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Isa Soares Tonight

U.S. And Russia Carry Out Massive Prisoner Swap; Turkey Confirms It Played Mediator Role In Huge Prisoner Swap Which Involved Seven Countries; Massive Russia And U.S. Prisoner Swap; Historic Prisoner Swap; American Prisoners Released En Route To U.S.; Bomb That Killed Hamas Leader Was Planted Months Ago; Former Head Of Mossad Speaks To CNN. Aired 2-3p ET

Aired August 01, 2024 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:27]

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Breaking News!

ISA SOARES, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST: Hello, and a very warm welcome, everyone, I'm Isa Soares. Tonight, we begin with breaking news that's been

years in the making. We are seeing the largest prisoner exchange between the U.S. and Russia since the cold war.

The Biden administration confirms "Wall Street Journal" reporter Evan Gershkovich, American Marine Paul -- veteran Paul Whelan, you can see that

in the middle of your screen, and Russian-American journalist Alsu Kurmasheva are now on their way back to the United States.

Part of the massive prisoner swap that has freed 24 detainees and two children. Here's what President Biden had to say just a short time ago.

Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Good Lord, deal is over and they're free. Moments ago, the families and I are able to speak to them on

telephone from the Oval Office. Throughout of Russia, earlier today, they were flown to Turkey, and soon they'll be wheels up on their way home to

see their families.

This is an incredible relief for all the family members gathered here. Is relief to the friends and colleagues all across the country who have been

praying for this day for a long time.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SOARES: Well, you are looking -- we're showing you there images released by Russian state media. They include Gershkovich, Whelan as well as Russian

dissident Vladimir Kara-Murza ahead of their release. You can see there, Whelan just walking up the stairs of that airplane.

On the other side of the exchange, some of the prisoners you're looking there released back to Russia weren't being held in the United States. They

include this man you're looking at, Russian assassin Vadim Krasikov who was convicted in Germany. Turkey, which played a mediator role says the swap

involved seven countries.

The exchange comes after months of very complicated and complex negotiations between Moscow, Washington, Berlin, as well as seven other

countries. Our international diplomatic editor, Nic Robertson standing by, but first, let's bring in CNN's Priscilla Alvarez live from Washington D.C.

And Priscilla, I mean, this really does end a nightmare scenario for all these families and hostages. And finally, we have some good news to bring

to our viewers right around the world. Just talk us through what we've heard from the President in the past hour, and what we're likely to see

here in the coming hours, because it was a very moving press conference that we saw there from President Biden.

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the President putting it quite simply, he said, quote, "their brutal ordeal is over. That has been the

theme of the day as administration officials on the President himself have talked about this historic prisoner swap. Now, of course, the President was

flanked there by the family members of those Americans released from Russia.

That too was an emotional moment in and of itself, and we learned more about how that unfolded over the course of the morning, the families at the

White House waiting to be let into the Oval Office when that happened, the President sharing the news, knowing the exchanged had happened with those

families, and then having two phone calls.

There was a phone call with Paul, Evan, and also they were in one place. There were the three of them able to talk to their family members and then

another call with Vladimir, so, the family could also talk to him. So, those phone calls taking place this morning as National Security adviser

Jake Sullivan called the moment and the families just overjoyed.

And you can tell just the weight of this day, not only through the families and from the President's remarks today, but also from the National Security

adviser who with his team was deeply involved in these intensive diplomatic negotiations when he was at that White House podium during the briefing

which ended moments ago, he got -- he fought back tears, and he is not one to get emotional, but he talked about the relief of the day.

Of course, this was weeks, months, years in the making. If you recall, back in December of 2022 with the release of Brittney Griner, the President also

addressing the nation and noting then that he understood the feelings, the mixed emotions of Paul Whelan's family because he had not been part of that

deal.

Of course, Evan Gershkovich had not yet been detained at that point, but now he is. And so, there is some relief here within the administration to

have been able to come through with that, along with some of these others.

[14:05:00]

And this of course, went to the highest diplomatic channels with the President himself talking to the German chancellor earlier this year twice

along with conversations that the Vice President had with the chancellor to try to reach this deal, because of course, it wasn't just about why these

Americans be released, but also findings someone to or someone's to do that exchange with Russia, and they did have to look across the globe for that.

Now, as what -- as to what happens over the next several hours, they will all -- they will be on their way back to the U.S., that being Paul, Evan

and also Vladimir will be heading to Germany. He'll meet his family there, the others will arrive here. The President and the Vice President will

greet them on the tarmac for what is expected to be yet another emotional moment with family members.

