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Erin Burnett Outfront

New Drone Video Shows Massive Destruction in Village Near Kyiv; U.S.: Russians Adding More Troops, Including in Last 24 Hours; New Satellite Images Show Rows of Mass Graves Near Mariupol; Marjorie Taylor Greene Testifies in Challenge Over Candidacy; McCarthy Tries to Contain Trump Fallout. Aired 7-8p ET

Aired April 22, 2022 - 19:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[19:00:00]

JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: There was another man who was a soccer player at UDC who said he knew it was shots and he just hit the floor until they stopped. Wolf, back to you.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: I suspect we'll get more information. Joe Johns, thanks very much. And to our viewers, thanks for watching.

Erin Burnett OUTFRONT starts right now.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN HOST: OUTFRONT next breaking news, new drone video revealing the breathtaking scale of destruction near Kyiv as Russia says it now wants to control all of the south and Putin state media gives a dubious death toll from the prized warship that sank.

Plus, Ukraine's Prosecutor General telling me that there are 'huge numbers' of mass graves and evidence of genocide in Mariupol.

And Marjorie Taylor Greene testifying under oath, defending her right to run for office. Tonight, she still insists Donald Trump won the election. Let's go OUTFRONT.

Good evening, everyone. I'm Kate Bolduan in for Erin Burnett. OUTFRONT tonight, we have breaking news. This new drone video revealing the staggering scale of destruction from Putin's war. This is all that is left of a village just north of the capital of Kyiv, home after home leveled, the roofs blown off other buildings.

This village was vital to stopping Putin's march toward the Capitol and why Putin pulled back and redoubled his efforts to the east. It is in the eastern part of the country that the Russians are attacking with increasing intensity tonight. These images from Kharkiv show apartments on fire, businesses gutted and tonight the Pentagon warns Putin's not letting up.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN KIRBY, PENTAGON PRESS SECRETARY: What we do know is that they are putting more enablers in there and they are adding more troops even over the last 24 hours. What we do know is that they are conducting offensive operations in the Donbas and certainly, they continue to bombard me Mariupol.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Now, one of Putin's top commanders declares Russia's ambitions go far beyond the east, claiming Russia now wants to take full control of southern Ukraine that would give Russia a massive swath of land that would stretch from Russia's border to the Black Sea. There are questions tonight about whether Russia could really accomplish that, given the number of setbacks that Putin has suffered, including the sinking of his prized warship.

These images show that ship tilting to one side as black smoke just rises above the vessel. Yet Russia is claiming tonight only one crew member died and 27 are still missing. When Russia released video earlier this week of the commander of the Russian Navy meeting with the surviving members, you can see clearly far fewer than the 396 crew members that Russia is now saying survived, much more on that in just a moment.

First, I want to go to Sam Kiley in Dnipro, Ukraine live with us tonight. Sam, what is the latest on the ground there?

SAM KILEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kate, I think the most significant thing is that in the last couple of days, both the Ukrainians and the Russians now agree that the Russian second phase is underway. It's underway in terms of an increased use of artillery and your long-range missiles against targets all over the east of the country, but particularly, Kate, around towns that are near Kramatorsk.

This is a town that's in a kind of lozenge (ph) of territory, a tongue of Ukrainian government held territory that sticks into the Luhansk and the Donbas oblast. Those, of course, are areas captured by Russia and they're sort of a separatist clients back in 2014.

Now, on top of that, of course, we've now heard also from the major general in charge of the central region of the Russian Armed Forces, saying that he want - he believed that the Russian target was now to capture all of the, not only the Azov Sea coast, which is still being held up by the fighting around Mariupol, but also all the way round as far as Odessa and on to the borders with Moldova because there is a Russian speaking enclave held with Russian troops there in Moldova.

Now, that may be extremely far-fetched, because I think, ultimately, they're already being held up at Mykolaiv, but what it's trying to do there is get the Ukrainians to spread their military operations in preparation for a potential attack there, whilst actually the focus is going to be very much in the east and trying to drive towards where I am here or a little bit further east of here, try and cut off Ukrainian forces in that enclave around Kramatorsk and annihilate them there.

That is the Russian plan. That's a Russian plan that the Ukrainians have already said they're aware of and are prepared for, Kate.

BOLDUAN: Sam, thank you so much for that. I want to go now to Alex Marquardt, he's OUTFRONT in Washington. Alex,

Russia says only one crew member was killed on that Russian warship that I mentioned at the top, that ship that sank last week. What more are you learning about that?

