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Inside Politics

Biden: Economy Is On The Move, COVID Is On The Run; Last U.S. Troops Leave Bagram Air Base In Afghanistan; Report: Trump Tried To Contact Election Official In Arizona; 6-3 SCOTUS Ruling Weakens Voting Rights Act; Trump Organization, Longtime CFO Charged In Multi-Year Tax Scheme; White House Defends Harris Amid "Whisper Campaign" On Office Dysfunction. Aired 8-9a ET

Aired July 04, 2021 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[08:00:31]

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): It's the Fourth of July and the White House is celebrating.

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Our economy is on the move. And we have COVID-19 on the run.

PHILLIP: But is America really back on track?

After 20 years, U.S. troops leave Bagram with dire warnings.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Afghanistan is likely going to end up in a civil war.

PHILLIP: Plus, Speaker Pelosi announces her January 6th committee picks and causes a GOP fire storm.

REP. LIZ CHENEY (R-WY): Our oath to the Constitution, our duty has to come above any concern about partisanship.

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA), MINORITY LEADER: To accept any committee assignments from Speaker Pelosi, that's unprecedented.

PHILLIP: And a Supreme Court ruling deals a blow to voting rights.

INSIDE POLITICS SUNDAY, the biggest stories sourced by the best reporters, now.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIP (on camera): Welcome to INSIDE POLITICS SUNDAY. I'm Abby Phillip. Thank you for joining us on this Fourth of July weekend.

President Joe Biden and First Lady Jill Biden will be spending the holiday at the White House and they invited 1,000 military personnel and essential workers to an Independence Day bash on the South Lawn. The White House is hoping that all Americans are celebrating finally

emerging from more than a year of pandemic era restrictions.

And on Friday, the monthly jobs report gave Biden fresh reason to take a victory lap.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: The last time the economy grew at this rate was in 1984. And Ronald Reagan was telling us "It's morning in America". Well, it's getting close to afternoon here. The sun is coming out.

Put simply: our economy is on the move. And we have COVID-19 on the run.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: But the GOP's congressional campaign arm is trying to make the case that President Biden and the Democrats are making your Independence Day BBQ cost more.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

AD ANNOUNCER: Burgers, buns, propane, gas. This year, your 4th of July is more expensive because Democrats' harmful economic policies are making everyday goods cost more.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: And joining me now with their reporting and insights, Jeremy Diamond, Melanie Zanona of CNN, Zolan Kanno-Youngs of "The New York Times", and Nancy Cook of "Bloomberg News".

So, Melanie, first of all, I think we should say on that GOP ad, it's not quite what they're saying. This is from an economist, the former Federal Reserve economist who says that this year's inflation rates are likely to remain far higher than usual, but that's because the pandemic pushed inflation uncommonly low last year. There's also a boom in consumer spending due to pent up demand as the virus recedes, and the lingering effects of disruptions of global supply chains. She says it is not a structural change in the economy. It's just a few months.

And yet, Republicans have been clear, on the record, they want to make this the midterm message, inflation, and they want to argue that the American people are worse off now, but is that really something that will work in time for 2022? Putting aside the fact that it's not true?

MELANIE ZANONA, CNN CAPITOL HILL REPORTER: Right, we'll have to say. There was an incredibly good jobs report on Friday, and it's coming at a very crucial times for Democrats because they are trying to go out and sell their economic agenda to the American public, not just what they did with the stimulus bill but also the infrastructure plan they're trying to pass. So, any signs of a slowing recovery would have undermined their hand in the negotiations.

But this is a good step forward, but there's still a long road to go. And I think Democrats have to be careful there.

PHILLIP: And there's some indications, though, that the American public, they're pretty happy with the way things are going. A recent NPR/Marist poll found that 47 percent of Americans say the country is going in the right track. That's about what it was in October of 2009. But let's compare this to January 2021 which was prior to Biden taking office. It was 20 percent.

So clearly there's movement in the positive direction for Biden. Can he count on that?

ZOLAN KANNO-YOUNGS, NEW YORK TIMES WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Still questions here, though, as well. Right? You know, the numbers were definitely something that the president is going to tout. But when it comes to also the labor participation rate here, the number of employees that are actively looking for jobs, that's going to be something to watch, something this administration is watching as well going forward.