So, the day, this momentous day will conclude with the family reunited with their loved ones and the Vice President and the President there to greet

them.

SOARES: Yes, and we're all longing to see those images as she was talking. I just want to brief -- just show our viewers this image that we want to

share, if it was actually put -- shared on social media by President Biden. You can see there, everyone on that plane after enduring unimaginable

suffering and uncertainty, the prison rights, the Americans detained in Russia are safe, free and happy.

Begun their journeys back into the arms of their families. And you can see many of them, Evan there and Paul Whelan as well as Kara-Murza, all making

their way back to United States. And stay with us, let me just go to Nic Robertson, Priscilla, and Nic, this is historic, and like President Biden

said, it is a feat of diplomacy and friendship and multilateral deal, Nic, that's involved numerous countries including many NATO allies. Speak to the

complexity of this deal.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Well, there were countries that were called upon here, like Norway, like Slovenia who had

Russians detained, spies, others detained, that President Biden was essentially asking to hand over those people for the benefit of other

countries, for the benefit of the United States --

SOARES: Yes --

ROBERTSON: For the benefit of other people, which they did, and Poland was involved as well. But I think most significantly, it's the German

Chancellor Olaf Scholz, that not only President Biden singled out for a deep sense of gratitude for what he's done, because one of the detainees

that went back to Russia is a murderer, a colonel from the FSB who murdered a Kremlin opponent, a Chechen in Billing(ph) Park in broad daylight.

He was convicted in 2019 of that, sentenced to prison. So, this was a big deal to go against the rule of law for Germany. But Olaf Scholz, the German

Chancellor said absolutely that he would do it. And we heard as well from Sullivan as well, saying that this was and I quote him here, he said --

Scholz said to Biden, for you, I will do this.

And this is really the art of diplomacy. It's not -- it becomes -- President Biden really wanted to put on the table today when he was

speaking about it, talking about the importance of having a leader in the United States --

SOARES: Yes --

ROBERTSON: That can work with other countries who is not -- who is not an isolationist. Because the clear -- the clear comparison would be with the

former President Donald Trump, who --

SOARES: Yes --

ROBERTSON: Had an absolutely tempestuous relationship with Olaf Scholz's predecessor, the German Chancellor Angela Merkel night and day, those

relationships. And it's -- and it's the daylight, if you will, of Biden that brings the results and brings the positivity here. And I think that's

something that he really wanted to put on the table.

And also shows you, it shows everyone I think, the value that Scholz puts in having a Democrat, if you will, in at the White House.

SOARES: Indeed, and on that, we heard from the White House in the last what? Forty five minutes or so, saying that Scholz told Biden for you, I

will do this when he agreed, of course, to a Russian assassin, of course, as it was mentioned, he was part of this prisoner swap, this is what the

White House has confirmed, has told us in the last hour.

So, Priscilla, I mean, we also heard Jake Sullivan, he was, you know, very moved by this historic day and by the fact that these families, these

hostages coming home saying this was vintage, his said vintage Joe Biden. I mean, we know he worked the phones on the prisoners, just an hour, I think

before he dropped out of the 2024 race. I mean, this is a huge diplomatic success for him. How significant is this for him, and indeed, the

Democratic Party?

ALVAREZ: Well, this is certainly going to be part of his legacy. Look, President Biden has always underscored his foreign policy chops. He did

that over the course of his presidency, and he also did it on the campaign trail when he was running for a second term, often talking about the

importance of relationships with world leaders.

[14:10:00]

Even mentioning moments in times where he would have private conversations with world leaders who would express concern if former President Donald

Trump were to take a second term. You know, the President, when he came into office back in 2021, made the point of wanting to re-assert U.S.

leadership on the world stage to strengthen alliances.

And that is a lot of what we have seen over the last several years. And it really came, came to fruition today. The President, when he did speak

earlier this afternoon, said that it was important for the U.S. to have strong alliances across the world. In fact, he said, quote, "our alliances

make people safer".

He also said, they matter, and he used this as an example of quote, 'why it's important to have friends". And so, clearly, the President, not only

using this moment to mark the celebration of the release of these Americans held in Russia, but also to yet again underscore the importance of U.S.

relationships with countries around the world, especially in the face of the former President's policies and Republican -- some Republican policies

to be quite isolationist as you heard there from Nic.

