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Isa Soares Tonight
Russia-Ukraine Ceasefire Talks Yield Only Prisoner Swap; U.S. And Iran Disagree On Possible Nuclear Deal; Israel Unleashes Heavy Strikes In Gaza Killing Hundreds; Trump: U.S. Sent Iran Formal Nuclear Deal Proposal; Cassie Ventura Wrapping Up Testimony In Combs Case; Children's Book Smile Focuses On Climate Change Worry; Millions Of Fans Anticipate Eurovision Final. Aired 2-3p ET
Aired May 16, 2025 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[14:00:00]
ISA SOARES, HOST, ISA SOARES TONIGHT: A very warm welcome to the show, everyone, I'm Isa Soares. Tonight, talks, but no breakthrough. Ukrainian
and Russia teams sit down for the first direct talks in years. But both leaders are no shows. Then Donald Trump says his team has sent Iran a draft
nuclear deal.
But Iran says it didn't get the message. We'll explain. And Israel unleashes heavy strikes on northern Gaza, as the Health Ministry there says
250 people have died there in the past 36 hours. We begin this hour, though, in Istanbul. Teams from Russia and Ukraine agreeing to hold direct
talks in the same room, even though their respective presidents skipped this meeting.
Turkey's Foreign Minister sees this moment as a, quote, "important day for world peace". Russia and Ukraine have now agreed to a large scale prisoner
swap, with more talks on the horizon. Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy weighed in, saying this earlier.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, PRESIDENT, UKRAINE: All of you know that this week we had a real chance to take important steps toward ending this war. If only
Putin had not been afraid to come to Turkey.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: We are also tracking a significant phone call. The one, that picture we're showing you right there between Mr. Zelenskyy, other European
leaders and President Donald Trump. This after the U.S. President claimed there will be no movement until he meets with his Russian counterpart,
Vladimir Putin. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I think it's time for us to just do it. I said -- you know, they all said Putin was going and Zelenskyy
was going, and I said, if I don't go, I guarantee Putin's not going. And he didn't go. And I understand that. But we're going to get it, we're going to
get it done. So --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When do you think you'll meet the President?
TRUMP: As soon as we can set it up. I was going to -- I would actually leave here and go. I do want to see my beautiful grandson.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Let's get more on all of this. CNN's chief international security correspondent Nick Paton Walsh is live in Kyiv. But first, let me go to
Clare Sebastian, who joins us from Istanbul this hour. So, Clare, no peace deal and no timeline, it seems, for anything. Just lay out for us very
clearly here, what exactly came out of this meeting and what Ukraine can reasonably expect now.
CLARE SEBASTIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Isa, I think what we got today was a very stark reminder of just how intractable the differences are between
these two sides. And frankly, it was to be expected. Expectations were pretty low going into this meeting because of the level of delegation, the
very low level delegation that Russia had sent, despite the urging throughout the week from President Zelenskyy and Trump for Putin himself to
turn up, it's not clear if he ever had any intention of going.
But certainly, that was not how things panned out today. So, look, Ukraine has come out of this, saying this was a tentative success. They got a
prisoner swap with a very large number of prisoners, a 1,000 on each side, they still need to iron out the details of that, but that is the one
concrete deliverable that was agreed.
And officials who came out and spoke in a sort of hastily-arranged briefing that we turned up to at an Istanbul hotel, said that it was worth it just
for that. This is ultimately, they say, about the people, but they also agreed on sort of two discussion points going forward. One, to talk about
the meeting of the two leaders, Zelenskyy and Putin, and one to talk about the contours of a future ceasefire.
And I think that is where reality really sets in here, because, of course, Ukraine had wanted a ceasefire in place before coming to the table with
Russia. In fact, we got this whole proposal from Russia to hold these talks last weekend when it was faced with an ultimatum from Ukraine and its
allies to sign on to a ceasefire or face major sanctions.
It has -- still continuing to sidestep sanctions and signing on to a ceasefire. And in fact, we heard from a Turkish official that Russia stated
a condition for a ceasefire, which was that Ukraine withdraw from all of the four -- all of the territory of the four regions that Russia has
attempted to illegally annex, even though Russia doesn't actually occupy all of that territory.
That is a red line, by the way, not only for Kyiv, but also for the U.S., so I think that really shows that Russia's maximalist demands are still on
the table. And I think Ukraine is trying to paint this as a tentative success, so that it doesn't look like Russia is essentially calling the
shots and playing for time.
[14:05:00]
And they can continue to keep this process moving. But we don't see anything coming out of the meeting today that really moves the needle
towards peace, Isa.
SOARES: Yes, and in that case, look, we heard from the British Prime Minister, Keir Starmer a few hours ago speaking on next, Clare, he said
"people in Ukraine and across the world have paid the price for Putin's aggression. Now he must pay the price for avoiding peace. I will not accept
Russia kicking a ceasefire down the road."
