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Erin Burnett Outfront
Trump Picks Gaetz To Lead DOJ, Which Investigated Both Men; Tulsi Gabbard For DNI; Melania Trump MIA. Aired 7-8p ET
Aired November 13, 2024 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[19:00:34]
ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: OUTFRONT next:
Trump -- breaking news, Trump making a mockery of the Justice Department, naming Matt Gaetz to be Americas next attorney general. Outrage tonight coming from Democrats and Republicans, loud and clear at this hour.
Plus, Tulsi Gabbard tapped for director of national intelligence. The same Tulsi Gabbard who has cast doubt on U.S. intelligence and repeats Russian propaganda.
And Melania Trump MIA, snubbing the Bidens today, likely not moving back into the White House. She really doesn't care, do you?
Let's go OUTFRONT.
And good evening. I'm Erin Burnett.
OUTFRONT tonight, the breaking news F you to America. That's a quote from Trump's White House attorney, Ty Cobb, about the president- elect's nomination of Matt Gaetz to be the nation's next attorney general. We'll be speaking to Ty in a moment.
"Axios" tonight with a simple headline: Trump's middle finger, and that image.
But this is a bipartisan disdain. Republicans and Democrats alike aghast at the announcement, which is clearly intended to mock the office of attorney general. Otherwise, how to explain nominating someone who has said this about the agency he has been selected to lead.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. MATT GAETZ (R-FL): We either get this government back on our side or we defund and get rid of, abolish the FBI, CDC, ATF, DOJ -- every last one of them -- if they do not come to heel.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Republican Senator Lisa Murkowski just moments ago, calling Gaetz an unserious candidate in her words and saying, we need to have a serious attorney general, and I'm looking forward to the opportunity to consider somebody that is serious.
This one was not on my bingo card.
Well, the scandal prone, conspiracy spewing Congressman Matt Gaetz has one very important asset when it comes to how Trump sees him.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GAETZ: This is Donald Trump's party, and I'm a Donald Trump Republican.
We are on a mission to rescue and save this country. And we ride or die with Donald John Trump to the end.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: And that's the way it is, ride or die with Donald Trump to the end. That is how Matt Gaetz has led his political career. There has been no bigger defender of Donald Trump, no matter what the cause.
I mean, you could go and cause after cause, but I'll just give you the 2020 election.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GAETZ: An election that was stolen as a consequence of illegal last minute changes to the rules.
REP. JAMIE RASKIN (D-MD): Here's the question I want to ask you. Let's just start with basics. Do you accept that Joe Biden won the 2020 presidential election?
GAETZ: I accept that Joe Biden is the president.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: And he's also spoken out on the conspiracy theories, surrounding the FBI on January 6th.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GAETZ: It's reasonable to ask whether or not the FBI has engaged in a playbook where first, they infiltrate an organization and then they try to bring that organization to the point of criminal conduct as a mechanism to try to bring it down.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Well, when it comes to Trump's trials, and this is important, right, because this gets right at the whole point here attorney general of justice, Matt Gaetz was also defender number one.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GAETZ: We would be remiss if we did not mention this corrupt judge. This is a made up crime. (END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: But none of those reasons are actually why many Republicans are so appalled by the choice. They are disgusted and shocked for many other reasons. At this moment, Matt Gaetz is the very moment that I'm speaking is under investigation by the House Ethics Committee, by his own colleagues, because of allegations that he quote, engaged in sexual misconduct and illicit drug use, accepted improper gifts, dispensed special privileges and favors to individuals with whom he had a personal relationship, and sought to obstruct government investigations of his conduct.
Well, that is a whole litany of awful. And Republicans do have a problem with that. Republican Congressman Max Miller saying, quote, Gaetz has a better shot at having dinner with Queen Elizabeth II than being confirmed by the Senate. You get the joke.
And Republican Congressman John Duarte saying, quote, Rep. Matt Gaetz is under ethics investigations by the House Ethics Committee. He would be a compromised AG. There are better choices.
Like Gaetz was under an FBI investigation into whether he broke federal sex trafficking laws and had a relationship with a 17 year old. Gaetz denied the allegations. The investigation was eventually closed without charges, but it did not stop powerful Republicans like Kevin McCarthy from speaking out about Gaetz.
[19:05:05]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KEVIN MCCARTHY (R), FORMER HOUSE SPEAKER: If there's anybody who should go to trial, I mean, Gaetz is one who should be convicted in a trial.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Again, he's under investigation by the House Ethics Committee for all those things. And more right now as we speak. That, of course, would end if he became attorney general.
And whether that happens right now is actually all in the hands of John Thune. And that is a really crucial conversation.
But amidst all the furor today about Matt Gaetz, one Democrats comments stood out Senator John Fetterman of Pennsylvania tweeting, quote, there have been serious qualified individuals nominated to pose like Rubio or Stefanik. Eric Schmitt would be a solid choice for AG. But Dem opinions on Gaetz aren't that interesting the good ones will come from my GOP colleagues to justify a vote for that -- and I'll just let you read it off the screen.
