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Erin Burnett Outfront
Biden: This Is Not A Third Obama Term Because U.S. Faces A Totally Different World; Biden Says Trump's "America First" Meant America Alone; Trump Brags About Stock Market In Tone-Deaf Public Event; Biden: The Hope Is The Trump Administration Will Be Able To Start Distributing The Vaccine Before I Take Office; Biden Doesn't Rule Out Ex-Rivals Sanders, Warren For Admin; Recount Underway In Georgia As Trump Attacks Officials Over Loss And Pushes Baseless Voter Fraud Claims. Aired 7-8p ET
Aired November 24, 2020 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: Her family tells us Evelyn was an Elvis Presley fanatic who visited Graceland almost every year. May they rest in peace and may their memories be a blessing.
"ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT" starts right now.
ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: OUTFRONT next breaking news, the President- elect in his first interview since the election, Joe Biden making it clear he's nothing like Trump but also says his presidency won't be a third Obama term.
Plus, America facing a critical and dangerous reckoning as the number of coronavirus deaths is climbing. Why is a top government doctor saying that if you must travel, don't bother with a test.
And the woman Biden wants to lead America's Intelligence Community has all the credentials you might expect and some you may not. A pilot's license, a brown belt in judo. Let's go OUTFRONT.
And good evening. I'm Erin Burnett.
OUTFRONT tonight, the breaking news, President-elect Joe Biden speaking out making clear tonight that things are about to change in an interview airing on NBC just moments ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES: America is back. We're at the head of the table once again. I've spoken with over 20 world leaders and they're all are literally really pleased and somewhat excited. America is going to reassert its role in the world and be a coalition builder.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: And he says he's looking to heal the divide, the deep divide here at home as well.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) LESTER HOLT, NBC HOST: Have you considered for the sake of national
unity selecting or nominating a Republican, someone who voted for President Trump.
BIDEN: Yes. And we still have a lot more appointments to make. I want this country to be united. The purpose of our administration is once again uniting. We can't keep this virulent political dialogue going.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: And as CNN is learning, the President-elect Biden's transition team is now in contact with all federal agencies, including the White House. The President-elect has announced his National Security team and made it clear that unlike President Trump, he is not hiring yes men and women.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BIDEN: They'll tell me what I need to know not what I want to know, what I need to know. To the American people, this team will make us proud to be Americans.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Also today, two and a half weeks after Biden won, President Trump finally giving formal approval for Biden to receive the President's daily brief. It's highly classified information that Biden will need information that Trump, of course, had blocked Biden from receiving, which also makes it very hard to imagine if this will ever happen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. President-elect, will you meet I think President Trump?
BIDEN: Of course, I would if he asked.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Of course, I would if he asked. Well, chances are he won't since he still as of tonight is not admitting Biden won, 17 days ago. Today, what did Trump do, well, he retweeted a picture of himself with the caption, I concede, in all caps, nothing. A very apprentice like boardroom pose there many exclamation points?
Well, legally, of course, the President doesn't have to concede. This is going to happen whether he likes it or not, because the American people had a decision to make which they did and they elected Joe Biden. But instead of accepting reality today, Trump used to rare public appearances. They are rare these days since the election is very rarely out.
But he came out today for the tone-deaf move of congratulating his administration, listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I just want to congratulate everybody, the Dow Jones Industrial Average just broke for the first time in history 30,000. It's now - that's good. It's great for jobs and it's good for everything. And this is the ninth time that we set a record during the course of 2020 and it's the 48th time that we set the record during the Trump administration.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Trump took credit for the stock market. Laying it on thick on his other appearance today as well. And you know what? That's fair. It's a big deal. It's a good thing. But it completely misses the tone. It no way represents the economic reality of this country right now. Nearly 260,000 people have died of the virus and what reflects reality is this massive lines at food banks and food pantries across the country heading into Thanksgiving.
So many Americans heading in for the first time to a food bank. There's one here in New Jersey up to 50,000 meals expected to be distributed ahead of the Thanksgiving holiday. In Phoenix, Arizona, align at a food bank more than two miles long.
Food insecurity rates in this country have more than doubled during the pandemic, according to Feeding America, which is this nation's largest hunger relief organization. More than 54 million people in this country facing food insecurity. That is what needed to be felt today, not just the Dow.
So when the President was not saying I refused to concede and spreading false information about overturning the election, he was ignoring the harsh reality and pain that so many millions of Americans feel.
[19:05:05]
Perhaps, because he is not willing to surround himself with people who will tell him what he needs to hear rather than what he wants to hear. Jeff Zeleny is covering the Biden transition in Wilmington, Delaware. Kaitlan Collins is covering President Trump near the White House.
Jeff, let me start with you. Biden today, I mean, this is truly full speed. I mean, GSA recognizes the formal transition. Every single agency they've now been in contact with. He does this interview. They are putting the accelerator to the mat. That's what they want to convey.
JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORREPONDENT: They absolutely do, Erin. And this is three weeks since Election Day, but really only about 17 days since his victory was projected. But they've been at this for a long time and that is very evident.
Look at that rollout of national security and foreign policy experts and leaders and cabinet nominees today, that is not something that just happened. He didn't just happen to win this election and suddenly they built their team. This transition has been in the works since the summer, since he became the Democratic nominee and now we're seeing the fruits of it.
This is going to be a very Joe Biden-like administration. We saw all of those protegees and mentees, if you will, standing on stage. This is a government that is going to be deeply filled with experienced people. Now, we're also hearing tonight that he said that he has not yet spoken to Dr. Anthony Fauci, but he said he would. He said he would like to, but his team has been in touch.
And we're also hearing that he said that he might receive the presidential daily briefing as early as tomorrow. He said that in his NBC interview tonight. So this is something that is happening very quickly and we also know that more announcements are coming soon. Like the Treasury Secretary next week.
So Erin, one thing that was striking here today in Wilmington, President Trump's name not mentioned at all on that stage. The only time it was mentioned when a reporter asked if he would speak with him if he asked, he said sure if he asked, of course, I would. Erin.
BURNETT: Yes, very interesting. And, of course, interesting. in that interview he said that he would want to appoint someone who voted for Trump, not a Republican, a Republican who voted for Trump, so we shall see. I want to go to Kaitlan Collins at the white ...
ZELENY: (Inaudible) cabinet and that would be some diversity.
BURNETT: Yes. I mean, it's certainly would be.
So Kaitlan, at the White House, you broke the news today that Trump although obviously tweeting he won't concede and full steam ahead on that path is stop, blocking Biden from getting the presidential daily briefing. He's going to allow that to go ahead even as he refuses to concede and is fundraising to fight the results of this election, so what's he doing?
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's kind of this walking contradiction that you're seeing play out at the White House, where the President is vowing that he is going to press ahead with these legal fights. He's continuing to talk about the conspiracy theories that he's pushed about the election. But everyone else around him at the White House is moving forward with what this transition is going to look like.
And it took a while to get here with the GSA just announcing last night, they're actually going to formally move forward with this transition. But then, of course, a natural next step that the President-elect Joe Biden had been denying so far was that classified briefing. He is still not gotten one yet as he confirmed tonight, though they are currently working on it, we're told.
But that's critical, because that's typically something a president gets right away. But because of this stonewalling that you've seen on behalf of the President by his administration, so far, it's not something that Biden has yet received. And so the President is still moving forward, saying that he is going to continue to fight the results of this election. It's not really clear how he even is going to do that, because you've
seen him take so many divergent paths, as his efforts have continued to fail the ones in court, the public pressure campaigns on state electors as well. And so that's really the ultimate question, but Erin this comes as - this is the third straight week where the President has not taken a single question from reporters.
Instead, he seems to be doing most of his work behind the scenes continuing to campaign off the idea that he's contesting the results of this election that everyone else says is settled.
BURNETT: Yes. All right. Kaitlan, thank you very much.
So I want to go now to Michael Smerconish, Host of CNN SMERCONISH, Nia Malika Henderson, our Senior Political Reporter and Nick Akerman, who served as Assistant Special Prosecutor during Watergate, also a former Assistant U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of New York.
Michael, let me start with you. Biden, coming out tonight and saying America is back and then saying that he would consider appointing a Republican who voted for Trump. Now, he said that he's going to do that, does he need to do it and what's the significance of such a thing?
MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN HOST, SMERCONISH: Well, I think it would be a good thing. If he were to reach across the aisle in the fashion that he has described, I don't know that it's going to placate the 70 some million who voted for President Trump and allow them to change their perspective of what's going on. But he has a reputation for having reached across the aisle during the course of his long Senate career.
And I would fully expect him to reach out to someone in the vein of say, John Kasich and invite them to play a senior role in his administration. In fact, I'd be shocked if he didn't do it.
BURNETT: Right, right. Now, of course, I can totally see that, John Kasich, of course did support Biden.
[19:10:05]
I mean, it's the Trump vote on this that, Nia, could be extremely very interesting if Joe Biden continues down that path.
NIA-MALIKA HENDERSON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER: Possibly. But listen, this is something that most presidents have done appointing somebody in their cabinet from the opposing party as a gesture of bipartisanship, as a gesture of unity for the country. You think back to Obama, he had LaHood at transportation as well as Gates as Secretary of Defense. But they did him a little good in terms of bringing Republicans along both average voters as well as folks that he had to deal within the Senate.
