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Erin Burnett Outfront
Police Shoot Armed Man at U.S. Capitol; New Video Where Attackers Lived, Allegedly Made Bombs; FBI Cracks Terrorist's iPhone Without Apple's Help; Trump, Cruz War Over Wives Escalates; Sanders' Uphill Path to Nomination; Fidel Castro to Obama: "We Don't Need the Empire". Aired 7-8p ET
Aired March 28, 2016 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[19:00:12] ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR: OUTFRONT next, breaking news. Shots fired at the U.S. Capitol. The Capitol building. The White House locked down. We're live with the latest.
And an exclusive interview with Ted Cruz who issues a new challenge to Donald Trump tonight OUTFRONT. And Bernie Sanders hat trick after three big wins this weekend, could his momentum carry him to the nomination?
Let's go OUTFRONT.
Good evening, I'm Erin Burnett. OUTFRONT tonight, the breaking news. Chaos at the capital. Gunfire, breaking out at the U.S. capitol this afternoon. A man setting off metal detectors at the entrance pulling a gun, then shot by a capitol policeman. All of it taking place in an area crowded with tourists and students on Spring break. The suspect we are now learning is identified as Larry Russell Dawson. He was rushed to the nearby hospital for surgery, still alive. A female bystander injured, struck by shrapnel. A jittery nation in the wake of the terror attacks in Brussels. The capitol and the White House both on lockdown.
Brian Todd is OUTFRONT tonight at the U.S. Capitol. And Brian, what more can you tell us about the shooting? The video from inside show true chaos.
BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It really was chaos, Erin, when this happened. What we can show you right now is the latest in the investigation and a visual here. This pickup truck behind me, this silver Dodge Ram 1500 silver pickup truck with Tennessee license plates, has been confirmed by law enforcement as the suspect's vehicle. It is surrounded now by law enforcement vehicles and personnel. We're told it has not been searched yet. They may be waiting for a warrant to search it. What we can tell you Erin according to law enforcement sources and the Capitol Hill police at a news conference not too long ago where is that the suspect at about 2:45 p.m. Eastern Time went through a metal detector at the capital visitors center.
He then, according to police, drew a weapon. At that point, police officers shot him and wounded him. A female bystander was wounded by shrapnel. Both of them have been treated. The suspect Larry Russell Dawson was taken away to a hospital. It is unclear tonight what his condition is, but he has been treated for his wounds. Now, according to these court documents that we've obtained and looked through, in October of last year, Larry Russell Dawson was picked up for disrupting a session in the House of Representatives. He said that he was a prophet of God and started to yell and was subdued by law enforcement.
These documents indicate that he was told that he should come and turn himself in, that they wanted to speak to him, and that he was restricted from going certain places inside the House Chamber. He wrote a letter back to them, which we have among these documents, saying he was not going to go talk to them and he was not going to comply with their orders. So, he was known to law enforcement, Erin. Larry Russell Dawson according to law enforcement forces is the suspects' name. He is not been publicly identified by law enforcement yet. But a law enforcement telling us that is his name. Court document identify him as a 66-year-old man from Tennessee.
Now, what's not clear tonight, Erin, is what kind of weapon he drew, whether this was an actual firearm, whether it was loaded or not. We don't have that information yet. Still working to get that -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Brian Todd.
Of course, a nation on edge after the terror attacks in Belgium. Of course, ISIS promising that more are to come. And we have breaking news there tonight just coming in about the apartment where the Brussels suicide bombers allegedly built those bombs. A source telling CNN that they actually thought something suspicious was taking place in that apartment. And it comes as we have new video tonight of one of the most wanted men in the world right now. That is the man dressed in white. He has been on the run ever since reeling what could have been a deadly bomb into that packed Brussels airport.
Nick Paton Walsh is OUTFRONT tonight.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's the apartment at the heart of the Brussels attacks, where the Bakraoui brothers Ibrahim and Khalid lived and made the bombs that tore through the metro and airport. This video shut Monday shows -- lifted but a source with knowledge of the brothers' lives there has revealed to CNN the remarkable instant just ten days ahead of the blasts. He explained to CNN that as this exclusive video shows police have sealed off both the top floor where the brothers lived and the one below it. Why? Because the brothers spilled so many chemicals ten days before the blasts when preparing their bombs it leaked through the top floor into the apartment below.
(on camera): The fact that chemicals could have leaked between entire floors in that building betrays really how careless the brothers must have been with the liquids they used to build those bombs, but also how many signs there were to the outside world that something was amiss. (voice-over): One man who regularly met the brothers there and
doesn't want to be identified for his own safety told CNN they were kind men and only had two beds and a refrigerator in the apartment.
(SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)
[19:05:03] Each time they went up with things in their hands, suitcases, things like that, he said. When you saw their face, you have no idea they were terrorists they looked good people. I just saw one visitor just one time. The man he recognized is airport bomber and ISIS bomb maker Najim Laachraoui. His expertise would have been vital to the brothers in preparing the bombs. He also explained that the brothers kept their working clothes and overalls in the basement of the building. Another mysterious window into what the brothers did there with such impunity for so long.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WALSH: Erin, you saw yourself here the staggering number of clues that seemed to be missed by Belgian authorities. Well, the one single potential moment of hope for the people of Belgium that they thought they'd caught the guy in the white, a man who was believed potentially to have been called Faycal C., well, that fell apart today. Because Belgian authorities, they didn't have enough evidence to continue holding him and released him effectively, he's innocent. He is free to go.
An enormous blunder people had. Had some sense of -- that is now vanished. U.S. officials believe they have a list of names who this man could be. Nothing conclusive to point out to he is, and it just adds to the staggering list of glaring clues that have been missed and identities still to be assessed in this investigation -- Erin.
BURNETT: Staggering. Thank you so much, Nick Paton Walsh. So, talking to those neighbors, incredible there. And of course in Brussels, if you hold someone for 24 hours, you don't have enough to charge them, you have to let them go. That's happened again and again in these cases and in this hunt since the Paris attacks.
OUTFRONT now, Art Roderick, former assistant director for the U.S. Marshalls. And Phil Mudd, former CIA counterterror officials. Phi, let me start with you. The breaking news out of Brussels. You know, we have learned and you just heard in that report, the bomb chemicals were leaking through the ceiling in the open, noxious smells and yet still Brussels authorities did not do anything. Nick Paton Walsh described the misclues as staggering.
PHIL MUDD, FORMER CIA COUNTERTERRORISM OFFICIAL: I think that's right. If you look at this case. Most counterterrorism professionals would be reluctant to criticize a sister service. But four months after Paris, you have a couple of things you have to look at. The first is, we already knew that some of these suspects had gone to Brussels in advance. And now as you're saying there are clues in the apartment building. I think there's a simple message here and that's a message of human error. A security service that doesn't face the kind of threat that Paris had already seen is maybe lackadaisical in terms of how it investigates. I don't think that will happen again but that's the only explanation I can give you, Erin, because this is basic counterterrorism stuff. If you got a plot that reaches into Brussels, you got to put more people with more urgency, than we saw in this case.
BURNETT: I mean, and you know, Art, not only did that not happen after Paris when the bombers were of course, most of them from Brussels. But when the ring ringleader, the left ringleader was caught in Brussels, there was no step up in interrogation. The fact that the brothers were using so many chemicals, these chemicals smell. You need a lot of space. People smelled it and it was leaking, so it actually creates the image on the part of the bombers of a pretty imprecise careless project that they didn't even think that they were going to be caught. Right? It's leaking through the ceiling. They don't care.
ART RODERICK, FORMER ASSISTANT DIRECTOR, U.S. MARSHALS: Right. Exactly. You can even take it back further even to the "Charlie Hebdo" attacks. We're talking about the same neighborhood here. And not only that, these shows -- not only were there mistakes made by police, but I think the police are handcuffed based on the laws that they have in that country and also the fact that there seems to be no communication between these neighborhoods and law enforcement. They haven't been able to dole up an informants. They're not meeting them in non-enforcement type meetings, you know, where they have town houses or town, you know, town hall meetings or just interaction with the community. You don't see any of that here.
BURNETT: No. And they're very open. You know, Phil from, you know, I've now met multiple young men who have talked about knowing multiple people, friends who are in Syria. You heard the neighbor Nick spoke to who said, the terrorists were, quote, "good people." I met a men who know one of the terrorists. He described him as generous guy who was well liked and well known in the community. I mean, I guess the question for you Phil, is it possible to truly hide being a radical, a psychopath as it is clear from locals that these men did?
MUDD: Sure, it is. We have seen in case after case that people can compartmental their lives. That is, we've seen youngsters here in the United States. I saw it many times. An FBI investigations where 17 or 18-year-old will be radicalized and will buy a ticket to go overseas to fight and their parent comes in, the FBI later and says, I didn't even know my child was being radicalized.
BURNETT: Right.
MUDD: Much less buying a ticket to go overseas. The compartmentation they can do is just remarkable, Erin.
BURNETT: Now, also breaking tonight are something perhaps very, very significant for counterterror operations around the world. The FBI, right? They were trying to sue Apple, begging Apple to let them into that iPhone related to the San Bernardino attacks. And Apple has been saying no. Well, the FBI says, well, guess what, forget the lawsuit, we got in. We found a way to get into that iPhone and now we're in. RODERICK: I think that was just a matter of time until the FBI was
able to get in. And this has been an issue for all law enforcement agencies not only just on the counterterrorism side but on the regular criminal investigative side. And I think the FBI has been working on this for quite a while as well as other agencies that are in the technical end of criminal investigations. And this was just a matter of time. And I am glad to see they were able to get into that phone. And hopefully just to open it up for other agencies to be able through search warrants and through regular criminal investigative means to get the information off those telephones.
