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Erin Burnett Outfront

Gabbard Sworn In As Trump's Intel Chief, Has Pushed Pro-Russia Views; Judge Lets Trump's "Buyout" Plan Move Forward For Now; Fired Inspectors General Sue Trump Over "Illegal" Terminations; Tonight: American Released From Russian Prison Reunites With Family. Aired 7-8p ET

Aired February 12, 2025 - 19:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[19:00:35]

ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: OUTFRONT next:

The breaking news, Tulsi Gabbard is in as America's director of national intelligence, someone who Russia has embraced. And it comes on the same day Trump says he's making a deal with Putin to end the war in Ukraine. At what cost?

Plus, fired and now coming back. Eight inspectors general now suing Trump to get their jobs back. And one of them is my guest tonight.

And a family feud from the White House to the world stage. Musk's son has been by his side, but his son's mother is saying she's not okay with it.

Let's go OUTFRONT.

(MUSIC)

BURNETT: And good evening. I'm Erin Burnett.

OUTFRONT tonight, the breaking news, Tulsi Gabbard, the United States' new intelligence chief. Gabbard sworn in tonight as the nation's director of national intelligence, someone whose nomination was deeply controversial, even among Republicans, because she has, among other things, embraced Russian talking points and conspiracy theories.

As Mitch McConnell said today when he voted no on her nomination, noting her support for Putin using the word tainted to warn of her intelligence assessments.

And her confirmation does come on the same day that Trump spoke to Putin for 90 minutes, saying he hammered out a deal to end the war in Ukraine, he and Putin, much more on that in a moment. Russia could not be happier with the call today, or with Trump's new director of national intelligence, because Tulsi Gabbard is a household name already in Russia.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Here's what our girlfriend, Tulsi, Tulsi Gabbard, is saying.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Is she some kind of Putin agent?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Yes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: And this comes -- her appointment as there is this major breaking news on Putin and Trump. So Trump says that he is about to sit down with Putin in person after that lengthy 90 minute phone call today about the war in Ukraine.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We had a great call and it lasted for a long time, over an hour. But we had a very good talk with -- people didn't really know what President Putin's thoughts were. But I think I can say with great confidence he wants to see an end.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: Well, Putin does want to see it end. And -- and here's the headline that you can see on sites around the world: Trump and Putin are about to meet. Trump says they've agreed to visit, quote, each other's nations. Putin hasn't been to the United States in a decade. They're planning the first sit down to be in Saudi Arabia.

Now, you might be looking at all this and perhaps scratching your head because where is he? Volodymyr Zelenskyy, remember him? He actually is the president of Ukraine. But what happened was Trump said he would call to inform Zelenskyy about the call with Putin today. They spoke afterwards.

And it seems from what we have heard from Trump, his secretary of defense today, that Zelenskyy is not getting what he's been fighting for. He's not getting all the land back that Russia seized, certainly not getting an invitation to join NATO. They were very clear about that.

But Trump is giving Putin some of what he wants, and that doesn't come out of the blue. Its not just in the context of right now land in Ukraine. It's over years. Trump has had glowing things to say about Putin.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I also have a very good relationship, as you know, with President Putin.

I knew Putin very well. I got along with him, actually, great.

Putin is a nicer person than I am.

So now I like Putin. Now, Putin called me a genius, by the way. (END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: Well, it's unclear how all this is related, but Trump did secure the release over these past two days of U.S. citizens detained in both Russia and, of course, its satellite state, Belarus. American Marc Fogel returned to Washington last night. And today an American citizen was released from a prison in Belarus, according to the White House.

Jeff Zeleny is OUTFRONT live outside the White House.

And Jeff, Trump spoke with Volodymyr Zelenskyy today as -- as I said, but he made it clear it was -- to inform him of the details that he -- of the conversation that Trump had had with Putin. And that seems to be what this is about. Trump and Putin talking Trump and Putin meeting to decide what will happen in Ukraine.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Erin, it was the order of these phone calls that really underscored the importance in which this White House views this. The president reached out to Vladimir Putin this morning in a 90 minute phone call. It was only then that he spoke to Volodymyr Zelenskyy in Ukraine. And this is something that marks a dramatic shift in U.S. policy, certainly during the Biden administration since the invasion of Ukraine.

[19:05:02]

There is no question that this is something that was front and center in the Trump campaign. He wanted to restore relations, and Vladimir Putin absolutely wants to be sort of removed from his isolation on the world stage. And Donald Trump, he believes, can help him do that.