(Inaudible) I remember Mitch McConnell saying that he wanted to make Barack Obama a one-term president, that didn't work. But he certainly stood in the way of a lot of the policy agenda that Obama wants to get done. So sure, Biden will likely do it, how many will it be, will it be one, two, three, who knows. Maybe he'll break our record with the number of Republicans that he appoints to his cabinet or around him.
But listen, I think this is in so many ways a fractured country. It's a very divided country, by party, by race, by all sorts of other metrics. So Biden can try, but I think history suggests that these appointments won't make much difference in terms of bridging the divide.
BURNETT: And Nick, one of the big decisions that Biden faces that is going to determine how all of this plays out is whether to support investigations into Trump. I mean, this is sort of an existential question. There are so many legal experts who believe that there's a lot there and yet it is also for Joe Biden political.
So when he was asked tonight, would he support these investigations into Trump, when Trump leaves office, here's how Biden responded.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BIDEN: I will not do what this president does and use the Justice Department as my vehicle to insist that something happened. There are a number of investigations that I've read about that are at a state level. There's nothing at all I can or cannot do about that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: So Nick, what's the significance of that, that he's basically saying he himself will not push the Justice Department to do it at all.
NICK AKERMAN, FMR. ASST. SPECIAL WATERGATE PROSECUTOR: No and nor should he. I mean, we're not a banana republic. This is the United States of America. We don't have our presidents going after their political opponents with the Justice Department.
So I think for the most part, many of these investigations that we know about that were done by the Mueller team probably will not result in anything further. The one area where I think Donald Trump has a great deal of exposure relates to his federal income taxes. And those kinds of investigations don't really start from the top, they really start from the bottom with the revenue agents that are doing the audits and they work their way up being given to other agents who are criminal IRS agents.
So that may be a big Achilles heel for Trump and it may be an issue that percolates up through the IRS through the Justice Department that at some point the Justice Department will have to deal with. But keep in mind, there is still an ongoing serious investigation in New York City by the Manhattan DA's office. And that investigation is looking at Trump's taxes, it's looking at possible bank fraud and the Biden administration has absolutely zero authority to do anything about that investigation.
BURNETT: So Michael, the President had two appearances today and as I emphasized, they are rare these days. And he used to, even though he didn't call them press conferences, love taking questions right from the press. Today showed up in the press briefing room for 64 seconds, no questions, just a statement and it was about the stock market. So that was purposeful, why?
SMERCONISH: That was a TV campaign commercial in the making. Erin, as soon as I saw it and he was only there as you say for 60 seconds, I said to myself, 30,000 is a big milestone. I give him credit for that. Because frankly we'd be blaming him if it had tanked.
BURNETT: Yes.
SMERCONISH: He does not want to trust the media to record that moment, so he walked into that White House pressroom with Mike Pence at his side and recorded it for posterity, including potentially for 2024, you can see that on a campaign real in four years.
BURNETT: Wow. It's a fair point. So Nick, today Trump pardoned a turkey. And there was a question that he got at that at that moment that was shouted out by a reporter, because it was around the pardoning of the turkey, here's what happened.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Will you be issuing a pardon for yourself?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[19:15:00]
BURNETT: Nick, the President said in the past that he could pardon himself. Now here we are, it's a moment of reckoning. Will he be able to do it? Will he do it?
AKERMAN: Well, first of all, let me say no one has ever done this before. Even Richard Nixon didn't pardon himself. He resigned and then President Ford, his successor, pardoned him. This issue has never been raised before in the courts, because no president has even tried to do it. But I think more importantly, I don't think legally it has any standing.
The President also has duties under the Constitution that he has to faithfully execute the laws of the United States. And it is not executing the laws of the United States to go and pardon yourself from federal felonies and to get yourself out of the soup. I mean, it goes against our entire system of justice, that doesn't allow somebody to be a judge upon himself.
But going back to your earlier question, there's a practical issue here. That is, he could go ahead and pardon himself, but the only way that pardoned will ever be questioned and brought before the courts is if the Department of Justice actually brought federal criminal charges against him. And so that would be a defense that he would raise at the point he is charged with a crime. The defense being, hey, I'm pardoned, I can't be prosecuted, and then that would likely go to the U.S. Supreme Court.
But it begs the question as to whether or not the Biden ministration would ever charge Trump with a federal crime. BURNETT: And interesting, Joe Biden making it clear, if for any
reason, at least of his reasons, perhaps, just that he doesn't want to do what he believes Trump himself would do. Thank you very much, Nick, Nia, Michael.
And next nearly 10,000 flights in the air right now over the United States, according to FlightAware, 10,000 flights. People flying all over the place. And a lot of those people think, oh, well, I got tested for coronavirus, so I'm cool. The White House testing czar says no, no, and maybe you shouldn't have even bothered.
Plus, the President-elect's team had its first meeting with the Pentagon, heading up the effort, a man link to spreading conspiracy theories about Joe Biden and Ukraine.
