Return to Transcripts main page
Connect the World
Nvidia Rides AI Boom to $1 Trillion Market Cap; China: U.S. Spy Plane "Deliberately Intruded" Training Area; House to Vote on Bill as Lawmakers Race to Avert Default; IAEA's Grossi: "We need Complete Stabilization" of Zaporizhzhia; Kosovo Excluded from NATO Exercises over "Unnecessary" Crisis; Sailors Compete in 32nd Annual Dhow Race. Aired 11a- 12p ET
Aired May 31, 2023 - 11:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[11:00:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ELENI GIOKOS, CNNI HOST: This hour industry leaders in AI development say that technology could be an existential threat. We'll be taking a closer
look at those risks. But first, your headlines this hour video showing of Chinese fighter jet cutting in front of an American spy plane and maneuver
the U.S. says was unnecessarily aggressive.
Beijing responding by saying the U.S. is endangering China's national security. Ukraine takes the fight to Russia. A day after a joint attack on
Moscow, a massive strike in the Belgorod region has wounded a number of people but Kremlin has called the attacks alarming.
The U.S. House of Representatives will be taking a key vote today on the debt ceiling bill that needs to be passed to avert a catastrophic U.S.
default. Top lawmakers are confident the bill will pass and be signed into law. And happening right now NASA is holding a public meeting evaluating
data of unidentified anomalous phenomena or observations in the sky that cannot be identified.
Welcome to our second hour of "Connect the World". Experts are warning that artificial intelligence poses an existential risk to human life does is of
scientists, researchers and industry leaders are voicing concern that the revolutionary technology could lead to extinction.
Yet, even as more voices join that chorus warning of the risks Nvidia, a chipmaker that builds products powering the AI boom briefly became a $1
trillion company. So tonight we ask well, greed from profit mean the risks are ignored.
I want to bring in CNN's Technology Reporter Brian Fung for more on this. Great to have you with us! Look, I tell you I read that release and it's
absolutely scary. I want you to tell me about who's signed this who agrees with it, and just some of the scary threats that humanity is facing.
BRIAN FUNG, CNN TECHNOLOGY REPORTER: Yes Eleni, this statement truly is kind of terrifying, especially when you consider it comes from some of the
biggest names in AI. Let's just take a very quick look first at what the statement actually says.
And it's very short, it says, "Mitigating the risk of extinction from AI should be a global priority alongside other societal scale risks such as
pandemics and nuclear war". Now to see, you know, some of these researchers and experts and executives comparing AI to the threat of nuclear weapons
and nuclear annihilation should probably, you know, get anyone's eyes and ears to perk up here.
And some of the biggest names, as I said, are signed along onto this statement, including Google, Microsoft, and OpenAI which is behind the
ChatGPT tool that took the world by storm last year, as well as anthropic another major AI company that, you know, all of these companies have met
with the White House and the Biden Administration to discuss how to regulate AI.
And, you know, with this statement coming out, it's clear now that, you know, the issues extend far beyond things like misinformation, or
algorithmic bias and decision making, which to be clear these companies are also concerned about but they're trying to elevate the potential risk of,
you know, AI driven annihilation as an equal priority, if not greater here and, you know, this is something that is not currently capable --
GIOKOS: It is -- warning?
FUNG: It is yes. It's not something that's currently capable in current AI systems, but within perhaps a decade, experts say, you know, general,
artificial intelligence could be capable of this.
GIOKOS: OK, so look, here's the thing. We've been seeing these warnings, we see industry experts, some of the companies that have been involved in
investing in AI, ringing alarm bells. And then I watch a company like Nvidia, which specializes in the technology and chips around AI, is
exploding.
And we said this is a company that became a trillion dollar company briefly. Why are we seeing warnings, but at the same time, investment and
excitement still flowing into the businesses that are building these ecosystems?
FUNG: Yes Eleni, I think it all boils down to you know, this is a race for who can become the most dominant AI company right now. And a lot of the
focus is on these AI chips that allow the construction into development of these AI algorithms that depend on.
[11:05:00]
You know, large datasets that require a lot of computing power, and so that's why Nvidia has kind of emerged as a major supplier to, you know
companies that offer large cloud computing and large computing services. And you know, when you look at the history of Nvidia back when it first
debuted on the stock market, it had a share price of less than $1.
And now here we are with Nvidia's share price at hovering about $400 per share. You know, look at it -- all a lot of this growth really came in the
last, you know, eight years or so, with the release of some of Nvidia's best line of GPUs.
