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Isa Soares Tonight
Russian Fighter Jet Violates Estonian Airspace; Jimmy Kimmel's Suspension Stirs Free Speech Debate; U.N. General Assembly Will Allow Abbas To Virtually Address Annual Session Next Week; Israel Vows Unprecedented Force In Gaza City Assault; University To Hold Vigil For Charlie Kirk Tonight; Italy's Political Past Stands As A Warning To The U.S.; Study: Chimps Eat Fruit Similar To One Alcoholic Drink A Day; Winners Of Ocean Photographers Of The Year Competition. Aired 2-3p ET
Aired September 19, 2025 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[14:00:00]
ISA SOARES, HOST, ISA SOARES TONIGHT: A very warm welcome to the show, everyone, I'm Isa Soares. Tonight, rising tension. Russian fighter jets
violate Estonian airspace, forcing NATO to get involved. In a moment, I'll speak to Romania's Foreign Minister after Russia violated that country's
airspace just days ago.
Then alarm bells ringing in the U.S. over free speech as the fallout from Jimmy Kimmel's suspension reverberates. Plus, the latest on Israel's war in
Gaza. I'll be speaking to one IDF reservist who says he won't continue to fight. That, and much more ahead this hour. But we do start this hour with
Russian President Vladimir Putin once again testing the West's resolve.
Those words are from the top EU diplomat Kaja Kallas after Russia's third incursion into European and NATO airspace in just days. This time, it's
Estonia reporting that three Russian-make 31 fighter jets circulated without permission and remained there for 12 minutes. In the last two weeks
-- and context here is important, Russian drones violated the airspace -- airspaces, I should say, of Poland and Romania.
That's three NATO states in a period of ten days. Meantime, in Ukraine, Russia has made significant advances on the battlefield -- you're looking
at the northeastern region of Kharkiv where the situation on the frontline is critical, and that is according to the Ukrainian military. Russian
troops, less than just 1 kilometer away from the city of Kupiansk.
Joining me now for more on this is international diplomatic editor Nic Robertson. And Nic, as we outlined there, first, Poland, then Romania, now
Estonia. Now, we've heard from the Estonian Foreign Minister the last few moments. The government of Estonia has decided to request NATO Article 4
consultations. How serious is this getting? This is not just a coincidence. This is Putin clearly testing NATO here.
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: He certainly seems to. These were very fast fighter jets that put them in contest as some of the
fastest fighter jets around. But we understand that Italian NATO members were involved in the response. And it's not uncommon for Russian planes to
be intercepted by NATO members.
They fly close to the U.K. sometimes, and the British Air Force will intercept them. So, it's not uncommon, but it -- but it comes right on the
heels of what you just mentioned in Poland, where there is for whatever reason, still outstanding questions about the Intelligence of whether
Russia intended or not. But when you see three of these super fast fighter jets for 12 minutes in Estonian airspace, it seems unlikely that this was
an accident.
They would know where they were, one, perhaps, you could argue, would maybe be lost, improbable, impossible, almost. But this does seem to fall into
what Kaja Kallas is calling the provocative action, brazen as the Foreign Minister of Estonia has put it. And I find it interesting that the timing
today comes on the heels today of the European Commission president, saying that she's asking European partners to step up sanctions on Russia for
those violations in Romania and Poland.
And the country that the -- whose airspace these fighter jets flew into, is none other -- none other than Kaja Kallas, the former --
SOARES: Yes --
ROBERTSON: Prime Minister of Estonia, who is now the High Representative on Foreign Affairs. You can read any level of messaging in there. It's not
an accident, and provocation --
SOARES: Yes --
ROBERTSON: Is where it seems to stand.
SOARES: You mentioned Kaja Kallas, we have heard from her in the last hour or so. I would like to play that. Let's have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAJA KALLAS, FOREIGN POLICY CHIEF, EUROPEAN UNION: It is clear that Russia is testing how far they can go. And we had very intensive discussions about
the international situation, and also regarding Russia's actions really. And of course, our pleas also to the countries that have more close
relationship with Russia is to really call them on stopping this.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[14:05:00]
SOARES: That last bit, please, those who have close relations with Russia to stop this. One person who has tried to do that is President Trump.
Yesterday you were at Chequers, you were covering, of course, the President's unprecedented second state visit. And he said Putin let him
down. But that was it. That's as far as it went.
ROBERTSON: And he doesn't give an indication of how he's going to pressure him because the Prime Minister standing next to him said Putin only
responds when you put pressure on him, and there was no response from President Trump that he was about to up that. He keeps talking about in a
few weeks -- in a few weeks.
