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Erin Burnett Outfront

Authorities Believe They've Identified Suspect In Brown University Shooting; Trump's Handpicked Board Votes To Add His Name To "Kennedy Center". Aired 7-8p ET

Aired December 18, 2025 - 19:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[19:00:25]

ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: OUTFRONT next:

Breaking news, major developments in the manhunt for the Brown University shooter. Police believe they've got a suspect -- identifying a suspect. And in a stunning turn now investigating possible ties to the shooting of the MIT professor. Is the same person behind both?

Plus, it's now the Trump Kennedy Center renamed by a board that Trump himself appointed. Even some Republicans tonight are raising their eyebrows.

And an OUTFRONT exclusive this hour, inside the Border Patrol Academy. Why more Latino men are joining.

Let's go OUTFRONT.

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BURNETT: And good evening. I'm Erin Burnett.

OUTFRONT tonight, the breaking news closing in with an incredible development in the manhunt. Officials at this moment believe that they know who the Brown University shooting suspect is. And that in and of itself, is huge. After six days, they have a warrant for his arrest. So, they know who it is. They've got a name.

They could be closing in at this moment, but then this incredible link. Take a look at this map. Officials are investigating a possible connection between the Brown University mass shooting and the murder of an MIT nuclear scientist at his home. Murder looked like some sort of assassination.

I mean, we just don't know. But they're looking at a possible link here. And look at the map about 50 miles between the two locations and think about the mass manhunt that began right after the Brown University mass shooting, the two shootings that were talking about here are 53 hours apart.

Now for six days, investigators have been looking for the man in this video. And at this moment, they could be closing in on taking a suspect into custody. Whether it is him or someone else we don't know. But we do know they've got a warrant. They've got a name. They've --

they've got it all and the question is, will they in moments have the actual individual. We've got all the angles covered tonight.

Brian Todd is in providence, Rhode Island. Danny Freeman is in Boston.

I want to start with you, Brian. What is the latest that you're learning there in Providence?

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Erin, we're awaiting a news conference that has now been delayed for more than three hours. They are telling us, pardon me? They are telling us that there will be a news conference, but they're not really giving us much of any indication as to when it will be.

The other, of course, huge question here is when they do have a news conference, are they going to give us a name of a suspect? Are they going to give us an image of the suspect?

I will say that in previous news conferences this entire week ahead of those news conferences, they have released images, they have released surveillance video, they have released a map of where this person was, they say, casing out the area around Brown University.

I can also tell you this, Erin, there was a second person who they said was captured on camera in vicinity of this main person of interest. I've got some information on that. That man who police say was captured on camera in proximity to the main person of interest, has been found and has been interviewed by law enforcement. That is according to Providence Police Major David Lapatin, who spoke to me here just a short time ago. Major Lapatin was quick to then say, though, that that second person, quote, he's not a suspect.

I asked if there was anything else he could tell us about that interview with that second person. Any details? He said he could not tell me that. I, of course, asked him if there was a name of a -- of a main suspect that he could give me, and he said he could not tell me that. But that other person that was in proximity to this person has been brought in, has been interviewed and is, quote, not a suspect -- Erin.

BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Brian. And, Brian. I think just also significant what he just mentioned there, that this press conference has been three hours delayed. Obviously, that in and of itself is significant. And perhaps the reasons behind it could tell us a lot.

Greg Ehrie is with us. John Miller, Mary Ellen O'Toole and Ed Davis, all with us.

John Miller, you're doing so much reporting on this. You believe that they've identified the suspect, so they certainly know the name. And they've got an arrest warrant.

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: Right. BURNETT: Okay. So that means they know who this person is. What?

Okay, so I guess let's just start with what else you're learning right now. I mean, all this happened very fast and furious this afternoon.

MILLER: Yeah. And this has been unfolding over the past 24 hours. But there came a point today where they reached a level of confidence that allowed them to go obtain a warrant for this individual's arrest. But the real change here is we've been looking at those pictures of, you know, the walker with the mask and the hat, you know, covering all of that ground for a few days now in various increments.

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There's a big difference between a manhunt where you're looking for a man who's a wraith, you know, an image, unidentified.

BURNETT: Right.

MILLER: And a manhunt where you know who the man you are hunting is. And that was the dynamic shift today. And that allows them to put together a lot of tools that can be used in that in real time. If you know who you're looking for in terms of technology, in terms of churning out pictures, in terms of giving that to the teams, doing the search, and that's what's been going on. And, you know, it's been game-changing.

BURNETT: So, Greg, let me just ask you because obviously, you know, Brian saying when he had talked to police there and they, you know, are not -- they're declining to give the name. But we now know. And look there have been flubs along the way early on in this investigation, which could make them a little bit hesitant. And maybe that's it.

Or what else could it be? If they know who it is and they have arrest warrant, why not tell the public the name? What does it mean that they're not doing that?