I mean, where then does this -- these are very stark, very stark language coming from Keir Starmer. There clearly is a sense of frustration from the
Europeans because they want maximum pressure. This even before Putin decided not to show up. Where then does this leave the Europeans? And can -
- do they have to wait from President Trump to have this meeting, goodness knows when with President Putin?
SEBASTIAN: Well, look, we may get more European and U.K. sanctions, Isa, we know that --
SOARES: Yes --
SEBASTIAN: A 17th package of European sanctions is in the works. But I think, look, the ultimatum that was laid out for Putin last weekend has
been well and truly neutered by President Trump, who, you know, who then came out and urged Zelenskyy to sort of have the meeting now to quote on
his Truth Social post, and has proceeded to say that nothing really will happen until he sits down with Putin, which is, of course, exactly what the
Russian side wants.
So, I think really what we look for now is what the U.S. does next. Marco Rubio, the Secretary of State was here in Istanbul, but he left, expressing
his disappointment about how this went down. He said we had hoped for a contact between Russia and Ukraine, but that really isn't what happened
because the delegation was not on the level that they were hoping for.
Will the U.S. come through on it and follow through on the threats that we've heard to ramp up sanctions? Will it decide to walk away from the
process? We don't see any sign of that as of yet. What they're dangling right now is the prospect of a meeting between Presidents Putin and Trump
as the only way forward in this conflict, and that is very much more a carrot than a stick to Russia.
SOARES: Indeed. Let me go to Nick, who is in Kyiv for us. And Nick, you know, as you and I have been discussing pretty much all week, President
Zelenskyy was there. He was ready to talk peace. Putin clearly no show. Where then does this leave Ukraine? Just speak to -- I mean, do they come
away thinking that they gained anything from this?
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL SECURITY EDITOR: I suppose they managed to continue, hopefully the feeling within the White House, probably their
most important audience of all on this, given how dependent Ukraine is on U.S. military aid and intelligence sharing, that they are doing all they
can to try and promote peace.
And indeed, Zelenskyy's comments today were to suggest he's ready for anything that brings peace as fast as possible, including again, his team,
saying that they are working on the possibility of the next step in this, being Zelenskyy meeting Putin, an offer that Zelenskyy, he already made for
a meeting to occur on Thursday when he specifically flew to Turkey, to Ankara, initially to meet with Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan in
the hope that, that would potentially spur both U.S. President Donald Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin to come to Russia -- sorry to Turkey.
So, a lot of effort being made by Kyiv here to show that they will take whatever steps are required of them to move this peace process forward. The
issue we face, I think is fair to say this week is that, we've learned that the Kremlin are pretty much impenetrable when it comes to European
pressure, and possibly even the threat of increased U.S. pressure as well.
Remember back on Saturday, the demand of a 30-day unconditional ceasefire, that was something which the Europeans announced along with Ukraine, saying
they had American backing, picturing themselves on the phone with U.S. President Donald Trump. Now, we've had a whole week of essentially the
Kremlin sticking to their guns on Sunday, proposing these first very junior level direct talks in Istanbul.
That's what the Kremlin stuck to. That's eventually what happened. And while Trump in the gap proposed himself as an intermediary, perhaps a
facilitator between Zelenskyy and Putin, Putin rejected that. We don't know what happened behind the scenes, perhaps there were specific negotiations
about how this might or might not come down.
But we're left now at the end of this extraordinary week of diplomacy, really having to ask quite what pain United States are willing to inflict
on Russia at all. We've heard from President Trump repeatedly saying, well, I didn't really expect Putin to go if I didn't go. He's since said that he
doesn't expect anything to happen until he has a bilateral meeting with Putin, and indeed said he'd go immediately from where he was to meet Putin,
if indeed it was possible.
For those in the Kremlin, they'll see that potentially as Trump being at their beck and call. And so, we've seen a week play out here in which
Russia has fundamentally resisted diplomatic pressure upon it to agree to a ceasefire, to agree to a three presidential summit with Zelenskyy and
Putin. And now, at the end of this, has agreed to a prisoner swap.
They've been happening quite regularly, is agreeing to continue talking about Zelenskyy and Putin meeting, where they already rejected that
initially.
But are saying, now continue to talk about it and is also agreeing, they say, to write a document about what kind of ceasefire they will potentially
sign up to.
[14:10:00]
That's not an unconditional ceasefire. That's the conditions for a ceasefire. So, very little ground moved by the Russians at all here. And I
think this feeds into the ultimate narrative of essentially Moscow playing for time and waiting to see what moves it can make on the battlefield to
change its position in any kind of talks or period in this war. Isa?