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: And remember, Kate, Russia said that that ship sank because of a fire on board that munitions exploded and caused it to sink whereas Ukrainians, of course, said that they fired two missiles at it and that's why it's sunk and that's the version that the U.S. agrees with.

[19:05:02]

The Russians not changing their story there, but they are filling out some of the details there giving us numbers in terms of the survivor, the lone survivor, the missing and the evacuee - sorry, the lone person who was killed and then the evacuees of which they say they're around 400.

Now, we have seen some video, as you mentioned, of those people who got off the ship. It appeared in that video that there were only around 100 of them. Of course, there could be a quite a few wounded who wouldn't appear there. They are telling a story about this one sailor who was killed. They say that thanks to him that hundreds of people survived, that he went down to the boiler to try to shut it down and in doing so, he rescued hundreds of sailors but he himself died. So they're telling this heroic story.

Kate, this all comes from Russian state media, at the very least, we have to take it with a huge grain of salt. Of course, they've been telling huge lies throughout this conflict. And then when it comes to the 27th who are missing, this ship went down on April 14th, so these almost 30 sailors have been missing for more than a week now, so their prospects do appear to be quite grim.

Now, we have heard from a number of families of the sailors who are getting increasingly angry. One father wrote on his social media page, when the initial story came out that all of his soldiers - sailors had been evacuated. He called that a cynical lie. We've seen him posting again tonight in the wake of this new story from Russia. He's talking about these missing sailors writing, "Now we'll have to look into the matter as to how long this 'gone missing' in the open sea can continue."

So father - so Kate, this one father is still very skeptical of the government story. As you and I were talking about the other night, there is a hope that as it becomes clear to Russian parents, how many of their sons are not coming home that there might be some kind of protest movement that rises up, we have not seen that yet.

Of course, it's very difficult to get information in Russia right now and very dangerous to go out and protest. Kate?

BOLDUAN: Excellent point. It's good to see you, Alex. Thank you very much. OUTFRONT with me now is retired U.S. Army Brigadier General Mark

Kimmitt, former Assistant Secretary of State for Political Military Affairs, and Andrea Kendall-Taylor, former Deputy National Intelligence Officer for Russia and Eurasia at the National Intelligence Council.

Gen. Kimmitt, we've heard today from the British Prime Minister, Boris Johnson, and he said that in his view, it is a realistic possibility that Vladimir Putin may win this war. Now, the United States disagrees with that assessment. Do you think there is a realistic possibility that Putin could win?

BRIG. GEN. MARK KIMMITT, U.S. ARMY (RET.): Well, I think it's the definition of win if Putin now is convincing his population that a win is to seize and hold the Donbas and now that we've got a path from Russia down to Crimea through Mariupol, that's his definition of win, if that includes the south and goes all the way to Odessa, that's his definition of win. But because he's trying to control the narrative, he gets to define what win is.

BOLDUAN: Andrea, what do you think?

ANDREA KENDALL-TAYLOR, FMR. DEPUTY NATL. INTEL. OFC. FOR RUSSIA & EURASIA, NATL. INTEL. COUNCIL: I definitely disagree with Prime Minister Boris Johnson and I think it's a little unfortunate that he said it, because the U.K. has been such a strong supporter of Ukraine, both in military assistance and sanctions. They even announced they're reopening our embassy.

But if you step back and look what's happening, I think this is absolutely going to be a strategic defeat for Putin. He set out to subjugate Ukraine, that's not happening and he's only hardened Ukrainians desire to integrate with the West.

Outside of Ukraine, we should see soon both Finland and Sweden joining NATO. NATO itself is entirely revitalized. NATO continues to move equipment closer to Russia's borders, which Russia has long sought to avoid. The Russian economy is in tatters and its prestige on the global stage is severely tarnished.

So in all of those ways, I don't think - I don't see how this could be anything but a strategic defeat for Vladimir Putin.

BOLDUAN: In General, as you're talking about the definition of win, we do now, at least, have some more definition of what the goal is at least now. Russian military commander said today that Moscow's goal is now to 'establish full control' over Donbas and southern Ukraine and they even have their sights on Moldova. How bad is that for Ukraine if that happens and it may be a big if?

KIMMITT: Well, first of all, let me let me go back to my colleague's point, you're absolutely right. This is a strategic defeat for Putin in the eyes of the West, but the way he is going to spin the narrative is that this is going to be success.