So, taken together, interesting. In the Oval Office this afternoon, as Trump was swearing in, Tulsi Gabbard as the director of national intelligence, he was asked specifically about Vladimir Zelenskyy and he said as long as he's there, but his poll numbers aren't very good.

So talking about Zelenskyy in a weaker state certainly underscores how this is viewed going into this, but that the first meeting in a Saudi Arabia, the president said, would be without a Zelenskyy there at the table. He said perhaps he would join other meetings.

But the question here is, is Zelenskyy completely out in the cold as Putin and Trump try and rekindle their relationship? We remember they met five times in the first, the Trump administration, and it seems like they're on track to do it at least once and perhaps more again -- Erin.

BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Jeff Zeleny at the White House.

And OUTFRONT now, the Democratic Senator Chris Murphy, who sits on the Foreign Relations Committee.

And, Senator, so appreciate your time tonight. So Trump spoke to Putin today, and he said he and Putin agreed to

start negotiations immediately. And then he said after that call, he was going to call Zelenskyy to inform him of the conversation.

Do you worry that Zelenskyy is getting cut out of this?

SEN. CHRIS MURPHY (D-CT): Well, I think there's no doubt that Donald Trump wants to negotiate Ukraine's future for Ukraine. Listen, I'm all for a diplomatic solution here, but not one that hands the entirety of Ukraine to Vladimir Putin. Donald Trump has said he doesn't want to spend any more money on this war. And if Vladimir Putin knows that, that means that he's got the better hand at the negotiating table.

Ultimately, it's really bad for the United States if Russia owns Ukraine. It's very possible Russia won't stop and they will invade a NATO country. That's American boots on the ground. That's our lives at stake.

It also means that China accelerates their plans to try to take over Taiwan, and maybe other areas of commercial transit in Asia, harming our economy. We benefit from the current world order in which big countries don't get to expand their boundaries through force. And so a bad deal for Ukraine is a bad deal for the United States.

BURNETT: So, you know, as part of this -- well, I don't want to imply its part of that. But the conversations that Trump is having with Putin -- Putin did release the American Marc Fogel, who had spent nearly 400 days in a Russian prison. And he didn't do that until Trump was president. The Biden administration was unable to secure Fogel's freedom.

Do you give Trump the full credit for that?

MURPHY: Well, I think it's always good when our hostages are coming home. The question is, you know, why did that happen? I think what you're seeing is, is Trump signaling to Putin that he's going to give Putin what he needs in Ukraine. And so perhaps Putin is trying to give Trump a few things that he needs.

I want our hostages home. I think ultimately, if Ukraine gets handed to Russia, there'll be a lot more Americans killed than are released from captivity.

BURNETT: But you think this may be in some way related -- sorry. You think this may be related to what's happening in Ukraine?

MURPHY: Well, I don't know. The reality is Trump has signaled over and over again that he's going to cut Ukraine off and hand Ukraine to Russia. And if that's the deal and that's been communicated to Russia, then of course Russia may be doing some small things to help Donald Trump be able to ultimately sell what will be an abandonment of U.S. interests.

BURNETT: All right. You've been highly critical of Elon Musk's role in the Trump administration, Senator. You've laid that out clearly. His role does seem to be getting bigger by the day, though. I mean, Trump is meeting with the Indian Prime Minister Modi tomorrow.

"Reuters" is reporting that Musk is going to meet with him to write, and he's been trying to get Starlink into India. He's been trying to get more Tesla's into India, deal with import duties with Modi. Do you have any problem with Musk's presence in a meeting with Modi, obviously, the second most populous country in the world?

MURPHY: I mean, this is a fundamental corruption. This is a fundamental corruption. I -- we cannot let this be normalized, that the richest man in the world is operationalizing American foreign policy so that he can make himself richer. That is what is going on here.

I mean, it's extraordinary that you are going to have Elon Musk, who's essentially running the government right now, be sitting across from the Indian leader and ask the Indian leader to give him personal, financial favors instead of asking for things that would broadly help the American public.

Musk wants to outsource jobs to India.

[19:10:00]

He wants to outsource jobs to China, and he is using his access to Donald Trump to be able to shutter jobs in the United States and make himself more money.

We've never seen anything like this, even in the Gilded Age of the early 1900s, you didn't have J.P. Morgan and the Rockefellers literally sitting in the White House using their access to the president in order to cut deals with foreign governments that would help them.

BURNETT: Senator, I appreciate your time. Thank you very much, Senator Murphy.

MURPHY: Thank you.