With the one thousand series, these graphics cards were originally used for video gaming applications. But you know, over time, you know, people
started realizing that you could use these machines for everything from crypto mining, to advanced AI applications like what we're seeing now.
And so that has really driven a lot of the stock growth of Nvidia and it's likewise probably driving a lot of similar growth with other firms in this
industry like AMD, for example. So Eleni, that's just kind of a slice of why Nvidia has emerged as this trillion dollar company.
GIOKOS: Right, thank you, Brian Fung, great to have you on. Well, one of those tech leaders sounding the alarm is Microsoft President Brad Smith. He
spoke to Julia Chatterley a little earlier, and she asked him whether we are headed for AI extension take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRAD SMITH, PRESIDENT, MICROSOFT: I don't think that is imminent. And I don't think it's actually the first or most important problem we need to
solve. But it's good to be clear eyed about all of the things that might go wrong.
And then let's just step back and think about every technology in the world that we use today. We even take it for granted that does great things but
could be dangerous. An elevator has a safety brake. Electricity has a circuit breaker.
The school bus on which we put our children our high speed train has an emergency brake. It enables humans to stay in control and slow something
down or turn it off. And we should have that for artificial intelligence as well.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GIOKOS: Right the Minister for Artificial Intelligence here in the UAE, also raising the alarm about the need for global dialogue to regulate AI.
He says there is room for disaster if there is no united front.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OMAR SULTAN AL OLAMA, UAE AI MINISTER: There are many risks. The first is not having a dialogue on the global front is definitely a very big risk.
There are certain countries that would agree not to do certain things or take certain actions. But if we do not have a unified front, there is
always room for disaster.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GIOKOS: Well, hundreds of AI experts signed that statement on Tuesday warning the new technology threatens humanity with extinction. My next
guest is a signatory to the letter and has also called for a pause on AI developments. Anthony Aguirre is Vice President and Secretary of the Board
at the Future of Life Institute. He joins me now live from Switzerland.
Great to have you on sir! Reading that statement it makes you wonder where we're headed. But in this rush to build AI systems, the very people who are
involved in this new ecosystem are also raising the alarm on what it means.
So signing this petition to slow down, we've seen these ominous warnings coming through. What are you seeing that is so threatening right now? And
why is it in conjunction with this race to do it better?
ANTHONY AGUIRRE, VICE PRESIDENT, FUTURE OF LIFE INSTITUTE: Yes. Well first, thanks for having me on. And I think it's very important that people really
understand something very important that has happened in the last half a year here which is that AI has gone from something that does a few things
really well like, recognize images, or try to drive cars or search the web, to something that does many things, as well as most people do.
So from writing poetry, to doing mathematics, to doing physics problems, to creating images, all with the same system doing all of these different
things. So it's a general system that is competitive with humans now.
And this is something that didn't happen before. This is something that really has only come to light in the last few months. And that has sort of
changed everything, I think in the way that people are thinking about both the opportunities and the risks that these AI systems pose.
GIOKOS: Yes look, Brad Smith of Microsoft President spoke to us a little earlier today. I want you to listen to some of what he has to say.
[11:10:00]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SMITH: I don't think things have moved too early. The truth is if you want to learn and how technology actually works you need to put it in the hands
of real people and get real feedback. So it's good that we're having this conversation now.
There was always going to be a point in time when suddenly people's eyes would open the way they did when they saw the iPhone from Apple in 2007, or
the browser in the 1990s, and suddenly realized that there was going to be this thing called the internet. But I think this is how we learn. And this
is how we then act on what we're learning.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GIOKOS: Yes, so Anthony, I mean, look, every time we have new technology that can shape the world, I think that begets a lot of worry about what
that can be could mean? I mean, is this comparable to the internet boom? Or is this different because it feels different?
AGUIRRE: I think it's at least comparable in the sense of how transformative it's going to be for society. But I think it's much
different in the sense of the sort of risks that it entails and sort of where its long term trajectory is.
I think it's much more in that sense to the advent of nuclear weapons. They changed the world, you know, in a much more one sided way than it turned
than then we hope AI will. But the change the sort of step change in how we consider the world, I think, is similar in that sense.
I think it's easy to compare these two other technologies now when they feel like tools. As these systems become more and more advanced, they're
going to feel more like other fellow beings in the world other intelligences that are in the world. And we have to ask ourselves, where is
that going? What happens as those intelligences get stronger and stronger, and surpass human intelligence, even expert intelligence?
