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Isa Soares Tonight
U.S. Seizes Two More Oil Tankers Linked to Venezuela; President Trump Says He's Not Ruling Out Military Action on Greenland; Trump Administration Lays Out Plans for Venezuela. Woman Shot and Killed by ICE Officers in Minneapolis; Trump to Meet with Oil Executives at WH on Friday; U.S. Seizes Russian-Flagged Oil Tanker; Rubio Outlines Three Phase Plan for Venezuela. Aired 2-3p ET
Aired January 07, 2026 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[14:00:00]
ISA SOARES, HOST, ISA SOARES TONIGHT: A very warm welcome to the show, everyone, I'm Isa Soares. Tonight, the U.S. seizes two more oil tankers
linked to Venezuela as it tries to choke off the country's oil exports. We have the very latest for you this hour.
Plus, President Donald Trump says he won't rule out military action in his mission to take control of Greenland. I'll ask a former U.S. Army commander
what that might look like. And as the White House lays out its plan for Venezuela, I'll get reaction from the region, and from a former top adviser
to ousted President Nicolas Maduro.
But first, tonight, the Trump administration's plan to tighten the U.S. grip on the western hemisphere is moving forward at a breakneck speed, and
sending pretty honestly, shockwaves right across the globe. The U.S. military today seized an oil tanker linked to Venezuela, which it had
tracked across the Atlantic.
That ship was flying a Russian flag, and Moscow is calling the seizure blatant piracy. The U.S. also seized another ship near the Caribbean it
says was stateless and conducting illicit activity. The White House says President Donald Trump is not afraid to seize more tankers, even if that
risks ratcheting up tensions with the Kremlin. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: This was a Venezuelan shadow fleet vessel that has transported sanctioned oil in the United
States of America. Under this President, it's not going to tolerate that.
I would also just add the vessel had a judicial seizure order and the crew -- so that means the crew is now subject to prosecution for any applicable
violation of federal law, and they will be brought to the United States for such prosecution if necessary.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Well, days after claiming control of Venezuela, President Trump is setting his sights again on Greenland. That's amid assertions by
Greenland's Prime Minister that a U.S. takeover would be catastrophic. The White House spokesperson says Mr. Trump is discussing a range of options,
her words, including taking the Danish territory by force or buying it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LEAVITT: That's something that's currently being actively discussed by the President and his national security team. And I would point out that the
acquisition of Greenland by the United States is not a new idea. This is something that presidents dating back to the 1800s have said is
advantageous for America's national security.
The President has been very open and clear with all of you and with the world, that he views it in the best interest of the United States to deter
Russian and Chinese aggression in the Arctic region. And so, that's why his team is currently talking about what a potential purchase would look like.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: I want to get straight out to the White House, and CNN's Kristen Holmes joins me now. And Kristen, we'll speak about Greenland in just a
second. But let me just start with what we heard with the White House press secretary there and the questions focus, of course, on the oil tankers.
On the aspect of those oil tankers that were seized, do we know what happens to the crew and to the oil? And does the administration believe
that this leverage will work against Delcy Rodrguez?
KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: It's not clear that this leverage is entirely all about this tanker. They are using any kind
of economic leverage that they can on Delcy Rodrguez. I mean, what we know now is that those sanctions and the fact that we had been chasing this kind
of shadow fleet and seizing oil from it, has put an enormous amount of pressure on Rodriguez and on the country of Venezuela.
To the point where we heard Secretary of State Marco Rubio discussing and saying that they were almost on the brink of not being able to produce any
more oil because they had their ships filled with oil, because there was no one to come and take that oil there.
And that was part of how this ended up getting negotiated, that 30 to million -- 30 to 50 million barrels of oil that is coming to the United
States. Now, that was oil that had been essentially seized in a way it was waiting to be picked up. But we had stopped anyone from coming in and being
able to actually obtain that oil.
So, that is what they are using against Rodriguez. And when they try to give leverage, it's about the economy. They're talking about sanctions,
rolling back sanctions to put pressure on Venezuela. Now, when it comes to the crew, you heard Karoline Leavitt, the press secretary there talking
about the fact that they will be detained, brought to the United States and prosecuted.
[14:05:00]
And in terms of the financing -- now, this is where there are a lot of questions. We know President Trump has said that the money from the oil
will go to the United States. But what exactly does that mean? Well, we got kind of an idea of this.
We heard Christopher Wright; the Secretary of Energy talking about particularly the 30 to 50 million barrels that are coming to the U.S. now,
not necessarily the tanker, but it does seem to all be linked. He said -- when he was speaking to a conference in Miami, that essentially the U.S.
would control the funding, that they would take the oil, they would sell it to U.S. refineries.
