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Erin Burnett Outfront
Market Rally; Cain's New Accuser; Syracuse Sex Abuse Scandal
Aired November 28, 2011 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ERIN BURNETT, HOST: Thanks, John. In Egypt, voters go to the polls today and an American college kid who was jailed in Cairo comes home. He's OUTFRONT tonight.
And late breaking news on Herman Cain's campaign, a woman claims she had a 13-year affair with him. Is this the end of Cain's candidacy and the latest on the economy something nice to say tonight.
Let's go OUTFRONT.
I'm Erin Burnett. OUTFRONT tonight, ratings agency Fitch affirms the United States AAA credit rating but says guess what, we're going to downgrade your outlook to negative from stable. This happened after the markets closed. Obviously, something negative and all related to the lack of action and the failure of the super committee, still stocks soared on Wall Street.
Well because the markets closed before that action happened. The Dow was up by nearly 300 points. The reason was a wow weekend for the American economy. Retail sales over Thanksgiving surged. That's a fair word. They were up 16 percent, according to the National Retail Federation. IBM says it was the best kickoff to the holiday shopping season ever.
Topping it off today the Federal Reserve said household debt in this country fell $60 billion. Now the OUTFRONT strike team called this optimism. Eighty-five percent of them said they were not going to go into recession when the pundits of America were sure of just that. Well, as you can see, they ended up being right. The question is, can this optimism really last?
Peter Kenny is a managing director at Knight Capital and he comes OUTFRONT tonight. Peter, what's your take of this market rally? Will it last, especially because after the markets closed, we got that hit from Fitch, the ratings agency, which yes, was expected, but is another reminder of the failure in Washington?
PETER KENNY, KNIGHT CAPITAL: Well it is about the failure in Washington, but the real story and the real reason why this fuse was lit this morning was for the very reason that you started off with by talking about the strength of the American consumer. I mean that really lit the fuse this morning. Markets took off right out of the gate, closed up 300, regained close to three percent or a little under three percent on the day.
Really taking back much of the weakness we've seen over the last three or four weeks. So markets are firm this -- were firm this morning and closed at the high of the day which is important. In other words, they didn't sell off midday. They closed off at the high of the day. The news on Fitch is not good, but I think it was largely expected and I do not think it's going to have a terrible down draft on the markets tomorrow.
BURNETT: All right, so do you think that this optimism can continue for the markets through the end of the year or is this going to sort of a whiplash thing that hits the pensions and 401(ks) of this country where you know we get a bad headline from Target saying oh guess what, people only want things on sale. They don't really have a lot of money to spend and the market goes down.
KENNY: OK, great question and it's really about profit and it's not so much about just aggregate numbers. So profit margins are important but aggregate numbers do play a role. So given the fact that volume has a lot to do with the shopping season and volume is being delivered by the American consumer, I think that we do have legs. Keep in mind, GDP is positive. Housing has largely stabilized. Unemployment has stabilized.
Consumer confidence has definitely been rising over the last two months or so. There's a lot of positive work going on within the economy, so I do think there's legs. I do think we could see more on this. We did open this morning at very, very oversold. So there is some -- still some buoyancy left in the market.
BURNETT: All right, Peter Kenny, thank you very much.
KENNY: Thank you.
BURNETT: Well optimism there and buoyancy may be there, but still one weekend does not a strong economy make. Far, far from it as so many in this country know. In Dallas today, the Federal Reserve Bank released a survey of businesses in the region and a plastics company said quote, "We wish we could receive some encouragement from the stalemate in Congress."
The truth is this. The super committee's failure is hurting the U.S. economy and its outlook and that means it could affect the president's chances for re-election. John Avlon senior columnist for "Newsweek" and "The Daily Beast" is with us. Leslie Sanchez, Republican strategist from Impacto Group (ph), and Paul Begala, a Democratic strategist and contributor. OK, good to have all of you with us.
John, let me start with you. A few good economic headlines and granted they come amidst an overall picture which is still very grim but you know they get the market to go up 300 points. They change sentiment. Headlines like this, good holiday, not great jobs creation, but some jobs creation enough to deliver him this election on a silver platter.
JOHN AVLON, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Not to deliver anyone on -- any things on a silver platter. This is not a silver platter election. But the trend is his friend and if you look at overall where we've been in political history before that's the important thing, the trend. When Reagan leading up to his 49 straight landslide in 1984 had 8.5 percent unemployment at this time, but he had eight percent GDP growth heading into next year. That's why it felt like morning in America. The fact that the economy seems to be stabilizing is a positive sign. That is a certain wind at President Obama's sails. But this is not over until it's over. This is going to be a squeaker.