GIOKOS: So I mean, what kind of regulation do you want to see? I mean, there's this call for regulation from the very people that are helping
build this new ecosystem, we've ascertained that. Do you want government to come in and say, we have to force a pause on this?
AGUIRRE: I actually think that's a good idea if the companies can't do it themselves, the reason that we initiated this open letter calling for a
pause on the most advanced AI development, not AI development in general, but the very most cutting edge models.
The ones that are having new capabilities that we don't know what they will be, as they are developed, are that things are just happening too fast.
These technologies are being rolled out in a race much faster than we are able to govern them, or regulate them or understand how to deploy them
safely or societies able to absorb them.
So I think we've called for a pause, and many, many 30,000 people have signed the letter now, including many technologists calling for a pause.
Because we need to give a chance to our, you know, systems and processes to understand and deal with new technologies to catch up.
So if the companies can't do that, and it's very difficult for them to because they are in a race with each other and the stakes are very large
financially. If they can't, then I think that's the role of government to step in the interest of public safety to really force the companies pause
if they can't do it themselves.
GIOKOS: Yes, and the race is still on. So there needs to be some kind of intervention, not just signing of petitions. Anthony Aguirre, great to have
you on thank you so much for your insights!
AGUIRRE: Thank you.
GIOKOS: China's military now weighing in on this incident last week over the South China Sea when a Chinese fighter jet cut in front of an American
spy plane. Plus new signs that the Ukrainian war is coming into Russia attacks inside Russian territory are raising alarm bells in the Kremlin.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[11:15:00]
GIOKOS: The Chinese military says a U.S. spy plane deliberately intruded into a Navy training area last week in the South China Sea and is urging
Washington to restrain its troops. This is a response to this video released by the U.S.
It shows a Chinese fighter jet cutting right in front of an American spy plane which had to fly through the wake turbulence. U.S. officials called
the fighters move unnecessarily aggressive CNN's Natasha Bertrand is at the Pentagon.
The U.S. says the fighter jet was in international airspace. While China's saying this is an act of provocation. It is important to understand the
context here, wider tensions that have been brewing for a while. But where are we in terms of what both sides are saying to each other?
NATASHA BERTRAND, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER: Yes, Eleni. So we actually just heard from U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken, who spoke
about this to reporters telling them that he does believe that the Chinese pilot in this instance was acting very dangerously.
And that the U.S. aircraft was operating in international airspace, but really underscoring the fact that this is exactly why the U.S. wants to
keep those military to military channels open with the Chinese to avoid this kind of confrontation.
And something of course, that could lead to a dramatic escalation between the two countries. And he's saying that because just this week, the U.S.
Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin tried to set up a meeting with his Chinese counterpart and that was summarily rejected by the Chinese.
One of many meetings that the U.S. has proposed in recent months that the Chinese have rebuffed as a result of these heightening tensions between the
U.S. and China, stemming from, for example, Former House Speaker Nancy Pelosi his visit to Taiwan last year.
The incident where the U.S. shot down as a speck of Chinese spy balloon earlier this year and other episodes where the U.S. has been operating over
the South China Sea in a way that China perceives as violating its own territory.
Now, of course, the U.S. does not accept that. They do not believe that the South China Sea is controlled by the Chinese. But all of this is really
contributing to this tension between the U.S. and China is pushing back.
Of course this morning with the Foreign Ministry releasing a statement saying that the U.S. was acting in a provocative way and the Chinese
military releasing a separate statement, saying that the U.S. had actually interfered in their training exercises so all of this really underscoring
for the U.S. why it's important to have this dialogue so that as two major obviously military powers, they avoid some kind of collision that could
then spark a broader conflict between the two countries, Eleni.
GIOKOS: Natasha Bertrand thank you. Well, Ukraine's Capital Kyiv is getting a break after days of incessant Russian strikes however; we are seeing an
uptick in action across the border. Five people were wounded in attacks in Russia's Belgorod region something the Kremlin calls alarming.
And there may not be a lit up anytime soon. A group of dissidents Russian fighters who claimed last week's incursion side Belgorod is now recruiting
drone pilots. This comes a day after a drone attack on Moscow. Russia's Foreign Ministry blames Ukraine and is vying to reiterate retaliate. CNN's
Sam Kiley has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SAM KILEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Same wall different capital, Moscow hit by a squadron of eight drones. There was a
deafening bang as if a huge bolt of lightning had struck somewhere near. The attack was immediately blamed on Ukraine, which reels daily from
Russian air assaults.
