Return to Transcripts main page
Isa Soares Tonight
Biden, Putin Meet With Their Respective Allies; Israeli Raid In The West Bank Kills 10, Injures 100-Plus; United Nations Warns That It Only Has Half The Money It Needs To Help The World's Most Vulnerable; White House Rolls Out Asylum Restrictions Mirroring Trump-Era Policy; Aftershocks Bring More Misery, Fear And Destruction To Turkiye And Syria; Resources Not Keeping Up With Megacrises; ISIS Woman Loses Appeal To Regain U.K. Citizenship; Starbucks CEO Reiterates Opposition To Unionization. Aired 2- 3p ET
Aired February 22, 2023 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[14:00:00]
ISA SOARES, HOST, ISA SOARES TONIGHT: A very warm welcome to the show, everyone, I'm Isa Soares. Tonight, the U.S. President vows that the NATO
alliance is rock-solid, as Russia and China reaffirm their ties in Moscow. And then tensions ratcheted up in the West Bank after a raid by Israeli
forces leaves at least ten Palestinians dead.
Plus, the United Nations is warning that it only has half the money it needs to help the world's most vulnerable. I speak to the UNAID chief about
how his organization is coping with these dueling crises.
But first, this evening, as the war in Ukraine rages and tensions threaten to expand outside Ukraine's borders, the U.S. and Russia are working to
fortify their relationships with allies. Russian President Vladimir Putin is drawing closer to Beijing. Earlier, he met with China's top diplomat in
Moscow, saying the country's relationship is reaching, quote, "new milestones". Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VLADIMIR PUTIN, PRESIDENT, RUSSIA (through translator): International relations today are complex. They have not improved after the collapse of
the bipolar system. On the contrary, they have become more tense and in this regard, cooperation between Russia and the Chinese People's Republic,
on the international arena, are very important for the stabilization of the international situations, as we have said many times.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Meanwhile, U.S. President Joe Biden, capped off his landmark diplomatic trip by meeting members of the Bucharest Nine. You can see there
in Warsaw. That is a group of eastern European NATO nations that formed after Russia annexed Crimea back in 2014. Mr. Biden reassured them that the
U.S. would never falter in its commitment to NATO, and that NATO would always protect them.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: As NATO's eastern flank, you have a front line of our collective defense, and you know better than
anyone what's at stake in this conflict. Not just for Ukraine, but for the freedom of democracies throughout Europe and around the world.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Well, Lithuania is one of the Bucharest Nine countries. Its leaders are asking NATO to send more military equipment to the Baltic
states, as the threat from Russia, of course, looms. Let's speak now to a Lithuanian Prime Minister Ingrida Simonyte, she joins me now from Vilnius.
Prime Minister, thank you very much for taking the time to speak to us.
We heard there, President Biden today, in fact, reassured the eastern flank NATO allies, the U.S. of course, will remain by their side amid the
grinding invasion -- Russian invasion of Ukraine. What is your assessment of what you heard? What really came out of this meeting?
INGRIDA SIMONYTE, PRIME MINISTER, LITHUANIA: Well, I think it is important that so much attention is being paid to the region, to Ukraine after
Sunday, on the battleground now, and it's the battleground now, but also to the eastern flank of NATO because we all know, as President Biden
mentioned, that this war is not just about the territory, some territory in Ukraine or Ukrainian territory.
It's about the -- you know, the challenge to the rule-based international order, and the fact that Putin thinks he has some right to declare some
countries his spheres of interest, although those countries do not intend to be his spheres of interest, and want to be their own, want to decide
their own destiny. So definitely, it is important both politically, but also practically.
Because in Madrid Summit last year, it was decided, it was agreed that Russia is a threat. We all know that Putin's invasion, as a matter of fact,
reinvented or reinvigorated NATO because there was a debate on how we should treat Russia and the countries on the eastern flank were insisting
on the understanding that this is a threat.
So, now, there is no question. And now, we only need to proceed and to decide how we strengthen the eastern flank further. And it also -- it of
course, covers the military presence, also prepositioning their defense and everything that makes Putin to understand that article 5 is ironclad, not
only in words, but also in deeds.
SOARES: You talked about how to treat Russia. Was there a discussion, prime minister, within the alliance about Russia's decision to suspend its
participation, the Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty or START?
[14:05:00]
How concerned is Lithuania and its -- and the allies over this move?
SIMONYTE: Well, practically, I would say that there was a very limited real implementation of this agreement. Of course, it's in Putin's habit to
use tricks like that, you know, to increase pressure. And there is no big surprise in this. But I would say that practically speaking, there was a
very limited possibility to sort of implement this agreement, anyway. So, we'll see what follows.