GREG EHRIE, FORMER FBI SECTION CHIEF, DOMESTIC TERRORISM OPERATIONS SECTION: Well, we've seen this, and certainly John and I have been in the command post and seen this investigative orchestra go on.

BURNETT: Yeah.

EHRIE: So, you have the analysts who are going through data. You have the forensics people who are bringing that DNA, the fingerprints, and you're painting a literal and figurative picture on the wall. Something changed. They found something that completed that picture, and they've been able to at least identify who they think did this.

But now the priority comes, as John pointed out, locate that person now that you have a name, but also, is there anybody else involved? Is there another aspect of this attack?

If it is truly connected with the MIT murder, does that have another plan? Is there something else that this would trigger? When you find this person and they're watching? I mean, if this person is still alive, they're watching the news right now.

BURNETT: I mean, and that whole development of a possible link to MIT really could change everything that anybody might have thought originally about what happened, about the horror at Brown.

Ed, as former police chief in Boston, obviously you know that area very well. And I just was laying out the map right about 50 miles between the two locations. And we understand the time between the two shootings. The incidence is just over 50 hours.

I mean, how long do you think, until this person is apprehended? We don't know exactly if they're still in that vicinity. But obviously, those two locations are pretty close.

ED DAVIS, FORMER BOSTON POLICE COMMISSIONER: Yes, they are. And similar neighborhoods, too. I'm very familiar with the Brookline neighborhood. I -- to answer your question, I really believe that, this arrest is imminent. From everything I've been hearing today, they know who this guy is and, quote/unquote, they're on him.

So, it's a little confusing about the facts of the MIT incident, and, it'll be very interesting to see how they're related, but there seems to be a lot of police activity up here. In the northern part of Massachusetts, as well as reported activity in the southern part of Massachusetts.

So, I don't know if they're following two people or if there's -- that they lost them at some point in time. But I do suspect when it's this hot, that they'll take them into custody soon.

BURNETT: How do you see it, Mary Ellen?

MARY ELLEN O'TOOLE, FORMER SENIOR FBI PROFILER & FBI SPECIAL AGENT: Well, I think that there is a risk evaluation that they're doing at this point. In terms of putting out the name of this individual, unless they have him under surveillance, because they're not sure what he could do, and certainly he could pose a threat to other people. He could pose a threat to himself. And at this point, they want to bring him in alive and not risk him taking his own life.

So that is a real evaluation. And at the end of their decision making, they're going to go with their best assessment. But I think that that's -- that really is a challenge is to protect the public and then to protect the integrity of the case and bring him in alive.

BURNETT: And obviously, John, they have to assume that he's a threat, right? He shot 20 people at Brown.

MILLER: You come into this armed and dangerous.

BURNETT: Armed and dangerous. But -- I mean -- I mean, look, at the beginning of this. You know, there were those of us who said, could these things be connected? And that seemed like something that was in conspiracy theory land.

MILLER: Yes. BURNETT: And now they're looking at potential ties, right? We don't

know for sure if they are related, but they are. We know enough to know that they are really looking at that. I mean, what is the likelihood that these two things are connected and what could tie them together? I mean, if they are and you're target is maybe the MIT professor -- seems to be the MIT professor. If they are, then what are you doing? I mean, how does this tie together?

MILLER: So the -- when this when this question came up, the FBI answered by saying we don't -- we don't see any connection at this time. We have consulted with the Massachusetts state police on the case.

BURNETT: That was their original statement on Tuesday, the morning after the murder in Boston.

MILLER: Right. And fair it is. The arbiter here is once they develop the name of this suspect, that they've obtained this warrant for, now, you have an identity, an entity that you can run against two things, which is, okay -- I'm going to call him John Smith.

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We have John Smith. What is his connection to cross over to MIT. And you go through all that and say, do we find one? Then you take the same thing and you ask a question that you couldn't have asked two days ago when you didn't have that name. What is his connection to the MIT professor?

BURNETT: And then you might --

MILLER: And that's where you start to see two lines of crossover. And that is what made them believe there's a good chance these are connected.

BURNETT: The MIT professor is a Portuguese nuclear fusion or fission. I'm sorry to experts out there to not know which, scientists. Right? So that -- that's who that is. We do know that, Greg, but, you know, interesting putting together what John just said and what Ed said a moment ago. What Ed said is that he's seeing a lot of police activity in the Brown area and also up in the Boston area around Brookline, where the professor was murdered.

What does that that say to you? I mean, you think there could be more than one person involved?

EHRIE: Well, certainly, as John pointed out, we've identified somebody now, the FBI is indicating that they have identified somebody. So that immediately puts into effect you're looking at who's the family members, who's the friends. You're looking through specific social media. Were there any text messages from this phone that went somewhere else?

So you're cautiously, as I believe, Mary Ellen said, closing in. Ideally, they have this person under surveillance where they're not further threat to the public where they're contained. But if that person goes to move, you have to take that person into custody immediately. So there's some things going around. I believe it's just the perimeter is shrinking very quickly. But he certainly has some associates, certainly has some family members that we want to make sure we're watching, too.