[19:10:37] BURNETT: Right. It just goes to show you, if there is a will, there is a way.
All right. Thanks so much to both of you. And don't miss "Terror in Paris," a CNN special report. That is Wednesday night at 9:00.
OUTFRONT next, an exclusive interview with Ted Cruz. His new challenge to Donald Trump right here OUTFRONT.
Plus, women voters for Trump standing by their man.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because he insults men as well, I can't be upset that he's insulting the women. That wouldn't be fair. You know?
(LAUGHTER)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: But did Trump go too far with his comments about Ted Cruz's wife? Plus, a huge weekend for Bernie Sanders.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BERNIE SANDERS (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: With your support coming here in Wisconsin, we have a path toward victory.
(CHEERING)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: We're going to lay that path out for you OUTFRONT. We'll be back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:15:09] BURNETT: Tonight, new threats and attacks as Donald Trump and Ted Cruz make a big play for the crucial battleground state of Wisconsin, a crucial upcoming primary that could dramatically reshape the campaign and the candidates know it.
Cruz slamming Trump today for attacking his family. Trump hitting the airwaves saying it was Cruz who threw the first punch. And tonight, a new sign the Republican race could get a whole lot uglier. Trump now threatening to sue for votes.
Sunlen Serfaty is OUTFRONT.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SUNLEN SERFATY, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Donald Trump accusing Ted Cruz of trying to steal delegates.
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He's trying to steal things because that's the way Ted works. Okay? The system is a broken system.
SERFATY: And threatening to sue, tweeting, quote, "I want the state of Louisiana and get less delegates than Cruz. Lawsuit coming."
Cruz today brushing it on.
SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: You know, I am always amused when Donald doesn't know what to do. And so, he threatens lawsuits.
SERFATY: Despite Trump's narrow win in Louisiana earlier this month, both he and Cruz won 18 pledged delegates, but there are ten delegates that are still up for grabs, five that belong to Marco Rubio are now free agent and five that are unbound. The "Wall Street Journal" reports that Cruz is in a position to potential pick up all ten. Thanks to his campaign's organizational skill at the delegate selection process. The delegate fight comes as Trump and Cruz continue their war of words over their spouses.
TRUMP: I didn't even know it was necessarily a very bad picture of her versus Melania.
SERFATY: Trump refusing to apologize for retweeting a photo of Heidi Cruz next to his wife Melania.
TRUMP: He owes me an apology because what he did was wrong. He sent out a picture to people in Utah --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He didn't. And you know he didn't. You know that it was a Super PAC.
SERFATY: The exchange coming during a contentious interview with a conservative talk radio show host in Wisconsin who is opposed to his candidacy.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Trump, before you called into my show, did you know that I'm a #NeverTrump guy?
TRUMP: That, I did not know.
SERFATY: Cruz meanwhile blaming Trump for planting a salacious tabloid story about him but offering new evidence to back-up his claim.
CRUZ: These are completely made up lies. They're garbage. But you know, it's indicative of just how low Donald Trump will go.
SERFATY: A charge Trump rejects.
TRUMP: I had nothing to do with it. The campaign absolutely had nothing to do with it.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BURNETT: Sunlen, you just spoke exclusively to Ted Cruz. And some news in there. He's now challenging Trump to a one-on-one debate here on CNN, tomorrow.
SUNLEN: That's exactly right, Erin. You know, Ted Cruz wants this chance to debate Donald Trump one-on-one and he's trying to force and challenge Donald Trump to push that into happening tomorrow night. CNN has a town hall scheduled for the candidate, they will not appear on stage together but they're scheduled here back to back. So, Cruz really upping the ante today calling on Donald Trump to try to force this into a debate tomorrow night. Here's what he had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CRUZ: Look, tomorrow CNN has two town halls back to back. An hour with me. An hour with Donald Trump in the exact same location. We should make it a debate. Let's make it a two-hour debate. Let's combine our event. CNN has already scheduled it. You've got a venue. You've got a location. You've got the TV cameras. The only thing missing is Donald Trump because he's scared to debate.
SERFATY: Last we talked on Friday, you said you were not in the habit of supporting someone who attacked your wife. Are you prepared to definitively say that you will not support Donald Trump if he's the nominee?
CRUZ: Well, as you rightly noted, I'm not in the habit of supporting people who attacked my wife and attacked my family. Donald Trump is not going to be the nominee. We are going to beat him for this nomination.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SUNLEN: And I went back and push Senator Cruz on and then I said, a lot of your women supporters here, at your campaign events tells that they will not support Donald Trump if he becomes the nominee. And Senator Cruz would not go farther than he had in the past, just saying he's not the habit of supporting someone that attacks his wife, but certainly is inching in my opinion -- it feels like he's inching towards potentially definitively saying no even if he did not tonight -- Erin.