SOARES: What we have been seeing, of course are promises, pledges and commitments being made from U.S. and Europe and many others. But like
President Biden said, you are the front lines of our collective defense. Those were his words today. So, what else would Lithuania like to see in
terms of deliverables here?
SIMONYTE: Of course, we want to see the commitments or the agreements that have been achieved during Madrid Summit, to implement it in the future
defense plans that are to be approved. And this means that there should be an upscale of the military presence on the eastern flank, from battalion up
to brigade.
Also, there needs to be a significant impetus on air defense, and also prepositioning. Because it works as a deterrence, not just, you know, that
you need the capacities to defend yourself, but it also works as deterrence, because when Putin, Kremlin, whoever, sees that there is a real
presence on the ground, then it means that article 5 is ironclad.
SOARES: Prime Minister, are you talking about additional boots on the ground? How many more boots on the ground are you talking about here?
SIMONYTE: Well, we are discussing about the upscale of the presence, up to the level of brigade. Of course, this is not like one month exercise,
because for so many countries in the West, unfortunately, that was -- this invasion was a wake-up call and only now, there is a rush to review the
policies towards the defense spending.
Because for so many years, so many countries were not even close to what this NATO standard of 2 percent of GDP. Countries in this region, of
course, have changed their attitudes of having increased their spending on defense and security significantly, since Crimea invasion and are
continuing to do so in the recent years, because our defense spending will be somewhere between 2.5 percent, 3 percent of GDP this year.
And of course, we need to also do our part of the job, and we are doing this. But for quite many countries, we needed, unfortunately, this invasion
for them to rethink that --
SOARES: Yes --
SIMONYTE: If you need -- if you have liberal democracies, then you need to have means to defend it.
SOARES: I was speaking to the Poles yesterday, to the Polish representative who told me that Warsaw supported, prime minister, sending
fighter jets to Ukraine, to Kyiv. Does Lithuania back this too? Do you see a longer -- do you see support from the alliance, growing support, I should
say?
SIMONYTE: I would say that, you know, I would put that more generally. Lithuania supports Ukrainians pledge to get the weapons they need to push
Russia out of the country. And whether that are tanks or jets, or whatever they need, I mean, it's equally true for anything or any sort of the
weapons.
But one thing to mention is that, in the past, there was quite an unfortunate loss of time for debate. Can we provide this weapon, this sort
of weapon or that sort of weapon? And in most of the cases, it ended up with those weapons being provided, but unfortunately, with a delay of a
couple of months.
And this means that people's lives were being lost during those sort of moments of you know, of debate and hesitation. So, I would -- I would think
that it would be best interest of all the countries that can provide the relevant weapons or relevant means to make those decisions faster than
later.
SOARES: Are you -- are you suggesting that allies are hesitating when it comes to jets or other supplies?
SIMONYTE: Well, I don't know, you might recall this debate, whether you can provide the weapons that are attack weapons or defense weapons, but
practically speaking, how can you pushback Russia's military forces, if you do not have heavy weapons?
[14:10:00]
So, there was this debate unfortunately in 2022, but in the end, of the day, things were being provided to Ukraine, including tanks. There was a
debate about tanks for a couple of months or going --
SOARES: Yes --
SIMONYTE: So, it is a loss of time, I'm afraid.
SOARES: A loss of time, and prime minister, I've got you here, let me ask you this. Our viewers may not know Jens Stoltenberg's term as NATO chief is
coming to an end in October, from what I understand. You, prime minister, among the favorites, I believe, to replace him. Is this something that
would interest you? Are you throwing your hat in the ring?
SIMONYTE: Well, it is a very interesting and intriguing moment, you know? When somebody's term is coming to an end, then you hear all the names and
surnames being thrown on the table, and sometimes, you wonder how they appear, how they pop up. So, this is something I cannot comment on.
SOARES: It's not a no, that's for sure. It's not a no. And maybe it's time we had a woman leader, that's for sure. Prime Minister, really appreciate
you taking the time to speak to us. Thank you.
SIMONYTE: Thank you. Thank you.
SOARES: Now, Russia's president says the country's soldiers are fighting heroically, courageously and bravely in Ukraine. Vladimir Putin addressed a
cheering crowd at a rally ahead of defender of the Fatherland Day. Once again, he framed his so-called special military operation as a fight for
Russia's, quote, "historical borders".