NANCY COOK, BLOOMBERG NEWS WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: And also the black unemployment rate is still above 9 percent.

[08:05:02]

So much of the Biden economic message is that we are going to lift up all people. And so you can't just look at the averages there.

The Friday jobs report was great for them. The economy added 850,000 jobs. But there's still millions of people out of work. I think the Biden administration is looking at the metrics of, you know, what is black unemployment. What does unemployment look like for women forced out of the labor market to care for children during the pandemic. They're looking at a number of factors, not just sort of the most traditional ones.

PHILLIP: It hasn't always been an even recovery.

At the same time, though, you heard Biden talking about COVID. And part of this 4th of July was supposed to be about emerging out of the pandemic, meeting some of the metrics that he wanted to meet in terms of vaccination rates. We're not going to get to the 70 percent of partially vaccinated Americans. And part of that is because of this partisan divide that we've started to see in the country. Republicans states less likely to be vaccinated. Democratic states more likely to be vaccinated.

ABC News/"Washington Post" poll just this weekend finding that 29 percent of Americans say they are not likely to get vaccinated. Of that, 20 percent say they are definitely not going to get vaccinated. So, even if they make it to 70 percent, at some point, it will just be potentially stuck right there at that number.

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. And this has been the story of their efforts to get to 70 percent over the last several weeks is that you have a shrinking, shrinking, shrinking pool of people who are actually willing to get vaccinated and actually want to get vaccinated as soon as possible. That number in this Kaiser Family Foundation monthly survey has been -- you watch it go from 5 percent to 3 percent to 2 percent.

And this is going to be the challenge for the Biden White House, is that ultimately, as much as there is some stuff in their control as far as vaccination, a lot of it is, but a lot of it isn't. And they have really focused on a localized strategy of quipping trusted mortgages in different communities with the message of vaccination being safe and effective.

But ultimately, whether people decide to take it, that's not something that President Biden can throw more money at or more resources. That's ultimately something that's going to have to be reflected in the culture of different communities. We are emerging increasingly with these two different Americas.

And it's no more evident than today on July 4th. as you have President Biden is celebrating at the White House with thousands of people, or over 1,000 people, and people in other parts of the country where virus rates are fairly high, and that is going to stratify even more going forward.

PHILLIP: Here's the counter message from the DNC. You know, I wonder if this is the right message or if this is maybe a little overly optimistic given where we are in the pandemic.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

AD ANNOUNCER: The freedom to hug a grandchild, to see a baseball game in person, to come back together again -- America leading the world out of the global pandemic with honesty and compassion. America's journey continues through fireworks and parades, to build a better future.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: Very soft focus ad there. Will it work?

COOK: I think what they're trying to do is argue that if you get vaccinated, you can do all of these things. And that's been their message much more than trying to scare people. They can say, you know, if you wear -- you know, if you're vaccinated, you don't have to wear a mask in the grocery store. You can get together with families. And that's really been what they're trying to say.

The trick they that have to do is they need to convince people who are 18 to 27, that's really sort of a key group that they're having trouble reaching. That will be their trick leading into the fall.

KANNO-YOUNGS: And you saw the president focus on that group when he traveled to North Carolina last week as well. You now, speaking to folks and saying look, when you go door knocking in this almost grassroots campaign, you know, akin to a campaign-like effort, as if it was a presidential campaign, or what-have-you. You know, when you're knocking on doors, tell the parents to also tell their children to get vaccinated as well. So, you see that focus on that group as well.

DIAMOND: And there is concern inside the White House about this delta variant. I mean, they aren't concerned about it as it relates to vaccinated Americans. But as you look at the pockets in the South -- I mean, Alabama, Arkansas, Tennessee, these vaccination rates are so incredibly low that the delta variant really can take hold. And you can see the mini clusters that will emerge in the fall. And that's something the White House is worried about.

PHILLIP: Is that the right message, though, to have this thousand- person gathering on the south lawn at the White House, I mean, given the picture on coronavirus is not 100 percent clear?

