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Day Eight of Florida Search and Rescue; Trump Organization's CFO Due in Court This Afternoon; President Biden This Hour: Democracy Is On the Line Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired July 01, 2021 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:30:00]

JOHN KING, CNN HOST: Terribly difficult. Kaitlan Collins appreciate the live reporting on the ground. Let's get some perspective now from the former FEMA Administrator and the former Director of Florida's Emergency Management Division Craig Fugate.

Craig, thank you for your time on this day. Let me start with the president's visit. Both when your state work in Florida and then your national work when you were here in Washington running FEMA you have had to deal with being in the middle of a response to a horrific tragedy, whatever it may be, and a presidential visit when a president comes down deciding it's time to give a moral boost to those first responders, to check in and console the families.

How do you balance the needs of the daily work with the importance of a presidential visit?

CRAIG FUGATE, FORMER DIRECTOR, FEMA: Well I think what we want to make sure is the president adds to what's going on and not takes away. And that's why there's a lot of work that goes on in the background to make sure that when the president does come that the local officials, the state are ready for it, it's the right time.

There's no set formula of when, it's basically going to be driven by when the locals say we're at a point where we need you to come down, we want you to come down and the White House supports that.

KING: It's day eight of the search and rescue operation. You've been part in the past. You have to make difficult decisions, when do you move onto the next phase and call it a recovery mission? When do you go into the families and say we are past the time where we believe there any hope? How are those decisions made?

FUGATE: They're not made easily and in some cases the teams will just keep working. Families will often come to this themselves and I think a big part of what the president will be doing today is listening to families and letting them tell their stories.

And as we move into, I think it was important that Governor DeSantis said, we're going to -- we're going to get everybody. This won't stop when this moves into just a recovery operation because families need closure. They need to know and it's important that we account for everyone.

So, this will not be over if somebody says we're in recovery. This will continue for some time and I think that's why the president's support is going to be critical to funding this operation.

KING: Help me through the complexity of the challenge. Obviously, you have a giant building, hundreds of millions of pounds of concrete that have collapsed. Bad weather, the risks the workers are under, they've had to suspend now because they're worried about falling debris and the stability of the remaining tower.

Plus, that we now hear there's likely be a grand jury convened. How does that fact that some of this -- what -- the rubble might potentially be evidence. How do you -- how does that effect the clean- up and the movement of materials from location A to location B if some of it might be required to be run through an engineering check for some grand jury?

FUGATE: Well, we've got experience. We saw this with the Oklahoma City bombing, we saw this with the World Trade Center. There are procedures in place, we've learned from those events. That's part of what the federal team will be offering up to state and locals. But the important thing is the safety of the rescuers and the recovery of the -- of the missing. And then gathering the evidence as they go.

KING: Craig Fugate grateful for you time on this day sir. Appreciate your insights very much.

FUGATE: Thank you.

KING: When we come back, we're waiting for the Trump Organization's Chief Financial Officer to appear in court. This after Allen Weisselberg turned himself in this morning. Prosecutors will detail their case a bit later. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:37:45]

KING: The Trump Organization's chief financial officer is due in court this afternoon, as New York prosecutors lay out their case against the Trump Organization.

Allen Weisselberg surrendered to New York prosecutors this morning, you see him there.

Let's bring in CNN's Paula Reid to explain what is happening today. Paula, the indictments will be unsealed, Mr. Weisselberg will be arraigned, what else?

PAULA REID, CNN SENIOR LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Truly extraordinary. These are the first criminal charges in the year's long probe of the former president's namesake company and one of its top executives expected to be criminally charged this afternoon in an arraignment. As you noted, earlier today long-time Trump Organization CFO Allen

Weisselberg, he turned himself in at this building right behind me and this afternoon he and the company will be back in court for this arraignment.

Now an attorney for Mr. Weisselberg says his client will plead not guilty and he will fight these charges. Now the charges are expected to stem from allegations that there were certain perks that were awarded to Trump Organization employees, free cars, apartments, even school tuition and that they were allegedly not properly disclosed for tax purposes.