BURNETT: And Mary Ellen, when you look at this and say if, if this person that they're saying that they have an arrest warrant out, we know they have an arrest warrant out for one person at this point, did commit both of these crimes, right. And in that case, that would seem that the that the intended ultimate target was the professor at MIT. Then what does this tell you about the killer?

O'TOOLE: Well, certainly what that suggests is when you look at both cases, in a lot of ways, they're very different. When you walked into the building there at Brown University, it really is unclear if he was targeting a single individual or if anyone in that room was a viable target for him.

But on the other hand, to go to someone's home so you find out where they lived, you go to their home and you kill them in their, you know, their safe environment. That's a -- there are low risk victim and a low risk environment, and you go to them that has the appearance of something a lot more personal.

So that gives an aspect to this offender that we don't see in the Brown case. And what does that say about his personality? Again, it said he's clearly then he was very committed to committing both of these crimes. And maybe the motivations are tangentially related, but they also could have separate motives that that ended up sparking or causing him to do both of these murders. If, in fact, he did.

BURNETT: Right. And again, we don't know. I mean, it's a potential link at this point.

But Ed to that point, you know, when the -- on Saturday with the horrific mass shooting at Brown, this was to Americans an all too familiar horror show of a mass shooting on a campus at a school. Then you have a murder as Mary Ellen pointing out, or an assassination, whatever it would end up being of a professor in his home. They are such different things.

What do you think would cause someone to do both of those things that are so different and have so many targets of brown? If the two are related

DAVIS: Right, that throws the whole narrative of a crazed mass murderer into question. You really have to step back now and look at the evidence you have, which, as John said, is the fact that we have a name, and they believe they know who the individual is. That's where the real detective work starts to draw parallels between this man and Brown and MIT. They're both very well regarded, high rate institutions.

There are some things that are similar. So, they're going to be looking for commonalities and they're going to be drilling down into, as we said earlier, friends, relatives, a lot of the digital footprint of this individual to try to divine exactly where he's coming from, what he's thinking. There'll be a lot of information out there that they can use.

BURNETT: All right. Thank you all very much. As this story is moving so quickly at this moment, awaiting that press conference in Rhode Island momentarily that has been delayed.

OUTFRONT next, we've got new information as authorities are investigating this possible link between the shooting at Brown, the mass shooting and the murder of one MIT professor. So, who was this MIT professor? Who exactly was he and why would anyone possibly target an MIT nuclear scientist?

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His friend is my guest.

And the Kennedy Center Board, which Trump chairs, just voted to rename the Kennedy Center the Trump Kennedy Center. Even Republicans tonight are asking why?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. KEVIN KILEY (R-CA): I don't know what's wrong with the old name. And I think the Kennedy Center is doing great

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: An exclusive reporting tonight inside the Justice Department, a frantic high pressure race over the Epstein files with the release supposed to be by law, less than 24 hours from now.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BURNETT: Breaking news, we are waiting right now standing by for a live press conference about the manhunt in the Brown University shooting. That could start at any moment, but it is moving very rapidly right now. A source close to the case telling CNN that police are looking at potential ties between the Brown University mass shooting Saturday and the murder of MIT professor Nuno Loureiro at his home in Brookline, Massachusetts, something that had initially been discounted by the FBI, dismissed.

Now, those two locations are about 50 miles or so apart.

Danny Freeman is OUTFRONT in Boston.

Danny, what's the latest you can tell us?

DANNY FREEMAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Erin, as you noted, there are a tremendous amount of moving parts at this time. Before I get specifically to that MIT professor, I just want to alert viewers that there's been a tremendous amount of police activity, of course, since that Brown University shooting back on Saturday, really throughout New England. We're keeping our eye on right now some police activity in Salem, New Hampshire. But we want to be clear to our viewers, we have not confirmed that

this is related to either the investigation into the Brown University shooting or the shooting of this MIT professor back on Monday.

BURNETT: That's a live pictures of it while you're talking about it, Danny.

FREEMAN: Exactly, exactly. You see overhead aerials up there. We are keeping our eye on that. And I just wanted to make sure viewers are aware. Again, a lot of police presence really all across New England. But I want to talk about that MIT professor, because that was really a stunning piece of news that happened in the greater Boston community on Monday. It happened, as you noted, in Brookline, Massachusetts, just outside of the city of Boston.

And we're talking about MIT professor Nuno Loureiro. He was shot at his home on Monday. He ultimately died at the hospital back on Tuesday.

Now, this professor, as you've been talking about it, Erin, a physicist, a fusion scientist as well, he was actually just named last year to lead MIT's Plasma Science and Fusion Center. He was working on clean energy technology.