DIAMOND: I think it's -- it's not an easy call. It's not a sure win for the White House here, and it does risk, you know, projecting a kind of two Americas vision that we were just talking about, but with them amplifying.

ZANONA: But Biden doesn't want is a George Bush "mission accomplished" moment, right? But I think it's a balancing act, because he's eager to tout a return to normalcy. I think it's a message that Americans want to hear.

DIAMOND: They want to allow vaccinated Americans to move on with their lives.

PHILLIP: And on some level, you know, I think that this has been true through out the pandemic, people are going to do what they feel the most comfortable doing. So, you know, symbols aside, I think Americans are going to make the decisions for themselves.

Coming up next for us, President Biden is the fourth and last commander in chief during the war in Afghanistan. But he'd rather not talk about that this particular weekend.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: I'm not going to answer anymore -- a quick question on Afghanistan. Look, it's Fourth of July. I'm concerned that you guys are asking me questions that I'll answer next weekend. But on this, the holiday weekend, I'm going to celebrate. There's great things happening.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:15:08] PHILLIP: This week marked a major milestone. All U.S. forces withdrew from Bagram Air Base in Afghanistan.

Biden's commitment to ending America's longest war has been the most consequential decision of his presidency so far. And according to White House aides, privately he is not wavering.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: It is a rational drawdown with our allies and it's making -- so there's nothing unusual about it.

We were in that war for 20 years. I think they had the capacity to be able to sustain the government. But the Afghans are going to have to be able to do it themselves.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: But fears of a Taliban resurgence in Afghanistan are rising as are concerns that the country could quickly slip into civil war as the U.S. presence on the ground shrinks.

And joining us, CNN's Pentagon correspondent Oren Liebermann.

Oren, the White House is saying this is a gut decision for President Biden. That he is committed to seeing this through. There are some real, it seems escalating, right, security concerns about what is happening on the ground.

So should that give him pause?

OREN LIEBERMANN, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, President Joe Biden's decision was made. He took everybody's account into consideration. But it's clear that for years now, decades, even since he was a senator and certainly as vice president, he wasn't in favor of a massive troop presence there. For him, the mission was complete. Osama Bin Laden has been dead for years and military officials say there is no threat coming from the tally ban, ISIS, al Qaeda that could target the homeland. For him, the mission is complete.

Military officials are also warning the Taliban offensive is taking a number of districts, pushing back the Afghan military. But for him, that's Afghanistan's issue. That the Afghan military will deal with and the U.S. mission there is done. For him, it's a diplomatic presence, new relationship.

PHILLIP: That being said, I mean, these security concerns include, yes, the Taliban launching 100-plus attacks every day against Afghan forces. The Afghans who helped the United States as interpreters and other ways, they are being targeted for murder. And then the U.S. intelligence assessment is that the Afghan government could fall to the Taliban in six to 12 months. On top of that, we're hearing that they're making contingency plans for evacuating U.S. personnel at embassies and other places.

These are real concerns that not just -- don't just relate to Afghans, but also relate to United States personnel who are still going to be left there.

KANNO-YOUNGS: It shows how resolute the president is in his decision here really. I mean, multiple outlets have reported, it's from the gut, right? The White House is prepared for the bad optics to come in the months ahead. Potential images of human rights violations. The Taliban continuing to advance in different provinces as well. And we're seeing that. These past of couple of weeks, the violence has

increased. Also, the logistical challenge as you just noted of pulling out interpreters and translators who helped U.S. troops there, special immigrant visas would be the visa for those.

And also the question is, where do you put those folks as well in between while their application is getting processed? Is it Guam? Is it going to be somewhere closer to Afghanistan? These are the questions we have right now.

DIAMOND: And, you know, it says a lot when the president is asked about these concerns of potential civil war in Afghanistan, the government crumbling. His first response is to say, we've been there for 20 years.

PHILLIP: Yeah.

DIAMOND: And ultimately that is what this decision comes down to for the president. We have been there for so long. He believes as Oren said, the objectives have been accomplished and ultimately, he believes it's time to come out.

And the White House also believes they have political cover. I mean, if you look at the polling, Americans are overwhelmingly supportive of withdrawing from Afghanistan. The question is, does that change once you see images in Afghanistan of chaos and a government potentially crumbling? That's the big question. But also, Afghanistan has been far from the minds of Americans for a long time, even with American troops there. So without American troops, who is to say?