BURNETT: All right, so now one thing that could help the president, nothing to do with the economy, today, this afternoon, on Wolf Blitzer, you saw it, a woman accusing Herman Cain of having a 13- year extramarital affair is now speaking out. Here is what she told Atlanta TV station WAGA about the affair and why she decided to speak out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GINGER WHITE, CLAIMS SHE HAD AFFAIR WITH HERMAN CAIN: He made it very intriguing. It was fun. It was something that took me away from my sort of hum drum life at the time. And it was exciting. I didn't want to do this, but it was something that I felt at the end of the day was the right thing to do. And is it going to hurt a lot of people? Yes. And I'm sure I will be one of them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: All right. So there she was and her background so you're aware in this piece to this investigative reporter, she talked about -- admitted she filed a sexual harassment claim in 2001, which of course, and there's a libel order right now on her, which of course, may not mean anything but it's background we wanted to share with you. Now Cain was on "THE SITUATION ROOM" earlier. He denied the affair and he also said this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HERMAN CAIN (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: As long as my wife is behind me and as long as my wife believes that I should stay in this race, I'm staying in this race.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: All right. Cain's lawyer later issued this statement. Quote, "This appears to be an accusation of private, alleged consensual contact between adults. Mr. Cain alerted his wife to this new accusation and discussed it with her. He has no obligation to discuss these types of accusations publicly with the media" -- Paul, true?
PAUL BEGALA, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Yes, in my opinion. Lin Wood is a respected attorney. If I were advising Mr. Cain, I would tell him to listen to his attorney. Mr. Wood says in the statement that you just read, right, basically none of your business. This is not an allegation of harassment. It's not an allegation of assault. It is an allegation of a consensual adult affair and Mr. Wood says that's none of your business. And you know what? I think he's got a good point. The problem is Mr. Cain didn't say that. He didn't stick to his lawyer's line. He said no, no, it's not true. It's not true and so now we are in that he said, she said. I have to say I think none of your business is a perfectly good answer for an allegation of an adult consensual relationship. But Mr. Cain has already deviated from that and I that's going to cause him political problems.
BURNETT: I mean Leslie he deviated from it because he actually came out with Wolf Blitzer on "THE SITUATION ROOM" and said, hey I know that this story is going to come out somewhere else and I want to come and you know break it to you first and give my side of it.
LESLIE SANCHEZ, IMPACTO GROUP: You're absolutely right. And it was a really -- Paul and I were talking about that. It was a very uncomfortable interview to watch because it was so personal --
BURNETT: Yes.
SANCHEZ: -- because he was trying to do that, but he was equivocating there. I think it was unfortunate that Wolf Blitzer had to be so direct about these questions because he wasn't direct in his response at the beginning of that, denying everything. And then he kind of eventually came to that. The point being I think many voters are going to look at this and say where there's smoke, there's fire.
This is going to cast additional doubt. And I think politically as Republicans are looking at who is best set to go into a general election it's seen as another distraction. It's something else that chips away at our viability in terms of winning the White House in 2012.
BURNETT: And of course extramarital affairs, John Avlon, you know personal, sure, some people may say they are. But they always come out and they do affect some voters, right? Newt Gingrich has been open about that he's had affairs. That's part of his public record now.
AVLON: That's right and given enough time he can transcend them, but here's the problem. This just isn't smoke in a fire. This is a forest fire. And this is a sad side show at this point because Herman Cain was already going down in the polls. This isn't going to help him with anybody. His numbers are going to continue to implode among women and evangelicals in particular who were some of his basic support early on. So this is actually sort of sad. This isn't an allegation of harassment. This is deeply personal and --
BURNETT: Yes.
AVLON: -- (INAUDIBLE) family.
BURNETT: OK. I want to get each of your views on this. Seventeen percent was his latest rating in the CNN national poll. Where does his support go, John?
AVLON: Going down. It's going down -- BURNETT: Who is going to get it? Is it going to go to --
(CROSSTALK)
AVLON: Gingrich has the momentum to be the conservative alternative for Mitt Romney. Anything that pushes Cain down probably goes to Newt Gingrich --
BURNETT: Leslie?
SANCHEZ: Absolutely and I think what you're going to see is the rise -- you're already seeing it -- of evangelicals who are moving over to Gingrich.
BURNETT: And Paul I would imagine that is something that well Barack Obama likes too, have a go at Gingrich, not Mitt.
BEGALA: Well, yes. I would think so. I don't talk to the president about these things or about anything for that matter, but yes, I mean the president -- I mean the Democrats want the most extreme candidate to be nominated.
BURNETT: Yes.
BEGALA: And you know, I actually think other people could benefit from this could be Congresswoman Bachmann who don't forget is from Iowa originally and I still think can light up social conservatives and Rick Santorum who is the only person in the race so far who hasn't gotten a bump besides Jon Huntsman --
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: -- waiting for his turn. Everybody --
(CROSSTALK)
SANCHEZ: No, I think -- you know, the truth be told, I think -- you know we like especially for these high level kind of candidates (INAUDIBLE) people like to narrow it down to one and two choices. That's what this invisible primary is supposed to do and you're seeing that. I think we've pretty much run the course in this set. You're seeing it's really gravitating toward Romney and Gingrich and that's where a lot of the battle is going to be right now.