And so, this again was an opportunity for the President to flex those foreign policy chops, and that is what we are hearing so much of from

senior administration officials today as they reflect on what the last few months have held, a lot of that was those calls that the President was

having with the German Chancellor, with the Prime Minister of Slovenia, to make sure that this came through, including as you mentioned, only an hour

before he dropped --

SOARES: Yes --

ALVAREZ: Out of the presidential race. So, this is certainly an important point in theme, that we have seen over the course of his presidency, one,

we'll hear about more in the weeks to come.

SOARES: Priscilla Alvarez and our Nic Robertson in Washington. Thank you to you both. Well, a U.S. official says the CIA was directly involved in the

negotiations. To discuss that, I'm joined by the CIA's former chief of Russia Operations, Steve Hall. He is also a CNN National Security analyst.

Steve, great to have you on the show. Look, as we heard from Nic there on the ground in Washington D.C., I mean, this was a multipronged effort,

right? Right behind the scenes historic. And it's so wonderful to see this for so many families. Just speak first of the logistical complexity of the

deal of this size.

STEVE HALL, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Yes, incredibly complex and incredibly difficult, especially because you're dealing with not with an

ally, but with the Russians who are very difficult to trust and have trust issues of their own. So, it's really a difficult thing. It's a whole of

government thing, at least on the American side of it.

And in this case, as we saw, as both Nic and Priscilla were saying, it's not just a whole of government, but a whole of partners. I mean, these are,

you know, partners or world around that we had to rely on, that we did successfully rely on because of the existing relationships.

Not just treaty relationships, which are, you know, technical in nature, but actual personal relationships between world leaders, between our

President, you know, and other world leaders. That's critically important. The CIA often times plays an important role in this particular situation

because often, the Russians insist on using Intelligence channels, as they refer to them, special channels.

Because they believe that there's an increased amount of secrecy, discretion and clandestine, which is critical when these -- when these

discussions and negotiations are going on. So, it's not uncommon to have at least a primary vector be between Intelligence services. But of course,

it's all a National Security issue. So, this is, you know, again a whole of government approach.

SOARES: And the Russians got their criminals back including the Russian assassin Vadim Krasikov. The U.S. got their hostages who were forcefully

accused via these sham trials. So, who then in your view, got the better of the deal? How much was this a strategic win Steve, for Putin here?

HALL: Yes, the way you phrase that question is excellent, and it's exactly the way it needs to be phrased. This was a hostage negotiation. This wasn't

bad guys on both sides, there is no moral equivalency between an assassin who actually killed somebody, you know -- you know, in cold blood in

Germany.

And then, you know, it gets -- it gets to go back to Russia after being sentenced in a country that has rule of law, that goes over evidence that

actually convicts people realistically. Whereas Russia just scoops people above the streets and uses them for hostages. So, that's exactly the way to

think about it.

I think for Vladimir Putin, this was personal. This is an FSB officer. Putin himself, former Intelligence officer, I think he understands and

wants to send a message -- in the future, and this is chilling, that tell other future FSB assassination teams, look, you may get caught, but if you

do hang in there because we'll get you out.

[14:15:00]

That's a really important thing for Vladimir Putin to say, and of course, for him personally as a former Intelligence officer, I think it was utmost

in his mind to get that guy back from Germany.

SOARES: Yes, an incentive really for Putin to keep this type of behavior really going. I wonder then, the timing of this, because politics, Steve,

as you all know, cannot be overstated here. I spoke to Mickey Bergman just two days ago, and he's one of the lead negotiators behind today's swap.

In fact, I spoke to him, I think it was on Tuesday. I want to play what he told me then. Have a listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICKEY BERGMAN, CEO, GLOBAL REACH: It's not that Putin wants to make Biden look good. But Putin now looks at the change in momentum and shift in

momentum, and he's not as certain as he was before that Donald Trump will become the President. Now, it is true that the window to bring Americans

home from Russia opens up with either one winning.

It's just a matter of the elections, but the argument that I make is that now that Biden is not one of the contenders, the window is open already

now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SOARES: What do you make of that? I mean, it speaks to the timing of this, and how the message may be viewed here critically.

HALL: Yes, I think that's dead-on, and I think to put a finer point on it, I don't think Vladimir Putin thought that if Donald Trump were the

President and were the one who is involved in these negotiations, that he could have pulled it off with all of the allies that he needed to.

I don't think that Vladimir Putin assessed, and I think this is a correct assessment that there would be the kind of personal trust and relationship

and shared values that President Biden has with, for example, you know, the German Chancellor and other world leaders.