Then they would use the funds, put them into a U.S. government-controlled bank account to eventually go back to Venezuela and to the people of
Venezuela. How that's going to work, what that means by going back to the people of Venezuela, how the United States is going to be determining that,
that is all a very fuzzy question that has not been answered here.
All we certainly know is that the United States is going to be getting the funds from that oil, from selling them to U.S. refineries and to refineries
around the globe.
SOARES: Yes, and I do wonder whether the 13, 50 million, whether that's just the first tranche, right? Because, of course, Venezuela has the
world's largest oil reserves, whether that's just part of the first phase, of course, of whatever has been agreed with the regime.
Let me turn to Greenland, because the White House Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt, was also, Kristen, asked numerous times about Greenland. And she
said that the administration is actively discussing the potential purchase of Greenland.
Where are we, though, on just for our international audience here on the diplomatic front? And what happens if Denmark says no to idea of a
purchase? What next?
HOLMES: Well, Denmark has already said no to the idea of a purchase. This has been floated before in this administration. Denmark has said no. We've
also heard Denmark saying, stop with the threats, leveling that at the United States after we heard President Trump essentially saying they
wouldn't rule out U.S. military on the ground in Greenland.
When you're talking to President Trump's allies, they say that the likelihood of actually putting boots on the ground or doing some kind of
military invasion in Greenland, that was probably not going to be something that happens. But right now, what you're seeing the administration do is a
lot of posturing that, yes, they do want to eventually acquire or buy Greenland.
What that looks like, we don't actually have an understanding of that. We know that the Secretary of State, Marco Rubio, in a closed-door briefing,
told lawmakers essentially to try and calm them because lawmakers have been so upset over this rhetoric about putting boots on the ground or invading a
NATO country or part of a NATO country.
That, that was not something that was really being talked about. This was all about starting point of wanting to purchase or acquire Greenland in a
non-aggressive way.
It's hard, though, to marry those two things when you have someone like Stephen Miller coming up on CNN, who is a huge part of this administration,
who controlled an enormous amount of policy coming out of this White House, saying things like, no one is going to argue with the U.S. military over
acquiring Greenland, using a very kind of strong man approach to this, saying we could threaten them with the military.
Which is something we've seen President Trump do in the past. So, this is obviously making our European allies incredibly uneasy. But it is clear
when you talk to administration officials and allies that, they're not actively making plans to invade Greenland at this point.
With U.S. military, it does more appear as though this is posturing so that they can try and get some kind of leverage over Greenland for what they
want from that country, which, again, is the location they want more access to that area because of its location on the naval corridor between the
Atlantic and the Arctic ocean. And also, those critical minerals, something that President --
SOARES: Yes --
HOLMES: Trump has talked about on a number of occasions.
SOARES: Critical minerals is there, critical minerals that we haven't discussed, but also in Venezuela, that is a story for another day. Thank
you very much, Kristen Holmes, appreciate it. Well, let's get more on the seizure of those two vessels by the United States.
The U.S. Homeland Security Secretary said they were both linked to Venezuela, a Russian-flagged oil tanker, as we told you, formerly known as
the Bella 1, was intercepted after being tracked for weeks, that is, according to a source. It was under U.S. sanctions for allegedly
transporting illicit oil.
And in the past few hours, news broke about the second vessel, that is the Sophia, being seized near the Caribbean. The U.S. Southern Command said it
is considered to be stateless and once conducting illicit activities. Our senior national security reporter, Zachary Cohen is following developments
from Washington.
So, Zach, bring us up-to-date, how -- what we know about those two tankers and how these operate -- this operation actually took place.
ZACHARY COHEN, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER: Yes, the saga involving the Bella 1 really does date back to last month when the U.S.
attempted to initially seize it when it was near Venezuela around the Caribbean, and failed to do so.
U.S. forces tried at that time to board the vessel, but were unable to, and the ship effectively turned around and started heading north.
[14:10:00]
U.S. forces continued to track the ship as it made its way back to essentially where it came from, and ultimately leading up to the seizure
today. But as it was en route or at some point when it turned around, the crew of the ship did something odd, and they painted a Russian flag on the
hull of the ship, essentially claiming that it was flying a Russian flag.
We saw the Russian government subsequently add the ship, the Bella 1 to its official registrar, and asked the U.S. to stop pursuing it. Ultimately
deploying some Naval assets in an effort to protect it from any sort of U.S. interdiction. That clearly did not work as the U.S. special operators
and U.S. forces, along with help from the United Kingdom, seizing this ship today and saying, as you mentioned, it's because it was a sanctioned
vessel.
One that was sanctioned back in 2024 as part of this -- operating as part of this so-called shadow fleet that transports illicit oil around the
world, including to U.S. adversaries like Russia and China. And I think that's really interesting because while it remains to be seen exactly what
was on board this ship once U.S. forces and the Department of Justice get done searching it and returning it back to the U.S.