BURNETT: There could be that, you know independent dark horse galloping like a knight in shining armor.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)
BURNETT: Who is going to be the knight in shining armor? All right, thanks so much to all three. Appreciate it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you.
BURNETT: All right. Up next, the latest details from the Syracuse abuse scandal. The wife of the assistant coach accused of molestation claims that incriminating tapes were tampered with. And then Barney Frank, his days in Congress are numbered. What are we going to do without being able to spar with Barney Frank on television?
All right and an ally America dislikes but can't seem to live without. A NATO strike accidentally kills 24 Pakistani soldiers. The country's prime minister fighting back against the U.S.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: The number tonight, 16. That's how many terms Representative Barney Frank has served. Now earlier today, the 71- year-old from Massachusetts announced he won't seek another term. He's retiring in part because his district was recently changed to include more conservative areas. Frank is the top Democrat on the powerful House Financial Services Committee. But unlike many former congressmen, he says he's not going to become a lobbyist.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. BARNEY FRANK (D), MASSACHUSETTS: I would be a lobbyist. Look, I will miss this job and I have (INAUDIBLE) of regret when the new Congress is signed up. But I will tell you this and you know maybe you're going to laugh, but one of the advantages to me of not running for office is I don't even have to pretend to try to be nice to people I don't like. Now, some of you may not think I've been good at it, but I've been trying.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: That's what we like about Barney Frank, just that curmudgeonly no BS sort of attitude. I think everyone is going to miss him and I have to say from experience as he did financial reform even people who absolutely detested what he was doing really respected his acumen and his ability.
Well there are a couple more (ph) 16's about Mr. Frank. He's tied for 16th in the length of time served among current House members and that is actually the number of people on our staff who were not born when he took office in 1981. That's frightening.
OK. Let's bring in Keith Ablow, one of the leading forensic psychiatrists in the field. He's OUTFRONT tonight to help us get a better understanding of the case in Syracuse. Keith thanks for being with us. Appreciate it.
KEITH ABLOW, FORENSIC PSYCHIATRIST: Yes, Erin, anytime.
BURNETT: And let me just ask you, obviously the background here is that there was a conversation that was taped between Bernie Fine, who is the man who was accused of molesting now potentially three young boys. There was a conversation between his wife and the first of those boys, now nearly a 40-year-old man, which I believe we have the sound bite don't we, Andrew? OK. Here it is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) FINE: You know what? Go to a place where there's gay boys. Find yourself a gay boy, you know, you know get your rocks off, have it be over with.
DAVIS: Yes, but --
FINE: You know, he needs a -- that male companionship that I can't give him nor is he interested in me and me vice versa.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: All right. So what do you make of this, Keith?
ABLOW: Well I know that Laurie Fine, his wife is you know maintaining that this tape has been doctored. If it hasn't been, then what you have is rare insight into just how toxic child sexual abuse can be and how people who look quite normal can be engaged in it. Here's a woman with her head in the sand if things are what they seem to be, literally allowing her husband to continue sexually abusing a boy.
Why? I don't know. Did she like the money from his basketball salary? I don't know. But the bottom line is it's going to be very tough to argue, hey those aren't my words and I didn't mean what I said. A lot of doctoring would have to go on, on that tape.
BURNETT: Yes. I mean it is pretty amazing. Keith, let me just pause here for a second and bring in Ed Lavandera who is in Syracuse tonight just to get the latest from what you understand, Ed, and what is your understanding of the situation here with the tapes? Which I also want to add are tapes that go back to I believe 2003. At that time they were given over to ESPN, the network looked into them and didn't find enough to corroborate them and actually put it on the air, report it at the time, right, Ed?
ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that was what they've been saying. Also the local newspaper here in Syracuse as well saying that they had that. We've reached out to the Syracuse Police Department who said that there had been very -- it's kind of even hard to say. They say that there was no investigation into this case, that the initial accuser, Bobby Davis, had called them and said that he had kind of inquired as to whether or not charges could be filed against Bernie Fine. It was kind of left at that. Syracuse police say that they were not made aware of these phone recordings, as well.
BURNETT: So, what is your understanding here about you know, the relationship between Laurie Fine and Bobby Davis, who of course is the man here allegedly who was both abused by Bernie Fine and then in a bizarre and very unpalatable twist also apparently when he turned 18 had an affair with Bernie Fine's wife Laurie?
LAVANDERA: Well you know, outside of just the tone of the way Laurie Fine (ph) was speaking with Bobby Davis kind of went very much against the grain of you know the little bit of a glimpse that we've gotten of Laurie Fine here in the last couple of weeks. So her demeanor on these phone calls if they haven't been doctored is very different from anything that I expected to hear, to be quite honestly. But in the course of those tapes and the ESPN report as well, does make and Bobby Davis mentioned as well that he did have a sexual relationship with Bernie Fine's wife. Clearly the relationship in Laurie Fine's words, the relationship between her and her husband seemed very strained at best.
