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Isa Soares Tonight
Macron Says Europe Must Deter the Russian Threat; WH Holding Talks with Hamas on Hostages; Deeply Divided U.S. Congress; Car Tariffs on Canada and Mexico Delayed One Month; Supreme Court Rejects Trump's Foreign Aid Freeze. Emmanuel Macron Addresses Nation on Security Threats Europe Faces from Russia; Macron Invites European Army Chiefs to Paris Next Week; CIA Director: U.S. has Paused Intelligence Support to Ukraine. Aired 2-3p ET
Aired March 05, 2025 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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ISA SOARES, HOST, ISA SOARES TONIGHT: Hello, and a very warm welcome, I'm Isa Soares. Tonight, we begin in Paris, where any moment now, French
President Emmanuel Macron will address the nation. Mr. Macron is expected to speak on what could be a brewing trade war with the U.S. and the Trump
administration's upending, of course, of U.S. foreign policy.
This week, European countries scrambling to boost defense spending and maintain support for Ukraine. President Macron has formed an alliance with
British Prime Minister Keir Starmer, as they both take on the challenge of mending ties between Washington and Kyiv. And President Macron's address
comes, of course, at a critical time for Ukraine.
The U.S. has now paused both Intelligence support as well as weapon shipments to the war-torn country amid the fallout, of course, as we can't
forget from last Friday's intense Oval Office meeting between the two leaders. CIA Director John Ratcliffe suggested this morning that the pause
may be short-lived. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHN RATCLIFFE, DIRECTOR, CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE AGENCY: President Trump said as he asked for a pause. In this case, as everyone saw play out,
President Trump had a real question about whether President Zelenskyy was committed to the peace process, and he said, let's pause, I want to give
you a chance to think about that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Well, all of this comes ahead of Thursday's emergency summit, where European leaders will continue discussions on Ukraine and European
security. Our CNN's international diplomatic editor Nic Robertson is in Brussels for us this hour, where that summit will be held. Just hold on
there, President Macron is speaking. Let's listen in.
EMMANUEL MACRON, PRESIDENT, FRANCE (through translator): Security, which is threatened. If one country can with impunity invade another, nobody can
be sure of anything. And it would be a question of might is right. And so, peace could not be guaranteed on our old continent.
And over and above Ukraine, the Russian threat is there and affects Europe and affects us. This has a global impact and it's mobilized on our
continent. And we have to remember that North Korea and Iran are involved here, too. Putin's Russia is coming up to our frontiers to murder his
opponents. The problems have happened in Moldova and Russia is trying to manipulate opinions with social network interference, and it is testing our
limits on all fronts.
This aggressivity doesn't seem to know any boundaries, and at the same time it continues to re-equip, to re-arm. And it is now giving 40 percent of its
GDP to defense. And it foresees having 300,000 men, more loads of tanks and so on and so forth. Who in that context can believe that Russia today will
actually be obedient?
Russia has become a threat for France and for Europe. I regret that very deeply. And I am absolutely convinced that in the long term, peace will
come to our continent with a peaceful Russia. But the situation is, as I describe it, and we have to face it. So, it would be very dangerous and a
folly simply to be a bystander.
Time has come to take decision for the Ukraine, for the security of France, and for security of Europe. For Europe first of all, all the initiatives
which have been taken have been in the right direction, and I salute them. We have to continue to support the Ukrainians in their combat until peace
can be achieved with the Russians.
And the path towards peace cannot bypass Ukraine. Peace cannot be achieved at any price, and it cannot be a question of capitulating. So, on the
contrary, it has to be translated through a ceasefire, and a ceasefire which cannot be fragile because we have experience of that in the past.
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Russia started in 2014, invading Ukraine, and we established a ceasefire, and Russia did not respect that. We have not been capable of maintaining
the equilibrium because we haven't had security guarantees. Today, we cannot believe Russia's word. Ukraine is fighting for its freedom and
security itself, and it's in our interest to defend that as well for Europe.
And that is why, in concert with our British allies and with the Germans, we have met in Paris and in London to consolidate the commitments which are
necessary for Ukraine. Ukraine must not be invaded again by Russia, and we have to prepare for that. And obviously, we have to support the Ukrainian
army in that respect.
And it may well be that we can do that through the deployment of European forces, but we're not going to start fighting now on the frontline, but we
have to make sure that there is backup to guarantee security. The next week, the leaders of Europe are going to assemble in Paris with commanders
in order to have a durable, lasting, solid, verifiable peace.