BURNETT: Which of course is a big move as you point out, Sunlen. You know, the last time he was asked publicly he said he would support him. So, what he said to you there, certainly seems like a shift there.
Let's go straight now to Katrina Pierson, spokesperson for Donald Trump's campaign and our political commentator Ben Ferguson, a Ted Cruz supporter.
Let me start with you, Katrina, first on this issue of Ted Cruz telling Sunlen there that he wants to make this a debate tomorrow night, not a town hall, a debate. Anything that -- is that something Donald Trump will consider?
KATRINA PIERSON, DONALD TRUMP'S CAMPAIGN SPOKESPERSON: Well, this wasn't news. Senator Cruz and the campaign have been talking about this for the better part of a week now.
BURNETT: Uh-hm.
PIERSON: And no, absolutely not. Senator Cruz does not dictate Mr. Trump's schedule and he's going to proceed accordingly.
BURNETT: All right. So, there's your answer to that. Ben, let me ask you about this shift that Sunlen noted. She said, you know, the last time as you know at a debate, when everybody was asked, will you support the frontrunner even if it's Donald Trump, he said, yes. So now here he is saying, I am not in the habit of supporting people who are critical of my wife and Donald Trump will not be the nominee, so this isn't a conversation. Sunlen thinks he's moving towards definitely saying, he wouldn't support Donald Trump. Do you see, hear it that way as well?
[19:20:27] BEN FERGUSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Look, I think Ted Cruz is on point here. And the fact is, you have Donald Trump where it looks like he's getting to the point where he is pathologically lying on purpose. He is lying about the Cruz campaign claiming that they bought some picture from GQ which we know factually is a lie. That is a pathological liar to say something consistently that is not true. We also have him saying that we are stealing an election in Louisiana. That is also a pathological lie. That is also not true. You have Donald Trump now that is doing everything in his power to not debate Ted Cruz and he's doing it because he realizes he cannot sit there one on one with Ted Cruz and actually debate these issues.
So instead what he does is he slanders and he lies and he makes up lies and calls into radio shows and then realizes, wow, I didn't even know who I was calling. I thought everyone loves me. They asked me a tough question and they I say, I don't like their radio show anymore, as we heard today. This is what Donald Trump does. And when he doesn't get his way, then he says, well, I'm really rich and I'm just going to sue you and everyone in Louisiana who doesn't give me exactly what I want. And this is, I think Donald Trump becoming unhinged in this campaign.
BURNETT: Unhinged, Katrina?
PIERSON: Well, I think what we -- I think what we do know here is that there is only one campaign that has consistently had dirty tricks and had to fire people accordingly for them.
FERGUSON: That is actually incorrect.
PIERSON: And that campaign is not Donald Trump. And that campaign is not Donald Trump's campaign. There's only one campaign that has been making those types of accusations against --
FERGUSON: Katrina, did anyone buy a picture for GQ?
PIERSON: -- From the beginning. Ben, you had your turn and now I get mine.
(CROSSTALK)
Mr. Trump said from the beginning that he does not support Super PACs, just about all of them and told the other candidates to do the same or --
FERGUSON: Not answering a simple question.
PIERSON: Hold the campaigns accountable for the Super PACs that attack him. That is what he did. It was a pro-Ted Cruz ad. Ted Cruz's name was on the ad. It was a Super PAC. Mr. Trump held them accountable.
FERGUSON: Again Katrina, you didn't answer the question.
BURNETT: Ben, my question to you though, Donald Trump is trying to say a Super PAC is the same thing as a candidate. Stop with all this distinction, which frankly is something a lot of the American people think too. Right? I mean, we're best friends of the guys in the campaign. And supposedly, they're not allowed to talk. Isn't it all the same thing?
FERGUSON: Let's be clear about this. This picture -- and let's deal with the actual lie here. You have Donald Trump's campaign saying that Ted Cruz bought a picture from GQ.
BURNETT: This is a picture of Melania nude, right?
FERGUSON: Let me finish. Let me finish. Let me finish. Yes. I've heard nude and saying that they then hand it to a Super PAC. First of all, if the Super PACs were talking, it would be against the law. So, that is not happening right there. Second of all, there is no facts that back up that any picture was bought. That is a pathological lie by Donald Trump's campaign. When they get themselves in trouble, they say, we'll going to sue somebody and you're lying and we're suing you. That's what you do?
BURNETT: Where are the facts that Donald Trump put out this horrible tabloid? Where are the facts?
FERGUSON: Katrina, great question. I'm going to answer.
BURNETT: Senator Cruz held a press conference and the facts are Rubio's people.
FERGUSON: I'm going to answer.
PIERSON: Rubio's people have been on record by many reporters by --
FERGUSON: Katrina. Katrina. PIERSON: -- now saying that it was Rubio people not Donald Trump. So, where are your facts there?
FERGUSON: I don't know why you don't have any I guess you'd say, scruples when it comes to these types of stories. Your name was in the story. The fact that you're willing to use this to the advantage of your campaign and put your own name through the mud, which you have also said this story is factually incorrect.