But -- because we know a core part of the Trump administration's focus following that operation to remove Venezuelan leader Nicolas Maduro is to
clamp down on the illicit flow of oil, and specifically targeting tankers like this that are part of the Shadow Fleet.
The illicit flow of oil, and specifically to China, Russia, Iran and Cuba, these so-called adversaries of the U.S., and you see today, you know,
countries like Ukraine applauding the U.S. move to interdict this vessel, saying that it is the appropriate way to handle Russian sort of actions of
this kind.
And Russia, meanwhile, claiming that the U.S. conducted modern day piracy in doing so. So, there is this concern that actions like this could ramp up
tensions with Russia.
But at the same time, there's this open question as to whether or not this interdiction specifically was maybe more about gaining leverage over Russia
in those -- as it continues to push for a peace deal with Ukraine, rather than increasing pressure or simultaneously increasing pressure on interim
president of Venezuela, Delcy Rodriguez.
Either way, the U.S. making clear that it intends to continue taking actions like this. And as you mentioned, there was a second tanker also
interdicted today, seized in the Caribbean near Venezuela itself. The Homeland Security Secretary, Kristi Noem, saying both vessels were linked
to Venezuela.
So, this focus on the oil industry, this focus on illicit oil flowing out of Venezuela, also impacting the U.S. and the Trump administration's
dealings with other countries, particularly Russia.
SOARES: Yes, and we've just seen the comment from China as well, spokesperson saying bullying acts, calling such bullying acts seriously
breach international law. Of course, China was receiving most of its oil from Venezuela. Thanks very much, Zach, appreciate it.
Well, President Trump is questioning whether NATO allies would help the U.S. if needed. In a Truth Social post, he writes, "Russia and China have
zero fear of NATO without the United States, and I doubt NATO would be there for us if we really needed them."
The President's remarks on the alliance tie in with his renewed interest in Greenland as we've been discussing. The Arctic island is the territory of
Denmark, a fellow member of NATO. Joining us with more insight, retired Lieutenant General Ben Hodges is a former commanding general of U.S. Army
in Europe.
Thank you very much, Lieutenant-General, for coming on the show. Lots of strands for us to talk about as you just heard at the top of the show, both
Venezuela with those oil tankers, but also some of the rhetoric we're hearing from this administration regarding Greenland.
Your thoughts, first of all, on those two Russian-flagged oil tankers that are linked to Venezuela that have been seized by United States. Your
thoughts, your initial thoughts.
BEN HODGES, SENIOR ADVISER, HUMAN RIGHTS FIRST & FORMER COMMANDING GENERAL, U.S. ARMY EUROPE: Well, Isa, first of all, I'm glad to see sanctions
finally being enforced. I mean, there's no point in levying sanctions on Russia or on these vessels if we don't actually do anything about it. And
so, I would applaud that decision so long as it's done in a way that is consistent with international law.
And, of course, I'm proud to see how well the Coast Guard and our U.S. -- our special operators carried out the operation. But it's also worth
remembering, this could not have been done, particularly the one that was seized in the North Atlantic without the assistance of our allies. The
ability --
SOARES: Yes --
HODGES: To fly the special operators into the U.K., and then to be able to launch -- to go out and get these ships. So, allies, it's a lot more than
just spending that helps the United States.
SOARES: Yes, and the U.K. Armed Forces, like you quite rightly said, provided -- I think was operational support. John Healey here in the U.K.,
he said -- the Defense Secretary said here, the ship with a nefarious history is part of a Russian-Iranian axis of sanctions evasion, which is
fueling terrorism, conflict and misery from the Middle East to Ukraine. To your point there.
[14:15:00]
I wonder whether you see this potentially escalating or how -- you know, Russia retaliating in some way. Russia, of course, is one of Venezuela's
long-time allies. Do you see that, and what will that look like? I'm not talking in the region. I'm talking even Ukraine, elsewhere, oil, Europe.
HODGES: Well, you're right. Russia has to do something. They've been humiliated over and over with ships being seized, their inability to help
allies like Venezuela, Syria or Iran. So, I would imagine they're looking for a way to counter somehow.
Most likely what they'll do is increase the number of missile strikes against innocent Ukrainian civilians as they try to lash out, because they
really are powerless to do anything against the United States, and in this case, or the U.K.
SOARES: Let's turn our attention, if I can, to just Greenland, of course. Because as you would have heard, Lieutenant-General, we're seeing the U.S.,
also seems to be pursuing Greenland, a military option is not off the table. But as we have heard today, Secretary Rubio did downplay military
action.
Preferring instead to buying Greenland. How do you read these comments from the administration? Should we take them at their word, given what we have
seen in Venezuela?
