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Inside Politics

Trump Sides With Putin, Then Intel Agencies On Meddling; Ex- Intel Chiefs Foreign Leaders Play On Trump's "Ego" & "Insecurities"; Congress Moves Forward With Tax Bill; Biden Leaves 2020 Question Wide Open; SNL Pokes Fun At "Fresh, New" Democratic Faces. Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired November 13, 2017 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[12:30:38] DANA BASH, INSIDE POLITICS HOST: Welcome back. Let's for a moment take a trip in a way back machine and imagine how a pair of key historic events may have played out if presidents then took the approach towards Russia that Donald Trump is taking now. Instead of Ronald Reagan going to Germany and saying Mr. Gorbachev tear down this wall, he may have said, well, if you want to keep the wall, you can. I mean, you said you like it. Or go back to even further in time to President Kennedy.

Imagine if he told U.S. intelligence agencies he did not believe that nuclear missiles were headed towards Cuba because Nikita Khrushchev told them it wasn't true. That is the way President Trump is still treating unanimous U.S. intelligence that Russia meddled in the U.S. election.

After his quick chats with Russian President Vladimir Putin in Vietnam, President Trump emerged sounding confident Russia didn't do it. Why, because Putin told him so. The outrage over those comments was too much even for Trump to bear, so he attempted to back pedal on Sunday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I believe that he feels that he and Russia did not meddle in the election. As to whether I believe it or not, I'm with our agencies especially as currently constituted with their leadership. I believe in our Intel agencies, our intelligence agencies, I've worked with them very strongly.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: A carefully worded statement there from the President. He believes the Intel community as it currently stands with the leaders he's endorsed. Well, let's take a look at what they have to say about Russia's role in the election.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE POMPEO, CIA DIRECTOR: I am confident that the Russians meddled in this election as is the entire intelligence committee. ADM. MIKE ROGERS, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL SECURITY AGENCY: No doubt at all, and I stand behind the intelligence, the intelligence committee assessment.

CHRISTOPHER WRAY, NOMINATED TO BE DIRECTOR OF THE FBI: I have no reason whatsoever to doubt the assessment of the intelligence committee.

DAN COATS, DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE: But I think it's publicly known and acknowledged and accepted that Russia definitely did try to influence the campaign.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Current members of the intelligence committee, leaders in the intelligence committee under the Trump administration. Take it back around the table. Olivier, I'm going to start with you, you're our, you know, international expert.

OLIVIER KNOX, CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, YAHOO! NEWS: Yes. What do you want to know there?

BASH: Even your speech, that sounds a lot.

KNOX: No. I mean, this is sort of push pull even going on since January 20 -- well, since before January 20th. We've always had this pattern of the President strongly publicly doubting his findings and then walking back slowly. And he -- eventually he'll comes back around and reassert it.

So, I mean I don't know that there's any -- there's no reason to doubt that the intelligence community found this. And I don't really know why the President keeps coming to this and doing this back and forth.

BASH: And, well, it has happened for the last 11 months. But the fact that it is still happening even though you have all of his leadership in the intelligence community saying it's not true. And after he talked on the sidelines with Putin in Vietnam, I'm just going to give you one of the many, many quotes from his unbelievable gaggle on Air Force One about Putin.

Here's what he said -- President Trump said. He said, speaking of Putin, "He absolutely did not meddle in our election. He did not do what they are saying he did. Every time he sees me he said I didn't do that. And I believe, I really believe that when he tells me that he means it."

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. And that's what got him into hot water, because it sounded like he was siding with Putin. And Putin said, well I didn't do it. Well, OK, it's fine. Let's move on. And it means he seems really eager to move on.

It will really seems too great for the President is the fact that he does ballots to have any ballots that he may have gotten some help from a foreign power to win this election. And he says this is a Democratic ploy to make it sound like Russians did anything to help with his victory.