But Gaetz tonight is not the only choice raising alarms. In fact alarms were already raised, and then the Gaetz bomb dropped. And so, everybody's eyes turned over there. But don't miss this. Trump also tapped the former Congresswoman Tulsi
Gabbard, to be the director of national intelligence. Gabbard made a dubious name for herself when she broke with U.S. intelligence over Syria, specifically over Bashir al Assad's regime being responsible for a chemical weapons attack that killed dozens of innocent people and civilians in 2017.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: You say you have doubts about these generals providing that kind of proof to the president?
TULSI GABBARD, FORMER U.S. REPRESENTATIVE: Yes. I'm skeptical.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Senator Mitt Romney has called Gabbard out for parroting false Russian propaganda. He used those exact words. He said she parroted Russian propaganda, and he added, and I quote him again, her treasonous lies may well cost lives.
And tonight, the conservative outlet, 'The Washington Examiner", saying Republican senators face a choice between putting the nation first or submission to Trump. After all, if Gabbard is approved, Chinese President Xi and Russian President Vladimir Putin will have an ideological sympathizer holding the keys to the U.S. intelligence community crown jewels.
Kristen Holmes is OUTFRONT live in Washington, beginning our coverage this hour.
Kristen, Senator Murkowski calling Gaetz an unserious candidate. But the reality of it is, of course, Trump has made this nomination. He is serious about it. Is this what he expected?
KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, I just got off the phone with a senior advisor who said that Donald Trump was expecting the backlash. The entire team was expecting the backlash and that they don't care about what they are seeing.
Now, essentially, this person said that Gaetz is perfectly positioned for what Donald Trump wants in an attorney general, somebody who he believes that being Donald Trump is an effective communicator who can go out there and put out the message that Donald Trump wants out there when it comes to the Department of Justice. And its something that Donald Trump said that he has seen Matt Gaetz do time and time again.
You played some of the clips there talking about getting rid of the Department of Justice, talking about defunding the Department of Justice. All of this is a larger plan that Donald Trump has openly spoken about when it comes to how he wants the government to be run and part of that means a Department of Justice that operates completely at the behest of the president of the United States as part of the executive branch.
So one of the jobs that he needed to fill and one of the most critical jobs in this administration, is an attorney general who will go along with those plans and Donald Trump, I'm told, met with a series of individuals over the last several days and was unimpressed that he made this decision almost last minute. It was today and wanted to go with somebody who he had seen pushing forward the same level of messaging that he wanted about the Department of Justice.
And it's not just the messaging. You've said this. We know we've heard this from Donald Trump's allies as well. Matt Gaetz is the truest loyalist to the -- to what that term means. He has been nothing but next to the president every step of the way, whether it comes to the election in 2020. And now whether it comes to how he views the Department of Justice.
At the end of the day, Donald Trump wants to get rid of the deep state. When he talks about the deep state, he is Department of Justice and using a lot of the messaging we've heard Matt Gaetz also use publicly when trying to talk about what their plans are for the Department of Justice moving forward.
BURNETT: All right. Kristen, thank you very much.
OUTFRONT now, Democratic Congressman Eric Swalwell, who sits on the House Judiciary Committee.
So, of course, attorney general are going to be crucial for what you'll be doing over the next couple of years.
So, here we are. What do you think?
REP. ERIC SWALWELL (D-CA): Well, to the president, I say no seriously, who is your pick for attorney general? Because this pick is a middle finger to Democrats and sane Republicans.
And it's not being panned only by Democrats, Erin. My Republican friends in the House are also clowning this pick. They're saying it publicly, as you just read off, but they're also saying it privately. And that was the mood earlier at the Capitol.
And so, you know, Donald Trump not known for having a sense of humor.
[19:10:03]
Credit to you. You landed a good joke on the country. But this is a position considering what it oversees -- counterterrorism, money laundering, public corruption, child trafficking -- it's worthy of being taken seriously, and also should tell you everything about Matt Gaetz that he would allow himself to be used by the president to try and own the libs with something that we know is never going to pass in the Senate.
BURNETT: Well, okay. Can I just ask you about that? Are you sure about that?
SWALWELL: Yeah, I'm sure. And I say that because you still have in the Senate, by the way, at least three individuals who on the Republican side who voted to convict Donald Trump. So you still have Senators Cassidy, Murkowski and Collins. You have Senator Tillis in North Carolina who just saw his state become a little bit bluer, although Kamala Harris did not win there, we elected a statewide governor and attorney general and the former governor, Roy Cooper, may be running against him.
So you have at least four reasonable people who are not -- I don't think going to be inclined to move on this. And then John Thune just beat Donald Trump's choice to be majority leader of the Senate. Everyone from the Trump camp was projecting this week that they wanted Rick Scott and John Thune creamed Rick Scott.
So I just don't see this.
(CROSSTALK)
BURNETT: And that happened on our secret ballot which is the irony of that.
SWALWELL: -- Democrats have to, you know --
BURNETT: -- that under secret ballot, Republicans chose -- chose the candidate that Trump did not want. I hope the irony is not lost on anyone there.