But he never mentioned the losses, of course, on the Russian forces on the battlefield. And his words come as the Wagner military group founder says
Russian fighters are dying from lack of ammunition and government support. Fred Pleitgen joins me now from Moscow with more. So Fred, we saw the
pictures there, a pretty big, patriotic rally for President Putin. But also, this meeting with China's top diplomat. What was said between both,
do we know?
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I think it was a really important meeting, not just for Wang Yi, the top diplomat of
China, but certainly also for Vladimir Putin as well. And I think it's simply shown in the fact that Vladimir Putin, you know, being the head of
state, Russia, took the time to meet with China's top diplomat.
And Vladimir Putin said that he believes that the relations between the two countries are going to new milestones as he put it. So obviously, as he
thinks in a very good way. For Russia-China has become extremely important with all the sanctions that have been placed on the Russians, but also, of
course, as the war progresses as well.
The U.S., of course, certainly thinking that the Chinese might be thinking about providing lethal aid to the Russians. That, of course, was a huge
point of tension between the U.S. and China just a couple of days ago. And we heard from the two men today when they had their meeting, Vladimir Putin
talking about the relations, but Wang Yi also speaking, it seems, as though about some of that criticism that has been coming from the United States.
He said the relations between Russia and China were very good. He also said that they are not subject to interference from third countries. And to
many, that seemed as though he was probably talking about some of the things that the U.S. has been saying about China. But you know, it's hard
to overstate just how much Russia is banking on China for its economic prosperity.
Less so maybe in the way of military. But if you look at just the amount of Chinese products that are in shops here now, the amount of Chinese cars
that are on the streets, just in the last year, you can see that China is certainly making an entry here into the market, in a big way, and it's
becoming ever more important for the Russians.
SOARES: Yes, especially an opportunity given the sanctions, of course, have been levied at Moscow. Fred Pleitgen for us there, thanks very much,
Fred. Well, China's top diplomat shook hands with two top Russian leaders earlier during a visit to Moscow. CNN's Stephen Collinson joins me now from
Washington to talk about the growing focus on Russia-China relations.
And Stephen, we heard Fred there talking about what we've been hearing from U.S. officials, I think it was like two days ago, warning of course, about
China's possible support, lethal support for Russia's war. How concerned should NATO allies be about China's potential involvement here?
STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN POLITICS SENIOR REPORTER: Well, it's very noticeable about how the U.S.' tone has changed in just the last week or
so. Secretary of State, for example, Antony Blinken has been speaking about this supposed idea that China might send arms to Russia publicly, and in
his meeting the weekend with Wang Yi.
This is a shift because previously, the U.S. position was that China was rather embarrassed about that no limit friendship it coined with Russia
just before the invasion, just because the invasion had gone so badly, and it sort of backed a losing horse. That has changed in recent weeks.
The fact that the United States is talking about this, presumably acting on some kind of intelligence it has, is a way not just of putting the Chinese
on notice, but I think it's raising this with its European allies as well, who would be involved in any effort to punish China through sanctions or
any other way, for any attempt to bolster the Russian war effort in Ukraine.
[14:15:00]
SOARES: So, if it looks like President Putin is facing a humiliating battlefield defeat, if we look at that, what options then, Stephen, could
China be considering here?
COLLINSON: I think it's still difficult to think that the Chinese would send massive amounts of weapons to Russia for use in Ukraine, mirroring the
western effort, that would be a massive undertaking, it would cost billions of dollars. And it would also expose Chinese companies to economic
sanctions, at a time when China has its own economic problems, and, of course, it is using its growing economic might in its pursuit of global
superpower status.
So, China, I think, sees the Ukraine war and the opportunities it brings to its own prism of its adversarial relationship, increasingly so, with the
United States. But there are things it could do, buying more gas and oil as it already has been doing, sending dual use technologies, sending non-
lethal aid to the Russians and helping them out that way.
I think China, in some ways, has an interest in this war going on much longer, having the U.S. and Europe bogged down, sending their ammunition.
We've heard about declining stocks in the West into the war. Those can't be used in -- for example, for the -- for example, for U.S. forces in the
Pacific or the whole thing may slow down and the delivery of U.S. weapons to Taiwan.
So, China has a lot of interest here. The idea that it would just throw in its lot completely with Russia, though, still seems a little questionable.
SOARES: Yes, I was looking at the trade with Russia, trying to trade with Russia, it actually hit a record level of $190 billion in 2022, that's a 30
percent increase, just shows how much it has benefited from this war in its relationship to Russia. But the other question, the bigger question here,
Stephen, is the concern perhaps that Ukraine could become a proxy war, really, between these superpowers.