But if we remember what the intelligence community assessment did say that the Russians interfered with the elections to try to help President Trump, and this was an effort that was orchestrated by the highest levels of the Kremlin by Vladimir Putin himself. They did not say they affected votalities but they didn't say that he tried to interfere with the process. And that is something that I think is just very hard for the President to actually acknowledge personally that he may have benefited him so much --

BASH: You're exactly right. This is always, always has been a soft spot for the President because he believes any talk of Russia meddling questions the legitimacy of his election which really sets him off. But at this point, it's gone further than that. And it's put into question the legitimacy of American intelligence which, look, at times there have been important questions like the Iraq war.

[12:35:14] But now let's look at some of the reaction. First of all let's see Senator John McCain. OK, not a big Trump fan, but understands a national security and history. "There is nothing America First about taking the word of a KGB colonel -- talking about Putin -- over that of the American intelligence community. There's no principal realism in cooperating with Russia to prop up the murderous Assad regime which remains the greatest obstacle to a political solution that would bring an end to bloodshed in Syria. Vladimir Putin does not have Americas interest at heart. To believe otherwise is not only naive but also places our national security at risk."

And I also want you all to listen to what two people that the President called out by name James Clapper and John Brennan, the DNI and the CIA director at the end of the Obama administration. What they said in reaction to what Donald Trump said.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN BRENNAN, FORMER CIA DIRECTOR: I think he's giving Putin a task and I think it demonstrates to Mr. Putin that Donald Trump can be played by foreign leaders who are going to appeal to his ego and to try to play upon his insecurities, which is a very, very worrisome from a national security standpoint.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: Do you agree that Donald Trump can be played by foreign leaders like Putin, and if so does that make you concerned about the security of the United States?

JAMES CLAPPER, FORMER DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE: I do. I think, you know, he seems very susceptible to ruling out the red carpet and honor guards and all of these, and all of the trappings and popping circumstance that come with the office. And I think that appeals to him and it -- I think it plays to his insecurities. And, yes, I do think both the Chinese and Russians think they can play him.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BASH: I mean, you know, we kind of all say this is just the President, but they make very important points. This is about establishing parameters in a relationship that could be very consequential and will be very consequential as issues erupt and as they're going on right now.

JOHN MCCORMACK, SENIOR WRITER, THE WEEKLY STANDARDS: Yes. I mean, it's incredibly naive for the President to say that he believes Putin, that he didn't have anything to do with it. But the Russian did have something to do with it which means he thinks that somehow this high level interference going to take in place without Putin and that just unbelievable.

I think this just goes back to the President's habit of trying to be nice to people who say nice things about him that might have worked. You know, a presidential primary doesn't work when you're on international stage dealing with ruthless dictators.

LAURA MECKLER, POLITICAL REPORTER, THE WALL STREET JOURNAL: I think the other thing is that he may be feeling nervous as the Special Counsel continues his work as the House Judiciary Committee, it's about to hear from Jeff Sessions and the Democrats have already warned him that they plan on pressing him on inconsistencies and this testimony that the House Intelligence Community is interviewing this Russian lawyer lobbyist who was at this meeting at Trump Tower.

There's a lot going on right now as both the Special Counsel and Congressional Committees are investigating as they getting closer to people in the inner circle. And that I'm sure is uncomfortable.

BASH: I'm sure it's uncomfortable, but it's almost like he's flying into their hands speeding into the notion of questions about why is he still being so nice to Vladimir Putin.

OK, everybody, stand by. Up next, tick, tick, tick, the clock is ticking on tax reform. We'll let you know what the latest is after a break.

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[12:42:57] BASH: Republicans have just a few weeks left to meet a self-imposed end of the year deadline for passing their tax reform bill. So far Congress remains on schedule. The House is expected to vote on its version as soon as Thursday. The Senate could vote on its own bill next week. Still, it is far from certain that Republican leaders have the votes to pass either one.

