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U.S. Tops 300,000 Deaths on Vaccine Rollout Day; COVID-19 Battle Gets Tougher in Parts of Europe; CNN Exclusive: Navalny, Novichok and Moscow; Trump to Impose New Sanctions on Turkey; Electoral College Cements Biden Victory; Deepening Divide between Wall Street and Main Street; U.K., E.U. Warn No-Deal Brexit Is Likely. Aired 10-11a ET

Aired December 15, 2020 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:00:00]

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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. JEROME ADAMS, U.S. SURGEON GENERAL: The finish line is in sight. The last couple of miles are the hardest.

BECKY ANDERSON, CNN HOST (voice-over): This hour, as COVID-19 vaccinations begin rolling out across the world, rising case counts are forcing several

countries back into lockdowns.

Plus --

JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES: Democracy prevailed.

ANDERSON (voice-over): It's done. It's over. Every box has been checked and Joe Biden has some blunt words for the American president.

But can Donald Trump accept them all?

Then --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): They said they would kill whoever is trying to escape and I began to run, climbing one rock to another,

through a forest.

ANDERSON (voice-over): A young Nigerian boy tells of his horrific escape after a school kidnapping; 300 of his classmates are still missing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

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ANDERSON: It's 10:00 in the morning in D.C., 4:00 in the afternoon in Berlin, it is 7:00 here in Abu Dhabi. I'm Becky Anderson, hello and welcome

to CONNECT THE WORLD.

Well, it was the best of times, it was the worst of times and so feels the world that we are in right now, almost Dickensian, trapped between the

light of the end of the tunnel, a vaccine and the darkness of the reality that we are still in, amid this pandemic.

As of now, according to official records, more than 1.6 million people have lost their lives around the world; the real number could likely be far

higher. Still, almost one in five of them are American. There are more than 300,000 people who have died from a disease that, a year ago, less than

that even, none of us had ever heard of.

Yet it's coming to define our lives, the way we speak now, intrinsically medical even, the number of people who have died in the states is in the

worst way we can possibly fathom in a league of its own. Have a listen to the U.S. surgeon general.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ADAMS: My message to America is that the finish line is in sight. The last couple of miles are the hardest but we have got to keep running because,

even if you aren't worried about COVID, your loved one who is in labor may not have a hospital bed. Your loved one who is having a heart attack or who

gets in a car accident may not have a bed.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON: Well, that might be the longest mile any of us will endure. Take the U.K., for example; last week, it was the first in the West to roll out

vaccines. Tomorrow, it will shut down its capital with the highest restrictions it has in its tool kit.

Germany and the Netherlands will also do the same, long, hard lockdowns. We will be connecting you to continental Europe in just a moment with CNN's

Fred Pleitgen, who is in Berlin for you.

First to Salma Abdelaziz on the ground in London, as the capital braces for a new round of "don't do this and can't go there."

I will come to you shortly, Fred.

Just describe what is going on in Germany at this point.

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Germany, Becky, is really on the eve of that major lockdown. Of course, a lot of

Germans really getting in that last minute Christmas shopping because, come tomorrow, all the shops will be closed.

I can tell you earlier today I was going around Berlin a little bit, I was in some of these shops and there are a lot of people who are still trying

to do things last minute because, come tomorrow, Christmas shopping is going to stop.

It is really a hard lockdown; all nonessential shops, all nonessential businesses will be closed. Schools will be closed as well. It's all going

to go to distance learning.

Another interesting facet of the German lockdown is that they're banning alcohol sales in public. What's been going on over the past couple of

weeks, people who would normally be in Christmas markets, selling mulled wine, they had mulled wine stands taken away. And people were bunching up

in front of those mulled wine stands.

They're shutting that down as well. Church services, people have to register for church services, no singing. It is quite strict lockdown

measures in Germany.

Becky, in Holland, in the Netherlands, it is actually even still a little bit stricter, a little bit longer. In fact, the prime minister of that

country, Mark Rutte, he was saying that the Netherlands are essentially being locked up, as he put it, also all nonessential businesses were

closing.