SOARES: Yes, very much maneuvering to avoid Trump's wrath, and to keep him on his side, like you said, very much playing the long game. Nick Paton
Walsh, our Clare Sebastian, thank you very much indeed. And I want to go back to that point, that moment that Nick was just referencing there in
Albania. And that's Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy, French President Emmanuel Macron, this photo here, the German Chancellor Friedrich
Merz and U.K. Prime Minister Keir Starmer right there in the middle as well as Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk, all on the phone call in that photo
with Donald Trump.
A clear image of Ukraine once again rallying support from its allies as a ceasefire deal still remains out of reach. While the European Commission
president now says the EU is working on a new package, as Clare was referencing there, of sanctions against Moscow. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
URSULA VON DER LEYEN, PRESIDENT, EUROPEAN COMMISSION: And we are ready to do more to bring Putin to the negotiation table. Many of the speakers
mentioned it. This war has to end. You said it, Giorgia, you said it, Keir. Volodymyr has described with others the roller-coaster of the last days. To
be very clear, again, we want peace. And so, we are working on a next set of sanctions.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Let's get more from my next guest, is a former Lithuanian Foreign Minister, Gabrielius Landsbergis, who joins us now from Estonia, a well-
known face here on the show. Gabrielius, great to have you back on the show. As you heard there from our correspondents, an agreement to swap
prisoners of war, but no peace deal and no timeline. Are you surprised at all that we're here?
GABRIELIUS LANDSBERGIS, FORMER LITHUANIAN FOREIGN MINISTER: No, I'm not surprised. To those who understand, you know what? At least try to
understand what Putin is thinking. You know, we know that he is not ready to make a deal. Any kind of deal for him can come out of his either success
or not success in the battlefield.
And currently, he's continuing to put pressure on Ukrainians, he believes that he can be successful. Therefore, you know, he's not interested in any
way, in any diplomatic solution.
SOARES: And, you know, the frustrating -- I'm kind of almost putting my hands and my head here, because the frustrating part of this is, you and I
have spoken numerous times, and you've made that point clearly, repeatedly on this show, and yet we're still at this juncture. So, let's focus then on
the diplomacy and potentially the pressure that may or may not come from the United States.
We heard President Macron say today that Russia, quote, "is merely trying to buy time". Basically, as we heard from our correspondent in Kyiv, that
Russia is stalling. So, just explain to our viewers why would it be stalling? Is it because they're playing the long game, or is it because
they're hoping that Trump will lose interest here? How do you interpret this?
LANDSBERGIS: Well, I think that for Putin, you know, the way that Putin interprets the current situation, he believes that he has Trump where he
actually wants him. He wants United States engaged, and you know, more leaning towards Russian side. And this is -- this is what he has currently.
You know, there was a promise of excruciating sanctions if the ceasefire is not imposed.
And well, that went without any notice, then there was a promise that Putin needs to appear in Istanbul, that also didn't happen. So, you know -- and
then President Trump comes out and basically agrees with Putin's position. So, for him, he believes that if he has Trump closer to his side, you know,
then he can continue putting pressure on Ukraine.
And then it comes, you know, on his position towards Europe. And I don't think that he takes Europe, you know, seriously. I know that there are
talks about the new sanctions package, but honestly, I mean, it's not doing enough, you know, to make him change his mind. So, he can -- he can play
this game, you know, and --
SOARES: Yes --
LANDSBERGIS: Then -- his -- in his mind, again, as I said, you know, that the victory might come only in the battlefield.
SOARES: Yes, and look, the differences as our Clare Sebastian was saying today -- and Turkey seemed to be pretty intractable here. But --
LANDSBERGIS: Yes --
SOARES: You know, I'm sure a lot of these European leaders, as they wait to see, put more pressure on Russia, will be looking to President Trump, whose
language has shifted somewhat regarding Putin, at least in the last several weeks. Clearly, he's more frustrated. But while he says one thing, the
actions don't reflect that, right?
[14:15:00]
There's definitely more carrot than stick. Why do you think that President Trump hasn't gone that far yet, or hasn't gone far enough yet when it comes
to pressure campaign against Mr. Putin?
LANDSBERGIS: Well, maybe the reason is that he doesn't want to do it. Maybe the reason is that he actually since the very first announcement that he,
you know, he wants to make a deal on Ukraine, he wants to talk with Putin, maybe that was always the plan, you know, for him to meet Putin, to talk
and then to decide the future of European security.
Because that is what -- that was the way I interpreted their messages during the Munich Security Conference several months ago. That basically,
the deal can only come from Trump's and Putin's meeting. And I'm really worried about this, especially since it came back just now, the idea,
because it is -- it doesn't sound like a deal.