SERGEI SHOIGU, RUSSIAN DEFENSE MINISTER: This morning the key of regime carried out a terrorist attack on the Moscow region and I will stress aimed
at civilian targets. In total, eight aero plane type drones were used. All of them were brought down.
KILEY (voice over): Kyiv was coy about its role in this drastic escalation.
MYKHAILO PODOLYAK, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENTIAL ADVISER: Of course, we enjoy watching and predicting an increase in attacks, but of course we have
nothing to do directly with it. What is growing in Russia is the karmic payment that Russia will gradually pay more highly for everything it does
in Ukraine.
[11:20:00]
KILEY (voice over): Ukraine's threatening an offensive to drive Russian troops out, part of its tactics have been increased efforts to destabilize
Moscow's forces. Across border raid by anti-Putin, Russian dissidents was backed by Ukraine last week, frequent attacks on Russian occupied logistic
hubs like Mariupol and Berdyansk. And now there's a mysterious drone attack that Russia has blamed on Ukraine.
VLADIMIR PUTIN, RUSSIAN PRESIDENT: Though I'm more worried not by this, but by efforts to provoke a Russian response that appears to be the aim. They
are provoking us to do the same.
KILEY (voice over): But this is the first drone attack by anyone on Moscow outside the Kremlin. Here Kyiv attacked for the 17th time, this month.
Putin's generals now know that they face attacks on Ukraine's front lines and at home. Sam Kiley, CNN, eastern Ukraine.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GIOKOS: Well, CNN's Sam Kiley is with us right now. We've heard the messaging coming through from Russia saying they're ready to retaliate.
Ukraine says they're not to blame for what we've seen in Belgorod and Kyiv is quiet, which I think is very telling. The big concern here is that the
war could be moving to Russia. What are you hearing, Sam?
KILEY: Well, I'm not sure it's a concern at all, though, Eleni, if you're Ukrainian, you'd be absolutely delighted by that development. And there is
indeed widespread irony and delight over the fact that now the Ukrainians are beginning to show the Russians what being at war really feels like.
Now, the downside of that, obviously, is that inevitably the number of people being injured and killed is civilians. But the Ukrainians do appear
to be trying at least to focus their attentions on strategic targets like the oil refinery down in Krasnodar. But local authorities much further
north, just on the northern border between Ukraine and Russia in the Belgorod region, have said that six people there, all of them civilians
have been injured.
Their children have to be evacuated from alongside other civilians from border villages as what is now becoming almost routine cross border
shelling by Ukraine into Russia, the other way round, had become dangerously routine. And throughout this war on an almost daily basis,
northern villages are getting shelled by Russia.
So we're seeing this as part of I think the early stages or perhaps even the main focus of Ukraine's counter offensive. Adviser to President
Zelenskyy has said on National TV, that there's going to be an exponential increase in these sorts of attacks.
The problem for the international community is that there are undertakings from the Ukrainians not to use the weapons donated by foreign powers for
attacks inside Russia. But James Cleverly, the Foreign Secretary of the United Kingdom, given a bit of top cover, or even a green light for the
Ukrainian saying that attacks against military infrastructure inside Russia, was consistent with Ukraine's right to self-defense, and were
therefore legitimate targets.
And as a consequence of that he's been added, or rather the Kremlin via Medvedev, the former president, prime minister, now deputy head of the
National Security Council in Russia has tweeted out saying that members of the British government now considered legitimate military targets by
Russia, that is part of the sort of public relations tit for tat.
But the significance really is that James Cleverly has come out and said that as far as the United Kingdom is concerned, within certain parameters,
they're fine with the idea that Russia gets attacked by Ukraine, Eleni.
GIOKOS: Yes, Sam Kiley, thank you so much. Well, a former staffer of U.S. President Joe Biden, who accused him of sexual assault, has defected to
Russia. In 2020, Tara Reid accused Mr. Biden of sexually harassing and assaulting her when she worked for him in the 1990s.
He was a senator at the time and denies those accusations. Reid tells Russian state media that she moved to Russia after receiving death threats
about her accusations. She says she feels safe and respected in Moscow. The U.S. House is set to vote on a bill to help the U.S. government avoid
defaulting on tens of trillions of dollars of debt.
House Speaker Kevin McCarthy and his top allies are confident bipartisan deal will pass later today, even though some Republicans have said they
don't support it. The deadline to get the bill passed through both chambers of Congress and signed into law is just days away.
