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Isa Soares Tonight
Talks to Begin Between Government and Opposition; Novelist Andrew Sean Greer Discusses "Villa Coco"; U.S. Senate Republican McConnell Says He's Been Discharged from Rehabilitation Center. Aired 2:00-3p ET
Aired August 06, 2026 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[14:00:00]
ISA SOARES, HOST, ISA SOARES TONIGHT: A very warm welcome to the show, everyone, I'm Isa Soares. Tonight, Iran and Oman edge closer to a deal to
reopen the Strait of Hormuz. But Tehran says it won't sign until it gets guarantees from the U.S., which far -- by far, which is not certain,
really. We'll be live from Washington for you.
Then a report from Lebanon, as communities there try to rebuild despite Israeli attacks. Plus, the U.S. Justice Department considers whether to
charge one of the most recognizable faces in modern medicine. More on why six years on, COVID-19 is still dividing U.S.
But first, tonight, we begin with a possible deal between Iran and Oman over the Strait of Hormuz, one that would not involve the United States.
Now Iran and Oman appear to be on the verge of a major agreement on a shipping route in the Strait.
But Tehran is stressing that Washington must meet additional conditions before the vital energy checkpoint can be completely reopened. Meantime,
U.S. President Donald Trump is disputing reports the Pentagon is running low on munitions and insists the U.S. has, quote, "massive amounts of
ordnance".
CNN was among those reporting earlier this week, if you remember, the U.S. had exhausted 80 percent of its interceptors for a key missile defense
system. So, let's go to our Kevin Liptak, who joins us now from the White House.
And, Kevin, we'll talk about that 80 percent and the massive amounts of munitions that the President said in just a moment. But first, let me start
with what we've heard from Iran clearly laying out its demands to reopen the Strait of Hormuz. And these -- if we go through them, they read a bit
like the Memorandum of Understanding, which was signed back in June and then broken. How is the U.S. administration responding to Iran's demands?
KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Well, they are not taking them off the table entirely. They do seem open to at least some of what
Iran is spelling out here. You know, lifting the Naval blockade, as you said, that was included in the Memorandum of Understanding.
It was lifted once the President signed that, but it went back into place once Iran began firing on vessels. And so, there is precedent for the
President to take that off. They're also asking to lift the sanctions that went back on after the President pulled out of the Memorandum of
Understanding.
So, both of those provisions are things that the President has already agreed to in the past. And because we know, of course, the President is
eager for a diplomatic off-ramp here. I don't think that those conditions are necessarily going to scuttle this entirely.
I think if there is a wrench that is thrown in all of this, it will be what conditions Iran puts on the vessels that are going through the Strait, at
least on its side of the Strait. So, do they apply a fee of any kind, even if it's not a toll per se, do they apply an environmental fee or a security
fee?
That would, I think, be a nonstarter for President Trump. Also, do they have to approve which vessels go through? That's something that I think the
American side will have a difficult time swallowing, because it will, I think, cement the fact that Iran does have control over the Strait in a way
that they did not before the war began.
And that is where I think the comparison will be very difficult for President Trump if he is going to seize upon this diplomacy to get the war
over with. It's almost certain that Iran now having shown its ability to control this very critical waterway, isn't necessarily going to give that
up easily.
And so, it will require some political massaging on the part of the President to cast whatever is agreed to here as a political victory. You
can bet that they're working on that behind the scenes. As of now, there's no deal in place, nothing on the table that's finalized.
But just given what we know about where the President's head is, his reluctance, despite the threats to begin the war again anew, I think it's
likely that this agreement will go through. It will just depend on how each side is describing it, to see sort of how solidly it will be able to
remain.
[14:05:00]
SOARES: Yes, and meantime, and I mean seeing this, President Trump has been firing back today or late yesterday at reports that U.S. munitions
stockpiles are running low after months, of course, of those punishing attacks you were talking about there on Iran, Kevin. What do we know at
this hour about where the U.S. arsenal stands?
LIPTAK: Well, it is getting smaller. And I think if even if you're looking sort of between the lines of what the President is saying, he is tacitly
acknowledging that. He's saying that the people who are leaking this information are treasonous.
You know, I don't think it's illegal to leak false information. And so, he is implicitly confirming that this is a worry that he and other officials
have. Now, what we have reported is that the U.S. has gone through about 80 percent of the THAAD missile interceptors.
They've gone through about half of the Patriot missile interceptors. That is a remarkable burn rate. And I think when you look at what the
administration is trying to do to remedy that, it's going to potentially take years and years.