Now, as to the south, there are some concerns that he would, in fact, as Alex said, not only take the south but continue on to the Transnistria inside Moldova. I don't think he's got that capability. But if he is able to take Odessa, what he's essentially done is made Ukraine a landlocked country.

[19:10:03]

And Ukraine is so dependent upon the - its agricultural exports through the sea to feed their treasury, that that would be a strategic loss in the long run for Ukraine.

BOLDUAN: A very big one.

Andrea, I want to ask you about the Russian warship Alex Marquardt was just giving us an update on. Russia is now saying that only one crew member died, 27 are missing and the remaining 396 were evacuated and rescued. One, do you believe it? And two, why is Putin putting this out there?

KENDALL-TAYLOR: I absolutely do not believe it. As Alex said, the Kremlin lies all the time, particularly throughout this war. And I think for Putin, this is his effort to try to control the narrative. This is part of his propaganda machine. He's trying to convince on looking countries outside of Russia, the Global South Africa, Latin America that Putin is still a competent leader and that Russia is still a great power. So he's trying to create a narrative that doesn't tarnish Russia's image in that sense and it's especially targeted at his own domestic public.

There is a huge vocal constituency inside Russia that now has very high expectations for what Putin should be able to accomplish in Russia. And so I think Putin is concern that as this 'special operation' drags on for two months now and has images of its flagship, the Moskva sinking in the Black Sea come back to Russia, that that risks tarnishing his perception as a competent leader.

So he is fighting tooth and nail to control the information environment in order to maintain his grip on power and his image as a competent leader of Russia.

BOLDUAN: Yes. In the meantime he's lying could - potentially lying about the most sacred of things, the lives lost of his own sailors who fought there. It's good to see both, thank you very much.

OUTFRONT next, thousand bodies recovered and that's just around Kyiv. Mass graves discovered outside of Mariupol. Those are not all the atrocities Ukraine is uncovering, of course. The country's prosecutor general is next.

Plus, Marjorie Taylor Greene fighting for her right to run for office despite her actions surrounding January 6th. The Congresswoman defiant and defensive under oath.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE (R-GA): You sound like you have as many conspiracy theories as QAnon at this point. (END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: And from taxis to trains to planes, a reporter travels to see firsthand just how confusing the country's mask policies are tonight.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:16:10]

BOLDUAN: Tonight, Ukrainian officials say the bodies of more than 1,000 Ukrainian civilians killed in this war have been examined by investigators. That count is just from Kyiv. The head of Kyiv region police saying this, "Those are civilians who had nothing to do with territorial defense or other military formations."

Just as President Zelenskyy vows to get justice for any victims of war crimes in his country. Phil Black is OUTFRONT for us live in Kyiv. A warning, some of the video and images that you're about to see, they are graphic. Phil, what's happening there?

PHIL BLACK, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Kate, the work continues, because that figure, 1,084, is by no means final. As we've seen, bodies are still being pulled from the debris. Bodies are still being exhumed from temporary graves. And once recovered, they are then taken to seven morgues scattered across the Kyiv region where they are examined, where autopsies are conducted, where they try to establish the cause of death, where samples are taken that could be useful for identification purposes down the track.

These are facilities that were not built to deal with this to operate at this scale. So large mobile refrigerators have been brought in just to store the victims of Russia's occupation.

The Kyiv region police chief says that of the bodies that have been examined so far, between 50 percent and 75 percent died as a result of small arms fire. We spoke to a forensics medicine expert who said that based on what he is seeing, he thinks that of those who were killed by gunfire, between 30 percent and 40 percent were clearly shot deliberately, that is murdered.

And that is a determination made by the fact that they were clearly shot and killed as a result of a gunshot wound to the head. He thinks others may have been killed deliberately as well. But they also experienced other injuries and so the determination isn't as straightforward.

Other causes of death, a common cause of death generally is a result of artillery fire that is being hit to crash by debris or bodies absorbing the force of a blast. But essentially what we were been told is that really the bodies tell the story of what happened in each community.

In the communities where the Russians were clearly in control, clearly the occupying force, that is where you are more likely to see close range gunshot wounds. In communities where they were contested where the fighting was intense, that is where people are more likely who have died as a result of injuries sustained through Russia's indiscriminate bombardment of residential buildings, Kate.

BOLDUAN: Phil, thank you.

