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Inside Politics

Dow On Track For Worst April Since Great Depression; CNBC Poll: Trump Approval On Economy 12 Points Underwater; ADL: Antisemitic Incident At Highest Level Since At Least 1979; Trump Admin Has Revoked More Than 1,000 International Student Visas; NYT: Trump Admin Weighs Proposals To Increase U.S. Birthrate; Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired April 22, 2025 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:30:00]

DANA BASH, CNN ANCHOR: -- and all of these other warning signs are very serious.

LEIGH ANN CALDWELL, CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, PUCK: Yes, and part of the challenge and maybe the problem is that I'm hearing from sources is all of this was self-inflicted as well. And that is what is so frustrating to members of Congress, to people, to Wall Street, that this didn't have to happen this way.

You know, Trump ran on the economy. He's barely talking about the economy now because it's obviously a weakness for him. He's talking instead about deportation and immigration and suing or taking colleges funding away. And so it's a distraction to take away what is really happening to people's pocketbooks and people's expenses.

BASH: But President Biden learned very well before that. You can talk about other things, you can focus on other things, but if people feel the way they feel --

CALDWELL: Yes.

BASH: -- that is a reality that can't be changed. You and your colleagues at the National Review wrote something that I want to read to our viewers, an editorial this morning, and what you write is it's called Trump's War on the Fed, which is very much related to the trade war.

"Maybe you think Trump's trade policy has merit or the Federal Reserve needs to be brought more firmly under the President's control. That's a separate question from how real investors with real money in the real world are really reacting to Trump's decisions. Their verdict is clear. They don't like it."

RAMESH PONNURU, EDITOR, NATIONAL REVIEW: That's right. I don't think that investors really around the world are looking at the conduct of U.S. trade policy and how chaotic and volatile it's been and saying we need more of that for U.S. monetary policy too.

But obviously Trump wants to bring everything within his orbit and he wants to be able to control everything with his whim. Markets don't like that. Markets want predictability, they want certainty, and that's the one thing that he is least eager to provide.

BASH: Yes, and of course what you reference here with the Federal Reserve is the idea that a big part of why there was such a big market sell-off yesterday is because the President woke up and sent off a social media post that was really, really scathing against the Federal Reserve chair who is supposed to be independent.

ZOLAN KANNO-YOUNGS, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Right, right. It's supposed to be an independent institution, but it seems like with the economic frustration that is forecast at this point that the President is sort of setting the groundwork to blame the Fed, you know, as people are frustrated if consumer prices go up.

And we've seen that in the past as well, him saying, well, look, can you bring interest? This would be a good time to bring interest rates down. Well, we also know that that's a factor in rising inflation as well. So that interest rates are a tool to keep inflation down as well.

So this is part of the playbook of the President. When facing criticism on a specific issue, including something as crucial to his electoral win, as you noted, like the economy, finding someone to blame.

BASH: Yes.

KANNO-YOUNGS: It seems like we know who that person is going to be here.

BASH: Right, except that Jerome Powell wasn't elected.

KANNO-YOUNGS: Sure.

BASH: He was appointed, by the way, by Donald Trump in the first --

CALDWELL: Yes.

KANNO-YOUNGS: Right.

BASH: -- term. And President Trump now says, well, I think it was really immigration that got me elected. If you look at every exit poll, it was the economy --

KANNO-YOUNGS: It's the economy.

BASH: -- that drove it. And look where he is right now, Leigh Ann. This is a question from a CNBC poll that came out a couple of days ago. On the economy, his disapproval is 55 percent. He's pretty underwater there. Inflation, very underwater, 60 percent disapproval. And then federal government spending is a little bit more even, but he still has a majority of people not happy.

I will say that he's above water on the issue of immigration, which is probably why he continues to talk about that, which is exactly the point you were making. CALDWELL: Yes, absolutely. And that is -- I mean, the fact that he's so underwater in the economy, like, that might be the worst poll we've seen. I mean, I haven't gone back and looked.

BASH: Let's bring it back up if we can.

CALDWELL: But I have not seen a poll that bad where he's so underwater on the economy. That's an issue that he was always either equal or winning, that people did approve of him. And, you know, when you have Republican senators like Senator Kennedy going on TV and saying that this is absolutely Trump's economy now, that is bad news for Donald Trump.

KANNO-YOUNGS: And he set really high expectations to move fast on this --

CALDWELL: Yes.

KANNO-YOUNGS: -- as well, to bring consumer prices down on day one, too. When you see polling like this, that cuts right through that argument.

PONNURU: And there's something so perverse about his campaign for lower interest rates. First of all, it might not even be in his own best interest if it means you get higher inflation. We've seen how inflation is deadly for incumbent politicians.