And this is why I went to defend a fortnight ago in the States, Europe's interests. And I think that it will be the case that U.S. will be by our
side. But that has not been the case so far. The European states or states of Europe must be capable of defending themselves better and to dissuade,
to deter the Russian threat.
We have to make sure that we re-equip better, and to increase our security and to deter. It is for that reason that we remain absolutely involved with
NATO and our other allies. But we have to also reinforce our independence in terms of security and defense. The future of Europe must not be
determined either in Washington or Moscow.
Yes, the threat is coming from the east, and since the fall of the Berlin wall, we still have threat. At the extraordinary summit of the EU, bringing
together 227 European member-states in Brussels. Tomorrow, we will set out decisive steps, steps which France has been putting forward, by the way,
for some years now.
The funding, massive funding will be determined for buying and implementing on European soil. Our arms, tanks, equipment and cutting edge weaponry.
This is the moment when we have to mobilize to make sure that our armed forces are upgraded as quickly as possible, and that we have a re-
industrialization of the defense sector in all our regions.
And I shall be seeing all the people involved in that in France in the coming days. The defense of France is very much a reality now. European
states are now determined much more to defend themselves and to produce the kind of machinery on their own soil which are necessary for their defense.
And this is a good thing.
Germany, Poland, Denmark, the Baltic States, and a number of our partners have announced that they are increasing their defense expenditure across
the board. And -- but France has a particular status here. We have one of the most efficient armed forces in Europe. And after World War II, we have
armed ourselves with a nuclear deterrent.
And that's much more than many of our neighbors. Moreover, we didn't -- we didn't wait for the invasion of Ukraine to do that. And according to the
two laws which I have decided on defense, we have doubled the defense expenditure over the last ten years. This acceleration, which I have just
described, will have to be underpinned by new budgetary adjustments, which are absolutely indispensable.
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I have asked the government to work on this as soon as possible. These new investments require private investments, but also public investments
without tax being increased. But for that, we need reforms, we need choices made and courage. Our nuclear deterrence protects us, protects French
sovereignty right across the board.
And this has always played a part in the security and peace of Europe. But responding to the historic appeal of the German chancellor, I decided that
we have to increase our protection amongst our allies in Europe. Whatever happens, the choice will always be in the hands of the President of the
republic and the commander-in-chief.
We have to work on the military dimension, but also economically, technologically, industrially and financially. We will have to take
measures, and we have to also be prepared for the U.S. to decide about the tariffs, which they might be imposing on Europe as they have on Canada and
Mexico.
This decision is incomprehensible as much for the American economy as for ours. And that particularly will have consequences on our branches. So,
this will not go without answering on our part. And together with our European colleagues, we will continue, as I did fortnight ago, to try and
convince them that this decision is going to harm everyone.
And I hope very much that I will be able to convince the President of the U.S. of that. This moment requires unprecedented decisions, and that
unprecedented over the last ten years on agriculture, all public policies, we can't have the same kind of discussions as we've had in the past. So,
that is why I've asked the Prime Minister of the government and all the economic, social and union forces to put forward proposals about this new
context.
The solutions of tomorrow cannot be the attitudes of yesterday. Dear compatriots, confronted by this irreversible new situation, we must not
give in to any kind of excess about going to war or defeatism. France will overcome this by a determination for peace and security, faithful to its
history. Yes, that is what we believe in terms of our security, but also in terms of defending our democracy and a certain idea of truth, an idea of
looking for respect in our society and the freedom of speech, which is not a return to the speech of hatred, but that of humanism.
Our Europe has the economic force, the power and the talent to overcome these problems of our new age. And we also have the means, and we have to
engage them by being unified as Europeans and determined, determined of our objective. And that's why we need you and your commitment. Budgets and
military expenditure and so on, this is one thing, but it will never replace the force of determination.
Our generation is not about precedents. It's about us, and we will be reaping the dividends of our commitments tomorrow. So, union is strength
together. Long live the republic. Long live France.
SOARES: You have been listening there -- very good evening to you, listening there to President Macron delivering a prime time speech as you
could see there in Elysee Palace addressing tariffs at the end, as you heard there, but principally addressing Ukraine and French security and
European security, being very clear on the French position and what relates to Putin and to Russia and the Russian threat.
Very different language, of course, from we've heard -- that we've heard from President Trump. He said, we need to recognize the Russian threat. We
need to deter the Russian threat, not only talking about French security, but European security and the global impact this could have.