But you know, okay, you say what you say about John Thune, but Trump has said that he wants whoever is the majority leader. And now, of course, that's John Thune. It's unclear what John Thune will do, but the Trump wants to basically anybody that he nominates can be appointed during recess.
So in other words, the Senate doesn't even get a vote. So John Thune has to take him on directly on that. Do you really think he's going to do that? It's essentially what would be the first thing he does.
SWALWELL: I believe that Senators Murkowski, Collins, Cassidy, Tillis and, of course the Democrats are going to put pressure on him not to do that. The American people also are not going to be quiet about this.
But I would just suggest to you, as disturbing as this is, Matt Gaetz may be a lapdog for the president, but that doesn't mean we as Democrats in Congress have to chase every ball that the president throws.
I think in a way, again, this is just trying to fire us up, spin us up. It's the beginning of a negotiation for the president. I've been dealing with this guy for nine years on the Judiciary, Intelligence, Homeland Security Committee. I've seen this move before, and I have confidence in the way that this is going to work out.
BURNETT: All right. Well, Congressman Swalwell, I appreciate your time, and thank you very much.
SWALWELL: Yeah.
BURNETT: All right. And joining us now, "New York Times" reporter Astead Herndon and Marc Caputo, national political reporter for "The Bulwark".
And I appreciate both of you being here.
So, Marc, I know you have some new reporting on Trump's thinking behind this pick. And interesting you heard the congressman's point of view on it. You just spoke with a Trump adviser though, just a couple of moments ago. What did you learn?
MARC CAPUTO, NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER, THE BULWARK: Well, I'd say I think Eric Swalwell, with all due respect to him is as wrong as two left shoes. This is not a serious about this. Donald Trump is serious about this.
Both Donald Trump and Matt Gaetz feel aggrieved by the Justice Department and Gaetz has been a long time adviser, well tested by fire in the president's eyes, well trusted by the president or the president-elect, and if he gets in that office, you can rest assured according to Trump's advisers and the people who are familiar with his thinking that Matt Gaetz is going to investigate the investigators, both those who investigated him and those who investigated former President Trump.
So this is a serious thing that they're doing. And in their minds, it doesn't really matter if the Democrats don't like this. What matters to them is that they have the votes in the Senate.
Now, it should be pointed out that there is this sort of new procedure, a new move to allow for recess appointments, that John Thune now, the Senate Republican leader has basically agreed to, and Matt Gaetz was among those who helped sort of formulate that plan and policy with former President Trump to get Thune to do that.
And so, if he doesn't get confirmed, you could possibly see a recess appointment made of Matt Gaetz by former President Trump or President Trump at the time. So I don't think this is a negotiation. There's really no indication that there is.
BURNETT: And if Thune, you know, as you say, goes ahead with those recess appointments, here we are. I mean, Astead, what are you hearing?
ASTEAD HERNDON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Yeah, similar to Marc, I think that this is a pick that should be taken seriously at least because the Trump advisers are serious themselves. And I think we should also see this as Trump following through on a campaign promise. He promised vengeance, he promised revenge. He made clear that this would be a second term in which retribution would be part of the -- would be part of the ideology.
And that's what this pick represents. I was in the audience when at CPAC, when Matt Gaetz made --
BURNETT: That comment about getting get rid of every single --
HERNDON: Yes, ATF, DOJ, FBI, there was rapid applause in the crowd. This has been something that the kind of MAGA ecosystem has talked about as a means of getting payback for what they feel happened to Donald Trump.
[19:15:03]
And I would just say, I don't think there's any indication that we should assume that Republican senators won't go along with this or that the recess appointment kind of switch that. Marc is talking about won't allow this pick to come through.
I am of the belief that because of the way the results went, there is so much -- there's so much of a sense that Donald Trump has a mandate to govern as he wishes, that I think that there will be -- there's going to be an interest. There's going to be the first test, how much the Republican Congress is willing to push back on this.
BURNETT: And he wants that test right away. I mean, now, Marc, I was sharing what a lot of Republicans said more than Democrats, because obviously, you know its now Trump's party and they obviously had a broad based disgust for this.
Now, Elon Musk has spoken out about Gaetz as attorney general. He posts the hammer of justice is coming, a clear endorsement for the whole idea.
So, in all the reporting, Marc, that you've been doing on Musk's influence on Trump and his role, say in a decision like this with Matt Gaetz, how much did he push gates for AG?
CAPUTO: Oh, I don't think he had to. I think this was Gaetz from the get go. One of the advisers I spoke to for President Trump had said that all the other people who wanted to be AG talked about it as if it was some sort of judicial appointment, right.
And they talked -- and I'm censoring myself because there's some F- bombs and the like. But they talked in these high minded ways about the Constitution and the like, and it was Gaetz who said, yeah, I'll go in and I'll cut some F-ing heads, and that's what's appealing to Donald Trump. Not only is Gaetz willing to do it, not only is he able to do it, he has a certain zeal to do it, and hes demonstrated his ability to be loyal to Trump and to be able to sort of prosecute his agenda. And that's what you're going to see.