It sounds like a pact, which is more reminiscent of 1938. You know, where the -- you know, where the people would meet and then, you know, draw
borders in Europe. That didn't end well. I don't think that it will end well now.
SOARES: So, very quickly then, where does this leave Europe? Does Europe announce another round of sanctions? Does it wait for President Trump to
meet with President Putin? Goodness know when that's going to happen. What are we likely to see and how impactful it is? Because as our correspondent
was saying, it seems that, you know, that Russia is pretty impenetrable to Russia -- to European pressure.
LANDSBERGIS: Yes, well, I mean, we have not seen the pressure, right? I mean --
SOARES: Yes --
LANDSBERGIS: It has been, you know, since February, how many months that we are talking about the pressure. We created a group of the willing, but we
have not created a group of the doing. So, that has been the biggest European problem, that, you know, we don't believe in our own ability to
put pressure on Russia.
And there are ways, there are clearly ways. I mean, sanctions, we could find a way how to impose real sanctions on Russia so that it would --
SOARES: Yes --
LANDSBERGIS: Really start to hurt. But then, we need to deal with Hungarian problem within the European Union, which again, seems like a far-out target
for certain member states. And, you know, supporting Ukraine like really sending serious packages, if not the -- if not the weapons, and at least
money so that they could build their own drones and continue passing up their industry.
So, these things have not yet happened, and I'm worrying that just willing for some sort of result might not be enough.
SOARES: Gabrielius Landsbergis, always great to get your insight, good to see you, thank you very much indeed.
LANDSBERGIS: Thank you so much.
SOARES: Well, it's been called Super Sunday as millions head to the ballot box across Europe this weekend in my home country of Portugal, Romania and
Poland there. Polls are voting in a first round, choosing between liberal, conservative and far-right candidates all vying to become President.
Meantime, in Romania, the far-right candidate and Trump admirer George Simeon is the frontrunner. Thus thanks to a surge of nationalism in central
Europe, and concerns over rising living costs, migration and security threats from Russia. Voters in Bucharest say they want a shake-up. Have a
listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): We want something different. We want change. And for this, we are labeled as the scum of society called
stupid, uneducated. I don't think we are like that. That's their opinion. But I argue this, if you don't agree with the change, I believe they are
afraid of change.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): We believe more in the Nukhuzaa(ph) option, because it is softer. It seems cleaner. He has some results through
the things he has done, and I think the direction in which Romania should go is pro-European, democratic path is far away from Russia and is close to
the west.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: We'll stay across those elections, of course, bring you the very latest on Monday. And still to come tonight, a desperate search for
survivors after a night of blistering attacks. Israel is escalating the war in Gaza despite international calls for a ceasefire. Also U.S. President
Trump claims Tehran has been given a nuclear proposal, but Iran says that's news to them. Details ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:20:00]
SOARES: Well, bombings, darkness, ambulance sirens, screams everywhere, all while starvation tightens its grip. That's how the municipality of Gaza
describes one of the fiercest waves of bombardments there in months. Israel attacked northern Gaza with heavy airstrikes and artillery overnight.
The Health Ministry says 250 people have now been killed in the past 36 hours, and that includes many women as well as children. Israel says it
hit, quote, "terror targets". Rescuers don't have equipment to search for people still missing under the rubble, instead, and as you can see here,
they're using hammers as well as their bare hands.
Officials say a mass displacement is underway as civilians flee the north toward western Gaza. One father says there is simply nowhere safe to take
his family.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FADI TAMBOURA, DISPLACED PALESTINIAN (through translator): Where should I go today? West Gaza, there's bombing in west Gaza. To the south, they are
killing people in Khan Younis. I go to there, there's bombing in there. Where should I go? Me, my children, my family. Where should we go? Here I
am today, I left, I left like this. How will I continue my life? How will I live?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Incredible anguish. There's also anguish among families of Israeli hostages. They say they woke up with heavy hearts upon hearing of the
intensified attacks in Gaza. They fear the window is closing fast to reach a ceasefire as well as hostage deal. They say, quote, "we are in dramatic
hours that will determine the future of our loved ones, the future of Israeli society and the future of the Middle East."
Enough pain to go around for everyone there. Well, Jeremy Diamond is following developments tonight for us from Tel Aviv. And Jeremy, we can
talk about the humanitarian situation, the dire humanitarian situation that you have been reporting on here on the show for months now. But first, let
me get your take on what you're hearing about the intensification of these IDF strikes that we've been seeing. Is this the offensive that they
promised? Is this now starting or is this a preamble?
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: I think it certainly is a preamble. But make no mistake, there has been a very significant
intensification in Israeli air and artillery strikes this week that have killed hundreds of people just in the last several days. In fact, just
within the last 24 hours, more than a 100 people have been killed, according to the Palestinian Ministry of Health.
