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White House And Colombia Reach Agreement On Deportation Flights; Trump's Tariff Threat Comes Amid Warning China-Colombia Ties; Auschwitz Survivors Pay Tribute To Holocaust Victims. Aired 10-11a ET

Aired January 27, 2025 - 10:00:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:00:32]

ELENI GIOKOS, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome to our second hour of CONNECT THE WORLD. I'm Eleni Giokos in Dubai.

A trade war in the first days of the new Trump administration has been averted after Colombia's president backed down in the wake of threats by

his American counterpart.

Colombia has signaled it will now allow the arrival of U.S. military planes, carrying undocumented immigrants.

President Gustavo Petro had blocked the flight, citing what he called inhumane treatment of the migrants. In response, U.S. President Donald

Trump, threatened to slap 25 percent tariffs on all goods imported from Colombia. That could increase to 50 percent.

That threat now rescinded, and migrants' flights have been arriving in other countries. One is due to land this hour in Guatemala. And Stefano

Pozzebon is back with us this hour from Bogota for an update on the latest.

Stefano, tell us what happened. What was the ultimate compromise for Colombia to agree to this -- to this, that initially it was very averse to?

STEFANO POZZEBON, CNN JOURNALIST: Yes indeed, Eleni. I think that the ultimate compromise was basically that trying to find the same relationship

that they had with Washington before Trump took office, before this last week.

We were talking in the previous hour that Colombia has received not fewer than 124 deportation flights just last year in 2024. That's more than 10

flights a day. So, you can't really say that they are not receiving deportation flights.

Surely, the president of Colombia wanted to draw a line on the type of treatment that he believed was considered inhumane. A lot of leaders in

Latin America and take have taken offense, Eleni, the idea that migrants are brought back to their home country in handcuffs, which is sometimes is

practice in on this type of flights.

And also tried to use these as claiming the baton of being a leader, as Latin America is sort of still scrambling to realize what the next four

years there will be. So, Petro tried to claim a sort of a leadership role with other minor countries.

You mentioned Guatemala, of course, Honduras that have declared -- that have called up for an emergency meeting of an inter Latin American body

later this week to meet there in Tegucigalpa, Mexico, Brazil.

These are conversations that are happening in every single government office. We are coming to you from the foreign ministry of Colombia, trying

to figure out what really happened in those frantic hours last night, where the diplomats were busy at work.

We know that the phones were ringing and ringing hot, and they were trying to salvage a historic relationship between Colombia and Washington at a

moment, Eleni, where others are also looking at Latin America, of course.

GIOKOS: Yes, really good point.

Let's talk about, Gustavo Petro, running his presidential campaign on an anti-U.S. sentiment. This will only strain the relationship a lot more.

Give me a sense of how China was quick to come in to support Colombia. And is Colombia looking for other foreign allies that could, perhaps, put the

United States in a difficult position?

POZZEBON: Yes, indeed, Eleni. I mean, when I mentioned others looking at Latin America, of course, China is the big elephant in the room yesterday,

and I think we can probably show it to you on the screen.

Yesterday, yesterday afternoon, on Sunday, there was the ambassador of China tweeting out that the relationship between Colombia and China was at

the strongest ever time possible, while the president of Colombia and the president of the United States were threatening each other with tariffs.

China is a huge presence here in Bogota. They are building, for example, the subway system now. They have huge contracts in areas of mineral and

other exports. And of course, Colombia is also trying to keep a good relationship with the likes of Venezuela, Cuba, and Nicaragua, other

countries that have come into Washington's crosshairs.

Gustavo Petro has definitely tried to distance himself from Washington, compared to a historic, very close relationship between Bogota and

Washington. We'll see what happens now that there is another president in Washington who is prone to do stuff.

Policy by social media, and he's not taking no for an answer, but what we saw yesterday.

[10:05:05]

So, we'll see how these all adjust. But definitely, China is looking very, very closely to Colombia.