HODGES: Well, of course, there's always different voices that come out of any administration, but the one that got my attention the most, of course,
was Stephen Miller the other night --
SOARES: Yes --
HODGES: He is the one that I think is probably the most influential inside the Oval Office. And if he says something like that, I think it probably
more accurately reflects what the President thinks or what the President would want to do. Now, Secretary Rubio, of course, as the Secretary of
State and also as a longtime senator, is going to be more measured.
I would imagine that also, his comments reflect the Senate, the -- his former Senate colleagues in the U.S. Congress finally starting to assert
themselves using their authority from the constitution to challenge or question what the administration is doing. So, I think that probably had
some impact, hopefully, on this ridiculous language --
SOARES: Yes --
HODGES: Implication that the U.S. would use force against an ally.
SOARES: And as you well know, because you are in Erfurt in Germany, that language, and if it's true, that is -- he plays a huge role, that vision,
his vision that is incredibly chilling of course, to many people here in Europe. We know, though, that Greenland has been a long desired of
President Trump for some time.
Clearly, this idea has been crystallized now, further after Venezuela. But their argument that we have heard repeatedly is that, and we heard that
from many people within the administration is a national security interest. I want -- I want to play a little -- a little sound from a former
administration official on this. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
THOMAS SHANNON, FORMER U.S. UNDERSECRETARY OF STATE: What is difficult for the Europeans to understand, our partners, our NATO partners, is that we
already have the tools necessary to protect ourselves, to protect Greenland, and to protect the Trans-Atlantic relationship as we compete
with Russia and China in the Arctic.
And for some reason, the administration has decided that only if we control it in some kind of sovereign sense can the United States actually trust the
nature of that security relationship.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Lieutenant-General Ben Hodges, I mean, when you listen to that, if you're a European leader, listening to the administration, listening to
what we just heard there, how should you take these words? What is your next step?
HODGES: Well, first of all, this is not about security. Just like Venezuela was not about drugs.
SOARES: Yes --
HODGES: Venezuela was about oil. And Greenland, I think is what people believe might be underneath the ice. So, you know, the assertion that
Greenland is covered with Chinese and Russian vessels, just not true. Easily disprovable. The Danes are allies who -- by the way, one of the
closest allies lost a lot of casualties in Afghanistan with us, have welcomed the United States to come in.
And you can grow the bases back that we used to have. We used to have 17 bases there during the cold war. And they've also invited in American
development of the mineral resources. So, we're pushing against an open door. So, why is it that we feel like we have to threaten and own it
versus, you know, doing what we do with so many other European countries that allow us access intelligence sharing.
[14:20:00]
It makes -- it makes no sense unless it's about theater or it's a desire to demonstrate that western hemisphere is ours, we can do whatever we want,
and I think this could end up being one of the biggest own goals in American history.
SOARES: Is -- very briefly, are rare earths a byproduct of, you know, empire building here?
HODGES: Yes, exactly. I mean, the President correctly is worried that China has cornered the market on so much or has control of so much of rare
earth materials that we all need. So, he's correct to look for other sources. But you don't have to threaten a NATO ally to get that. The Danes
and the Greenlanders would love to see American companies come in there and start digging in Greenland.
SOARES: Lieutenant-General Ben Hodges, really appreciate you taking the time to speak to us. Thank you, sir.
HODGES: Thanks for the privilege.
SOARES: And still to come -- you're very welcome. Still to come tonight, Trump administration officials brief U.S. lawmakers on their plans for
Venezuela. We'll go straight to Capitol Hill for you. And then still ahead, with Maduro gone, tanker seized and competing claims of who is in charge?
Venezuela's future is uncertain. We'll ask Maduro's former chief of staff about what comes next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SOARES: Well, lawmakers on Capitol Hill were briefed today on the Trump administration's actions in Venezuela and what comes next. As expected, a
bipartisan -- a partisan split. Democrats lashed out at the White House, while Republicans largely backed the White House.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. ERIC SCHMITT (R-MO): I think it sends a very powerful message to folks around the world, our adversaries around the world, the capabilities
of the U.S. military in support of this law enforcement operation.
SEN. CHRIS MURPHY (D-CT: I heard no detailed plan. Obviously, things are getting more chaotic in Venezuela as the hours proceed. Their plan seems to
be to steal the oil and use the leverage over the oil to try to micro- manage the country on a day-to-day basis. That sounds like a recipe for disaster.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Let's get more from our Manu Raju, who joins us now from Washington. Manu, I saw you pressing members of the administration today on
Venezuela and on Greenland. Secretary Rubio, and I know you've been hearing from lawmakers on both sides.
Let's start first on Greenland. What are the concerns that you are hearing? And are those lawmakers getting any clarity as to a strategy on what
relates to Denmark, which is a NATO country?
[14:25:00]
MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, at this closed-door briefing that happened, two of them happened in the House and
then in the United States Senate. There was actually scant discussion about Greenland that I'm told from senators and House members.
