in England. Researchers say the first results from human trials should be available by mid-June. Doesn't mean we'll get a vaccine by mid-
June but it is encouraging we'll have results to go on.
Several hundred people have been vaccinated. The university partnered with AstraZeneca to manufacture the vaccine once regulators approve it.
Sterghios Moschos is a professor of molecular virology at Northumbria University.
Before we get to any vaccine, the Food and Drug Administration in the United States would be ready, I'm sure, to fast track remdesivir as a
potential treatment for COVID-19. Anthony Fauci, the top health official in the U.S. says it reduces recovery time it seems by four days from 15 to 11
for people admitted to hospital.
How significant is that in your opinion?
STERGHIOS MOSCHOS, NORTHUMBRIA UNIVERSITY: Well, for the people receiving the medication, unfortunately, it is not as significant as it may sound,
unless they're lucky enough to be in the team that exits the hospital.
What it means is that they have the burden of four days less chances of infection, if they're privately funding their stay, not being intensive
care for four days or even in hospital, four days.
So it is important from that perspective. It is important from the hospital perspective that they can be looked after. But the data we have seen from
the Chinese study do not support that this drug is actually active on this virus.
GORANI: So you're saying the data you've seen from Chinese studies don't suggest remdesivir acts as effectively as we with like against the virus
itself?
Is that what you're saying?
MOSCHOS: That is correct. In clinical science, pharmacology, when we make a drug, we need to be as sure as possible that this drug actually acts the
way we believe it does.
Now when it comes to drugs like these, direct acting anti-virus, they act directly on the virus itself, what you usually see is, within a day or two
of giving the drug, the actual amount of virus drops dramatically. Talking about billions copies the virus disappearing overnight. This is not
happening with remdesivir. If there was a glimpse of that happening, we would see it in the Chinese data.
Somehow it is helping people recover faster. Now Anthony Fauci has a great reputation; I very much doubt that he would have made the statement he
made, had the data not been convincing and if there was anything untoward he would have refrained from making a statement, suggesting that remdesivir
can help the hospitalization.
[10:15:00]
MOSCHOS: So likewise I'm being careful here, saying it can help with hospitalization but it doesn't seem to help with the infection.
GORANI: Got it. I guess at this stage we'll take anything we can get, if it can reduce hospitalization times, it is better than nothing.
As you say, we still -- I guess the jury is still out on whether or not it attacks the virus. You're saying based on Chinese data, that may not be
the case now.
If we can talk about a potential vaccine, is it -- it seems very, very quick to me that the results of human trials, Oxford University, would be
available by mid-June.
Is this faster than normal?
Should we be encouraged we have results this quickly for a potential vaccine?
MOSCHOS: Yes, they need to be congratulated for their effort. AstraZeneca needs to be congratulated for offering to do this at cost. Many were asking
for these actions in Africa in the Ebola outbreak. Some of us were going forward with this.
And now it is fantastic to see a large pharmaceutical company saying we'll do this at cost and get the job done. And it is happening a lot faster than
any other disease beforehand.
Now will it work?
Nobody knows. We just need to be sober and clear about that.
GORANI: Yes. And how do trials work in this case?
Are subjects, are volunteers injected with the virus or are they just vaccinated?
One control group is vaccinated, the other one not and all are sent out to the wilderness and tested mid-June.
Is that how it works?
MOSCHOS: There will be a degree of randomization going on to try to assess how people respond to the virus. So the first few people, we saw first of
all they injected a couple of people because it was nobody being tested before, that particular version of the vaccine, to make sure nothing
untoward would happen.
They probably accelerated the number of people receiving the vaccine. And what they will anticipate is, within two weeks, most likely within a month,
the body to have responded to the vaccine.
So the people will be called back in, in a month's time, samples will be taken and we'll see what the response looks like. Some of these people may
have -- may not have been exposed to the virus. And it will be interesting to see what happens.
If somebody in their family, for example, is exposed to the virus and they don't get it but everybody else in the family gets it, that is an
interesting single data point. But it is only one data point.