Yesterday, there was the celebration of the Chinese New Year here in Bogota, an investment of millions of dollars. Tens of thousands of people

went there and celebrated.

So, times are indeed changing in Latin America. Washington is still proving a strong part here, but China is also on the horizon. Eleni.

GIOKOS: All right. Stefano Pozzebon, great to have you with us. Thank you so much.

I want to bring in CNN politics senior reporter Stephen Collinson.

In your latest analysis, Stephen, which is always brilliant, and you can find it on cnn.com to our viewers, you say this, "Donald Trump claimed an

early victory for a coercive foreign policy based on tariffs and hard power." All right. So, and then, you know, also, importantly, the White

House said in the statement, "Today's events make clear to the world that America is respected again." Take me through all of what transpired in the

last 24 hours.

STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN POLITICS SENIOR REPORTER: Well, I think what we saw from political sense narrowly, was a victory for the Trump administration,

because they not only want to get these migrant flights back to countries in Latin America, they wanted to send a message throughout the region that

not allowing these flights to land would not be tolerated. This was a test of strength, an early one, for President Trump, and this mass deportation

strategy, which is so key to his political project, and was one of the reasons why he won the election.

I think this was an equal battle, because the Colombian economy is much smaller than the American economy. The trading relationship is fairly

small. So, had those tariffs of 25 percent initially rising to 50 percent come into effect, it would have had a much more painful impact on Columbia

than it would on U.S. consumers, although we would have expected to see the price of coffee rise, and that is a conflict -- would have been a

complication for Trump's other big plan to get us grocery prices down.

So, politically, I think This was a win for the Trump administration. It probably saved them similar showdowns with other Latin American nations. I

think we can ask the question whether, if we get four years of what some might call a bullying foreign policy, the United States will be in a better

or worse position in the world after the Trump administration. But for now, the White House is pretty satisfied.

GIOKOS: Yes, and it's a really interesting sort of calculation made by the Colombian president. It's you've got a trade war looming. What does it mean

locally, domestically, and even knowing that it would have spillover effects in the United States.

But importantly, it's almost like this vacuum that could be created by the United States and by the Trump administration, could be filled by China.

There is a lot of talk about China influence in Colombia. And I wonder if not only Colombia is looking at this from a long term -- long term

perspective, but China is watching on very closely.

COLLINSON: Well, China certainly is watching closely. I think the fact that China is trying to make inroads into Latin America is something that's very

much on the mind of the Trump administration.

They've only been in office a week, and we've seen a lot of concentration on Western Hemisphere issues. Secretary of State Marco Rubio will make his

first trip to Central America this week. The issue of migrant deportations and stopping migrant flows will be on the agenda, but it is clearly a

signal to China, because Rubio is one of the most anti-China politicians in the United States, especially through the last 10 years or so during his

tenure in the Senate.

I think that the United States still has outweighs China diplomatically in the region, but there are a number of leftist leaders, like Petro, who are

looking towards China and wouldn't mind more of a role.

We've seen the United States alienate Panama through Trump's rhetoric about possibly taking back the Panama Canal. Now, Colombia, you have to wonder

who is next, and I think this is an opportunity for China, definitely.

GIOKOS: All right. Stephen Collison, great to have you with us. Thank you so much.

And today marks a grim milestone in human history. It is the 80th anniversary of the liberation of Auschwitz, the Nazi death camp during

World War II.

We are seeing live pictures right now from Auschwitz. A very moving scene. World leaders are gathering to pay tribute to the victims of the Holocaust

who were killed. But today's focus centers on the survivors. They have been bearing witness for decades, urging the world to never forget. Let's listen

in.

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[10:09:58]

MARIAN TURSKI, AUSCHWITZ SURVIVOR (through translator): Of the victims of the Holocaust, it is absolutely understandable, if not downright obvious

that people, that the media turn to us to those who survived, so that we shared with them our memories.