But look, we're not talking about free coffee here. These are the kinds of benefits, especially here in New York that can be worth tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of dollars. So, it will be very interesting to see when these are unsealed, the extent to which prosecutors are able to put a value on these alleged benefits.

Now former President Trump has suggested that Weisselberg is being used as a pawn and at this point there is no indication that the former president will be charged anytime soon.

KING: Fascinating case as it plays out. Paula Reid grateful for your reporting and insights. We'll watch as the court case unfolds this afternoon.

Let's come back into the studio with Laura Coates and Elliot Williams, both former federal prosecutors. And I want to read a statement from the Trump Organization to back up what Paula was just saying.

"Weisselberg is now being used by the Manhattan District Attorney as a pawn in a scorched earth attempt to harm the former president. This is not justice; this is politics."

It's not just allies of the former president who are saying after three years, at least what we've seen so far and we'll see what plays out in court this afternoon and we'll see if there is follow-up, as there often are in such cases, but tax charges, things that are normally settled through civil cases or civil fights, is it easy for the Trump Organization to say, wait a minute these are two New York Democrats coming after us?

LAURA COATES, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: And by the way, two separate offices that came together to do this. You have Cy Vance the Manhattan D.A. and you have Letitia James who is the New York A.G. It has the feeling for people that this might be in like a lion out like a lamb in terms of what the investigation was reported to have.

[12:40:10]

We don't yet know. Having said that, tax violations are quite serious. Remember the only thing certain in life, death and taxes and you've got to pay the piper both times. And so, the idea here that you withhold your taxes or you would not pay what is rightly owed to the state of New York or otherwise is a very serious crime that can lend you -- lead you in prison. Here's what's interesting about this case, Elliot, and as you know,

it's both the corporation --

ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yes.

COATES: -- which is not a person, they can't go to jail.

KING: Right.

COATES: And it's the actual person, Allen Weisselberg, so you have a combination of the tax law and the penal system combined to show you how serious it is.

WILLIAMS: And moreover it's rare that there's a crime where the same fact pattern would create criminal liability for both a company and the individual, right. And that's the sort of not paying taxes on perks, it's both of them are seeking to evade the tax laws.

Now look, no matter what charges were brought here, President Trump and his allies and his team would have issued a statement like that.

KING: Right (ph).

WILLIAMS: So, you know, the mere fact that they are only tax charges and I hesitate to even say that because it's still unlawful conduct, but they still would have behaved the same way.

KING: But we have seen -- we have seen in the political environment and a lot of people out there who are not Trump fans are going to roll their eyes or get mad at me, but we have seen Donald Trump play the victim.

WILLIAMS: Yes.

KING: And play the victim card quite well. Again, it's ludicrous at times when you fact check it, but he has done it and he won four years in the White House and he has used it to keep the loyalty of his base.

This is from David Axelrod, Obama's Chief Strategist, long-time Democrat. "I'm sure the New York D.A. and A.G. understand it from an optics standpoint, the first charges they bring against the Trump Organization can't be petty, rarely-prosecuted crimes. Don't they?"

It's the question at the end and there's a bit of snark there form David, which is understandable. But there also is, you're both former federal prosecutors, you understand this is not John Q. Public. John Q. Public should be treated the same way as Donald J. Trump in terms of analyzing the law. But if you're going to bring a case into court against somebody with a megaphone of -- and the standing of a former president you have to be careful, right?

COATES: Yes.

WILLIAMS: Well, it's sort of like the lion in "The Wire," you come at the king you best not miss, the TV show "The Wire." And I actually think these are charges that they knew they could succeed on. Now they probably had other -- I -- who knows and we'll see when it comes out.

KING: Right (ph).

WILLIAMS: Perhaps they had other things that they -- that they might have been able to charge but didn't have the evidence for yet or so on. We don't know and --

COATES: Yes.

KING: Yes. All right the hope seems to be that --

COATES: And first of all, and --

KING: -- the hope seems to be that they try to get Weisselberg to cooperate during the grand jury investigation, he would not do so. They're bringing him into court today in hope that he or someone else in the organization decides, OK, jail time for me, serious time -- fines for me, maybe it's time to start talking. Is that a reasonable hope of a prosecutor?