BURNETT: So, Astead, last night, Pete Hegseth, the news broke on that, and there were some who thought, okay, well, that's the one that that won't pass muster to your point, with recess appointments, all of them would but that's the one.
Then Tulsi Gabbard comes out and you have a lot of very serious Republicans who have an incredibly serious problem with Tulsi Gabbard. Again, just pretend Democrats don't matter.
Then you get Matt Gaetz. So which all three of those then presumably are all real and in the world that were talking about with, say, a recess appointment all three of them will get their nominations?
HERNDON: I don't think its a sure yes, but I don't think we can act like it's a sure no. BURNETT: Right.
HERNDON: And I definitely think that we should. I think this is us recognizing that Donald Trump was clear as day about how he intended to govern, and he plans to follow through on that promises. And so it's going to be interesting how Democrats play this, how Republicans play this, too because will they try to kind of fend off the worst of these, maybe Matt Gaetz, because maybe that position has more power and let other ones through, or are they going to try to fight them on all fronts?
I think this is also a test of some of the resistance energy that was very different in 2016, '17. You had an immediate reaction after Trump's win and Democrats very enthusiastic, pressuring others to push back on every single thing. There hasn't been that grassroots energy there this time either.
So will the public -- will the electorate speak out on this? I mean, one question I have is, is the for the voting public who put Donald Trump back in office, was that a rejection of Biden and the status quo, or was that an endorsement of the MAGA agenda, of the Gaetz as attorney general?
I don't think we really know that yet.
BURNETT: We don't know.
HERNDON: Those type of appointments will give us clues on that front, based on the reaction we see from the electorate.
BURNETT: Right. That's going to be crucial, right? With the people who voted for the politician, housing prices. This is -- this is maybe not what they signed up for, because if they don't hear that stuff coming from the public, I don't think you'll see Republican senators go out of their way to oppose Donald Trump.
HERNDON: All right. Well, Astead, thank you. Marc, thank you. Great to have you both and all of your reporting.
And next, our breaking news continues. Matt Gaetz has just resigned from Congress ahead of what he thinks is going to be his confirmation. His confirmation battle first.
Plus, Trump making light today of third term, bringing up a third term. Former Trump White House lawyer Ty Cobb is going to listen to exactly what Trump said. We'll tell you what he hears. He's OUTFRONT next.
And a special report this hour on Trump's controversial pick for defense secretary, who is Pete Hegseth, the Fox News anchor, and what does he believe?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETE HEGSETH, FOX NEWS HOST: I'm straight up just saying we should not have women in combat roles. (END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:23:35]
BURNETT: And the breaking news, Trump's pick for Attorney General Matt Gaetz just resigning from his seat in the House. The first step for the Republican congressman to join Trump's cabinet. It ends the ethics investigation that he's facing into allegations that he may have, quote, engaged in sexual misconduct and illicit drug use, among other things.
OUTFRONT now, Ty Cobb, former Trump White House lawyer.
So, Ty, you called the nomination of Matt Gaetz for attorney general of the United States and I'm quoting you an F you to America. You don't use the words lightly. Tell me why.
TY COBB, FORMER TRUMP WHITE HOUSE LAWYER: Yeah, this is just a shocking event and intentionally so I mean, you know, he's a -- he's a -- he's a disrupter. Trump is.
And -- but Matt Gaetz is, you know, is just simply unqualified, both academically and professionally ethically, morally and experientially. He has no business being in this conversation. He doesn't have any, you know, leadership and it's quite the contrary.
I mean, the one thing he did that he's famous for, he got eight votes for, out of his own party, which was deposing Kevin McCarthy. You know, when he walked into the White House, when I was in the White House, you know, serious staffers, you know, threw up red flags. They looked the other way and hoped he wasn't there to visit him, visit them.
So this is not -- this is just not a serious choice. This is a choice that is contemptuous.
[19:25:01]
I think anybody who served in the Justice Department historically, and most of the people that are there today, you know are deeply saddened by this. And it diminishes the pride with which they associate themselves with the Department of Justice. Hopefully, this will be a chapter that passes quickly. Hopefully, it wont even get to a hearing.
And with regard to the discussion of recess appointments, I think the one thing that Trump could have done that quashed his ability to get recess appointments or ensured that if recess appointments are approved, they wont be approved at the cabinet level was what he did today in terms of nominating Matt Gaetz.
BURNETT: That's interesting and obviously John Thune now is going to be majority leader as opposed to Rick Scott who is Trump's choice.
COBB: Right. BURNETT: So you mentioned that you met with him. And I just want to ask you about that, Ty, because you did have meetings with gates at Trump's request. You met with him at Trump's direction at the White House. I believe, many times, right, during the Mueller investigation when Gaetz was on the Judiciary Committee.
Can you -- what can you share about those interactions? What he was like? And, obviously, how's leading to your point of view of his lack of fitness for this?