BURNETT: Yes. I mean, Keith, let me ask you. This situation seems to be just utterly bizarre, right? A man accused of abuse and pretty much everyone who knew him, several of whom talked to this show and other shows thought it was shocking. Now it comes out that not only is there tape between his wife and the -- and you know accuser but that the wife may have also had an affair with the accuser. Is this just utterly bizarre or do these sort of twisted things not as uncommon as we all might hope?
ABLOW: You know I wish Erin that they were completely uncommon, a husband and wife potentially abusing the same person even though I know he supposedly turned 18, rare, of course. But I can tell you, I've got an office in Massachusetts north of Boston. I've had several people in their 30's and 40's and 50's come to me and reach out to past abusers and get corroboration and a check that yes it happened and they've buried this for many, many years. So if that's my one office, Erin, imagine the whole country. This is rampant and so it's not an exception in that regard.
BURNETT: And Keith, how in your experience, as you talk about your office, is it possible or how common is it for a spouse to not know their significant other has these types of tendencies? Obviously in this case, Laurie Fine is saying that she was well aware, but in general how often are spouses not aware?
ABLOW: Well psychologically, it's very often the case that the women who marry these guys want to keep their heads in the sand. They're in denial to start with. That's why they picked someone they didn't know at all. Very often the roots for that level of denial go back to their own childhoods, their own life experiences. So by nature, they keep their heads in the sand. If you listen to that tape, by the way, you'll hear something very disturbing in Laurie Fine's tone when she asks him, whether there was oral sex involved. There's a voyeuristic quality as though she's enjoying hearing the story. That's tremendously disturbing.
BURNETT: I think that's a good word to use to describe it. Keith, you're also the author of a new book "Inside the Mind of Casey Anthony: A Psychological Portrait". As you look at these sorts of situations, I just wanted to ask you your view on everything you've learned now about Casey Anthony. Do you think that she was abused? What kind of conclusions did you come to?
ABLOW: Well, when we talk about families where parents have their heads in the sand or one spouse does, Casey Anthony grew up in a house where her parents utterly denied her existence. All of her pathology went unaddressed. Her mom didn't even know she was seven months pregnant. She delivered her baby in an obstetrical suite with her father at the foot of the bed looking at her. Why, because she didn't even exist as a human being. So when people say how could it be that she let her daughter go missing without reporting it, well guess what, Casey Anthony had gone missing a long time before that, and her tattoo that she got saying beautiful life, that wasn't for her winning hot body contest. That's saying good-bye to her daughter who had a short beautiful life she would say without the abuse she suffered.
BURNETT: All right. Well thank you very much, Keith. We appreciate it and of course also to our own Ed Lavandera up in Syracuse.
ABLOW: All right, Erin. Take care.
BURNETT: All right. Well coming up, an American college student released from an Egyptian jail comes OUTFRONT and we lighten up with a story we can't resist.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: And now a story we can't resist. With Thanksgiving behind us, oh, we can finally focus on Christmas, my favorite time of the year. And for a lot of people, that means decorating the outside of the house. So every year there are amazing displays out front of the homes in this country. And when we asked our Facebook followers about their favorites, we got a lot of great submissions, lots of them.
But the craziest most over the top display we've seen is the Oakdale Street display in St. Petersburg, Florida. Now produced by the same family since 1977, it covers almost an acre, half an acre and includes an 18-train railroad, a tight rope walking bear, 70-foot Christmas tree, and 600,000 lights. Just how big is it? Well, the Christmas tree display at Rockefeller Center in New York City has a tree roughly the same height, but uses just 30,000 lights.
Now the display in Florida is also a lot bigger than the largest one in the other St. Petersburg, St. Petersburg, Russia, which has a lot less Christmas lights and if their accident reports are any indication, a lot fewer traffic lights, as well. Now, that St. Petersburg is home to arguably the most dangerous intersection in the world. Don't believe us. Well check it out.
We found some video of crashes caught by traffic cameras at the Prospect Slavic (ph) intersection. Not as amazing (INAUDIBLE) Florida, but we've tried to make it just as festive.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(MUSIC)
(RUSSIAN THRU THE INTERSECTION)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Gosh, did a person just come flying out of that car? All right, well, maybe the ice and snow contribute there. We just couldn't resist.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Still OUTFRONT, the "OutFront 5": Released.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I thought that there was a good chance that they might kill us perhaps that night.
BURNETT: Drones watching you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Big brother is arriving in the form of surveillance drones.
BURNETT: Who's really smarter?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well it's like the terminator, it just keeps coming.
BURNETT: All this OUTFRONT in our second half.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: We start the second half of our show with stories we care about where we do our own reporting, make the calls and find the OUTFRONT 5.