So, again, this, you know, you could argue -- if you're a strategist right now trying to figure out what President Putin is thinking about, you could
-- you could be applying the lessons that Putin may have taken away from that press conference just yesterday. Another version of President Trump
kicking the -- appearing --
SOARES: Yes --
ROBERTSON: To kick the can down the road and not take the possibility of being firm when he could be. And so, it appears, and we know -- this is not
a -- it's not a -- it's not a question. It's a known fact that Putin really would like to break United States away from the rest of NATO --
SOARES: Yes --
ROBERTSON: And here, he is testing that. He's testing many things. The resolve as we have been told, his testing, you know, how deep are NATO's
pockets? How many -- you know, now, with Estonia calling for Article 4, what happened in Poland? Was additional NATO Air Force assets were sent
there that cost money.
Now, presumably that may happen in Estonia, that will cost more money in addition to the NATO troops already there, 900 Brits on the ground, all of
these costs escalate. You can all see that, it's not just a military test and a passing test to see how quickly the NATO fighter jets respond. But
this resilience test --
SOARES: Yes --
ROBERTSON: NATO and the EU talk about wearing down Putin's financial capabilities, and that's what the pressure is on --
SOARES: Yes --
ROBERTSON: Trump --
SOARES: It's unity in so many forms --
ROBERTSON: And he's trying to wear down Europe --
SOARES: Right? It's unity in so many forms.
ROBERTSON: And he appears to be trying to wear down the resilience, the patience, the economics of NATO's pushback.
SOARES: Nic, thank you very much indeed. Well, let's stay with this as we discuss one country condemning Russia for violating its airspace is
Romania. Last weekend, the Defense Ministry said a Russian drone used in attacks on Ukraine entered the country's airspace, remaining there for just
short of an hour. It was intercepted by F-16 fighter jets and eventually returned to Ukraine.
A statement from Romania's Defense Ministry criticized Moscow's, quote, "irresponsible actions". And Romania's Foreign Minister Oana Toiu joins me
now. Foreign Minister, very welcome to the show. Let me get, first of all, your reaction to the news that Nic and I were just talking about there,
that news out of Estonia, that its airspace being violated by three Russian jets. Foreign Minister from that country saying it was unprecedented and
brazen. Just your reaction.
OANA TOIU, FOREIGN MINISTER, ROMANIA: Thank you for having me. I have just exchanged messages with the Foreign Minister of Estonia today, because I
have been in meetings in Congress throughout the day to discuss eastern flank and the U.S. contribution to the NATO position on the eastern flank.
Article 4 has been invoked, and we are going to continue our conversation in that format.
SOARES: Just explain to us what -- you know, when you say Article 4 has been invoked. What does that actually mean in real terms?
TOIU: In real terms, it means the country that invokes the article, in this case, Estonia, has been the case of Poland, is a country that fears
its own security at risk, and the security of one of us is the security of all of us.
SOARES: Let me go back --
TOIU: In practical terms --
SOARES: Go ahead, go ahead Foreign Minister --
TOIU: No -- yes, in practical terms, we're going to have consultations and continue on the path that we have already decided after the provocations in
Poland and Romania, which is the Eastern Sentry decision and the decision - -
SOARES: Yes --
TOIU: To supplement our air defenses on the eastern flank.
SOARES: And, of course, your airspace was violated last weekend. Do you believe this was intentional? Do you believe this was a mistake because it
isn't the first time this year, is it, Foreign Minister?
TOIU: I have some on the Russian ambassador two times the previous week, and I have transmitted a clear message that we perceived it as being
intentional. And we are clear on the fact that it is unacceptable. Russia is trying to undermine the NATO coherence, but I think they're achieving
the exact opposite.
We are in closer contact to each other. We see more clearly that the decisions we have taken in The Hague summit to increase our budgets to 5
percent are the right decision, and we are accelerating our sanctions.
[14:10:00]
SOARES: So, when you say intentional, Foreign Minister, intentional with what purpose? I know you said to test NATO, but is also to test resolve to
Intelligence gathering. What exactly is the purpose here then?
TOIU: All that you have mentioned, and also to heat up the debate in society is one of the objectives that Russia has. In the case of Romania,
this is not the first time they have done this more than ten times, but we have considered some of the incursions in the past to be potentially
accidental. This time, 50 minutes into our airspace is definitely not an accident.
And the drone was of Iranian design. So, clearly, not one of the drones that the Ukrainian army has been using. So, what the Russians have tried to
say that it does not belong to them. It is clearly a lie.
SOARES: And can you give us any more information about the drone? I know you say Iranian design, but what type of drone was it? Can you give us
that?