PHILLIP: Yeah, I mean, I think it's clear Americans have kind of taken a step away from what's happening on the ground there. But this is what an Afghan official told CNN's Anna Coren about what could be coming for that country.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANNA COREN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: How can you guarantee it that Afghanistan will not be a safe haven for terrorists in the future?

ADBULLAH ABDULLAH, CHAIRMAN, AFGHANISTAN'S HIGH COUNCIL FOR NATIONAL RECONCILIATION: I don't think that there is a guarantee and there also, Taliban have failed their promise that they will de-link with al Qaeda and other terrorist groups. We don't have many signs of that, so that's the danger.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: So, I mean, I mean, look, there's a lot of concern on the ground there. There's also a lot of concern on Capitol Hill, Melanie. You have Michael Waltz, a Florida Republican, saying that of the fact that we are leaving the Bagram Air Base, it is by far the biggest symbol of our 20 years of blood and treasure that we have expended for all veterans that have served there.

[08:20:05] As our only base sandwiched between China, Russia and Iran, it's a huge strategic asset. Why are we giving away?

What's Capitol Hill going to say about all of this down the road?

ZANONA: Well, there's already a debate going on in Congress about repealing the war authorizations, the House repealed the 2002 AUMF and the Senate is going to consider at some point this year. But you're seeing critics of repealing those war authorizations already seizing on the situation in the ground in Afghanistan to say, we need to slow down. We need to fully assess and study the situation, the implications of our moves, whether it's, you know, pulling out troops or repealing this AUMF. So, it's certainly going to heat up the debate going forward.

PHILLIP: And, Oren, I mean, what is the strategic concern about that base, basically being left to the Afghans at this point?

LIEBERMANN: That base was the heart of U.S. and NATO military operations with the alliance military operations for decades. It became a miniature city. It was handed over to a few thousand Afghan members of the military.

What happens to it now? Biden said that's somebody else's problem. For him, the alternative to essentially getting out now was trying to stick around for 10, 20, 30 more years and trying to rid the country of the Taliban, al Qaeda, ISIS K, and that wasn't something he wanted to do it. And it seems obvious, at this point, he's ready to accept the consequences of that decision, and nobody is sugarcoating what Afghanistan will look like when this withdrawal is complete.

PHILLIP: He also wants to pivot right to China at the same time. But I mean, is that the natural consequence of leaving Afghanistan? Is it a real pivot to China? Are we actually going to do that as a nation?

ZANNO-YOUNGS: You are seeing this White House definitely start to -- I mean, you're seeing them speak about China and the growing competition both when it comes to an economic standpoint and the potential human rights valuations that are happening in China as well. So, you're seeing the focus there.

PHILLIP: Yeah. Well, coming up next for us, now that the Supreme Court's term is over, is it time for the most senior liberal justice to bow out?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:26:30]

PHILLIP: It wasn't just Georgia. Former President Trump personally tried to reach out to Arizona election officials following his narrow loss in November. According to the "Arizona Republic", Trump, along with close allies like Rudy Giuliani, Arizona GOP chair Kelly Ward, tried to pressure election officials in Maricopa County.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) KATIE HOBBS (D), ARIZONA SECRETARY OF STATE: It's so maddening. I mean, we knew this was happening in Georgia. We suspected there were some attempts to undermine the election here, and now we have it clearly in tapes. And, you know, Arizona law makes it clear that interfering in an election is against the law. And that is exactly what this appears to be.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: And this interference has continued to this day.

Joining us at the table right now is CNN Supreme Court analyst, Joan Biskupic.

So, I do want to start with this Arizona stuff because I mean, we've known for a long time, obviously, that the president has been interested in getting states to basically find the votes that he needed in order to win. What went on in Arizona, I think, highlights the big challenge. It didn't end after Election Day. It didn't end after the inauguration. We have an audit going on there.

And this is a little bit from Rudy Giuliani's voice mail to one of the Republican Arizona officials. He says to him: If you get a chance, would you pleads give me a call? I have a few things I'd like to talk over with you. Maybe we can get this thing fixed up. You know, I really think it's a shame that Republicans are sort of both kind of in this situation. I think there may be a nice way to resolve this for everybody.