Up first tonight, the stock market had a very strong finish, up nearly 300 points, 291 to be exact. One of the reasons: strong Internet sales this Monday. It's called Cyber Monday. IBM also predicted Cyber Monday sales would be up 30 percent.
We got this statement from the center of it all, our strike member, eBay CEO John Donohue. He said, quote, "The thing that stands out about this holiday season is how consumers are using their mobile phones to shop. Consumers now feel like they have a mall in their pocket." Those smart phones have done it. We'll watch those cyber sales.
Number two: U.S. Internet users watched 42.6 billion online videos in October. It's big and it is a new record. One hundred and eighty-four million users watched videos, with the average person watching 21.18 hours of content during the month. That's actually kind of disturbing.
We looked through the new comScore data. Google sites rank number one. That's primarily because of YouTube. Facebook came in second with 59.8 million viewers.
And number three: new home sales climbed 1.3 percent last month, up 9 percent from last year. The Census Bureau report released today found roughly 160,000 new homes on the market at the end of October.
Now, we spoke to a lot of analysts. They tell OUTFRONT that despite the increase in sales, most indicators which includes mortgage applications and housing permits really show only a modest improvement in the housing market. Obviously, without an improvement there, the economy is still in the doldrums.
Number four: new satellite images show extensive damage to an Iranian military compound which blew up earlier this month. Analysis of the images, which you see here, appear to show that buildings were destroyed and that there was a lot of debris. Senior defense officials told our Barbara Starr earlier that the U.S. believes the Iranians were missing volatile fuel for a ballistic missile when the explosion happened. Seventeen people were reportedly killed in the blast.
Well, it has been 115 days since the U.S. lost its top credit rating. What are we doing to get it back? Right now, it looks like we're doing enough for Fitch to maintain its AAA rating, but the outlook was revised to negative, which means we are far from in the clear. There's a better than 50 percent chance Fitch will downgrade the United States.
In the next two years, they say $1 in $5 of American tax dollars will be going to pay the interest on our debt alone by 2020.
Well, Egyptians took to the polls today in the first parliamentary since the Democratic uprising which ended the 30-year dictatorship of Hosni Mubarak in February. With the promise of democracy at hand, peaceful crowds are gathering tonight in Cairo's Tahrir Square. You're looking at live pictures there.
It's a far cry from the violent protests against Egypt's interim military rulers that you saw last week, ahead of the elections. Caught up in that were three American students, 19-year-old Derrik Sweeney and Gregory Porter, and 21-year-old Luke Gates.
Now, the three were arrested on the rooftop of an American University building accused of throwing fire bombs and Molotov cocktails at security forces that were dealing with violent protesters in the streets below.
Last Wednesday, the students were unexpectedly set free.
And with us tonight, one of them, Derrik Sweeney. He joins us along with his mother Joy, which regular viewers recognized. She was on the show last night.
Derek, while you were -- at that point, she didn't know where you were. She just talked to you one time before she came on the show.
They're joining us from Jefferson City, Missouri, tonight.
Great to have you both with us.
Derrik, let me start with you --
DERRIK SWEENEY, U.S. STUDENT ARRESTED IN CAIRO: Hi.
JOY SWEENEY, DERRIK'S MOTHER: Hi.
BURNETT: -- and tell us what happened. D. SWEENEY: Yes. Well, we were actually never on a rooftop. And we certainly never handled or were involved with these fire bombs as they say. We came to the protests that night around 11:00 p.m. hoping to see democracy being born, hoping to adhere ideas of liberty and freedom and hoping to partake in the spirit of revolution, certainly. And we were in the square itself, and it was quite peaceful. And it was really exciting.
But then around midnight, we got a call from an Egyptian friend and he invited us to come onto the side streets where I knew that it got more violent to some degree, though I didn't quite know the full extent of it. We decided to go with him. And we ended up on a street next to the building for the ministry of the interior, and where there was an especially large and dense gathering of protests, and police shot something into the crowd.
And shortly after that, we ran away and some folks offered to take us to safety. And that's when they actually started hitting us and arrested us.
BURNETT: All right. So, you're saying totally it wasn't -- you know, some had said maybe you guys just, you know, you were idealistic, but you got swept up in the moment. And you're saying, no, you didn't. None of these allegations were true at all.
D. SWEENEY: No, not at all. I would say -- I would say I was quite passionate about the protests but quite passionate in a peaceful manner.
BURNETT: So, Joy, where were you when you heard he was going to be released? I know when you and I spoke last, you were unsure when you would hear.
J. SWEENEY: Yes, it was actually about 6:00 a.m. on Thanksgiving day that I heard, 6:00 a.m. local time, that I was -- it was confirmed to me that he would be released. So it was a tremendous gift from God and the universe of love for Thanksgiving Day. So we had much to be grateful for.
BURNETT: Derrik, everyone is talking about what it's like in Egypt right now. Whether there's a rule of law or not. So, in the two nights that you spent, what happened? How were you treated?