You know, the President is saying that some of these defense contractors are starting to build factories to produce these weapons. Well, that is a
measure that is measured in many years. They are not going to build a factory in six weeks and suddenly start producing Patriot interceptors.
And so, this is a worry not just in the United States, but it's a worry in the Gulf as well, because if the President decides to escalate, if Iran
retaliates, they will also rely on these weapons to defend themselves.
And so, that's part of the reason why you've seen, you know, the leader of Saudi Arabia, the leader of Qatar, all get on the phone with the President
over the last week to encourage him to go down the diplomatic route to deescalate the conflict because they know that the dwindling supplies will
affect their security as well.
SOARES: Yes, indeed, the implications are huge. Kevin Liptak, good to see you, Kevin. Thank you very much indeed. Well, an Israeli official says a
third round of talks with Lebanese officials in Rome has now concluded. This comes as Israel ramps up strikes on southern Lebanon, saying it's
going after Hezbollah.
Israel accuses Hezbollah of violating a tenuous ceasefire. It reports two Israeli soldiers were killed by an explosive device on Wednesday. CNN's
Nada Bashir has more on how the airstrikes in Lebanon are affecting civilians trying to rebuild. Have a look.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NADA BASHIR, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Clearing the debris of a home now turned to rubble, the result of a months-long Israeli military assault
on southern Lebanon. "When the shelling started, my family fled", Abu Ali says. "And when I returned, everything was destroyed."
His family fled the village of Zawtar, which overlooks the Litani River, in February, and have only now been able to return following the withdrawal of
Israeli forces. Inside what remains of their home, the remnants of this war lay scattered.
"Israeli bullets", he tells us. Walls completely blown out, bullet holes above where his grandchildren once slept. "We want calm. We want security.
We want a state", he says. "We want to be protected by the military. We don't want to fight. But if Israel attacks us, we will attack them."
Abu Ali is far from alone. Among the more than a million people displaced from their homes by the war in Lebanon, Issam Hashem(ph) says he and his
family of four returned to their village as soon as the military gave them the all clear.
After months spent sheltering in a school in Beirut. "Take a look at this scene. The destruction. The Israelis were sleeping here in this room",
Issam(ph) says. "They even left behind their food and water." Through shattered glass and concrete, Issam(ph) takes us to what was his children's
bedroom.
Out in the distance, he says, Israeli tanks are still positioned. "You can see them right in front of us, just a few 100 meters away", he says. Across
Zawtar, the scars of this deadly conflict remain. Homes left crumbling; neighborhoods deserted.
This monastery, now bullet-ridden and desecrated. The scale of the destruction here is reflected across southern Lebanon, and the recovery
process could take years. While members of this community work to rebuild homes and restore critical infrastructure, some wounds are more difficult
to heal.
Many have lost their livelihoods. "Most of the residents here depend on agriculture. There was a harvest season right before the war started.
People fled and left it behind." Abed Ezzeldine; the mayor of West Zawtar, says.
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"I believe there is a big percentage of farms that are not fit for farming anymore due to shelling and airstrikes." For many, this is not the first
time they've been forced to flee their homes, nor the first time they have returned to find utter destruction.
Locals here know just how fragile a ceasefire can be, and how quickly everything can change. And while some say, they are putting their trust in
the Lebanese Army to protect them, others say they remain faithful in their support for another military force, Hezbollah.
The Iran-backed political and military group has long dominated in the south. "I'm proud that my husband, a fighter who defended his land, was
martyred in his village." Israa Schroyer(ph); a mother and now widow, tells us. She and her children fled the border village of Tair Harfa in October
2023.
Their community coming under intense Israeli bombardment after Hezbollah launched a series of attacks on Israel in solidarity with the people of
Gaza. "War with Israel", she says, "has impacted generations of her family. No stranger to Israeli occupations of the past.
They killed my grandfather. My father was a prisoner of war", she says. "All my uncles were tortured. My entire village suffered." Now, Israa(ph)
says she is determined to carry on the struggle. "Eventually, we will return to our village, and if we don't, then our children will return. And
if they don't, our grandchildren will." Nada Bashir CNN in London.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SOARES: Well, another deadly night of Russian strikes on Ukraine, killing at least six people, according to Ukrainian officials. Homes in eastern
Ukraine, as well as in the northern region of Sumy, were among the areas that were hit. That's as Lithuanian Intelligence officials warn against a
new threat.