They were open in the first wave of the pandemic in spring. Also, of course, schools closed as well. In the Netherlands, they are going further.

[10:05:00]

PLEITGEN: In Germany, all of this is still January 10th; in the Netherlands, January 18th, Becky.

ANDERSON: Back to you shortly.

Salma, you are in London. Just over a week ago, we saw the lovely Maggie Keenan getting her first vaccine there. Now or certainly in the U.K., now

more restrictions, further lockdowns.

What has the reaction been from the public?

Is there an understanding that the fight is nowhere near over in the U.K.?

SALMA ABDELAZIZ, CNN PRODUCER: Becky, I think there's an understanding that there's a problem. But the controversy is over the solution. We have

yet another spike in coronavirus cases, an increase in hospitalization rates and, with that surge, of course, comes the debate over what to do

with it.

So the government strategy, the prime minister's strategy, is a three-tier regional restriction system. And starting midnight tonight, this city will

fall under the country's toughest rules, tier 3.

Let's start looking at how that's going to change life here in London. I know you have that graphic up. So right now, restaurants, casinos,

nightlife, pubs can remain open as long as they close at 11:00 pm.

That's all going to change, they all have to shut down, all those social life restrictions, all that social gatherings will be curbed; hotel, indoor

entertainment venues also closed; right now those are open in a limited capacity.

And then weddings, funerals, all of that canceled. But here is the catch to all of this. Schools can remain open and this is, of course, concerning

because the group with the fastest rising infection rates is between the ages of 11 to 18. So that's students.

And the government's answer to this has been to roll out testing programs at the schools in the most affected neighborhoods in London. But this is

something that has many experts worried, including the mayor of London, who says he wants to see those schools shut down before the end of the week.

The other critical part here, unlike my colleague, Fred, in Berlin, who is watching people scramble last minute for Christmas shopping, here there

will be no scramble. All crowds can continue shopping away because all nonessential shops can remain open.

The other important point to remember here is that there is a special Christmastime dispensation. Rules will be relaxed further between December

23rd and December 27th. The prime minister under a lot of pressure to reconsider this, from the opposition Labour Party, health experts, from the

medical community, two medical journals saying if the prime minister does not reconsider Christmastime rules, many more lives will be lost. Becky?

ANDERSON: Yes. What unprecedented combined op-eds from some of the most renowned medical journals there, urging the prime minister in the U.K. to

reconsider.

Fred, back to you. Germany's health minister said earlier today that the European Medicines Agency or the EMA could approve for COVID-19 vaccine as

early as December 23rd.

Does that tally with what we are hearing from the agency itself?

And is it clear why the approval process for a vaccine rollout in the E.U. has been slower than elsewhere?

PLEITGEN: Well, Becky, it's starting to tally with what we're hearing from the European Commission. Earlier today, we were in touch with the European

Medicines Agency and they were still saying essentially their deadline was January 29th and not January 21st.

We have since heard from the head of the European Commission that apparently a key meeting has been moved up to December 21st and that that

approval could come maybe on December 23rd. At least that's the hope of the German health minister and certainly the hope of many people here in Europe

as well.

Now the German health minister talked about this as to why it's taking so long here on the European continent. What they're saying is they never went

for an emergency use authorization like we saw, for instance, in the U.S. and in the U.K..

What you're going to see here in Europe is a full approval, going through a full approval process. That rolling process has been going on for quite a

while. So while the Europeans would then be capable of saying that they have the first fully approved vaccine, that certainly is not good enough

for a lot of people here in Europe, who are saying, look, the Pfizer BioNTech vaccine was developed in Germany.

The regulatory bodies in the U.K. and the U.S. are among the best in the world and they managed to get emergency use authorizations faster than the

European Union. And even the German health minister at the end was saying, look, in the end right now, this is about the credibility of the E.U. and

its ability to act on all of this.

Of course, they're saying all this needs to happen as fast as possible. Now we're seeing some movement there from the European Commission, saying that

key meeting now on December 21st and vaccinations then could start when they get that authorization, could start fairly soon afterwards, certainly

before the end of the year, Becky.