And another vote recount in Georgia the state underway, the second in less than a week. Joe Biden won, why can't some Trump supporters there let it go?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:21:10]
BURNETT: Breaking news, the U.S. reporting more than 1,800 lives lost to coronavirus already today. Today now on track to become one of the deadliest days in this country since early May. And a troubling trend fueling that death count hospitalizations, again breaking records for 15 straight days.
The latest numbers just in today, another record breaker 88,000 people hospitalized in this country tonight with the virus. It comes as President-elect Joe Biden reveals new details about how he plans to roll out the coronavirus vaccines.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BIDEN: I think we should be focusing on obviously the docs, the nurses, those people who are the first responders. I think we should also be focusing on being able to open schools as rapidly as we can. The hope is we can actually begin to distribute it this administration can begin to distribute it before we are sworn in and take office.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: All right. OUTFRONT now Rick Bright, a member of Biden's coronavirus advisory board and former Director of the Federal Office charged with developing vaccines. So you know this, Rick, from the government perspective and you know what we're seeing here.
So President-elect Biden said moments ago that he hopes to actually begin distributing the vaccine before he's sworn into office and that fits with what the Trump administration said, mid December. You're starting with health care workers. How soon do you think the general public actually gets this? For real, when you ask your doctor, they're going to say, oh, yes, I've got it, I can give it to you, like they do with the flu shot. RICK BRIGHT, BIDEN COVID-19 ANDVISORY BOARD MEMBER: Erin, thanks for
having me on. That's a really important question. So I share the excitement and optimism that so many people across America are feeling when they hear about the good news about the vaccines and I know our FDA scientists are working really hard right now to review all the data from the manufacturers.
So once the vaccine is authorized by the FDA, it can be distributed. But it's in very, very limited supply, as you said. I heard today that perhaps only 6 million doses or so might be distributed by the second week of December. So that's not very many doses, when you spread it out across all 50 states or 64 territories across our country, jurisdictions.
So the rest of us if you're not in those high risk categories, such as the health care workers and the school teachers, and then those in nursing homes, et cetera, are going to have a long time to wait. It's going to take a while to manufacture more of these doses and prep them for distribution and set up mass vaccination campaigns across the country.
BURNETT: Yes.
BRIGHT: I really think this is going to be until May or June of next year before many of us can easily obtain a dose of vaccine.
BURNETT: And I know you're obviously putting it all out there. You got to convince people to do it. We've never had anything like that in this country to happen so quickly. So this is all going to be historical, if it happens.
BRIGHT: Yes.
BURNETT: On top of it, you have currently three vaccines showing promising results, all of which have different positives and negatives. One of them is really effective, but it's got to be stored at incredibly cold temperatures.
If the FDA says all of them are safe, how are you going to decide who gets what? Some of them are going to be more effective than others. Who's going to get to choose? I mean, someone's going to say, OK, you get the 60 percent effective one. I mean these are hard choices, how are you going to make them?
BRIGHT: They're really difficult choices and we want to make sure that the vaccines are appropriate for all populations. We might learn that some of the vaccines might work better in certain populations or maybe not be suitable for other populations. Some of them might work better in older people than a younger people are better than younger people than older people.
Some of them might be limited for people with underlying conditions or weakened immune systems, maybe we'll find that the vaccine might not be most suitable for those people.
[19:25:06] So we want to make sure that we get all the data from the vaccines and
the FDA and the CDC are able to review those special characteristics of the vaccines, and then make sure they're suitable for all.
I want to emphasize that when you hear about differences in the efficacy of the various vaccines, any vaccine right now, especially with the attributes and the efficacy that we're seeing from these first three vaccines is good news, is promising news. And we want to make sure that they're used and they're all safe.
So I'm excited on all of them, we might even have a fourth one coming through in early January. So good news is we'll have vaccines, but you're right is going to be very complicated to just review and administer vaccines with different characteristics.
That is why we need to work immediately with the Biden transition team and the current Trump administrations, we can make sure that we have a smooth handoff for those very complicated logistical issues that we'll have to deal with in distributing the vaccines.
BURNETT: Now, I just want to ask one quick follow up here, because I know you're now in contact with them. The head of Operation Warp Speed says we could reach to herd immunity by the month of May, which would mean 70 percent of people plus 75 maybe have either had this or have gotten the full vaccine schedule.
You're telling me that by May or June, you think most people will be able to get it whenever they want. Are you basically agreeing then, you guys are on the same page on this?
BRIGHT: I haven't seen the math that he's using to make that prediction about herd immunity by May or June. I really think it's going to take a long time. I think through most of next year, I think it's going to take that long to probably get everyone vaccinated, even though the vaccines will come available. It still takes a lot to distribute it and roll those out and administer that many doses of vaccine in a broad population.