TOIU: Yes, the pilots have seen the drones once they followed the drone to the -- to F-16 planes that we have. And we also had into our air police
team, the two German flights also present there. So, that is how we know from the pilots of the F-16 planes that it is of Iranian design. It's one
of the Shahed drones.
SOARES: The reason, Foreign Minister, I was asking you about whether you thought this was -- you think this was coincidental or mistake is because,
as you would have seen, President Trump said it could have been a mistake. These are the words that he used. And then we understand from U.S. and
western officials tell CNN, they've been unable, this was their words, unable to determine whether the incursion was accidental or intentional.
They said their flight patterns and their technical specifications have been mixed up and difficult to interpret. When you hear that, how do you
respond?
TOIU: Each of the country has their own analysis, but also as -- it has been clear in the statements of Ursula von der Leyen today in the European
Union format, we consider these incursions to be intentional, and we're reacting with increased pressure. But also, in terms of the conversations
we've been having here in the United States, I have seen clear support from the Congress, and the clear understanding of the situation on the Black Sea
and at the border of the eastern flank.
SOARES: Support from the United States. I have spoken to many European diplomats here on my show, Foreign Minister, and all they tell me is, of
course, they need to step up pressure, of course, as European countries, but also they want to see the U.S. President apply more pressure on Putin,
less deadlines, more sanctions.
I want to get -- I just want to play his response to this. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Very simply. If the price of oil comes down, Putin is going to drop out. He's going to have no choice.
He's going to drop out of that war. And when I found out that the European nations were buying oil from Russia -- I'm willing to do other things, but
not when the people that I'm fighting for are buying oil from Russia.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Foreign Minister, give me your reaction. I don't believe Romania imports much in terms of oil, but what is your response? And does Mr. Trump
have a point here?
TOIU: We agree that we should stop buying Russian oil, not on behalf of Romania. We have already taken this decision for a while, but the entire
European Union should do so, and it is a common decision in the proposal of the 19th package of sanctions. Romania is currently the main supplier of
natural gas within the European Union.
We supply 25 percent and our increase with U.S. investments as well in nuclear energy is going to make it not just easy, but also affordable to
have sources of energy that allow all economies in the region to cut off the need for any type of Russian oil or gas.
SOARES: So, very briefly, what would you like to see from the United States here, to try and try apply more pressure to Putin. How -- what kind
of pressure needs to be applied to turn things around, and to stop incursions like the ones we have seen into your country?
TOIU: We believe the role of the United States and the President Trump is an essential role in creating the deterrence capacity on the eastern flank.
Also, the needed pressure for the peace negotiations for Romania in the conversations we are having these days in congress, it is very important
that we have a sustained NATO presence in the military bases that we're having.
President Nicusor Dan already informed parliament of our approval to have an increased U.S. presence in the Kogalniceanu base on air fueling.
Obviously, also, it is part of the partnership we are having and our role as allies to support United States in their decision concerning the
volatile situation in the Middle East.
SOARES: Foreign Minister, really appreciate you taking the time to speak to us. Thank you very much indeed. Live there from Washington D.C. And
still to come tonight, President Trump celebrates as one of his biggest TV critics is pulled off the air. Now, he's threatening to target others.
[14:15:00]
And then later, terrified to stay, terrified to go. Gaza city residents fear for their lives as Israel escalates a major assault amid evacuation
orders.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SOARES: A Senate Democrat is calling the suspension of talk-show host Jimmy Kimmel a red alert moment for free speech in the United States. While
Republicans say it's simply a business decision. Whether it's online or on Capitol Hill, the divide on the issue runs deep along party lines. Have a
listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. CHRIS MURPHY (D-CT): Donald Trump in the wake of the tragic murder of Charlie Kirk, has decided to exploit that tragedy to try to silence his
political opponents. I think Kimmel is just the beginning. I think you're going to see a potential dizzying campaign of political repression against
anyone who opposes this President.
SEN. TOMMY TUBERVILLE (R-AL): There's free speech, and if you're going to go out there and speak your piece, fine, but you're accountable to
somebody. It's not the government. You're accountable to your people that employ you.
MANU RAJU, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Is the right dabbling in cancel culture?