So then the next thing to do is probably do the so-called vaccination studies, as we saw with Ebola, they would see new outbreaks, they would
vaccinate everybody that was exposed and hope that the vaccine would protect the people from developing the disease.
GORANI: All right, well, let's hope for the best. And sorry if --
(LAUGHTER)
GORANI: -- if my description was very unscientific.
MOSCHOS: That's fine. That's fine.
GORANI: Thank you very much, Sterghios Moschos, an associate professor of molecular virology.
Britain's prime minister will soon have to answer tough questions in his first briefing since recovering from the coronavirus. The latest from
Downing Street is next.
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[10:20:00]
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GORANI: Britain's prime minister Boris Johnson, haven't seen a lot of him over the last few weeks. He was in hospital, sick, as a result of having
been infected with COVID-19. He is going to be giving today's daily briefing on the country's response to the pandemic, his first since
recovering from the illness.
Boris Johnson will face some tough questions today over the country's weak response in the early days of the outbreak.
Another blow to the government is the likelihood that a crucial target will not be met by the end of April as promised. Officials vowed 100,000 tests a
day would be given by the end of the month, that is today.
As of Tuesday, only half that number of tests were performed. Let's bring in Clarissa Ward, she's at 10 Downing Street.
And Boris Johnson should answer questions in about 1.5 hours, Clarissa.
CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right. As you said, there will undoubtedly been tough questions for the prime minister,
just over a month since he last held one of the press conferences.
And there are a lot of questions as to why the British government has essentially allowed this crisis to spiral to levels that are very
concerning to a lot of people. The death toll now in the U.K. stands at over 26,000.
That makes it one of the highest death tolls in Europe and the persistent promises that have been made such as the question of testing, 1100,000
people supposedly were to be tested every day by today as you said, the last day of April.
In actual fact, we're around half that number are being tested. The government says the capacity is for 70,000, which is certainly a big
improvement on 10,000, which is what it was when they first announced this target.
The government's line here is that it is important to have bold ambitious targets and maybe you don't meet them all but still, in the process at
least, you do make a leap from a number like 10,000 to 70,000.
But to many people, I think, in the U.K., there will be more questions to be answered about why they are failing to meet those targets, why there
hasn't been more progress as well made on the issue of PPE and this perpetual problem of the United Kingdom's health workers not having
adequate and sufficient PPE in order to do their jobs.
The other question, of course, Hala, that everybody wants to know is when will the lockdown be lifted?
What will the lifting of the lockdown look like?
And I think, realistically, few expect the prime minister to give any satisfying answers on that. The line coming from Downing Street and from
his spokesman today is very much, we cannot afford to move too quickly, lift the lockdown, risk a second wave of infection and essentially squander
all the hard work and sacrifice that the British public has already made.
GORANI: And why did the death toll jump so much in the last 24-36 hours?
We're over 26,000 dead in the U.K.
WARD: So essentially this comes down to an issue of the data that is being presented every day. So the government, in its daily briefings, when they
present those death tolls, they're looking at people who have died in hospitals. They are not looking at people who have died either in their
homes, residential homes or in care homes.
Essentially what has transpired is that Britain's care homes have been ravaged by the coronavirus. And so once the various organizations have been
able to gather the statistics and gather all the information and data pertaining to deaths in care homes, what they have come up with is a number
that is, you know, jaw-droppingly higher than what people had initially expected.
And there had been discussion weeks ago by some speculation, one might say, that the U.K. could end up having one of the worst death tolls. Now it
appears that speculation may become reality, Hala.
GORANI: All right, Clarissa Ward, thank you very much.
We'll be talking to Clarissa a little bit later after the prime minister holds that briefing.
[10:25:00]
GORANI: And we will be, by the way, bringing you that briefing live. It is at 12:00 pm Eastern in New York, 5:00 pm here in London.
Well, what if countries did not need to shut borders in order to fight the coronavirus?
