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U.S., Russia, Ukraine Holding Peace Talks in Abu Dhabi; Trump Angers Allies with Swipe at NATO Troops in Afghanistan; EU Leaders United After Trump's Greenland Threats; Boy Taken by I.C.E. Being Held with Father at Texas Facility; Vance Defends Actions of I.C.E. Agents in Young Boy's Case. Aired 9-9:45a ET

Aired January 23, 2026 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ELENI GIOKOS, CNN HOST, CONNECT THE WORLD: You're looking at the skyline right here in Abu Dhabi as Russian, Ukrainian and American delegations are

meeting together for direct talks for the first time since Moscow's invasion of Ukraine in 2022.

It's 06:00 p.m. here. I'm Eleni Giokos. Welcome to "Connect the World". Also coming up from growing outrage over U.S. President Trump denigrating

the service of NATO troops in Afghanistan. And in Trump's escalating immigration crackdown in Minnesota, a five-year-old boy is being held with

his father by I.C.E.

30 minutes to go before the start of trade in New York. Let's check in on those market futures, and we're seeing a second day of rallies anticipated

that we'll see numbers hitting higher today. But for now, the future is pointing half a percent down for the DOW, S&P down a quarter of a percent,

and NASDAQ also taking a big of a knock.

And of course, a lot of rhetoric geopolitical tension, and of course, a lot of talk of tariffs had market spooked earlier this week. It seems that

President Trump has pulled back on some of that policy, and investors are feeling appease. We'll check in on those numbers in around 30 minutes from

now.

In the meantime, nearly four years into Russia's war on Ukraine, a diplomatic first today. Negotiators from both countries, joined by the

United States, are sitting at the same table here in Abu Dhabi. The trilateral talks coming after U.S. President Donald Trump's Special Envoy

Steve Witkoff and son in law, Jared Kushner, met with Russian President Vladimir Putin in Moscow before leaving the World Economic Forum in Davos,

Switzerland.

Witkoff said negotiations have narrowed down to a single issue. We have Paula Hancocks here with us in Abu Dhabi to break this down. We also have

Nick Paton Walsh standing by for us in London with further analysis. Paula, I want to start off with you, and of course, very important talks.

There's a big question around how far they're going, how the negotiations and conversations are going. Frankly, what can be achieved here that hasn't

been achieved before?

PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. So, Eleni, we know from a source familiar with the negotiations that these talks have begun. So, these

trilateral talks significant in the fact that you have all three of these players in the same place for these talks. Now, Abu Dhabi, of course,

there's a precedent for having these talks here.

We know there have been prisoner exchange deals done between Russia and Ukraine in the past that have been mediated by the UAE.

GIOKOS: Yeah.

HANCOCKS: And of course, here, these countries have privacy. You're not going to have protests in the UAE.

GIOKOS: Yeah.

HANCOCKS: You're not going to have doorstepping so they can try and discuss this single issue that it appears they are discussing now, of course, one

of the most crucial issues and the trickiest issue when you're talking about territory, when it comes to the delegations themselves, we've had

some insight into what these delegations look like.

To break it down, simply, the Russian delegation is military. We know that the Ukrainian delegation is wider. It has it has military. It has the

diplomats. It has the negotiators. And we know that President Zelenskyy has had a meeting with this delegation before they came here. And he said,

quote, the delegation knows what to do.

GIOKOS: Yeah.

HANCOCKS: So, they've come here with a specific mandate. Of course, whether we will get any kind of information out of this is a big question. It's

unlikely, but the fact that they are sitting down, presumably together, presumably in the same room, has to be seen as significant.

GIOKOS: Significant hopefully there will be a breakthrough. Nick, you've also pointed out in your analysis online that this meeting seemed to appear

out of nowhere, and that Moscow has sent a slightly different military, different delegation, as well as military, as Paula has pointed out.

So, what can be achieved here when, as Zelenskyy, put it where in Groundhog Day?

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. I mean, look, Zelenskyy's reference to Groundhog Day was towards the

Europeans and his constant need to tell them to assist Ukraine or take more responsibility for their own future.