OUTFRONT now Ukraine's Prosecutor General, Iryna Venediktova. Thank you so much for being here.

These new satellite images that we're seeing, they show rows of apparent mass graves just about 10 miles west of Mariupol. An advisor to the mayor there said that Russian forces are digging these graves that are a hundred feet long and we know access to Mariupol is just nearly impossible. What do you know about this?

IRYNA VENEDIKTOVA, UKRAINIAN PROSECUTOR GENERAL: Now, we understand that we have a huge number of mass graves. But actually we don't understand and we don't have access to these grave. Now I can't say who're in site, civilians or militaries. That's why again, it will be a question. It's a huge difficulty for us, for Ukrainian prosecutors to investigate, because we are still in the war and we don't have access to the occupied territories.

BOLDUAN: Do you believe that Russian forces are trying to cover up get rid of evidence that could help your investigation?

VENEDIKTOVA: I'm sure they try to hide everything, that try to make information in different way.

[19:20:01]

And, of course, they won't have to say they were something else. Now we see that they have done huge propaganda in the Russian Federation and actually the information is absolutely different and it is not objective. That's why it's the ordinary strategy.

BOLDUAN: You've said that you expect to find evidence of genocide in Mariupol. How confident are you that Vladimir Putin is not only committing war crimes in the country, but genocide as well?

VENEDIKTOVA: What we see exactly in Mariupol it is departure of the children. We started several criminal cases about departure and we understand that huge number of our adult population and children who are departed from the territory of Mariupol. Of course, we - if we will have access to the city, I am sure that we will find of them characteristics of genocide.

Actually, we started to persecute people who calls about genocide. They spoke about that Ukrainians state should be destroyed. Ukrainians should be killed as a nation, but we should find all evidences for this. That's where we will do our job, we will find all possibilities.

BOLDUAN: You have seen such crimes have taken place in all of the occupied areas of Ukraine. Are you seeing it in every population; men, women, even children that are becoming victims to these sexual crimes?

VENEDIKTOVA: Even old women. When I was in Borodyanka, I try to be on such places by myself and speak with policemen, with prosecutors on the ground, with witnesses. And when I was in Borodyanka, it was the same day when they started the criminal case about rape in the old women.

That's why, yes, unfortunately, we have such operative information. I speak about - when I speak about facts like in Borodyanka, but from other side, I can speak about operative information. We should check it when we will find actually the victim, because it's very sensitive question. It's a so sensitive question. Victims don't want to be like a statistics, they understand that it will be a difficult way for them. That's why we, again, have this information from priests, from neighbors, from the relatives, but not always from victims. We're starting cases, but we are waiting when the victims will be ready to come and speak with us.

BOLDUAN: Prosecutor General, thank you very much for your time.

VENEDIKTOVA: Thank you very much.

BOLDUAN: OUTFRONT for us next, Congresswoman Marjorie Taylor Greene under oath pressed on who she was talking to around January 6th.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GREENE: I don't remember. I do not remember. Sorry, I don't remember.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Plus, how worried should Kevin McCarthy be after he was caught on tape saying that Trump admitted some responsibility for the insurrection?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA): He told me he does have some responsibility for what happened.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: The reporter who broke that story is OUTFRONT next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:27:58]

BOLDUAN: Marjorie Taylor Greene in court and on the stand today, defending herself and her right to run for reelection which is facing a direct challenge from a group of Georgia voters. They say her actions around the January 6th riot should disqualify her from holding office.

Under oath, Greene defended herself and still insists Donald Trump won the 2020 election. Amara Walker is OUTFRONT.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

AMARA WALKER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): An extraordinary day in court as Georgia Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene took the stand.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (Inaudible) so help you God.

GREENE: (Inaudible).

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALKER (voice-over): In a hearing to determine if the Republican lawmaker is constitutionally disqualified from running for reelection because of any role she may have played and the January 6th insurrection, Greene still pushing the big lie.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDREW CELLI, LAWYER FOR CHALLENGES: You believed that Joe Biden had lost the election to Mr. Trump, right?

GREENE: Well, yes, we saw tremendous amount of voter fraud ...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALKER (voice-over): But continuing to deny prior knowledge of what would happen on January 6th.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CELLI: You were aware that people were going to make noise outside the capitol as a means to disrupt the proceedings inside the Capitol, is that fair?

GREENE: No. I have no idea what you're talking about.