However, there's always been a very small minority of us, us who went through all those selections positively. That number itself was very

little. And those who lived to see freedom, there were hardly, hardly none, so few.

And now, there is only a handful such a small baby. That is why I believe that our thoughts should now go towards this huge majority, those millions

of victims who will never tell us what they experienced, what they felt, just because they were consumed by that mass destruction, the shore.

However, there is a certain document that has survived. A document, a poem that to a particular degree, tells us something about those very people.

And do remember the name, It's by Henryka Lazowert.

Henryka Lazowert. She was a Polish poetess. She had very successful attempts at writing literature. She had an opportunity to hide beyond the

walls of the ghetto, but she was loathe to leave her mother behind.

Today, when I listen to her poem, I find it as something that goes absolutely beyond anything that the mind can imagine. This is a document.

We have a photo of Henryka. She was a beautiful woman. She was 33. By that time, she had been a recognized poet, a Polish poet. She wrote in Polish.

And as a Jewess, she was sentenced to annihilation.

[10:15:01]

She had an opportunity to find a hiding place on the so-called Aryan side, but she didn't want to leave her mother. She wrote a letter, a poem to her

friend. Let me quote that letter.

"I'm going somewhere, there, to a very distant place, a station that is unknown for it is not in any map. There is the sky hanging over the station

like a huge black lid, the engine shrieks, with the voice of a beaten man. The train drivers have the faces of paper. All I have with me is just one

suitcase and one grief that no one's ever tried to plummet. I'm so very composed, and what you cannot see at all so very sad. Be healthy. My

distant."

There are hearts where nothing changes. I am no longer -- no longer.

May I ask all the present to stand up for a moment silence.

Thank you. Thank you very much.

Difference, for at least 2,000 years of our civilization, we've been accompanied by a vision of apocalypses.

Here, the four riders of Apocalypse arrive, war, pestilence, hunger, and the death. People are perplexed with fear, paralyzed, paralyzed with that

fear, and they feel absolutely helpless. What can be done?

At this point, I would like to quote a song that certainly many of you would recognize if I hummed the tune, but don't worry, I'm not going to

sing. But all I want is to draw your attention to the lyrics, because these lyrics are exceptionally inspiring.

The author of the lyrics is Rabbi Nachman of Breslov, who was better known as Rabbi Nachman of Uman, because that was where he had his body buried

among the graves of the victims of a pogrom.

[10:20:17]

All our world, the whole world we have is nothing, a very narrow bridge, and which is most important, one must not be afraid at all.

Thus, not to be afraid, we see in the contemporary world. Today, and now, we see a huge rise in anti-Semitism, and that is precisely anti-Semitism

that led to the Holocaust.

Deborah Lipstadt called it the tsunami of anti-Semitism. And it was her courage, her tenacity in fighting with Holocaust denial, which in English,

is called the denial of the Holocaust, put an end to it. It ended in a success after she won a trial against David Irving in London.

Let us not fear demonstrating the same courage today when Hamas attempts at denial of the massacre of the seventh of October.

Let us not oppose the conspiration theories, saying that all the evil of this world results from a plot started by some indefinite social groups,

and Jews are often mentioned as one of such.

Let us not fear discussing the problems that torment the so-called last generation. These young people may disturb our social order. They may

disturb our system of truth, yet, whether the judge has pronounced the sentence when he uttered those memorable words, perhaps, today, I sentence tomorrow's heroes.

Let us not be afraid to convince ourselves that we can solve problems between neighbors, because for centuries on many continents, many nations,

many peoples and many ethnic groups have lived and have had their homes among one another -- and between one another.

All the hatred, all the hate speech, led to armed conflicts between those neighboring peoples and ethnic groups that always ended in bloodshed.

[10:25:00]

Yet, luckily, there are the positive experiences as well when both the sides reach a conclusion that they have no other way of ensuring a

peaceful, safe, and secure life for their children, grandchildren, and for the future generations, then leading to a compromise.