BURNETT: Ben, Ben, let me ask you a question.
(CROSSTALK)
I don't want to get into the details of the story. Hold on. Hold on both of you. I don't want to get to the details of it because it's a tabloid story. But Ben, if it is such garbage, why is Ted Cruz continually bringing it up?
PIERSON: That's my point.
FERGUSON: I think it's that fact that you show -- it shows you that Donald Trump is willing to pathologically lie. And Roger Stone who is connected to his campaign, who was best friends with the "National Enquirer," Donald Trump has been endorsed by the "National Enquirer." The idea that Donald Trump's campaign is not the originator of this story is insanity to not to connect these simple dots and realize they endorse Donald Trump.
PIERSON: Connecting the dots are not facts, Ben. Rubio's people are on record doing it.
FERGUSON: Let me finish this. Let me finish this. Your name is in this to make this story look like somehow that Donald Trump's campaign was not connected to this. You guys --
PIERSON: No, my name is in this, Ben -- my name is in this because the establishment doesn't --
BURNETT: OK. Final word, Katrina.
PIERSON: My name is in this because the establishment doesn't want me doing exactly what I'm doing and that is helping Donald Trump win the Republican nomination and win the presidency. It's not going to work. It didn't work.
BURNETT: OK.
PIERSON: It's not true with regards to myself.
FERGUSON: I will say this.
PIERSON: So, for Ted Cruz to blame the Trump campaign for something that the establishment has done is very, very transparent and very desperate.
[19:25:22] FERGUSON: This is exactly why Donald Trump will not debate Ted Cruz because he cannot talk about issues, but he can talk about tabloids and these types of stories.
BURNETT: OK.
PIERSON: Donald Trump not talking about it.
BURNETT: All right. Thanks very much to both of you.
PIERSON: Ben, Donald Trump is not talking about it.
BURNETT: We will have you back as we always do. Thank you both.
FERGUSON: Thanks.
BURNETT: And tomorrow on CNN, the final three Republican presidential candidates will take part in a live town hall from Milwaukee tomorrow night at 8:00 Eastern. We will also be in Milwaukee tomorrow. Bernie Sanders will be my guest for a live extended interview.
OUTFRONT next, Bernie Sanders with landslide victories in Washington, Alaska, and Hawaii. Does he have a path to victory? We're going to show it to you. And women who support Donald Trump. Do his comments ever offend them?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, because we're strong women. We know who we are. We have respect for ourselves --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You didn't see Megyn Kelly being attacked. You felt that she had provoked the attack?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She provoked the attack.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:30:10] BURNETT: Bernie Sanders scoring an electoral hat trick this weekend, going three for three against Hillary Clinton in Alaska, Hawaii, and Washington state, cutting her lead amongst pledge delegates to less than 250.
Right now, here's the bottom line: 1,256 for Hillary Clinton, 1,019 for Bernie Sanders; 2,383 are needed to win overall. In other words, it's close.
It's close enough that today, Tad Devine, Sanders senior media adviser said this.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
TAD DEVINE, BERNIE SANDERS SENIOR MEDIA ADVISER: I think it's clear now anybody who knows how to count delegates that neither candidate, Hillary Clinton nor Bernie Sanders, is going to win a majority of the delegates to the Democratic Convention with just pledged delegates. OK? No one is going to do that. (END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: So, that's pledged delegates, which means it comes down to this. The word superdelegates and who is that? Those are Democratic Party officials whose votes could swing the nomination to Hillary Clinton.
Tom Foreman is digging into the numbers.
And, Tom, let's just start with the basic math. Bernie Sanders with that big electoral win this weekend, the hat trick, what's his path forward from here?
TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It is a narrow path through a deep canyon, Erin, but it's not impassable or impossible. Look, these are all the states that Hillary Clinton has won so far, shown here in deep blue, and these are all the states that Bernie Sanders has won so far. If you break it down to that delegate math, this is what you get.
Yes, she has a lead here over him. She is closer to winning the 2,083 delegates you need to clinch the nomination before the convention.
Here's another way of looking at it though: she needs 63 percent of all the remaining delegates out there in all the other states, and he needs 77 percent of all those delegates.
So, let's ask if this is even possible on his part: 77 percent, that's pretty big. If you look at Wisconsin, the next big race that's coming up, 86 delegates available there. This is a state that is almost 90 percent white.
That's good for him in the sense that she does stronger with minority voters out there, but it's a state that's kind of middle age, meaning it's not really old, not really young in terms of the population. That might help one of them if it shifted one way or the other, and it is a state where that has relatively low unemployment.
He's done pretty well in places where there's high unemployment. But for all of that, he has to come out of here with three out of four of these delegates. And then he has to repeat that trick over and over again in all sorts of states including some powerhouses out there, like New York, her home state, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, and California over here.
So, as I said, Erin, it is a narrow path through a steep canyon, but not undoable.