BURNETT: All right. And more breaking news here as were speaking to the senator, just moments ago, a judge giving President Trump the green light to go ahead with those buyouts, as they've been calling them that, would they want to go to about 2 million federal employees? Now, the White House previously said that at least 40,000 people had already accepted those buyouts as part of Trump's efforts to significantly shrink the federal workforce. A judge had put that on hold because they had to guarantee that they would be able to pay them out in the term that they were promising. And so, it had been on ice. But Trump now getting a victory in court, that that will move ahead.

OUTFRONT now, former Democratic Congressman Mondaire Jones, who also worked in the Justice Department's Office of Legal Policy under then- President Obama, and Republican strategist Lauren Tomlinson.

I appreciate both of you.

Congressman, you're sitting here with me. Let me start with you. This -- these buyouts had been -- there had this had been sort of put

on ice, put on ice by a court. Now a federal judge is saying giving it the green light to go ahead. So, so -- is this -- is this it? Is this now going to go ahead?

MONDAIRE JONES, FORMER DEMOCRATIC CONGRESSMAN: Look, I wouldn't read too much into it. It seems like it was decided on standing grounds. I mean, a different set of individuals could -- could bring a similar lawsuit and, and maybe it would go further, but I'm just taking a step back.

The idea that we would as a -- as a federal government, try to push millions potentially of highly qualified expert people who are keeping not only the lights open, so to speak, but who are bringing just decades of experience to their jobs and administering critical federal programs, including, but not limited to Social Security and Medicare and Medicaid. To say nothing of the folks who have scientific backgrounds, who are working at, you know, NIH is really the opposite, I think, of what the American people wanted when they think of a government that works for them.

BURNETT: So, Lauren, can I ask you, though, because they get a victory now and that that Trump will be happy about that. But what you hear when it doesn't go their way is, well, these are activist judges. Trump will use that word.

Or Vance will say the court should stay out of it and give it room, right, when it doesn't go your way. But when it does go your way, is everything okay? I mean, it is the message here to just everybody lay off criticizing the courts and let it play out.

LAUREN TOMLINSON, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: I think that you've heard dual messages from the president. He said today that he would adhere to anything that the courts ruled both, you know, in those court cases, that he was also saying that he thought that the judges were activists. And then also today, obviously, he's celebrating this -- this win by the judge against the federal buyout.

So, you know, it's like anything. You -- you love when you win, you hate when you lose. But I think that what we see here is that a lot of these policies are going to continue to play out in the courts. And so I think that for -- it's key for the Trump administration to get answers from the courts because they're going to be pushing the limits on a lot of these decisions to push through what they are viewing as a really important job of cutting the federal government.

BURNETT: All right. So it's interesting to give you a chance, Congressman, to respond to what Lauren was saying, though, you know, to play it out in the courts. Okay. But then let's just enter in Elon Musk, okay? Because what Elon Musk has done is attack judges who have sided against Trump on social media. He has called them a whole different level than anyone else, but he's in every room that matters here right now.

He's called them corrupt. He's called them evil. And tonight he posted a poll asking, and I quote him, federal judges who repeatedly abused their authority to obstruct the will of the people via their elected representatives, should be impeached. Yes or no?

Now, for anyone who doesn't see an Elon Musk poll on Twitter, here's how they go. It's all whatever he would want the answer to be 97 percent. Then there's okay, I maybe -- maybe I'll be off by a percent. But it's -- it's a rhetorical question when he does that.

So what does that mean? Does his voice matter here with those -- that rhetoric?

JONES: Well, look, I think, you know, having served in Congress and having helped appropriate money for the security of judges who Republicans were saying were being threatened by certain speech from liberal commentators, it's quite interesting, to put it mildly, to see Donald Trump and his co-president, Elon Musk and Republicans on down to potentially incite violence against judges who are just doing their jobs as part of a co-equal branch of government.

We don't ever want to get to a place in the United States of America where the executive branch is able to do whatever it wants to do, and that the law doesn't matter anymore.

[19:15:02]

In fact, the Constitution says that the president of the United States shall take care to execute the laws, not ignore them because they don't like the outcome of a judicial decree.

BURNETT: All right. I want to ask you both about the Kennedy Center developments that have been happening here.

And, Congressman, let me just start with you because I want to ask something very specific to Lauren on this. President Trump announced that the board of Kennedy Center unanimously has elected him as its new chairman, him. Last week he said, quote, I have decided to immediately terminate multiple individuals from the board of trustees, including the chairman, who do not share our vision for a golden age, G and A capitalized, in arts and culture.

And then when he announced an interim executive director, Ric Grenell, he capitalized the words "golden age".

What does he mean by golden age in arts and culture, Mondaire?