He was married. He was originally from Portugal as well. He had actually been working as a researcher in Lisbon prior to getting to MIT back in 2016. And everything that we understand, and certainly from the science and research community, certainly from MIT, is that he was a beloved leader on that campus.

The president of MIT calling his killing, quote, a shocking loss. The U.S. ambassador to Portugal also expressing condolences when news of this killing occurred.

Now, you also noted the press corps back in Providence, which I was a part of back on Tuesday. We asked local officials and the FBI if there was any connection between the shooting here in the Boston area and the shooting in Providence at Brown. Initially, they said no. There seems to be no connection. That was according to FBI special agent Ted Docks.

But of course, now in large part due to reporting from our own John Miller, there is the potential that these two investigations are related, but still unclear at this time what those connections might be.

So again, that's the outline of what happened here in the Boston area. But again, there's a lot of activity in New England happening tonight -- Erin.

BURNETT: All right. Danny, thank you very much. And we're going to be going back to Danny as we get more in just a moment, we'll be joined by a friend of the MIT professor who was murdered in his home. To understand more about that terrible tragedy and about him.

But the breaking news, John and Greg, I want to ask you about where we stand here right now. So, the Salem, New Hampshire, seems to be a lot of activity right now. Local media that were using their aerial shot. There's a lot of coverage that the possibility that this could be related.

MILLER: So they have been focused with this individual and a car and the search in Salem, Massachusetts, according to law enforcement officials who were briefed on this, relates to a car that they believe is similar to, if not the car they've been looking for because of the description of the car, but also the license plate was located in Salem, Massachusetts, and, I'm sorry, Salem, New Hampshire.

BURNETT: New Hampshire, yes, sorry.

MILLER: There\s one in each, but this is New Hampshire, was located there, and they are fanning out in the area around that car to see if their suspect is there as well.

BURNETT: Right. I mean, so if they have a car, right? I mean, they're pretty far along then, Greg, I would imagine. Now, obviously they don't know, but if he's gotten out of that car right then, either he is very nearby possibly. I guess I would suppose most, most probably, unless he found some other way to get another vehicle and get away from there. But that that, as John is saying, that that vehicle appears to be in Salem, New Hampshire, where were seeing all this activity right now.

EHRIE: This does seem to be now the focus of the investigation. There are other processes going on at the time, but this is the nucleus, and this could very well lead to at least taking somebody into custody, which then leads to more questions, why and how this happened and the motivation behind this attack. If this individual is involved with this. But what we will see not only from the press conference when we get the warrant, it won't list all the evidence that the authorities have, but it will list enough to get a probable cause warrant.

So, we get kind of a basis of what we thought happened or what the authorities think is going on.

MILLER: And there's other opportunities. As Greg says, once they have a person in custody, you know, there's going to be more questions, but there's the opportunity for more answers.

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There were items left behind believed to be belong to the shooter at the scene at Brown University, that they believe they've recovered relevant DNA from. Once you have a person that you can test that against --

BURNETT: Right.

MILLER: -- you may come up with even more than you had in the original warrant. And then, of course, there is. What else could you find either on that person where they're found or in that car, potentially guns that matched the ballistics or other things. But the DNA is going to be key. BURNETT: And they have to be worried. I'm thinking back to the

Tsarnaev brothers when there was that manhunt, Greg, about what is going to happen when they find this individual, you know, is he going to fight? Is he going to shoot? You know, is he? They don't -- they don't know. And they obviously have to presume he is heavily armed.

EHRIE: Absolutely. That's the presumption, as John had said earlier, that this is absolutely an armed and dangerous individual. So this arrest, taking this person into custody will be done by tactical teams at both the state, federal and local level, regardless of whether he resists or not, they're going to take every precaution to protect every law enforcement officer involved.

BURNETT: Do they feel they're -- I mean, imminent?

MILLER: Well, this has been hot pursuit today. They have always been what they felt was just a few steps behind him. I think as we, learn more about this case, it is likely that were going to learn that someone who went to that much trouble to disguise themselves, that went to that much trouble as Mary Ellen O'Toole would have told us to be so mission oriented --

BURNETT: Yeah.

MILLER: -- that he employed other countermeasures, which is probably why they were a step behind. But it certainly seems that that is ground zero of the case right now because related to the vehicle and its, you know, where it is.

BURNETT: Right. The vehicle, as you said, license plates that they believe John's reporting was located in Salem, New Hampshire, where we are seeing all of this very, very heavy police activity right now. So we're going to keep these live shots up as much as we can. Weve got an affiliate here with these aerials.

As you're looking at them for this live activity going on in Salem, New Hampshire, Greg and John standing by, I want to go OUTFRONT now to Bruno Soares Goncalves. He is a plasma physicist, friends with Loureiro, once worked with him in Portugal.

Bruno, what an absolute shock for you, for his friends and family. I am, you know, just its horrible to be talking to you under such a circumstance. I can only imagine. I mean, how shocked were you when you heard such a thing?