I mean, this is like the kind of thing that you would see in a, you know, gangster movie or something like that. But it's happening in American elections. I mean, you know, what does this matter at this point given that this is the predicate for voting restrictions that are coming down the pike in states like Arizona?

COOK: Well, I think it means -- I covered the Trump presidency, now, I'm covering Biden. But I've covered Trump for four years. And Trump right now is surrounding himself with people who are continuing to tell him that the election was stolen from you. And, you know, maybe there's hope. And we can do this.

And I don't know if he actually believes that or not. But he is continuing to further that message, and I think that his supporters are really still thinking at rallies, they think the election was stolen from him. That's something a lot of people in this country believe.

PHILLIP: And, you know, Arizona was in the news again this week. Actually, for some voting restrictions that were prior to this latest set of restrictions that they're trying to put in place after the big lie. But it has some tea leaves for what comes next, right, Joan? I mean, this is a conservative court, 6-3, basically upholding Arizona's restrictions and narrowing in some ways, the scope of what is left of the Voting Rights Act.

I mean, what does this mean for Democrats who are looking to the courts and saying this is our last hope if we want to stop restrictions from going into place in Arizona and in Georgia and all over the country?

[08:29:43]

JOAN BISKUPIC, CNN SUPREME COURT ANALYST: This is part of a pattern at the Roberts court. Democrats really cannot look to the Supreme Court at this point. This 6 to 3 ruling upholding two restrictions in Arizona involving ballots cast out of precincts and third-party collection of ballots both were upheld in a decision that very much hollowed out the Voting Rights Act.

We saw back in 2013 when the court eliminated the preclearance requirement for states that had a history of discrimination, which Arizona was one, that allowed more states like Arizona, like Texas to impose new limits.

But the court then said well, you always have this other provision that forbids discrimination based on race. But what the court did this week was make it very hard to prove -- to bring those kinds of claims.

So states are going to be more involved, Abby, to your question of what happens next. They really have great latitude here to impose restrictions that might have a disparate impact on racial minorities. The court said some disparities are just the usual burdens of voting.

PHILLIP: And you wrote this week to that point, that this is a key feature of the Roberts court. The headline on this piece is "John Roberts takes aim at the Voting Rights Act and political money disclosures, again."

This is the second time. We just passed the eight-year anniversary of him hollowing out Section 5 of the Voting Rights Act.

The question now turns to what happens with Justice Breyer? The term ended. He is hiring more clerks. And progressives are pulling their hair out on Capitol Hill because they want to know if he's going to get out in time for them to confirm someone else.

ZANONA: Right, exactly. They see this as a very small window. If Democrats do lose the Senate, Mitch McConnell has made clear what he would plan to do if there was a Democratic-appointed SCOTUS nominee.

So Democrats are very anxious. They're looking to him. I think the problem you could probably see to this is, you know, the more you pressure him, does he dig in more. He doesn't want to have an appearance of political interference on the high court.

PHILLIP: Joan, before you jump in, I just want to show this because this is fascinating. How long does it take for other justices to get out? What was their turn?

You've got -- it ranges from zero days or, you know, maybe even negative days to all the way up to 95 days in the case of Justice Marshall in 1991. So there's a wide attitude here but I think actually all of these scenarios kind of give us before the end of the year. So do you think that that's in the cards for Breyer?

BISKUPIC: Democrats are in such despair. And I'm not here to deliver good news. Although you don't know for sure.

Justice Breyer himself has not said a word, but every sign that I'm seeing, and I'm staying incredibly close to this, is that it is not imminent. He has more authority at the court now that he's the senior justice since Ruth Bader Ginsberg departed and even invoking her name makes Democrats shudder even more because she was pressured to leave and then didn't obviously.

He has, as you say Abby, he's got his full complement of four more clerks hired for next term.

But another element is that he has just given a major speech and is preparing to unveil a major book about keeping politics out of the judiciary in September. And he's promoting that book at least right now as a sitting justice.

So I don't see it. But the pressure could get stronger.