Let me quote here two examples from Europe, Germans and the French, Poles and Lithuanians, let me reiterate. Let us not fear convincing ourselves

that one needs to have a vision, not only of what is here today, but also what is going to come tomorrow and what will Come in several decades.

Thank you for your attention.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GIOKOS: We're seeing live pictures from the Auschwitz, 80-year anniversary memorial underway. Powerful words from Marian Turski, Auschwitz survivor,

sharing stories and painful memories, and importantly, ones of survival.

I want to go now to CNN international correspondent Melissa Bell, who joins us now live from Auschwitz-Birkenau at the memorial service.

It's extremely moving, you know, seeing some of the people that have attended, not only survivors, but of course, world leaders as well. And

seeing some people wearing that striped blue and white scarf, symbolizing the prisoner uniform, really moving. Melissa, an important message to never

forget.

MELISSA BELL, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: And to watch Eleni, those guests, distinguished as they are, you'll have seen there, King

Charles, but also, President Zelenskyy, the German chancellor, the German president, the French president, all rising there to give a very well-

deserved standing ovation there to Marian Turski, 98 years old, who just delivered that very powerful speech.

Now, he is the first of the survivors who will be speaking here today, but a handful of others will as well, Eleni, in all 50 survivors of the

Holocaust are gathered there in that tent just nearby here at Birkenau to hear, to mark this remarkable occasion.

And I think one of the most poignant things about it, the organizers have been telling us here is that this is likely the last large commemoration

where any great numbers of them will be fit or well enough to attend.

So, these are important words that we're hearing, possibly from many of them for the very last time.

And we've been speaking to one of them yesterday, coming ahead, to this commemoration, who spoke to us of the great difficulties physically at this

stage, very late in life, to make the journey emotionally for those survivors coming back.

This is a very difficult journey to make, but she explained to us a necessary one, because precisely of what we just heard Marian Turski refer

to there, the fact of rising anti-Semitism, and the fact that memory is, in the end, as short as it is. It takes those dwindling numbers to make the

journey back, to remind us exactly of what they witnessed and what happened here.

GIOKOS: Yes. Melissa Bell, thank you so much for that update.

We are now joined by Robert Gerwarth. He is a professor of modern history at University College Dublin, and director of the Center for War Studies.

Great to have you with us on this important day.

We just heard from Marian Turski, one of the Auschwitz survivors, and as Melissa bell just said, that, you know, the survivor numbers are dwindling,

that they are anticipating this is going to be one of the very last big moments to hear their stories, their memories.

Tell me about what this means overall as we look on the 80th anniversary of liberation, of Auschwitz, an important moment in time.

ROBERT GERWARTH, PROFESSOR OF MODERN HISTORY, UNIVERSITY COLLEGE DUBLIN: Yes, you're absolutely right. Eleni, the event of the Holocaust is

increasingly receding into the distance. And if you were 18 at the time of liberation, you're now 98.

So, as you say, it is very unlikely that for the next major anniversary, 90 or even 100 years, there will be many survivors who are still with us.

[10:30:09]

So, this is a very important moment in time, and obviously, extremely moving to hear from the survivors themselves, who are incredibly brave, of

course to return to the sight where they experience absolute horror, and in all likelihoods lost many family members.

GIOKOS: Marian Turski also spoke about the rise in anti-Semitism, and that has been eventually led to the Holocaust, and of course, a big warning.

We're also seeing a rise in nationalism. Do you believe that humanity, the world, has actually learned from this mark and stain on humanity? Something

that, frankly, is still with us in many ways and we're seeing some of these stories. It's easy to listen in, but it's one thing to look at the news and

look at the his -- the historical facts and another thing to really feel it and have empathy and saying we should avert anything like this again.

GERWARTH: I think empathy is still quite strong among the older generation, or even my generation, whereas for people, this is now an event, the

Holocaust, a genocide that occurred a long time ago. So, these moments in time, these commemorations are quite important to remind people of the

sheer scale and horror of the Holocaust in which six million people perished.