Your friend, your former colleague. He's a nuclear physicist. And you hear that he was murdered at his home.

BRUNO SOARES GONCALVES, PLASMA PHYSICIST WHO WORKED WITH SLAIN MIT PROFESSOR: Yeah. It was quite a shock to hear the -- that he was murdered. And the -- to process that someone could do such a violent crime against someone that was so kind, and known for being so kind with everyone. So it was -- it is really difficult to process and really difficult to accept this event.

BURNETT: You know, we've been reporting, Bruno, that police are now looking at potential ties between your friends murder and the mass shooting at Brown University this weekend. Initially, they had completely discounted any link between the two events, and it is truly stunning to think that it is possible they are related.

But no one has any understanding of ties between your friend and Brown University. I mean, are you aware of any ties?

GONCALVES: No, I'm not aware of any ties between his work and the work done in Brown University. It's actually very difficult to think and to find any ties between the two events. One is really targeted towards Nuno. It seems something that was a violent crime very directed. And the other one looks like a random shooting of people that were there.

So, it's really difficult to find why they would be connected.

BURNETT: Yeah. Well, it is a fair point. I mean, I know you and Nuno, you were friends. And in a very tight knit community. I can only imagine. I know you saw him last year. You communicated by email. You've been on video conferences with him through this year.

Was there ever anything different? I mean, now that you're looking back on it through this unbelievable lens that you are right now, does anything stand out to you about anything he said or did or how he looked recently?

GONCALVES: No. Everything, he was the same person that I met, the same humor that we were used to. So, it was a very funny guy to be around. Very intelligent humor. Maybe from the time that he lived in England, he developed this kind of humor. We discussed at the time, he was just -- when we met in Rome, he was -- he took the -- it was some months after, he started his new position at MIT.

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So, we were discussing what he was doing, the advances. We were in a conference about the advances in nuclear fusion and all the investment, private investment that is going on. And he was discussing what was his role now, mostly. And if anything, he was a bit sad that now he didn't have enough time to do so much theoretician -- theoretical work as he enjoyed doing. And he was more dedicated to finding funding, and to develop new infrastructures for his research lab.

BURNETT: So he, you know, I want everyone to have a chance. You know, we've been seeing his picture in recent days, but to actually hear from him, Nuno recorded a video last year, and he loved working with actual students. And he shared this advice with them.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NUNO LOUREIRO, MIT PROFESSOR: I think on any given day, it's tempting to go for the low hanging fruit, be a little more ambitious and tackle the really hard problems because, you know, if you're not going to tackle the hard problems as a graduate student, when are you going to tackle them? (END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: What else do you want people to know about your friend, Bruno?

GONCALVES: Yeah, well, that's Nuno, the guy that was very rigorous in the work he did always trying to find challenging problems. Someone that enjoyed to be near the students. Someone that loved to be in front of a blackboard and drawing equations, explaining what the -- that mean, from the scientific point of view, understanding the nature.

So, what you see here, is it's him. He's exactly what he did, inspiring students to do more and to be -- to find their own scientific voice.

BURNETT: Bruno, thank you very much. Were all grateful for your time and your insight and to talk about your friend who so tragically has been killed this week. Thank you.

GONCALVES: Thank you.

BURNETT: And next, we are continuing to follow this breaking news as police activity, heavy police activity as I speak, live pictures. This just moments ago. But these are -- they're continuing here in Salem, New Hampshire. At this time, we understand John Miller reporting that they had seen a vehicle there that they believe is tied to the suspect in the Brown University shooting. And also, of course, they're looking at a link between the Brown and MIT killings.

We'll be right back.

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[19:37:26]

BURNETT: Breaking news we are watching right now police activity in Salem, New Hampshire, the manhunt intensifying for the shooting. Suspect in the Brown University mass shooting. And John Miller is back with new reporting.

As, John, we're just getting different angles here. Coming in from Salem, New Hampshire, where there is extensive police activity right now and you're learning a lot.

MILLER: So this has been the focus of an automobile. That is something that came up in their investigation, where a witness provided a plate. They were able to investigate that car, who that car was driven by. And then when they saw the description of the similar car in the be on the lookout that was sent out to officers in the Boston murder, they're like, wait, we've got the same kind of car, different plates. But then they've got the same kind of car from --

BURNETT: Okay, wait, so this is -- the car is what gave them the connection between the two shootings. MILLER: It is one of the things that connected them. It's the thing

that started them down the road of let's take a closer look at that. But for now, they were able to locate that car in Salem, New Hampshire, in an area where they've now got a very heavy police presence. And it is kind of where they are focused on their search now, understanding that they haven't known this individual to have another car.

So, is he nearby? Is he hiding out? Is he laying in wait? Has he taken his own life? All of these possibilities are on the menu.

BURNETT: And also, it sounds like from what you're learning, he had a very sophisticated plan to escape detection?