And I think at this point, Putin said, look, I need to go with what I think is going to -- is going to work. I think he knows as much as he dislikes a

lot of Biden's policies and a lot of U.S. policies at this particular point. He knows that the Biden administration can effectively and

efficiently run an administration, and that's a really important part of these negotiations. I don't think he had that same level of confidence as

he looked forward to a possible Trump administration.

SOARES: And Steve, I think it's fair to say, from what I've noticed, we haven't heard much from the Kremlin in fact. Often, they like to be ahead

of this and put out the messaging -- in fact, we have very little. How do you think then this would play out? How do you think the Kremlin could

potentially spin this?

HALL: I think for their domestic audience inside --

SOARES: Yes --

HALL: Of Russia, I think the critical thing for Putin is that he, you know, despite what he says and despite these other relationships that he has, you

know, with his pariah friends, Vladimir Putin is very concerned about his personal appearance and his personal respectability as well as Russia being

respected.

I mean, if you listen to any major Russian speak -- speech, you know, the word respect for Russia always comes out. They have a huge chip on their

shoulder. And so, I think what's going to happen is Putin and the Kremlin are going to play this as, you know, look at how we can continue despite,

you know, the attempts of the West, to marginalize this, how we can still be in the news, how we can still, you know, cut big deals like this, how we

can still work internationally and conduct successful diplomacy. That's probably how it's going to play in Russia.

SOARES: But for -- for world leaders watching and for viewers around the world, this is not a softening of Putin's position. This is not -- you're

not seeing opening here for deals on Ukraine for -- reach an end to the war in Ukraine.

HALL: Yes, I think our National Security adviser sort of -- sort of dispelled that, and I -- that was my sense as well, which is that --

SOARES: Yes --

HALL: Those are completely different silos. There is one highly specialized, and it's been used many times in the past, you know, back into

the cold war when we had to do these types of exchanges, that's one set of -- set of things. The situation in Ukraine is much more complex. There's a

lot more on the table for Putin on that. And I would be surprised if there were a whole lot of connectivity or linkage between those two issues.

SOARES: Steve Hall, always wonderful to get your insight, really appreciate it, thank you very much. And we are --

HALL: Sure --

SOARES: Tracking this historic prisoner swap throughout this hour. Still to come tonight, our chief global affairs correspondent, Matthew Chance will

give us his perspective on the delicate discussions that led to this moment. That's after this short break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:22:00]

SOARES: Well, allies matter. Those words coming from U.S. President Joe Biden just in the last hours. He celebrates the power of alliances after

the biggest prisoner swap between the United States and Russia since the cold war. The Biden administration says "Wall Street Journal" reporting

Evan Gershkovich, U.S. Marine veteran Paul Whelan in the middle of your screen, and Russian-American journalist Alsu Kurmasheva are in the air and

en route to United States this hour from Turkey.

Turkey, which played a mediator role, says the swap involved 26 people from seven countries, including two children. Our chief global affairs

correspondent Matthew Chance joins me now. And Matthew, I know you're busy, you're working your sources, trying to get more information. Just speak

first to what's -- what happened behind the scenes and the complexity of this deal.

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CHIEF GLOBAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, this has been a very painful, drawn-out negotiation that has taken months, if not years.

It's been very delicate. It's involved multiple countries in order to strike the right sort of mix of people that would enable Vladimir Putin to

hand over these individuals who is carefully collected, and you know, kind of sentenced to, you know, long periods in prison.

With the expressed purpose, according to many Kremlin critics, to use them as bargaining chips in an instance like this. And so, you know, I think the

timing, I think the last guest was talking about this a bit. The political timing and the United States has played a part in this, neither the White

House nor the Kremlin wanted to see this fall apart in a new U.S. presidency. And so, that's why I think it all came together now and not in

six months from now.

SOARES: I mean, wasn't it just two weeks ago that we saw Evan Gershkovich sentenced to 16 years or so in prison? I mean, the timing of this is

interesting too. I mean, why now? Would Alexei Navalny would have been part? Would he have been part of this deal?

CHANCE: I mean, look, yes, he was. I mean, to answer --

SOARES: Oh, he was, OK --

CHANCE: That part of the question. Yes, I mean, that's what Navalny's team say, that, you know, originally, this broad prisoner swap, which has again

been negotiated for some months or some years, would have involved Alexei Navalny. It's the person -- he's the person that the Germans wanted in

return for swapping or handing out over Vadim Krasikov, this FSB colonel, who was, you know, carried out a contract killing in a Berlin park, and was

sentenced to murder for it.