PHILLIP: It's incredibly timely, but considering that it relies, this whole confirmation process relies on politics seems --

(CROSSTALK)

PHILLIP: Yes.

BISKUPIC: Can I just add one other thing real quickly? You know, the Senate that we have now, even though it's so fragile with the Democratic majority, should be the Senate that we would have next year at this time.

And I think that's what he believes is that this Senate should hold a Democratic majority. But to your thinking --

(CROSSTALK)

PHILLIP: Unless something -- unless something goes wrong. I mean, of course, none of these folks -- very few of these folks in the Senate are spring chickens.

I do want to turn to -- you know, actually coming full circle here. We are a couple of days away from six months past the January 6th insurrection. Nancy Pelosi says she has created -- she has created this committee. She's giving Republicans five seats.

Kevin McCarthy hasn't said what he's going to do. What is the strategy for Republicans on this committee?

ZANONA: My sources are telling me he will be appointing Republicans to this panel. The question is who, right? Does he stock the panel with a bunch of Trump-loving fire brands? Does he try to appoint some more reasonable members that might have sway with middle America?

I think it will be a mix of both probably. The issue that Kevin McCarthy is going to run into is that me and my colleagues at CNN reported, a lot of these moderates in tough districts want nothing to do with this assignment. It's a very politically tough assignment for most members to go on.

But what he decides will tell us a lot about their strategy which is just going to be making it as partisan as possible.

[08:34:52]

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: And by picking Nancy Pelosi's decision to appoint Liz Cheney, I think in some ways may have boxed McCarthy in a little bit in terms of who he appoints to that panel.

In effect, Nancy Pelosi was already ensuring that this would be in some ways a bipartisan panel. That you would have Republican voices represented.

You would have at least one person who could go out there say hey, I'm a Republican and I buy into this. And I believe that these findings are true.

And so I think it does maybe ups the ante -- ups the pressure a little bit on McCarthy to appoint some more moderate --

ZANONA: Yes. I agree.

(CROSSTALK)

DIAMOND: -- folks, some more sensible folks probably rather than just the fire brands who he is interested in like Jim Jordan, for example.

PHILLIP: There is also a sense, I think, you know, perhaps among Republicans that they could be targets of this committee, of this investigation. The folks who are the closest to the White House at the time, Jeremy, and Nancy (ph) you're covering this Trump administration. You know how close they were to some of these folks.

Could they be called? I think that's a major, major question for many of them and one of the reasons why you're seeing so much resistance to this committee.

Thank you, Joan, for joining us for this great conversation.

But coming up next for us, Trump remains defiant as his company faces criminal charges.

[08:36:04]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PHILLIP: In Florida this week, a study in contrast. On the one hand former president, Trump still desperately clinging to the limelight. He insisted on rallying his supporters on the Fourth of July weekend despite pleas from his close ally Governor Ron DeSantis who urged him to cancel the rally as miles away families grieved and waited word of their loved ones who are still missing in the Surfside condo collapse.

Trump spent much of the rally defending himself after his company was charged with evading taxes on fringe benefits paid to top executives.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: They go after good hard working people for not paying taxes on a company car. Never before has New York City and their prosecutors or perhaps any prosecutors criminally-charged the company or person for fringe benefits. Fringe benefits.

Murder is ok. Human trafficking, no problem. But fringe benefits, you can't do that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: And on the other hand, President Biden traveled to Surfside, visiting with first responders who worked to remove the rubble, meeting with grieving families and praising local officials including Governor DeSantis, someone who he could conceivably be running against in 2024.

Jeremy, the president was out there not only seemingly admitting to what his top executive was indicted for. But really kind of just doing the same old, you know, jig that he's been doing for four years. At some point does this get old?

DIAMOND: For some people I think it got old a long time ago. I mean, what struck me in watching that intro and seeing those side by side images is if Trump was still president today, he would have been doing the exact same thing he was doing last night. I don't think there would be any difference.

He would be at a rally somewhere. He would be talking about prosecutorial misconduct and, you know, semi-admitting that these things actually took place. And he would be railing against the system.

And it is remarkable to see that now he is in some ways a side show, you know. He is not at the center of what is happening in Washington of decision making. He is certainly at the center still of the Republican Party.