But second, he's making it harder for Powell to cut interest rates. Even if Powell decided in a month, we really need an interest rate cut, if he does it at that point, it'll look like he is giving in to Trump. And Fed chairs are very, very concerned about maintaining their credibility.

[12:35:06]

BASH: Yes, that's such a good point.

OK, everybody, stand by. Up next, we're going to take a look at the epidemic of anti-Semitism. It did get even worse in 2024. There are new numbers from the Anti-Defamation League that we are going to bring you after a quick break.

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BASH: Anti-Semitic incidents in the United States are at the highest level since at least 1979. That is the chilling finding from the Anti- Defamation League's annual audit of anti-Semitic incidents published this morning.

[12:40:09]

The report finds incidents increased significantly over the past year and that those happening on college campuses rose more steeply than in any other location.

Joining me now to talk more about these findings is CEO and National Director of the ADL, Jonathan Greenblatt, who, this week in the Time 100 issue, is named one of the 100 most influential people in the world. I'll just throw that out there, Jonathan.

But let's focus on this finding because we have talked for the past several years as you've released this report, and it's been an increase, an increase. Last year, it was a huge spike. They continue to trend higher.

The explosion, I mean, you can see on the screen we're putting up a graphic that really illustrates the data that you are putting out here over the past two years is stunning.

JONATHAN GREENBLATT, CEO & NATIONAL DIRECTOR, ANTI-DEFAMATION LEAGUE: Yes. I mean, look, Dana, I feel like I say this every year, but we've never seen a moment like this. But the reality is over the last decade, anti-Semitic incidents in America are up nearly 900 percent.

And to think that after breaking the record last year, we did it yet again. But this is the fifth time in six years that we've shattered another ceiling. And we're talking about nearly 9,400 incidents in 2024. Almost 200 acts of assault, more than 2,600 cases of vandalism, and more than 6,500 cases of harassment.

And these are Jewish people being assaulted or molested or otherwise, you know, intimidated in public spaces, on college campuses, in political environments, not because of something they've done, but just because of who they are, what they believe, and it's fundamentally un-American.

BASH: And you talk in this about something that we just see with our own eyes, which is that the anti-Semitic incidents on college and university campuses, that is what has spiked more than any other location.

I want to talk about that, and especially as it relates to what we're hearing from the Trump administration, Jonathan, because they are cracking down on top universities on what they say is all about anti- Semitism on campuses.

They froze more than $2.2 billion in federal funding for Harvard, and that prompted you to say, quote, "resolving the very real crisis facing Jews on campus should not jeopardize the American system of higher education".

Do you think the Trump administration is using anti-Semitism, which you point out is very real, especially on college campuses, but using that to crack down on elite universities that it just doesn't like?

GREENBLATT: OK, so there are a few things to kind of unpack here, Dana. So number one, let's just underscore, anti-Semitism is a crisis, it's a catastrophe that has not gotten nearly enough attention from the very institutions where it's happening.

Again, at ADL, we issue an annual report card grading colleges and universities, and they for too long failed to deal with this issue in a strategic, systematic way. So let's acknowledge that, number one. Number two, let's also acknowledge that the federal government, which is pumping billions of dollars into higher education, has the right to expect some degree of accountability from them. We've seen, you know, the U.S. government demand it with law enforcement agencies, with other institutions. They're pressing here, and that is long overdue.

Now, at the same time, let's also admit that I think there are ways you can tackle anti-Semitism. You can go at this cancer without killing the victim, if you will. So, for example, our system of higher ed, it's the envy of the world. It fuels innovation.

It enables economic prowess. It is so important to our scientific leadership on the planet. I don't want to obliterate the whole thing. So I think there's a way with specific, strategic measures that you can get to the root causes of anti-Semitism, and the federal government has a role to play. But I worry about the overreach that, again, could kill the golden goose, if you will.

BASH: And the Trump administration is also arresting international students, revoking some of their visas. You have been really clear that due process is essential. You have said that it's not even remotely clear that this has been the standard. What is the ADL doing to pressure the White House to give students who are being arrested due process?

GREENBLATT: Well, look, at the ADL, it's our job to protect the Jewish people. We're not sort of public defenders for some of the Hamasniks on these college campuses. And I don't want to be.

[12:45:10]

And I think I really need to say that. If you take Mahmoud Khalil, who's one of the ringleaders at Columbia, based on his conduct, we thought he was a very problematic individual. I don't know if he lied on his visa application or anything like that.

But on his conduct, not his speech, the challenge becomes when the administration doesn't substantiate or clarify the specifics of the charges. So that's where this due process thing comes into the works. Now, again, it's not my job at ADL to provide due process for some of these young people.