And then we're going to have to really see how long the immunity is and last after we received those vaccines and start to collect those data before we can make any bold projections about any level of herd immunity.
BURNETT: All right. Well, I appreciate your time, Rick. Thank you very much for leveling with us on how you really see it. Appreciate it.
BRIGHT: Thanks, Erin.
BURNETT: And tonight, millions are going against CDC guidelines and they are traveling for Thanksgiving. This is the number of flights over the United States at noon today, 6,900, higher than the number at that same time in 2018. Just to remind you there was no virus back then and it's not a good thing.
And Admiral Brett Giroir, who is in charge of testing has come out and told people don't even bother with getting a test. Doesn't want you traveling, but says a test isn't going to do it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. BRETT GIROIR, ASSISTANT SECRETARY FOR HEALTH, HHS: What I think I want people to understand more importantly is that a test that's negative today, doesn't mean you're going to be negative tomorrow or the next day or the following day. That negative test is not a free pass to do risky behaviors.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: OUTFRONT now, Dr. Jonathan Reiner. He advised the White House medical team under President George W. Bush. So Dr. Reiner, how much does this worry you? I mean, just on the basic numbers, you have 10,000 flights in the air right now, 6,900 at noon, that's more than at the same time in 2018.
A lot of people are traveling, they are limiting their gathering size. Hopefully most of them but not all of them. But they're traveling and they're coming from different places. And you just heard what Admiral Giroir just said, how worried are you?
JONATHAN REINER, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: Really worried, Erin. It's the potentially the mother of all super spreader events. One of the ways we think the Midwest was seated with virus during the summer was with the Sturgis, South Dakota Motorcycle Rally, where people were infected and then dispersed out through the Midwest.
Now, imagine that on a massive scale with people leaving from every airport in the United States and carrying virus with them. I want to emphasize that a PCR test is just a snapshot in time.
BURNETT: Right.
REINER: And if you're negative when you get it, you may be truly negative or perhaps you were infected a day or two before and you don't have enough viral RNA to be detected. And you will still be carrying the virus or as Admiral Giroir said, you can acquire it on your travels. So testing itself is not a free pass.
BURNETT: Right. I know and I think what is concerning me so much as just hearing about so many people who are really trying to be responsible and doing the right thing by being tested not doing risky things but not sitting in a bubble that you multiply that over 10s of millions and everyone can see how you have a horrific situation possibly coming.
On this front, Dr. Reiner, the President not of course setting an example, two public events today failing to mention the virus at either one and we know that the White House as of now is planning to hold multiple holiday parties, holiday parties, obviously in violation of the CDC guideline.
[19:30:02]
BURNETT: At this point, how damaging is this message from the White House?
REINER: I mean, we have seen this story before. I have seen this movie before. I know how it ends.
Ask Chris Christie how this ends. If you bring a lot of people together at a White House party, particularly a party that has food where you have to take your mask off, there is no safe way to do that in public, with a lot of people, unless you're widely spaced.
And I have been to these parties. These parties are packed with people, people trying to get a photo with the president. I don't know if they will still do that this year. People glad handling each other it's another super spreader event.
It's completely optional and harmful in this pandemic environment. It should not be done.
BURNETT: All right. Dr. Reiner --
REINER: And realize this is the last year that it should not be done.
BURNETT: Thank you very much, Dr. Reiner.
REINER: My pleasure.
BURNETT: And up next, Biden's cabinet nominees already saying they will be different from team Trump.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AVRIL HAINES, DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE NOMINEE: Mr. President-elect, you know that I have never shied away from speaking truth to power.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: And some Republicans in Georgia still refusing to accept Trump's election loss, a squeeze on GOP Senate runoff candidates to do the same.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:35:07]
BURNETT: Breaking news: President-elect Biden saying nothing is off the table when it comes to assembling the rest of his cabinet, including former rivals like Senators Bernie Sanders or Elizabeth Warren, including a Republican who voted for Trump.
This coming after Biden made clear his history-making national security team is a clear rebuke of Trump and his administration. Biden saying he doesn't want his team to be full of people who say "yes", which his pick for national intelligence director promised to honor.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) HAINES: Mr. President-elect, you know that I have never shied away from speaking truth to power, and that will be my charge as director of national intelligence.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: A clear contrast to what President Trump's cabinet often sounded like. Their top priority -- well, just listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MIKE PENCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Look, greatest privilege of my life is to serve as vice president to a president who is keeping his word to the American people.
REINCE PRIEBUS, FORMER WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF: On behalf of the entire senior staff around you, Mr. President, we thank you for the opportunity and blessing you have given us to serve your agenda and the American people.
BEN CARSON, HUD SECRETARY: I just want to thank you for your incredible courage and stamina and resilience, with unwithering criticism, unfair criticism all the time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: OUTFRONT now, two people who know the ins and outs of presidential transitions and new administrations, and, well, that sort of behavior, John Podesta, who is chief of staff to President Bill Clinton, and former White House chief of staff to President George W. Bush, Andy Card.