Here, though, I think Zelenskyy may possibly have caught Moscow off guard by saying these trilateral talks were happening. They are the first to see

U.S., Russia and Ukraine at the same table since the start of the invasion. We don't know if Moscow had already signed up to it or felt they sort of

had to rush at least send a team there.

That team, though, is led by the Head of Russia's Military Intelligence, the GRU. They've been active across Europe, obviously inside Ukraine as

well, as well.

[09:05:00]

And Igor Kostyukov had, in fact previously been to some of the talks in Istanbul, but not as the head of Russia's delegation. So, a slight change

here, I think, in the composure of the Russian team here, it's arguably, I think, that this is not a senior team as the Ukrainians who have sent the

chief of Zelenskyy staff, the lead negotiator, top diplomats, top security officials as part of their team, familiar faces on the U.S. side, and one

new one as well, a White House Advisor towards the "Board of Peace", Josh Gruenbaum.

So, lot moving, I think, in terms of how Russia may be operating here. We don't know, for example, if this new military team is more empowered to

negotiate on behalf of Moscow, or if this is what we've seen in the past, a sort of procedural format change by Russia to potentially slow things down

or cause a reset, because the makeup of their team is different.

How close are we to some kind of peace? Well, I would argue we're still quite some distance. Even President Trump himself said were aways to go.

The meeting the Kremlin didn't appear to yield any immediate results, possibly overshadowed by the fact these Abu Dhabi trilaterals were supposed

to occur after it, but it is the issue of land here that remains.

WALSH: It's not one small issue.

GIOKOS: Yeah.

WALSH: It's not some outstanding, tiny thing that can be resolved. It's the key. It's the reason Russia invaded. It's the thing that Russia wants

Ukraine to give up more of, and that Ukraine says is a red line in terms of giving up land without a fight. So, look, it's a huge mountain to climb.

We are in procedural progress, seeing these three sides together here, but there's no sign at this stage that removes the huge obstacle in the way to

some kind of ceasefire or peace.

GIOKOS: Yeah, exactly the concessions by both sides, perhaps still something in question. Paula Hancocks, great to have you with us. Thank

you, and a big thank you to Nick Paton Walsh. Right, there's growing condemnation from international governments after Donald Trump downplayed

sacrifices by America's NATO allies with these comments on Thursday. Listen in.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: We've never needed them. We have never really asked anything of them. You know, they'll say

they sent some troops to Afghanistan or this or that, and they did. They stayed a little back, little off the front lines.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GIOKOS: And a quick reminder that article five of NATO, which states that an attack on one member is considered an attack against all and has only

been invoked once, and that was after the 9/11 terror attacks and more than just 1000 non-U.S. NATO troops were killed in Afghanistan.

NATO Secretary General privately spoke to Trump following his comments. "The Atlantic" is reporting that he told the president, for every two

Americans who paid the ultimate price, there was one soldier from another NATO country who did not come back to his family.

Our International Diplomatic Editor, Nic Robertson is live from Greenland for us. And you know, these comments, Nic, it's an insult to NATO, and

we're seeing quite a lot of shock from NATO members. I want to also just touch on what we're seeing in Greenland, because it's still pretty vague in

terms of any deal that could be on the table. Listen in.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: We're all going to work together. And actually, NATO is going to be involved with us. We're going to be doing it in conjunction, parts of it in

conjunction with NATO, which is really the way it should be. And we won't have any expense, because we're not going to have expense other than

building the Golden Dome.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GIOKOS: Right, so a lot to unpack there, Nic. I mean, we've got the issue of Greenland, what that means for NATO. And importantly, Trump's insults

towards NATO and just their role that they've played in wars where the American President believes more Americans died. So, give me a sense of the

reaction there.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yeah, look, I think president's comments cut very deeply in Denmark. They already do his

comments about NATO because Denmark committed two forces in Iraq and in Afghanistan.

GIOKOS: Yeah.

ROBERTSON: In fact, in Afghanistan, they lost 48 troops per capita, a country of 6 million compared to the 350 million in the United States per

capita, they lost more troops than the United States and Afghanistan. And I've spoken to military commanders here, and it really rankles with them

that President Trump uses that kind of language.