COLLINSON: Yes, and from the U.S. point of view, it is arguing that it's only giving the Ukrainians the means to defend themselves. It has no
interest as President Biden said during his trip in damaging Russia, specifically or hurting the Russian people. Biden, of course, said that,
you know, if Putin gave the order today, the war could end if he left Ukraine.
So, the U.S. doesn't have an interest necessarily in fighting a proxy war against Russia, as much as Russia would like to frame the conflict as that
kind of situation. Again, I don't think the Chinese necessarily want to engage in a proxy war in Europe. Their interest is in the Pacific. But
we're going through a period in which there are increasing links between the Russians and the Chinese.
The world seems to be dividing itself a little bit into a contest between democracies, autocracies, and a bunch of non-aligned nations. And of
course, it's long been, for decades, a fear of the United States that the Russians and the Chinese could tie up more formally in anti-U.S. alliance.
That is a question going back all the way to the cold war, and was one of the reasons, in fact, why Richard Nixon took part in the opening of China
back in the 1970s.
But I don't think we're at that point yet, but it's clear that the U.S., after spending a year basically downplaying the Chinese influence in the
war, have some reason to believe that things could be changing. This big meeting and the Kremlin today between Putin and Wang Yi, plays into those
concerns, and it's really part of the massive diplomatic symbolism that we've seen this week, during President Biden's trip to Europe.
SOARES: Important context and analysis there from our Stephen Collinson. Stephen, thank you very much, appreciate it --
COLLINSON: Thanks.
SOARES: Well, Palestinian leaders are calling on the international community to intervene immediately, and help protect Palestinian lives
after what they call a daylight massacre. Israeli soldiers carried out a raid in occupied West Bank, targeting three militants accused of planning
imminent attacks. The Palestinian Health Ministry says ten people and others were killed, including a teenager. More than 100 others were
wounded, most from live bullets.
Israel says it exchanged fire with armed suspects during the raid. There were no Israeli casualties. Let's get more now from CNN's Hadas Gold, who's
live for us this hour in Jerusalem. So Hadas, just bring us up-to-date. What more do we know about this raid in Nablus and what happened? I mean,
it's important at this point it took place as well during the day.
HADAS GOLD, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Yes, really midday. That's very unusual for the Israeli military to do that. Typically, when they conduct
these raids, they do them overnight or in the early dawn hours. Now, the IDF saying that they undertook this raid because they had Intelligence that
these militants were about to carry out in imminent or immediate attack.
[14:20:00]
And they say, one of the wanted militants was partly responsible for the killing of an IDF soldier in recent months. And the IDF says that when they
entered into Nablus and they were trying to get these militants, they say, to give themselves up, they engaged in a firefight. And then they say that
that firefight and an ensuing clashes, they say, they say they came under heavy fire and that they returned fire.
Now, according to the Palestinian Ministry of Health, at least, ten people were killed in the firefight, in the ensuing clashes, and more than a 100
injured. Now, militant groups such as Islamic Jihad and Hamas, have claimed at least six of those killed as those members, including two commanders of
Islamic Jihad.
But when you look at the breakdown of the victims, their ages, there is a very high likelihood that some of those killed were potentially just
bystanders, because two of them were over the age of 60, and one of them was a 16-year old boy. Now, in terms of the numbers of injured, these are
numbers that are incredibly high.
I've never seen numbers this high injured in a raid, in the West Bank. I mean, some people are saying they haven't seen numbers like this since the
second Intifada. Now, what we're hearing from witnesses on the ground is the reason the numbers were so high. Obviously, we've seen videos, we've
seen people in the streets clashing with the IDF vehicles, you know, throwing stones, throwing Molotov cocktails at them.
But this happened midday when a lot of people are out at the market doing their shopping. The old city of Nablus is very -- you know, small, narrow
street interconnected. And what we're hearing from officials from places like the Red Crescent is that they just call it -- you know, it was a
crowded situation, and they are saying that essentially, that the fire was coming from all directions.
So, again, we don't have a breakdown of the injuries. You know, how many people were actively engaged in the firefight, how many were not -- but you
can only just imagine at that time of day, in the old city of Nablus, what that kind of situation may look like. Now, everyone now seems to be on very
high alert after this raid.
The Israeli police says they're on high alert, and also the militant factions in Gaza, put out a statement, essentially saying that they're
angry and that their patience is running thin. And keep in mind that because we had commanders in Islamic Jihad and a member of Hamas killed,
that there's a very high likelihood that there will be a response from these militant groups in Gaza.
That will most likely happen in the form of rockets being fired towards Israel, and there is a big concern that, that could spiral once again, into
another conflict between the Israeli military and these militants in Gaza. The last time we had this was in August between Islamic Jihad and the
Israeli military, it lasted about two or three days, left dozens dead in Gaza.