ANDERSON: Yes, clearly significant pressure behind the scenes.

[10:10:00]

ANDERSON: Citizens of the E.U. who have decided sort of, you know -- or had it decided for them -- this is going to be a kind of "we" rather than

"I" process, you know, there's a lot of nationalism going on in the vaccine rollout. The Europeans deciding it would be a full on sort of E.U. effort.

But I'm sure many people where you are desperate to see these vaccines approved.

Fred, Salma, thank you.

When the British health secretary announced that London was moving into England's highest pandemic alert level, he also announced that there is a

new strain of coronavirus circulating across the U.K. That could sound very scary.

There's no published research to back up his statement yet and scientists have been quick to try to calm the public's fears. I do want to investigate

this further with our chief medical correspondent, Dr. Sanjay Gupta.

I realize it's not unusual for viruses to mutate, Sanjay.

What do we know so far?

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. First of all, you're right. As viruses spread more and more, you do -- they do tend to

accumulate some mutations.

But interestingly, the mutations they often accumulate are towards mutations that may make them more likely to spread but make them less

lethal.

If you are a virus, how are you trying to change?

You'd like to try to get as many hosts as possible so make yourself easier to transmit but you certainly don't want to kill your hosts. So that is how

viruses typically mutate.

Again, it's not uncommon; the flu virus does that as well. This could be a mutation that he's talking about, which may have existed for a while and is

maybe coming more to light now or, in fact, it is a newer mutation and it's coming to light because it is transmitting more quickly.

But regardless I think the two key things that investigators really look at, one is the lethality, how likely it is to kill -- and it doesn't seem

that it's any more lethal than the other -- you know, the more common strains.

And two is, will it still respond to vaccines?

The way that these vaccines are made, the ones that you were just talking about, the way that they target the virus should not affect these mutations

within this new -- this new strain. So something to keep an eye on. But I don't think anything to be alarmed about, not right now.

ANDERSON: OK. Interesting.

Well, the U.S., of course, began rolling out the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine yesterday, Sanjay. I know you spoke to the Pfizer CEO, who said this year

they will have some 50 million doses available, with the majority, he says, already manufactured.

At what pace are these vaccines rolling out at this point?

GUPTA: Yes, this is a good question. So 50 million doses globally is what the CEO of Pfizer said, so 25 million. They say at least the initial 50

million, 25 million will be in the United States and 25 million around the world.

By the end of next year, just to give you some idea of the expected manufacturing pace, he thinks that the number will be well over a billion,

close to 1.2 billion or 1.3 billion doses. So if you think about it, it's close to 100 million doses per month, 25 million per week, roughly. And,

again, that's globally.

Right now, as you may know, Becky, 100 million of those billion-plus doses have been reserved for the United States and the rest for around the world,

although these negotiations continue.

This really, you know, counts on the fact that the manufacturing process goes as expected, in terms of actually being able to scale up that

manufacturing, being able to meet all those quality controls and being able to get all the raw ingredients.

That's been a problem in the past with things like testing, you know, not having enough tests but not having enough reagents. Now you have Pfizer

making an mRNA vaccine; Moderna is making an mRNA vaccine.

Will they be competing for some of the similar raw ingredients and how will that play into this?

We'll see. But they're quite bullish, you know, Becky, about making over a billion doses, they say, by the end of next year.

ANDERSON: Fascinating. Our viewers will be keen to get an update on the Moderna vaccine, Sanjay. As I understand it, that is also on the cusp of

being authorized.

What more do we know on that?

And we also heard from a surgeon earlier in the program, who said, when we see the light, that's when the hardest mile sort of appears, as it were.

Do you agree with that?

GUPTA: Yes, I mean, you know, I think it's interesting, Becky. I think people hear about the vaccine and see this hope and there's a lot to be

hopeful for, there is no question. I think people fall into two camps at that point.

[10:15:00]

GUPTA: You know, a certain percentage of people, who say, well, this thing is over, we can look at this pandemic in the rearview mirror. And that's

obviously not the case. We're still very much in the throes of this.