So, you guys have seen all the players that come in and try to seek the approval of the president.
John, a difference of night and day between these two teams -- what President-elect Biden says he wants and, well, what we heard time and time again. This is when they would invite the cameras in and this is -- they would go around the table because they wanted us to hear this and only this.
JOHN PODESTA, FORMER WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF TO PRESIDENT BILL CLINTON: Well, I had the pleasure of serving with Avril Haines in the Obama White House and she tells it like it is. I think that's what Joe Biden wants. That's what the two presidents I worked for wanted. They want -- they want to hear it straight. They don't want to mince words. You don't need to curry favor.
And, actually, both of them, and I think Andy would have the same experience with the presidents he served, they have kind of tossed you out of the office if they thought you were doing, kind of polishing your shoes.
BURNETT: Yeah, well, obviously, that's the way it's been recently, Andy.
Do you really believe this? How different will this be?
ANDY CARD, FORMER WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF TO PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH: Well, it's going to be different. First of all, everyone at the White House serves at the pleasure of the president. But their job is not to try to please the president. Their job is to do the job.
And if you lose the pleasure of the president, you're gone. That's okay. I understand that.
But they're not supposed to be there just to suck up to the president and please the president. You are supposed to help the president do his job, and that means sometimes you have to tell him things he doesn't want to hear, or you have to challenge his thinking because it wasn't as inclusive as it might have needed to be. So that's part of the responsibility that you have working at the White House or in the cabinet.
BURNETT: So, John, you know, there are -- there are some who are very worried, right, that because Joe Biden is surrounded by a lot of people who he has known for a long time, many whom worked in the Obama administration, that is going to be reflective of what happens here, which is a basically a take two.
In an interview tonight of NBC -- with NBC, President-elect Biden rejected that, he said it's not going to be a third term of the Obama administration, just because the faces are familiar.
Here how -- here's how he put it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT-ELECT: This is not a third Obama term because we face a totally different world than we faced in the Obama/Biden administration. The president, this President Trump has changed the landscape. It's become America first, which meant America alone. We find ourselves in a position where the alliances are being frayed.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Is he right, Andy?
CARD: It's a very different world. It really is. Number one, the pandemic dictates a lot of things have changed.
But the world is certainly changed. The alliances that we had before Donald Trump was president have been tarnished and are not as respectful as they should be or used to be, and, yes, I think President-elect Biden is focused on trying to restore the -- I'm going to say the polished democracy of America rather than the one that has been so grossly tarnished over the last, I think, three and a half, four years.
BURNETT: So, John, the Pentagon held the first transition meeting with Joe Biden's team, right? So, now, they are all finally talking. And it's being led by Kash Patel. He's a Trump loyalist, chief of staff to acting Defense Secretary Christopher Miller. He, Patel, was connected to efforts to spread conspiracy theories
about Joe Biden and Ukraine, to pressure Ukraine to investigate Joe Biden, and he used to be an aide to Republican Congressman Devin Nunes, worked to discredit, of course, the entire Mueller probe.
[19:40:09]
Does this give you concern, John, that this is the person who is heading up ostensibly sharing all the information about the military?
PODESTA: Well, look, the reason he is sitting in that seat is because the Trump loyalists are decapitating anybody who have the temerity of actually speaking truth to the president, including the secretary of defense. But I think people do act professionally.
I think once you get below, particularly certain level, people will give -- they will do what they need to do as public servants as people who believe in the Constitution, share the information, play it straight, and I think that hopefully, Mr. Patel will do his constitutional duty.
But I am certain that the people underneath him will, and that Biden, who has been deprived of access to that information up until last night, will have full access put to the technology and the information that are so critical to plan for national security, the COVID recovery, and these other crises, the climate crisis.
You know, very interesting pick to put Secretary John Kerry in as a special envoy to sit at the National Security Council, to deal with the climate crisis. So, he is building a diverse, experienced team because he is facing so many challenges.
BURNETT: So, Andy, John mentioned the former defense secretary. There have been obviously multiple, but let's talk about Jim Mattis, right? Four-star general, one of the most respected generals in this country took that job to work for Trump.
Trump remember famously went out, Mad Dog Mattis. Well, now, Jim Mattis has come out and said America first isn't the right way to go, it's not the best thing, right, and he obviously resigned. The president came out and said that says it all about Mattis, Obama fired him, I should have fired him sooner. Did best work after he was gone, world's most overrated general.
Does anything change in terms of the broader way people talk when, you know, this is -- this is now normal?
CARD: Well, I have been impressed with that President-elect Biden has done in terms of bringing some people who have already climbed a learning curve, if you will. They will be ready to start on day one with some competency.