BURNETT: You know, one thing, though, that's hard to understand when you just take a step back and you say get outside all the math and the inside baseball of this is how Hillary Clinton had about a 350- delegate advantage over Bernie Sanders before a single person voted. No one had voted and yet she had all those delegates in her corner just based on the basis of those superdelegates.
How does that happen? If Bernie Sanders keeps winning from here, could the superdelegates swing in his direction? Because they don't have to vote for Hillary Clinton. They're not obligated to do so.
FOREMAN: Yes, but many of them say they're going to.
BURNETT: Yes.
FOREMAN: The superdelegates are elected officials and party big wigs. This is the Democratic establishment. That's another way of looking at it.
And they have overwhelmingly so far said they will support Hillary Clinton when it comes to the convention and they get to weigh in. Look at how few are on his side over here.
But, Erin, this is the thing, if he keeps winning states and if he has a lot of momentum going in and if for some reason at convention time, a lot of these establishment Democrats say, look, for some reason, we don't think she can win, but he can, then they could shift over here.
The bottom line though is this still remains a difficult haul for Bernie Sanders, but for everything Hillary Clinton has tried so far, she has yet to knock him out of this race -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Tom Foreman.
I want to go to straight now to Jonathan Tasini, a Sanders supporter and author of "The Essential Bernie Sanders and His Vision for America." Tasini challenged Hillary Clinton in a Democratic primary for her 2006 Senate race. And political commentator Bakari Sellers, he is a Hillary Clinton supporter.
All right, Jonathan, looking at the playing field from here on out, just on a state-by-state basis, putting aside these crucial super delegate issues, because it is crucial, do you think Bernie Sanders could win this nomination? You heard how Tom described it. Impassable, but not impossible.
JONATHAN TASINI, BERNIE SANDERS SUPPORTER: He called it a canyon, I think.
BURNETT: Yes.
TASINI: Well, I would say it's more like a long road, it's a tough road. I think his report was quite good, I have to say, a credit to Tom.
The first thing is, if you look since March 15th, where it was Clinton's high watermark, she had a 326-delegate lead. Now, it's down to 240, partly because of the three states that Bernie won on Saturday.
[19:35:00] And Tom was absolutely right. What Tad said today, no one is going to come with the convention with enough delegates to clinch this nomination. It is going to come down to a debate at -- which will involve the superdelegates. There is no reason -- we are not going to drop out. This is going to go all the way to the convention. We just raised $4 billion just since Saturday. So, we'll have plenty of resources to compete.
The last point I want to make is, I think what's going to happen at the convention is people are going to look and say, who can beat Donald Trump or if Ted Cruz actually manages to get the nomination, who could beat either of them. And the polls have been absolutely consistent. Bernie Sanders does far better against Donald Trump, against Kasich, and Cruz, all the Republicans than Hillary Clinton does. Hillary Clinton's unfavorability ratings are very, very high.
Bernie scores very well with independents, much better than Hillary Clinton. Those are the people we have to excite and bring into the election. And they're very important in swing states.
So, when you come into the convention and people are looking at those polls and saying, oh my goodness, Hillary can't beat these people, we've got to go to Bernie Sanders and I think that's what Tom pointed out in his report.
BURNETT: So, Bakari, what do you say to people who are worried about these superdelegates, right? If you're Hillary Clinton, you want to win this without anyone having conversations about supeelegates who decided they were going to vote for you before any regular Americans actually voted.
Jake Tapper actually asked the head of the Democratic Committee, Debbie Wasserman-Schultz, about this recently. And here's how she answered a question about whether voters will feel the system is rigged because of these superdelegates. Here's what she said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DEBBIE WASSERMAN SCHULTZ, CHAIR OF THE DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL COMMITTEE: Unpledged delegates exist really to make sure that party leaders and elected officials don't have to be in a position where they are running against grassroots activists.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Ouch. That sounds like the system is rigged against grassroots activists, against people like Bernie Sanders.
BAKARI SELLERS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: The system is not rigged. This is not new system. In fact, I'm a fervent supporter of Barack Obama. This is the same system that the, quote/unquote, "grassroots insurgent" candidate from Illinois came through and knocked off Hillary Clinton in 2008. It's not different.
And Jonathan and no one else can point to me a simple fact where superdelegates came into the system or came into a race and took someone who was from behind and totally flip the popular vote on its head. It's never happened, and it won't happen this time.
In fact, in 2008, we only had about 60 superdelegates to actually from Hillary Clinton to Barack Obama. So, there was not a ton of flipping there either. But this is a long road ahead for Bernie Sanders. This is a steep road ahead. However we want to characterize it, as a road or a canyon, but we look forward to Wisconsin and then New York.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you both very much. We will see.
And OUTFRONT next, a slap in the face from Fidel Castro. The former dictator blasting President Obama's visit to Cuba just days after the historic trip.