They say they believe Russia could soon use captured Ukrainian-made drones to provoke NATO members in the Baltic region. We'll stay across that story,
of course, for you. Over in Greece, a 26-year-old man, Afghan man accused of killing a Scottish aid worker has appeared in court.
The suspect, who cannot be named under Greek law, is reportedly a boxer who competed in Greece. He was arrested on Sunday, charged with the murder of
38-year-old Elisabeth Ross in Athens. Her body was found in a suitcase at an abandoned construction site on July 18th.
The suspect denies he killed her. So, let's go to -- we're going to go to Greece in just a moment, but we're going to try and see if we can do the
connection. In the meantime, we'll take a short break. Why not?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
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SOARES: Welcome back, everyone. Last week, he exercised his constitutional right to remain silent. Now, the man who was once America's most prominent
health official faces the possibility of a criminal indictment that could include jail time.
A U.S. Senate committee voted today to hold Dr. Anthony Fauci in contempt of Congress for his refusal to answer questions about his handling of the
COVID pandemic. For years, Republicans have attacked Fauci for his leadership during the health crisis and his role in the lockdowns.
Democrats accused Republicans of grandstanding and attacking science. The committee now plans to refer Fauci to the Justice Department for potential
prosecution. Let's go to our Stephen Collinson who has been on this story. And Stephen, we'll get to the bigger picture in just a moment.
But just explain to our viewers what happens now once Senator Paul sends the referral to the DOJ, what will Todd Blanche do and what tests, major
tests are we facing here legally?
STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN POLITICS SENIOR REPORTER: Well, this Justice Department under Donald Trump has shown a great appetite for prosecuting
people who get --
SOARES: Yes --
COLLINSON: On the wrong side of the President. And I think that's the big worry. And that tells you why Fauci, in a hearing last week, took the Fifth
Amendment to avoid self-incrimination because he was worried, even though he had an official pardon from President Biden for actions taken under the
previous administrations.
He was worried that the members of the committee would try to catch him in an inconsistency when he was testifying under oath, and then prosecute him
for perjury. Now, the administration has the option to prosecute him for not testifying to Congress.
The previous Biden administration prosecuted several former Trump officials from his first-term for the same reason, and they went to jail. So, Dr.
Fauci is in some legal threat here. So, I think given what we know about the Trump Justice Department, we could expect them to open an investigation
fairly quickly.
SOARES: Right. So, let's get to the wider aspect of this story, because I was -- I was reading your latest piece for CNN.com in which you write --
I'm going to read part of it. "The hearing was a classic Washington melodrama in which each party zeroes in on a larger-than-life personality
to grind ideological axes."
You then go on to say, "but more importantly, the new Fauci saga is a clarifying moment regarding COVID-19 still potent political legacy heading
into the 2026 and 2028 elections." So how so? How may it be? Just explain that.
COLLINSON: So, conservatives are still getting energy from their base, from attacking the scientific and government and elites in Washington who
they argue, suppress the freedoms of Americans during the COVID pandemic with what they argue were unnecessary shutdowns of businesses, of cities,
and prolonged period of time when schools were closed.
Which now we're starting to see some of the very negative impacts on that, on America's young people. Democrats, of course, are quite happy to talk
about the pandemic because that reminds voters of the erratic and unsuccessful management of the pandemic by President Trump in his first
term, which actually helped to lose him the 2020 election.
So, both sides have an incentive here for carrying on this argument. And Democrats are also trying to draw the connection between Trump's
mismanagement of the pandemic and his second term crackdown on academics, on research, on his Health Secretary Robert Kennedy Jr., who has cast doubt
on the efficacy of vaccines, which is quite popular with a small part of the Republican base, but actually horrifies a lot of more moderate voters.
So, both sides here have political incentives to keep this going.
SOARES: Stephen, thank you very much for laying it all out for us, we shall see where this goes. Stephen Collinson there for us --
COLLINSON: Thanks --
SOARES: In Washington. Well, President Trump is using vulgar language to lash out at Michigan's new Democratic Senate nominee, we were talking about
him, of course, on the show yesterday -- just hours after Abdul El-Sayed's primary win, the President accused him of being a, quote, "hater of Jews
and a hater of Israel".
On Wednesday, El-Sayed reached out to Jewish voters, calling them his sisters and brothers and promising a commitment to their safety. The big
challenge now for the 41-year-old candidate is to work on uniting the Democratic Party.