Sweden has taken that path, giving us a clear picture of what would happen if other countries had decided to take the approach of a much looser
lockdown.
Now critics say that strategy, though, has brought deadly consequences to Sweden. Sweden has a much higher death toll than other Nordic countries.
Phil Black is in Stockholm and sent us this report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PHIL BLACK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: To visit Sweden now is to enter a strange land where people can just hang out together. To seek shelter from the cold
and cozy restaurants, go for a drink or a coffee.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It has been crowded all over. All the bars, restaurants and so on.
BLACK: You can shop for fashion and beauty products, or even allow a hairdresser to invade your personal space.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sooner or later we will get corona, I think, too.
BLACK: So, you've accepted that that will happen?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
BLACK: And in the meantime, it's important to look good?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. You're right.
BLACK: That sums up the authorities approach here. COVID-19 is going to be around for a while and society must find a way to live with it.
So, no forced lockdown, instead, an emphasis on personal responsibility. Please work from home, keep to yourself in public. The official rules in
bars and restaurants is stay in arm's length apart. No gatherings of more than 50 people, elementary and middle schools are still open, while most
high school students and college students, study at home.
Anders Tegnell is the state epidemiologist driving the policies here. He claims success in flattening the curve and keeping serious cases within
hospital capacity and he says it's a good thing.
BLACK (voice-over): His agency estimates 26 percent of Stockholm's population has now been infected because in theory, that means more
immunity.
BLACK: But you insist that herd immunity has never been a goal?
ANDERS TEGNELL, SWEDEN'S CHIEF EPIDEMIOLOGIST: No, but it will help us in achieving our goal which is slowing down the spread as much as possible so
that we can keep in good healthcare.
BLACK: But for a small country, Sweden is already paying a big human cost. More than 2,400 people have died here. Vastly greater numbers, the
neighboring countries which imposed much tougher restrictions.
TEGNELL: That is true. Even in --
(CROSSTALK)
BLACK: What do you take from that?
TEGNELL: Yes. That we need to investigate and try to understand why. We know for sure one of the reasons why is that we have this huge amount of
cases in our homes.
BLACK: It's a disturbing trend around heart of those who've died here live in care homes. The Swedish government admits they failed to protect the
elderly. The open policies are broadly popular here but there is anger too, especially among those who have lost so much to the virus.
MIRREY GOURIE (PH), FATHER DIED FROM CORONAVIRUS: I'm so sorry. It hurts when I say his name.
BLACK: Mirrey Gourie (ph), buried her father Joseph on Monday. She says he and many others would still be alive if Sweden had just chosen a different
path.
GOURIE: There is people dying and there is a human being like me, like you, like my dad. They are not just statistics or numbers.
BLACK: Sweden's experience will inform governments around the world as a plot their exits from lockdown, but authorities here say it is still too
soon to judge their actions, because they, like everyone, are struggling to deal with the threat they are only starting to understand -- Phil Black,
CNN, Stockholm.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
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[10:30:00]
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GORANI: Well, China says it is really not interested in meddling in the U.S. presidential election. That's after the U.S. president himself said
China would do anything to stop him getting re-elected in November.
Mr. Trump told Reuters that China should have done more to contain the coronavirus and that its goal all along was to make him look bad and lose
the election. China's foreign ministry calls the U.S. election "an internal affair" and says the world will make its own judgment on China's pandemic
reaction.
We're joined by Ian Bremmer, political scientist and president of the Eurasia Group.
President Trump is pointing the finger at China and blaming them for the pandemic that has spread around the world and made him, you know,
potentially less politically popular at home.
What do you make of that?
IAN BREMMER, EURASIA GROUP: Well, not a surprise. And, of course, China did cover up the human to human transmission for the first month in China.
While that was happening, you had hundreds of thousands of Chinese leave Wuhan for the United States; 5 million leave Wuhan for parts of China. You
don't get a pandemic of this scale unless China made those missteps.
And they weren't transparent with the World Health Organization either. But the first cases were in South Korea and the United States, same day. And
South Korea, Germany, other countries responded to this much more effectively. The Americans did not.