And we talk to a group of women who tell us why they back Donald Trump. Is it his transparency?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think you've just hit it, why we like him, because he's not politically correct.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:41:56] BURNETT: Donald Trump says nobody has more respect for women than he does, but critics point out that he has called women bimbos and fat pigs. And now, he's going after his rival's wife.
The big question, though, is whether Donald Trump's female supporters even care about this. We asked them.
Martin Savidge is OUTFRONT.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Who is for Trump?
(LAUGHTER)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm for Trump.
(LAUGHTER)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm for Trump.
SAVIDGE (voice-over): I'm in Tucson with a group of conservative women. They meet every month to talk about politics and they all support Donald Trump.
(on camera): So, I'm going to go around and just say, why?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I just find that what you see is what you get with this man, and that is what I want.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He's not afraid to say what he thinks.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He is a strong man with a strong personality. He really does love his country. He loves people. He really has a respect for women.
SAVIDGE (voice-over): To non-Trump supporters that may seem ridiculous given some of the things Trump has said and done. For example, the weekend Twitter fight between Ted Cruz and Donald Trump over their wives.
(on camera): OK. So, you have all seen this. This was a retweet by Donald Trump.
Have we crossed some sort of line here?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This tweeting, it's quite ridiculous. We need to focus on the issues at hand and what's going on in our country and around the world and the problems.
SAVIDGE: This latest incident involving him does not change your support.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This isn't new to politics. So, I mean, it's not nice.
SAVIDGE (voice-over): He's unfiltered, not politically correct. That's something these women love. Even if they don't always love how he says things.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I've cringed maybe on occasion when he's said a certain thing. I've wondered why he said a certain thing, but that's his personality. He's just lets it roll.
SAVIDGE: And nowhere has Trump perhaps let it roll more than with his feud with FOX anchor Megyn Kelly.
MEGYN KELLY, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: You've called women you don't like fat pigs, dogs, slobs, and disgusting animals.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He's been baited. He's been baited by Megyn Kelly. I can't even believe --
SAVIDGE (on camera): You really think that?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I -- that -- come on, the first question asked by her at that first bait was to bait Donald Trump to get him in a position where he would react.
SAVIDGE: How about his reaction to that?
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: You could see there was blood coming out of her eyes, blood coming out of her whatever.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He did say it, but you don't know what his connotation was. I don't -- I didn't take it that way.
SAVIDGE: I would have thought that would have got you upset.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Not necessarily. Just because he insults men as well, and because he insults men as well, I can't be upset that he's insulting the women.
SAVIDGE (voice-over): I asked, how is it they didn't seem to think their personal values of honesty and decency weren't comprised by supporting someone who seems to go against those principles.
(on camera): How do you balance that with your support of a man who seems to violate every aspect of what you believe?
[19:45:06] UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because the other side is worse.
SAVIDGE: Is there anything Donald Trump could do that would make you change your support?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Just going back on his policies and on the issues.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BURNETT: Marty, that was just a fascinating -- fascinating. What did they say to you they would do if Donald Trump is not the nominee?
SAVIDGE: Well, these are very politically passionate and very strong- willed women. And what they basically said was that they would be angry. They would be frustrated. And every single one of them said they would quit the Republican Party.
They also say they know a lot of other women who support Donald Trump, but don't necessarily come forward and talk about it because they're afraid of some kind of backlash. But they say they all intend to vote -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Martin Savidge, thank you very much.
And our senior political analyst, David Gergen, is with me, former advisor to Presidents Nixon, Ford, Reagan, Clinton.
That was a fascinating report to hear those women, their points of view, why they feel the way they feel. Are you surprised at all by what they say?
DAVID GERGEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: I am surprised, but I'm not totally surprised. They are very conservative. They live in Arizona where the wall is very popular. Donald Trump did extremely well there.
But I think it's important to recognize, they do represent a minority viewpoint in the country. It's -- I think what that shows is that they're not going to stand in the way and support him all the way through the nomination process. But if he gets to the general election, if you look at the numbers, he's hovering at a place where he could become unelectable. In the last nine months, his unfavorability ratings with American women overall, all registered voters, the women --
BURNETT: Yes.
GERGEN: -- have gone from 58 percent to 73 percent in CNN poll.
BURNETT: That's a big jump, from December just until now, yes. GERGEN: We've never seen -- now, Hillary Clinton has also got a lot of people disapproving of her. Well over 50 percent, but Trump is up in the 2/3 range overall disapprove, and among women, up 73 percent. You can't get elected if the 73 percent say I don't like him. I'm not going to vote for him.
BURNETT: He's got to turn that around.
All right. Well, thank you very much, David Gergen, a fascinating report and a fascinating takeaway, of course, from David Gergen on those numbers.
OUTFRONT next, Fidel Castro slamming President Obama over his trip to Cuba, stunning what he had to say. The dictator speaking out.