COATES: It always is if you think about who the bigger fish would be. But let -- make no mistake, Weisselberg is a head of a major company. He is a very large fish. So, the idea that he would be somebody who's only being used to get somebody else to get somebody else, that is always a hope for a prosecutor, but we prosecute both the big fish and the little ones to. We have to wait and see what these charges actually entail.

KING: It will be interesting to watch it all lay out in court and read the documents. Appreciate it Laura, Elliot for coming.

Next, the President of the United States just weighing in on a giant Supreme Court case about voting rights.

[12:43:15]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:48:00]

KING: President Biden this hour says, quote, "Democracy is on the line." That after the Supreme Court today upheld new restrictions, voting restrictions out of Arizona. The ruling by the conservative majority will likely add urgency to what was already a big push from Democrats to protect voting rights.

The president says the new decision today is more for reason for Congress to act and to act quickly. "The Court's decision," the president says, "harmful as it is, does not limit Congress' ability to repair the damage done today. It puts the burden back on Congress to restore the Voting Rights Act to its intended strength."

With me in studio to share their reporting and their insights CNN's Nia-Malika Henderson and Lisa Lerer of "The New York Times." CNN's Phil Mattingly and Tamera Keith of NPR. The president's right that if you -- whether -- if you want something

done now the burden is on Congress. The Supreme Court decision makes pretty clear it upheld these two Arizona restrictions at a time dozens -- more than a dozen states have had new restrictions this year. The court has essentially said, states get to do what they want, if Congress is going to change the rules here, but will they?

NIA-MALIKA HENDERSON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER: Right. And the burden has been on Congress for a few years now --

KING: Right.

HENDERSON: -- at least going back to the Shelby decision and they haven't really acted. The issue here is we have two different parties. The Democrats very much want to make voting as easy as possible for a wide swath of Americans. Republicans don't want to do that.

They want to put in roadblocks to voting and hurdles to voting, whether it's voting -- you have to have an I.D. or anything like that. So, that's where they remain. Two different parties with a two different approaches to voting rights in this country. So nothing is likely to get done.

Democrats will have to work sort of at the state level to figure out what they can do in the states where they control the Houses, the governorship and the State Houses. But other than that I don't think Congress --

KING: But we can put up the map. This is from the Brennan Center, 17 states that have already enacted some form of restrictions. And again, they are larger restrictions, more restrictive in some states than in others. But if you look there's a lot -- there's a lot of Republican states right there.

So the question is, this has been -- there's been a ton of talk about this in Washington. One of the issues is the conversation we have on just about every issue, can you get enough Democrats into the Senate, will the Democrats in the Senate agree to break or suspend the filibuster? Is this decision enough to get Joe Manchin, Kyrsten Sinema, Maggie Hassan, one or two other Democrats in a room to say at least on this one issue I'm willing to go with 50 votes?

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: No.

TAMARA KEITH, NPR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, it --

MATTINGLY: The answer's no. Like and I -- look, I understand the interest in it.

KING: Right.

MATTINGLY: And I understand why reporters ask the questions and why people keep bringing it up, because they're looking for pathways that right now simply do not exist. And I cannot stress this anymore in any conversation that I've had in having covered Joe Manchin for a number of years and where Kyrsten Sinema is, they're not going to move. That's not the route here.

And so, I think one of the interesting things if you're talking about the filibuster is the process that they're going to lay out going forward. They are going to start moving the process on the John Lewis bill knowing that they don't have the votes for it.

And trying to see if, hey, another big failure on something that's smaller than the For The People Act or S1 that Manchin supports explicitly and that he's been reaching out to Republicans on, perhaps this is what moves you on this issue. It's not going to related the filibuster. And you make a great point, it's not just Sinema and Manchin. There are other Senate Democrats on this issue as well.

KING: Yes.

MATTINGLY: And so, from the White House perspective, as Tamara knows better than anybody, it's what can they do outside.

KEITH: Right.

MATTINGLY: Because the inside --

KING: And so let's get to that. And it connects to your point, that if you're a Democrat out there in these states or if you're an Independent or a Republican out there in these states and you want -- you think it should be easier for people to vote and you live in a place where they're making it harder, the question is what do you do about it? In the sense that it will take money, it will take time, it will take presidential level interest and effort to educate people on, look, they've changed the laws in your state.