It didn't come up in much detail. This was muchly -- mostly has to do with Venezuela, but does not mean that the issue of Greenland has not been
dominating the discussion here in the capitol. Because of that rather stunning statement that the White House put out last night saying that
military option is on the table when it comes to the President's demands and hopes to acquire Greenland.
And now, in talking to Republicans in particular about it, some of them would be totally fine if Donald Trump went down that route even if it
risked the NATO alliance. Others say it is simply not going to happen, including the Speaker of the House, Mike Johnson.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): We're not at war with Greenland. We have no intention of being with it. We have no reason to be at war with Greenland.
There's a lot of thoughtful discussion to be had there, and that's what we expect is going to happen.
So, all this stuff about military action and all that, I don't -- I don't think it's -- I don't even think that's a possibility. I don't think
anybody is seriously considering that.
RAJU: So then, is it responsible for the White House to continue to raise the specter of military action? They said very explicitly last night --
JOHNSON: I'm not going to -- look, I'm not going to take a thousand gotcha questions this morning, trying to pit me against the White House. It is --
I've said I can't be more clear than I have been on this. I've given lengthy statements on it. You know where I stand.
You know where the House stands. We're going to get a briefing today, and then we'll see how it develops. So, everybody, relax.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
RAJU: But there are some Republicans who are concerned about the rhetoric coming from the administration about Greenland and what it may mean for the
NATO alliance in particular, including one Congressman, Don Bacon, who didn't hold back his criticism against the White House.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. DON BACON (R-NE): Greenland wants to work with us, so does Denmark. There is no reason for these threats and insinuations that will -- that
everything is on the table to include military, it's just wrong. I feel like it's very -- I use this word right now, maybe too much, but very
amateurish. I feel like we've got high school kids playing risk.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
RAJU: And when I asked the Secretary of the State -- of State, Marco Rubio, about this as well, saying, well, why did the White House put out
that statement, saying that the military is an option still? And is it worth the risk of blowing up the NATO alliance if it were to go down that
route of a military operation?
He said, the military option is always, he said, an option for any number of issues, not Greenland specifically. He himself, Isa, not wanting to get
pinned down on this, saying that he was -- this discussion was mostly about Venezuela and that anything dealing with Greenland would be dealt with
diplomatically. He said he is meeting with Danish officials next week on this issue.
SOARES: Very similar to what we heard, of course --
RAJU: Isa --
SOARES: From Karoline Leavitt at the White House. Let me ask you about Venezuela then, because I do wonder whether you got more clarity or
lawmakers got more clarity on the question of strategy, because this is using oil to try and pressure Delcy Rodrguez, the current regime. What
happens then if she resists? Is there a plan?
RAJU: Yes, that is the big question that still was not clear in the aftermath of this briefing. What will happen if Delcy Rodriguez does not
comply with the demands from the United States?
The belief among the administration is that she has no choice but to comply because of how important oil is to the Venezuelan economy and the oil
embargo that the United States has put on Venezuela that ultimately will force her into agreeing with the administration's approach in Venezuela.
But if there is resistance, that is something that I asked a lot of members about, they said it was just not clear exactly what the administration
planned to do in that regard. And some of them also were concerned, too, Isa, about the fact that Delcy Rodriguez is the -- still is the leader of
Venezuela.
Some of the administration is signaling it is willing to work with rather than someone like some other potential replacements of Rodriguez who could
foster a new era of democracy in Venezuela. Potentially, the White House right now is content on her staying in power, at least if she were to
listen to what their demands are.
And that is the hope of the administration that ultimately she will have no choice but to listen to the White House and all the pressure that it is
putting on it. But again, if that doesn't happen, there's a big question of what will happen next? How long will the U.S. stay, and will the U.S. again
engage in military action?
SOARES: Yes --
RAJU: All big questions that still remain here in Washington --
SOARES: Some very big questions -- some very big --
RAJU: Isa --
SOARES: Questions indeed. Manu, thank you very much indeed. Such important sound to hear from these lawmakers there. And still to come, tonight, the
Trump administration plans to sell oil from Venezuela and control the proceeds. And I'll speak to Nicolas Maduro's former chief of staff. His
thoughts on the oil push and the country's future. That is next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:30:00]
SOARES: Welcome back, everyone. Turning now to a story we are following for you out of the U.S. state of Minnesota. We have learned there's been a
shooting involving federal law enforcement officers in the city of Minneapolis. The Department of Homeland Security says a woman has died from
a gunshot. The agency claims the shooting was in self-defense, but the mayor of Minneapolis disputes that.
Joining us now is Josh Campbell. Josh, just tell us what -- just give us a sense of what we know at this hour. What exactly has happened?
JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, we know that ICE agents have been in the Minneapolis area conducting one of the many raids that
we've seen across the country. This all part of the Trump administration's push to target unlawful immigration.