JONES: Look, I think it's -- I think it's a dog whistle to a time where women and people of color and members of the LGBTQ plus community didn't kind -- didn't have the kind of comforts and, and rights, frankly, that that they enjoy today. But -- but let me say, I've been thinking a lot about how authoritarians throughout history have transformed sort of liberal democratic societies into dictatorships, for example. And it wasn't just about, you know, so winning elections in air quotes, but -- but it was also about changing culture, so that -- that power would, would last.

Donald Trump cares a lot about culture. Donald Trump cares that a lot of people in the arts don't agree with his politics. And in fact, they find him repulsive. And so this is another way to advance MAGA principles, MAGA ideology through the arts. And that's, I think, why he cares so much about the candidate.

BURNETT: Well, you certainly see it historically when you look at places Soviet Union, et cetera, arts and culture are so central.

And, Lauren, you know, we have heard the words golden age, which is why I wanted to put that out there first. We've heard them a lot from Trump. He's used them in many contexts. Here he is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Isn't that a beautiful phrase? The golden age.

This is the golden age of America. We're going to have a great country again.

The golden age of America has officially begun.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: So, Lauren, is Mondaire, the former congressman, right when he is saying that when he is saying -- using the word "golden age" and talking about arts and culture now, is -- is a crucial code for Trump to try to control culture, right? To have culture be part of what comes from his administration?

TOMLINSON: No, I think that Trump is a branding guy at heart, and this is something that he has been saying on the campaign trail. You just ran this through. He is termed his second Trump 2.0 to him is the golden age of America. He's doing this through economic policy. He's doing this, you know, with the Kennedy Center.

I think a lot of it is that conservatives have long felt shunned and pushed out of Hollywood, out of culture, out of arts. There's a lot of talk in conservative circles about how Hollywood actors will be blacklisted if its found out that they are conservatives.

So I think a lot of this is opening the doors for there to be not just one worldview in arts and cultures and bringing all Americans back into that discussion, especially at the Kennedy Center, which is, you know, it's a diplomatic arm of America. It shows our free speech, our -- our breath of culture, everything that's great about America.

And so I think it's -- he's looking at this as a more inclusive way of bringing people into the conversation, not as a secret dog whistle.

BURNETT: All right. Well, I appreciate both of you very much. And I think this will be a conversation we will be having a lot. So I appreciate it. And thanks to you both.

And next, suing to get their jobs back. Tonight, eight inspectors general who Trump fired in mass now filing suit. And one of them is speaking out OUTFRONT next.

And the mother of X, Elon Musk's 4-year-old son, not talking about formerly Twitter, breaking her silence, coming out, slamming him for bringing their child to so many high profile events, political events. And RFK Jr. on the verge of taking over America's health agencies. His supporters now expect him to deliver.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's, I think, a real hunger for politicians across the aisle to be targeting this voter anxiety about why are we getting so sick?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:23:35]

BURNETT: Breaking news, President Trump says he wants the Department of Education closed immediately, his words calling it a, quote, con job. It comes as an influential Republican is saying President Trump is not following the law after he purged more than a dozen inspectors general without notifying Congress.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. CHUCK GRASSLEY (R-IA): The only thing I don't like about the way we had this mass firing is the law that says that Congress should get notified. The president hasn't abided by that law.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: Now, tonight, eight of those inspectors general who were fired by the president four days into his term, are now suing Trump to get their jobs back.

OUTFRONT now is Michael Missal. He is the inspector general at the Department of Veterans Affairs. He was fired and is now part of this lawsuit.

So, Michael, I appreciate very much you coming on.

People hear inspectors general, and it's important to understand that that those are -- those are people, right, your face, your name. And you're going to tell us about what it is that's happening here. You served as the inspector general at the V.A., I know, for nearly a decade. So that would include all of president Trump's first term. All right?

And then you're fired here a few days into his new administration, you get a two sentence email that you've shared with us from Sergio Gor at the White House, says they're, quote, changing priorities.

So what is your legal case here in trying to get your job back?

[19:25:01]

MICHAEL MISSAL, INSPECTOR GENERAL FIRED BY TRUMP, NOW SUING TRUMP ADMIN: So when Congress passed the Inspector General Act, what they did is created independent and nonpartisan individuals to fight fraud, waste and abuse and make the government more effective and efficient at many agencies.

What Congress also asked, and this is the key, is that if the president decided to remove an inspector general, that the president give Congress 30 days notice and a specific case, specific reason why this decision was done. That was not done in this situation. It was a clear violation of Congress's law to keep them informed of why the president wanted to make a move.