But you're hearing it in the UK reaction from the parents of soldiers who are still suffering the trauma of injuries that they received in

Afghanistan. It cuts deep. We know that Mark Rutte, NATO Secretary General, met this morning with the Danish Prime Minister Mette Frederiksen.

She's in the building behind me. That's what you can see. The police are here. We just step back across the road a little bit. You get a better

sense of where we are. She's inside this building here, meeting with the prime minister from Greenland.

[09:10:00]

No doubt part of the conversation will be to update the prime minister, Greenland's Prime Minister about what she heard in her conversations with

Mark Rutte this morning. Mark Rutte has spoken about that meeting this morning. He said that Denmark is committed to increasing its military

support for NATO in the Arctic to improve Arctic security.

So, NATO and Denmark's commitment to it, and, of course, Greenland's commitment to whatever new items, new points and details are in this

agreement with the United States that's front and center of the conversations here. But I think for the people here in Greenland, there's a

sense that President Trump taken or appearing to take the threat off the table of military action is a good thing.

But everyone, and right now the prime minister in Greenland, who told us yesterday that he didn't know the details of that agreement yet, will be

keenly listening to the Danish Prime Minister who's just obviously come from that meeting in Brussels, flown in, really, landed here in the last

half an hour, 45 minutes or so.

It's not clear she'll give a briefing, an update afterwards, but certainly looking at the press corps here, there's an expectation, potentially may

get a few more crumbs of details about this agreement, but we're told to expect the first high level talks about that agreement that President Trump

says get everything that he wants that we're told to expect in a week or so.

GIOKOS: All right. Nic Robertson, thank you so much for that update. Good to have you on the show. I want to turn now to the U.S. States of

Minnesota, where tensions remain high over the Trump Administration's immigration crackdown there, the latest outrage among protesters centers

around the case of a five-year-old boy he was taken from his driveway of his Minneapolis area home by federal agents on Tuesday.

The boy, Liam Conejo Ramos, is being held with his father at an immigration facility in Texas. The family's lawyer says they came to the U.S. from

Ecuador legally presenting themselves to border officials and applying for asylum in December 2024. U.S. Vice President JD Vance is defending the

I.C.E. agents' actions as competing claims emerge. I want you to take a listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JD VANCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: The father ran. So, the story is that I.C.E. detained a five-year-old. Well, what are they

supposed to do? Are they supposed to let a five-year-old child freeze to death?

MARY GRANLUND, COLUMBIA HEIGHTS PUBLIC SCHOOLS: There's ample opportunity to be able to safely hand that child off to adults. And mom was there. She

saw the window, and dad was yelling, please do not open the door. Don't open the door because of the other picture that I'm sure you've seen where

there's a little boy knocking at the door with an I.C.E. agent looming over him.

MARC PROKOSCH, ATTORNEY REPRESENTING THE RAMOS FATHER: And this family was not eluding I.C.E. in any way. They were following all the established

protocols, pursuing their claim for asylum, showing up for their court hearings, and pose no safety, no flight risk, and never should have been

detained.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GIOKOS: Right, in this post on next, the Department of Homeland Security says officers took the boy with him after the father said he wanted the

child to remain with him, and the boy's mother refused to accept custody of her child. Meantime, more protests are planned for today against

immigration crackdown.

Hundreds of Minnesota businesses are expected to close and a rally is planned in Minneapolis. We are tracking a possible historic storm that's

heading east across the U.S. These images show the aftermath in Little Rock, Arkansas in the south. Potentially long, lasting power disruptions

are possible, especially due to the southern I.C.E. storm.

Major travel interference on the roads and at airports is expected. Preparations in the Northeast are underway. Cities like New York as well as

Philadelphia, could see the biggest snow fall in the last four years. All right, still to come. The day in Iran went dark, the internet blackout

drags into the third week across the country.

We have testimony from protesters who witnessed the regime's violent crackdown. That story coming up right after this.

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[09:15:00]

GIOKOS: New and dramatic footage is emerging from Iran, shining a light on just how brutal the regime's crackdown was two weeks ago, thousands are

dead. And tens of thousands have been arrested, according to Human Rights Groups. The internet is slow to fully return, making reporting on Iran

incredibly difficult.