So of course, it is not Trump's style to take any responsibility for anything that ever goes wrong. But clearly there is a fair amount of
accountability that is also on the president's shoulders when it comes to how the Americans pull out of this crisis.
GORANI: Right. And also there were huge spikes and case numbers in Italy and Spain and European countries before it became a huge issue in the
United States.
Similarly in the United Kingdom, they had about a three-week warning because they were three weeks behind Italy. And the numbers announced
yesterday were over 26,000.
So I wonder, governments that are failing to respond well to this pandemic and managing the problem poorly, how will it change the political
landscape, do you think, around the world?
BREMMER: You know, we already see that the bump that Trump received in the first few weeks of the crisis in his polls has gone away.
Same thing is true for President Macron in France. Merkel is improving about 80 percent levels now. South Korea doing very well, they had
parliamentary elections, President Moon returned to a supermajority, a lot of support.
So look, a big crisis, you know, really tells you who is a leader, who isn't. As Warren Buffett says when the tide goes out, you see who is naked.
We're seeing which emperors aren't wearing clothing.
And on balance the United States hasn't failed; the economic response has been pretty robust but the healthcare response hasn't been super to our
standard.
GORANI: Then you have other countries, you mentioned those that have been the leaders who have been pleased for their response, Jacinda Ardern in New
Zealand, Germany, some of the Nordic countries as well.
And it is going to be interesting as well to see, I guess, how that affects upcoming elections in the United States and other parts of the world.
What do you think?
[10:35:00]
BREMMER: Well, it is interesting that Trump is now blaming the Chinese and saying not only that they are responsible for the pandemic but also they're
going to interfere in the U.S. election and they really don't want him to win.
I will tell you that, first of all, Chinese understand that the only major foreign policy issue with the broad Democrat and Republican agreement is on
taking a harder line toward China.
So they expect that either Biden or Trump would be problematic for them. Biden would focus more on human rights issues, Hong Kong treatment of the
Uighurs, things that Trump doesn't care about.
Trump, you have more focus on the national security side but on the core economic and technology issues, they're going to be hit by the United
States either way. Interesting thing is the leaders I talked to, actually to the extent they have a preference -- and hard to imagine them
interfering in the way the Russians have with U.S. elections because they don't have a background in that.
But to the extent they have a preference, they actually prefer Trump to win a second election because, even though it is going to be hard against the
Chinese, they see the absence of U.S. leadership globally, the fact that Trump's relations with so many allies is so damaged, providing some
geopolitical space for the Chinese to do better in that environment over four more years.
So to the extent they have an interest here, it is the opposite of what Trump was saying.
GORANI: Just a quick point also on battleground states and Donald Trump's favorability has dropped quite substantially because, in the United States,
in states like Pennsylvania and Michigan, Joe Biden wasn't seen or heard from much, as much as you would see or hear from him during a typical
campaign, is leading by several percentage points in these very important states.
Also despite the fact that there are questions now about a decades-old sexual assault allegation, so it is interesting to see because, normally,
Americans, especially, rally around their leader in times of national crisis and in this case it isn't happening.
BREMMER: I see between the one sexual assault allegation, the talks of Hunter Biden being corrupt, the incoherence when Biden speaks, I'm starting
to think Biden might be president material because what I'm saying is that, you know, Trump has all of those allegations and realities to a much, much
greater degree. Didn't stop him from being elected in 2016.
I think the reality is that the swing state polls are still pretty tight. They are lot higher than the national polls that show Biden is way in
front. Swing state polls are the ones that matter.
The worst recession of our lifetime is hitting the United States when there is an election. It clearly plays very badly for Trump. But we will still be
socially distancing in November. And even though there is a lot of broader enthusiasm and support for Biden and Mr. Trump, among the base, Trump's
base is much more fervent about him than Biden's base is for Biden, which means that lower turnout is an advantage for Trump.