COBB: Well, you know, ethically, there's not a lot I can share, but I can say that, you know, he was there basically to curry favor with the president. He wanted to be the president's point on the spear in terms of attacking Mueller. You know, my -- my -- one of one of the things I demanded from the president in taking the job was that the criticisms of Mueller would be infrequent and muted.
And Gaetz was acting contrary to, you know, the goals that I had and the belief that I had in terms of what was important to get the case to a conclusion and demonstrate that, you know, whatever else Trump may have done, historically, and has done since, the one thing he didn't do was the Russian collusion, and that was going to be obscured by the viciousness of the attacks on Mueller that Gaetz launched.
BURNETT: So President-elect Trump today told House Republicans in Washington, and I quote, I suspect I won't be running again unless you do something.
Now, Republicans are saying that that was just a joke. What do you think?
COBB: I don't -- well, Trump is not a jokester when it comes to those things. There's always some desire. Keep in mind, you know, my oft stated view is, you know, Trump is a crippled narcissist. Nothing happens. Its not, you know, in his self-interest or in an effort to accumulate self esteem, praise, glorification and wealth.
You know, this is -- this -- you know, the idea of power to him is, is like a narcotic. So, you know, if Trump could run again for a third term, if the Constitution permitted it, he would do it. I don't think that's, you know, a possibility. I don't think there's anything Congress can do other than pass a constitutional amendment, which is not going to happen.
So, I think Trump certainly would love to, you know, be a dictator for life, but that's not going to happen. But yes, I don't think it was a joke. I think Trump would -- would love that. And he was signaling -- signaling that but that's not going to happen.
BURNETT: All right. Well, Ty, I appreciate you. Thank you.
COBB: Nice -- nice to be with you, Erin. Take care.
BURNETT: All right. You, too.
And next, a Republican civil war breaking out tonight over Matt Gaetz. One Republican warning their careers will be over if they stop his nomination.
Plus, where is Melania? The president-elect's wife was not there at the White House today as we are learning that she does not have any intention of moving back to Washington.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:32:28]
BURNETT: Breaking news, blindsided. That's how many Senate Republicans feel by Donald Trump's choice of Matt Gaetz to be attorney general. Sources telling CNN there were audible gasps on the Hill as the announcement was popping up on people's phones. They were hearing from reporters.
Here's how Republican Senator Susan Collins described how she felt when she heard the news.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
SEN. SUSAN COLLINS (R-ME): I was shocked that he has been nominated. If the nomination proceeds, I'm sure that there will be an extensive background check by the FBI and public hearings and a lot of questions asked.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
BURNETT: Republican Kevin Cramer also raising the issue very explicitly of the background check from the FBI, making it clear many perhaps feel that that will block it before they have to deal with it.
Manu Raju is OUTFRONT live on Capitol Hill.
And, Manu, I mean, you have been trying to talk to Republicans tonight. There you were there witnessing those audible gasps what are they telling you?
MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, it's very clear, Erin, that this is going to be a rocky road to confirmation because a lot of Republicans are concerned about a number of things that Matt Gaetz has said or done over the years. His efforts to try to oust Kevin McCarthy as speaker successful efforts in leading that charge, the fact that he's facing a house ethics investigation into sexual misconduct, something that he denies as well, his defense of Donald Trump in the aftermath of January 6th. And it really goes down the line.
It does not align with a lot of the views of the Republican senators, who have the votes to confirm him. Now that doesn't mean that everyone wants to talk about it. In fact, I tried to talk to a lot of Republican senators tonight about Matt Gaetz being nominated to the post. And they made clear they were not ready to engage.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm having trouble. RAJU: What about Matt Gaetz?
Do you support him?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have confirmation process.
SEN. LINDSEYGRAHAM (R-SC): I don't know yet. I have to think about that one.
RAJU: Do you have any concerns about it?
GRAHAM: We'll see.
RAJU: Do you think Matt Gaetz is confirmable?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We'll find out, won't we?
RAJU: Senator Kennedy, what do you think of Matt Gaetz as attorney general?
SEN. JOHN KENNEDY (R-LA): Happy Thanksgiving.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
RAJU: And several members on the Senate Judiciary Committee which, of course, will play the key role in deciding whether or not to advance that nomination, some of those members, including Senators John Cornyn and John -- and Thom Tillis, both of them had concerns about, or at least would not say that they would back Gaetz's nomination.
Also, the new Senate majority leader, the incoming Senate majority leader, Senator John Thune, indicating today that this would be an Advice and Consent process.
[19:35:04]
It would go through the regular Senate process and not saying if he believes that Gaetz could be confirmed to the post -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Manu.
OUTFRONT now, Kate Bedingfield and Shermichael Singleton.
And, Kate, you just heard some of the Republicans that Manu spoke to, right? They don't want to talk about it at this point when it comes to Matt Gaetz. Others, though, have been very open.
So what do you think happens here? I mean, you know, you can have a big firestorm and then eventually people just get on board. I mean, that's what history would show is going to happen, right? That's the precedent.
But here we are. Do you think this will actually be a bridge too far for enough Republicans to block a nomination?