CNN's Jomana Karadsheh was able to speak with protesters about what they witnessed. And we must warn you that some of these images are distressing.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOMANA KARADSHEH, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It was 08:00 p.m. on Thursday, January the 8th. Just as these incredible images were emerging

from protests in Tehran and other cities, Iran went dark. Under the cover of the digital -- it imposed the regime launched one of the bloodiest

chapters in the history of the Islamic Republic.

KIARASH, PROTESTER (voice-over): I saw the army and they were attacking us. I saw shotgun, I saw heavy guns. They didn't allow many of the injured

bodies to go to the hospital.

KARADSHEH (voice-over): This protestor spoke to us from an undisclosed location after leaving Iran, Kiarash is not his real name, but for his

safety, we're not identifying him. He's one of the countless Iranians who joined the protests.

KIARASH (voice-over): The blood was all over the street. Three bodies collapsed. A girl on my left hand, another girl, just two steps, she was

near me, and a guy who was like four meters away.

KARADSHEH (voice-over): Kiarash took to the streets again after a day spent in Tehran's largest cemetery where scenes like this played out surrounded

by grief, anger and chaos, he searched through the dead for the body of Nassim, a family friend who was shot in the neck.

KIARASH (voice-over): I saw two layers of dead bodies. In my eyes, I can say minimum 1500 up to 2000 just in one warehouse. And small bags. I

realized that, oh, my God, these small bags, they are children. Many of them.

KARADSHEH (voice-over): His harrowing account is consistent with other testimony and verified visual evidence collected by CNN and Human Rights

Organizations from various reported protest sites across the country, pointing to a widespread coordinated armed attack by regime forces turning

the streets of Iran into something that resembled a war zone.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They were shooting at us from the top of the buildings and the Ashrafi Esfahani Bridge. They were aiming with lasers, and the

shooters were shooting people in the face. They massacred people.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We started hearing gunshots and feeling tear gas from behind. In Iran, we call this the scissor. They sent forces to the back of

the protests to start hitting people from the back and the front. From 12:00 a.m. Thursday night onward, the type of injuries changed.

The live round started. I've never seen anything like this. The sound of heavy machine guns in the city is something you only see in movies.

KARADSHEH (voice-over): The little video that has broken through the regime's wall of censorship not only captures the horror. It also shows the

forces and weaponry deployed to suppress protests in major urban centers like Tehran and Mashhad.

[09:20:00]

A tactic not previously seen on this scale outside of minority dominated border regions. This is a regime that has never tolerated dissent, one with

a long history of crushing protests violently. But this was like nothing anyone had ever seen before.

MAHMOOD AMIRY-MOGHADDAM, DIRECTOR OF IRAN HUMAN RIGHTS: It's a completely different level of violence and brutality.

KARADSHEH (voice-over): Mahmood Amiri-Moghaddam has spent his life documenting atrocities committed by the Islamic Republic. He says this

crackdown is unparalleled in scope and lethality.

AMIRY-MOGHADDAM: Everywhere we have had witness testimonies, they have been going doing it the same way, you know, using live ammunition, military

grade weapon with the aim of killing as many as possible, even those injured on the ground.

KARADSHEH (voice-over): Iran's leadership has admitted that thousands were killed, but blamed the deaths on rioters and agents of Israel and the U.S.

They've released video like this on state media claiming to show violence committed by protesters. The regime has long used the narrative of a

foreign plot to justify its crackdowns.

This time it had an exiled opposition and a U.S. president urging a revolt.

AMIRY-MOGHADDAM: I think that the regime has never been closer to a fall to a complete regime change. They are doing it for survival, but also to

prevent more protests in the coming years, the aim is to traumatize a generation.

KARADSHEH (voice-over): Even for those who know the regime's brutality all too well, this is just too much to bear.

KARADSHEH: I'm so sorry.

AMIRY-MOGHADDAM: We have no other option. Those who have lost their loved ones, but they still speak out, and that inspires us.

KARADSHEH (voice-over): The world may never know the real scale of the loss and pain as a scarred nation slowly emerges from the night Iran went dark.