The second camp of people, Becky, often say, look, we just got a little bit longer to go, let's just get there. I think, you know, a couple months ago,

we weren't sure how long it was going to take to really see this light at the end of the tunnel or to get through this pandemic.

Now I think it's pretty clear, by middle of next year, we're going to be in a very different position. It's still a ways away. But you know, now you

know at least. You have a timeline.

But let me tell you the Moderna data is very interesting. It was -- 54 pages of results were released this morning, it's the first time we're

seeing results from a source other than the company. A couple of highlights here and a lot of people are paying attention to these specifics.

But with Moderna specifically, one of the things, it was for people aged 18 and older. OK. You remember with Pfizer, it was 16 and older. That's just

something to keep an eye on.

It's also slightly different dosing. So the Pfizer dose is separated by three weeks; this is going to be separated by four weeks. It's 100

micrograms versus 30 micrograms in the Pfizer dose. It still needs to be super cold but not as cold as Pfizer.

And that could be relevant because that could open it up to being distributed in areas that don't have the same cold storage.

But look at that efficacy, right in the middle of the screen, 94.5 percent effective at preventing COVID-19. That's extraordinary. The FDA in this

country would have accepted 50 percent.

So this is much better than people anticipated and it is being considered for authorization, as you point out. Pfizer is very similar. But you know,

a few differences that may be -- may come to light as the vaccine rolls out; 16 and older, similar efficacy and slightly different dosing, Becky.

ANDERSON: Dr. Sanjay Gupta, it is always a pleasure, sir. Thank you very much indeed.

GUPTA: Thank you.

ANDERSON: If there was any doubt left about the winner of the race for the White House, well, that doubt ended on Monday. Joe Biden gave an emotional

speech to the American people in the evening hours after the Electoral College formally voted to make him the next President of the United States.

And for the first time, he directly condemned president Donald Trump's efforts to overturn the election. He also praised the electoral workers,

who withstood unprecedented pressure from the president and his allies to toss out millions of legally-cast votes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: It is my sincere hope we never again see anyone subjected to the kind of threats and abuse we saw in this election. It's simply

unconscionable. We owe these public servants a debt of gratitude. They didn't seek the spotlight, you know, and our democracy survived because of

them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON: Only minutes after the Electoral College affirmed Biden's victory, president Donald Trump announced on Twitter that his attorney

general, William Barr, would be resigning just before Christmas. Barr confirmed that he is stepping down.

The apparent last straw; Barr's refusal to affirm Mr. Trump's claims of election fraud, leading to a split between the erstwhile allies. Now

silence.

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ANDERSON: That is Russia's response to a joint CNN Bellingcat investigation into the poisoning of the opposition leader Alexei Navalny.

The Kremlin canceled its press briefing both today and tomorrow, refusing to respond to CNN's investigation.

We found that elite Russian agents trained in poisoning had followed Navalny for years. He was poisoned in August and almost died, though CNN

hasn't confirmed that Russia was behind that. You will remember that we brought you Clarissa Ward's reporting this time yesterday. I just wanted to

play a clip of that again for you.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Back in Moscow, we went in search of the FSB's toxins team.

WARD: So we're here now at the home of one of the FSB team and we are going to go see if he has anything to say to us.

WARD (voice-over): We enter a rundown apartment building on the outskirts of Moscow, where operative Oleg Tayakin lives.

WARD: (Speaking foreign language).

My name is Clarissa Ward. I work for CNN.

Can I ask you a couple of questions?

(Speaking foreign language).

Was it your team that poisoned Navalny, please?

Do you have any comment?

He doesn't seem to want to talk to us.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON: CNN's Clarissa Ward, who you saw there, first broke this story for us Monday.

[10:20:00]

ANDERSON: She joins us now live from Moscow.

Every time I see that clip, it surprises me.

(LAUGHTER)

ANDERSON: Well done.

What has been the reaction to your reporting, Clarissa?

WARD: Well, I mean, it's just, the silence is deafening, Becky. I think all of us expected that there might be some kind of retaliation in the form

of a propaganda piece, denouncing our work, denouncing our methods.