CNN White House Reporter Kevin Liptak joins us now from Washington. It has been a wild ride watching the negotiations and here we are so close to the
deadline. It's all about the voting now. Do they have enough to pass this?
[11:25:00]
KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Well, certainly in the eyes of the house speaker, Kevin McCarthy, he's very confident that this will pass
later today. And the question really now is by how much what that margin will be. And there is kind of this unofficial rule in the house that a
speaker won't bring a measure to the floor if it can't gain the support, at least of the majority of the majority.
And so that is really the effort now underway up on Capitol Hill is to try and consolidate the centrist coalition of moderate Republicans and moderate
Democrats around this package. Because you do hear bulking from both sides, the far left and the far right about what is included in this measure.
But certainly, Kevin McCarthy is confident and they will hold a procedural vote later this afternoon before that final vote in the House. There is
this massive effort underway. Now White House officials are up on Capitol Hill trying to persuade Democrats to come along with this deal.
And you also saw Kevin McCarthy trying to explain some of the finer points of disagreement to members of his caucus late into the evening last night.
I think the issue for some of these most more conservative Republicans is that they don't think that this necessarily cut spending as much as they
would have liked from here bulking from what's known as the House Freedom Caucus, which is this ultra-conservative, a faction of the party that has
dozens of members.
So potentially dozens of Republicans could vote against that that will have to be backfield by our moderate Democrats. But we also heard from the
leader of the progressive Democrats earlier today, Representative Pramila Jayapal from Washington State who said that she would be a no vote and that
many members of the Progressive Caucus would vote no as well.
So it does expect to be passed later today. But certainly the margins will be very closely watched here in Washington and then it's on to the Senate.
One senator could hold this up. The hope among Senate leaders is that it will pass by the end of the week, Eleni.
GIOKOS: Yes. It's not over yet, but hoping for good news by the end of the week as you say, Kevin Liptak, great to have you on. Well, coming up on
"Connect the World" the U.N.'s nuclear chief tries to get Ukraine and Russia to agree to protect Ukraine nuclear plants that's been surrounded by
fighting.
We'll be speaking to Rafael Grossi next. Plus, Kosovo is accused of stoking ethnic tensions and ignoring the advice of one of its strongest supporters.
Now it's facing repercussions from the United States. We'll be back right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[11:30:00]
GIOKOS: Welcome back to ""Connect the World" with me Eleni Giokos, your headlines this hour. Beijing is defending the military pilots who flew
right in front of an American spy plane. It happened last week over the South China Sea. The Chinese military says the Americans were intruding
over a Navy training area.
U.S. officials say it was a routine mission in international airspace. Some of the top minds working on artificial intelligence warned that if AI is
left unchecked, there's a risk of human extinction. Dozens of tech leaders signed on to a joint statement published by the Center for AI safety which
says "Mitigating the risk of extinction from AI should be a global priority, alongside other societal-scale risks such as pandemics and
nuclear war".
Now it was signed by top executives and researchers at open AI, Google and Microsoft, among others. New signs the war in Ukraine is spilling over into
Russia attacks on the Belgorod region wounding five people, drone strikes were also reported, one sparked this fire at an oil refinery.
This comes a day after drone attacks on Moscow, which Ukraine denies carrying us. Now moving on the Zaporizhzhia power plant in Ukraine is a
focal point in this war. Russian forces captured Europe's largest nuclear plant last year. And ever since experts have been concerned there could be
an attack from on the site.
Now the U.N.'s nuclear watchdog is condemning military activity in the area. The International Atomic Energy Agency Chief Rafael Grossi laid out
five principles to safeguard the plants. But neither Russia nor Ukraine has committed yet. Now the Head of the agency Rafael Grossi joins us live. So,
great to have you on, thank you so much for taking the time.
RAFAEL GROSSI, DIRECTOR-GENERAL, INTERNATIONAL ATOMIC ENERGY AGENCY: Thanks for having me, my pleasure.
GIOKOS: Yes, well, in your recent statement, I mean, you're talking about concerns of a major disaster, you're talking about the risks. I want to
speak about the probabilities of a disaster happening and how they've been amplified of late.
GROSSI: Well, they are real; let me say that, in your introduction, you were talking about possibility of an attack. The plant has been attacked
already, on a couple of occasions, at least directly last summer and last autumn as well, second time with direct bombing at the site.