And what I'm also concerned about is, given the number of I.G.s who were fired, is that this is really an attack on the independence of I.G.s who've done so much good for this country.

BURNETT: So when people want to understand exactly what it is that you do and that you've done right. So again, just to say you did this for almost a decade, you did it the entire front. Trump first term. You met with their transition team just before you were fired. And I know in that meeting, things seemed to be copacetic to you, right? You thought you were going to be moving ahead.

So, you know, all of a sudden they say, well, I.G.s are doing nothing and DOGE is going to come in and do all these cuts. Can you explain just so we understand why it is so important to have an I.G. in V.A.?

MISSAL: So during my almost decade as the inspector general, we issued about 2,500 reports, made 10,000 recommendations for improvement, and had a monetary impact of about $45 billion.

BURNETT: $45 billion.

MISSAL: But those are numbers. What's more important -- 45 billion? What's more important to me is that we helped V.A. improve the quality of the benefits and services that they provided to veterans. My staff and I were just passionate about helping V.A. improve.

So we did that through looking at all the various programs and operations of V.A., and I think we were very successful in doing so. And as you pointed out, I met with the transition team beforehand. Again, my goal was to make sure this administration was as well prepared to manage a very complicated agency, which V.A. is, and the meeting was very professional and productive, and there was no indication that they were not happy with what the what the work we did.

BURNETT: Well, I know, I mean, you know, a new chief of the V.A. had even emailed you to set up a meeting after taking over before you were fired. So it wouldn't seem that that they knew either.

But, you know, now you've got Elon Musk and DOGE in there, right? So it seems to be that they say, well, what you were doing $45 billion, whatever. That's nothing in their mind. They say that DOGE is going to come in and DOGE is going to slash and review operations and contracts.

Now you've got obviously medical records for millions of veterans stored in the V.A. computer systems. And, you know, the agency, it's complex. So what's the risk of DOGE?

MISSAL: Well, I didn't work with DOGE. And the five days I was in the second Trump administration and have the opportunity.

But doing oversight is incredibly hard. You have to really know the agency. You have to know the people there. You have to know their processes, and you can't just come in and start slashing because it really could harm veterans. There could be unintended consequences for just cutting things.

So what we did is we were really smart about the oversight we did and finding fraud, waste and abuse. We used data analytics pretty extensively. We met frequently with senior leaders over at V.A., so we got to know what they were trying to achieve. And our goal was to help them improve V.A. And I think we were very successful in doing so.

BURNETT: All right. Well, Michael, I appreciate your taking the time coming out to explain some of this. And it is so crucial right now to have people understand what these titles mean and who is doing them, and the people that have obviously made the sacrifices to do these jobs in this country. Thank you so much.

MISSAL: Thank you so much for having me.

BURNETT: All right. And next, people with ties to Elon Musk and Silicon Valley now do have access to sensitive information. This is according to "Wired". Their global editorial director Katie Drummond is next.

And RFK Jr., hours away from a confirmation vote. And his supporters expect him to hit the ground at full sprint. So what will he do?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:33:57]

BURNETT: Tonight, the White House putting out this photo taken inside the oval office. So this is, you know, this is what they want as the photo. You see President Trump, Elon Musk and Musk's 4-year-old son front and center.

Musk proudly sharing this other photo from the news conference where the little boy, who was adorable, stole the show, and he has been at his father's side at nearly every high profile Trump event since the election.

Sunlen Serfaty is OUTFRONT.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TRUMP: X, are you okay?

SUNLEN SERFATY, CNN WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): From the Oval Office --

TRUMP: This is X, and he's a great guy. High IQ. SERFATY: To rally stages.

ELON MUSK, TECH BILLIONAIRE: I'm sorry, little X just followed me on the stage here. He's -- he's a very enthusiastic supporter, as you can see.

SERFATY: Exclusive events at Mar-a-Lago and even in the halls of Congress.

REPORTER: Mr. Musk, what is DOGE?

SERFATY: One of Elon Musk's sons, X, has made quite the political debut with his father.

MUSK: Yeah. We're going to do great things here. Thank you.

SERFATY: Eager to promenade him before cameras into some of the most powerful and high level centers of Washington.

TRUMP: And his sons name, who's cute as a button. His sons name is X. He's the only guy who could get away with the name X.

SERFATY: Musk's latest move, bringing X into the Oval Office for an executive order signing this week, creating moments of levity.

MUSK: -- is to restore democracy.

X: Please forgive me, I have to go pee.

SERFATY: Musk, all too happy to engage with his son for the cameras.