As we have seen particularly strong airstrikes in the northern part of the Gaza Strip where more than 50 people were killed overnight, just in that
area. One man, Rifaq al-Tatari(ph), said that his sister and 14 members of her family were killed in a single strike. All of them, he said, were
civilians, including his sister's baby, grandchildren.
And so, we are seeing the rising cost on civilians, of course, as we unfortunately, all too often do in Gaza. The Israeli military seems
prepared and is preparing for this larger intensification as early as next week, which would involve significant ground operations and ultimately what
the Israeli Prime Minister has described as a plan to take over and occupy large swaths of the Gaza Strip.
Of course, at the same time, we are seeing these ongoing negotiations to try and reach a ceasefire deal. A ceasefire could avert all of that. But
for now, there's no real indication of concrete progress towards actually achieving that goal.
[14:25:00]
SOARES: And today, we heard from President Trump talking about the dire humanitarian situation in Gaza. I just want to play this. Have a listen to
this and we'll talk afterwards, Jeremy.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: And we're looking at Gaza, and we've got to get that taken care of. A lot of people are starving. A lot of people are -- there's a lot of bad
things going on, OK?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: So, in the meantime, we've heard from the U.N. saying that it won't support a new plan by the U.S. organization to kind of deliver the aid
because of their lack of neutrality. What more can you tell us about the makeup of this Gaza humanitarian fund, and how exactly will it work?
Because I know you've been speaking to them. Give us a sense of what -- how it's going to work.
DIAMOND: Yes, Isa, I actually just conducted the first interview with Jake Wood; the executive director of this Gaza Humanitarian Foundation, who
responded quite directly to many of these criticisms that we've heard from the United Nations and other groups, including the U.N.'s Emergency Relief
Director, Tom Fletcher, who called this new mechanism a quote, "cynical sideshow".
Jake Wood told me that he believes that much of this criticism from these aid groups is based on misinformation. They heard about these plans early
on, and he urged these groups to reconsider. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JAKE WOOD, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, GAZA HUMANITARIAN FOUNDATION: I want to stress this plan is not perfect, but this plan will be feeding people by
the end of the month in a scenario where no one has allowed aid to be in over the course of the last ten weeks. Ultimately, the community is going
to face a choice.
This is going to be the mechanism by which aid can be distributed in Gaza. Are you willing to participate? The answer is going to be, you know, pretty
critical to whether or not this ramps up to sufficiently feed 2.2 million people in a very desperate situation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DIAMOND: And to that critical question, I asked him whether or not he believes that the Gaza Humanitarian Foundation can ultimately provide
enough aid for all of Gaza's population if the United Nations, biggest aid organizations do not participate. And he told me, quite frankly, it is hard
to say whether or not that will be possible.
And so, you can see how high the stakes are. He also confirmed to me that the Israeli government has agreed to allow some aid into Gaza before this
new mechanism gets fully up and running by the end of the month. He said that he could not provide a timeframe on exactly when that would happen,
but he said that he is confident that the Israeli government has agreed to allow some aid into Gaza.
He believes that there will be news on that front in the, quote, "coming days". But beyond that, of course, this aid mechanism is only being created
because Israel insists that Hamas is stealing aid in Gaza. That is a claim that Hamas has rejected. Humanitarian aid organizations insist that there
has been no significant diversion of aid in Gaza.
I asked Wood, you know, what he believes about this? And he told me that, frankly, from his point of view, it simply doesn't matter. He said that
this is going to be the only way that aid gets into Gaza because Israel has decided it will be the only way aid gets into Gaza. And so, that is why he
renewed this plea to aid organizations to join this effort, to help shape it, and to help ramp up ultimately this delivery of aid in Gaza to serve
the entire population through this new mechanism over the course of the next 30 to 90 days. Isa?
SOARES: And I think we have that -- do we have that clip from his interview with Wood. Let's play it if we have it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WOOD: The situation on the ground is clearly urgent. And we can't afford to wait. We are committed to being operational with our plan by the end of the
month, ideally in advance of that. But you know, no time like the present to move aid in under existing mechanisms. The Israelis have agreed to that
operational condition.
We don't yet have final details as conversations are ongoing about what precisely that means and when? But we do expect to have some positive
updates on that in the coming days.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Well, we hope to get more details soon because we know the needs as you've been reporting, as we showed our viewers with your package
yesterday, incredibly dire warning. Many NGOs on this week on my show talking about starvation, really, and the need for this food. Jeremy, I
appreciate it, thank you very much indeed for that interview, very needed at this moment, thank you. We're going to take a short break, but we'll be
back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:33:12]
ISA SOARES, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Welcome back everyone. President Donald Trump says Iran has a nuclear proposal deal being offered by U.S.
but warns they don't have much time to make a decision on it. On his way back to the United States, after wrapping up his Middle East tour, the
President was asked about the state of those negotiations with Thran and this is how he responded.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: On Iran, has the U.S. given them a formal proposal? Has Steve Witkoff handed that over?