[14:20:00]
Michigan is a must-win for Democrats as they battle to win a Senate majority this November. Of course, that's what they will be up for. El-
Sayed will be going up against Republican former Congressman Mike Rogers. Our Kaitlan Collins spoke about it with Abdul El-Sayed.
She spoke with him yesterday about his narrow primary win, and how he plans to ensure a victory in November. This is what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR & CORRESPONDENT: This seat is so critical for your party to win control of the Senate in Washington. We've heard some
Democrats who are worried that you cannot defeat Mike Rogers come November. How do you plan to address those concerns from people in your own party?
ABDUL EL-SAYED, DEMOCRATIC SENATE CANDIDATE: We don't need worry, we need work. You know, we took on $70 million of outside spending and 11 to 1
funding gap -- spending gap on the airwaves. And we took it on because we did the work.
Twelve thousand people knocking nearly 10,000 doors a day. We started this campaign 15 months ago, having conversations in rooms of 5 or 50 people at
a time. And so, that's how we're going to beat Mike Rogers, the old- fashioned way, brick-by-brick.
So, if you're worried right now, get to work. That's the work that we need to do. And I can tell you on our campaign, we're going to be out there
knocking doors, having those conversations that are what our democracy is about.
But worrying and Democrats worrying is not going to solve the problem. You heard Donald Trump at the top of this show. This is a guy who can't even
focus on our affordability. He's more interested in saying my name in an interesting way, or calling me a lovely gentleman, than he is interested in
actually solving our problems.
We have to stand up to that, which means let's go get to work. Let's go talk to our fellow Michiganders about who we are and who we want to be, and
what it takes to take on the most corrupt president in American history, and his lackey who licks every boot he possibly can of that man, Mike
Rogers.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Well, I want to take you back to Greece. I promised you that I would. We were telling the story about a 26-year-old-man, Afghan man who's
been accused of killing a Scottish aid worker. Her body was found in a suitcase at an abandoned construction site on July 18th.
The suspect denies killing her. Let's go to our Elinda Labropoulou, who is joining us from Parga, Greece. So, Elinda, just talk us through, first of
all, what this 26-year-old man has been accused of and what authorities are telling us has occurred.
ELINDA LABROPOULOU, JOURNALIST: Well, so far today, he's been charged with murder, robbery and firearms-related offenses. It is a very strange story
what we saw in Athens, Isa, basically, this was discovered. The incident was discovered on the 18th of July when someone found in a derelict
building a large suitcase.
He called the police and they found the body of a woman in it. As you can understand, this obviously shook everybody. It's an incredibly unusual
thing to see. And then, you know, the story started unfolding. Basically, the body of the woman that was discovered was that of an aid worker.
And then CCTV footage appeared showing a man who's wheeling the large suitcase. And this man has been identified as the suspect that was in the
court today. Now, he denies the charges of actually murdering her. He said that he went to the flat to meet with her and found her dead.
Meanwhile, the other lead that we have into this story is actually his wife. His wife said that the man was on the 15th of August through a
tracking device that they both shared through an app, she found out that he was in that flat, something that he had not shared with her.
And when the news of this woman's death came out, she went to the police and reported it herself. So, these are the two main leads that the police
had to get to this man. And as the story has been evolving, a number of other strange details have been emerging.
Basically, it looks like her phone had been used even after her death and until the suitcase was found to send messages to people, basically saying
that she needed time, she needed to be by herself and basically pushing people off just so her death would not become known.
The man in question denies killing her. He says that now he wants his lawyer to look into the case further. He's asking for further tests,
further toxicology tests, because he's trying to prove that perhaps she was dead when he went into the flat to meet with her.
SOARES: Do we -- I mean, that video that we're just playing of the CCTV, Elinda with the suitcase, it gives me chills as you were talking and we
were watching that. Do we know, Elinda, whether how they knew each other, the man, the man and the Scots woman. So, do we -- do we know the
connection between Elisabeth Ross and him?
[14:25:00]
LABROPOULOU: Yes, there appears to be a possible work connection. The man came into Greece in 2016 as a refugee through the island of Lesbos. This
was a time that a lot of refugees were coming into Greece. He spent some time on the island.
It appears that this is where he met his future wife, who was there as an aid worker. The two of them got married in 2023. They moved to Athens; they
formed an NGO in Athens that was also helping refugees. And through their work, they came across the aid worker in question, Elisabeth.