We've already been in a stage of such heightened tensions. It's already been such a deadly, just two months so far of this year for Israelis and
Palestinians. More than 60 Palestinians killed. Those include militants and civilians. At least, ten Israeli civilians killed and then one security
officer killed. It's only February, Isa. And so, there is a long year ahead. And a lot of concerns, especially when you look at the internal
politics of the Israeli --
SOARES: Yes --
GOLD: Government and who is in charge. It's a far-right wing government, there are Israeli settlers in positions of power. It's hard to see the
situation calming down, and right now, all eyes, our eyes are towards the south, towards Gaza, to see what's going to happen in the next few hours.
We may see those rockets in the sky soon.
SOARES: And like you said, Hadas, we have seen numerous raids in the last two months in what has been a pretty violent start to the year. We're only
-- it is February. These raids you mentioned, and you and I have spoken about this when we saw the Jenin raid. These take place -- take place at
night because obviously, there's less chance that those nearby residents would get caught up in the crossfire.
We're talking about more than a 100 others, 100 people wounded or so. What does the IDF say as to why they decided to do this raid during the day?
GOLD: They are essentially saying, the Israeli military is saying that they had Intelligence about where these militants were, that it was both a
confluence of the Intelligence saying that these people were going to plan an immediate attack or carry out an immediate attack, and also Intelligence
of exactly where they were.
And essentially for them, this was the opportunity to go in and get them. The Israeli military says, they are looking into the reports of
bystanders or civilians killed, because we do see some rather disturbing video of what looks like some men running down the streets, seemingly
running away, and then they're shot.
Now, granted, we don't see the beginning or end of that situation. But that is something that is -- it's very disturbing to see things like that, and
especially in such a crowded place like Nablus to see that taking place. You did -- you're right, it's been a very violent year. The Israeli
military has been taking up these raids on a regular basis, in response to that wave of attacks at the beginning of last year that killed something
like 19 Israeli civilians.
[14:25:00]
And the Israeli military say that they're doing this to prevent further attacks. But there's a big question, Isa, is this just potentially
furthering this cycle of violence, this back and forth that we continue to see? Isa.
SOARES: Hadas Gold, I know you'll stay on top of this story for us, thanks very much, Hadas. And still to come tonight, a new rule effectively barring
migrants from entering the U.S. through other countries. We'll have more on how the Biden administration is trying to manage the U.S. and Mexico
border, that is next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SOARES: The Biden administration is rolling out a new rule, largely barring migrants from entering the United States. Migrants who travel
through other countries on the way to the U.S. will not be eligible for asylum. It's one of the most restrictive policies put in place by the Biden
administration. CNN's Priscilla Alvarez explores the similarity to a Trump- era policy.
PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Isa, this is the most restrictive border policy of the patchwork of policies that the Biden
administration has rolled out so far. And it really underscores the concern within the White House over what the next few months may look like, as they
wrestle with mass migration in the western hemisphere.
So what's different here? This is a rule that would essentially limit access to asylum in the U.S., marking a departure from decades-long
protocol. And it would be different because currently, U.S. law allows migrants on U.S. soil the right to request asylum. So, this is already
faced fierce criticism from immigrant advocates and democratic lawmakers, who say this is essentially reminiscent of Trump-era policies, which also
tried to dramatically curtail asylum.
Now, administration officials reject that comparison, saying that this is not a categorical ban on asylum and rather, they really want migrants to
instead apply for legal pathways to the United States from where they are, instead of journeying to the U.S.-Mexico border. But they also concede, it
wasn't their first choice, with one administration official telling reporters, quote, "this was not our first preference or even our second."
Now, this will not take effect right away. It still has to go through a public comment period. But the timeline here would essentially have it go
into effect in May, when a Trump-era COVID border restriction known as Title 42, will end. That has allowed authorities so far to turn away
certain migrants at the U.S.-Mexico border.
When it expires in May, as it is set to do, that is when administration officials say they need these measures to try to manage the U.S.-Mexico
border. Isa?
SOARES: Priscilla Alvarez there for us. Still to come tonight, the United Nations call for action as the world faces its largest food crisis in
modern history. I will speak with U.N.'s undersecretary general for humanitarian affairs and emergency lead coordinator. That is next.
(MUSIC PLAYING)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(MUSIC PLAYING)
SOARES: Welcome back, everyone.