BASH: No. No, but you have a very big megaphone.

GREENBLATT: We do, and so we want the individuals who are behind groups that support foreign terror organizations dealt with. We think there should be accountability when people commit violative behavior and conduct.

But if you're going to tackle someone on speech or their ideas, you better clarify, you better substantiate so everyone understands. And I think if the administration does that, they'll have all people of good faith on their side.

BASH: Jonathan Greenblatt, thank you so much for being here. Appreciate it.

GREENBLATT: Thank you, Dana.

BASH: Coming up, a look at the ideas being pitched to the White House to get Americans to have more kids. The politics of procreating. Yes, you heard that right, and that is next.

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(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We will support baby bonuses for a new baby boom. How does that sound? That sounds pretty good. I want a baby boom.

(END VIDEOCLIP)

[12:50:59]

BASH: That was candidate Donald Trump at the Conservative Political Action Conference in 2023 pushing for a new baby boom. Now, The New York Times is reporting the White House is assessing, quote, "ways to persuade women to have more children".

Baby bonuses, like you heard from President Trump there. Menstrual cycle classes. Those are among the ideas pitched to Trump aides as they consider plans to try to boost the birth rate.

My panel is back now. Let me just look at a couple more of these proposals in The New York Times story. $5,000 baby bonuses to new U.S. mothers shortly after delivery. Thirty percent of Fulbright scholarships reserved for married or applicants with kids. Funding for menstruation education program to help women conceive. And then Medal of Motherhood awarded to parents with six or more children.

This is very much a political movement, a cultural movement --

CALDWELL: Yes.

BASH: -- which also has kind of taken up a lot of space in some of the parts of the conservative movement. And it is very real, which is why Donald Trump didn't just come up with this. This is why this issue is being pushed at the White House on Donald Trump, because a lot of people who support this idea supported his candidacy in a big way.

PONNURU: Yes, but there are a lot of disparate voices in this movement.

BASH: And I should say that you have written a lot about this.

PONNURU: Right.

BASH: In addition to what we showed.

PONNURU: And my view on this has been that surveys for decades have shown that Americans would like to have more kids than they end up having. And so the thing that we need to be looking at as policymakers or people who are interested in this is how do we remove the obstacles that are keeping people from achieving their goals for their families, not trying to change their minds or socially engineer an outcome for them, which starts to look, frankly, weird and creepy.

And I think that this thing about, you know, the mother of the year, it sounds like something that would have come out of Ceausescu's Romania --

BASH: Yes, yes.

PONNURU: -- and not something that is going to go over well in America, something that is not going to move the culture in a more pro-child direction, but again, make it look weird.

BASH: So on that note, maybe instead of or in addition to teaching people about their menstrual cycle, how about offering a policy that is actually viable for child care that will help with people's economic situations? Because let's be honest, I mean, if we look, it is true that the birth rate has been going down. This is according to the CDC, and we'll put it up.

It has been declining over the past several years. But there are lots of reasons for that, including and especially economic reasons --

KANNO-YOUNGS: Sure.

BASH: -- because it is expensive to have children. It is very -- especially in cities. And it's expensive just to kind of live life as a single person. But then when you add children, the inflation that we're seeing, everything that has built up over time makes it very difficult. And that is a big reason why women and men, parents, make choices, perhaps to have smaller families.

KANNO-YOUNGS: This moment is making me go back to the Biden administration when there wasn't enough political support for extending something like the child tax credit, which would support many of these families.

And you're right, this is also an economic issue here, where you have plenty of American families that don't feel they have the support to also support multiple children. So, yes, there's a diverse coalition that is concerned about a declining birth rate and an aging population that won't be able to fully support a social safety net moving forward.

[12:55:00]

But, you know, the economic support is what people are looking for here. Just one more point in that time story by my colleague, too, which I think will be important for people, is that the administration is also considering releasing a report by mid-May on IVF options as well to support IVF, which I think will be important as well.

CALDWELL: Yes, absolutely. The policies post-birth just aren't there. You mentioned child tax credit. There is no support for child care. There is no paid leave program that also is not politically able to be passed even in the Biden administration.

And absolutely, as a woman, as a mother, economics plays a major role in what the decisions that you do have with your family. And so it's nice to have a $5,000 bonus to help out, but it's probably not enough.

PONNURU: One more thing. Housing. Housing is too scarce.

BASH: Yes.

PONNURU: That's a big problem. That's a factor.

BASH: Yes, and it definitely plays into the economics. Thank you so much.

Thank you for joining Inside Politics. CNN News Central starts after the break.

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