But what just recently transpired, and we got video cleared actually showing this incident, which is disturbing, is that you see there was a
woman in a vehicle who was near a group of federal agents. At one point, they actually approach her vehicle, try to open the door. She then begins
to drive away. An agent that's at the front of that car then opens fire. You can see the vehicle there. Pay attention to the vehicle there on the
right, specifically the front left of that car, where you see that one of the agents will eventually come, open fire again. Again, we'll warn our
viewers that what you're about to see is disturbing.
Now, there will be a question about the judgment of that officer. Under federal policy here in the United States, agents can use deadly force. If
there is an imminent threat to themselves or to another person, they are then allowed to open fire. But as you look at that video, it appears that
there were other options for that agent to move out of the way of that car. What we see instead is that he opens fire, fatally shooting this woman. The
vehicle then travels a short period of time down the road, where it then is involved in a collision. She is later pronounced deceased.
We're still waiting for a lot of details from federal officials. One thing that is notable is that the U.S. Department of Homeland Security has
quickly come out and essentially exonerated the agent who opened fire, the Secretary of Homeland Security calling this domestic terrorism. They
provided no evidence that any of that is actually true in this case, that this was someone who was politically targeting the agent who opened fire.
[14:35:00]
And so, again, we'll have to wait and see where this goes next. We have not seen many U.S. immigration agents in this country prosecuted for excessive
force recently. That may end up being the case here, where prosecutors decide not to hold this person accountable.
But the final point I'll note is that since this has happened, the community there has essentially been left to their own devices. We've seen
multiple protesters come out. We've seen the police, as well as the city's mayor, calling on ICE to get out of their city, using profanity and very
colorful language, telling ICE it's time to go, saying they're inflaming the situation, certainly a powder keg right there, right now in
Minneapolis, Minnesota.
SOARES: It does seem like that at this moment. I saw the mayor also accusing ICE of sowing chaos and distrust. Two questions as we speak to
this video. I'm just going to ask my producer, Elle, to bring that video up again. Do we know from officials -- and I know there's lots of questions we
do not know -- lots of answers we do -- you know, we do not have at this moment. Do we know if the lady inside that car, if she had any weapons,
anything on her or do we know anything about this woman that was shot, that was killed?
CAMPBELL: We don't. We know -- the one thing we do know is that she was not herself the target of an immigration enforcement operation. So, this
was not someone that they were actively seeking. And so, there will be a big question here about why they decided to actually go and approach this
vehicle, try to get her out of the car, and then we see obviously what had transpired.
We don't know about any weapons. I mean, I can tell you as a former law enforcement officer, seeing the posture of those agents as they approached
her vehicle, they did not seem to be tactically concerned that they had already observed some type of weapon or that they were in fear for their
life. It appears that moment comes, the moment that she then turns and starts to drive away, that that is when one of the agents opens fire. You
can see the bullet wound there in the driver's side window of that car.
So, there will be a big question about whether this was within policy. Again, federal agents have wide latitude and using force if they can say
that they felt they were an imminent threat. But you look at the circumstances of that video, it appears there were other options available
for that agent. So, again, we'll have to wait and see where this goes.
Now, there's the legal aspect of it that will play out, but certainly a community aspect as well. And you can imagine that we're going to see more
and more community members coming out protesting against what occurred.
SOARES: Indeed. I know you'll stay across it for us. Thanks very much. Josh Campbell there with the very latest.
CAMPBELL: You bet.
SOARES: We'll stay across this story, this breaking news story for you throughout this hour. Well, the White House says President Donald Trump
plans to meet with U.S. oil executives on Friday to discuss Venezuela. Senior officials, as representatives from Chevron, the only currently
active U.S. company in Venezuela, are among those expected to attend.
This comes as President Trump says Caracas will be turning 30 to 50 million barrels of oil to the U.S. to be sold, he says, at market value. The U.S.
Energy Secretary said earlier today that any cash gained from the sale of Venezuelan oil will be controlled by Washington. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHRIS WRIGHT, U.S. ENERGY SECRETARY: We're going to market the crude coming out of Venezuela first, this backed up stored oil, and then
indefinitely going forward, we will sell the production that comes out of Venezuela into the marketplace.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SOARES: Let's get more of this. Matt Egan joins me now. So, Matt, just add some context for our viewers right around the world. We know that Venezuela
has the world's biggest reserves of oil. 30, 50 is not that much. Is this the first stage in terms of the deal that we're hearing or what do you hear
from the White House? How are you interpreting their words in these deals?
MATT EGAN, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: Yes, Isa. Well, look, I would just stress that this is a fast moving, evolving situation and it is clearly an unusual
one. But White House officials are saying that this is really just the start, right, that there's going to be more transfers of oil coming.