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He said Putin's Russia is coming to our frontiers, they're manipulating, he said, opinions, testing all our limits on all fronts. And aggression, he
said it doesn't know any boundaries. He talked about how Russia is spending something like 40 percent of their GDP on defense. They have more men to
bring to the frontlines.
Who can believe, he says, today that Russia will be obedient. So, that plays very differently to what we heard from President Trump that believes
that, that really Russia would stick to the terms of any sort of ceasefire agreement. He said that Russia has become a threat to France and to Europe.
It's dangerous and folly to be a bystander here.
We know from what he said, and we've seen before in those images between President Macron and Prime Minister Starmer that, they're going to keep
supporting Ukraine and the path towards peace cannot bypass Ukraine, and it cannot be a question, he said of capitulation. He then spoke about the
meeting that is expected to come tomorrow with European leaders on the question of defense.
He said that there will be -- they will set out decisive steps on what that would mean. He did address a message also to -- domestic message, very
clearly to the French people, talking about doubling defense expenditure, hoping, of course, that this won't impact taxes. There won't be -- taxes
will not be increased, and making sure very clearly that there has to be some sort of security guarantees.
He also said they will have more investments in defense, and he added, let me just get it quickly -- well, yes, army chief, European army chiefs will
hold a meeting in Paris next week. So, there's a lot for us to unpack, specifically on Ukraine, and we can talk about tariffs afterwards. Let me
go first to Kyiv with our Nick Paton Walsh who was listening there.
We'll go to Brussels in just a moment. But Nick, just give me a sense of what you heard, a very clear message from him to the French people. What
France's objectives are here.
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY EDITOR: Yes, I mean, sort of him and U.K.'s Keir Starmer alternating and trying to lead the
European dynamic here, clear echoing actually Canada's Justin Trudeau when he said that might cannot be right. Reminding people that North Korea and
Iran are involved in this war, that it is increasingly becoming global in its context.
Russia are getting North Korean troops and Iranian technology and even ballistic missiles, apparently, in recent weeks. So, an effort to try and
remind people of the gravity that they face, and also saying that Russian aggression does not seem to know any boundaries. And I think this is really
a bid to shore up French public opinion for the gravity of the threat that he sees potentially posed towards them.
He did hope, he said, that the United States would be on their side, but then began to suggest that at this particular moment, that's not entirely
in doubt. And Europe needs to defend itself better. So, we have the sequence of a meeting tomorrow in Brussels, which President Zelenskyy will
attend, right as his country is reeling from a pause in U.S. Intelligence sharing and U.S. defense aid as well.
That is clearly Europe showing again for the third time, frankly, in about ten days, its solidarity alongside of Ukraine. And then we have this as yet
unannounced meeting next week in Paris, another bid to shore together European military strategies. Now, speaking to one European official
earlier on today, before that speech, I was told that if there is a reassurance force inside of Ukraine in the event of a ceasefire, something
which the Americans have been pointing towards, that would predominantly be French, British and possibly Turkish troops being part of that, because
many eastern European countries don't want to reduce their force sizes along the border with Russia in the event of any further hostilities.
So, planning apparently there, talk of a limited ceasefire that he mentioned on Sunday in an interview with "Figaro", involving sea, air and
energy infrastructure. So, a lot beginning to take shape fast. How much of it we see publicly after tomorrow's meeting, we'll have to wait and see.
Isa.
SOARES: Yes, Nick, appreciate it, thank you very much. And I'm going to let you go. But let me go to Nic Robertson, who is with us from Brussels.
And Nic, it is a very clear message, very similar to what we heard from Keir Starmer, very much directed in terms of the clarity on where he stands
on Putin, how he sees the Russian threat. But this was a message, a domestic message too, Nic. What were your takeaways from what you heard?
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Absolutely, a domestic message and absolutely following on the heels and style and substance of
what Keir Starmer said on Saturday, which was an appeal to the country to say, as Keir Starmer said then, that our skies are under attack from
Russia, our seas are under attack from Russia, our cyber space is under attack from Russia, even people killed on British soil or attempted killing
of the former spy Sergei Skripal and his daughter by the Novichok nerve agent by -- perpetrated by Russian agents in 2017 in Salisbury.
[14:20:00]
Keir Starmer laid out that very strong rationale for why the country needs to grasp the issue that Russia is a threat, and that's exactly what we've
heard Emmanuel Macron do. You know, there isn't a leader it appears within the sort of structures of the European Union that can take on the mantle of
the leadership of the sort of moral cause of being the big voice galvanizing the sort of entire 27 nations of the European Union.