And Holocaust education is also very important for younger people in schools and universities. But there is certainly a sense that memory of the

Holocaust is receding into the distance, and that it is not perceived as relevant as it was say, 20, 30 years ago, when people united around

Holocaust Memorial Day to commemorate it and to also view it increasingly as a sort of universal reminder of what horrible things people are capable

of doing to other humans.

GIOKOS: You make a really important point and you say generationally, you know, people remember and, you know, engage with this history in a very

different way. I remember when I was in my teens and I learned about the Holocaust, and it stayed with me, and in fact, I was -- I was really

shocked about what we know about this part of our history. It's not just about teaching it. It's about the way we engage with history.

It's about the way that we pass this information on generation to generation. What do you think we're learning from the rise of anti-

Semitism? The fact that even Peter Lauder, the head of the World Jewish Congress says that anti-Semitism wasn't dead, but it was just in hiding.

GERWARTH: Yes. I would agree with that. I think for some time it became politically incorrect to

publicly voice anti-Semitism but now with the rise of social media in particular, where you can also hide your identity, it is much easier to see

the extent of anti-Semitism but also racism more generally because I feel very often, people don't use that filter anymore. They express their views,

radical and appalling as they might be, in a much more open fashion.

And in that sense, I would certainly agree that it is much more visible today and certainly given recent events in the Middle East, this has

intensified further. But yes, I would see that there is a rise, obviously, of the far right in many countries in Europe and further afield, also left-

wing anti-Semitism to a certain degree and therefore it's become much more of an issue than it ever has been, at least an open issue than it ever has

been, certainly in my lifetime. And it's very worrying to see the return of anti-Semitism in present day societies.

GIOKOS: It is indeed, Robert. Thank you so much for your time and your insights. Good to have you on.

All right. We're going to very short break. We'll be back after this. Stay with CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:36:43]

GIOKOS: Welcome back to CONNECT THE WORLD. I'm Eleni Giokos. At any minute now, a U.S. deportation flight is expected to land in Guatemala City as

part of President Trump's ongoing crackdown on immigration. Guatemala has reportedly said it can handle about 20 weekly flights of deported citizens

or some 2500 people. I want to bring in attorney and immigration analyst, Raul Reyes. Raul, great to have you with us.

What do you make of the images that we saw yesterday of the immigrants that were sent to Colombia and then sent back and then the, you know, the tit

for tat, frankly, between Colombia and the United States and then, importantly, this flight now to Guatemala?

RAUL REYES, ATTORNEY: Right. Well, in terms of the U.S.-Columbia controversy that we saw play out this week -- weekend, just for context, I

think it's worth noting that the U.S. and Colombia have had a bilateral agreement that allows for deportation flights for years. This is something

President Petro, you know, signed off on when he came into office. Last year, there were 126 deportation flights back to Colombia.

What the issue here is with Colombia is the use of U.S. military planes. Because Colombia, like many other Latin American nations, is extremely

sensitive about the presence of U.S. military on their territory. So just to be clear, the issue is the use of U.S. military planes. What the images

we'll see today of Guatemala deportees being returned is one I think will be increasingly common during the Trump administration.

Not that previous administrations have not done them, but I do believe it's an important part of the Trump administration's messaging that the American

citizens see Trump's promises as you will, as we could call them, fulfilled in terms of mass deportations and returning to people to their countries of

origin. This problem, though, does get trickier when we talk about countries like Venezuela, China and Cuba, that basically refused to take

the deportees back.

GIOKOS: Yes. Really interesting that you say that it is a bit misleading that it was the use of military aircraft that was the issue and not so much

about anything else, because it was an existing deal between the U.S. and Colombia. But, you know, it really looked like it was going to turn into

this trade war. I want you to give me a sense of the protocol that is required when you are looking to deport people back to their homeland.