I've certainly been on the receiving end of that before. But so far, there has been absolutely no response, which is quite stunning when you think

that it's well over 24 hours since this story first dropped.

This is a highly significant bombshell of a story; it's impossible to ignore. We have reached out to the Kremlin. We have reached out to the FSB,

who told us we might have to wait as long as nine days.

We reached out and, in fact, went to see in person, as you saw there in my report, members of the team and so far nothing. You mentioned Dmitry

Peskov, the primary spokesperson for President Putin with regard to Western media. He holds a call every single day with journalists, abruptly

announcing today that that call will not happen today and it will not happen tomorrow.

The official excuse given is that Thursday is President Putin's big press conference and so that's why these regular calls have been canceled. But

quite frankly, it's hard to believe it's a coincidence.

We have also seen, Becky, stunning silence from Russian media, who normally would be very happy to start attacking CNN and attacking Bellingcat and

certainly attacking Navalny. But so far we have heard almost nothing. It is just stunning, Becky.

ANDERSON: Fascinating. Clarissa, thank you for that.

You can, viewers, watch that report and, indeed, read more on the investigation conducted by Clarissa, her team and Bellingcat at cnn.com.

And Alexei Navalny will speak to CNN's Christiane Amanpour in just a few hours. You can watch their conversation 11:00 pm Abu Dhabi time, that is

7:00 if you are watching in London.

Still ahead on CONNECT THE WORLD, the incoming Biden administration could start off on shaky ground with one of America's NATO allies. A live report

on that is coming up.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): When I decided to run, they brought a knife to slaughter me. But I ran away quickly. I ran into the

crowd.

ANDERSON (voice-over): This Nigerian boy escaped. But the fate of more than 300 other boys is unclear right now, after they were abducted from a

boarding school. More on that is just ahead.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON: You're watching CONNECT THE WORLD. I'm Becky Anderson. Stay with us.

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ANDERSON: Turkey's defense minister says the U.S. has, and I quote here, "shaken all values of alliance" between the two countries.

Those harsh words come after the Trump administration imposed sanctions on Turkey's purchase of a Russian air defense system. Turkey took possession

of these Russian S-400 surface-to-air missiles more than a year ago. U.S. officials say they could pose a threat to both the United States and to

NATO.

Congress has been pushing for these penalties but president Donald Trump initially opposed them so as not to upset his relationship with Turkey's

President Recep Tayyip Erdogan. This condemnation puts the U.S. in an uneasy spot with its NATO ally as Joe Biden prepares to take office.

Arwa Damon is in Istanbul for you, looking at the possible short- and long- term fallout on these sanctions.

Arwa, who has been sanctioned and how has Turkey reacted?

ARWA DAMON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, these sanctions at this stage are really focusing around Turkey's defense procurement

agencies and senior officials within that, as according to the U.S.

This is the agency that was mostly responsible for the purchase of that S- 400 missile defense system.

Turkey, as you can imagine, is extremely upset with the U.S., that, as you were saying there, it considers to be a NATO ally, saying that they had

been hoping for more dialogue and diplomacy, as opposed to these kinds of measures. But here is how the Turkish president Recep Tayyip Erdogan put

it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RECEP TAYYIP ERDOGAN, PRESIDENT OF TURKEY (through translator): From our NATO ally, the United States, we expect support in our battle against

terrorist organizations and forces that have plans for our region, not sanctions. We are never a country that chases after conflict or tensions

with its neighbors or any other.

We are fighting for the prosperity of our entire region and the world. But this situation does not mean we will remain silent against our rights, laws

and sovereignty being trampled. Just like we don't want anyone's rights, we will not allow anyone to take our rights, either.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DAMON: Becky, it's worth noting, though, that these sanctions will not be impacting any sort of existing deal. So any sort of deal that NATO has with

Turkey, to continue producing parts for the F-35 fighter jet, for example, those will continue to go forward.

But there is a sense that, given how long it had been since the U.S. had been threatening sanctions, perhaps this was some sort of a way to finally

indicate that America was actually serious and, maybe perhaps for President Trump himself, a parting gift, as we would say, to the region.