But what has emerged over the past couple of weeks is the British Prime Minister Keir Starmer, is the French President Emmanuel Macron, and they're
both stepping through this process together. Macron this evening, as you say, explaining to the French people why these coming changes are
necessary. Now, just spring forward to tomorrow, it's all about money.
It's about coming up with perhaps about $860 billion worth of funding to allow the European nations to better fund their defense, better organize
their defense, better produce war machinery, if you will, in the context of what Macron was actually saying. You've discussed a lot of it, but there
was one point that really jumped out to me, and this was the notion that it was raised twice by Emmanuel Macron.
He spoke about France's nuclear deterrent. It's normally President Putin who's raising the sort of the nuclear issue and sort of rattling the
nuclear saber. Macron wasn't so much rattling the nuclear saber, but he was putting it on the table and saying, France has developed a long time ago,
of course, in conjunction with the United States and the U.K., a nuclear deterrent capability.
He said in the current context, Germany didn't -- coming out of the second World War, did not do that. France, he said, will now extend that sort of
cover and protection to Germany. Well, historically, Article 5 of NATO would have looked to the United States to provide that sort of security
protection and guarantee.
The fact that Macron sort of puts that on the table and states it in the context of providing it for Germany, certainly underscores the concern that
Macron, Starmer, other European leaders have about where the United States stands, not just in terms of Ukraine, because that's becoming very evident,
but in terms of standing up to its alliance obligations to protect the European Union, which, of course, is all about why the EU right now is
trying to figure out how to spend and how to prepare to fill that --
SOARES: Yes --
ROBERTSON: Hole.
SOARES: And we also heard him say, I want to believe the U.S. will remain at our side. And this is something, of course, that I've heard from Foreign
Ministers, Nic, here on my show. As we look ahead, very quickly, to that meeting, I mean, we've had meeting after meeting after meeting, he spoke
about proposals that we'll have some sort of clarity, decisive steps.
When are we going to get a sense of what those proposals are going to be? Is -- they're still insisting on the backstop, and will that then be
presented to President Trump? I know I'm going five steps ahead here, just trying to get a better sense of how quickly this can happen.
ROBERTSON: Look, speed is the absolute key here. President Trump can turn on a dime and decide a course of action literally in a split second. The
European Union doesn't make changes that fast. When President Trump comes into office, as he did a few weeks ago, the expectation was that he might
not take this precise tack on Ukraine.
He has -- Europe is trying to respond to it. So, while there have been multiple meetings, this is the way that the European Union and its allies
like Norway, like the U.K. work. They have to decide and agree amongst themselves how to fund the up-scaling of the -- of weaponizing, if you
will, for want of a different expression, the European Union, putting it in a place where it can defend itself, putting it in a place where it can
provide security guarantees and additional strength and support for Ukraine.
It just doesn't happen overnight. And that's a reality. So, tomorrow is about agreeing a plan of where the money should come from, 150 billion
euros worth of loans that would then be spent on defense, and the other monies would come from the loosening of constraints about how the 27-member
nations can spend their money and increase defense spending without scoring other penalties, if you will.
[14:25:00]
So in that context, tomorrow is about the money. The money. The commission will likely go away then and figure out the details of the money side
having been given the permission by the leaders when they come here. It's still maybe a month away before they'll be --
SOARES: Well --
ROBERTSON: Talking about the details of how they'll spend that. There are a lot of ideas, you know, just to hit a couple of points here. There are
about 7 or 8 nations in the EU of those 27 that are major defense armament manufacturers. There are a lot of smaller, medium and smaller companies
around Europe and those other nations that feed into that, that support those big companies.
So, how do you divvy all that up? Who does what? What do you produce? All of that takes time to discuss. As I say, for President Trump, he can make
decisions in seconds. What we're witnessing here is the European Union trying to act quickly, having this emergency meeting tomorrow, it's speed,
but it's not built for speed here.
SOARES: No, not built for speed. But perhaps, you know, President Trump's position forcing their hand a bit. Nic, I know we'll talk tomorrow, no
doubt, appreciate it. Nic Robertson there for us in Brussels. Well, my next guest says -- "to put it bluntly, for Trump, Ukraine is nothing more than a
buffer state between the spheres of influence of two great powers, the United States and Russia. Notwithstanding the latter's dismal economy and
conventional military."
Rym Momtaz is the editor-in-chief of Carnegie Europe's blog "Strategic Europe". She specializes in Trans-Atlantic relations and joins me live from
Paris, a well-known face here on the show. Rym, great to see you. I am sure you heard the address, French President address the nation, saying that
Europe is entering a new era. What were you -- what stood out to you from what you heard from him?