Jomana Karadsheh, CNN.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GIOKOS: Right harrowing pictures coming out of Iran. And joining us now to discuss this further. We've got Sanam Vakil, Director of Middle East and

North Africa Programme at Chatham House. You know, really harrowing report there as we signed to get connection back with Iran after that blackout.

I want you to start perhaps with your perspective of the significance of this crackdown, and whether you believe this is one of the bloodiest we've

seen in the history of the Iranian Revolution, I mean, this is -- it's really shocking to see some of these images.

SANAM VAKIL, MIDDLE EAST & NORTH AFRICA PROGRAMME AT CHATHAM HOUSE: First of all, thank you for having me on to discuss such a critical topic at a

critical time for Iran and Iranians. Iran has been in an unprecedented blackout for over two weeks now.

And what is emerging from your footage, but also from statements and reports trickling out from those that have the intermittent connectivity

using Starlink are sharing just the breadth of the regime's brutality. We have never seen anything like this. And this is a country -- this is a

people that have been protesting for quite some time.

The government always cracks down. But this level of brutality, the use of lethal force and the truly unprecedented deaths, is shocking, and we won't

really have a sense of the extent until they turn on the internet switches and reconnect Iran, and I think then we will really be shocked by the level

of violence.

GIOKOS: Yeah, because that will be inevitable. You know, getting everyone back online. Where does the regime go from here? You know, we've been

consistently asking the question around just how weakened Khamenei is and Iran is domestically, because we know that its proxies have been degraded.

But domestically, what does this mean for the regime?

VAKIL: I think this regime cannot recover. It is hit an economic dead end due to its own mismanagement, corruption and sanctions. It's a sort of

triple threat that is strangling the system from within, but the political grievances and the unwillingness to reform or address popular grievances.

And as we have seen in these protests, choosing to be so violent and brutal to their own population really showcases that there is no going back. There

is no rehabilitating the social contract, no building back of legitimacy.

[09:25:00]

It's just a matter of time until the system will have to transform, and we're hearing of U.S. redeployments to the region and suggestions that

conflict might be coming. So, there's a lot of uncertainty and concern as to what comes next.

GIOKOS: Yeah, so, OK, let's talk about the fact that President Trump addressing the U.S. build up in the region last night. I want you to listen

to his messaging.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: You know, we have a lot of ships going that direction, just in case, we have a big flotilla going in that direction, and we'll see what happens.

It's a big force. We have a big force going toward Iran. I'd rather not see anything happen, but we're watching them very closely.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GIOKOS: So, what's the likelihood of any kind of action? And I think keeping in mind the context here that regional players, regional leaders

have dissuaded the United States from striking Iran. So, you know what are we anticipating here?

VAKIL: Well, President Trump keeps flip flopping between maneuvering and threatening to use for us. It's important to remember that over a week ago,

he also threatened to come in to protect protesters after calling them to come out on the streets, and that force never developed, probably because

the American posture in the region wasn't prepared for broader conflict or able to, without an aircraft carrier in the region, defend American

partners and bases across the region adequately.

I suspect that President Trump is putting pressure on Iran, perhaps their diplomatic discussions and messages going back and forth to stave off a

conflict. Ultimately, President Trump is looking for submission from the Islamic Republic and a change of behavior writ large, not just towards the

domestic population, and it's worthwhile remembering the extraction of Maduro in this context.

But ultimately, he wants this regime to end its nuclear ambitions permanently, to curtail its ballistic missile program, to stop its decades

of destabilizing activities in the region, and submit to American pressure. Should that be achieved, President Trump will have achieved the

unachievable.

GIOKOS: Yeah.

VAKIL: And he will grant this regime, or, of course, reconfiguration sanctions relief. Otherwise, I think military force is certainly on the

table.

GIOKOS: All right, Sanam Vakil, thank you so very much for that update and your insights today, we appreciate it. All right, we're going to very short

break, and when we come back, we'll check in on Wall Street closing out what has been a very turbulent trading week. Futures pointing down. I'll

bring you an update on that in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:30:00]

GIOKOS: Right. Three days of trade, final day of the week of trade, starting in New York. And what a week it's been. It's been very turbulent.

There's been a lot of risk on and risk off, and a lot of it has to do with what happened at the World Economic Forum in Davos.