MILLER: Based on the conversations I've been having today, he has employed a series of countermeasures to surveillance, to being tracked and so on. And, I mean, I think one of the things we can look at is he uses one set of plates in one city, another set of plates in another city.

BURNETT: License plates.

MILLER: Right. And when you think about that, here's an individual who's thinking about there's going to be video cameras. Can I make myself unidentifiable by this level of clothing and masking and the hat and so on, which he did a fairly effective job at beating things like facial recognition.

BURNETT: Right.

MILLER: If I'm moving in the same vehicle and I'm changing plates, will that thwart license plate readers where they're looking for one plate, but they're finding another --

BURNETT: Easy pass in stuff like that?

MILLER: Exactly.

So, he's been paying attention. I liken it to Luigi Mangione, who, you know, took all of the same types of precautions.

[19:40:06]

And, you know, in the notes that they allegedly found on him kind of had scribbled in there, you know, I attribute this to my engineering background, you know, that I've carefully laid this out.

BURNETT: Yeah. Well, it's interesting, obviously, at least one of the targets here we know is a nuclear fusion physicist.

Greg, what does all this say to you? I mean, this -- this is a lot of new information, right? This is someone who -- he's saying that the car is seen at both places. The plates were changing, which means that he thought through all of that, that he had been able to obtain different plates. That a level of sophistication and incredible planning. EHRIE: Yeah. This is just showing you the investigative why this

investigation is taking so long that every little piece this is somebody who planned this out at least far in advance, thought about what the response was going to be and is taking these steps to evade it when they're on this manhunt, as John has pointed out earlier, even when you don't know the individual, you're always one step behind because that person knows what they're going to do. You're trying to figure it out and react to it, and they've closed that delta, and it looks like were coming to a hopefully a culmination here.

But what John has pointed out, this is a very, very intricate, well- thought out, methodical plan. And is this the end of the plan or is there more to it?

BURNETT: Yeah. I mean, Ed Davis is with us, former Boston police chief again. Ed, you know, you heard what Greg saying, right? Methodical. How this was thought out and the sophistication of seeing ahead things like EZPass readers, license plate readers photographs. I mean, who knows if the video that we have, it does end up being of the person. You know, is that sort of limp and pouch in his stomach, is that even real? Right?

We just -- we just don't know. What is this new information that John's relating signal to you, Ed?

DAVIS: Well, it sounds like it's a very sophisticated plot. And this is the kind of thing that makes you believe that this man had a -- had a conspiracy, maybe with other people, maybe just in his own mind, to go after targeted individuals, all locations. He probably had some type of grievance. It's hard to see an obvious connection between Brown and MIT, but I think that as time goes on, we're going to find things that he has in his possession or his social media footprint that will give us a clue as to why he was targeting these two locations and whether or not there were other locations that he intended to target.

But I'll tell you this, he was good at what he did. He managed to elude the dragnet for the first five days. And eventually got caught up through some evidence, like DNA or ballistics evidence that they were able to, to identify him. So it didn't work, but he kept them out for a while.

BURNETT: You know, John, you're raising the connection between Luigi Mangione, who is, you know, going to stand trial for murdering -- assassinating the CEO of UnitedHealthcare. At the very beginning, it was clear that was an assassination. Motive was unclear. Right? But you knew what it was.

You have two things here where if they're related and it appears more and more that they are the same car is seen at both locations. I mean, at some point you start to say, it really does look that way. We don't know formally yet.

These two situations, what he did could not be more different, right? So, is there one motive that ties them together? Is it possible that there are two motives? Is any such thing happen, where there's two different motives on something with this much planning?

MILLER: Well, it could be. And until investigators get deeper into his background and we get deeper into his background behind them, we may not know every connection, but the stark difference between the two, in terms of M.O. and targeting is, you can look at the Brown shooting as he walks into a crowded room and shoots people that almost to 100 percent certainty he doesn't know. Nobody knew who was going to be in that room ahead of time, because you didn't know who was going to show up.

That seems to be on its face. An attack on the institution. I'm going to do something to hurt Brown University and the people in it. The other is highly targeted to a specific individual at their home.

So, one of the questions that they're going to have to delve into is, what was the common grievance between Brown University and this nuclear physicist?

BURNETT: Yeah.

MILLER: Or were there two separate grievances that are somehow related to each other?

BURNETT: Greg, what do you think the likelihood is that he is in Salem, New Hampshire? Right. So, it appears from John's reporting, right, that he had a car. We know that, had license plate changes, right. So, he was -- the car seems to be the primary vehicle, literally, that he was going to use. Right, because he had set that up.

[19:45:00]

So, the question is, did he have another plan as to what to do after that?

EHRIE: Exactly.

BURNETT: And even if he did, how would he have expected that to trigger in Salem, New Hampshire? Right? I mean, it would seem odds are that that he's in Salem, New Hampshire, dead or alive, right?