About 900,000 people in Turkiye are now living in tents or containers more than two weeks after the devastating earthquake killed more than 48,000
people. Our Nada Bashir talked to survivors in a tent city in the southern part of the country.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NADA BASHIR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The majority of families are Syrian. These are families that have already had to flee war and now have lost their
homes in Turkiye. They're already been through so much. You can see behind me the tents that have been set up.
The message that we've been hearing from so many of the people here is that these tents are not enough. So many of the families that we've been
speaking to have been sleeping out on the street for the last two weeks, since the earthquake struck.
And there have been these devastating aftershocks of the last two weeks, which have really struck fear into a lot of these families here.
You can see the children behind me. This camp is full of young children sleeping out on the street in the cold at night. And you can see them now
just collecting some of the snacks and food that have been provided by the aid groups here.
Turkiye's disaster and emergency management agency is overseeing the distribution of aid here. And as you mentioned there, some 900,000 people
in southeast Turkiye are now living in tents like this.
This is a really a tent city over here. But look, there's still so much need here. The feeling here is that not enough is being done. At this
stage, just this morning, we are already seeing 150 new tents being built in this particular area, this particular camp.
[14:35:00]
BASHIR: But these families have been living on the streets for the last two months. It's far too late for them.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SOARES: Nada Bashir there.
And it's not just shelter with the earthquake, many people in Turkiye and Syria are now in desperate need of food, of cash, as well as medicine. The
United Nations say megacrises such as this one and the war in Ukraine are adding to the millions of people in need right around the world.
The U.N.'s undersecretary general for humanitarian affairs, Martin Griffiths, says $54 billion are needed to meet the basic needs of the
world's most vulnerable.
But that the U.N. does not expect to raise even half of that. Martin Griffiths joins me now.
Martin, thank you very much for taking the time here to speak to us. Let me start, really, where our correspondent, Nada Bashir, left off really
focusing on Turkiye and Syria, where we've continued to see these aftershocks.
Clearly, as she said, you know, not enough is being done. Many still in need of humanitarian aid. You've been in both countries. Give us a sense of
what is needed right now, Martin.
MARTIN GRIFFITHS, U.N. UNDERSECRETARY-GENERAL FOR HUMANITARIAN AFFAIRS: Sure and thank you for having me on the program, Isa.
The first thing to say is that it's probably going to get worse, in terms of needs, because in both Syria and Turkiye, the engineers are going
through all the buildings that haven't collapsed, to assess how many of them are safe for reoccupation.
We are going to see thousands of buildings which will need to be brought down, probably, because of being unsafe. That adds to exactly the point
that your correspondent was making there, which is this vital, crucial priority of shelter.
In places like Aleppo in Syria, where I went, also people are in schools. But the schools want to open again this week. So people are going to be
moved out to temporary shelters.
Buying, acquiring tents in the market is extremely difficult because, of course, they're all being used. So we're asking generous donors to airlift
tents and other bulk items like that into Syria, into Gaziantep, on the border in Turkiye and Syria. It's going to get worse, I think, in terms of
shelter.
But Isa, if I could just add one thing.
SOARES: Go for it, yes.
GRIFFITHS: What's so shocking to me was the trauma of the event; 4:00 on a Monday morning, suddenly the worst noise in the world, as one person
described to me. Rushing out of these collapsing buildings, hoping to see all of your children out with you and often finding that is not the case.
The trauma will go on a long time.
SOARES: And this is something that our correspondents on the ground have been reporting on, the trauma and the numerous families who've been broken,
children without parents.
And the needs, like you said, Martin, are mounting. As we mentioned just before we came to you, I read that $54 billion are needed to meet the
basic needs of the worst affected among them. But you said the experience shows that we can expect to raise barely half of that amount.
Why is that, Martin?
GRIFFITHS: Well, because the needs are growing because climate change, because of the war in Ukraine, because of these terrible natural disasters,
now these earthquakes. The needs are growing.
By the way, the figure of $52 billion is to reach a population of about 220 billion around the world. It's a huge number. The needs are growing and the
generosity -- and it is very generous -- of donor member states is saying pretty much level as we go through each year.
So the proportion of funding for needs is a real challenge. And what that means, of course, is that people will die or people will not go to school
or suffer from gender based violence when they shouldn't.
SOARES: Let me ask you this -- and I hope you don't take it as a crude question -- but if you know you can only get half of that amount, how then
do you prioritize, Martin?
GRIFFITHS: It's a really good question and it's a terrifying truth. For humanitarian aid workers in the front lines -- mostly, by the way, local
NGOs -- there is a kind of triage about how to decide where the amount of aid that is available will go.
We talk glibly about whether it'll all go to lifesaving assistance. Well, that's already the $52 billion in lifesaving assistance.