The wife, in her testimony to the authorities, said that they had both met the woman in question. And once she heard that she was dead and then, you
know, put things together, basically that her husband was in that flat just three days before the suitcase was found.
That's when she started getting worried. She said that he had been acting quite strange recently when she spoke to authorities and, that's why she
wanted to let them know because she really didn't feel comfortable with him anymore. And this is how, you know, the story was eventually discovered.
SOARES: Yes, the wife clearly seems like playing a key role, of course, on this investigation. Elinda, thank you very much. Elinda Labropoulou, good
to see you, Elinda, thank you. And still to come tonight, face-to-face. But can they see eye-to-eye?
New discussions over the future of Venezuela between the ruling party and the opposition. But one key figure is missing.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SOARES: Welcome back, everyone. Forging a new chapter for Venezuela. Talks are set to begin over the future of the country's political system, with
the aim of preparing for elections. The government side is being led by Jorge Rodriguez; the head of the National Assembly and brother of acting
President Delcy Rodriguez.
Opposition figure Dinorah Figuera, you can see there, is also attending the U.S.-backed discussions. Not present, as you can see from that footage,
opposition leader and Nobel Prize winner Maria Corina Machado. There are questions, many questions, over how -- just how much support she still has
from Washington.
[14:30:00]
Let's get more on this. Journalist Mary Triny Mena joins us now live from Caracas. Mary Triny, great to see you. Look, I was speaking to a Venezuelan
analyst this morning who sounded, if I can say honestly, pretty skeptical about these talks, primarily because Maria Corina Machado isn't there. So,
what can we expect realistically?
MARY TRINY MENA, JOURNALIST: Yes, and if you ask people here in Caracas, Isa, that those are the words that are most frequent for people to say.
There are doubts and they are skeptical about the results of this new set of talks, because it's not the first time that opposition figures and
government authorities sit on the same table. In the past, the government has been using the dialogue and the negotiations before elections or to de-
escalate conflicts in the country.
So, right now, the main goal here is to focus on objectives, on key specific objectives, such as provide humanitarian aid for the victims of
the earthquakes that struck Venezuela back in June, and also to rebuild key institutions. And this is fundamentally here because they are talking about
reforms in the Supreme Court, in the electoral board.
We need to remember that Venezuela has an absence of the mandatory since January, considering that Nicolas Maduro was took out of the country by
U.S. security forces and then presented in front of a U.S. court to press - - to face federal charges. So, right now, there's an absence of a leadership in the country.
Unlike the U.S., Delcy Rodriguez, which is the vice president and now the interim president, according to the U.S., was not elected. In the U.S., the
vice president is elected along with the president, but Delcy Rodriguez was not elected, was appointed by Maduro, and then was backed by the U.S. Right
now, analysts consider that these conversations could be slightly different, considering the leverage that the U.S. has on Delcy Rodriguez's
administration.
SOARES: Right. So, let's talk about that, because I think that's really interesting, because these are, this is an important point that you made,
these are U.S.-led talks, Mary Triny, Secretary Rubio has said that these talks will mark the beginning of what he called the transition process.
President Trump has sounded less optimistic, saying the country is not ready for that.
How does Delcy Rodriguez interpret then these negotiations and these conversations? What has the government been putting out, either her or
indeed her brother?
MENA: Well, the government has set an agenda focusing on, for example, the aid that the victims of the earthquakes require. And that is a point that
the opposition said is something that you have to do, because you are the government, you have to handle that crisis.
But they are adding new topics. They are using these conversations in order to stay in power as much as possible. They say the country is not right now
at the point of having an eventual presidential election. And they are saying basically what -- or replying what the U.S. government is saying.
They have the same speech when they talk about elections in the country. They say it will come eventually, but we are not at this point - at that
point right now.
SOARES: Let me get -- whilst I have you here, Mary Triny, I want to get your thoughts about what we've heard from President Trump and how he may be
received in Venezuela. Because I think it was in the last 24 hours, President Trump said something on the lines, you know, we've taken billions
and billions of barrels of oil coming out, we've taken from Venezuela. And then he -- you know, he said, the victor, the spoils.
When I was in Venezuela in Caracas with you, post of course the back-to- back earthquakes over a month ago, the mood was somewhat souring over the U.S. role, the U.S.'s role in Venezuela. What is -- what are you hearing
from Venezuelans? Are they feeling the benefit of Maduro's exit?
MENA: Well, it's hard to say for an average Venezuelan that they are happy that they are dancing in the streets, as President Trump keeps saying often
in the U.S., because many people here are suffering from issues that are not resolved yet.