But of course, you know, Vladimir Putin, according to his critics, ruthlessly took Alexei Navalny off the negotiating table. He died in prison

at the beginning of this year. And I think that set back the deal getting across the line as well. And so, it had to be sort of rehashed,

reconstituted, other people had to be brought into the -- into the mix, which sort of brought all sorts of complications as well.

[14:25:00]

But you know -- you know, the mix of people was found, there are, you know, 26 people in total, 16 on the one side, 8 on the other, and that finally

got this across the line.

SOARES: And I think we've got a graphic showing the Russians returning -- who were expecting maybe in the next hour or so to arrive, speak to those.

You mess -- you mentioned Vadim Krasikov, here we go. He is the one that was being held, having had a life sentence in a German prison. He was --

was he the lynchpin, the deal maker here for the Russians?

CHANCE: Yes, he is the only one really that the Russians have actually spoken of, sort of more or less directly. Putin has said that he wants him

back. He's called him a patriot, and you know, and he was the person that everybody has been trying to convince the Germans to let go.

I mean, they didn't want to let him go, because he was convicted of this brutal murder in Berlin. It's a -- you know, it's an ethical, moral issue

for them to release a convicted murderer in a country like Germany. But nevertheless, you know, a full window was found. And the other individuals

that have been sent back, and there are, you know, kind of eight Russians in total that have been sent back, include people who have been convicted

of espionage in Slovenia for example, recently.

People who are cybercriminals -- one individual, run a sort of bitcoin cryptocurrency exchange that dealt with drug dealers in the United States

and was -- and was serving a very long prison sentence there. So, they're not exactly heroes of Russia, and that may be one of the reasons, you know,

why -- you know, the Kremlin has been so tight-lipped about this exchange.

We've not really seen it played out in the way we have, for instance, in the West than in the U.S.

SOARES: Interesting to see, once they land, how then the Kremlin spins this, what they say, how the media and then reacts to this. Matthew,

appreciate it, thank you very much. I want to bring in a go-to U.S. State Department reporter Jennifer Hansler. She joins us from Washington with the

latest.

And Jennifer, for once, we have some good news to bring viewers and a wonderful news for the hostages and their families. Many of you, whom of

course, have been waiting for years. I know you have been working tirelessly behind the scenes, speaking to these families. In particular in

the case of Paul Whelan, well, just give us a sense of what you've been hearing from these families today.

JENNIFER HANSLER, CNN STATE DEPARTMENT REPORTER: Well, Isa, we haven't heard much from their families there, obviously, very overwhelmed. This is

a very important day for them, but we did see them at the White House earlier today alongside President Biden.

And, you know, the emotions in that room were palatable. We saw the family of Alsu Kurmasheva, her two daughters, one of whom is turning 13 tomorrow,

just overwhelmed by the idea that their families are coming back home. And of course, this brings an end to this absolute nightmare that has occurred

in Russia with these three Americans, Paul Whelan had been there for five and a half years, Evan and Alsu have been there for over a year, and they

are finally getting to come home.

And as you noted, I've spoken to Paul a number of times from his detention in that remote penal colony, out about 8 hours from Moscow. And there were

times where he felt very depressed about the prospects of coming home. He said that he wasn't sure that he would ever get out of there.

But in the recent months and weeks, he seemed very heartened about the efforts that were underway for his release. And so, we see this all coming

to play today. And Isa, I want to read you what we heard from David Whelan, his brother. This is basically the only statement we've heard from the

families thus far.

He said that this is now Paul's story to tell after all of this time. And I'm sure he will in time communicate how he wants to tell it. It is vital

that he be given urgency over his life again, something the Kremlin took away for so many years. So, we will see how these returned detainees come

to talk about what they went through.

I should note, Isa, they will be offered something called PISA, which is a program run by the U.S. government for people who are coming out of hostage

situations, coming out of these detentions to help them re-acclimate to their lives, and also learn how to tell --

SOARES: Yes --

HANSLER: Their own stories. So, we'll be watching and waiting to see --

SOARES: And we can -- yes, indeed, and looking forward to hearing, of course, from Paul Whelan as well as all the other hostages. And Jen, very

briefly, I mean, I was speaking to Mickey Bergman, you know him very well just two days ago, and he was telling me that when it comes to, you know,

any sort of negotiating with Russians, they like symmetry, he said.

Just so explain the deal and critically to what Matthew and I were talking about, the timing of this now.