MUSK: Well, if you don't have a feedback loop, okay, X, we'll have to -- if you --that's all right. It's all right. I'll tell you. Gravitas can be difficult sometimes.

SERFATY: But X's mother, Canadian singer Grimes, making it clear she does not approve of how her former boyfriend is using their son, calling it, quote, a personal tragedy, and directly responded to X's Oval Office appearance, saying on X that she was only made aware of it after seeing it on social media. He should not be in the public like this, she said. But I'm glad he was polite. Sigh.

Even as Musk continues to elevate the high profile moment, retweeting picture after picture, even one making the comparison to the famous photo of JFK and his son around the Resolute Desk.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- States of America!

SERFATY: Musk shares two other children with Grimes and 12 in all, with two other women.

Some of his other kids joining him in the spotlight, too.

MUSK: Punish up with the agency heads. And -- and I checked previously with the president to make sure that this --

SERFATY: For Musk, these moments, while endearing, could also be seen as calculated.

MUSK: Sorry for this. I thought my son might -- might enjoy this, but he's sticking his fingers in my ears and stuff, so it's been hard to hear sometimes. Hey, stop that.

SERFATY: Distractions from the realities of his political week.

MUSK: The people voted for major government reform, and that's what the people are going to get.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SERFATY (on camera): And to that point, Elon Musk has called his son X, his cuteness prop and his emotional support human. Musk is known for being a man. Of course, that's very intentional with his image, very controlling of every aspect of that image. And so, certainly, there is an awareness of how he's coming across with this.

Meantime, X's mom has also picked up on this pattern of Musk bringing their son into a lot of these public, powerful moments. And she says she believes that Musk sees him as his protege -- Erin.

BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Sunlen. His emotional support, human.

All right. Katie Drummond is with me now, "Wired" global editorial director, frequent guest, obviously here.

And your team, Katie, has been breaking so much news on Musk and his team and DOGE.

You know, it, obviously, we're talking about a very young child here, but it is a very young child that you just heard Sunlen say Trump is. I'm sorry, Musk, she said, has called his emotional support human and is a part of he's putting him out there.

Sure, he is putting him out there in public. He is retweeting images right there. It's the opposite of a seeking privacy. It is the -- it is the opposite.

What -- what is he trying to project?

KATIE DRUMMOND, GLOBAL EDITORIAL DIRECTOR, WIRED: Certainly, this is -- this is calculated, right? This is opportunistic. You don't bring your 4-year-olds to this many high profile public appearances without doing it in a seriously intentional way. It's impossible to know sort of exactly what Musk's idea here is, but certainly this is a humanizing thing to do. If you look at the responses on the platform X from his fans, from Musk acolytes, and, you know --

BURNETT: His fans love it.

DRUMMOND: They love it. I mean, they think that this is adorable. So in that corner of of he world that he is reaching, you know, this is something that is looked on very favorably, whatever you know, anyone else thinks about it. BURNETT: Yeah, of course, you know, as his the mother of the child

says, you know, it's a tragedy as she sees it.

DRUMMOND: Yeah.

BURNETT: You have a lot of new reporting on those around Musk, right? Musk, Silicon Valley, obviously, people from Silicon Valley that he knows well that have been placed in some top roles at these agencies and how you keep track of them, its incredible. But office at OMB, Office of Management and Budget, OPM, Office of Personnel Management and the Energy Department.

DRUMMOND: Yes.

BURNETT: All of these places are roles that would typically be held by career civil servants.

DRUMMOND: Yes, although that has changed recently. So these are chief information officer roles, CIOs. They are within key federal agencies. And you know, these are the individuals who oversee IT within an agency. They oversee access to sensitive databases to systems, including classified systems, right.

So this is very, very sensitive data that these individuals have oversight of that the Trump administration has now created a process, a new regulation whereby they can actually appoint their own CIOs instead of sort of an apolitical structure that existed previously.

[19:40:01]

So what we do know is that in at least three of these agencies now, we have new CIOs, new appointees, one of one of whom was a longtime Palantir executive, another who worked as an engineer at SpaceX. So these are individuals closely linked to Musk or to Peter Thiel, obviously a longtime ally of Elon Musk.

BURNETT: And so, they -- they obviously have these are Silicon Valley people that these are resume that is their background.

DRUMMOND: These are technologists. These are not individuals with experience in the federal government or within federal agencies. And the concern really here that sources and experts pointed us to is that, as we know, engineers for DOGE, you know, individuals working for Musk have been trying to access all of these systems, right? They're trying to get access to all of this information.