[14:35:00]
Most importantly, the economic area, the price of the dollar in comparison with the bolivar, which is the local currency, is depreciating -- it's
faced a depreciation every day. So, the money that they receive for the jobs is not enough. And they don't feel that in that area that has been
improved. And also, in basic services, such as water, electricity, Venezuelans are facing scarcity of electricity in many places for more than
five hours. So, that is a complex situation.
And despite the good review that Donald Trump gave on the Venezuelan progress, it does not feel quite here in the country.
SOARES: Mary Triny, I really appreciate you being with us. Good to see you, my friend. Thank you, Mary Triny, there live for us in Caracas.
Well, let's get more now on how Venezuela's political landscape might unfold. Will Freeman is a fellow for Latin American Studies at the Council
on Foreign Relations. He joins us now. Will, good to have you on the show. I'm hoping that you were hearing what Mary Triny was saying there for us in
Caracas, very much in line to some of the conversations I had.
I was speaking, excuse me, to a former U.S. ambassador who told me today, and I'm going to quote him here, "These talks are a pantomime that aren't
going anywhere. The purpose, give the appearance of U.S. concern about return to democracy." Does he have a point? I mean, what are you expecting?
WILL FREEMAN, FELLOW FOR LATIN AMERICA STUDIES, COUNCIL ON FOREIGN RELATIONS: It's a real and a valid concern. Many people expected this kind
of pressure or towards negotiations towards a real transition to democracy to come immediately after the capture of Nicolas Maduro in January.
So, some are wondering, why has it taken us this many months to get here? Why is President Trump praising the interim president of Venezuela, Delcy
Rodriguez, who still comes from authoritarian regime? Why is Maria Corina Machado, the undisputed leader of the opposition who won those elections
that the regime tried to manipulate in 2024? Why is she not at the table? And so, these are all real questions hanging over the process.
That said, if you look at history of South America, I mean, most dictatorships in the region in the last 40 or 50 years that lost power,
they did so through negotiations. So, I think that we can't count out the idea of negotiations here. I mean, they are essential. They're probably the
only way that Venezuela ever has a shot at getting back to democracy.
But yes, there are real questions about whether or not the Trump administration is pursuing this in good faith, with pressure in the right
places, including the right people at the table. That's all valid.
SOARES: Right. And the point of negotiations, look, according to America's Quarterly, over the past 27 years, Venezuela has seen at least 17 dialogue
initiatives between Chavismo and the opponents. Some, yes, yielded some results, like the release of political prisoners and kind of modest
electoral reforms, but really haven't rocked the boat so much.
So, questions of what would, if you are on Maria Corina Machado's team, what would you be trying to get out of this?
FREEMAN: Well, first, I try to make sure that I'm included in these discussions, right, which the regime in Venezuela has an obvious incentive
to resist, right? They want to be negotiating with parts of the opposition they feel are more pliable or that they don't present such a risk to them,
right? But first, I would try to make sure that this is genuinely inclusive dialogue.
You know, second, in addition to that, I would try to make sure that there is a credible, independent electoral authority. That's key, right, because
Venezuela, you know, had elections. They had elections under Hugo Chavez and under Nicolas Maduro, but those elections were repeatedly undermined by
a government-aligned electoral authority. So, I'd make sure that you have genuinely independent referees there.
And also, of course, make sure that you have guarantees of the release of remaining political prisoners and that you have a commitment that's
observed from the government to not take any new political prisoners, right, to give up intimidating the press, opposition politicians, et
cetera, and voters most of all, so that when there are new elections, these really occur under free circumstances. So, I'd make sure that that's -- all
of that's in place.
SOARES: Yes. It's not clear, is it? It hasn't been clear, at least I haven't heard it, a sort of strategy, because we heard, as you heard me
talking to Mary Triny, Secretary Rubio was saying this is the beginning of transition process, but then President Trump says the country's not ready
yet to hold elections. You know, we're seven months, I think, seven months since Maduro was captured. It's not clear what the strategy is and what the
process is. So, hopefully that will shed some light.
There is another thing, though, Will, and I'm hoping that you can shed some light on this. There's the element of the Venezuelan oil and who's
benefiting. People, as you heard from Mary Triny there in Caracas, are really not feeling their lives improving financially.