HANSLER: Exactly, Isa, they are always looking for parity here, and because --

SOARES: Yes --

HANSLER: They accused both Paul and Evan of being spies, they wanted spies in return. And the U.S. government did not have any Russian spies in their

custody. So, this led to this very complicated, dramatic scouring of the globe, looking for partners who did have Russian spies in custody, who

might be able to have them traded to Russia.

And we saw the result of that today, seven countries were involved in the swap. They were giving people back who had been detained in Slovenia, in

Poland, in Norway, and of course the convicted Russian assassin, Vadim Krasikov, who was in Germany. This was kind of the linchpin for today's

deal. So, a lot of negotiations behind the scenes here, Isa.

SOARES: Momentous day indeed for these hostages as well and their families. Jen, appreciate it. Thank you very much.

And still to come tonight, we'll have much more analysis, of course, in the landmark prisoner swap between Russia and the U.S. We'll be back after this

very short break. You are watching CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:33:46]

SOARES: If you're just joining me, I'm bringing up to date the breaking news that we've been following here on CNN as Russia and the West complete

a landmark prisoner exchange, including a number of American citizens en route this hour to the United States, Wall Street Journal reporter Evan

Gershkovich and U.S. Marine veteran Paul Whelan are among the 26 people being released.

The swap comes after months of complicated negotiations between seven countries. President Biden called the deal a feat of diplomacy and a feat

of friendship. So, does it signal any sort of shift? In the relationship between Washington and Moscow? I want to bring in Alexander Baunov. He's a

senior fellow at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace.

And, Alexander, great to have you on the show. We can talk about U.S.- Russia relations in just a moment. But first, just talk to me about your reaction to this prisoner swap.

ALEXANDER BAUNOV, SENIOR FELLOW, CARNEGIE ENDOWMENT FOR INTERNATIONAL PEACE: Well, first of all, for everybody in the Russian civil society, it's

a big joy, despite the fact that many others are still remaining in jails. We are counting -- we are talking about the numbers of hundreds or even

1,000 political prisoners or even more. But these are people and everybody's happy that they are free.

[14:35:00]

SOARES: And of course, we've got several Russian political prisoners who have been released, including Kara-Murza. Just speak to this moment and

what this means for them.

BAUNOV: Well, first of all, the question is, is it exchange existing in itself or it's a step to something else? Like clear the way to the possible

peace negotiations or something alike? Well, to my opinion, it is not. In (INAUDIBLE) view, it's waging a war not against Ukraine, but against the

West on Ukrainian soil. And Putin has told many times in the past that any real Russian opposition is not an opposition. They are not politicians.

They are foreign agents. They are agents of the West.

So, in this logic, he's exchanging the western agents for Russian citizens, it happens for the first time since the Soviet period. He's changing them

for Russian citizens who are like a combatant, like prisoners of war in this conflict between Russia and the West in Ukraine.

This is the logic. It doesn't mean -- it does not -- in this logic, the exchange of prisoners of war is not necessarily a step towards a peace

negotiations.

SOARES: Yes. So, does this say then -- I mean, how much then is this a strategic win then, Alexander, for Putin?

BAUNOV: Say it again?

SOARES: How much is this, Alexander, a strategic win for Putin?

BAUNOV: Well, domestically it -- he gains something, because he always asserted that those guys who are against me in Russia are not the real

politicians, are not opposition. Oppositioners (ph) are now the very fact that they are taken by the West, rescued by the West in this distorted

logic confirms the fact that they belong somehow to the West. And this fact will be used, certainly by Russian propaganda.

SOARES: Yes.

BAUNOV: Second thing, it's a matter of prestige, because when this part of big swats of agents happen, in the Cold War time. And the Cold War time is

a peak -- is a pinnacle of Soviet Union might, bipolar world. So, anything that is similar to this time in the eyes of Russian regime is an element of

prestige. But, of course, it's -- the very fact that Russian regime is trying to gain something from this swap doesn't mean that we have leave the

people in the clutches of the Kremlin. It's very good that they have been arrested.

SOARES: And, Alexander, we are waiting to see the Russian and Russian criminals, I think it's fair to say, who are being sent back to Moscow

today. They should be arriving, who knows, in the next hour or so. Among them, the linchpin of this negotiation from what I had from our

correspondents is Vadim Krasikov. Talk to our viewers about who he is and what he means for Putin, more importantly here.

BAUNOV: Most probably he is an official agent. We don't know because -- we don't know what happens exactly in this -- inside Russian secret agencies,

but he's a killer, obviously, who has killed a Chechen fighter of the Second Chechen War. Putin fought in the early 2000.