So how do you choose between a school or a clinic?
How do you choose between food and nutritional support?
These are choices that are kind of a dirty little secret. These are choices that are being made all day, every day, because precisely of this funding
gap.
SOARES: And of course, you've got myriad crises as you've outlined.
How much, Martin, has the war in Ukraine and the commitments and aid being offered -- you talked about the generosity, too -- how much has that
impacted countries' ability to do more?
[14:40:00]
SOARES: Because obviously, as you well know, so many countries also facing economic challenges, rising inflation, cost of living crisis here in the
U.K.
Is that playing a part?
GRIFFITHS: Huge part. Huge part. You know, when the war in Ukraine started, most of us were worried that the aid that would be needed for
Ukraine would be taken away from the aid that is needed elsewhere. That's been true, to a certain extent although less than I feared.
But these other factors, Isa, that you're referring to have cut in: the cost of living, spiking energy prices, the food prices for the global
south, all of those have been a big impact. And that adds to the misery of the world in 2023.
SOARES: And I want to ask you finally about Ukraine. We heard from President Putin speaking this week, Martin -- and he hinted that this war
wasn't going to end anytime soon -- when you hear this, what worries you, from a humanitarian aid perspective?
Another -- potentially another year, another grinding war here.
GRIFFITHS: Well, I think a number of things. First of all, the mediator in me has, you know, the heart drops when you hear remarks like that, which
are probably true. But the idea that we have another year of misery in Ukraine and the effect of that misery on the global economy and the effect
of that misery on global relations between states.
And the latter of which is so important for the protection of the charter, the protection of multilateralism and, frankly, for the protection of
humanitarian efforts as well. So when I hear those words, of course, your heart reaches out to the desperate people of Ukraine, whose future has just
been postponed.
But also to the rest of us around the world. Ukraine has that special capacity to affect us all. And of course, the earlier that comes to a
conclusion, the better.
SOARES: Indeed. Martin Griffiths, really appreciate you taking the time to speak to us. Thank you, Martin.
GRIFFITHS: Thanks a lot, Isa.
SOARES: Now we are now learning that Turkiye's radio and television supreme council is imposing fines and broadcasting bans on three TV
stations. It's over their coverage of the deadly earthquake that hit the southern part of the country more than two weeks ago.
A council member justified this by saying that these stations discussed the problems experience in affected areas and the demands of citizens during
their coverage. Turkish journalists expressed concern that these fines are indicative of how the government will pressure the media ahead of the
coming elections.
A general election is scheduled to take place on June 18th. But president Recep Tayyip Erdogan has signaled he wants it to be held a month earlier.
And still to come tonight, two prominent figures are descending on the site of the toxic train derailment in Ohio for very different reasons. A live
report from East Palestine, just ahead.
(MUSIC PLAYING)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:45:00]
(MUSIC PLAYING)
SOARES: Under intense pressure to do more from a town affected by toxic train derailment, the U.S. Transportation Secretary orbited East Palestine,
Ohio, tomorrow. A U.S. official tells CNN the time is right now that the federal government is moving out of the emergency response base and
transitioning to long-term cleanup.
Pete Buttigieg's visits will coincide with a government report on what caused the Norfolk Southern train to derail, triggering a fire as well as
releasing toxic fumes.
Also, former president Donald Trump is visiting the site of the train derailment. He arrived in Ohio a short time ago. That's where we find
Miguel Marquez, who is live from East Palestine, with more.
Just explain to our viewers, what president Donald Trump is doing there.
What we have we had from him so far?
MIGUEL MARQUEZ, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, no big rallies but he's gone over to the site near where the train derailed. And he's meeting
some of the first responders and those cleaning up this mess, as well.
This has become both a disaster and also very political at the same time. This is a part of Ohio that is very supportive of Donald Trump, very
distrustful of Democrats and the Biden administration, which now is going as far as they can go to push in Norfolk Southern to clean up this mess and
pay for it, ordering it at this point for them to do just that.
I want to show you how difficult it is to do this. This is one of the creeks right in the middle of East Palestine. These booms that you see,
these little white booms, those lay over the top of the water, as it stirred up any toxins in it. They are captured in that. They are getting
ready to lay new ones out. They've been replacing them all day long.
And then you have these generators here that suck water out of the stream and pump it back in at a very high volume so you can see how it disturbs
the water. So anything flowing along the bottom or in the water is pushed to the top and it is captured by these things.
It is dirty work, it is hard work and it's taking them a long time to do this. But now not only the railroad, Norfolk Southern, but the federal
government and the states of both Ohio and Pennsylvania, which is right next door, now all saying they are here for the long term, years until all
of this is cleaned up.