And apart from that, it has experienced total blackout, which means that without any external power supply, it lost seven times the cooling function
that it was needed, and for that, that is needed in any nuclear reactor to avoid the meltdown of the reactors core.
And it had to be the reactors have to be cooled with emergency generators, like the ones that you could have domestically or at a private residence.
So the situations there the dangers there are not hypothetical. They are real. We have seen it; we have avoided so far a major accident.
But now and this is why we have an increased level of alert and concern. Now with the renewed and an increased military activity in general, along
the front line, we believe that the probability of a major accident involving a radiological release has also increased mathematically.
GIOKOS: And look, you're saying that what is protecting, you know, a full blown disaster happening is those diesel fired generators, which is keeping
the nuclear plant going or cooling during those moments of attack. I mean, you also say that Zaporizhzhia continues to be extremely fragile and
dangerous. I mean, what is the risk assessment right now? What are your team telling you right now?
GROSSI: The risk assessment is that with the increased military activity, probabilities of attack, direct attacks on the plant, and losing external
power and therefore, cooling capacity are higher. It's as simple as that. So we have to do something about it apart from reporting that this is the
situation or expressing concern.
So this is why I went yesterday to the United Nations Security Council, and I laid out five basic principles that should be observed by both sides by
everyone to avoid a nuclear accident there.
[11:35:00]
So this is the sense of the effort. And now as of yesterday, my team there is not only assessing and monitoring specifically technical nuclear safety
related aspects of the plan, but also the possibility of attacks or the militarization of the plant in the principles that I describe a new coated
yesterday in New York, that is also the commitment not to store, deploy heavy military equipment at the plant, not to use it as a military base,
basically, to protect its internal systems to prevent acts of sabotage.
So there is a series of things that could happen we are in a position to assess those from a technical point of view. And this is the sense of what
we are doing at the moment.
GIOKOS: Yes. I mean, we haven't heard from Moscow and Kyiv, in terms of those that five point plan. But I'm curious into what you say transpired in
the last 24 hours in -- Belgorod, have you?
GROSSI: May I interrupt you there to say that I have heard from them. And they are not opposing these points. Actually, we had a very public, by the
way, public session of the Security Council, where they expressed both support to the work of the agency there.
Of course they have a different look at it. They are enemies at war, we should not forget, all right. But at the same time, they are recognizing
the dispensable role of the IEA.
GIOKOS: But have they committed to it?
GROSSI: I think so. I think so.
GIOKOS: Have they committed to that plan? OK.
GROSSI: They haven't opposed. They haven't opposed what I said, as an indispensable thing. And I am monitoring it. So I believe that they are
committing to it indeed, yes.
GIOKOS: Look, I think the other big risk is that in the last 24 hours, we've seen attacks in Belgorod; we've seen drone attacks in Russia. The
concern here is that the war might be moving to Russia. How concerning is this for you? We've heard Moscow threatening nuclear before and Moscow has
vowed to retaliate, does that put you on a much higher alert profile? I mean, what is your -- and has that changed all the risks?
GROSSI: It's a good point. I mean, from the beginning of the war, there have been certain moments, not permanently but there have been moments
where the issue of nuclear weapons have the possibility of the use of nuclear weapons has been evoked. Of course, this should be avoided, it is
obvious that here we have a nuclear weapons state, the Russian Federation, and a non-nuclear weapons state, which is Ukraine.
So there shouldn't be any use of those. What we from the perspective of the IEA, we are looking at is to avoid that there is an amalgam that there is a
mixing up of the militarization of a nuclear power plant as a justification for the use of nuclear weapons or -- into the possibility of nuclear war.
So we are following that, of course, very, very carefully.
GIOKOS: I want to talk about Iran. And the question is has there been any progress on those three sites with undeclared nuclear activity? There have
been reports in Iran, that the IAEA has resolved the issues at one of the sites, is that true, and what exactly was resolved?
GROSSI: Well, there are many things that we are working on in Iran. I should say that the agency some time ago discovered traces of uranium at
places where they should have been none, which indicated to us that there had been in the past undeclared, or possibly undeclared nuclear activities.
So ever since we have been trying to clarify the situation. We have been asking questions; we have been putting in front of Iran, certain technical
issues that we wanted them to clarify. This so far has given very partial limited results. And there is one particular aspect related to one of those
sites on which the agency is not asking more questions, because we don't have any more relevant issues to be asked.