And he was mentioned by Putin himself on many occasions, including Tucker Carlson interview, as an important guy, important person to be rescued, to

be saved from the West. It's clear why, because for him, it's important to demonstrate that those people who carry out the most dangerous orders by

the Kremlin can count on the regime's help.

And this is urging who --

SOARES: Yes.

BAUNOV: -- anybody who will carry out dangerous tasks.

SOARES: Yes. Alexander, I'm going to have to wrap up and just -- you were talking, it's important to mention what of -- to our viewers what we are

looking at. This video is of the Russians who are making their way to -- back to Moscow. Part of this deal of the -- including is -- of course, is

Vadim Krasikov, the former high ranking FSB colonel who was serving a life sentence in the German prison, including another one, Vadim Konoshchenok,

who facing conspiracy -- charges of conspiracy. So, quite a few of them making their way down the tarmac.

[14:40:00]

This was earlier going -- making their way as we understand now to Moscow. Alexander, appreciate it. Thank you very much.

And still to come tonight, an emotional day at the White House as families and officials reflect on the long road to get the historic prisoner swap.

We have the details just ahead for you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SOARES: Welcome back, everyone. If you're just joining us, we have been following breaking news for several hours. The largest prisoner exchange

between the U.S. and Russia since the Cold War. An incredibly moving and historic day for so many of the hostages as well as their families.

I'm joined now by our security correspondent -- national security correspondent, Alex Marquardt, who joins us now from Washington, D.C. And,

Alex, finally, like I've been saying, I was saying to Jennifer Hansler just a few minutes ago, we have some good news to bring viewers. And this is a

very complex negotiation. It's taken weeks, if not months. And we've heard in the last few minutes from the publisher of "The Wall Street Journal,"

for whom, of course, Evren Gershkovich works for. I just want to play this and we can talk after that. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ALMAR LATOUR, PUBLISHER, WALL STREET JOURNAL: Yes, it was an emotional moment. We've obviously spent a lot of time together, often at moments

throughout this 16-month ordeal that were a very intense. They've been ups and downs. And so, this morning, getting together for a breakfast in

Washington, as we had before at other moments there was a lot of humor, but also a heavy load of emotion in the room.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SOARES: And that emotion continued. We've seen the scenes in "The Wall Street Journal" newsroom applause. Let me just listen.

We're all celebrating. We're all so happy for everyone, including for Evan and his family. And it's crazy in many ways, Alex, to think that just a few

weeks ago, we saw him sentenced, right, in this sham trial for 16 years. So, just frame this moment for our viewers right around the world.

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's so historic because of the size and how complicated and widespread this deal

is today It's so dramatic because of how it actually unfolds with the planes all landing in Ankara Airport and then taking back off to their

respective countries.

[14:45:00]

And of course, it's so emotional as well. And I think our colleague, Oliver Darcy, our media reporter, reported that there was actually champagne being

popped in "The Wall Street Journal" newsroom for very, very understandable reasons. It's a very emotional day.

I have to give credit to Dow Jones and "The Wall Street Journal" for keeping Gershkovich's story front and center, for reminding us how long

he'd been in detention and how he was wrongfully detained and then wrongfully convicted.

I mean, last month, it was certainly a shock when Gershkovich was convicted to 16 years for what so many of us believe where these trumped-up know --

were these trumped-up espionage charges. We know that he was in Moscow just working as a journalist. But at the same time, we also knew that from that

moment there was really a possibility of him being released, that the Russians wouldn't actually go ahead with something like this until he was

convicted and sentenced.

And so, obviously, U.S. officials have been working at this for so long. And it was not going to be just a Russian-U.S. trade, because there were

other -- there were -- we knew that there was Vadim Krasikov, this FSB killer, assassin, being held by the Germans, sentenced to life in prison.

We knew that this was going to be a multi country deal involving prisoners from different places, but we didn't understand, I think in the lead up to

this how complex this was actually going to be.

In the end, 24 prisoners who were held in seven different countries all converged on Ankara today to be exchanged. So, this is just an

extraordinary feat of diplomacy. And that's why I think you saw this emotion unfolding at the White House today with Jake Sullivan, who

actually, he briefly cried, he cried at the podium because of the emotion of today and how long it has taken to get here.

SOARES: Yes, and so many of the people who work behind the scenes, who work in the shadows, who try and get this deal done, right. Indeed, a feat of

diplomacy, of friendship, and to what President Biden said, it speaks to the importance of alliances. Alex, appreciate it. Thank you very much.