KATE BEDINGFIELD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I mean, look, time and again, we've seen Trump say or do things that we expected Senate Republicans would not fall in line behind and they inevitably have.
So I think past precedent plus the combination of Trump's, you know, frankly overwhelming, you know, political victory last week suggests that ultimately, if Trump is really serious about putting muscle behind this nomination and getting it over the finish line, will it probably get there probably. But I think the big questions are, which were kind of just alluded to, or, you know, what comes up in the vet, you know, are there things that come up that are just that are so appalling and unacceptable that, you know enough Republican senators walk away?
I think the other big question here, though, is, is this a genuine nomination or is this an exit ramp for Matt Gaetz to leave the House to have the oversight? You know, ethics investigation into him closed, which happened effectively when he resigned today? I mean, is this Trump giving him, you know an exit ramp and a graceful exit?
And I -- and I think we actually don't know the answer to that yet. So its going to be really interesting to see how this how this develops.
BURNETT: Shermichael, so earlier today, Republican Senator Markwayne Mullin was on with my friend Jake Tapper, and he said, Gaetz is really going to have to sell himself lots of questions, right, and the reason that Mullin's comments stood out is because he has spoken out about Matt Gaetz before. Here's what he told Manu.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. MARKWAYNE MULLIN (R-OK): He was accused of sleeping with an underage girl. And there's a reason why no one in the conference came and defended him, because we had all seen the videos floor that all of us had walked away of the girls that he had slept with. He bragged about how he would crush ED medicine and chase it with -- with an energy drink so he could go all night.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: I mean, you know, I don't know, it's like here we are, and we got to hear this stuff and talk about all this stuff. And, you know, frankly, it's beneath everybody. But this is the situation that we're in.
So do Republicans get -- get past all of that. Get past the House ethics. Do they get past it, Shermichael?
SHERMICHAEL SINGLETON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Look, I want to approach this from two different perspectives, Erin. Procedurally, you can't afford to lose three Republicans. You lose 3 or 4, then you can't get confirmed. So they got to work on whipping the votes.
From the president-elect's perspective, I think he wants someone to come in as a wrecking ball. And I say to this, based upon his experiences with DOJ, based upon his experiences with prosecutors writ large, I think Trump would probably argue that prosecutors have too much power, too much discretion, and he wants someone that he believes would be loyal to him and sort of dismantling that sort of prosecutorial state, if you will and I think from the president elects perspective, Gaetz is probably the best individual to accomplish that.
But again, everyone has process. You can't afford to lose too many of them in order to get them confirmed.
BURNETT: All right. And I'll note, of course, Gaetz has denied any wrongdoing. He was not charged by the DOJ. That House ethics investigation obviously was going on until he resigned a few minutes ago.
So, Kate, Tommy Tuberville, one of Trump's most loyal allies in the Senate obviously supports this. He made that clear because he had a warning for any Republican who would consider opposing the nomination. Here's what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. TOMMY TUBERVILLE (R-AL): At the end of the day, President Trump was elected by an enormous vote, and he deserves a team around him that he wants. It's not us to determine that. Vote with President Trump. This is the last chance were going to have of saving this country. And if you want to get in the way, fine. But we're going to try to get you out of the Senate, too, if you try to do that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: How serious of a threat is it, Kate/
BEDINGFIELD: I think it's probably pretty serious. I mean, again, I think the victory that Trump notched on Tuesday, you know, he expressed a lot of support in, you know, we saw his vote increase in states across the country where these senators are going to be looking at their own, looking in their own backyards and saying, you know, do I really want Trump right out of the gate?
I mean, it's such a, you know, it's such a shame that Trump is chooses to surround himself with people like this who have such, you know, appalling lapses of character and ethics, you know, it's just unfortunate.
[19:40:03]
There are many brilliant conservative minds in this country who would make qualified attorneys general.
But, you know unfortunate that Trump's chosen to do this. You know, I suppose it's also always possible that he, you know, he throws gates out there as kind of chum in the water. Its often true in a in a transition in confirmation fights that somebody becomes the lightning rod and sort of actually makes it easier for everybody else to get confirmed.
BURNETT: Yeah.
BEDINGFIELD: Maybe that's what Trump is doing here, except I will say, you know, Trump hates to lose. So I'm not sure if that's a strategy that he'd be trying to employ here. BURNETT: Shermichael, I want to ask you about something else. Actually
until 3:30 today, I wanted to -- I was planning, we were all planning to lead our show with this because I thought it was very significant. You had the Trump pick. You know, clearly the supported pick for majority leader of Rick Scott, you know, backed by everyone from, you know, Tucker Carlson and on lose -- lose to John Thune.
John Thune, an establishment Republican, okay, not the MAGA choice at all. And he won, and he won in a secret ballot because the Republicans nobody was going to know who they voted for so they could vote what they really wanted to do. And when Trump wasn't looking and couldn't identify it, they didn't vote for the guy he wanted. They voted for John Thune. Scott didn't even make it to the second round of voting.
Is there anything to read into that, Shermichael, or do we just take away from it well, that's what happens in a secret ballot? And that's the only time you're ever going to get one. So that's the last time you're going to see something like this.