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: They have a proposal but more importantly they know they have to move quickly or something bad --
something bad is going to happen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: So, they have a proposal, but Iran's foreign minister says his government has not received any written proposal from the United States,
something a source familiar with the matter also told CNN just a short time ago. And it comes one day after the Iranian president called his U.S.
counterpart naive for thinking he could threaten Thran and would back down.
Let's also remember that it was President Trump who withdrew the U.S. from the Iran Nuclear Deal during his first term.
CNN's Chief National Security Correspondent Alex Marquardt joins me now from Washington. So, Alex, I mean, there seems to be confusion about this
proposal. Iran says he hasn't received it, though Trump says it has. What are you hearing? What are you hearing from your sources?
ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, we have to remember, Isa, there have been four rounds of talks so far and another one
does appear to be in the works. Bear with me. It was in the third round where each side took technical teams with them to essentially put more meat
on the bones for a potential proposal. And then in the last round, the fourth round which was last weekend, Iran's Foreign Minister Araghchi and
Steve Witkoff, the Middle East Envoy, they exchanged proposals.
Now, there had been an expectation that perhaps there would be another revised U.S. proposal this week that has not materialized, we were told.
But the proposal that President Trump appears to be referring to is what was given to Iran last weekend. And they would talk about those exchange
proposals in the next meeting which has yet to be confirmed both in terms of location and in terms of timing.
[14:35:16]
But more broadly, Isa, things do appear to be progressing. They're moving forward. They're talking about this next round. Neither side is walking
away. But it's hard to tell where the two sides stand. We did hear President Trump earlier this week talk about Iran sort of agreed to the
terms to not produce what he called nuclear dust. Not clear what nuclear dust actually is. But there is still this very fundamental question of
whether or not Iran will be allowed to enrich at all.
We've heard top administration officials say that Iran should not enrich. They should import fuel from outside for their civilian energy purposes.
But the Iranians are firm that that is a red line. We heard a rather frustrated Foreign Minister Araghchi of Iran today writing on Twitter. I
want to quote some of what he said.
The messages they continue to receive are confusing and contradictory. Iran nonetheless, he writes, remains determined and straightforward, respect our
rights and terminate your sanctions and we have a deal. Mark my words, there is no scenario in which Iran abandons its hard-earned right to
enrichment for peaceful purposes. So, a very firm Araghchi there.
So, again, Isa, things do appear to be moving forward. We do expect a fifth round of talks. But in terms of an actual final deal, that does not appear
imminent right now.
SOARES: Right. OK. So, I'm glad you laid out very clearly for us the four rounds, and it seems like it's a technicality at this point. But in terms
of the positions where they stand from what you just read there, it doesn't seem like they've moved at all because President Trump, you know, while he
was in Saudi Arabia, Alex, he said it presented an olive branch to the Iranians, but he also stressed, and I'm quoting, "This is not an offer that
will last forever. The time is right for them to choose -- now for them to choose."
So, speak to that. Why is the time right now for Iran? Speak to the pressures it's facing as well as economically within the country.
MARQUARDT: Well, from the beginning, President Trump has made clear both with this and with the Ukraine deal that he wants to get this done very
quickly. And in fact, he put a two-month timeline on it. We know that an added pressure is that Israel is very keen to strike Iran while they are
weak, historically weak in terms of their military readiness and their air defenses. But the President has made clear that he wants to solve this
issue uh diplomatically.
So, I think we have heard the impatience of Trump on both those fronts, Ukraine and Iran, but at the same time these timelines tend to slip a
little bit. And he is still giving the room for these negotiations. They're clear -- they're eager to say that there has been progress made but clear -
- but they are also understanding now that these things do take time. And they are giving them the time because there is an expectation of more
rounds of talk. So, frustration on both sides, but both sides do appear to be getting closer however slowly to making some progress in these
negotiations.
SOARES: And in diplomacy, that is a very good sign indeed. Alex, as always, thank you.
MARQUARDT: Thank you.
SOARES: And even though the U.S. and China may have agreed to a tariff truce, it's clear Donald Trump's global trade war is far from over. Mr.
Trump says his negotiators will be sending letters to 150 countries over the next few weeks informing them of new U.S. tariff rates. The President
admits that's not enough time to hammer out so many deals that he says countries want to make before his self-imposed July deadline.
Last month if you remember, Mr. Trump issued a very similar warning that within a few weeks he will set the tariff for countries that failed to
negotiate those new terms.