And social distancing in November and a pandemic is an advantage for lower turnout. So I still think it is actually pretty close when you look about
where we're heading in November right now.
GORANI: All right, Ian Bremmer, thank you very much. Thanks for joining us. I think there was a dog on that chair behind you. There he is.
BREMMER: That's Moose. Moose says hi.
GORANI: What's his name?
BREMMER: Moose.
GORANI: Thanks. Love it. I think I might bring my dog on, on to the show before this is all said and done. Thanks very much, Ian Bremmer.
Well, he's not too interested.
Now to the goal for the city of Dubai is trying to reopen, shoppers at one of the giant malls there are allowed back in. And they're out and about at
one of the world's largest malls, the Dubai mall.
Once again, open after closing for a month due to the coronavirus outbreak. However, it is operating at only 30 percent capacity. And crowds are still
sparse. Normally 250,000 people a day visit the more than 1,300 retail stores. And John Defterios joins us live from the mall now.
What is it like now at this shopping mall?
It doesn't look too busy where you are, John.
JOHN DEFTERIOS, CNN EMERGING MARKETS EDITOR: Yes, a great perception , Hala. I've been here for the entire day. This is starting to pick up now.
We'll be breaking for Iftar and breaking fast in the next five or six minutes. People are going to restaurants or staying at home would come
later.
They changed the hours. They started midday and finish at 10:00. This is the new normal. You test people for temperatures as they come in. They want
to limit capacity to 30 percent. They're not even anywhere near it in the early days of opening up.
But that would be 75,000 versus the 250,000 or above that you're talking about. Sometimes it is 350,000 people here on the weekend.
[10:40:00]
DEFTERIOS: And I had to say, they are abiding by the rules. They have heat sensing cameras to measure temperatures and the flow of people as well.
But I think consumers are taking a very easy step coming in. There is a price for this, though, Hala. That is growth. UAE is expected to contract
by 3.5 percent this year. And the chairman of this mall, Dubai Mall, Emaar, was saying the road to recovery is a long one. Second half of 2021. Let's
take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MOHAMED ALABBAR, EMAAR: I expect that we really have to go gradually and more upward toward the end of the year. If there is no major outbreak there
and then into first quarter next year.
DEFTERIOS: When you start to recover.
ALABBAR: Mid next year maybe we are back to normal.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DEFTERIOS: That's a pretty long timeline. You know the chairman there, he's being very cautious. I was thinking about this and we can relate to
this, usually Dubai and UAE benefit from chaos around them, the Iran-Iraq War, the Gulf War, even the Arab Spring.
They always served as a safe haven. What is different this time with the pandemic, it is hitting everybody equally. The Gulf carriers are suffering.
Tourism is suffering and, in this early evening, the shopping malls are just starting to pick up but not a lot of steady flow. Not the old normal
but the new normal.
GORANI: All right, thank you very much, John Defterios.
You'll remember at the beginning of the pandemic, Russia was saying it was not as affected as other countries. That is not the case anymore. It has
reached a pretty grim milestone, recording a total number of coronavirus cases above the 100,000 mark for Russia.
And this comes after more than 7,000 infections were reported in a single day on Thursday. The country's health care system is stretched thin and is
struggling to handle all these rising numbers. Matthew Chance has our story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): For weeks, Russia insisted the pandemic there was under control. But these
startling images from a hospital in the south of the country show just how overstretched its health service has become.
This cold, tiny room was a laundry storage cupboard, according to the narrator. Now it's a makeshift ward for five coughing women. No room for
social distancing here. And these aren't even the hospital's patients. They're medical staff, the narrator says, who have fallen ill with symptoms
of the virus and with nowhere else to be treated.
We can't confirm they have COVID-19, but a local government official says the women were later moved to a fully equipped ward and several hospital
employees were disciplined. Still, it's a grim picture with a toll this coronavirus is taking on Russia's health workers.
This Russian doctor says she believes a large proportion of medical workers are already sick, and in current working conditions, she says more
infections for just a matter of time.