You know, are -- is the U.S. government engaging with embassies locally to ensure that they have verified citizenship? What is the process? Because

we're going to start seeing, from what we understand, probably a lot more of these instances.

REYES: Right. Well, the processes involving returning nationals to the -- foreign nationals to the countries of origin is very complicated and it

varies from nation to nation. For example, Mexico right now, well aware of the U.S. administration's plans to deport people back to Mexico, they are

ramping up efforts on their side of the board to receive migrants, to provide them with some basic necessities, counseling, flights back to their

-- the cities where they originally lived.

[10:40:00]

In other countries, it's much harder because you have to remember that, for example, when we're talking about Central American nations, many of the

reasons that migrants left is because they were driven by civil instability in these nations where the government was really not functioning, where

there was a lack of civil stability. So, it gets much harder when we talk about these countries, but generally, the U.S. does try to ascertain the

country and citizenship of origin.

And then the home country tries to figure out if there's someone who can receive them, or if not, they just choose a, say, a dropping off point in a

major city. And then it's basically up to many migrants to figure out what to do next.

GIOKOS: Yes. I mean, in terms from a legal perspective, and if anyone wanted to appeal this, you know, once they're on the aircraft, I mean, the

process has started. What have you come across, in terms of phone calls and people looking at how they can, you know, try and get out of the situation

if they choose to? Can they?

REYES: Well, not really. Once someone has an order of removal and the process has begun, say, when they are slated for deportation flights or

even on the plane. At this point, they're really -- they really do not have legal avenues in the United States that they can viably pursue to try and

come back or to reverse order. And also, what for context, I think something that people may be missing is that many of these people who we

are seeing on the deportation flights going back over the weekend and since Trump took office, these were people who were arrested, detained and

processed by the Biden administration.

It is just that -- it is now the Trump administration that is sending them home, because this can be a very lengthy process in terms of the legal and

logistical obstacles. So, it's actually some of these people we could say that they are Biden deportees as well. What is unfortunate for many of

these people is that they say as immigration attorneys, we often hear stories of people who say that their due process rights were not fully --

that they did not receive the due process rights as they are entitled to.

That some of them were -- are being removed from the United States without having seen an immigration judge. And that's part of what Trump intends to

do going forward, using a process called expedited removal whereby recent arrivals can be returned home -- to the countries of origin very quickly

without going before a judge.

GIOKOS: Raul Reyes, great to have you with us. Thank you so much for your insights. All right. CNN's David Culver joins us now from Guatemala City.

Guatemala, great to have you with us, David. What are you seeing on the ground there?

DAVID CULVER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Eleni. We're actually on the tarmac right now. We're waiting for two flights that are coming in today, expected

here to Guatemala City from the U.S., both of them carrying deported migrants. Now, one of them is a commercial flight. The other is a military

flight. And I specify military because that's new in recent days. In fact, the first military flights that arrived here in Guatemala City with

deportees on them began just Thursday of last week.

So, they're going to come here. The first is going to be the commercial one. It's going to arrive here and the migrants will be coming off that

plane. And let me show you where they're going to head into. They're just going to come over here into this facility where they'll be greeted by the

country's vice president, and it's a reception area for returned migrants. And they'll be processed and they'll begin what is a very lengthy process.

A lengthy process essentially trying to figure out how they're going to reintegrate into society here. And it is a very challenging one, as the

vice president described to me, I want you to hear a little bit about what she had to say when she spoke to us just a short time ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CULVER: I asked the Vice President for those who are coming in today. What opportunities they're going to have. Obviously, they left Guatemala for a

reason, and she says that's part of the efforts now is to find a way to give them those opportunities, create employment, and allow them to relieve

their burdens because she says a lot of them are coming here with a lot of discomfort and at ease.

OK. So, there's two flights arriving today. One is a commercial flight. That's got 80 or so deported migrants and other is a military flight that

will come later today.

I'll just give you a quick description of that. The Vice President I asked, is this a complicated relationship? Is it difficult? She said, of course,

for the migrants that are returning, their situation is very complicated.