D. SWEENEY: Well, the first night was horrible really. We spent about seven hours on the ground, in the dark, in the fetal position with our heads to the floor, our shirts over our head covering our eyes and there were guys behind us, Egyptian policemen with guns telling us that if we moved, we would be shot. If we spoke, we would be shot.
So, there's certainly the idea of death at least crossed my mind in that period. But after that, we were in -- we were in sort of the more formal legal process and we were in prisons and jails, though the treatment was improved.
BURNETT: All right. Quickly before we go, in a word, Derrik, do you still believe would you go back?
D. SWEENEY: Yes, one day I hope to go back. Though I think it may take awhile.
BURNETT: All right. Well, I'm glad for the optimism and happy for both of you on that reunion. Thanks so much. Good to talk to you again, Joy.
D. SWEENEY: Thank you.
BURNETT: And to see you, Derrik.
J. SWEENEY: Great to be here.
D. SWEENEY: Many thanks.
BURNETT: It's a police force dream. Drones used by the military to track down terrorists are shrunken to fit in the trunk of a car, yet able to soar across America's skies to track down criminals. Drones like the remote controlled Qube with a Q, which is currently being tested by engineers with AeroVironment in southern California.
It all sounds well and good and until the same kind of drone flies over your backyard, and falls into the hands of the very criminals or terrorists law enforcement wants to track. The FAA still has some technical issues to hammer out with the drones. But it plans to propose new rules for their use in January.
But, obviously, this raises serious questions about drones, about privacy in America, about what the government can look at when you don't know they're looking.
Paul Callan joins us now to talk about this issue, contributor here at CNN.
All right. This is an interesting issue because we've been talking a lot about this lately with the rise in homegrown terrorism and we will use drones overseas to look for these people. We're not allowed to use them in the United States.
What do you think?
PAUL CALLAN, CNN LEGAL CONTRIBUTOR: It's a fascinating issue and grows out of the military's development of this technology to track terrorists and very effectively fight terrorists overseas. But, now, of course, they're selling the drones to commercial enterprises and local police forces. And literally, a local police force, might have the ability to have one of these small helicopters come right down outside your window and look through the window taking photographs of a suspected crime scene.
The question is, is that a violation of the Fourth Amendment to the Constitution, which protects us from unreasonable searches? And is it an invasion of privacy?
BURNETT: But isn't it -- OK, first of all, what do you think about that? But, secondly, isn't it just a matter of time, and maybe I'm cynical, it would seem if we have the technology and the fear that people are doing bad things, someone's going to do it, they're going to look.
CALLAN: Well, they're going to look. But should the police be looking into your window?
Traditionally in the United States, we've had a doctrine if you have an expectation of privacy and it's a reasonable expectation, then the government can't do a search unless they get a search warrant from a judge.
And that goes back to a case when they put a listening device on a public telephone booth. And the court there said: you know something? Even though it's in public, you when you go into the booth you think it's private.
And out of that has grown all of this law in this area that's not kept up with the technology at all.
BURNETT: So what do you think is going to happen here? You have to get the permit I guess to do it?
CALLAN: I think what's going to happen ultimately is the government's going to need a search warrant for certain kinds of searches. And that is if the helicopter can literally cross your land line and look in your window, you would have an expectation of privacy here. You got to go to a judge and get a warrant for that. I think on the other hand, if the drone is just flying overhead, much like a commercial airplane, then tough. They're going to be able to take a picture.
BURNETT: Well, look, Google -- here's my thing, Google is doing it every day, right? You can look at someone's house. I remember sitting with my former co-anchor Mark Haines and he went and looked at this one day, he could see his car parked in the driveway. They're doing it.
CALLAN: They are.
BURNETT: So, then why can't --
CALLAN: Why can't the police do it? Well, I think the difference is, at least with Google, that's a satellite shot. We know maybe the roof is fair game, maybe even the yard is fair game.
But they can't look at your window yet, you know? So, I think the courts are going to be somewhat restrictive about this. Otherwise, we're going to have no privacy at all.
I mean, eventually, you're going to have technology where you can look through walls with infrared. You can listen. But government needs laws in this area if we're going to having any privacy or if our lives will be open to public view -- as, by the way, the younger generation seems to say OK.
BURNETT: Right. It's a sea change of who we pursued the whole term.
CALLAN: I mean, they're putting it all up on Facebook as it is, so why not take a picture of it, too. But, frankly, I don't agree with it. I think the Fourth Amendment is there for a reason. So, I vote for get a judge if you're going to look at my house, the inside of it anyway.
BURNETT: All right. Well, Paul Callan, thank you very much.
And viewers, let us know on our Facebook page, interesting issue on privacy. But what do you think the government should be allowed to fly drones over America and look wherever they want to look, if that means they could thwart a terrorist attack. Is it OK if they look in your bedroom?
All right. Let's check in with Anderson Cooper with a look what's coming up on "A.C. 360."