I just hope the Trump administration shares the information with them so that they have the capacity to be fully prepared on day one to meet any of those threats, especially in the national security foreign policy arena, but also with regard to the pandemic. So I agree with John Podesta. The senior executive service, the highest level of career public servants are very, very responsible, do their job, and they want to serve the country well.
They tried to serve President Trump well, and I guarantee they will be trying to serve President Biden well.
And they are the ones that are really doing their legwork on getting things ready for this transition of knowledge to be passed on to the Trump team -- sorry, the Biden team. And I think that's a good thing and it's overdue. I'm glad that it's starting, but there is a lot to learn and we have to get the security clearances done so people can do the job once they get the job.
BURNETT: All right. Well, thank you very much. I appreciate it, John. Andy, thank you.
PODESTA: Thank you, Erin.
CARD: Thank you.
BURNETT: And next, Republicans in Georgia clinging to the belief that election results can still be flipped in Trump's favor. Is that delusion actually now hurting the GOP and the Senate runoff races, these most crucial runoff races?
And who is Avril Haines? The physicist who practices judo and is a licensed pilot who has been picked to head America's intelligence community.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:47:43]
BURNETT: Tonight, the statewide recount in Georgia is underway. It is the second recount in 11 days. But President Trump still refuses to accept that he is the first Republican to lose the state since 1992, tweeting, quote, why isn't the Georgia secretary of state, a so-called Republican, allowing us to look on signatures on envelopes for verification? We will find tens of thousands of fraudulent and illegal votes. Of course, those signatures were all checked for.
Well, the president is not alone, though, in this complete denial of reality.
Ryan Nobles is OUTFRONT.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RYAN NOBLES, CNN WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The political stakes in Georgia's Senate runoffs couldn't be higher.
SEN. DAVID PERDUE (R-GA): This isn't about my seat. It's so much bigger than me.
NOBLES: But three weeks since Election Day, some Republicans have yet to shift their focus to the contests coming in January.
TRUMP SUPPORTER: What are you doing to help Donald Trump?
NOBLES: One Trump supporter even interrupting David Perdue at a campaign stop, demanding the incumbent senator and Kelly Loeffler, the other Republican senator running, do more to help President Trump's effort to overturn the results of the election.
DAVID WEST, TRUMP SUPPORTER: I think they should be more vocal.
NOBLES: Republican voter David West believes President Trump's unfounded claim that the presidential election was stolen. He wants Perdue and Loeffler to focus their efforts not on their own re- election, but instead Trump's fanciful fraud allegations.
WEST: They should be used in every news outlet that gives them a voice, every social media that give them a voice, that this whole election is a farce.
NOBLES: Pressure from voters like West has forced Perdue and Loeffler to continue to fuel Trump's narrative, even at the expense of fellow GOP leaders in Georgia who have repeatedly defended the integrity of the election.
PERDUE: We call for the resignation of our secretary of state is what we did. We're calling for lawsuits right now. We are doing a lot because right now we want him, every valid, every legal vote should be counted for Donald Trump.
NOBLES: But every legal vote has been counted and is in the process of being counted for the third time. Today, Republican Governor Brian Kemp, who has been the target of attacks by Trump supporters, defended the administration of the election.
GOV. BRIAN KEMP (R), GEORGIA: Over the last several weeks, unfortunately, we've seen a lot of misinformation and more recently, quite honestly, baseless attacks that are absolutely absurd and accusations made against myself and my family.
NOBLES: While the president's supporters remain passionate, it's still unclear how big of a role he'll play in the runoff.
[19:50:06]
So far, the president has been quiet about the runoff election, but his son, Donald Trump Jr., made it clear in a tweet the GOP majority needs. A Trump visit to Georgia remains a possibility, but the campaigns are not counting on it. They believe even a tweet from the president would be enough to calm his supporters' fears.
Meanwhile, Georgia's lieutenant governor is pleading with his fellow Republicans to look forward, while warning the party is at a crossroads.
LT. GOV. GEOFF DUNCAN (R), GEORGIA: I also think for the Republican Party, this is a starting point, or at least points in the direction of starting to talk about what potentially GOP 2.0. looks like.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
NOBLES (on camera): And it's important to point out that that Trump supporter we spoke to said that he will vote for Kelly Loeffler and for David Perdue, but this situation demonstrates the difficulty these Republican candidates find themselves in. They would prefer to be talking about the stakes and how it's important to protect the Republican majority. But instead, they are forced to talk about an election that already happened.
It just goes to show that Trump's shadow looms large, even though he just lost an election -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Ryan, thank you. I want to go straight to our senior writer and analyst, Harry Enten, for CNN Politics.