A lot of talk from President Trump around Greenland, around policy, around tariffs, and that had market participants very spooked earlier in the week.

Then we saw a two-day rally, and it seems that the markets are taking a little bit of a breather today. You've got the DOW JONES down around a

third of a percent on the start of trade.

And of course, I'd like to delve into what's driving the markets, and we've got Rana Foroohar joining us to discuss some of that in just a moment. But

in the meantime, I want you to take a listen to some of the drama that we heard from the World Economic Forum in Davos. Listen in.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Certain places in Europe are not even recognizable, frankly, anymore, they're not recognizable. Without us, right now, you'd all be

speaking German and little Japanese, perhaps, until the last few days, when I told them about Iceland, they loved me. They called me daddy, right?

GOV. GAVIN NEWSOM (D-CA): I can't take this complicity. People rolling over, I should have brought a bunch of knee pads for all the world leaders.

No, the new Trump Signature Series knee pads. And they are available online. I told you the last one sold out.

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, PRESIDENT OF UKRAINE: Europe still remains in Greenland mode. Maybe someday someone will do something.

EMMANUEL MACRON, FRENCH PRESIDENT: Having a place like Europe, which sometimes is too slow for sure and is to be reformed for sure, but which is

predictable, loyal and when, where you know that the whole of the game is just the rule of law.

MARK CARNEY, CANADIAN PRIME MINISTER: The middle powers must act together, because if we're not at the table, we're on the menu. Let me be direct. We

are in the midst of a rupture, not a transition.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GIOKOS: All right, Rana Foroohar joining us now. Rana, I hope you heard some of that. I hope you had your popcorn out this entire week, because I

certainly did. I mean, it's a case of whiplash, but also pretty unbelievable comments, right? I would ask you, which is your favorite?

But it's no laughing matter, because it really moved the markets this week.

RANA FOROOHAR, CNN GLOBAL ECONOMIC ANALYST: Yeah, for sure. Well, I'll tell you what's my favorite. And that was Mark Carney's speech. I mean, the

Canadian Prime Minister is.

GIOKOS: Yeah.

FOROOHAR: He is the anti-Trump. You know, we always knew this. I mean, what a guy. It's interesting, because times like this in which you have a

disruptor like the U.S. President, they also present opportunity, opportunities for heroes, you know, for people to step into the fray.

And Carney really did that. I think his speech was incredibly powerful and important. And I think the most powerful thing about it was that he asked

everyone to be honest. Let's be honest about what the flaws in the global system were. You know, Trump himself is, in some ways, and I've long said

this, the wrong answer to the right questions.

You know, are there problems with drug cartels in Latin America. Yes, is overthrowing a leader in Venezuela and taking the country's oil the way to

deal with it. No. Are there, Arctic security concerns? Yes, is annexing Greenland the way to deal with it and blowing up NATO.

No, so there, and you know, Chinese mercantilism, I could go on. Carney said, look, we have to acknowledge the flaws in the old system, but we have

to move forward together in a new paradigm to solve them. And I think that, that was really setting the stage for a big global debate, not just over

the next year, but the next few years, maybe even the next few decades.

GIOKOS: Yeah, because he's talking about multilateralism, right?

FOROOHAR: Yeah.

GIOKOS: And what that ultimately means going for forward, if that exists in this world, and we know that the markets want a more interconnected,

integrated world. And when I look at what's happening, I mean, you've got the gold price, for example, really standing out, and that's a gage of

fear.

People of you know, flocking to gold as a sign that they worried about where fiat currencies are going, frankly. And I wonder whether you're

seeing de risking out of the United States or a de risking out of China and where it's all going to land.

FOROOHAR: Yeah, great question. Well, you're completely right, Eleni, that gold is a mark of where we are now.

[09:35:00]

And it's interesting, because you know, you heard in -- yes, a lot of people are hedging with gold, but not a lot of people are dumping dollars

yet. That said, there has been, this is true, since the beginning of the first Trump term, there has been a slow and steady diversification away

from dollar-based assets.