[11:40:00]
But it doesn't mean that we have solved all these issues. I think it's very important the point you're making, because sometimes in the simplification
of the presentation of issues, it looks like we have sorted, pending issues. And this is not the case. We have in one of my reports that will be
issued soon.
We have indicated that on one side, the explanations that Iran has given us are possibly correct, or at least we cannot say that they are incorrect. So
as in any investigation, if I can compare it to an investigation, you say, well, on this thing, we cannot pursue the matter further.
But it doesn't mean that we have solved fundamentally a number of issues. This is work in progress. This is what I want to emphasize today.
GIOKOS: I've got two more questions. And we've got two more questions. I just don't want to run out of time. The other reporting today is that your
quarterly report is showing Iran is continuing to breach restrictions on its nuclear activities. Can you confirm that for us?
GROSSI: Well, no. Again, we must clarify something. There was an agreement called the JCPOA. A big agreement, you may remember that Iran and a number
of countries, including the United States had struck back in 2015. In 2018, the United States, under the previous administration in America withdrew
from that agreement, considering it flawed.
What happened there is that Iran, as a form of reply, responds, retaliation, however, you may wish to describe it decided on its side to
cease implementing it since they said well, the Americans have ceased implementing it, we do it.
So what in real terms, what they are doing is they are not observing anymore, an agreement that they feel is not in force. So this is the
discrepancy that we are having.
GIOKOS: I want to, I want to go on, I mean, and finally on Iran, you know, has the IAEA reinstalled monitoring equipment's that was originally put in
place under 2015 agreement?
GROSSI: We are in the process of doing that. We are in the process of installing some cameras, some online systems that allow us to determine the
levels and amounts of enriched uranium in the country and cameras to look into certain facilities.
But again, this process is slow. And it hasn't been going at the pace I would have liked. So as you can see, I mean, the general conclusion is that
we are making some partial progress, but there is a lot of work ahead of us.
GIOKOS: You have a lot of work on your plate. So and I thank you for your time and your insights.
GROSSI: Thank you very much.
GIOKOS: Thank you very much for joining us today, Rafael Grossi there for us.
GROSSI: Thank you, Eleni.
GIOKOS: Thank you, sir. Cards of demonstrators are gathering yet again in northern Kosovo where violent clashes erupted earlier this week. Ethnic
Serbs are displaying Serbian flags and covering barriers put up by NATO peacekeepers. NATO is deploying hundreds more troops to bolster that
peacekeeping force.
It's after dozens were injured in unrest on Monday. The U.S. blaming Kosovan authorities for aggravating an already tense situation with an
unnecessary show of force and now it's sidelining Kosovo from joint NATO exercises.
CNN's Scott McLean is falling developments for us from London, a strong message to Kosovo, sidelining them from NATO exercises. What does this mean
in terms of the pressure that they could put on Kosovo to force them to de- escalate?
SCOTT MCLEAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, so far, it hasn't worked Eleni though the U.S. has made clear that they are also considering what other
steps they might take to force Kosovo's hand, given the lack of action they believe the prime minister of Kosovo has taken so far to de-escalate
things.
What you need to understand about this situation is that the vast majority of Kosovo is populated by ethnic Albanians, though there are very small
parts mostly in the north of Kosovo, which are populated by majorities of ethnic Serbs. And despite agreements in 2013, and then reiterated earlier
this year, to try to give those areas some level of self-autonomy.
Those agreements have not been fully implemented, not even close. And so local Serbs boycotted municipal elections something that the French
president said today that France made clear it advised against even going ahead with those elections.
[11:45:00]
And so what you ended up with is extremely low voter turnout in the single digits, ethnic Albanian elected mayors in four areas and Serbs, protesting
that. And then the clashes that we saw erupt more recently on Monday.
The U.S. Ambassador today seemed at his wit's end. He said, "This was a crisis that from our perspective was unnecessary. The operation that took
place on Friday, to obtain access to municipal buildings through forcible means was not coordinated with the U.S. when we became aware of it, we
advise strongly against it".
So the U.S. is saying that Kosovo needs to do things withdraw the police from the town halls, and also to have the mayor's work from other
buildings, at least for the time being to try to de-escalate, but Albin Kurti told CNN last night that that's not going to happen. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALBIN KURTI, KOSOVAN PRIME MINISTER: As long as there is a violent mob outside of the building, I cannot have only few policemen. I need to have
police who will defend rule of law who keep the order, peace and security and municipalities should be for everyone, not only for parallel structures
of Serbia turned into criminal gangs.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MCLEAN: And in the meantime, NATO says that 700 more peacekeepers will be sent to the region to try to keep the peace since the Kosovo prime
minister, at least according to the U.S. hasn't done much to deescalate the situation, Eleni.