RYM MOMTAZ, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, CARNEGIE EUROPE'S BLOG, STRATEGIC EUROPE: Good to be with you, Isa. I was really struck by the tone the French
President Emmanuel Macron struck about the United States. For me, this is a very different tone than what we've heard before. He is basically saying
that he is now basing his planning on a real possibility that the United States is not going to back up a European reassurance force or security
guarantees in Ukraine.
That's huge for him to be saying it almost as explicitly as I said. And he is recognizing and explicitly explaining to his population and, you know,
expect to -- you know, basically, viewers who perhaps don't follow the news as much as you and I do, there, he's explaining to them that the world they
grew up in, they were born in since World War II, no longer exists.
In the sense that the alliance with the U.S. is changing in nature. Of course, it's not dead. I think it's way too early to say that it's dead,
but it is changing in nature, and that the United States will perhaps be less involved in helping the Europeans secure their borders and their
countries. And that, that means that the French population has to make new sacrifices --
SOARES: Yes --
MOMTAZ: In order to enable that ramping up of defense.
SOARES: And we'll talk about that sacrifices. But he said on that point, Rym, the United States, our ally, has changed its position on this war, is
less supportive of Ukraine and is casting doubt on what will happen next. And he said, you know, to remain a spectator to Russia's threat would be
folly, he said. So, it was very much making the position very clear on where France and what he sees as a threat to French security, but also
European security.
Framing Putin really as a huge threat. We need to recognize the threat. We need to deter Russia. Would this message, Rym, resonate with the French
people, given, of course, the Trans-Atlantic alliance and how it's a bit on shaky ground at the moment?
MOMTAZ: Well, yes, first of all, you're right to point out that specific quote because it's an explicit recognition that the U.S. and the Europeans
no longer share the same risk assessment when it comes to the threat posed by Russia. Clearly, Russia is an existential national security threat for
the Europeans, and the United States doesn't see it that way.
Second, will it resonate? It's very interesting polling lately has shown that at least in France, people are quite aware of the threat that Russia
poses against them, but also against the European Union. And that's a very important development. It's on very solid ground. It's quite a majority of
French people who perceive Russia as a real threat to their security.
SOARES: Yes --
MOMTAZ: Where there's a bit of a gap is when you ask people in polling, well, where do you get the money to fund the ramping up in defense? That's
where -- that's where the trouble is, and that's also part of the reason why Macron gave the speech today. He's preparing basically his population -
-
SOARES: Yes --
MOMTAZ: To the choices of, for example, a higher retirement age, et cetera.
SOARES: Yes. And of course, talking about defense, increased defense spending, may perhaps -- hoping taxes are not increased, but you know, we
have been here before, clearly laying the ground for what is to come. We really appreciate you staying with us for the last 30 minutes or so
listening in to President Macron. Great to see you, Rym. Take care.
MOMTAZ: Thank you.
SOARES: And still to come tonight, Tuesday's presidential address to Congress was anything but typical. How the verbal clashes between Democrats
and Republicans on the House floor reflect a deepening political divide. That's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SOARES: And this just coming in to CNN. The White House says it is holding direct talks with Hamas about hostages held in Gaza. The White House press
secretary says Israel was consulted and that the talks are ongoing. This is, of course, a big departure for the U.S., which has long considered
Hamas a terrorist group. Well, we'll stay across that story for you.
In the meantime, the United Kingdom, France and Germany have all been urging Israel to allow aid into Gaza. Israel said on Sunday it would halt
relief until Hamas agrees to an extension of cease -- of phase one, pardon me, of the ceasefire. This after Israel missed the deadline to start
negotiations for phase two.
In a joint statement, the three European powers warned that using aid as a political tool will be catastrophic for the besieged enclave. They also
demanded a sustained ceasefire and called on Hamas to immediately release all hostages.
Let's go back to the United States because U.S. President Trump touched on topics from tariffs to tax cuts to Ukraine in his address to Congress on
Tuesday, a speech that also showcased the very deep political divide in America, the split screen emblematic of the widening gap between the two
parties as well as their supporters.
Democrats heckled the president at times. Some, as you can see there, held signs or wore t-shirts emblazoned the word resist on them. While others
simply walked out on the speech. Congressman Al Green shouted at Mr. Trump, as you can see there, and was escorted out of the chamber. Then, president,
in turn, fired back at the Democrats.