ANDERSON: Difficult times for Joe Biden, as he takes on the Turkey file. Thank you for that.

International aid has finally arrived in Ethiopia. Next hour I will talk to the Red Cross director who has just returned from the deadly fighting in

Ethiopia's Tigray region.

Also ahead, the U.S. government will run out of funding on Friday unless lawmakers act now. We will explain what is at stake after this short break.

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[10:30:00]

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ANDERSON: Welcome back. You're watching CONNECT THE WORLD, I'm Becky Anderson.

Time running out for U.S. lawmakers to negotiate a second coronavirus stimulus relief bill. U.S. government funding runs out on Friday night and,

in order to avoid that, lawmakers need to agree on a bill now.

As investors wait for the bill and, indeed, the people of America, who are suffering most, U.S. stocks opened notably higher on Tuesday. My next

guest, Mohamed El-Erian, wrote an op-ed about all of this. He says the fiscal package should not just be about relief; it also should be about

ensuring what he describes as "a better glide path" to an economy that can quickly overcome the damage already incurred as a result of COVID-19.

He joins me now. He is the chief economic adviser at Allianz.

Always a pleasure to speak with you. Last-ditch negotiations are happening at this point.

Is it becoming a matter of too little too late at this point?

MOHAMED EL-ERIAN, CHIEF ECONOMIC ADVISER, ALLIANZ: I'm afraid so. I mean, there's four degrees of difficulties.

One is just to keep the government running, the funding. That will get done.

The second is a mini package, aimed at relief; that will probably get done.

The third one is help to states and local government. That's unlikely now.

And the fourth one and, importantly, is making sure that we stop the scarring, the long-term damage to our economy. And that is nowhere, nowhere

on the radar screen right now.

ANDERSON: Which means what going forward?

EL-ERIAN: So first, we're getting further confirmation that the U.S. economy is losing steam in terms of its recovery. So think of a type of

square root sign, it came down, it came back up but instead of continuing back up it has flattened.

When you flatten, you risk a double-dip recession that Europe is going to experience in the next few weeks. So you do not want to flatten. That's the

first issue.

The second issue is you're eating away at potential growth, at what you look like when you emerge from this COVID emergency. So it's bad news, both

for actual growth and for potential growth.

ANDERSON: Why is there such a disconnect, then, if what you are saying is a fear that others share, why is there such a disconnect between what is

going on as far as U.S. stock markets are concerned?

And what is going on in the U.S. economy and for people on the street?

EL-ERIAN: So it's a massive disconnect: Wall Street booming, Main Street suffering. And if you want to understand why, let me take you inside an

investor -- an investment strategy room. And someone is proposing to put money to work.

And they will be asked, who will buy behind us?

Because there's nothing more reassuring to investors than the knowledge that someone else will be buying behind you. And if that buyer is a central

bank, meaning a printing press in the basement, willingness to use it and noncommercial, they're not price sensitive, you will buy ahead of the

central banks.

So what has happened is that the market has said, forget about all these other things, I don't care. The only thing I care about is ample (ph) and

predictable central bank support. And the market has gotten that from the Fed and from the European central bank in particular.

And therefore it is conditioned to keep on going up, even though the underlying economy, the underlying fundamentals, are so decoupled from

where the market is right now.

[10:35:00]

ANDERSON: I want to take you back, what, 12 years, to the financial crash of 2008.

How does what we are witnessing now, with regard the U.S. and, indeed, the global economy, compare to what happened then?

And what are the learnings, if at all?

You know, this was a -- this was a financial mess that Joe Biden took on as vice president, of course, back in 2008 with President Barack Obama. This

is clearly now something he is going to have to get to grips with when he is inaugurated January 20th, with regard at least the U.S. economy.

EL-ERIAN: Yes, he is inheriting a much more difficult economic and financial portfolio than what President Obama inherited. And that was

really hard and this is even harder. Not just because of domestic issues but because of global policy coordination is at a low, a multi-generation

low.

I think the most important lesson, Becky, is not to repeat the mistake of 2008. And the mistake of 2008 was winning the war but losing the peace. We

won the war against a global depression and we will again win the war against a global depression.