If the CIO of a given agency is someone who works closely with Elon Musk, it makes it much more likely that that access will be granted.

BURNETT: Right? And that they can -- you can go ahead and click the yes, and all of a sudden, someone's in.

All right. Thank you very much, Katie, as usual with so much breaking news there.

And next, RFK Jr.'s confirmation in just a few hours is all but certain. And it is not just Republicans cheering him on.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm here for the moms, all the moms, who struggle to feed their children healthy food.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: Dana Bash with a special report next.

Plus, American Marc Fogel just freed from a Russian prison tonight, seeing his wife and sons for the first time in nearly four years.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BURNETT: All right. We are just hours away right now from the confirmation vote of one of Trump's more controversial cabinet picks, RFK, Jr. And here's where it stands. He is all but certain to become health and human services secretary tomorrow, after a key Republican holdout, Senator Lisa Murkowski, got behind him. And now his supporters expect him to deliver right away.

Dana Bash is OUTFRONT.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DEMONSTRATORS: Let us in! Let us in!

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): October 2024, Battle Creek, Michigan.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is a monumental moment.

BASH: An army of protesters delivered 400,000 petitions to Kellogg's headquarters, demanding the company make good on a pledge to remove artificial dyes from its food.

VANI HARI, FOUNDER, FOOD BABE: I'm here for the moms, all the moms, who struggle to feed their children healthy food.

BASH: The leader, Vani Hari, a food activist known as the Food Babe, who says cutting out the processed and fast food of her youth not only helped her shed weight, but curbed serious health struggles. She has a wellness brand and a massive online following.

HARI: I feel like my voice represents so many ordinary citizens, moms and activists and dads and so many people across the United States that have just had had enough.

BASH: Hari volunteered for Barack Obama's presidential campaigns. She was a delegate at his 2012 convention, where she wrote, "label GMOs" on signs.

She got disillusioned with politics and turned to activism, pressuring restaurants like Chick-fil-A and Subway to take some additives out of their food. HARI: Why is it citizen activists like me and the people that follow

me, and all the grassroots movement holding these companies accountable? Why -- isn't there anybody in Washington doing this?

BASH: She and others, livid about the American food system, found common cause with Robert F. Kennedy, Jr.

CALLEY MEANS, SAFE FOOD ADVOCATE: There's, I think, a real hunger for politicians across the aisle to be targeting this voter anxiety about why are we getting so sick.

BASH: Calley Means and his sister Casey are well known leaders in the so-called MAHA, Make America Healthy Again movement.

ROBERT F. KENNEDY, JR., HHS SECRETARY NOMINEE: I got a call from a safe food advocate named Calley Means.

BASH: He was a GOP Trump critic who turned supporter and helped broker the first call between Kennedy and then candidate Donald Trump last summer.

KENNEDY: Don't you want a president that's going to make America healthy again?

BASH: With that endorsement, the MAHA movement came with him.

Dan Pfeiffer, a former senior Obama aide, says Democratic leaders missed an opportunity.

DAN PFEIFFER, FORMER SENIOR OBAMA AIDE: We're not living in the same social media internet spaces that a lot of the public is where, you know, people talking about, you know, what to feed your kids, what chemicals to avoid. Long before he even decided to run for president in 2024, RFK Jr. lived in those spaces.

BASH: And when Trump nominated Kennedy for secretary of health and human services, the MAHA network went to work.

SEN. BILL CASSIDY (R-LA): I was getting hundreds of messages a day personally, and thousands through the office.

BASH: Despite serious misgivings about Kennedy pushing conspiracy theories and regularly suggesting vaccines cause autism, which was scientifically debunked --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Cassidy.

BASH: -- Republicans like Louisiana Senator Bill Cassidy, a medical doctor, saved Kennedy's bid for HHS secretary.

CASSIDY: Vaccines save lives. They are safe. They do not cause autism. There are multiple studies that show this.

Mr. Kennedy and the administration reached out seeking to reassure me regarding their commitment to protecting the public health benefit of vaccination. BASH: Are you completely confident that none of those theories that

RFK Jr. has, and he's expressed many times over the years, will be part of America's public health, as he promised to Senator Cassidy?

[19:50:05]

MEANS: I am completely confident that Bobby Kennedy will come in with opinions and believe those opinions do not matter. Bobby Kennedy is coming in to institute a process.

And I know that many people on the left watching that can't stand Bobby Kennedy and stand President Trump, I know they resonate with something that's happening. I know they resonate, that there's a strain that we're touching on childhood chronic disease. And I would just urge them, there's a mass opportunity in society to support the Trump administration on this sector.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BURNETT: I mean, Dana, you know, its really interesting the way that he puts this. I mean, Trump has said, what are his words? You know, go wild on health to Kennedy. But does he really have free rein?