And still to come tonight, testimony is wrapping up for the ex-girlfriend of Sean Diddy Combs. We'll take a look at the key moments from her cross-
examination today. And then later, the creator of Charlie and Lola joins our book club. Lauren Child tells me what she's learned from writing for
children.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LAUREN CHILD, AUTHOR, SMILE (CLARICE BEAN): I think one of the really biggest things I've met doesn't matter where I go and which children I talk
to is that that hopefulness that they sort of carry hope naturally.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:42:02]
SOARES: Well, questioning is wrapping up today for the ex-girlfriend of Sean Diddy Combs. The judge requested testimony end today for Cassie
Ventura due to her advanced stage of pregnancy. The prosecution is trying to use Ventura's testimony to show Combs' and his associates engaged in
illegal activity. Sean Combs is accused of racketeering conspiracy, sex trafficking, and transportation to engage in prostitution. He's pleaded not
guilty to all charges.
Let's get the latest from the court from CNN's Elizabeth Wagmeister. So, Elizabeth, just talk us through what we've been hearing today. I mean, did
the defense or the prosecution get across what they wanted with Cassie Ventura's testimony?
ELIZABETH WAGMEISTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. So, I just stepped outside of the courthouse. And what is happening right now as we speak is the
prosecution is now up with Cassie Ventura on the witness stand. And they are doing their redirect after about a day and a half of cross-examination
from the defense.
So, what the defense is trying to get across is that this is not a sex trafficking -- it's a sex trafficking case but they're trying to say it
should not be a sex trafficking case. It should not be a racketeering case. It should not be a case about transportation to engage in prostitution.
They are saying that this was a volatile relationship where both parties were engaging in drugs, both parties had issues with infidelity to one
another, and they have tried to portray Cassie Ventura as an individual who had a propensity for violence. They've also portrayed her as someone who
was in love with Combs and was jealous that she could never essentially be the number one woman in his life.
Now you have the prosecution who as I said is up there right now and they are being quite effective on redirect. From what I have seen it was just
started a few minutes ago is they have questioned Cassie to say, why did you write these things back to Sean Combs and why did you send him sexually
explicit messages. And she said that it is because she essentially knew what he wanted to hear, knew what he needed to hear, which is that she did
want to engage in these so-called Freak Offs which the government has described as drug-fueled sex parties that Combs allegedly orchestrated
forcing Ventura and other women to have sex with male sex workers.
So, Ventura said that she knew that if she didn't comply, if she didn't act that way, that she could be hurt. She said that Combs was physically
violent. Remember that the jury has seen photos of physical violence on Cassie Ventura's body. We saw a busted lip, a gash on her eyebrow,
bruising.
So right now, the prosecution is again being quite effective in getting their point across which is this was a young woman who met a very powerful
man in the entertainment industry. She was just 19 years old when he signed her to his Bad Boy record label. And they essentially are saying that she
was groomed into not becoming his girlfriend, but the word that Cassie Ventura used, was that her second job was essentially being a sex worker.
So, again redirect will end shortly. And we do expect will end shortly and we do expect that we are actually going to get another witness today after
Cassie Ventura is on the stand. And this by the way is her fourth day testifying.
[14:45:20]
SOARES: Elizabeth Wagmeister, I know you'll keep it across for us. Thank you very much there, Elizabeth, live in New York.
Well, the man who attacked author Salman Rushdie in 2022 has been sentenced to 25 years in prison. That's the maximum time allowed under the law. Hadi
Matar was convicted of attempted murder and assault in February for the brutal stabbing attack that left Rushdie blind in one eye. Rushdie's book,
The Satanic Verses published nearly 40 years ago sparked angry protests in the Muslim world over its controversial depiction of the Prophet Muhammad.
And still to come tonight, children's author and illustrator Lauren Child joins our book club with her new story Clarice Bean, Smile, inspired in
part by children sharing their stories on climate change. Our conversation just ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SOARES: Joining us today is Lauren Child, the author of Clarice Bean, Smile. Lauren, welcome to the show.
CHILD: Thank you. We are all very excited in our -- in our book club, my team, all-girl team about this because obviously we know you. Many of our
viewers no doubt will know you through some of your previous books. But this one is a bit different from what -- you know, from what we've known
previously.
Obviously, those who remember, Charlie and Lola, huge books. I remember my kids reading it. Now it became a TV series. Where did the idea come from
for this one in particular, for Smile?
CHILD: I pretty much always write about things that either have grabbed my attention. I've got particularly interested in or things that maybe are
troubling me. And at the time, I needed to come up with a new Clarice Bean story. I was finding myself feeling full of despair and that's not a great
way to begin a book. And I was just feeling rather hopeless about I think world events and particularly climate change. And I thought I needed to
deal with that because you can't live without hope. It's difficult to do that.
And so, I thought I needed to look at these things through the eyes of a child. And the child I chose was Clarice Bean because I've been writing
about her for 30 years now.