[10:45:10]

She says the relation between Guatemala and the U.S. remains fluid. They remain in communication, and that it's something that day by day, they're

essentially trying to make sure that they can keep across.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CULVER: I'll pick up on that last point, because I also asked her. I said, are you all scared of President Trump? And she reverted back to remaining

essentially the status quo. We want to keep relations strong. Obviously, what played out between the U.S. and Colombia yesterday and the brief

refusal of military flights carrying deportees is something that has many countries here in Latin America a bit rattled and focused on how the U.S.

administration is handling things.

So, they're going to be very keen to know that they are still in good standing with the U.S. And that's something that she wanted to come across

with. That yes, as she indicated, it's complicated on many levels. She specified more so for turning migrants, but this is something, Eleni, that

is obviously in very early stages because I asked, what's the difference between what is happening right now in the numbers and what's been

happening in recent years under President Biden?

And she said, as far as the numbers in capacity are concerned, there's no change. Perhaps the one distinction that she could make is that there are

military flights, and that's what began last Thursday and obviously is continuing today.

GIOKOS: Yes. That's really interesting on the military aircraft that's in use, and sort of how the calculation has changed on that fines. When they

say they are in permanent communication with the White House, what are they anticipating to transpire in the next few weeks?

CULVER: Well, I think one of the bigger parts of all of this is obviously going to be the visit from Secretary Rubio who is coming here to Guatemala

this week. And so, I think one of the things they're hoping to try to communicate is that, yes, they want to be able to work in any functional

and a coherent manner with the U.S. They don't want this to be adversarial in any way.

But at the same time, they have a lot of concerns with potential numbers and who's going to be coming into this country and returning, and how

quickly they can reintegrate that because -- I mean, you've got to think going from the 60s to the mid-90s, Guatemala was dealing with a very brutal

civil war. A lot of the folks who are in the U.S. have been there for several decades. They have built lives there.

I was asking one of the communications folks here. How many people, roughly, will be fluent English speakers that we might see coming off these

plates? She said roughly 60 percent. So, it just shows you, they're fully integrated in many ways into life in the U.S. So, this will be the huge

challenge for them as they come back here to their native Guatemala and try to figure out how to move forward.

GIOKOS: All right. David Culver, great to have you there on the topic as you wait for those flights to come into Guatemala City. Great reporting.

Thank you so much. We'll be back right after the short break. Stay at CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GIOKOS: A fragile ceasefire is holding in Gaza, but there are concerns about the U.S. vision for the enclave. After President Donald Trump implied

that he would "clean out the whole thing." Today, there is mass movement internally, as Israel allows tens of thousands of Palestinians to finally

return to the decimated north. Last hour, I spoke with Khaled Elgindy, adjunct professor at Georgetown University about what the day after could

look like for Gaza.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[10:50:05]

KHALED ELGINDY, ADJUNCT PROFESSOR, GEORGETOWN UNIVERSITY: It's very hard to say at this point. I think, first of all, the spectacle of a mass movement

of Palestinians back to their homes, or at least their home areas and their land and their properties is quite something remarkable. It's not something

that we're used to seeing. We've seen many instances in history where Palestinians are pushed out of their homes, but this is a different kind of

moment.

And I think for a lot of Palestinians reassuring in the sense that there is a strong commitment by Palestinians to remain in their homeland. Even

frankly, if their homes have been destroyed, they would rather return to the rubble of their homes than to be exiled, yet again, from their

homeland. So, I think it is a -- it's a powerful display that we're seeing today.

GIOKOS: In the fall of 2024 Saudi Arabia's Foreign Minister Prince Faisal bin Farhan spoke with our Becky Anderson about the future of Palestinians.