BASH: Probably. But it is certainly complicated when you think about what he is trying to achieve, which is to tell a sector of a very powerful sector of business in America, or two of them, really, the food industry and the pharmaceutical industry. What to do, what Cali means. You heard there, who is a lifelong conservative, insists is that it is it is in keeping with the conservative movement because what they are going to try to do is rewrite some of the guidelines.

And I think that's really what we need to look for low hanging fruit, if you will. Not so much the regulations, but things like what the FDA and HHS say is appropriate to eat and what is appropriate to label when it comes to food for children and really for -- for everybody.

BURNETT: Yeah. All right. Well, Dana, thank you very much.

And next, another jailed American released as we have new details about Marc Fogel, the American who today is seeing his family for the first time in almost four years.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:56:42]

BURNETT: Breaking news, President Trump's exchange for American Marc Fogel, Russian cyber crime kingpin and bitcoin co-founder Alexander Vinnik, convicted of laundering billions through crypto exchanges, will soon be on a plane back to Russia. Free there. This comes as the White House is negotiating the release of three more prisoners today, including an American. So there's another American.

Let me show you exclusive video of another one of those prisoners, though, that we understand is part of this, held by Putin's ally, Belarus, sent to prison. We understand for six years for participating in political demonstrations, reportedly losing custody of her two children. In this video, she is thanking President Trump for her release.

And Marc Fogel, who was freed by Trump from a Russian prison just yesterday, is in San Antonio, Texas, at this hour, and he is together with his wife and sons for the first time in nearly four years.

Josh Campbell is OUTFRONT.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Hours after being released from a Russian prison, Marc Fogel arrived Tuesday in Washington draped in an American flag, and went straight to the White House for a meeting with President Donald Trump.

MARC FOGEL, AMERICAN TEACHER: I feel like the luckiest man on earth right now.

CAMPBELL: The Pennsylvania schoolteacher wasted no time celebrating his release with a cocktail as the plane bringing him back to the United States left Russian airspace.

Tonight, Fogel sister says he is in San Antonio, Texas, reuniting with his wife and children.

FOGEL: This super organism of people that came to my support, and the love that I was given to sustain me for three and a half years.

CAMPBELL: Two sources tell CNN that Fogel's release came after Steve Witkoff, the U.S. special envoy to the Middle East, flew to Moscow and met directly with Russian President Vladimir Putin. Witkoff said the deal to secure Fogel's release came together in just the last few days.

STEVE WITKOFF, U.S. SPECIAL ENVOY TO THE MIDDLE EAST: I talked to the president, his national security adviser, and his chief of staff, Susie Wiles, and John Ratcliffe, and the president directed me to go over there and completed if we could. And that's -- that's what happened. We ended up, thank God, with a good result.

CAMPBELL: Fogel sister told CNN the family started getting hints the release might be happening last week, when they heard he had received new clothes and a haircut.

ANNE FOGEL, MARC FOGEL'S SISTER: We knew that something was happening, but these things can go sideways. And we were -- we've been on -- on the edge of our seat for the entire week. To hear that he was out of Russian airspace, it was just the best.

CAMPBELL: In exchange for Fogel's release, a Trump administration official tells CNN they agreed to release a Russian man named Alexander Vinnik. He's accused of operating a cryptocurrency scheme that allegedly did business with drug dealers and identity thieves. This was Vinnik after his arrest in Greece in 2017, before eventually being extradited to the United States. At the time, he called his arrest nonsense and a circus that was

politically motivated.

TRUMP: He's healthy. He looks good, actually, to me. You look good, ill tell you that.

FOGEL: I think -- well, expectations are low. Maybe. Maybe that helps a little bit.

CAMPBELL: Fogel was arrested in 2021, in Moscow for carrying cannabis, which his lawyer says was prescribed by a doctor to treat severe spinal pain. He's now at a military post in San Antonio, beginning a special government readjustment program for people who have been wrongfully detained abroad.

FOGEL: Knowing I had the support of my fellow Pennsylvanians, my family, my friends, it was so overwhelming that, it brought me to my knees and it brought me to tears. And I will me to my knees and it brought me to tears. And I will me to my knees and it brought me to tears. And I will forever be indebted.

CAMPBELL: Josh Campbell, CNN, Los Angeles.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BURNETT: Something so crucial to celebrate the fact that he is home with his family.

Thanks for joining us.

Anderson starts now.