CELLI: Prior to January 6th 2021, had you heard that people were planning to enter the Capitol Building illegally in order to disrupt the electoral count process?

GREENE: No. Absolutely not.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALKER (voice-over): Green also unable to recall her conversations with other lawmakers.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CELLI: You didn't talk to anybody in government about the fact that there were going to be large protests in Washington on January 6th.

GREENE: I don't remember.

CELLI: You spoke to Representative Biggs or his staff about that fact that, didn't you?

GREENE: I do not remember.

CELLI: How about Representative Gosar? GREENE: Sorry, I don't remember.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALKER (voice-over): Using the same defense when asked about some of her controversial social media posts.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CELLI: Did you like a post that said it's quicker that a bullet to the head would be a quicker way to remove Nancy Pelosi from the role of speaker?

GREENE: I have had many people manage my social media account over the years. I have no idea who liked that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[19:30:05]

WALKER (voice-over): Green frequently objected to the line of questioning.

GREENE: You sound like you have as many conspiracy theories as QAnon at this point.

WALKER: But maintain that her objections on January 6th were political free speech, not advocating violence.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You used the term 1776 to describe to -- in response to a question from Newsmax broadcaster, right?

GREENE: I was speaking about objecting.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, he asked you, what is your plan? What do you prepare to have go down tomorrow on January 6th? And your response was, tomorrow is our 1776 moment, right?

GREENE: I was talking about the courage to object.

WALKER: Greene's attorneys focusing on her own fears that day.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Were you a victim of the attack?

GREENE: Yes, I was. I was in the House chamber when it happened.

WALKER: Even though, Greene still defended some of those charged in connection with the insurrection as patriots.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Some of them were veterans. Yes. Some of them differently are patriots.

WALKER: At the core of the case, a provision of the 14th Amendment barring American officials from future office if found aiding or engaging in an insurrection.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is not politics. This is fear. This is serious case.

WALKER: The outcome in Georgia could set a precedent for similar challenges against other Republican officials for their roles in the insurrection.

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT: We're going to the Capitol.

WALKER: Including against former President Donald Trump, if he runs again in 2024.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WALKER (on camera): Now, the judge is expected to make a decision sometime early next month on whether or not Marjorie Taylor Greene should be disqualified from running for reelection. He will then make his recommendation to the Georgia secretary of state, who will then make a final determination.

Now, Kate, keep in mind this insurrection disqualification clause in the 14th Amendment, is from a civil war era. So that means, this provision has never been tested in modern history. And that will make it likely an uphill battle for the challengers, Kate.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN HOST: Amara, thank you very much for that.

Joining us now, David Aronberg, state attorney from Palm Beach County, Florida.

It's good to see you, David.

DAVE ARONBERG, STATE ATTORNEY, PALM BEACH COUNTY: Thank you.

BOLDUAN: How strong of a case do you think this is against Marjorie Taylor Greene, after -- I mean, Amara really put it all together very well?

ARONBERG: I think it's going to be an uphill battle because no one, including Marjorie Taylor Greene, has been charged with a crime of insurrection, stemming from January 6. And there's a reason for that. The Department of Justice has deemed that it's easier to charge someone with obstruction of an official proceeding. It's easier to prove, and you get more years in prison if found guilty.

So they're using that statute. So don't expect anyone to be charged with insurrection, and it makes it harder to prevail here.

Also, her testimony today didn't quite establish that she planned violence, or coordinated with rioters before January 6. And although, there is no requirement for Marjorie Taylor Greene to be charged with insurrection, to be found to be guilty with this offense here in this administrative hearing, and thrown off the ballot, it's up to a state court to create this new precedent because as was said, this is uncharted territory.

And state court judges don't like to be the first one to create something new, especially when it comes to bouncing the sitting member of Congress out of her job.

BOLDUAN: That's a good point.

I want to play some more of what Marjorie Taylor Greene said on the stand today. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You think that Speaker Pelosi is a traitor to the country, right?

GREENE: I'm not answering that question. Speculation --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You've said that, haven't you, Ms. Greene, that she's a traitor to the country?

GREENE: No, I haven't said that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, but at the exhibit, please.

GREENE: Oh, no, wait. Hold on now. I believe by not upholding -- securing the border, that violates her oath of office.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: One example of how it laid out in the few hours that you was on the stand. Do you think Greene helped herself, for her defense, in what you did on the stand?