Hey, Anderson.
ANDERSON COOPER, HOST, CNN'S "A.C. 360": Hey, Erin. A lot happening tonight on the program. The story you touched on, allegations of a 13-year affair rocking the campaign of Republican presidential candidate Herman Cain.
The woman's name is Ginger White. She says the affair ended only eight months ago when Cain declared his candidacy. White also said she didn't want to come out with this. We'll tell you why she says she did.
You'll also hear from Cain himself who denied the affair, calling the woman an acquaintance.
Our political panel ahead on whether Cain's campaign can survive the latest accusation.
Keeping them honest tonight. Who knew what and when in the sexual abuse allegations swirling around now fired Syracuse' assistant basketball coach Bernie Fine. Our Gary Tuchman is in Syracuse, and spoke with the coach's wife about the taped conversation between her and one of the alleged victims that was released this week. A conversation where she seems to admit she knew what her husband was allegedly doing to underage boys.
Those stories and tonight's "Ridiculist" at the top of the hour, Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much. Looking forward to it, Anderson.
And coming up in the "Outer Circle": the prime minister of Pakistan reassessing its relationship, troubled relationship with the U.S. Why? A NATO helicopter killed 24 Pakistani soldiers.
An update on baby Sky. She disappeared three weeks ago. Where is she? (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: We do this nearly the same time every night. Our "Outer Circle" where we reach out to our sources around the world.
And tonight, we start in Russia -- no, we start in Pakistan where the prime minister says his country is reassessing its relationship with the United States. This comes just a couple days after a NATO helicopter strike killed 248 Pakistani soldiers.
Here's what Prime Minister Gilani told CNN's Reza Sayah.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
YOUSUF RAZA GILANI, PAKISTANI PRIME MINISTER: Business as usual will not be there. Therefore, we have to have something bigger so that to satisfy my nation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Reza Sayah who did that interview is in Islamabad.
Reza, what does this whole situation mean for the U.S.?
REZA SAYAH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Erin, that has a lot do with what the investigation shows by U.S. Central Command. There are some still questions whether these U.S. and NATO forces drew fire first. But if indeed U.S. forces made a mistake here, look for Washington to go into diplomacy overdrive. That means for the time being, less criticism of Pakistan, less tough talk, all in an effort to win back some goodwill and do some damage control -- Erin.
BURNETT: Reza, thank you very much. It's going to be interesting considering the U.S. obviously put quite a bit of its military into Pakistan on hold.
And now to Russia where Vladimir Putin formally accepted his party's presidential nomination for the 2012 elections.
Matthew Chance is covering the story from London.
Matthew, are Russians happy about President Putin's third presidential run? Obviously, he's currently the prime minister.
MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Erin, in general, I think they are. But we have seen indications that there's a growing sense of unease with Vladimir Putin returning to the Kremlin. Recent opinion polls suggest his ruling party may not win the overwhelming majority it usually enjoys.
And earlier this month, Putin was actually heckled by a crowd, which is unprecedented for a man who's often hero worshipped by the Russian public -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Matthew. Well, it's been three weeks since 28-year-old Sky Metalwala disappeared in Bellevue, Washington. And so far, investigators have not come up with a solid lead.
According to his mother, Julia Biryukova, she ran out of gas and left 2-year-old Sky alone in the car as she walked for help. Police have since questioned the mother's story after determining the car was not out of gas and was working fine.
Police have also questioned Biryukova's link to a Web site which helps women searching for, quote, "sugar daddies." She has estranged from her husband, Solomon Metalwala, for more than a year. And the two were in the midst of a better custody battle. But it doesn't have anything to do with their son's disappearance.
Solomon Metalwala is OUTFRONT tonight with his attorney, Clay Terry.
Appreciate both of you being with us.
And, Solomon, let me start with you. What do you think happened to your son Sky?
SOLOMON METALWALA, FATHER OF MISSING 2-YEAR-OLD BOY, SKY: e can just take a guess what happened with Sky. The police and FBI are working on the case night and day. All we know right now is that Sky is missing and we need to find him.
BURNETT: And do you have any idea as to where he might be at this time or who might have been responsible? Do you think it was your estranged wife?
METALWALA: Like I said, you know, the police and the FBI are working on it day and night, and I have great trust in what they're doing. I've been to their command center, and they are doing everything possible to get Sky back.
BURNETT: All right. Let me ask you, there were reports of ransom note that turned out to not be true. Are you hearing anything about a possible suspect at this point?
CLAY TERRY, ATTORNEY FOR SOLOMON METALWALA: No. We pretty much suspect that the mother has more information to tell us than she's actually telling.
The ransom note was bogus. Somebody sent it and asked for, I think it was $25,000 for the return of Sky, but it was a bogus note. It was too bad people are enjoying the tragedy of this family.
BURNETT: Solomon, when was the last time you spoke to your wife? I'm under the impression you haven't seen your kids in more than a year. What kind of custody deal are you trying to get here?