And clearly, while 30 to 50 million barrels of oil, that's only about half of what the world consumes in a day. So, it's not a massive amount as far
as world oil consumption. But you're talking about a country that is only producing about a million barrels per day. So, when you look at it from a
perspective of how much oil Venezuela is producing, it is significant.
Now, oil really is front and center here. We know that Venezuela, their production, as you can see on that chart, it has come down in recent years.
That's because the country's economy has been under so much pressure because the oil industry itself has been decaying from a lack of investment
because the power grid in Venezuela is not working right. They're just having trouble keeping the lights on.
So, clearly, they need more investment. But one of the questions here is whether or not U.S. oil companies are really interested in investing in
Venezuela.
[14:40:00]
And the sense that we're getting from energy industry sources is that there's a lot of reluctance right now, right. I mean, for a number of
different reasons, right. They need to know what was the political system going to be in Venezuela. What is the rule of law going to be? And of
course, how much will they be able to sell that oil for? Because as you know, right now, oil prices are very low, probably too low to justify
investing in Venezuela.
SOARES: Yes. And be interesting to see because obviously years of mismanagement with Chavez and Maduro, but also sanctions played a crucial
role here. Thank you very much indeed for the very latest.
Now, let's -- I want to bring in Temir Porras. He was Maduro's chief of staff from 2007 to 2013 and a former vice minister of foreign affairs. He's
now the managing director of Global Sovereign Advisory. Temir, welcome to the show.
Let me start, if I may, with what we have been hearing from the U.S. administration, which my colleague was just talking about. They're going to
take that the administration is going to take 30 to 50 million barrels of oil and they're going to sell it. We've heard also it is our oil. We've
also heard they're going to run. We're going to run Venezuela. How would that be received? These words being received, you think, by Delcy Rodriguez
and the interim government?
TEMIR PORRAS, FORMER CHIEF OF STAFF TO MADURO (2007-2013), FORMER VENEZUELAN VICE FOREIGN MINISTER AND MANAGING DIRECTOR, GLOBAL SOVEREIGN
ADVISORY: Well, thank you, Isa, for having me. There's certainly been a lot of inflammatory rhetoric coming from Washington after Washington
attacking Caracas. The fact of the matter is that there is the reality of power and the reality of the Venezuelan economy.
The person running Venezuela right now is Delcy Rodriguez. The very fact that the Trump administration made the decision to leave the government in
place after four years trying to sabotage it and to promote a regime change to leave the government in place is the very realization that a country
like Venezuela needs institutions that work, that a country like Venezuela needs stability. And if the U.S. were to run Venezuela independently, they
wouldn't be able to do so. Even the opposition that aspired to seize power in the aftermath of the attack was deemed not capable. Therefore, once
again, there is a reality of power there.
And second, there's also a reality. Venezuela has not been selling oil to the United States, but only as the result of the imposition of U.S.
sanctions. Before U.S. sanctions, the U.S. was the first client of Venezuelan oil. And -- well, it is likely that this situation is going to
change.
SOARES: Right. Then let's talk about Delcy Rodriguez and whether you think, Temir, that she will comply with U.S. demands. She's now the interim
government. She's to her right and to her left. She's got a defense minister. She's got the interior minister, both pretty men who play a huge
role, have played a huge role in the regime.
Do you think that she will walk the line? Do you think that she will be loyal to the United States? And how much will this risk her position within
the regime?
PORRAS: I think that Mrs. Rodriguez, who's a very capable person, she has been a minister of finance, minister of oil, has an extensive, despite
being a relatively young politician, extensive experience, is facing a very harsh situation, which is, again, preserving the unity and the stability of
the country. And that today includes engaging with the United States.
It is also to be said that Mrs. Rodriguez in the past, but also Mr. Maduro, but Mrs. Rodriguez effectively in the past was in charge of the
negotiations with the United States for months and years. She has met U.S. officials during the talks that preceded the attack. So, this is nothing
new. Engaging with the United States is nothing new.
And finally --
SOARES: And let me ask you on that -- Temir, let me ask you, just pick up on that point, just very briefly, because the report suggests that -- and
this is -- there were classified briefings in the United States, that the administration is asking Delcy Rodriguez to shut off -- shut out, pardon
me, Russia as well as China. Will she do it then? I mean, to try and keep the peace, to try and keep her position safe, will she do it? I mean, these
are two of your biggest historical allies here.
PORRAS: Yes, but that doesn't mean that China or Russia are occupying Venezuela. So, she doesn't need to change anything else. There is economic
relations with China. We need to understand what the U.S. administration wants. Do they don't want, I don't know, Chinese products coming from China
to Venezuela? There's Chinese products everywhere in Latin America. And the cooperation with Russia was essentially military.
[14:45:00]
And now, of course, given the U.S. attack, I think that cooperation should be potentially put on a pause. But other than that, the life of Venezuelans
is not affected day to day by China or Russia. It is affected today by the fact that the United States has stricken Venezuela and is threatening to
attack again the country.