ARONBERG: We'll, if she's ultimately bouncing from the ballot or charged for perjury, because she lied I think throughout this hearing, then, yes, she would clearly hurt herself. But proving perjury is a lot tougher, and that's why, she kept saying I don't recall. She clearly talked to a lawyer here, and she's trying to avoid a perjury trap. So, I don't know if she'll ever be charged.

But as far as whether she heard herself on the court of public opinion, that's to be decided. Her detractors will continue to despise her, and her supporters will probably continue to love her. One thing, though, is that she's seem to backtrack a little bit there, and be a little hesitant. And that's something that could upset some of her true believers, of course, who are living in this crazy world, who thinks everything is a conspiracy, and all Democrats are pedophiles.

I mean, when she was asked if Nancy Pelosi is a traitor, and she backtracked on that, I think that could hurt her standing amongst her real hard supporters, who believe she is a trainer. So maybe in the long run, this could cost her a few votes and some campaign contributions.

[19:35:04]

BOLDUAN: She did get an applause from her supporters when she entered the courtroom this morning. It's good to see you, David. Thank you very much.

ARONBERG: Thanks, Kate.

OUTFRONT for us the next, House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy caught on tape, saying he believe Donald Trump should resign over January 6th, after denying reports that he said that very thing. The reporter who has the tapes is my guest, next.

And, to mask or not. Travelers are confused by mask policies that really are all over the map.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: About to go down a jetway, another change in policy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERICAL BREAK)

BOLDUAN: Tonight, new leaked audio getting at the heart of Donald Trump's role on January 6. House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy talking about this very issue with fellow Republicans, just days after the riot. These are calls obtained by two "New York Times" journalists for their bombshell new book.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA), MINORITY LEADER: Let me be very clear to all of you, and I've been very clear to the president. He bears responsibilities for his words and actions, no ifs, ands or buts. I asked him personally today, does he hold responsibility for what happened?

[19:40:03]

Does he feel bad about what happened? He told me he does have some responsibility for what happened. And he needs to acknowledge that.

I had it with this guy. What he did is unacceptable. Nobody can defend that, and nobody should defend it.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

BOPLDUAN: So these states are emerging, after another recorded call is released, proving the McCarthy lied when denying the report, that he considered telling Donald Trump to resign.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

REP. LIZ CHENEY (R-WY): Is there any chance, the team might resign? Is there anything that you think might happen?

MCCARTHY: I've had a few discussions. My gut tells me no. I'm seriously thinking of having that conversation with him tonight. I haven't talked to him in a couple of days. From what I know of him, I mean, you think he would never back away. Do you think he'd ever back away? Whatever discussion I could have with him, I think this will pass, and

it would be my recommendation, should he resign. I mean, that would be my take, but I don't think he would take it. But I don't know.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Republican sources tell CNN that McCarthy is saying that Trump called him about that leaked audio last night, and the sources also saying to McCarthy that he didn't seem worried and had said, quote, Trump was fine.

OUTFRONT now, Jonathan Martin, who was one of the authors of this new book, which is titled, "This Will Not Pass: Trump, Biden, and the Battle for America's Future".

It's good to see you, Jonathan.

JONATHAN MARTIN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Thanks for having me, Kate.

BOLDUAN: Of course.

McCarthy says, according to sources, McCarthy said the Trump was fine. And a top Republican told CNN that McCarthy didn't see more about his political future after this. Do you think -- do you sense that Kevin McCarthy should be worried?

MARTIN: Well, I would make two points. Number one, President Trump is famous for, sort of a slow build off, and a number of past cases, he doesn't respond initially. But actually absorbs the coverage for a few days, his tone can change.

And secondly, I was would just add, Alex Burns, my coauthor, spent two year reporting this book. We have extensive material inside their rooms. The inner sanctums of both political parties, and we have a lot of conversations that were had in the days, weeks, months after January 6th. Some of which we have not reported yet, in this book that's out May 3rd.

So, I think, it may be premature to guess how President Trump's going to fully respond to this book, when he hasn't seen only but a couple of passages.

BOLDUAN: It's a good point. Some of the loudest voices, in Trump world, they have been quick to step up and slam McCarthy. Republican Congressman Matt Gaetz, he's one of them, he tweeted this in part, Jonathan. He said, while I was rallying Wyoming against Liz Cheney, Kevin McCarthy was defending Liz Cheney among House Republicans, and also writing, to Kevin McCarthy, you should have trusted my instincts, not your own.

