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Christie On Loyalty Pledge: "Bad Idea"; Americans Honor Juneteenth; Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee Speaks Out On State Of Race In America; Obama, Scott Spar On Race Relations; SC GOP Votes To Move 2024 Primary To Feb 24. Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired June 19, 2023 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:30:00]

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN HOST: Of course. But a Republican has to get through the primary in order to win the general election. And the question is, is anybody who is opposing Donald Trump going to win with these kinds of arguments? The one who's trying the hardest is Chris Christie, his former friend, former governor of New Jersey. Listen to what he told Jake Tapper.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: It's only the era of Donald Trump that you need somebody to sign something on a pledge. So I think it's a bad idea. But look, I will do what I need to do to be up on that stage to try to save my party and save my country from going down the road of being led by three-time loser Donald Trump.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: So that's about the loyalty pledge which is very much connected to the first conversation that we're having because all of these Republican candidates who are not Donald Trump are being asked to support somebody who many of whom argue is somebody who is a threat to national security. This isn't, I don't like the guy, this is whether or not they are going to choose from their perspective party over country.

TIA MITCHELL, WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, ATLANTA JOURNAL-And I think, to me, listening between the lines of what Chris Christie just said, it's like the pledge is not really going to be worth the paper that it's on once they sign it because he said he's going to say what he needs to say to get on the debate stage. But that doesn't mean that in the long run he's going to stick with Trump or anyone would stick with Trump if he is the nominee, especially if they attack him so fiercely during the primary process.

The same way, you know, we don't know if Trump will sign the pledge and we know that Trump may or may not become the nominee. And what would he do in the long run? I think it also goes on to say that in this primary, the candidates who are speaking about Trump most forcefully are not the leading competitors to Trump.

BASH: Right.

MITCHELL: And I think that matters as well.

BASH: OK. So you mentioned whether Trump will support the pledge or not, never mind the other candidates, let's go back in the Inside Politics way back machine, not even that far back. It's back to 2016 in this moment on the debate stage.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who is unwilling tonight to pledge your support to the eventual nominee of the Republican Party and pledge to not run an independent campaign against that person? Mr. Trump. So --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: He did not raise his hand. He ultimately did sign the pledge. It wasn't put to the test because he became the nominee.

LAURA BARRON-LOPEZ, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes. And I think that there's no reason for us to credulously believe that the former president would even stand by a pledge like that if he signs it. The same way Chris Christie is basically, to Tia's point, outright saying, look, I'll do what I need to do, but I'm not going to subscribe to that if Trump is the ultimate nominee.

Because he's out here saying that he is a threat to national security. And out here saying that, you know, he's someone who has threatened the very foundations of the country. So far, it only seems like Chris Christie and Asa Hutchinson, maybe a little bit of the former vice president, Mike Pence, are being very aggressive in their attacks against the president, particularly on his fitness and on his -- the fact that he threatens small d, democracy.

Whereas, a lot of the other candidates, they've waffled between, you know, saying, yes, we understand that these charges are concerning, but then also defending the former president even, in particular, Ron DeSantis, who has repeatedly defended the former president and has essentially floated the idea of potentially pardoning him if he is ultimately elected president.

BASH: All right, guys, stand by. We appreciate this conversation.

And the nation is pausing today to reflect Juneteenth. We're going to talk to the congresswoman who made a federal holiday a reality. Sheila Jackson Lee joins us next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:38:38]

BASH: Today, Americans across the U.S. are commemorating Juneteenth. It marks the moment in June of 1865 when Union troops got to Texas to tell enslaved African Americans that they were free. This was months after the Civil War ended, and over two years after President Lincoln signed the Emancipation Proclamation. Texas Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee helped lead the charge to make June 19th a Federal Holiday and joins me live from Galveston, Texas, the site where the last of the slaves were told that they were free. We should also note that the Congresswoman is running now for Mayor of Houston.

Thank you so much for joining me. I hope you're having a meaningful holiday today. I want to play for you what President Biden said marking this holiday.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Folks, my message on these occasions and on this Juneteenth day is we got to go forward. We have to move forward together. When we choose to protect the freedoms we all deserve, when they are attacked, that's when we cannot remain silent. Silence is complicity to heal the wounds of division, so racism no longer tears us apart. We have to choose to be believers in a dream, doers of the world.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Congresswoman, how should Americans balance celebration with the solemnity of this day?