SINGLETON: I mean, look, I think if it were a public ballot, they probably would have voted for Rick Scott.
BURNETT: Yeah.
SINGLETON: If I'm being honest, I just got to be candid here, but I think Thune, you know, look, he's an institutionalist. He's been there a long time. When you've been there a long time, you sort of befriended a lot of the folks there.
I'm not surprised that many of them stood with him. Rick Scott has sort of had some disagreements with members in the past, when he and Mitch McConnell had some back and forth about a year ago, so I wasn't necessarily shocked by the ultimate outcome here.
Look I think the senators are looking at the mandate that the former that the president elect has I think they're going to give him as much leeway as they possibly can. And then I think you're going to see a little pushback here and there. I think the president elect sort of likes that that battle in politics when he was with the president, he said, look, it can be a rough sport. And I think a bit of I think he enjoys that a little bit.
BURNETT: All right. Well, thank you both very much. I appreciate it.
SINGLETON: Thanks, Erin.
BUNETT: And next, you know, when you say the former president, the current president, the president elect, they were all together today. And one person not there was the former, and future First Lady Melania Trump. We've learned she does not plan to return to the White House full time. New reporting on that tonight.
And then quote, an effing nightmare. Senior military official stunned by the former Fox host that Trump has tapped to run the Pentagon. And we have some new details today. But digging into who Pete Hegseth is and what he believes in. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:46:54]
BURNETT: Tonight, the former and incoming first lady, Melania Trump, who has not been seen publicly in a week, declined an invitation to join her husband at the White House today.
Officials say First Lady Jill Biden gave a handwritten congratulatory note to President-elect Trump to pass along to Melania on her behalf. This is CNN is reporting that Melania Trump is not expected to live at the White House full time during her husband's second term.
Kristen Holmes is back OUTFRONT with this report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
HOLMES (voice-over): President-elect Donald Trump back in Washington for a triumphant return.
Among his small entourage, a slate of advisers and billionaire Elon Musk. Notably absent, former First Lady Melania Trump despite an invitation from current First Lady Jill Biden.
In a statement, Trump's team not giving a reason for her absence, instead writing, quote, her husbands return to the Oval Office to commence the transition process is encouraging and she wishes him great success.
After carving out her own approach to being first lady during Trump's first term, sources telling CNN Melania Trump's absence is likely to be a staple of Trump's second term in the White House, with Mrs. Trump unlikely to move back to Washington full time, she herself indicating she has a better understanding of the role and how to handle it this time around.
MELANIA TRUMP, FUTURE FIRST LADY: I'm not anxious because this time is different. I have much more experience, much more knowledge. I was in the White House before so when you go in, you know exactly what to expect.
HOLMES: Discussions about when and how the next first lady will spend most of her time are ongoing, though she's expected to split her time between Palm Beach and New York, where her son Barron will be attending college.
M. TRUMP: I could not say I'm an empty nester. I don't feel that way.
HOLMES: The decision unsurprising. On the campaign trail, the former first lady was rarely seen by her husbands side, appearing only a handful of times, including at his announcement and the convention, her only speaking role at her husbands Madison Square Garden rally.
M. TRUMP: Let us start together with a shared vision that builds on American greatness. Let's seize this moment and create a country for tomorrow, the future that we deserve. HOLMES: Before appearing again on election night after his victory.
In a series of interviews promoting her memoir, the incoming first lady said this about her husband's presidency.
INTERVIEWER: Would you have married Donald Trump if you had a crystal ball that said he would be president?
M. TRUMP: Huh? That's an interesting question.
(LAUGHTER)
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HOLMES: Yeah, a very interesting answer there, Erin.
We obviously know that Melania Trump herself was not super happy being in the spotlight, but one thing I will note is I talked to a number of people close to her and the former president who say that Melania Trump will still be present at the White House for big events, including things like state dinners. She will also still have a platform, even if she is not physically living in the White House full time -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Kristen, thank you very much.
[19:50:01]
And OUTFRONT now, Evan Osnos, staff writer at "The New Yorker", author of many must-read books including the biography of Joe Biden.
So, Evan, lets just start with this with Melania Trump skipping the traditional White House meeting, and we're now learning not going to live in Washington full time, according to her current plans, as Kristen is reporting.
How rare is that for a first lady?
EVAN OSNOS, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: It's completely rare. Look, the last time a first lady hasn't lived in the White House was Bess Truman. And that was only because they were renovating the building. Before that, you have to go all the way back to the 1800s.
I think some people might say, look, is this trivial? Why does it really matter? The point is actually that this a reminder of something and a preview of a kind of disregard for the institution of the presidency that the Trump family has, the sense that look, not everything is in the law. It's not all codified in the rules.
Some of this is about the ritual. The public demonstration of what it means to be in this office.
BURNETT: Right, the pomp and circumstance kind of that. Yes. And when you put it that way. So today she obviously did not come back invited Trump, and Trump came and they had a very cordial meeting. I have to say, you know, you look at them sitting together and I don't think there's anyone who doesn't go, wow, I cant believe you know that they're sitting there like that. No signs of bitterness from Biden, despite the fact that Trump has said many things about him.