What do you think -- I consider this kind of like extra layer to how the reaction to this book is playing out so far? It doesn't seem fine, though, when you see that?

MARTIN: Yeah. So, he obviously has detractors in his cause, McCarthy does, and Gaetz is one of the louder ones. But Gaetz does reflect the kind of hard right faction in that caucus, and they're loyal to Trump.

I think this is what McCarthy is a little nervous, overall, that, you know, he needs the Trump loyalists, like Matt Gaetz, to stick with him. Because if you loses too many of them, especially the ones who are not quite as critical as Matt Gaetz, that can create enough problem for him, if he wants to be speaker of the house next year should his party pick up the majority. So --

BOLDUAN: Let me say if he wants to be speaker. I mean, this is like we know this is like his entire goal in life right now as speaker.

MARTIN: No, this is -- right. Everything he is driving towards is becoming a speaker. And this is why, precisely the last year and a half, he's run from his tone and posture and comments that you just played a minute ago there in those private conversations. He has sort of repented for his criticism of President Trump. He's re-embraced President Trump, because he knows he needs Trump's approval to get the far faction of this caucus placated.

And that goes to the heart of what we're talking about in this book. What we write about in this book which is the story of two political parties in this country who are facing existential challenges trying to sort of keep their equilibrium. And in the case of Republicans, people like Kevin McCarthy, trying to watch this tight rope, Kate, of keeping the Trump faction happy and keeping an old guard, who despise President Trump happy at the same time.

[19:45:01]

And it's not easy, because it's basically two parties in one.

BOLDUAN: And what I'm also seeing, this is not a book about the past. It's actually about the present and absolute future. This is what it gets that.

You mention material to come, of course, you and Alex, I can't wait to see the book. Who else should be nervous, Jonathan?

MARTIN: We have spent hours an hours an hours interviewing top officials in both political parties, in Washington and state capitals, and city halls across the country. Nearly every page has fresh reporting on it. So, I think readers are going to learn a lot about the 2020 campaign, certainly the aftermath of the campaign, January 6th. They're also going to learn about the Democrats challenges in 2021 and how President Biden has struggled to keep his party together, too.

So, I hope your viewers can preorder a copy tonight on Amazon.

BOLDUAN: Got to get the plug-in. It wouldn't be smart if you didn't.

MARTIN: It's out May 3rd, Kate. Thanks for having me.

BOLDUAN: Wait, what date is it out, Jonathan? I got it.

MARTIN: May 3rd. You're the best. I appreciate it. Bye. BOLDUAN: Thank you.

OUTFRONT next, masks required here but not there. A reporter along with many other Americans in the state of confusion as pains, trains, taxes, all of it, have different mask policies in different cities.

Plus, the blame game. Voters angry about rising prices and some pointing figures at the president.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ever since Mr. Biden took office, everything's been going up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

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[19:50:33]

BOLDUAN: Planes, trains and masks. Our Pete Muntean took just about any type of transportation and what he found was a whole lot of confusion.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PETE MUNTEAN, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): We put the new nationwide patchwork of mask rules at airports and transit hubs to the test.

A mask optional rideshare started my trip from Washington, D.C.

We're going to Union Station. No mask required.

Most people here are still wearing masks -- like Verna Swann, who was boarding our train to Philadelphia.

VERNA SWANN, TRAVELING TO CONNECTICUT: I just feel like I need to take more precautions than anyone else. So --

MUNTEAN: You are just being careful?

SWANN: I'm being careful.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Masks are welcome and remain an important preventive measure.

MUNTEAN: After Monday's sudden end of the federal transportation mask mandate, Amtrak was among the first to announce that masks are now optional.

ANTHONY TISDALE, AMTRAK CONDUCTOR: Thank you, sir.

MUNTEAN: Thank you.

Conductor Anthony Tisdale told me he is going mask-less after months of wearing one on the job.

TISDALE: I'm like, yes! I took it right off.

MUNTEAN: My train took me to Philadelphia Center City Amtrak hub. Philly was one of the few major cities to have an indoor mask mandate. But it was just rescinded.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It changes a lot. So, it has been confusing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I feel like I should wear a mask regardless.

MUNTEAN: My trip continued with a local train to the airport.

Except that here in Philadelphia, one of the mass transit systems where masks are optional, unlike the New York City subway system where masks are still mandatory. The change here happened so abruptly, the signs hasn't been changed yet.