SEN. JOSH HAWLEY (R-MO): Not this guy on the right. I mean, I just -- I just said he's entitled under the First Amendment to say what he wants. But
on the other hand, I applaud the move of "Disney", it's corporate parent to say we think this is terrible.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Well, after applauding the move, U.S. President Donald Trump is threatening to go much further. He's now suggesting the government could
revoke broadcast licenses from any network that is critical of him.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Well, I read some place that the networks were 97 percent against me. I got 97 percent negative. And yet, I won it easily, won all seven
space states, popular vote, won everything. I mean, they're getting a license. I would think maybe their license should be taken away. It will be
up to Brendan Carr.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: And the President there referring to this gentleman, the Federal Communications Commission Chair, who says Kimmel's show is not the last
shoe to drop. A source tells CNN, Brendan Carr's threat that "Disney" could lose its local broadcast license has played a major role in Disney's
decision to yank Kimmel off the air over his comments on the Charlie Kirk murder suspect.
Meantime, the union representing writers on Kimmel's show are among those protesting today outside "ABC" offices, as you can see there in New York.
[14:20:00]
A number of different layers, of course, as we just outlined there to cover on this story. Our Kristen Holmes is at the White House, and CNN
entertainment correspondent Liver Y(ph) -- Elizabeth Wagmeister, pardon me, join us from Los Angeles. Elizabeth, let me start with you. We saw -- was
all over, pretty much all over social media on this side of the pond, late night talk-show host retaken, two TV yesterday in support of Jimmy Kimmel.
Many of them lampooning, of course, the President and the decision by the FCC. I want to play the mash-up, and we can chat after that. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEPHEN COLBERT, COMEDIAN & TELEVISION HOST: If "ABC" thinks that this is going to satisfy the regime, they are woefully naive. And clearly, they've
never read the children's book, if you give a mouse a Kimmel.
SETH MEYERS, COMEDIAN & TELEVISION HOST: I just want to say, before we get started here, that I've always admired and respected Mr. Trump.
(LAUGHTER)
MEYERS: I've always believed he was -- no, a visionary, an innovator, a great President, and even better golfer.
JIMMY FALLON, COMEDIAN & TELEVISION HOST: To be honest with you all, I don't know what's going on, and no one does. But I do know Jimmy Kimmel,
and he's a decent, funny and loving guy, and I hope he comes back.
JON STEWART, COMEDIAN & TELEVISION HOST: An unprecedented, consolidation of power and Unitarian intimidation. Principle-less and coldly antithetical
to any experiment in a constitutional republic governance. Some people would say that, not me though, I think it's great.
(LAUGHTER)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: So, Elizabeth, I mean, is this frustration, anger just being matched by producers, writers out there in Hollywood? I spoke to a union --
head of a union in L.A. yesterday who was very concerned. What are you hearing?
ELIZABETH WAGMEISTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, everybody is incredibly concerned, and the Hollywood community really backing Kimmel, really
waiting to see what "ABC" is going to do and hoping that "ABC" takes a stand for free speech. It's really not surprising that all of the late-
night hosts are backing Kimmel, and that they are poking fun at it with comedy.
But what's interesting here is we did see President Trump right after Jimmy Kimmel's show was indefinitely pulled by "Disney". We saw Trump post on his
Truth Social, saying, "NBC", you should do it next. Go cancel "Fallon's" show and cancel Seth Meyers show. So, it's now -- the question is, what
comes from here? Because they joked about that.
Are they now going to be threatened by Trump's appointee at the FCC? Is the FCC going to encourage station groups to pull these other late-night shows
just like exactly what happened with Kimmel's show? Although, I will say that "Nexstar" has denied that. They have said that they were not
encouraged by the FCC.
But this is a big problem, and it is much bigger than Jimmy Kimmel. It is much bigger than "ABC" and "Disney". This is a problem that Hollywood is
contending with, and I am hearing from all of my sources that they are terrified. Can you no longer freely put content out and especially have
comedians speak their minds without being attacked by this administration?
SOARES: Yes, and as I've been hearing, let me bring Kristen into this discussion. You know, the concern is, it doesn't stop with Kimmel, of
course. President Trump suggesting that TV networks should lose their broadcast licenses to operate if their viewpoint on him appears to be
overwhelmingly negative.
So, let me bring Kristen Holmes into the conversation. What then, Kristen, is the next move? Because I'm seeing now a comment from Senator Ted Cruz,
who -- and I'm going to quote him here. "I hate what Jimmy Kimmel said. I am thrilled that he was fired. But let me tell you, if the government gets
in the business of saying we don't like what you, the media have said, we're going to ban you from the airwaves if you don't say what we like,
that will end up bad for conservatives."
What are you hearing then from both sides of the aisle on this?
KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, they're certainly walking a line when it comes to Republicans. I mean, you heard
Josh Hawley there, the senator you played him, talking in the intro, saying the same thing, essentially, that he doesn't think the government should
get involved, but that, of course, he is happy that Jimmy Kimmel got fired.