Across Russia, the plight of essential medical staff has become a major concern. Moscow's main coronavirus hospital is reported to have suffered
mass resignations of key workers. Like Natalia Lyubimaya, who complaints on social media of excessively long shifts, lasting days on end, lack of
equipment, as well as food and salary shortfalls.
The hospital denies it's using staff, but even the Kremlin is now acknowledging acute shortages of personal protection equipment or PPE
despite ramping up production.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VLADIMIR PUTIN, RUSSIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): In March, 3,000 protective suits for doctors were produced per day. By mid-May, it would be
over 150,000. Yes, in comparison with what it was just recently, it is a lot. But in comparison with what is needed now, it is still not enough.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHANCE: It's been just a few weeks since Russia was exporting assistance overseas to the U.S. and especially Italy, where Russian doctors were shown
working side by side with a European comrade.
But at this hospital at home in St. Petersburg, Russia's second biggest city, ambulance drivers said they were waiting up to 10 hours outside just
to deliver a single patient.
The numbers, it seems, are already overwhelming, and Russia's peak, according to the Kremlin, is yet to come -- Matthew Chance, CNN.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GORANI: After the break, an outbreak in a refugee camp, imagine that. It would be almost impossible to contain. I'll be speaking to the president of
Doctors without Borders on what they're doing to try to prevent that from happening. We'll be right back.
(MUSIC PLAYING)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[10:45:00]
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GORANI: Well, one major concern is what happens if COVID-19 takes hold in places already dealing with another crisis, whether a war or a hunger
problem.
For instance in an overcrowded refugee camp in Greece or elsewhere, where access to running water and six feet of space is really pretty much unheard
of, or Cameroon, for instance, where confirmed cases are some of the highest in sub-Saharan Africa.
And violence is spilling on the border from neighboring countries. Medecins sans Frontieres or Doctors without Borders is in at least 70
countries, they deal with all sorts of medical issues and emergencies but are also now having to manage the pandemic. Joining me now is Dr.
Christophe Christou, the international president of MSF.
Talk to us about your operations now around the world and how they're affected by the pandemic.
DR. CHRISTOPHE CHRISTOU, MEDECINS SANS FRONTIERES: Well, thank you for the question and for the invitation. I think it is really important to
understand that this right moment we -- everyone tries to adapt and we need to look at the bigger picture.
And this bigger picture involves several other crisis within this crisis of COVID-19 pandemic. So we try to get better prepared. However we know in
some places as those that you just described, this is not easy at all. Measures like wash your hands or even isolate and keep some social
distancing are not an option.
[10:50:00]
CHRISTOU: In all these places, I think that crucial part of what we do is how much we inform and we engage with the communities. And developing
isolation wards and clinics.
What about the doctors who are working in these difficult circumstances?
Do they have the protective gear that is required if they suspect a COVID case?
Well, we are in a position where we think that we have what we need. At least for the coming months. However, we must make sure that everyone,
every health worker, not only the people we work with us but also people that we collaborate from the different ministers and the national health
system, they need to be very well protected. And I'm afraid we're not there yet. It is important also for them to inspire the security, the safety that
they need. And I think that so far we have witnessed cases where everyone really applauses and we want to shower show our respect for what people do
in the front line. Over times we also see fear driving, stigmatizing and cruel behavior towards these people.
One thing I find interesting and we have collated case numbers for developing countries with very high population densities. Nigeria, Egypt
and South Africa.
[10:50:00]
GORANI: And relatively speaking these countries have far fewer COVID cases than Italy or, you know, Spain or the U.K. or the U.S.
Why do you think that is?
You have a global look that we don't have on the health care systems and the health crises around the world.
What is your explanation for this?
CHRISTOU: That's the question that keeps bothering everyone at this moment. First of all, we don't know yet how much this is true. However, I
hope this is a true hypothesis. And there are several factors that it can explain partially why this happens and they are related both to
morphological (ph) figures as well as environmental ones.