And still to come tonight, I'll be speaking with Efraim Halevy. He's the former head of the Israeli Mossad. He'll weigh in on the recent attacks in

the Middle East, and what it means for the region. That is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:50:05]

SOARES: Well, we are learning new details about the assassination of Hamas' political leader, Ismail Haniyeh, in Tehran on Wednesday. A source tells

CNN, Haniyeh was killed by an explosive device that was covertly hidden in the guest house he used in Tehran. That source also says the bomb was there

for about two months and was detonated remotely.

This latest detail comes as thousands gathered in Tehran, as you can see, to mourn Haniyeh during a memorial service. Iran and its allies vow

retaliation against Israel for the death of Haniyeh, for which Israel has neither confirmed nor denied responsibility.

But Israel is claiming responsibility for the death of Hamas military chief, Mohammed Deif. The IDF released this video of a strike in Gaza that

killed Deif in mid-July along with at least 90 Palestinians.

And these just some really of the dizzying series of events in what's been a dramatic week in the Middle East starting last Saturday, let me remind

you, when a deadly rocket attack in the Israeli occupied Golan Heights killed at least 12 children. It was blamed on Hezbollah. Hezbollah

commander, Fuad Shukr, then was killed in Lebanon by Israel on Tuesday. On Wednesday, the explosion in Tehran, which I mentioned, which killed

Haniyeh. And today, Israel announced the death of Deif during last month's airstrike. Those three leaders, all key members of groups opposed to

Israel, as you can see there.

Joining me now is the former director of the Mossad, Efraim Halevy. Sir, welcome to the show. Let me really just get your reaction to what I've just

outlined there for our viewers. It's been a very fast paced week. The political leader of Hamas assassinated, the head of Hamas' military wing

also killed last month, a senior Hezbollah commander. Your take on what we have seen just in the last few days.

EFRAIM HALEVY, FORMER MOSSAD CHIEF: Well, you shouldn't connect the events in the north to those that happened in Tehran. Those are the -- as far as

what has happened in the north, a very, very senior commander was killed because he was responsible for a very, very dastardly attempt and -- which

succeeded, unfortunately, of lobbying an explosive into a football event in one of the villages in Israel's possession.

And over the 12 children were killed there, and it was a very, very, very grim event. And this became the reason for which Israel responded and

killed the man in Beirut. And he is a -- was a very senior figure in the Hezbollah movement of -- in Lebanon.

What happened in Tehran, I have no information of myself as to exactly what happened there. And I don't think it is useful to speculate on this, how

exactly the assassination took place and who was behind it and who benefited from it.

SOARES: Yes.

HALEVY: I don't think that Israel benefited from this, because, ultimately, Haniyeh was the key figure in Doha negotiating the ultimate release of

Israel's hostages. And to kill a person like that at this stage doesn't necessarily mean that this is an act that Israel carried out.

SOARES: Well, Israel hasn't commented on that. We know that Israel and Prime Minister Netanyahu, in particular, has called for the elimination of

Hamas, but many in the region are putting the fingers -- pointing the fingers directly at Israel.

So, let me ask you this. How then does this shift at all how Hamas -- does it shift how Hamas operates? Is it weakened? Is it facing existential

crisis? Are the efforts that being done by Netanyahu, are they working in your view?

HALEVY: The question is, of course, what is -- are Israel's interest at this particular moment? The number one priority for us is to secure the

release of the hostages, over 120 people who are being held in Gaza. And for that to happen, there has to be a decision taken by the leadership of

Hamas, which until yesterday, was, of course, including Haniyeh, who now will be the person who is going to replace him.

[14:55:16]

I don't know at the moment. We don't know at the moment. But it could well be that this act has delayed the process of getting a release of the

hostages. And that is a matter which is of paramount concern to Israel at the moment.

SOARES: Yes. And of course, the fear is that that just complicates those -- the release of the hostages and then to the ceasefire. And of course,

important to point out, the Iranians have warned of retaliation and they said the response for an assassination will indeed be special operations,

hardened and intended to instill deep regret in the perpetrator.

Unfortunately, we are running out of time, but I appreciate you taking the time to join us, sir. Thank you very much.

HALEVY: All the best.

SOARES: Thank you, sir. Thank you for watching tonight. Our breaking news coverage, of course, on the historic prisoner swap between those western

countries, as well as Russia continues after the break with my colleague, Jim Sciutto. Do stay right here. You're watching CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

END