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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: This is my fifth such speech to Congress, and once again, I look at the Democrats in front of me and I realize there
is absolutely nothing I can say to make them happy or to make them stand or smile or applaud. Nothing I can do. I could find a cure to the most
devastating disease, a disease that would wipe out entire nations or announce the answers to the greatest economy in history or the stoppage of
crime to the lowest levels ever recorded, and these people sitting right here will not clap, will not stand and certainly will not cheer for these
astronomical achievements. They won't do it, no matter what.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Naturally, those on the other side of the aisle had a very different reaction to the president's address.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CROWD: USA. USA. USA.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: What a split screen that is. For a closer look at the political divide in the U.S., we're joined by CNN Politics Senior Reporter Stephen
Collinson. And just that last image, Stephen, really spoke volumes. So, I mean, from what I've heard from that speech, it did sound a bit more like a
victory lap, a campaign speech than anything else.
Putting aside the falsehoods that we've heard, just what stood out for you in terms of foreign or future policy, as you say, in terms of vision for
America here? Was there any clarity on that front?
STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN POLITICS SENIOR REPORTER: Not really, I think it accurately portrayed a country in the chamber there that doesn't -- that is
split into two and doesn't have any common political language or frame of reference or even agreement on facts, and I think that is part of the Trump
effect that we've seen unfolding over the last eight years.
Millions of Americans believe, the ones that voted for Trump, that is about to lead the country into a new golden age, just as many believe that he's
set on destroying pretty much everything that's made America great, and he's made great progress towards that goal over the last six months.
The president was talking there, he seemed to be complaining, as he often does. He adopts a bit of a victim posture. Let's face it, this was a guy
that tried to stay in power after an election that he lost and to destroy democracy. So, it's not perhaps surprising Democrats are angry.
But at the same time, what you saw there just expresses the party's absolute impotence. Sitting there with slogans written on paddles, is that
really the best they can do? So, I think that theater last night was a very accurate description of the current political situation in the United
States.
SOARES: Very concerning, indeed. Stephen, appreciate it. Thank you very much.
COLLINSON: Thanks.
SOARES: Well, let's get more on this. Democratic Congressman Ami Barra has been an outspoken Trump critic. He called last week's chaotic over office
meeting with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy, quote, "shameful display that saw the president and vice president refuse to side with
freedom and democracy over a brutal dictator. It's not reflective of what this nation stands for." And Congressman Ami Bera joins us now.
Congressman, really appreciate you taking the time from your busy schedule to speak to us. Before we talk about President Trump's address to Congress,
what you -- what was said and what wasn't said, can I just get your reaction, first of all, to what we've heard in the last, what, 38 minutes
or so from President Macron. Do we have the Congressman? Because I can't see him.
REP. AMI BERA (D-CA), MEMBER, U.S. HOUSE FOREIGN AFFAIRS COMMITTEE: Yes, I can. I'm sorry, Isa, can you see me?
SOARES: Oh, fantastic. Fantastic.
BERA: OK.
SOARES: Let me get your take of what we heard from President Macron. He said in the last few minutes, as he addressed the nation, a primetime
speech, Europe is entering a new era. The United States, our ally, has changed its position on this war. He then was very clear, Congressman,
saying, that Putin's Russia is coming to our frontiers. Who can believe today that Russia will be obedient? Just your -- a sense of what you take
from what we heard, the clarity there from President Macron.
BERA: Look, I heard that speech last night. I think President Trump is taking America in a different direction. What saddens me is my Republican
colleagues who, six months ago, would have said something totally different are just going along with that. And, you know, I feel like many of us are
not abandoning Europe. They're our close allies. We share values of democracy and freedom. But I also urge Europe to step up at this juncture
and do what they have to do to preserve the freedoms in Ukraine, preserve their own freedoms, and hopefully, we come to our senses and rejoin our
friends.
SOARES: Yes, and this is what we heard from Macron, we need to do more to defend Europe and also defend France. And we know there are meetings on
Thursday, there are further meetings next week here in Europe. But, you know, what we have seen from the United States just in the last, what, 48
hours, Congressman, is that, you know -- and this is important because, of course, you sit in the Affairs Committee.
[14:40:00]
So, give me a sense. We've had military aid pause to Ukraine. We've had -- intelligence also has been paused, intelligence sharing. Just your
reaction, how concerning this is, if this lasts much longer than we are seeing right now?
BERA: I mean, look, the United States led a post-World War II world order that was very prosperous for the world, that, you know, created relative
peace, stability, prosperity. Yes, the 21st century is different. The pandemic changed things. Russia's illegal invasion of Ukraine changed
things. But we shouldn't demand we shouldn't leave that context of what we've created. It is going to be different, but again, where Trump is
taking us is a very different direction.