And on a lighter note, Jeanne Moos on the newest member of the Trump family.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:51:01] BURNETT: Tonight, Fidel Castro slamming President Obama just days after though president's historic trip to Cuba. The former dictator rejecting his visit in a letter, saying, "We don't need the empire to give us anything."
Castro's slam was part of an extremely critical column in the communist newspaper titled "Brother Obama".
Patrick Oppmann is OUTFRONT in Havana tonight.
And, Patrick, you knew the government. This is an about-face last week, right? The government was welcoming President Obama, first trip from a U.S. president in 90 years. Now, Fidel Castro with this major slam at Barack Obama. Why now?
PATRICK OPPMANN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You know, Erin, how quickly things changed. When you were here, of course, Raul Castro was wining and dining with President Obama. They went and saw a baseball game together.
And then, this morning, we wake up to this. Cuba's newspaper, the state-run newspaper, the only kind you get in Cuba and a 1,500-full page article from Fidel Castro just attacking Obama in every which way. And, of course, talking to government officials today, they said, well, he's retired. He's been out of power now for almost a decade. He only speaks for himself. You know, this is a right that he has still.
But, of course, when Fidel Castro speaks -- any time Fidel Castro speaks, people take notice and they are today. And they are wondering what the disconnect is all about, Erin.
BURNETT: They certainly are and they are noticing in the United States. When I was with you last week, most of the Cubans I interacted with were excited about Barack Obama's visit. Why the disconnect? Why now would Fidel Castro come out with this? OPPMANN: And that disconnect, Erin, only seems wider, talking to
Cubans who have digested the speech. They seem absolutely ecstatic about the way that President Obama respectfully but very clearly laid out the differences between the U.S. government and the Cuban government.
There has been something of a fear though among the Cuban government, the officials point view of that perhaps President Obama was a little too effective in reaching the Cuban people in a way the Cuban leadership just never does. The Cuban leadership, you don't see them having that common touch that perhaps U.S. official that President Obama when he was meeting with comedians here and he was cracking jokes and speaking Spanish really showed that he possessed.
And I think in a lot of ways, this is an answer to President Obama's way of getting around the Cuban government and really showing the U.S. is not the enemy. Fidel Castro is coming back in a strong way and saying, no, the U.S. is still the enemy. But, of course, these two governments have to continue to work forward on these issues. They don't have another choice, Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Patrick, thank you.
OUTFRONT next, Jeanne Moos on Donald Trump -- a grandfather for the eighth time.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:57:33] BURNETT: For weeks Donald Trump has been saying his daughter Ivanka is going to have a baby at any moment.
Well, Grandpa Trump finally got his wish. Here's Jeanne Moos.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEANNE MOOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Donald Trump was a hands-on grandpa.
TRUMP: Ivanka, you know, we have a hospital ready just in case.
MOOS: Even before there was a baby to put his hands on. Here he is. Meet Theodore James, born in New York City.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Congratulations.
TRUMP: Thank you. It's very exciting.
UIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How did it happen? What time?
TRUMP: How did it happen?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I know how it happened. Don't answer that.
MOOS: Trump had told a mostly Jewish audience.
TRUMP: My daughter Ivanka is about to have a beautiful Jewish baby. MOOS: Ivanka converted to Judaism before marrying Jared Kushner and
the baby was born.
TRUMP: On Easter. So, we have an Easter baby, which is beautiful.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Donald Trump, kissing babies?
MOOS: When they are his own.
TRUMP: Hi, sweetheart.
MOOS: Donald now has eight grandchildren. ABC's "20/20" caught the Donald's warm and fuzzy side when they stormed his office when the kids stormed his office.
Ivanka's 4-year-old told her this.
IVANKA TRUMP, DONALD TRUMP'S DAUGHTER: My daughter sees a large pothole in the middle of the New York City street. She says, grandpa would not like that.
MOOS: But Donald once read "Winners Aren't Losers" to one of his granddaughters, Jimmy Kimmel supplied the book.
JIMMY KIMMEL, TV HOST: Winners do deals and winners get rich, while sad little losers just sit there and (EXPLETIVE DELETED).
MOOS: Baby Theodore, we wanted you to have this video scrapbook so some day you could look back and see how even though you were still in the womb, you were already part of the 2016 presidential campaign.
TRUMP: Ivanka can have a baby like tonight. In fact, it could be happening right now. It could be any second. It could even be before I'm finished.
MOOS: When the baby's name Theodore was announced, some made an instant connection to Ted -- Cruz. Someone even had the nerve to replace the baby's head with Ted's.
TRUMP: Lyin' Ted. Lyin' Ted. What's your name?
MOOS: Call him "crying Ted". The only lying this baby is doing is in a crib.
Jeanne Moos, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BURNETT: All right. Well, thank you for joining us. We'll see you tomorrow. We'll be live from Milwaukee where Bernie Sanders will join us for a live interview. You'll see that only OUTFRONT tomorrow.
In the meantime, "AC360" with Anderson Cooper begins right now.