METALWALA: What kind of custody I'm trying to get here?
BURNETT: Yes. METALWALA: Was that your question?
BURNETT: Yes, sir.
METALWALA: A hundred percent custody.
BURNETT: One hundred percent?
METALWALA: Right, for both my children.
BURNETT: And why do you think you were denied it the first time?
METALWALA: It was all of Julia's lies in court. That's what was so difficult to -- I mean, the truth is always right there, but it's all fouled up by so much false.
BURNETT: All right. Well, thank you very much, Solomon Metalwala, the father of Sky. We certainly hope he is found and found OK.
And, Clay Terry, thanks very much -- Solomon's attorney.
TERRY: Thank you, Erin.
BURNETT: Well, coming up, machines could be smarter than humans? Uh-uh, uh-uh. That's what the teleprompter says. And you know what we say to that? Hmm.
Jeffrey Kluger comes OUTFRONT with the truth, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BURNETT: Computers versus brains. So, who is winning? Well, when it comes to storage and processing speed, OK, the computer. But that's not everything.
The case, Fujitsu's latest computing wonders four times faster and holds 10 times more data than the human brain. But pound for pound and watt for watt, is the brain still more efficient?
We're joined by "TIME" magazine's senior editor, Jeffrey Kluger.
And, Jeffrey, what's interesting about this, there are so many things. But just use of the word "watts," that literally our brain has wattage power equivalent to turning on light bulbs on.
JEFFREY KLUGER, SCIENCE EDITOR, TIME MAGAZINE: That's right. And we don't think of ourselves as electrical machine. We think of ourselves as gooey masses of living stuff, but we do run by electricity. A computer, the Fujitsu K, for example, requires 9.9 million watts to operate, which could run 10,000 homes. Our brains require 20 watts, which is all it takes to run a refrigerator bulb. So, we're a teeny bit more efficient than the Fujitsu K.
BURNETT: More efficient, but like, I mean, you know, human brain, refrigerator doesn't sound quite so -- quite so inspiring which gets me to the crux of the issue, and that is who is smarter, the computer or the human brain? I mean, both in terms of -- it's interesting, I like the words here -- bites and mega flops.
KLUGER: And mega flops, absolutely.
BURNETT: But -- so what's the answer to the question?
KLUGER: Well, here's the thing. I mean, you look at the way Watson, the computer that won --
BURNETT: He won "Jeopardy," yes. He, like we personify that.
KLUGER: We always anthropomorphize, he's capable of moving 500 million bytes in one second or a million books worth of data in one second.
BURNETT: A million books in a second.
KLUGER: In a second. But that's steam shoveling. He's just going through enormous quantities of stuff, pulverizing it down and looking for the data bit. Human beings go to the key data. We do it through intuition, we do it through nimbleness, we do it through our ability to learn, to draw information from multiple senses and get there the same -- in a much different way from the way the computer does with much smaller processing capacity.
BURNETT: OK. But when you look at this over time and I know you've been looking at interesting studies "Scientific American" -- is it going to continue to stay this way? Because we're seeing this push towards, right, smart cars that can park themselves and ways to avoid getting in accidents, or robots that can really take over for human beings.
KLUGER: Well, in certain areas, they're more efficient. But remember, they are more efficient in the areas of the jobs we don't necessarily want to do. Think about a computer diagnostician versus a doctor, for example.
BURNETT: Yes.
KLUGER: If you give a computer a series of symptoms, the computer will go through all of the hundreds or thousands of diseases that could come up with these symptoms and come up with your diagnosis. A doctor will look at you, he or she will intuit things, get a sense of how you look, of how you're describing your symptoms. They can tell the difference between sharp pain or cutting pain. They're two very different things.
BURNETT: Which is really important and I would imagine in most cases good. But in others --
KLUGER: Yes.
BURNETT: -- that esoteric case that really, the human brain misses. OK. But now, the real question -- and this is the "who is smarter question". OK. So, let's do it. Who is smarter, the iPad or the human?
KLUGER: The human is smarter than the iPad at many, many levels. And, look, I think Siri on the iPhone is terrific, but you don't get past the third question with her before you realize --
BURNETT: Anderson was wondering iPad 1 or 2. Does it matter? We're smarter than them?
KLUGER: I think the iPad 2 got, you know, advanced placement.
BURNETT: Cats are smarter than iPads, too.
KLUGER: Cats are smarter than iPads, too. Their brains work a lot faster, a lot more nimbly. But the things they know how to do are different from what an iPad know.
BURNETT: Then, quickly, the final and most important question, cat versus dog?
KLUGER: Cat versus dog, that is a fight I would not want to get in the middle of. I would say a dog, but 50 percent of the people in the world would say a cat. And I would say I'm agnostic.
BURNETT: All right. Well, on that note, thanks so much. Appreciate it.
KLUGER: Thank you so much.
BURNETT: "A.C. 360" starts now.