During my travels on Sunday, Philadelphia's airport was one of the few still requiring masks inside the terminal. LAX in Los Angeles is joining the list, along with New York's Kennedy and LaGuardia.

MARY NICHOLS, PHILADELPHIA TRAVELER: I think it's confusing. We all need to be on the same page.

MUNTEAN: But the airports mask rule no longer applies the moment you board.

MUNTEAN: About to go down the jetway, another change in policy. We're leaving the airport where masks were required. Now we're getting on the plane. The transportation mask mandate is over, so I can take my mask off.

Once seated, I did decide to wear a mask. The 32-minute flight back to D.C. was full. It's a new era for travel now governed by personal choice and a patchwork of rules.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MUNTEAN (on camera): Here at Reagan National Airport where we landed, no masks are required. The point is, it's getting harder and harder to know the local mask rules as you are traveling. Two examples, Philadelphia International Airport just told us that mask rules there are loosening, whereas LAX, the mask rules are tightening. You can still wear a mask while you're traveling, in fact, the CDC recommends it -- Kate.

BOLDUAN: Pete, thank you.

OUTFRONT next, stocks plummeting today as inflation hits home. It has Democrats on edge.

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[19:57:14] BOLDUAN: The Dow plunging almost 1,000 points, this after the Fed chairman floated an interest rate hike to tame inflation. Democrats are now bracing for impact.

Jeff Zeleny is OUTFRONT.

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MARIAMA DAVIS, STORE MANAGER, THE BEEHIVE BOTIQUE: When you go to the grocery store, it feels like you're shopping in Hawaii.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): But Mariama Davis live in Georgia and feels the sting of inflation for herself, and customers at her boutique, The Beehive.

DAVIS: The idea the eggs are $3 now is -- that's a lot. People have their families to feed. So if they have an option between buying a gift or putting food on the table, I'm going to expect folks to put food on the table.

ZELENY: Six months before voters decide of Democrats maintain control of Congress, a sour mood is hanging over the economy.

As inflation looms as a major issue in a national election for the first time in 1980, some blame President Biden.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ever since Mr. Biden took office, everything's been going up.

ZELENY: Others do not.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's a number of things. I wouldn't just blame President Biden solely.

ZELENY: Yet, it's a problem he owns, and one of the biggest challenges facing the White House.

At Daddy D'z barbecue, owner Christianah Coker-Jackson sees inflation everywhere.

CHRISTIANAH COKER-JACKSON, OWNER, DADDY D'Z BARBECUE: I love that.

ZELENY: From paper goods to the cost of meat, to how often people are dining out.

COKER-JACKSON: We are not seeing the same amount of traffic that we normally do. And I think that's the fear of just spending with the top of inflation, inflation, inflation. Customers are scared.

ZELENY: And as a Democrat, she is scared of the consequences come November.

COKER-JACKSON: If we can't get out and vote for the midterms, then all the work we did in 2020 is not really going to matter. Because we're going to have a handicap president. ZELENY: Georgia is also a hot political battleground, which Biden

narrowly won in 2020. This year, it will help determine whether Democrats hold the Senate by reelecting Raphael Warnock -- his early campaign ads trying to redirect any economic blame.

SEN. RAPHAEL WARNOCK (D-GA): What if I told you shipping container companies have been making record profits while prices have been skyrocketing on you? That's why I'm pushing to hold them accountable.

ZELENY: That message is competing with loud Republican criticism.

POLITICAL AD: Joe Biden's ruining our country.

ZELEN: Jen Jordan, a state senator who turned a suburban district from red to blue, and is now running for attorney general, knows the Democrats faces headwinds. But she said Republicans have not offered an alternative.

JEN JORDAN (D), GEORGIA STATE SENATOR: We're still in the middle of a pandemic, right? So, what people do is they respond to how they are feeling. How are their lives, right? They are also going to tag the president for that.

But look, we have got 1 million miles to go before November.

ZELENY: Back at The Beehive where we first met Davis a year ago, she then urged people to give Biden time.

DAVIS: Just be patient. Like, it's coming. Everything doesn't happen overnight. Folks know that.

ZELENY: Now, she adds this caveat.

DAVIS: Patient but frustrated. Just frustrated. Just would like to get the relief that we need so we can start operating how used to.

ZELENY: Jeff Zeleny, CNN, Atlanta.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BOLDUAN: And thank you for joining us tonight.

"AC360" starts now.