Every time the U.S. does a treasury auction, there are a fewer foreign buyer. That's normal. That's natural. I actually think that's healthy,

because, frankly, most of the growth is in the rest of the world. We have new powers. We have China playing a much bigger role on the world stage.

The question is, are people going to dump treasury bills? That's what you heard post Greenland. You heard some of the Nordic nations talking about

that. I don't think that's going to happen, but I do think that we're in a world where we're going to have a risk on, risk off environment for a long

time.

GIOKOS: Yeah. So, Rana, the other big thing, I mean, this also went viral, is frankly, the CEO of JP Morgan, Jamie Dimon, when he was asked the

question whether there's a reticence and a fear of corporate America to speak out and criticize President Trump.

And of course, right now, we're hearing about JP Morgan facing a $5 billion lawsuit for closing Trump's account. And here's the question, when the

private sector is feeling pressure from an administration. What are the consequences?

FOROOHAR: Yeah, well, I think one of the consequences is silence. The corporate world in America has been way too silent about the problems that

this administration has foisted on the U.S. and the world. They've just been silent. They've been hoping every single time that he pulls back, you

know, the TACO trade, that things are going to be OK.

I think Mark Carney to come back to his speech was right. This is not a transition. This is a rupture. The U.S. has changed, and CEOs need to be

more vocal. I like it when Jamie Dimon says, you know, let the president sue us. That's what courts are for. I like it when Ray Dalio says, you

know, we're in the 1930s this is a worrisome situation.

We haven't even talked about I.C.E. and what's happening in Minneapolis and some of the real concerns domestically, this is a disruptive period. And

CEOs should be speaking out about their own interests before it gets any worse. I think that they need to be a lot stronger and take a stand.

GIOKOS: Yeah, it's a moment in time. You know the way we started 2026, so let me ask you this. You know, people are looking at their investments

right now, asking where to park them their money. What is the best investment right now that could see you through the foreseeable future

without all this uncertainty.

FOROOHAR: Well, look, it's a moment to make sure you don't have a lot of debt on the balance sheet, because interest rates could change

dramatically. We don't know which direction things are going. It's a very uncertain time. It's a good moment to marshal your cash.

You know, I personally think that this very bifurcated trade of gold and, you know, S&P, with a certain amount of moving out of U.S. dollars and into

emerging markets and foreign assets, is a good one. I think diversification is where it's at. But it's not time to dump your stocks.

I mean, at the end of the day, unless you need this money immediately, you're going to want to be in the markets and we just have to ride it out

and strap in for some volatility.

GIOKOS: And markets actually have surprisingly done quite well. Thank you so much, Rana Foroohar great to have you on. Thank you so much.

FOROOHAR: Thank you.

GIOKOS: All right, I want to get you up to speed on some of the stories that are on our radar right now. Donald Trump says he's withdrawing his

invitation to Canada's Prime Minister to join his "Board of Peace". Canada had indicated it would join with conditions. The board originally meant to

oversee the reconstruction of Gaza was unveiled in Davos, Switzerland Thursday, with the chartered draft, which does not reference Gaza.

The U.S. says it has completed its withdrawal from the World Health Organization, the long-standing goal of President Trump. Officials say the

United States will continue to work with other countries on global health issues outside of the WHO framework. CNN has reached out to WHO officials

for comment.

And Egyptian students in the United Kingdom is facing deportation over involvement in pro Palestinian protests. King's College London suspended

Usama Ghanem and has revoked his visa sponsorship. The university, instructing him to return to his home country until it reviews his

suspension.

Ghanem fears he will be imprisoned when he returns to Egypt. Right, we're going to short break. I'll be back right after this.

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[09:40:00]

GIOKOS: Icons of the fashion world and the silver screen are in Rome for the funeral of late Fashion Designer Valentino Garavani. In attendance with

Elizabeth Hurley, Anna Wintour, Tom Ford and Anne Hathaway. Since Wednesday, Valentino has been lying in state at the Arts and Cultural

Center he opened in 2025.

His coffin was moved to a church designed by Michelangelo in the 16th century for today's service. Valentino Garavani was 93 years old. Amanda

Davies is up next with "World Sports". And I'll be back in 15 minutes with more news in the second hour of "Connect the World".

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[09:45:00]

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