But what we failed to realize in 2008 is that this was also about establishing a long-lasting peace of high, inclusive and sustainable

growth. We lost sight of establishing the peace.

And I think this time around it is critical that we not only win the war but also win the peace. We need to come out of this with a focus on high,

inclusive, sustainable growth. Otherwise, we're going to be in an even worse place.

ANDERSON: You talk about a double-dip recession in Europe.

Do you see plans afoot by the ECB and fiscal administrators to ensure that, what you have just suggested we need to see in the U.S., is also mirrored

in Europe?

EL-ERIAN: So the ECB is doing all it can. In fact, in my opinion it's doing too much. But when it comes to the economy, the ECB is like pushing

on a string. So even though they increased their support by 500 billion euros last week and extended it, in time, it will have minimal impact on

the economy.

At best it's a bridging operation, a holding operation. But they don't have the -- they don't have the policies to improve infrastructure, to get to

the people who need it the most, to improve skill acquisitions. They can't do that.

That is up to governments and to the E.U. together. And there, we've seen some progress, some important progress. But it's early days yet. More is

needed, especially given that Europe is going into a double-dip recession.

ANDERSON: Meantime, we are still extending deadline after deadline with regard these Brexit talks. At some point the U.K. will be no longer working

-- well, we don't know whether there will be a deal or no trade deal. But the U.K. will have finally cut the cord as it were with its European

counterparts.

How does the U.K. economy fare going forward?

EL-ERIAN: So there will be uncertainty. My own gut feeling is they will get to some sort of deal or some sort of longer transition. But the U.K.

has to think about this as an opportunity.

We've focused a lot on the negatives and there are certainly negatives. It's not easy to rewire the way to trade. But having said that, you're

doing it in the context of an economy that is incredibly fluid.

So you can look forward and ask yourself, not what was in the past but what would it look like in the future?

And how do I prepare for that?

So to the extent that this Brexit forces a fundamental rethink of what you want your economy to look like and to act in the future, it will end up

being a massive silver lining because you don't want to go back to where we were, because the world isn't going to come out from where we were; the

world is coming out in a different place.

ANDERSON: I'm just looking, as we speak, at the -- at the British pound, which is holding steady. I mean, holding steady below where it dropped to,

of course, in June of 2016, around about 1.35 against the dollar, which would seem to have been the Brexit level. It's around about 1.33 at the

moment but hasn't dropped off a cliff as yet.

[10:40:00]

ANDERSON: Once again, of course, those investing in currencies keeping, you know, a very close eye on what happens. It does seem to be, at least at

present, some optimism among investors that there will be a silver lining for the U.K. at the end of all of this.

Mohamed, it is always a pleasure. Thank you so much for joining us. You make what is a very complicated world, so far as finance and economics is

concerned, a lot simpler for us to digest. Thank you, sir.

EL-ERIAN: Thank you.

ANDERSON: I just want to get you a quick update from D.C. on some news just coming into CNN. The most powerful Republican in Congress finally

admitting that Joe Biden won the U.S. election.

It is the first time Senate majority leader Mitch McConnell has acknowledged Joe Biden's win. He also said Americans can take pride in the

fact that the country will soon have its first female vice president. We will do more on that after this.

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ANDERSON: Well, check this out.

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ANDERSON (voice-over): Parts of South America getting a rare treat courtesy of some celestial mechanics. You are looking at a total solar

eclipse, the only one of the year. The moon passing in front of the sun, plunging the area into a frigid darkness for about two minutes.

Remarkable, isn't it?

The sun just a tiny sliver and almost completely disappearing, turning the middle of the day into night. This eclipse visible in China and Argentina,

with neighboring countries able to see a partial eclipse. Just an incredible thing and not a bad way to end what's been an otherwise dismal

year, right?

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ANDERSON: We have just got a moment for a quick sports quiz for you. Stand by.

What country is the current powerhouse of women's golf?

Actually, quite a tough one. Well, it's South Korea. If you got that, well done, you. A Lim Kim won the U.S. Women's Open Monday, making it six of the

last nine major tournaments won by South Korean women.

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