And major differences between the House and the Senate remain. Just for an example, the House bill kills popular deductions for medical cost and student loans though they did end up keeping a deduction for adoptions. The Senate keeps all three but on another popular deduction for state and local taxes, it's the other way around. The House keeps a more limited version of it and the Senate kills it completely.

That could be a deal breaker in the House where dozens of Republicans know their constituents rely on that deduction. It's why Ways and Means, Committee Chairman, Kevin Brady calls it non-negotiable.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. KEVIN BRADY (R), WAYS & MEANS CHAIRMAN: We want people keep more of what they earn regardless of wherever they live including in these high tax states.

CHRIS WALLACE, HOST, FOX NEWS SUNDAY: Are you saying then that the House will not accept a total elimination, that that just won't fly in -- even if the Senate passes it?

BRADY: That's what I'm saying.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: OK. I'm not saying that Chairman Brady doesn't think it's important for all Americans, blue state or red state to keep their deductions, but I will point out a political fact which is that in the House Republican struggle to keep their majority, they have a lot of vulnerable members in blue states where these tax deductions are a big deal. California, 14, New York, nine, Illinois, seven. New Jersey, five. Minnesota, three.

RAJU: That's -- so that's going to be an issue on the floor. I mean, the House is going to try to push it through this week. And if there is any question that they may fall short in the necessary votes, particularly from these members from high tax states, they are going to do everything they can to appease them. I think that there's a decent chance of the steps.

[12:45:03] It probably a pretty good chance if this gets through the House. But there are still significant difference with the Senate, not just on that but also on how much is this bad to the debt and deficit where you have some people who are, like Jeff Flake, very concerned about the numbers coming out on the Senate. They have chances on the Senate side too to confirm what the budget rules over there.

So, they want to push this through quickly but there are still a lot of hurdles they need to get to appease those members as well as just to get it through so they can pass it on a simple majority vote without any Democrats.

MECKLER: And I think that the big problem we have over in the Senate is that they -- if you don't do this state local, if you change it and you essentially undo part of the roll back of the state local taxes, should then you have to fill the hole some other way.

Somewhere else we're talking about a lot of money. So this is all a game of whack a mole. I mean, you give somebody what they want. Here, you know, you got to take it away from somewhere else. So that the big problem that they have to me.

I think the biggest question is going to not whether the chambers are each individually able to pass a bill. Because I suspect we'll able to -- but well have it when they go to reconcile them which is not going to be easy because they are each making tradeoffs that are essential to getting those bills through their own houses. Many other thing is notable in this debate is that there very few Jeff Flakes, very few fiscal hawks left anymore who are truly worried about the impact on the deficit.

BASH: Well and then there's another, the deficit is one thing. But then there's voters who will be affected and they're waiting for a tax cut, particularly middle class voters. Steve Mnuchin, the President's Treasury Secretary was here on CNN yesterday. Here is how he described the middle class voters' tax burden.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVE MNUCHIN, TREASURY SECRETARY: It's very complicated. So by simplifying the code, we're putting everybody on the level playing field. We've literally run hundreds of not thousands of examples within treasury.

And for most people, and again, it may not be 100 percent, but by far the majority both the House and Senate version provide middle income tax relief. And that's what we want to do.

BASH: It is complicated. The tax code is complicated. But middle class voters, many voters who are, you know, taking Donald Trump's word for it that this is not, you know, your father's Republican Party are waiting to see if their tax burden goes down.

MCCORMACK: Yes, the voters who are going to end up worse off according to a tax policies on our analysis, about 7 percent of the country. And as you mentioned, the problem for some of these Republicans in the House is that they are closer in this high tax suburban districts. Districts maybe that Hillary Clinton won.

The reason that the Senate did what they did is they're not in these blue states. So that's why they gotten it completely. But as you said there are a lot of moving parts. You can't look at the state and local income tax without also looking at the fact that they double the standard deduction, they increase the child credit. Well, it also getting rid of the personal's interest, so all these different parts really going to look at it, you know, and see how it affects in yourself individually.