[12:40:03]

REP. SHEILA JACKSON LEE (D), TEXAS: Well, first of all, happy Juneteenth and thank you so very much for having me. That's why this is such an emotional moment for me and introducing the legislation was so emotional. Because if you realize, we now stand 2023, a 100 -- only 158 years from 1865 when the slaves were freed. And, in fact, we have lived a trying and difficult time.

There have been some joys, but we still continue a steep climb to rid the nation of racism. I believe this legislation and this day, Juneteenth, the only holiday amongst the other 11 holidays in the United States, federal holidays. That even mentions that very brutal history, but it mentions it through Juneteenth in a moment of freedom.

A moment of recognizing democracy. And I think it is a wonderful pathway forward for the nation to recognize. This is not a black holiday. This holiday speaks to freedom, the joy of the slaves when General Ranger (ph) came after Abraham Lincoln, I guess, was a little fed up that, in fact, they had not freed the slaves here in Texas, but there was joy in jubilation when they were freed.

Now I believe the President is absolutely right. There is work to do in front of us. There is work to do to teach the America that if there is equality, equity and inclusiveness, they're not left out. So his words were potent and powerful, that Juneteenth is now part of the fabric of America.

We had slaves, the country, the nation, the government had people in bondage. It was ugly. But now is a time that we can show the world that America doesn't stay in bondage, that it actually comes forth. And we view the diversity now very richly more than African Americans we are mosaic.

BASH: Right.

JACKSON LEE: People from all over the world who come to this country, and we must always stand to fight against this divisiveness and racism. The work is not yet done.

BASH: The work is not yet done. Let's just be more specific on that. The average black households' net worth was about one quarter that of the average white house hold at the end of last year, 2022. Black men are disproportionately targeted by law enforcement. Black women are more than two times more likely to die giving birth than white women.

So it has been merely 160 years since Juneteenth. What is the work I just described to you -- and then there's a lot more than I just mentioned -- what does that say to you?

JACKSON LEE: I don't want to call it good news, but the very fact that you have those statistics shows that there is a stark recognition that that inequity, that disparity has to be finished and ended. Here is what Juneteenth should do for us. Juneteenth in its glory of freedom and the recognition that it was real that Africans now, we, the descendants of enslaved Africans were held in bond, and that trajectory has carried into life today.

That means that governments, state governments, local governments and federal government has to address that inequity. The good news is that we have stronger HBCUs than we've ever had before. Historically black, we have people in public service who have -- including African- Americans in all levels of government -- who actually realize the black maternal mortality rate, who realize the economic disparity, who realize the harshness of black men losing their life.

We are here to fix it. That didn't happen before.

BASH: And Congresswoman --

JACKSON LEE: But let's move swiftly to get these things done.

BASH: Forgive me for interrupting, but on that note about black --

JACKSON LEE: Not at all.

BASH: -- representation I know you argue that your experience shows how black representation secures black history. Karen Bass, the mayor of Los Angeles, your former colleague in the U.S. House, she was on State of the Union yesterday. She said that she wants Congresswoman Barbara Lee appointed to the U.S. Senate if Diane Feinstein retires.

There are currently no black women in the U.S. Senate. Do you want Gavin Newsom, the California governor, to appoint Barbara Lee if there is a vacancy before the election there?

JACKSON LEE: I absolutely do because I know Barbara Lee's work, and that's the difference in this whole idea of freedom and the cleaning up of what we need to do for this nation. Black people are prepared and well. We can help others come up the ladder. We must show young people that there is a future. We must take guns out of the hands of young people as well.

And we must end the bloodiness of gun violence. We have a lot to do, but we have a lot of role models that they can utilize. And I think if the country utilizes Juneteenth message of freedom, diversity, equity, inclusiveness, we can overcome the book banners. We can overcome policies coming from states like mine --

BASH: OK.

JACKSON LEE: -- to eliminate diversity, inclusiveness, and equity.

[12:45:09]

Yes, Barbara Lee will make a great senator and Barbara Jordan would've made one too, but she's my mentor and we thank her for her life and service. But I --

BASH: Absolutely.

JACKSON LEE: -- know Congressman Barbara Lee's work and that's what she should be judged on, and I hope the governor will do that if, if the senator --

BASH: Yes.

JACKSON LEE: -- steps down. The senator is now working and not stepping down --

BASH: That's right.

JACKSON LEE: -- at this point in time.

BASH: Big if. I know you have to get back to the ceremony that you stepped out of in order to speak with us. Thank you so much. Again, hope you're having a meaningful holiday today.