As a Democrat, we need to stand up and tell the truth. This is what President Trump wants to do. We need to fight back. We need to not abandon
our values. You know, whether it's USAID providing food aid around the world, providing, you know, military aid to our allies, I just don't think
it makes America safer.
SOARES: Yes. Let's look. I can tell you when we saw -- speaking to -- on Ukraine, when we saw President Zelenskyy, it was last Friday during my
show, Congressman, when we saw that whole hoo-ha. It really, on this side of the pond, there were gasps, I can tell you that, and what unfolded
there. Accusations, Congressmen, of this being an ambush of a U.S. ally.
And so, I wonder then, you know, we've seen President Trump focusing, asking of concessions to Ukraine, but very little on -- from Putin. Why is
this administration apparently favoring Putin over Zelenskyy? How do you interpret this?
BERA: You know, that's a question for President Trump. That isn't where we historically have been as a United States. That isn't where my Republican
colleagues were six months ago when they were very hawkish saying Putin and illegal invasion, he's an aggressor here. He's a war criminal. All of a
sudden, they're not saying anything.
So, you know, when you see us being relatively silent in the chambers, I think it's shock at how quickly the Republican Party has changed. Again,
let's rise to who we are as Americans with our allies. Yes, it'll be a different contour. We do need Europe to step up and do more for European
security, but Putin's the aggressor. The Ukrainian people are the heroes.
SOARES: Let's turn then to Trump's address to Congress, as I was discussing with my colleague, he dug in on his divisive agenda again,
saying, I'm quoting, "We're just getting started." Just give us a sense, Congressman, what you made of what you heard. Anything from his speech that
you or your fellow Democrats would agree with?
BERA: I mean, very little. If we could create peace in Ukraine, if we could work with the Europeans, the Ukrainians, to create a context of
Ukrainian security, you know, and peace and stability, great. But he was gloating about gutting USAID, aid development, humanitarian assistance
around the world. That is what he is doing right now. And again, my values, I think most Christian values are we don't want to see people starving
around the world. We want to relieve suffering. We need to work together in context with our allies to do what we've done historically.
It could be different. If there's fraud and waste and abuse, great, let's go after that. But let's not retreat from the world.
SOARES: Can I ask you, you've mentioned USAID twice now in this interview. Can you give us a sense, Congressman, of what you are hearing from any
federal workers of how their life has been upended by the whiplash, the political whiplash in decision making from this administration?
BERA: I mean, the real disrespect. So, many of these folks are foreign service officers that work in refugee camps, in war zones, in conflict
zones. Many of them have served our country in uniform, in the military, and now they've gone on to serve our country, you know, around the world.
To have a 22-year-old sit there and say, justify your job. Give me five things that you did. That is shameful. That is disrespectful. That is not
how we treat one another. Again, I would hope my Republican colleagues find a voice, find our better nature, say, wait a minute, this isn't the United
States of America that we grew up in.
Yes, things may change in the 21st century, we may have to share some of the burden, but let's not retreat from the world.
SOARES: You know, the White House press secretary, and you're speaking of disrespect, thought the way the Democrats handled -- some of the Democrats
handled themselves wasn't very respectful yesterday. We saw -- as we were mentioning, we saw some Democrats holding up placards, reading liar or
false. We also saw others walking out. Senate Democratic Whip Dick Durbin told my colleague Manu Raju that there were better ways to do it -- to do
this. Adding, that basically he thinks that, you know, that Democrats should stick with the basics when responding to Trump.
[14:45:00]
So, just for our viewers right around the world, Congressman, it's been nearly, what, four months since the election, why can't Democrats get their
message together?
BERA: I mean, so, I don't agree with what some of my colleagues did yesterday Yes, we can sit there silently, but we've got to get out there,
tell the truth. We've got to make the case to the American public. We've got to appeal to the values. I still think there are values of compassion,
of caring, of wanting the world to be a better place. We've got to make the case directly to the American public, and hopefully, we can win some of our
Republican colleagues to say, yes, this isn't where they were six months ago.
They're a coward of Donald Trump right now. They've got to find their voice. They've got to stand up for our values as a country and a world.
SOARES: Congressman, really appreciate you speaking to us this evening. Congressman Ami Bera there. Thank you, sir.
BERA: Thank you, Isa. Be well.