And it's not just Ted Cruz and Josh Hawley. There are a lot of conservatives that are very concerned that this is ultimately going to
backfire. And that's why you're hearing some of these officials really exclude any conversation about the FCC or about the government. Instead,
they are focusing on Kimmel himself.
They are posting photos of his ratings. They are saying that this was a business decision. This wasn't a decision that was made by the government
or by the fact that they were forced by the government. When you say next steps, it's really unclear right now. I mean, one of the things we heard
from the FCC commissioner or the chairman, he said that maybe the agency should start looking into "ABC's" "The View" next.
And clearly, stoking fear when it comes to these various shows and these various networks. And as you noted, President Trump himself really
elaborating on this idea that if you talk consistently negative about him, that maybe you could have your broadcast license revoked.
[14:25:00]
He even went on to say at one point that he thought that these various networks should have to re-apply periodically to see if they could even get
another license. So, clearly, here, he is pushing this idea that the FCC should be involved. This idea that Brendan Carr should be involved. But
that's not what you're hearing from Republicans uniformly.
And of course, what we've heard from Democrats is the complete opposite, which is that, this is a disgrace, and that this is an affront to freedom
of speech. But you are going to continue to see some of these Republicans walking a fine line. Many of them talking to me on background, behind
closed doors, saying that they are really concerned about where this could eventually go. But the word from the top, President Trump, you heard it
himself.
SOARES: Yes, indeed, very clear. We heard it. We played it. Let me go back to Elizabeth Wagmeister. Elizabeth, of course, Kimmel was suspended. We
have a sense of what next for him. Negotiations, do we know? Have we heard from him yet?
WAGMEISTER: We have not heard from him yet. I have been reaching out to his team, but he has not said anything yet. And I do want to note that when
Ted Cruz said that he has been fired, and when President Trump said that he's been fired for bad ratings, that's just not true. Jimmy Kimmel has not
been fired.
His show is suspended right now. It is obviously off of the air at the time being. Now, I hear from my sources that "ABC" is very hopeful that they can
bring him back. Now, of course, that right now doesn't seem to be the path forward. "ABC" has a very tough road ahead of them. It's really a lose-lose
situation because you bring back Kimmel, and of course, you let him speak his mind as he has always done on his show.
And you know that the President is not going to be happy with that, and that the FCC isn't going to be happy with that. But then, if he never
returns, then you have much of the country mad at him, but you also have the Hollywood community who is going to be angry with "Disney". So, right
now, there is no clear resolution. We are waiting to see what happens.
But I do just want to point out that he has not been fired, that this is very much --
SOARES: Yes --
WAGMEISTER: A wait-and-see approach. And what I have heard is that things between Kimmel and "ABC" are rather cordial. He has had a longstanding,
positive relationship with them, so, we have no indication yet at least that this is very contentious.
SOARES: Very important to mention that. And of course, we have seen the protests as well in New York in support of Jimmy Kimmel. Ladies,
appreciate, Elizabeth, Kristen, thank you very much to you both. Now I want to stay in the United States because President Trump and Chinese leader
Xi Jinping have held their first phone call since June.
Xi says the conversation was candid and in-depth, and that he told Trump to avoid imposing unilateral trade restrictions. Trump says the two leaders
made progress on trade, fentanyl, the Ukraine war, as well as TikTok. He also says they agreed to a series of in-person meetings, including at the
Apex Summit next month in South Korea.
The leaders were expected to finalize a deal that would sell most of TikTok's U.S. assets to American investors, but it's unclear if that
actually happened. And it comes after the U.S. Congress passed a law banning the app,. If you remember, in the U.S., unless China ceded control
of 80 percent of TikTok's assets.
And right now on Capitol Hill, the former U.S. attorney who negotiated a controversial 2008 plea deal with Jeffrey Epstein is testifying before the
U.S. House Oversight Committee. Alexander Acosta is appearing voluntarily for the closed-door interview, where he'll be pressed by both Republicans
as well as Democrats, over what many believe was a sweetheart deal for the late convicted sex offender.
Epstein, a well-connected multimillionaire, avoided a federal trial at the time of the plea deal, and he served just 7 -- 13 months, pardon me, in
prison for state prostitution charges over his involvement with underage girls. And still to come tonight, smoke on the horizon as Israel escalates
attacks in Gaza despite growing international pressure to end the war.
There is also growing pressure at home. We'll speak with IDF reservist who was jailed for refusing to serve in Gaza. Both those stories after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:33:06]
SOARES: Welcome back, everyone. He won't actually be on the world stage, but Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas will address the U.N.