And a quick programming note --

JACKSON LEE: Yes, for trying to have us.

BASH: Thank you. Watch --

JACKSON LEE: Happy Juneteenth.

BASH: Watch "Juneteenth: A Global Celebration for Freedom". Live coverage starts at 7:00 p.m. Eastern, right here on CNN.

And up next, there's no higher compliment. At 2024, contender takes pride in the attention being on the business end of an attack from a former president.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:50:47] BASH: Republican Senator Tim Scott says, thank you to former President Barack Obama.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TIM SCOTT (R-SC), 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There's no higher compliment to be attacked by President Obama. When they -- whenever the Democrats feel threatened, they pull out, drag out the former president and have him make some negative comments about someone running, hoping that their numbers go down.

Here is what people need to know. The truth of my life disproves the lies of the radical left. If anyone should be standing and shouting at the mountaintops that America is not a racist country, it should be the man that Americans supported twice for the nomination and becoming president.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: So here's what he's responding to. The 44th president singling him out, Tim Scott, for what Obama says is too rosy in outlook when it comes to race relations.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I think there's a long history of African American or other minority candidates within the Republican Party who will validate American say, Everything's great."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Back with our panel. Tia?

MITCHELL: Yes. It's interesting because what President Obama said, you know, if we had continued listening, was that a lot of times on the Republican Party, he even said, I'm not just saying Tim Scott individually, he's saying that on the Republican Party they like to bring out minority candidates who talk about the fact that, hey, I'm proof that, you know, America's moved past its issues and they don't really wrangle with those issues that persist.

And I think a lot of black people, a lot of people of color in America will say that they agree with President Obama because yes, you can talk about the American dream and pulling yourself up by your bootstraps, and that's what we hear from a lot of Republican candidates, but they don't address the systemic issues that we know persist in America, redlining school to prison pipelines over policing, maternal mortality rates that no self-actualization can overcome if you don't address a systemic issue.

BASH: Yes, no, it's true and I will say that it's not as if Senator Scott just completely side steps questions and issues about race. I was really struck by an email that ended up in my inbox yesterday, and I'm sure all of yours as well from the Scott campaign, it was a fundraising email about his father who left home when Tim Scott was seven.

It said, "Dad isn't just a Vietnam vet. He's a black Vietnam vet. They left the misery and brutality of an impossible war front and arrived home to a nation that wanted nothing to do with them that was embarrassed by them. On top of that, my father came home to a nation that wouldn't allow him to rise purely because of the color of his skin".

BARRON-LOPEZ: It's striking that Senator Scott said that, mentioned the fact that his father was not allowed to rise because of the color of his skin. But then repeatedly along with candidates like Nikki Haley will say that they do not believe that there is prevalent systemic racism in the country that still exists and that they are examples of the fact that it doesn't exist anymore when a lot of the lived experience of, as Tia said, people of color elsewhere is that it is prevalent and that it does exist.

And I think that part of this is also because their base does not, their base does not believe that systemic racism exists. The Republican base doesn't believe that. I mean, there's polling from the Public Religion Research Institute that shows that 81 percent of Republicans disagree with the statement that slavery and discrimination have created conditions that make it difficult for black Americans to work their way out of the lower class.

They also, 65 percent of Republicans agree with the statement that discrimination against white Americans is just as bad today as it is against black Americans. So that's who I think Senator Scott and candidates like Haley are speaking to when they're trying to say that systemic racism doesn't exist anymore.

MITCHEL: And I think it's interesting just in his email, he seems to acknowledge systemic racism, but then doesn't go as far to say and therefore, this is what should happen. Doesn't take it the next step towards solutions.

BASH: Very interesting. Thank you so much for that discussion.

And up next, mark your calendars. South Carolina picks a date for its Republican primary.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:59:45]

BASH: South Carolina Republicans set February 24th of next year as their 2024 presidential primary date. If the RNC gives its stamp of approval, candidates will have more time to campaign in the state than they did in 2016. It also means that South Carolina would vote 18 days after Nevada's primary. Iowa and New Hampshire, meanwhile, still have yet to decide their hotly contested primary dates.

And an important CNN interview you're not going to want to miss. Former President Barack Obama sits down with CNN Chief International Anchor Christiane Amanpour in a global exclusive, "Obama and Amanpour: Will Democracy Win?" It airs Thursday, June 22nd at 10:00 p.m. Eastern.

Thank you so much for joining me on INSIDE POLITICS today. "CNN NEWS CENTRAL" starts right now.