[14:50:13]
SOARES: When you read Smile and this drawing to the young children, do they -- does it resonate with them? What do they tell you? What do they take
away from it?
CHILD: Well, I think what I love particularly about writing the Clarice Bean series is that it is very conversational. And so, the way she's
thinking is hopefully the way that they are thinking. And so, I -- you know, particularly it's lovely to get letters from them. And they will
often tell you about their home life or what's going on or -- I wrote a -- one of the stories is about losing your best friend because she's moved
way, and that's like your first love in a way. That really, really strong relationship that holds you together.
So, they'll tell me about things that happen in their life or things that are difficult things, that are joyful. So, I think that's what I love. And
it's something I never expected to get as a writer is actually it's very nourishing for me because I hear back from them.
SOARES: And I love the idea, you know, of daydreaming. That all feeds the creativity, the imagination. And I wonder, you know, after all these years
of writing these exceptional books as so many of our children know and we know of course that we've learned along the way, whether you think, Lauren,
that you -- what you have learned from children.
CHILD: I think one of the really biggest things I've met, it doesn't matter where I go and which children I talk to is that hopefulness that they sort
of carry hope naturally. And I think if we're not careful, that's what we push out of -- out of them. So, when you become an adult, you're much less
able to see what's possible. And I think children hold our hope and our -- and our curiosity and what's possible.
And it's amazing I've been to some really tough places where children are living on the streets and you ask them what do they -- what do they want
and expect out of life. And they will tell you, oh, I want to be a hairdresser or I want to be a footballer. And that's just there inside
them. And that's what I don't want to be crushed because it's the most valuable thing.
SOARES: I saw that too when I was in Ukraine, you know, the answers, the most beautiful, innocent, and hopeful answers you get from children in the
most difficult of circumstances and environments.
I want to return just briefly as we wrap up to Charlie and Lola because often, you know, we have this discussion like, where do the ideas come
from? Are you lying down in bed and something comes up in your mind and you write it down in a pad next to your bed -- bedside table. Where did the
idea? For example, Charlie and Lola, where did that come from? I know you said it's based between you and your sister, but where -- how did it all
start?
CHILD: Well, it started -- I have a notebook of things I write down. And so, some of -- some of the stories that, you know, I don't get to for 20
years.
SOARES: Oh, wow.
CHILD: And it takes that long sometimes. I kind of think, well, I think that might work. And -- anyway, so that partly came from that memory of my
sisters and me and the way that you can be playing one minute, and then you can be fighting the next, and something can seem very tragic and dramatic
and then really happy and silly. And I think -- I mean, that's what I've tried to get into Smile that it's funny as well -- as well as big.
And so, Charlie and Lola was all about that perfect 15 minutes in a child's day where everything seems to be slotting together beautifully, but also
the way that I love listening to children talking and playing because they can travel so far in their imagination, and I as an adult cannot go with
them. So, there's a sort of sadness sometimes to that.
SOARES: That we cannot.
CHILD: But it's charming and beautiful. And I remember how it was but I just love what they can do with their time.
SOARES: Well, you've captured it beautifully in all your books. So, we're all huge fans here on the show.
CHILD: Thank you.
SOARES: Thank you so much, Lauren.
CHILD: Thank you.
SOARES: I'll pass you the pen.
CHILD: Oh, yes.
SOARES: Do us the honor.
CHILD: Yes.
SOARES: There you go.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SOARES: And our thanks to Lauren Child. And next on our book club, Monika Radojevic joins us with A Beautiful Act of Consequence, a collection of 30
striking tales navigating womanhood. She tells me how society can break women with the pressure it places on them. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MONIKA RADOJEVIC, AUTHOR, WITH A BEAUTIFUL ACT OF CONSEQUENCE: I think to constantly have in the back of your mind that your freedom is only very
recently won, hard-won, and is constantly at the -- at the edge, you know, at the precipice of something very dark. And so, you carry that around with
you all the time. It's a privilege to be a woman in today's times, but it is also startling and alarming in many different ways.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[14:55:25]
SOARES: You do not want to miss that conversation.
And finally on the show tonight, it's party time in Switzerland this week with the Eurovision song contest finals set to take place on Saturday.
Millions are expected to tune in including my director to the world's largest live music event, while many fans have already arrived in the host
city Basil.
And this includes a group of fans who drove a sauna -- yes, a sauna, from Finland to Switzerland almost 3,000 kilometers. They are supporting one of
this year's favorites, a catchy Swedish song about, well, you guessed it, saunas. And in true Eurovision spirit here is the musical rendition of
Sweden's entry.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Do sponsor them. That does it for us for tonight. Don't go anywhere. I'll be back. Much more news after the short break.
END