But as I said, you know, 7 percent right at the back will pay more taxes under the 86 Reagan Democratic tax reform, bipartisan tax reform about 20 percent of the American people ended up being unmet more taxes.

BASH: OK, we're going to leave that discussion there. We're going to have a lot more discussion on taxes. We're going to be right back with discussion about Joe Biden in 2020.

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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[12:52:44] OPRAH WINFREY, HOST, SUPER SOUL SUNDAY: Has there been a thought or consideration for 2020?

JOE BIDEN, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT: No, not yet.

WINFREY: No.

BIDEN: And I say that not yet because, look, I'm a great respecter of fate. I don't plan on running. I don't know what else but things are going to be two years from now. We just don't know. So I promise you, I'm doing anything to organize and run, but I'm going to go out there and continue to do what I've done since I was a 26 years old.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Former Vice President Joe Biden talking of course to Oprah Winfrey, staying a bit coy about a presidential run in 2020 but it is pretty clear he is not ruling anything out. He has been spending a lot of time on the question as part of the publicity tour he is launching for his new book, "Promise Me, Dad", a memoir about his son Beau Biden who died from brain cancer. He says he does not regret choosing not to run out of concern for his family, but he does regrets that he is not the president.

Olivier, you said Joe Manton (ph), is Joe Lieberman going to have to give it over his.

KNOX: It's a private moment off camera. I mean, look, I don't know what Joe Biden kinds to do. Obviously, he's going to spend a lot of time reliving the most difficulty stretch of his life or one of the most -- one of two most difficult touches of his life.

We'd spoke about Beau, but it was clear, you know, when he went to the Rose Garden and said he was not running, it is clear that this was somebody who, in his heart, really wanted to.

BASH: Yes.

KNOX: And he certainly doesn't want to leave the political stage. He still wants to be part of the effort to shape this country. It's very clear this -- he's a man in public life. He always has been.

BASH: And look, he is known as President Obama's vice presidential -- vice president rather. But he also has a history with the kind of working class voters that Donald Trump stole, lured over to the Republican side, many of them in 2016. Could he get them back?

MECKLER: Well, I mean, that's the whole theory the case --

BASH: He could (INAUDIBLE).

MECKLER: I mean, yes, that's the whole theory of the case. He could win those people over. And I think, he -- his heart believe that he had been the nominee in 2016. He would have won them over. He would have the same -- different baggage, but not the same baggage or as significant as Hillary.

Now he said something interesting in that interview. He said, I'll tell you a secret to becoming the most popular person. Don't run for president. BASH: That is exactly right.

MECKLER: You know, so.

BASH: OK. There's another thing that we should say about Joe Biden. He's not the youngest person in the world in his mid 70s.

[12:55:05] Saturday Night Live had a little bit of fun with the fact that he's not the only Democratic leader who is a senior citizen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KATE MCKINNON, AMERICAN COMEDIAN: You love our fresh new ideas delivered by fresh new faces like me, Nancy Pelosi.

CECILY STRONG, AMERICAN ACTRESS: And me Dianne Feinstein.

LARRY DAVID, AMERICAN COMEDIAN: And me, Chuck Schumer.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And yo soy Tim Kaine.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And I'm team player Donna Brazile.

MCKINNON: And we also have some great new layer tweeting in the range like hot young thing, Elizabeth Warren and also that's right --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's Biden time.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm still around too.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: Well, that's a thing. The Democratic Party is a very think thin bench to go after Donald Trump ahead of 2020 and all faces from the past when people may want something neat (ph).

MCCORMACK: And the reason for it is -- I mean, you had all these Democrats lose over the Obamacare, so you've got the presidency but you had these huge backlashes and like that the Democrats.

BASH: And to be fair, we'll do this in other time. There is a pretty long list of Democrats under 50. But the question is whether they're going to have a chance.

Thank you very much for joining us today on INSIDE POLITICS. Wolf Blitzer is up after a quick.

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