GIOKOS: All right. A fluid situation, Scott McLean, great to have you on thank you so much! And an alert, we've got Serbian President Aleksandar
Vucic later on tonight, he will be joining my colleague Isa Soares that will happen at 7 p.m. in London time 2 p.m. in New York, you can tune into
Isa Soares tonight.
Well, coming up, the murder of a teenage girl in India has brought the epidemic of violence against loan back into the spotlight. I'll speak to a
woman's right activists on what needs to be done.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GIOKOS: Outrages growing over the killing of a teenage girl in public in India. This video shows the moments before the 16 year old was stabbed and
bludgeoned to death by a busy alleyway Sunday as multiple people walked by, but did not intervene.
My next guest is the founder of People against Rapes in India following the incident Sunday. She wrote, "For me the killer isn't just the man who's
stabbing the girl, but all the passersby who did not intervene. This is not just the murder of a girl, but the end of humanity and compassion. A
society that has become so apathetic and cowardly has to be reproached".
[11:50:00]
Yogita Bhayana joins me now live from Delhi. Really difficult story, really difficult firstly, what she went through and what she injured and secondly,
because no one intervened. This is not new; we've seen issues like this in India happening far too often. Could you give me a sense of how community
is responding, how governments is responding in terms of putting this behavior to bed.
YOGITA BHAYANA, FOUNDER, PEOPLE AGAINST RAPES IN INDIA: It's very sad. It gives us jitters to see the video, and we all are appalled, and I couldn't
sleep the day I saw the video. And unfortunately, this is not the only incident. Last year, we handled similar cases where the girls are in
vegetable state.
And I was really worried when they must be going to seeing this video. Coming to the authorities, they are also numb like you saw the people you
know, they were passing by as a daily routine and they did not even react to the situation and one man dead. But otherwise, they were very casual
about this approach.
It goes under dominion authorities also unfortunately, they have become numb, the society has become numb. And they have become immune to such
cases, every day such similar cases are happening, some are recorded in CCTV, some are shown but mostly they are not shown or not, they are not
reported or they don't come to our knowledge. But at the same time, it is a very sad reality. And I think the system per se has become --
GIOKOS: It is. So I mean, you know, could you explain to us the dynamic inside of India that is exacerbating this rage against women? And what do
you feel the intervention should be?
BHAYANA: It's all about the mindset. See, this boy was 20 year old, and this girl was 16 year old. And similar cases we have dealt last year as per
the People against Rapes in India, the age group is the same. So it is about the mindset of, you know the boys and the men and the system, the
patriarchal system, the social -- per se is very much evident in such incidences.
So you can say that guy could not handle rejection. So the upbringing, the kind of mindset, we bring up the boys with, I think that's the bottom line,
and it needs to be addressed. Unfortunately, everything else has been done; the so called CCTV cameras or other security measures have been taken.
But nothing has been done on insight, like how to change the behavior of the men and the boys how to, you know, deal with adolescence, I mean, this
guy just crossed teen and entered into his 20. And this is what he has done. And he has no remorse.
And he has I mean, you could not see even 1 percent regret on his face. So what must be brewing in his head for years or for months? And what kind of
outrage he must have had that he could just butchered that girl, not he went back and then came back again after a few seconds.
So kind of mentality, we have to deal with the mental health issues which we are ignoring as like, as society, we also need to address that. So
really, so many things have to be done.
GIOKOS: Yogita it's so tragic. And we know you're doing a lot of work with your team on the ground. And we thank you for that. Yogita Bhayana, thank
you very much for joining us. I'll be back with more news in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[11:55:00]
GIOKOS: Welcome back. Off the coast of the UAE sailors competed in the 32nd annual iconic Al Gaffal traditional Dhow race with the wind in their sails.
125 boats kicked off the 50 nautical mile race in the Arabian Gulf Tuesday. Teams' navigated wooden vessels more than 18 meters long called Dass once
widely used across the region for centuries.
The crew of Namran 211 was first to cross the finish line in Dubai followed by ships -- and Zilzal are coming second and third. The event organized by
the Dubai International marine club honors the UAE's marine heritage, absolutely wonderful. All right, well, thanks so very much for joining us,
up next, "One World" with Zain Asher.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[12:00:00]
END