SOARES: Thank you. Now, frustration with the Trump presidency is also being felt domestically. A record number of Americans applied for British
citizenship around the time of Mr. Trump's re-election in November. This is according to data from U.K.'s Home Office. It shows more than 6,100 U.S.
citizens applied for U.K. passport last year. The most since records began in fact in 2004. More than 1,700 of them applied in the last three months
of 2024, the most in any quarter in the past two decades. Read it as you wish.
And if you want to start a new life abroad, a tiny island in the Southwest Pacific Ocean is selling citizenship for 105 -- just over $100,000. Nauru
lacks the resources to protect itself from climate disaster, with the island's future threatened by rising sea levels, storm surges, and coastal
erosion. Its government says the Golden Passport Initiative will raise the funds to move 90 percent of its 12,000 -- 12,500 residents to higher
ground.
We're going to take a short break, a very busy hour. We'll be back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SOARES: While the White House says, after discussions with America's big three automakers, it will make a one-month exemption on tariffs on any
autos from Mexico and Canada. And it comes as we are learning more about a phone call between those two men, Donald -- President Donald Trump and
Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau.
[14:50:00]
Mr. Trudeau's office says the two discussed the trade war for about 50 minutes and called the conversation constructive. But in a post on social
media, the U.S. president says he isn't convinced enough is being done to stop the flow of fentanyl. And to be clear, U.S. government data shows
Canada is not a major source of fentanyl coming into the United States.
Mr. Trump, though, went on to say the call ended in a somewhat friendlier manner. U.S. Vice President J. D. Vance and U.S. Commerce Secretary Howard
Lutnick were also said to be on the call.
Well, the U.S. Supreme Court has declined to intervene on President Donald Trump's behalf. The high court narrowly rejected Mr. Trump's request to
keep billions of dollars in foreign aid frozen. In a five to four ruling, the justices did not say when the money must be released. Instead, the case
will continue to be litigated in the lower courts. CNN's Chief Legal Affairs Correspondent Paula Reid has the latest for you from Washington.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: This is a technical decision. It does not answer the larger constitutional questions about
Trump's efforts to reshape the government. But this 5-4 split tells us a lot about the sharp partisan divides inside the court. Now, here, the case
was about billions of dollars in foreign aid that had been approved by Congress. Then the Trump administration came in and froze that aid. Groups
that rely on that funding to do their work sued, saying that the Trump administration had usurped the power of Congress.
Now, a lower court judge said that these funds have to continue to be dispersed, and the Trump administration went all the way to the high court
to try to get a pause on that, to keep those funds frozen. But here the court declined to intervene on behalf of the Trump administration, and this
is the second time that the Trump administration has asked for relief from the high court in response to the dozens of challenges it has faced over
Trump's executive action and his efforts to reshape and reform the federal government.
But look, this was a 5-4 decision, and it was notable that four conservative justices took the time to write an opinion criticizing the
majority and expressing outrage that now a district court judge will be able to potentially compel the administration to disperse these funds.
Now, the Supreme Court did not say when this money needs to be sent out. They're leaving that, again, to the lower court. But eventually, the larger
question here, the constitutional controversy about whether the executive, whether the White House can make some of the moves that they've made in
this case, or in others with DOGE and efforts to fire federal employees, those questions will eventually make it to the Supreme Court through one of
these cases.
And look, the fact that four conservative justices took such a hard line on this technical issue, that does suggest that the Trump administration may
ultimately prevail when it comes down to the question of whether Trump actually has the power to do what he has done over the past six weeks. Back
to you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SOARES: Thank you very much to Paula Reid there. Still to come, Coldplay sings about ruling the world.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(MUSIC PLAYING)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: But they could soon sing about ruling the World Cup. Details on their big contribution to next year's tournament coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:55:00]
SOARES: Well, the World Cup is turning to the Super Bowl for inspiration. The president of FIFA says for the first time ever, there will be a
halftime show during the 2026 World Cup final. He adds the band Coldplay will help decide which musical acts should perform. Coldplay performed at
the Super Bowl, if you remember, back in 2016. The U.S., Canada, Mexico are co-hosting next year's tournament.
Now, three piglets left to starve in a controversial art exhibition have been stolen. Artist Marco Verratti enraged animal rights activists by
leaving these three piglets to die as part of installation on farming practices in Denmark. The display called "And Now, You Care" uses shopping
carts to hold the three pigs. One animal welfare organization says it agrees with the principle of the exhibit to raise awareness of poor rearing
conditions, but it disagrees with our how Verratti is conveying that message.
That does it for us for tonight. Do stay right here. Newsroom with Max Foster is next. I shall see you tomorrow. Bye-bye.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:00:00]
END