General Assembly next week despite the U.S. refusal to grant him a visa to attend the gathering in New York.
Today, the UNGA voted to allow Abbas to speak by Video Link. This year's assembly is expected to be dominated by the war in Gaza and the fate of the
Palestinian people amid growing accusations that Israel is committing genocide. Countries including Britain and Belgium are expected to formally
recognize a Palestinian state.
There is a small but growing push for Palestinian independence among U.S. lawmakers as well. Eight senators have introduced legislation calling on
President Donald Trump to recognize a Palestinian state. Two of them recently visited the Gaza border, as you can see there. They've now issued
a report accusing Israel of ethnic cleansing in Gaza. They say America is complicit and that the world must step in.
Senator Chris Van Hollen spoke to CNN. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. CHRIS VAN HOLLEN (D-MD): We now have the Trump administration who actually is just providing a total blank check to the Netanyahu government.
They've contracted out American policy in Gaza and the Middle East broadly to Netanyahu. So yes, U.S. taxpayer dollars are funding what amounts to
this campaign of ethnic cleansing in Gaza.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Well, Israel and the U.S. both support Palestinians leaving Gaza, but insists any immigration would be voluntary. The IDF says its war is
against Hamas, and it's tightening a siege today on Gaza City as it orders residents to evacuate south. Local officials report relentless attacks amid
the famine there. All this happening as Hamas makes its strongest threat yet against the remaining hostages. Our Jeremy Diamond has more for you
from Tel Aviv.
[14:35:05]
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Well, the Israeli military is slowly but decisively moving forward with its planned invasion of Gaza City
as Israeli tanks and troops have been spotted getting closer to the center of Gaza City. Although for the moment they do remain around the city's
outskirts.
We know that the Israeli military is now warning that they will operate with "unprecedented force against Hamas inside of Gaza City where there are
still hundreds of thousands of civilians who are sheltering there. Many of them unable to leave even as the Israeli military is calling for them to
immediately evacuate that city.
We know that some 450,000 Palestinians are estimated to have fled the city so far, but many more still remain and either lacking the resources, the
financial means to leave the city or unwell enough not sufficiently able to make the hours-long journey by foot in order to get out of Gaza City. And
then they know that what awaits them in southern and central Gaza is an area that is already overcrowded with displaced Palestinians as the entire
population of the Gaza Strip is being pushed into a smaller and smaller area of Gaza.
Now, meanwhile, Hamas is also issuing a dire threat about the state of the hostages and the potential for them to be killed as the Israeli military
moves into Gaza City. Hamas' Al-Qassam Brigades, its military wing, says that it has now spread out the remaining hostages throughout different
neighborhoods of Gaza City, and saying that effectively the blood will be on the Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's hands if they are killed
as Israeli forces advance.
The Israeli military for its part has said that it is keeping the hostages in mind. As it advances, will proceed with caution, do everything that they
can to avoid harming them in cooperation with Israeli intelligence. But this latest very dire warning from Hamas really goes directly to so many of
the fears that we have heard from the families of those Israeli hostages which they have been voicing very loudly over the course of the last few
weeks in almost daily protests in front of the prime minister's residence for example calling for a halt to this Gaza City offensive, an end to the
war, fearing that their loved ones could be killed if Israeli forces continue to advance.
Meanwhile, at the U.N. Security Council, we saw on Thursday this latest effort to put a resolution forward calling for an immediate and permanent
ceasefire in Gaza failing once again as the United States vetoed the resolution, claiming it didn't sufficiently condemn Hamas. And for now,
there is no real progress in terms of getting those ceasefire and hostage deal negotiations between Israel and Hamas back on track.
Jeremy Diamond, CNN, Tel Aviv.
SOARES: Protesters in Israel marched the Gaza border today, demanding their government end the war. They chanted, Free Palestine and urged an
international boycott of Israel as a pressure tactic. One protester said, "These crimes are being committed in our name, and it is our duty to resist
them."
Our next guest is resisting in a different way. Captain Ron Feiner is an IDF reservist who recently refused to serve in Gaza. He spent several days
in Israeli military prison. Captain, I appreciate you being with us this evening. Can you just tell our viewers around the world why you're refusing
to serve and how this potentially may be received or is being received by the IDF?
RON FEINER, IDF RESERVIST: Thank you, Isa. Thanks for the opportunity to speak up. So, I refused to serve after I finally realized that this war is
going to keep just going on forever if it depends only on our government, against the will of the Israeli people, against our interests. And the only
way for it to stop is us putting as much pressure as we can on our government to stop it by any means necessary. And to refuse is one of the
most powerful means that we can use to stop it.