Ill play a few here.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES: Joe Biden was the worst president in the history of our country.
We're going to knock off the Biden crime family.
We have a man that can't put two sentences together. We have a man that doesn't know he's alive.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: So having spent extensive time with Biden, when you saw them together today, what do you think was going through Joe Biden's head?
OSNOS: Well, I think there needs to be a new Academy Award for a certain kind of presidential performance. Look, the reality is Joe Biden has a deep and very personal disdain for Donald Trump even more -- not only for refusing to accept the loss of the 2020 election. It's even more than that.
It's for mocking Paul Pelosi when he was attacked by an intruder in his home. There's a level of real personal contempt. However, Teddy Roosevelt said that the presidency was disinterested services for people all over the nation, meaning you have to be able to pull yourself out of it.
And Joe Biden has 60 days in effect to try to project to Americans that this is larger than just him and Donald Trump.
BURNETT: So right after the meeting Trump announces, so he had not announced at that point, Tulsi Gabbard or Matt Gaetz. I don't know -- I wonder if Joe Biden would have behaved that way if that had happened. I'm curious what you think about that.
What do you what do you make of Trump's timing? He waited until after that meeting.
I think it's partly the meeting. I think it may also be the fact that Donald Trump had just lost something, which is that in the Senate, John Thune was elected, not the person that Donald Trump wanted in that job and really a reminder for all of us that the Senate is becoming more and more an essential institution in putting up the guardrails around Donald Trump's presidency.
BURNETT: Right. Well, and, of course, we were saying the great irony that it is a secret ballot.
OSNOS: Absolutely.
BURNETT: A secret ballot of all this. When you talk about democracy, it was a secret ballot that enabled the GOP to do that.
OSNOS: And done in public. We don't know what they would have done.
BURNETT: Yeah, we don't know. We can we can make our guesses, but we don't know.
All right. Thank you very much, Evan. Great to see you.
And next, new reporting tonight on the former Fox host Trump's pick to lead the Pentagon and why senior military officials are sounding an alarm.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[19:57:36]
BURNETT: Tonight, baffled responses from current and former senior military officials calling the selection of former Fox News host and Army veteran Pete Hegseth ridiculous and an F-ing nightmare. That's what they told our Jim Sciutto. But who really is he?
Alex Marquardt is OUTFRONT.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice- over): It's among the most surprising of Donald Trump's picks so far. Pete Hegseth, a Fox News host set to now run the U.S. military at the Pentagon.
The 44 year old veteran, a stunning choice for defense secretary after Trump named several more classic experienced, national security hands to other posts.
HEGSETH: I'm straight up just saying we should not have women in combat roles.
MARQUARDT: He's someone who has flaunted his controversial views.
HEGSETH: Men in those positions are more capable.
MARQUARDT: And railed against what he sees as a woke military, as he did in this interview that was posted just last week.
HEGSETH: Any general that was involved, general, admiral, whatever that was involved in, any of the DIE woke shit has got to go.
MARQUARDT: Hegseth's crusade on the culture war in the military appears to be what he has most in common with Trump.
TRUMP: The woke generals should be fired immediately.
MARQUARDT: Trump's decision was met with shock by current and former military officials, the choice seeming to come out of left field.
Hegseth has been a weekend host of "Fox and Friends", after serving the military for nearly two decades with tours in both Iraq and Afghanistan.
While in the National Guard, he claims he was barred from serving at President Joe Biden's inauguration because of a cross tattoo that the guard unit found extremist.
HEGSETH: It's back to even the Crusaders. It's long been a Christian symbol and so they used it as an excuse to frame me as an enemy of the state, effectively.
MARQUARDT: Hegseth served at Guantanamo Bay and has defended waterboarding. He also advocated for three U.S. troops accused of murder, including former navy seal Eddie Gallagher, who posed for a trophy photo with the corpse of an ISIS detainee.
HEGSETH: The murder of an ISIS dirtbag.
MARQUARDT: Trump would go on to promote Gallagher and pardon the two others.
Hegseth has cast doubt on the 2020 election and praised January 6th insurrectionists.
HEGSETH: These are people that understand first principles. They love freedom and they love free markets.
MARQUARDT: Hegseth recently moved to Tennessee with his third wife and seven children, where he says he now lives on a farm.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MARQUARDT: After the initial shock of Hegseth announcement, several current and former defense officials who I've been speaking with were very critical of this pick. One senior military official telling me today that it's not a serious choice. Another top former Pentagon official highlighting Hegseth's lack of working in defense policy.
Erin, you have to remember that this is a massive bureaucracy. The Defense Department is the biggest employer in the country with a global presence of some 3 million personnel. At the same time, assuming that Hegseth is confirmed, that military official told me, quote, he's the presidents choice and were going to have to make it work -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Alex, thank you very much.
And thanks to all of you for joining us.
Anderson starts now.