So, Harry, just listening to that Republican, and I know he is going to vote for the Republican senators and the ticket, but it does show the frustration here, right, that you have some Republicans who are angry that the Trump part of this is being handled and can't move on to focus on the Senate. How significant might that be?
HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL WRITER AND ANALYST: It could be quite significant. And what we should point out is traditionally, Republicans are the ones who have a turnout advantage in these runoffs. You know, African-American turnout, which obviously African- Americans are the base of the Democratic Party in the state of Georgia, traditionally has fallen in runoffs, right?
2008 is an example. That's the last time there was a Senate runoff. And indeed, if you look at runoffs overall in the state of Georgia since 1992, what do you see? You see that the GOP traditionally has a turnout advantage. They have gained ground, I believe, at something like 7 out of 8 times, Republican candidates have widen their advantage from round one to run off.
So, something like this with a turnout that we don't know which way it will go with all these Trump allegations could be a wildcard and could perhaps change a historical trend.
BURNETT: Yeah. And, I mean, you have, you know, Stacey Abrams and the organization that clearly, you know, pulled off that incredible victory for Joe Biden in Georgia. It's interesting, though, in that context, right, that they're saying, OK, Joe Biden won, it's the first time since 1992, so Georgia is blue.
Well, here's something else that the Republican lieutenant governor of Georgia told me last night.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DUNCAN: You know, Georgia is a red state. All eight statewide constitutional officers are Republicans. We have both the state senate, the state house are Republican majorities.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: So what do you say, Harry? I mean, is Georgia still a red state? He laid out why, but Georgia just voted for Joe Biden. Razor thin, but that is a victory.
ENTEN: It was a victory, and the Senate races were also really, really close, right? We are talking about in both those Senate races and in the special and you look at the regulars Senate election, you see that in both the cases, neither the Democratic candidate nor the Republican candidate, including the presidential race, got more than 50 percent of the vote. They all fell short. They are basically hovering right around 48, 49 percent.
It's very, very close. And the other thing I will note is historically speaking, what we have now in Georgia is a very different electorate with gains of Democrats in areas with college degrees, and well- educated areas. It's not the Georgia of old anymore, Erin.
BURNETT: Well, it's fascinating to see what is going to happen here. The eyes of the world on Georgia.
Harry, thank you.
ENTEN: Thank you.
BUIRNETT: And next, she was a physicist, a pilot, and bookstore owner who hosted readings of erotic literature. Who is Avril Haines, Biden's nominee to be the next director of national intelligence?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:57:24]
BURNETT: Tonight, President-elect Joe Biden's pick for director of national intelligence vowing to never shy away from speaking truth to power.
If confirmed, Avril Haines will be the first woman to hold the post. And she is a fascinating person. There's so much more about her background that sets her apart from any DNI we've seen before.
Alex Marquardt is OUTFRONT.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ALEXANDER MARQUARDT, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The president-elect today lavishing praise on his nominee to lead the U.S. intelligence community, Avril Haines.
BIDEN: Brilliant, humble, can talk literature and theoretical physics, fixing cars, flying planes, running a bookstore cafe, all in a single conversation, because she's done all that.
MARQUARDT: Haines, in response, vowing to tell Biden what may be difficult and what we may not want to hear as she takes on a role that recently has been held by loyalist allies of President Trump who did his political bidding.
HAINES: Mr. President-elect, you know that I have never shot a way from speaking truth to power. And that will be my charge as director of national intelligence.
MARQUARDT: As DNI, Haines would be the first woman, whose path was different than her predecessors. Under President Obama, Haines was made number 2 at the CIA by Director John Brennan, who just out with a book called undaunted because of what he calls her unprecedented breath of experience.
JOHN BRENNAN, FORMER CIA DIRECTOR: She is wicked smart. She has tremendous understanding of national security law. She has terrific inter personal skills, and she has a work ethic that is unrivaled.
MARQUARDT: Haines's path to the world of security and secrets was untraditional and eclectic. After high school, she attended an elite judo academy in Japan. At the University of Chicago, she studied physics, but took time off to learn to fly with an instructor who would later become her husband.
They opened a bookstore in Baltimore, which would sometimes host readings of erotic literature, before she went on to Georgetown Law School.
BRENNAN: I think that background really gives her, I think, a tremendous perspective as far as the role that the director of national intelligence needs to play in this very complex, complicated world of ours.
MARQUARDT: Haines has worked with Biden for more than a decade and a variety of national security roles. Now, she looks to take over and intelligence community which for years has been repeatedly insulted and sidelined by Trump.
HAINES: To our intelligence professionals, the work you do, oftentimes under the most austere conditions imaginable, is just indispensable.
MARQUARDT: Next, Haines will help the future Biden administration set on another important intelligence pick, the director of the CIA, a critical partner for Haines and formidable challenges that lie ahead.
Alex Marquardt, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BURNETT: And thanks for joining us.
Anderson starts now.