But you know, so many of these comments carried a lot more weight when they were said as president of the United States. We would be going through a whole cycle of what does this mean for the Justice Department and what does this mean for the independence of the judiciary?

The conversation is a little bit different now. I do think, though, the longer these investigations go on, the closer they come to him, the more likely it is that Trump ultimately he decides to run again and the more likely it is that he continues to remain in the national conversation.

PHILLIP: That's a really important question because indictments are a real thing. This is not just rumors of an indictment. It's not just talk of an indictment. It's a real charge that Weisselberg is facing. And it could have potential consequences for Trump.

But Susan Glasser in "The New Yorker" asks a really important question which is, will the American people care about this at the end of the day? She says "Each new Trump crisis, and there were many, offered hope of some redemptive, indisputable, unambiguous end to Trump that would conclude this sorry chapter in American politics. And yet, it's never happened."

It's a combination of will the American people care and will this actually embroil Trump at tend of the day or it's just the people around him?

COOK: Well, sources tell me, because I'm still in touch with some Trump people, that the president -- the former president is telling people at Bedminster where he's living at his golf course now, that he does plan to run again.

And you know, one reason is he wants to raise money for legal fees. Another reason is because he wants to really, you know, lock out Republicans from the field, including Governor DeSantis who he has had some clashes with this week over whether or not to hold that rally in Sarasota.

So I do think that he is trying to position himself as a key rainmaker, you know, in the Republican Party, giving his endorsements, raising money, you know, even as he is holding these rallies and, you know, sort of playing the role that he's typically played.

KANO-YOUNGS: And already taking a similar strategy that he did in previous campaigns as well. Seizing on some of these different investigations and framing them as witch hunts, right, into his organization, into his family.

By no way does that mean that he is at any point happy or, you know, only seeing this as a political tool at this point. There is definitely anxiety throughout that circle. But you are seeing him -- I mean, just in that clip, seizing on these investigations. Seizing on a law and order message as well. Focusing on crime. Trying to galvanize whatever base is still there.

[08:44:58]

PHILLIP: And Biden is leaning in to the ways in which he is so different from Trump, right? Leaning into this contrast. Just on immigration, take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: We built a wall that was not a wall that anybody could get through. We had very few breakthroughs. JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Since our nation's

founding, a quintessential idea in America has been nurtured and enriched and advanced by the contributions and sacrifices of so many people almost all of whom were immigrants.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIP: This is a different world that Biden is living in, that the American people are living in now. And, you know, I mean I think we were talking at the top of the program about people -- it's 47 percent of Americans think that we're headed in the right direction.

It seems that there's some evidence out there that the American people are kind of more comfortable with where Biden is on some of this stuff than where Trump was.

ZANONA: Yes, I mean absolutely. And as you were saying, it really is a study in contrast when you're hearing them talk about immigration, even just the way they're handling July 4th.

If you remember, President Trump when he was president had a whole rally. There's tanks. He threw this big bash. Whereas Biden has really taken on the role as adviser (ph) and chief this week you've seen at Surfside.

PHILLIP: Speaking of Fourth of July, the cost of all of this. There was a recent GAO report. The 2020 Fourth of July celebrations -- plural, total $14.6 million. That includes fireworks at Mount Rushmore, the National Mall, the Capitol of course, the White House celebration and other costs -- this is in the midst of the pandemic.

So yes. I mean this is a weekend in which it could not have been more night and day.

Nancy, you were saying?

COOK: I was just going to say I was with President Biden in Surfside on Thursday. I was traveling with him. And it was such a contrast.

He met with families behind closed doors for three hours, you know. He was very empathetic. He went to this wall where people had hung photographs and flowers.

And he felt very comfortable in that role. It felt very natural. And he appeared to bring people a lot of comfort there. And it was just really different from traveling with President Trump to disaster sites or things like that where I feel like he was a little bit uncomfortable.

DIAMOND: In many ways that's why he won the election.

COOK: It is.

DIAMOND: His empathy over Trump's lack of empathy in the midst of the global pandemic. I mean that is one of the main things that this what it came down to. PHILLIP: Yes. I mean I think there's a sense people think that this is an exaggerated contrast. But it really is something that Biden has spent decades and decades through his own personal tragedy honing and in moments like this, it really starts to matter.