So, I think she's a very balanced and wise person and will try to navigate the situation, preserving the stability of the country and, of course,
trying to recover Venezuelan economy. And probably there, there is common ground or a coincidence with the United States. We need also to relaunch
our oil industry. And I trust that she will be focusing in working with U.S. companies to obtain that objective.
SOARES: Temir, I mean, you sound pretty positive about this next transition. You know, the Nicolas Maduro, who you worked for, was picked up
in the middle, in the early hours of the night from his bed. I wonder why you think -- why you are so positive with this transition? Do you worry at
all that this may not be as well received by the Venezuelan people who are increasingly anxious about what this may mean? Because Maduro is gone, but
the regime still stands.
PORRAS: Well, first, I'm outraged that my country was bombed. I have a family, to give you an example, a bomb destroyed the Faculty of
Mathematics, the Department of Mathematics of the Venezuelan National University. So, no, I'm not happy at all about the situation.
Nonetheless, I -- caring about the stability of my country, I am happy that our political leaders are taking the decisions that refrain, or at least
put a check on the willingness of the United States to further bomb Venezuela.
SOARES: But they're not taking the decision -- Temir, they're not taking the decision, they're being forced.
PORRAS: Well, when you have an army at your borders, of course, the scope of your strategic movements is limited. But once again, the internal
decisions that the government is taking, in my opinion, once again, have two constituencies, the national constituency, and yes, addressing the
problems of the Venezuelan people, and then power that is trying to occupy the country.
And I think that the Venezuelan citizens understand this. Of course, nobody is comfortable with that, but that is the reality. We're dealing with a
government that is threatening the world. It is threatening Venezuela, but it's also threatening Greenland. And we have paid the price of the Trump
administration's policy.
So, I believe that our leadership in Venezuela is showing maturity and balance in the movements they're making. And of course, they are trying to
deal with the demands of the United States in an effective way that doesn't harm the interests of the Venezuelan people.
SOARES: Well, let's see whether maybe they can start by releasing some of the political prisoners. That would be a first step, an important step of
course --
PORRAS: The U.S. administration has never asked for that.
SOARES: No, they haven't asked for that, but that's --
PORRAS: The Trump administration is not asking for that.
SOARES: I understand. But if you're serious about transition and equality for the Venezuelan people, maybe that is the next step. Temir Porras,
really appreciate it. Thank you very much indeed.
We're going to take a short break. We'll see you on the other side.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:50:00]
SOARES: U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio is outlining the Trump administration's plans for Venezuela. Secretary Rubio said the
administration is planning three phases for the country. Those include stabilization, recovery and transition.
Stefano Pozzebon is in neighboring Colombia. Stefano, you know Venezuela very well. A plan, but very few details.
STEFANO POZZEBON, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: A plan with very few details, but we're starting to see the effects of that plan already shaping in front of our
eyes in the streets of Caracas or in the offices behind closed doors where everything is happening.
Let me take you there, Isa. There are two things happening at the same time right now in Caracas, and one is the rhetoric and the other is the action.
So, the rhetoric is still the fact that Venezuela is demanding the release of Nicolas Maduro and Cilia Flores, his wife. Right now, hundreds of pro-
Maduro, pro-government supporters are rallying once again in the streets of Caracas demanding an end to this imperialistic attack and the return of
their former commander-in-chief. And that is the rhetoric that will never go away from Caracas.
But behind closed doors, the action. A statement a few minutes ago from the Venezuelan oil company, PDVSA, confirming that they are currently holding
"a negotiation," and I'm quoting them, a negotiation to sell some of their crude oil directly to the United States. In that statement, they pointed
out that that negotiation is similar to when PDVSA sells the oil to a private enterprise, for example Chevron or other international oil
companies that are active in Venezuela, only that in this case they are conducting the sale negotiation directly with members of the Trump
administration, with public employees, officers representing the state of the United States.
That is clearly a difference from what is happening on the streets. So, you see the rhetoric once again demand the return, but the real action is that
we're all happy to make deal with you and make business with you, Mr. Trump.
SOARES: Stefano Pozzebon for us in Bogota. Thank you, Stefano. We're going to take a short break. We'll see you on the other side.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:55:00]
SOARES: Well, a quick update on our breaking news out of the U.S. city of Minneapolis. Protesters and police have been gathering at the scene of a
fatal shooting that happened a short time ago. The Department of Homeland Security claims a protester tried to run over an immigration officer who
then fired his gun in self-defense. The mayor of Minneapolis denies the claim and is demanding an investigation. Lots of questions this hour on
this breaking news story.
That does it for this hour. But my colleague, Max Foster, "What We Know" will continue on top of that breaking news.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:00:00]
END