SOARES: And Trump's visit and Pete Buttigieg's visit tomorrow, it speaks to the frustration we've been hearing on the ground. Tell our audience what
you have been hearing from those there who feel they have been forgotten.
MARQUEZ: The biggest problem that people here have is that the derailment happened and that was bad enough. Where we are standing, this is a mile or
two kilometers or so from where the train derailed. So it derailed and that was bad enough.
Then Norfolk Southern said, well, we have to do a controlled burn, because some of the cars, if we don't do, it they are going to explode.
That sent up a massive plume into the air. Farmers and others for miles around into Pennsylvania were affected by that as well. And then after
that, they discovered, oh, there is more chemicals than we first knew were on that train.
So day after day, people have had a slightly different story, finding out information is not exactly what they were told to begin with. And that is
the concern. That's why EPA, the federal government has now come in and said, we are going to be responsible for the entire cleanup.
We are going to approve Norfolk Southern's plan and we are going to watch them through this entire process. And they are going to pay for all of it.
SOARES: Miguel Marquez for us in East Palestine, Ohio, thank you. We appreciate it.
Well, Mexico's former security minister has been found guilty of taking bribes from the drug cartels he had sworn to combat. A U.S. federal jury
found him guilty on five charges, including conspiracy to obtain and distribute cocaine in United States.
Garcia Luna pleaded not guilty to all charges and can appeal.
A woman who left the U.K. as a teenager to join ISIS has lost an appeal against the decision to revoke her British citizenship.
[14:50:00]
SOARES: Her lawyers had argued that the U.K. should investigate if she was a victim of trafficking. Her legal team says the case is nowhere near over.
Former British home secretary Sajid Javid, who removed her citizenship, said he welcomed the court's ruling.
Still to come tonight, fresh coffee, extra virgin olive oil, two of Italy's most iconic tastes.
But in the same cup?
Starbucks thinks so, we will tell you about the new beverage line, next. I have my doubts.
(MUSIC PLAYING)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(MUSIC PLAYING)
SOARES: Welcome back, everyone.
I love my morning coffee and I also love olive oil. I am Mediterranean, after all.
But do they need to be brought together in one mug?
The world's biggest name in coffee thinks yes. "CNN THIS MORNING" anchor Poppy Harlow went to Italy, where the drinks are rolling out this week, to
ask the Starbucks CEO about his latest creation. Have a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HOWARD SCHULTZ, CEO, STARBUCKS: To our surprise, to say the least, the taste profile started producing this luscious, velvety flavor that lingers
in your mouth. We've discovered something quite extraordinary.
POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: You think this transforms coffee?
SCHULTZ: I know it'll transform the coffee industry. A very few people outside of Starbucks have tasted it -- no consumer research, whatsoever.
Nothing.
HARLOW: Isn't that a risk?
SCHULTZ: I don't think so. I mean, I just think everything we've ever done that has succeeded at Starbucks is proven in the cup.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: I want to know what you think of the new drink.
Is it the next pumpkin spice?
Or do oil and coffee go together?
If you are Italian, we already know what you think. They do not go together, you're like your coffee, short and strong.
In case you're asking, he's talking about extra virgin olive oil, which makes me think twice there. But the coffee giant is also facing a big
social issue and that is unionization. Schultz does not believe that's the answer to the wider issues really motivating employees.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SCHULTZ: When you have a whole generation that has lived through 2008 financial crisis, 9/11, COVID.
[14:55:00]
SCHULTZ: And they've been imprinted with a government situation of politics that's not working, government that is not representative of them,
companies that have let them down.
There is a macro issue here that is much, much bigger than Starbucks Coffee Company. And that, to a large part, is being somewhat intertwined with
companies who are now being faced with unionization, because they are upset, not so much with the company but the situation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Well, unionized workers say they are fighting for things like guaranteed schedules. It's worth noting the numbers here, of more than
9,000 U.S. Starbucks store, 282 have been unionized.
It is National Margarita Day. But before you squeeze the lime into your drink, we have got some news. Scientists say these could soon be at risk
and it's because of the climate crisis.
They say agave, the main ingredient in tequila, is too fragile to really endure the recent weather whiplash. The plant's pollinators are also
threatened. Warming temperatures are a growing concern for the only animal to pollinate agave. And those are bats.
Ron Magill, wildlife expert at Zoo Miami, said, "You wouldn't have tequila if you had no bats."
Think about that when you order your next margarita.
That's it for me tonight, thank you. Stay right here, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" is next.
END