I want you to take a listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FAISAL BIN FARHAN AL-SAUD, SAUDI ARABIA'S FOREIGN MINISTER PRINCE: I would say certainly normalization with the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia is not just a

(INAUDIBLE) it is off the table until we have a resolution to Palestinian state.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GIOKOS: What is your sense of how Saudi Arabia is likely to respond to this President Trump was talking about the $600 billion investment that it's

anticipating in the U.S. Clearly, this is a transactional relationship. What is your bet?

ELGINDY: Well, I think in addition to Egypt and Jordan, the Trump administration is likely to hear about this latest idea from the Saudis as

well. I'm sure the Saudis will privately let their American counterparts know of their disapproval and their unhappiness. They probably won't say so

publicly. Even the Egyptians and the Jordanians have been fairly circumspect and understated in criticizing the president.

They don't want to obviously spoil that relationship at this stage, but they have also made it clear that that this would be an unacceptable

outcome. The Saudis are likely conveying that message privately as well.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GIOKOS: Well, there's a new Chinese A.I. startup on the block, and it's sending U.S. stocks plunging. It's called Deepseek and it has already

demonstrated stunning A.I. capabilities, despite apparently costing a fraction of the billions of dollars that have been invested by American

A.I. players like OpenAI, Google as well as Meta. U.S. tech stocks are taking a hammering this session. Nvidia, the leading supplier of A.I. chips

is down around -- let's take a look, 13 percent.

Alphabet down two percent, Microsoft, three percent in the -- in the -- in the red and Meta is up two percent. Interesting. We've got Clare Duffy.

She's got details from New York. I tell you, I've been calling this A.I. coup since I read the story. And it's truly pretty phenomenal. The numbers,

I think, shocking everyone in the A.I. industry. And big questions, how did they crack this code?

CLARE DUFFY, CNN BUSINESS WRITER: That is the big question, Eleni. Look, this is essentially a direct competitor to some of those big tech platforms

you need OpenAI, Chat GPT, Google's Gemini, Meta's A.I. tool. This is a one-year-old startup that was reportedly able to build this advanced A.I.

model for $5.6 million. As you said, just a fraction of the billions of dollars that most of these big tech companies have spent on their advanced

A.I. models.

And the question really is, how did they do it? Because this is a Chinese startup that is, at least in theory, subject to U.S. export restrictions on

the most advanced A.I. chips. So the question is, were they able to get around those restrictions or did they really build this advanced model that

is competitive with the big tech players models for a fraction of the cost and with less powerful A.I. chips?

Because then I think we're certainly going to have American investors asking these Silicon Valley tech giants, what have you been spending all of

this money on? How is this Chinese startup able to compete with you for a fraction of the cost, potentially with less powerful chips? The other issue

here is that this is an Open Source model, whereas many of the big tech players like OpenAI are making their most advanced models.

Something that you have to pay for to access. Anybody can access Deepsleep. We've seen it rocket to the top of the Apple App Store. And so, I think

this, this story, is really challenging, this idea that the U.S. is the far and away leader in the A.I. arms race.

GIOKOS: Yes. And it could be falling behind because there is a hardcore race that's on the go. And you mentioned in terms of spending, you know,

$5.6 billion to get this up and running.

[10:55:04]

And Meta last week said is going to spend $65 billion on A.I. development, which is really fascinating. Who's going to come out as the winner here?

And importantly, have you downloaded it?

DUFFY: I, you know, I have not downloaded it only because I running around working on this story this morning, but that is next on my list. Look, I

think we're still it's unclear who is going to end up being the big winner here, but I do think we may see sort of a turning point at this point where

these big tech companies are forced to scale back their spending and try to find other ways to create these advanced models.

Because clearly, as we go into big tech earnings week this week, I think investors really are going to have tough questions for these companies. How

was the startup able to create something so competitive for such a fraction of the cost?

GIOKOS: Yes. Absolutely, big question. But, you know, the consumer, at the end of the day will decide, we'll see how everyone responds. Clare Duffy,

great to have you on. Thanks so much for joining us. I'm Eleni Giokos. Stay with CNN. NEWSROOM is up next.

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