LISA LERER, NYT, NATIONAL POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes.

KING: Your drop box is not going to be there. Or your mail-in ballot's not going to come automatically, it's different in every state. Are the Democrats willing, ready, financed to make that case heading into the midterms?

KEITH: Well the outside group Priorities USA was out very quickly today saying we have millions of dollars to spend and we're going to spend it. So certainly the Democratic infrastructure is behind this.

The White House has made very clear that the president and the vice president, especially, intend to use their bully pulpit to go around the country to make this case to both argue about you know -- to teach to people about how to vote and to get them riled up.

Democratic voters it is proving galvanizing for Democratic voters to be upset about their voting rights being taken away. Just look at Georgia. I think part of what happened in Georgia, the reason there are two Democratic Senators from Georgia, at least in part is because the state did -- made some restrictions to voting and the Democratic Party and Democratic voters stood up and said we're going to vote.

KING: And the question is and I go through this all the time with maps where the states have done the restrictions -- LERER: Yes.

KING: -- where the big midterm races are, I mean what do we know the impact on 2022 and our midterm election where certain states with big Senates or vulnerable House districts, the ones that will decide the Democrat do they keep the House, do they keep the Senate, both holding just by strings right now?

LERER: Well look, I think Democrats recognize that they need to do a serious education with -- campaign with their voters are aware not only of it -- you know, this as an issue that could galvanize voters, but how they can actually cast their ballot given these restrictions.

KEITH: Yes.

LERER: Because you know as Phil pointed out, they just don't have a lot of plays -- cards to play here. It's -- nothing feels like it's going to move in Congress. The White House can do some stuff through DOJ but not much.

They don't control a majority of state legislatures and this ruling from the Supreme Court means that it's going to be harder for them to stop -- you know, the courts are not -- the Supreme Court is not going to stop some of these laws from being put in place. So, they don't have a -- there aren't a ton of pathways for getting these laws struck down for Democrats.

So, some of it will amount to serious education and election protection. And when you talk to Democrats who are working campaigns, who are working on campaign committees, they say that they have more lawyers earlier in the process looking at this stuff than they've had every before.

And in fact that these lawyers are more educated about this. There is a bigger group pool of people to hire from because they've been, you know, interest in this and these restrictions have been growing over the past couple cycles.

KING: But nothing from Washington is the expectation?

MATTINGLY: I mean -- I mean, look, not legislatively from the federal level obviously.

KEITH: Yes.

MATTINGLY: Justice Department was dealt a blow on Section 2 today, but it's going to be outside for sure.

KING: Outside. All right, thanks for coming in. It's a big issue.

When we come back, Bill Cosby a free man today, already making plans for life after prison.

[12:54:10]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [12:58:50]

KING: Anger, disappointment and outrage, that's just some of the reaction coming in from dozens of Bill Cosby's accusers after Pennsylvania highest court overturned his sex assault conviction.

The court ruled the 83-year-old actor and comedian and due process rights were violated. Cosby had been in prison since 2018. One of his accusers says she is stunned.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HEIDI THOMAS, ACCUSED BILL COSBY OF SEXUAL ASSAULT: It's absolutely clear Cosby has always maintained his innocence because he does not understand that sexual assault and rape are crimes. And that's why he keeps saying he's innocent. And then you add on some arbitrary legal loophole and you've just allowed a serial rapist to get off. I mean, I'm in a state of disbelief.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KING: You see the pictures right there, just a short time ago we saw Mr. Cosby leaving his home. We believe he is off to see -- visit some friends today. We also are told to expect that he will see his wife Camille later today for the first time in three years.

What else is next for Mr. Cosby? The disgraced, comedian, entertainer and philanthropist has signed a deal for a five-part documentary series. He also, we are told, has plans to get back on stage.

Thanks for joining us CNN Inside Politics. Hope to see you back here at this time tomorrow. Don't go anywhere. A very, very busy breaking news day. Ana Cabrera, Wolf Blitzer pick up our coverage --