[14:40:00]
I want to play a little clip from what we've heard from President Trump regarding this. Have a listen and we can talk afterwards.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: We're taking a lot of oil from Venezuela and we're getting along great with them. Billions and billions of barrels of
oil is coming out of Venezuela. It's one of the most fertile places for oil in the world. And as you know, it was a 48-minute war, lasted 48 minutes.
And we paid for the war with what we've taken out many, many, many times. Where have you heard that before? You haven't heard that before. It's the
old-fashioned way, right? It's the old-fashioned way. To the victor belong the spoils.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: So, Will, to the victor belong the spoils. Does that sound like this administration's pushing for a democratic and equitable future for
Venezuela, in your view?
FREEMAN: It raises really serious questions, right? I mean, this has been very opaque from the beginning. It's unclear exactly where these oil
revenues are going, right? Who they're going to benefit? But look, I think on the other hand, you want some kind of economic reconciliation between
the U.S. and Venezuela. Obviously, not on those terms, on the U.S. taking the spoils, but the kind of sanctions regime that had been in place before,
and much of which still remains in place, that was really destructive to the Venezuelan economy.
So, you want a situation where the two sides can move away from that, right, and have normal economic relations. So, I hope that this is a first
step towards that. Of course, if it becomes perpetual, and it's just the United States acting as essentially a tollbooth on Venezuelan oil, and
perhaps diverting much of the profits away from Venezuela, that would be extremely concerning.
SOARES: Yes, and concerning indeed. Will, really appreciate you taking the time to speak to us. Will Freeman there for us from Minneapolis. Thank you,
Will.
And still to come tonight, our latest book club guest, Andrew Sean Greer. His novel, "Villa Coco," is a witty and heartfelt tale of a young
American's arrival to Tuscany, and all that unfolds while he's there. And that's quite a lot. That's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SOARES: Joining our book club today is Andrew Sean Greer with "Villa Coco." Welcome to the show.
ANDREW SEAN GREER, AUTHOR, "VILLA COCO": Thank you for having me.
SOARES: This is such a joy of a book. It's charming. It's full of heart. It's a story, I'm not going to give too much away, of a young American who
is kind of down, right, about his life or where he is right now.
[14:45:00]
He's just graduated from college or what we call here university, and he is broke, has no clear direction in his life, and then takes up this job in
Tuscany as an archivist, right, cataloging the possessions of a 92-year-old woman called Coco. She's also called Lisabetta, who we'll talk about in a
minute. She's just phenomenal.
Can I ask, first of all, where this idea came from? Was it Tuscany that came to you first or was it the characters that came to you first, Andrew?
GREER: Tuscany came to me first because I'd lived there for two years, and I was first thinking about, I wanted to write the kind of book you're
talking about, something where readers come into a bookstore and say, do you have something to take me away from all this? And I thought --
SOARES: Sort of escape?
GREER: Yes, I wanted to escape myself, and I realized I had this material of this place I'd lived, and then the people I'd met, and then you start
inventing and having fun.
SOARES: So, break that down a bit for us, because the main, the male character, the archivist, which we, whose name, you know, we only found out
-- I only found out much later on in the novel, he does very little in terms of archiving, right?
GREER: Yes.
SOARES: Very early on, he looks after the pugs, the olive trees, the crumbling villa, which has got a sewage problem going on as well, which I
loved it, it was so well depicted. But what I was, what I found interesting is, what aspects of that Tuscany lifestyle did you take away from your time
living in Italy? How much of that was created in your imagination? How much of that was a lived experience?
GREER: Well, I think my lived experience was the shock of being an American, and I know things to be done very regularly where I come from in
California. Things are done by app, or you get Amazon to deliver, and then, you know, every door opens the same way, but not in a Tuscan villa.
Everything is very personal, it's been done decades apart, the work, this part of the roof and that part of the roof, by different people. And so,
that personality and the people who did it was really, was the shock and the realization of a place that's very human.
SOARES: And it was interesting because Coco also tries to educate him in the arts, in culture, even language. You can only speak Italian in the car,
which I loved, by the way, and she's trying to make him, I think the words we use, less American. Is this something you've experienced? Why do you
think that is important?
GREER: When I first got the job, friends told my employer that I was too American --
SOARES: Really?
GREER: -- for it. That I would be unchangeable, inflexible. And I was at first, and then I discovered that I had to be flexible. I had to know how
to -- I couldn't prevent a crisis. I had to learn how to deal with a crisis and how to make it into a funny story --
SOARES: Yes.
GREER: -- and not just be an American complainer. And so, I wanted to give that to him, and because it's sort of buildings roman, a kind of awakening
of a young person, to have him change and be a little freer.