EHRIE: One would think so, especially with the conflicts of activity that's taking place right there. But we'll see. I mean, again, this was well thought out.

And as John has pointed out, the speculatively right now, he was tripped up by accident. Somebody saw him that he didn't anticipate and took down that license plate, which he didn't anticipate or wouldn't even be this far.

And id also have to point out that it's unfortunate we keep focusing on motivation. It might not be a motivation that makes sense to the normal person. This could be something somebody who's disturbed and just believes that something out there. But it's usually -- whatever this motivation drove this man to kill.

BURNETT: Ed, what do you think happens here over these next hours?

DAVIS: Well, there's a very active scene up in Salem right now. It appears as though there are technical investigators that are all over that vehicle. That would be a common practice to use a bomb squad to clear that if the suspect was associated with it, that may be what we're seeing up there right now.

So, they'll process that scene and collect any evidence that that is readily apparent. This will also trigger search warrants and evidence collection at residences with cell phone -- cell phone providers and other, in other places where, they can drill down and really get a good idea as to who he's been talking to, was discussed earlier about accomplices, whether or not he had somebody helping him with a gun came from.

All of those things are going to be really important to this investigation and are happening simultaneously right now.

BURNETT: All right. Thanks very much to all of you standing by here as we've got more of this breaking coverage, these live pictures out of Salem, New Hampshire, tactical crews as Ed Davis, former Boston police chief, just talking about and mass police activity, finding an abandoned car.

The license plate on that car matching a car possibly used by the suspect in the Brown University shooting that same car seen in the vicinity of the MIT professor's murder. We're following all of this as it unfolds this hour.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[19:51:32]

BURNETT: Breaking news monitoring this major development. That is what appears to be a self-storage facility in Salem, New Hampshire. Right now, ground zero in the search for the Brown University shooting suspect. Police finding an abandoned car that they say matches a car they believe was being used by the suspect. According to our John Miller's sources, they have found that car there at that self-storage facility, and they say that car also they had seen in the vicinity of the MIT professor's murder. So, all of these coming together at this hour. Live images.

So, we're going to bring you updates as, as they come in here waiting a live press conference. We'll keep these images up as much as we can. As you can see people going in and out, they're not sure the status of any warrants on that facility.

It comes as there is also tonight, political story here. The growing outrage over the Trump Kennedy Center, which is the new name of the Kennedy Center, just announced by the board that Trump appointed.

President Trump claims that he was surprised, but it is hard to believe that because he did post twice online, the Trump Kennedy Center. Whoops. I mean, Kennedy Center awards. And then in public he said this:

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: You have a big event on Friday at the Trump Kennedy Center. Excuse me, at the Kennedy Center.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: And this is not the first time that long established institutions are being named after Trump, right? The State Department recently unveiled the Donald J. Trump Institute of Peace, and everyone is here with me now.

Max Rose, Congressman Rose, let me let me just start with you. You know, it is now at the top of the website, I guess, much like the Department of Wars, the Department of War on their website, it's not technically the Department of War. But this is now the Trump Kennedy Center.

So, it's there, and he had changed everyone on the board. They voted.

MAX ROS (D), FORMER U.S. CONGRESSMAN: Yeah. It proves to be one of the few things that this administration is actually adept at, which is renaming things for show business. Now, in this particular case, this will require an act of Congress, as I think at this point, Speaker Johnson is actually elated because he now has a bill that he actually could reasonably put on the floor of Congress, something he's failed to do for any issue of affordability or any other matter of significance to the American people. So, at the very least, he's happy about this. Everyone else thinks that this is a total distraction.

BURNETT: And does he -- does he bring it to the floor? I mean, you know, there's been a lot of hits to Trump recently, right? The discharge for the Epstein petition and Obamacare and all these things. But is this one that Republicans will just happily go ahead and let him have his Trump Center?

CHARLIE DENT (R), FORMER U.S. CONGRESSMAN: Well, at a time when the health care premium subsidies are about to expire, it might not be a very good look to bring a change to name -- to bring this bill up. It does require an act of Congress. But could you imagine the outrage if the airports down in Washington, D.C. decided to change the authority, tried to change the name of the Reagan National Airport to the Biden Reagan Airport, or the Obama Reagan Airport, there would be an outrage. It would take an act of Congress.

So, I think this is a really unwise. It's certainly inappropriate to be naming these facilities after sitting presidents. We usually do this after they're gone. Kennedy was assassinated. That's why he was memorialized this way. This is really -- it's beyond the pale.

BURNETT: Right. It's part of the reason he has things like airports and all of those things.

I mean, Astead, it is sort of if you take a step back, it's fair to make the comparison to Biden or anyone else. Nobody else would have done this.

ASTEAD HERNDON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Yeah, it's total Trump move. And I think honestly, I think he's distracted himself in the second term with these type of focuses, whether it be the ballroom, whether it be -- what we're seeing with the Kennedy Center, I think there's an air of incompetence that has really infected top to bottom of this second term. And you're seeing that kind of play out with people's reactions, too.