You've got a rally in Florida that is really all about you versus, you know, consoler-in-chief. I mean, I think the contrast is there for everyone to see.

Coming up next for us, Vice President Kamala Harris is taking on some tough issues, but the question is at what cost to her political future?

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PHILLIP: Vice President Kamala Harris is facing a spate of headlines this week that paint a less rosy picture of the climate in her office. The complaints range from communication breakdown to griping from donors about a lack of access to her, to reports of tension with the West Wing.

But now, the White House is ramping up its defense of Harris even dispatching members of the president's inner circle to stamp out these allegations in a sign that they are taking this negative press very seriously.

And this was incredibly notable this week. It went from sort of pushing back in the stories themselves to a real full court press from members of the Biden administration.

Cedric Richmond calling it a whisper campaign designed to sabotage her. You have Ron Klain, the White House chief of staff, saying the president's trust and confidence in her is obvious. And Jen Psaki, the press secretary saying the vice president is an incredibly important partner to the president of the United States.

So Zolan, what does that tell us about how concerned they really are about, you know, whether it is the perception of the problem or maybe even the reality of a negative narrative coming out of her office.

KANNO-YOUNGS: It shows that the White House at this point is seeing these complaints as not just a unique circumstance here, right. This has been a trend. Ever since this administration really took office and the vice president had been tasked with these rather polarizing subjects for her agenda -- addressing migrations at the border.

That comes with questions of whether or not she was going to visit the border. That came with a lot of criticism even when she's traveled to Central America.

So right now, we are seeing that the White House is definitely concerned about this and, you know, trying to get out there and really defend her.

PHILLIP: Perhaps it extends to her political future as well, right.

ZANONA: Right. She's the heir apparent here whether it's in 2024 or 2028. Now, whether -- voters go to the polls and they're actually thinking of these things on their minds, whether it's to (INAUDIBLE) to the border or these staffing issues, I don't think they're going to be thinking about these things.

But it is kind of a broader story and that's why the White House is trying to get ahold of the narrative.

DIAMOND: And there's a risk always to doing this all-out kind of damage control right. Because ultimately, it kind of solidifies some of the allegations that are being levelled about the culture in her office.

When you go out on such a defensive point, you know, you tend to solidify some of those things. I mean when Anita Dunn told Politico earlier this week that this was not anywhere near what you are describing. That's not saying that there's not --

(CROSSTALK)

PHILLIP: It is not exactly a denial of the situation.

DIAMOND: It is not quite what you are saying. And seeing this kind of full court press it really does say a lot.

PHILLIP: What about the other part of this? When you talk to her supporters and aides, they say it is a double standard. She's a black woman being blamed for sort of normal office dissatisfaction.

[08:54:59]

PHILLIP: I mean to what extent do you think that maybe that's true, or is that an excuse for, you know, problems that just need to be resolved.

COOK: Well, I think that part of the issue that's she's having is that a lot of the complains that dogged her primary campaign's sort of decision making and management experience are also popping up in the vice president's office.

And I think that as much as these attacks are extremely common against black women, I think that the Biden White House is very worried that if these attacks continue in multiple platforms and multiple offices, that there will be some truth to them.

And also, it reflects poorly on by Biden's own legacy, I would argue because his White House is trying to project this image of no drama, the staff gets along. That's a really big part of the brand. And these sort of stories drag that down.

PHILLIP: She's facing a two-front problem which is that Republicans see her as the easiest attack, you know, point in this administration. But at the same time, these complaints are coming from inside the house. Thank you all for being here today. Have a great Fourth of July weekend to all of you.

And that's it for INSIDE POLITICS SUNDAY. Join us back here every Sunday at 8:00 a.m. Eastern time and the weekdays show as well at noon Eastern time.

Coming up next for us, "THE STATE OF THE UNION" with Jake Tapper and Dana Bash. Dana's guests include White House COVID response coordinator Jeffrey Zients and House Majority Whip Jim Clyburn.

Thank you again for sharing your Sunday morning with us. Enjoy your barbecue. Have a great day.

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