SOARES: Let's talk about my favorite character. I love her. I want to be her friend. I wish she existed. She just lit up this entire book, and
that's Coco. Can we just take five minutes to really talk about her? Because I'm intrigued. Where did she come from?
GREER: She comes from a few elderly women I know in Italy that I have combined together, especially a dear friend of mine who's now 100, and is
as vibrant and creative and impatient as ever, and I just loved having her on the page all the time.
SOARES: And I suppose that begs the question, what young readers can take away, Andrew, from a woman in her 90s and what she's gone through, right,
the lessons to learn from her perspective. What do you think those are?
GREER: I have a lot of friends in their 80s and 90s.
SOARES: What do you take away then from the conversations you've had with them?
GREER: Their sense of humor. They have lived long enough to have processed the things that happen to them into funny stories and a kind of lightness
that they bring to everything they do, and they don't talk about the pains and worries of their life, which must be 20-fold of the ones that I have.
And so, they don't want to hear about my problems either, except if they're real ones, but the petty ones of every day of, I ran out of mosquito
repellent, not an interesting conversation. But to have a sense of humor about things, and that's really liberating.
SOARES: How was it for you writing this book? Because obviously it's different from your very well-known books that you've covered, people will
know you well for less.
[14:50:00]
How was the transition between one and the other, you felt, in terms of writing?
GREER: Well, this one, I just wrote whatever scenes occurred to me. I wrote the septic tank scene first.
SOARES: Yes. Why did you write that one first?
GREER: Because I had dealt with the septic tank, and it was so much funny. I mean, there's something funny about a septic tank. And I thought if I put
a princess in the scene, then it's perfect. That's what I want to do.
So -- but I didn't know what else the novel was about. So, I just wrote that, and I wrote scenes that occurred to me, and then I connected them
together, and I did it -- I tried to have as much fun as possible.
SOARES: So, hold on, take us back here. You started with, what, septic tank, but with already cocoa in mind?
With cocoa in mind.
SOARES: Right.
GREER: I inserted a princess. I made the scene where a princess is arriving, and there's a train strike.
SOARES: Still in Tuscany.
GREER: Still in Tuscany.
SOARES: Right, yes.
GREER: I knew Tuscany. But a lot I didn't know. I didn't know side characters, romantic characters, her friend Oscar who arrives, I didn't
know, or a sort of villain character who comes along. And all of that is part of the fun discovery, and the frustration, if you haven't found your
way yet, that comes from writing a novel.
SOARES: Andrew, thank you very much indeed. I'm going to give you our pen.
GREER: Yes.
SOARES: And our book.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SOARES: And our thanks to Andrew for that. And for our next book club, I'm joined by author Karan Mahajan to talk about his new novel, "The Complex."
You do not want to miss that.
We're going to take a short break. We'll see you on the other side.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SOARES: And this just in to CNN. U.S. Senate Republican Mitch McConnell says he's been released from a rehab center and will continue recovering at
home. Now, the Kentucky lawmaker, if you remember, was hospitalized back in June after reportedly being unconscious at his D.C. home. And that's fueled
intense speculation about the 84-year-old's fitness to remain in office. Kentucky's Democratic governor, Anand Basheer, has been among those
demanding McConnell prove that he's still fit to serve.
Now, a long workday in space. I'm going to show you these live images coming to us of astronauts in the final stages, by the way, of a nearly
seven-hour spacewalk.
[14:55:00]
They are giving the International Space Station a power boost, preparing it for new solar panels to generate more electricity. The aim is to keep
critical systems running and support the station through its eventual return to Earth. That is slated for early 2031. Pretty extraordinary to see
these images out of space.
And finally, now for one 97-year-old British woman. This is a terrific story. The sky's the limit. Betty Bromage, just has set her second world
record as the oldest female wing walker. She took to the skies again on Tuesday, breaking the last record she nearly set four years ago. Here's
what she had to say. Listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BETTY BROMAGE, WING WALKER: I just get bored with life otherwise. When you get old, you can't go here. You can't do this. You can't drive. You can't
see. I can't see very well. And I get a bit frustrated. So, I want to do the things that I can do.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SOARES: Go, Betty. And if the record wasn't remarkable enough, Betty recovered from a stroke in 2025 and used the flight to fundraise for the
unit that treated her. Just really incredible.
That does it for us for this hour. Thanks very much for your company. "What We Know" is up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
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