You know, his approval rating going down, lack of focus on the economy, whether it is tariffs, whether it's the Epstein files or whatever, the focus of this administration is not where even the voters that brought them to the White House expected, said focus to be.

Now we know, I also think it's reflective of Donald Trump's desire to control all parts of kind of culture and life. He's not -- he's not -- he's not -- he's not content with just, you know, policy for policy's sake. He believes that part of the reason he is there is to claw back a conservative culture that he thinks was on the decline.

I don't think that's the mandate from voters. I don't think that's what people put him there to do. But it is his personal obsession, and we are seeing that play out.

DENT: By the way, it would take 60 votes in the Senate to rename, to rename the Kennedy Center. So --

BURNETT: I mean, is there any chance they have that?

DENT: No, I mean, what Democrat is going to vote to rename the Kennedy Center? I mean, in the Senate, I mean --

BURNETT: Right. So it would have to be the 60 votes.

I mean, Max, I guess it is amazing, though, when you think about recent things even. Right, just in the past year. Right? There's the Trump bible and there's the memorial 250th coin that they want to do, which I guess could be a sort of a non-real coin, right? Because real coins don't get put until after you are dead.

ROSE: Sure.

BURNETT: But this is -- he does have a real focus on this.

ROSE: Yeah. I mean, it's almost as amazing as the fact that we're not talking about the manhunt right now, which is --

BURNETT: What we're thinking about it. It's pictures of --

ROSE: Oh, so pretty.

BURNETT: Look, at this point, we should just call this out for what it is. Donald Trump is an 80-year-old lame duck president who truly cares about only two things. And that is advancing his own ego. Every opportunity that he gets and increasing the wealth of his family members and closest cronies and associates.

It's difficult to track the progress of any other issue. And this is why we're seeing such a clear failure on anything he campaigned on, and I can understand it if he was actually trying on the things that he campaigned on, trying on matters of affordability and failing.

There's a complete absence of them even trying. And that, I think, just makes a mockery of everyone who voted for him.

BURNETT: Well, they're trying on the border and they're trying on immigration in the way that he's chosen to do so.

HERNDON: Yeah, I mean, it kind of makes me think that the places we've seen, the real effort have been the Stephen Miller areas of focus, right, have been the immigration, have been the domestic policy, have been the places where they've sought to expand executive authority.

Donald Trump's been out to lunch on a lot of the issues of affordability, of the reasons he got there, kind of prices, all of those things. And even actually, I would say even more than that, he's infused chaos on those issues specifically with tariffs, right?

And so, I think what's happened from an electorate sense is not only is -- not only is he not focusing on the things I think folks expected them to, but what he has done on particularly the economy, has really created a causal relationship between him and I think chaos, right? And I think it is really kind of I think, I think Donald Trump has made the argument that it's still Biden's economy. He needs time and all of that. His own actions have forfeited that argument because the electorate understands it is Donald Trump who has infused this chaos and that and that they're paying for it.

BURNETT: Right. Well, the -- even the Supreme Court when it comes to tariffs, right. Tariffs, tariffs have hurt the economy in many ways.

Congressman, it is also coming as were hours away from the Epstein files coming out.

ROSE: Well, yeah --

BURNETT: Or whatever, I don't know whether they're going to come out whatever is going to come out has to come out, I should --

DENT: Yeah. Tomorrow is supposed to get -- we're going to get the scrubbed, sanitized, redacted version of the Epstein files, and we'll see if they'll be ready tomorrow. But I can guarantee you one thing, because this administration has hoisted itself on its own conspiracy theory petard, they've raised expectations that Epstein was murdered and that there is a client list. And then they said there wasn't. And so, when this comes out sanitized, I guarantee you, those people who believe them the first time are not going to be going to be happy.

BURNETT: Right. Well, I mean, whatever we get, Max, and, you know, we know there's -- there's -- there's a lot, right? There's hundreds of thousands of pages of information. There's -- I don't know whether the video will come out, but we know all of those things exist in some way, shape or form at the DOJ. You know, if there's one thing that we know from the many victims that that we've all spoken to is that there are a lot of men who did horrible things.

So, whatever we get, the American public deserves to know that. It's very unclear whether well know who those individuals are.

ROSE: Sure. But and I think also, Donald Trump created a movement that is now out of his control, right? So, they will be so deeply upset because of what they've already done to them. Keeping these Epstein files away, fighting their own movement.

Marjorie Taylor Greene is still a politician. She sees these fissures in this movement and is looking towards a post-Trump era. And that that's going to be, I think, a dynamic that will continue to see for the rest of this president's term.

BURNETT: All right. Well, thank you all very much. I'm glad we did get to talk. Of course, you're looking at live pictures of that manhunt, as we know, the activity by Salem, New Hampshire.

Thanks for joining us.

Let's hand it off now to "AC360".