However, I think that the question when it comes to places like Africa or other places around the world of less developed countries, I think the
question should not be about how much they have been infected by the COVID- 19 but how much they have been affected by this pandemic.
And we see all the public crises, collateral damages that are unfortunately, I can already tell you that they're going to affect this
population. So more than we can even imagine. We see people that they still need our care. Babies are still born and we need to run vaccine campaigns.
We need to provide care to the traumas of the wards, we need to treat malnourished populations. And I'm afraid that the fact that even ourselves
will not allow this moment to move around the different projects as well as the supplies that cannot reach these places makes these things even more
tough. And I'm not --
(CROSSTALK)
GORANI: Are you seeing a decline in -- are you seeing a decline in funding and donations for MSF?
CHRISTOU: I don't see a decline in the funding of MSF. What I see is that everyone now is looking at the -- what can I say, any response to COVID as
if it is the only problem. And their funds are more earmarked toward COVID.
However, I insist that we need to bring this bigger picture and there is a picture that is bigger than the one that COVID drove at this moment.
GORANI: Yes. OK. Dr. Christophe Christou , the international president of Doctors without Borders, thank you very much.
Coming up, he captured the hearts of millions of people around the world after raising millions of for the U.K.'s National Health Service. Now
veteran Tom Moore, Captain Tom, is being honored because today he turned 100. That is next.
(MUSIC PLAYING)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(MUSIC PLAYING)
GORANI: Well, warm wishes and congratulations are in order for British World War II veteran Tom Moore. He became a national -- in fact, it has got
to be said, an international hero for raising millions and millions of dollars for NHS charities. Look at this, he was treated to a flyover by
these historic military planes to mark his 100th birthday today.
[10:55:00]
GORANI: But that is not all. Moore has been promoted to an honorary colonel of the British Army for his amazing achievements. I had the
pleasure to speak with the colonel a couple of weeks ago. He said it was overwhelming to see how much money he raised just by walking in his garden.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CAPT. TOM MOORE, BRITISH ARMY VETERAN: I'm absolutely overwhelmed by this sum of money. When you translate it into American dollars, it is even
bigger. And really we never, ever for a minute thought we would get to this sort of money, which started off with a little modest figure, we might try
and make a thousand pounds, which we did.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Well, today on his 100th birthday, Tom Moore, Colonel Moore, raised more than $37 million for the fight against COVID-19. Our Anna
Stewart shows us how people around the world, because they need it, we need heroes right now, all the healthcare workers and doctors are and Tom Moore
is as well. Anna Stewart has more on how the world is honoring him.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANNA STEWART, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Tens of thousands of cards fill this school hall, a makeshift sorting office near the home of someone very
special. The message is simple and heartfelt.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Happy birthday to you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're our hero.
STEWART (voice-over): War veteran Captain Tom Moore captured the world's heart when he walked 100 laps of his garden ahead of his 100th birthday,
raising tens of millions of pounds for NHS charities.
Since crossing that finish line, he's been nonstop, opening a Nightingale Hospital in Northern England, appearing on numerous TV shows.
PIERS MORGAN, TV HOST: It seems that Moore and is even I do.
MOORE: I'm enjoying every minute of it.
STEWART (voice-over): He's even had a tree named after him. And recently he became the oldest person to ever hit number one in the record charts.
(MUSIC PLAYING)
STEWART (voice-over): In honor of his birthday, the British Royal Mail are marking every letter sent in the U.K. with a special postmark. Of course,
this week, thousands of those letters are destined for him -- Anna Stewart, CNN, London.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GORANI: And a programming note, Bill Gates will be joining Dr. Sanjay Gupta and Anderson Cooper for CNN's weekly town hall, which takes place at
8:00 am Friday in Hong Kong, 8:00 pm in New York.
And the program will replay Friday at 9:00 am in Abu Dhabi and 1:00 pm in Hong Kong.
Thanks, everyone, for watching this hour. I'm Hala Gorani. We're going to take a quick break on CNN. We continue our coverage of the coronavirus
pandemic with John King after this. Stay with us.
END