SOARES: And when you decided to refuse, I mean, what -- how was the IDF receive that? How was that decision received?
FEINER: Yes. So, I decided to refuse after the last ceasefire was broke by our government and I was sentenced to prison by my battalion commander and
after it again by my division commander because, of course, they don't see me -- see it well as I'm an officer and they think I only should obey
commands of my commanders. But I think I also have the responsibility as a citizen and as a patriotic citizen to protect my people and my country also
from the threats from our own government.
[14:40:21]
SOARES: Incredibly powerful your message, Captain. How long -- just clarify for us, how long were you in prison for?
FEINER: So, I was sentenced the first time for 20 days. I sent an appeal and I was released after one day and was sentenced again. This one for 25
days in prison.
SOARES: And when you came with the decision, I mean, how was this received from family and friends? Are you seeing a growing number of IDF reservists
doing something similar? Is -- are you starting to hear from others like yourself?
FEINER: Of course, we are getting larger. We are a movement that is growing and I'm a part of a group of soldiers who are refusing to serve. We are
almost 400. We are doing it publicly and we know about also others -- few thousand others that are doing it privately. From my friends and family,
they were really supportive almost all of them. They were a bit frightened that it will hurt my career maybe, but until now it wasn't so bad and I got
a lot of support.
SOARES: Yes. And we have seen, Captain, we have seen this on our air for many weeks, in fact, large-scale protests across Israel calling for an end
to the war, calling for a ceasefire, and of course for the hostages to be returned. Do you believe that this government of Prime Minister Netanyahu
wants to end the war? Do you believe he's prioritizing the hostages?
FEINER: No. No. This government led by Netanyahu is a government led by some extremists, a minority in Israel that prioritize their own political
survival, that prioritize the occupation of Gaza. And they put him in -- they put that in top priority instead of bringing back our hostages,
instead of saving the lives of our soldiers, instead of saving the lives of the people in Gaza, and instead of giving us hope for a better future and
for security.
SOARES: Yes. And look, we've heard from Hamas's military wing saying that Netanyahu's grand incursion in Gaza City means that Israel has lost any
chance of getting it hostages back. This is incredibly hard to hear of course because what we've seen is not a pullback, quite the opposite.
Israel conducting a new offensive in Gaza that -- in Gaza city that according to the government may take months here, Captain. And facing --
important to add here -- facing international condemnation as well as backlash from the hostage families of course.
I want to ask you this. You would have seen this. We -- you know, this all against the backdrop of this U.N. commission report that you would have
seen that said that Israel is committing genocide in Gaza. How do you assess your government's actions in Gaza?
FEINER: I didn't understand that the last sentence. Can you say it again?
SOARES: Of course. We have seen just in the last week in fact a U.N. Commission report that said that Israel is committing genocide in Gaza. How
do you, Captain, assess your government's actions in Gaza?
FEINER: So, usually I don't speak about judicial terms because I'm not a specialist in international law. But what I can say that those decisions of
my government, they are against any moral compass, any human logic of choosing to save lives. And a lot of citizens, thousands of citizens are
paying the prices and being -- and are dying because of air strikes or lack of food and medical supply. And also soldiers and hostages from Israel are
losing the lives because of the decisions of those -- of this government that as I said before are serving only their own narrow interest of those
minority extremists and not the interest of most of the people -- the people -- the majority of the people in Israel.
SOARES: Captain Ron Feiner, thank you very much for taking the time to speak to us. Thank you, Captain.
FEINER: Thank you, Isa.
SOARES: Thank you. And still to come tonight, the political pass of Italy may serve as a warning to the United States. We'll take a look at how Italy
overcame violent political division. That is next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:47:27]
SOARES: Utah Valley University will hold a vigil tonight for the late Charlie Kirk. The conservative podcaster and activist was murdered last
week on the university campus during one of his college tours. Now, the U.S. government is debating whether -- over increasing security for
government officials. Members are also debating proper ways to honor Kirk. Republicans want a resolution honoring Kirk along with an official
condemnation of political violence. However, Democrats say they've already issued those statements.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): That resolution is written very well. I think there's no partisan language in that either. We're honoring someone who
contributed greatly to the free marketplace of ideas and public discourse and who died in a dis disgraceful, horrific manner. It's appropriate for
Congress to make -- to pass a resolution in favor of of his work. He advocated for America and Free Speech and he did it in a -- in a respectful
manner.
REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D-NY): We issued a statement as it relates to political violence in America. The statement speaks for itself. No single
member of the House Democratic Caucus, not a single member, condones political violence in America.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Well, the political violence as well as turmoil in the U.S. is familiar to what we saw in Italy from the 1960s to the 1980s. The country
was hit by political bombings, assassinations, and clashes by opposite ends of the spectrum. Now, those lessons from the past may serve to help the
United States. Our Ben Wedeman with a look back at Italy's years of lead.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And so far, there have been anonymous telephone calls claiming responsibility by both the far-left Red Brigades and the far-right
Armed Revolutionary Nuclei.
BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): They were known as the Anni di Piombo, Italy's Years of Lead. From the late 1960s
until the 1980s, the country was convulsed by bombings, assassinations, kidnappings, and street clashes as extremist factions at opposite ends of
the political spectrum replaced ballots with bullets.
WEDEMAN: In the aftermath of the assassination of right-wing activist Charlie Kirk, Italy's Years of Lead offer a cautionary tale to a United
States increasingly torn apart by political differences.
WEDEMAN (voice-over): Victor Simpson spent four decades covering Italy for the Associated Press.
VICTOR SIMPSON, FORMER ROME CORRESPONDENT, ASSOCIATED PRESS: Yes, there was a very serious rivalry going on between leftists and rightist terrorists
and who could cause the most damage. But you know, Italians are actually very wise people, I always thought, and they kept their heads. The
politicians kept their heads.
[14:50:04]
WEDEMAN (voice-over): In 1978, the far-left Red Brigades kidnapped then murdered five-time former prime minister Aldo Moro. Two years later, far-
right extremists with the Revolutionary Armed Nuclei planted a bomb in Bolognia's train station, killing more than 80 people.
Yet through it all, the leaders of the mainstream parties rejected violence. The center held, says Loyola University's Claudio Lodici,
speaking next to the spot where Aldo Moro's body was found in the trunk of a car.
CLAUDIO LODICI, LOYOLA UNIVERSITY: The center or the parties that were in office, including the Communist Party, stood their ground. There was an
across-the-board consensus that terrorism had to be defeated. It was across the board.
WEDEMAN (voice-over): A consensus that saved Italy from chaos and politicians knew united we stand, divided we all fall.
Ben Wedeman, CNN, Rome.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SOARES: Ben Wedeman there looking back at Italy's Years of Lead.
And still to come tonight, although our exploration of Earth's steep oceans is very limited, we are lucky when it comes to seeing the immense beauty of
our massive waters. See some of wonder after the break. And this is not the wonder, this is a special -- another guest. We'll show you the wonder,
though.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SOARES: Well, as the saying goes, of course, it's 5:00 somewhere. Well, this is important. A new study finds -- this is what we're telling you --
chimpanzees may be going to nature's happy hour, savoring fermented fruit equivalent to one alcoholic drink a day. The study's hypothesis was coined
drunken monkey, even though chimpanzees are actually great apes.
While scientists have known for some time that chimpanzees consume alcohol in their food, the latest research is the first attempt to measure just how
much they actually consume. U.C. Berkeley grad student Aleksey Maro who did the fieldwork says this research should -- research should shed light on
why many humans have a thirst for booze, suggesting our fondness for fermented fun might actually be evolutionary. That would be something.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALEKSEY MARO, GRAD STUDENT, U.C. BERKELEY: Yes. So, it really shows that there's an evolutionary mismatch between how much alcohol we are able to
drink and how we're able to consume it versus how the chimpanzees and potentially our remote ancestors were also consuming alcohol through their
diet.
A lot of animals are eating these fruits out there, and the chimpanzees aren't just competing with one another for fruits, they're competing with
monkeys and birds. And sometimes these other animals will eat the more unripe versions of the fruits ahead of time, so there's all kinds of chaos.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[14:55:36]
SOARES: There you go. And finally tonight, Ladybugs of the Sea is the winner of the Ocean Photographer of the Year Award. Let's show it to you.
Competition organizers say this image shows two tiny amphipods resting on a piece of coral in Bali. It was chosen from a field of more than 15,000
photos submitted by photographers from all over the world.
Nine category winners were also selected, including this image that took the prize in the Adventure Category. And if you look closely, it shows a
personal watercraft navigating the massive waves off the coast of my home country, Portugal. And the prize for the Human Connection Award went to
this photo of a group of people trying to save a stranded humpback whale.
The winning photographs are part of a Ocean Photographer of the Year exhibition. Its first stop is at the Australian National Maritime Museum in
Sydney on November the 6th.
And that does it for us for tonight. Thank you for your company all week. Do stay right here. "WHAT WE KNOW" with Chrissy is up next. Oh, I love the
green.
END
