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Laura Coates Live

A Shooter Barricaded a Door and Opened Fire into Church Pews in Minneapolis. Aired 11p-12a ET

Aired August 27, 2025 - 23:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[23:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

UNKNOWN (voice-over): This is CNN Breaking News.

LAURA COATES, CNN HOST AND SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Good evening, everyone. I'm Laura Coates right here in Minneapolis, just a few feet away from the Annunciation School here in Minneapolis, a site of yet another horrific school shooting in this country.

Earlier today, it was a site where two children, ages just eight and 10 years old, were gunned down while they were, among other students, in a school mass praying together. Fourteen other children were also injured and three adults.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIAN O'HARA, CHIEF, MINNEAPOLIS POLICE DEPARTMENT: During the mass, a gunman approached on the outside, on the side of the building, and began firing a rifle through the church windows, towards the children sitting in the pews at the mass. Shooting through the windows, he struck children and worshipers that were inside the building. The shooter was armed with a rifle, a shotgun, and a pistol. The coward who fired these shots ultimately took his own life in the rear of the church.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: Tonight, we're learning that 23-year-old gunman, who ultimately took own life, attended the school, changed legally name from Robert Westman to Robin Westman in 2019, purchased those weapons legally and purchased them recently, unbelievably so, and left a sprawling -- and I mean sprawling hate-filled manifesto that targeted so many different groups.

It's hard to even comprehend that level of hate that was spewed. And the motive tonight is still unclear. But one thing is certain, the pain and the wake of tragedy, unimaginable.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR JACOB FREY, MINNEAPOLIS, MINNESOTA: There are no words that can capture the horror and the evil of this unspeakable act. Children are dead. There are families that have a deceased child. But to everybody out there, do not think of these as just somebody else's kids. Those families are suffering immense pain right now. Think of this as if it were your own.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: It's hard not to think about this if it was all of our own. This was supposed to be the first week of school for these children.

I'm joined now by Shimon Prokupecz, who has been here from the beginning. Shimon, I mean, tell me more about how this unbelievable tragedy has unfolded, looking at a marquee behind us where they're still welcoming school students here.

SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN CRIME AND JUSTICE REPORTER: That marquee, when I got here this morning -- this afternoon, struck me because --

COATES: Yeah.

PROKUPECZ: -- it talked about a future filled with hope. That -- that stayed with me. That was the sign that was welcoming these students on Monday. And now, we're what? Day three of the school and for some of them, sadly, there is no hope and for these families now to deal with this.

COATES: Ahh.

PROKUPECZ: One of the things about this that has been so interesting, I -- and -- and some of it -- some of it, what I've been thinking so much about, is how all of this unfolded and how the shooting occurred. This isn't normally what we see in -- in these shootings --

COATES: In terms of what?

PROKUPECZ: This -- you usually see someone going into the school. But this was a very calculated and thought-out plan of how to target these children through the window of this church. And we heard from the police chief tonight say that the doors to the church were locked. That was part of their security measures. So, perhaps, maybe the shooter knew that. But the other thing, the shooter using those wood -- those wood out, two by fours, to put over the door so that no one could get out --

COATES: Just pause for a second.

PROKUPECZ: Yeah.

COATES: I -- I have to tell you, that -- that keeps striking a chord with me.

PROKUPECZ: It's chilling.

COATES: The idea that you would try to barricade people in to this mass while they're praying, children, students, older adults as well, that that was part of the calculus, it seems --

PROKUPECZ: Yeah. COATES: -- for this sadistic act.

PROKUPECZ: Yeah, wanted to do a lot more harm. And luckily, we're hearing such stories from the heroes of this, teachers, other students, students jumping on other students, taking a bullet for a classmate. Think of that. You know, these little kids that are thinking like this at this point in their life, to me, is just -- it's mind-boggling, it's amazing.

[23:05:02]

It's just children to think like this. But sadly, what has happened is they read about this stuff, they know about this stuff, they drill for this, they prepare for this. That's what -- what these children are dealing with, you know, in this country.

COATES: You know, I'm -- I'm so -- just you saying that because, you know, I grew up here and we would have, on Wednesdays, there was the siren that used to go off. There was a tornado drill that would happen. You get accustomed to that. Maybe it was a fire drill. Stop, drop, and roll.

Our children, they are doing shooting and active shooter drills. And these kids likely have not had one this year, but they would have had one in the years past.

PROKUPECZ: Yeah.

COATES: And it was real today in mass.

PROKUPECZ: In mass. And that's -- that is what has, to me, has stood out through -- through this day. And the other thing that's happening now is, you know, a lot of people are raising all kinds of speculation about motive and what happened here --

COATES: Yeah.

PROKUPECZ: -- and they're trying to attach certain reasons for why this happened. But the police chief is saying, we don't know because what's happening is this individual wrote about so many different things and was filled with so much hate and hated everything and everybody. And it's very difficult for them at this point to pinpoint an exact motive.

And, obviously, mental illness is a factor here, that we don't know that this person had ever received any kind of professional help. There's no indication of that. But something was going on in this person's life to have such hate, to be -- to have such a plan, and also was very fascinated with other school shootings and mass shooters. And that, obviously, is something that investigators are trying to work through.

COATES: And why do we know that? What about that?

PROKUPECZ: They did search warrants from his -- from -- from the home, and they've also been able to get video that was posted on YouTube, they believe, by the shooter that shows writings and different fascinations with school shootings and other shooters and studying some of this. That also goes to the level of preparation. So, they have all this information.

But having all this information doesn't necessarily mean for them that they're going to be able to determine a motive. And they may not be able. There could be a bunch of different things.

We learned tonight that this individual knew about the school, went to the school. The mother worked at -- at the -- at the church or at the school there. So, there's connection to this. Not so surprising from this neighborhood. Okay.

COATES: Uh-hmm.

PROKUPECZ: So, was that part of the motive? Who knows? But there's every indication that this individual planned this for some time, may have mapped out or sort of what they call case -- cased it out to sort of figure out how to -- how to do this. That is everything that law enforcement is working with.

And, you know, the thing for them tonight also is this community. This community is so affected and so traumatized.

COATES: Yes. You went to a vigil.

PROKUPECZ: I did. And I -- you know, I was so struck and felt so hopeful for this -- for -- for this community because so many people turned out packed. It was at a local gym, at a local school in the -- in the gymnasium, standing room only, about 2,000 people. They had to stop letting people in. Imagine that.

COATES: And they waited outside?

PROKUPECZ: They waited outside. And there were victims that you could see and people who knew the victims. People were crying. Young kids hugging each other. It was -- it was a really amazing moment for -- for this community to have this opportunity --

COATES: Yeah.

PROKUPECZ: -- so quickly to be together. And tomorrow, no doubt, we will begin to learn more from law enforcement because they're going to work through the night to sort this out.

COATES: They say some of the youngest among us are the true geniuses and out of the mouths of babes. One child today, a 10-year-old, 10- year-old, described what he saw. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNKNOWN: When you heard the shots, what went through your head?

WESTON HALSNE, 5TH GRADER, ANNUNCIATION CATHOLIC SCHOOL: I was, like -- the first one, I was, like, what is that? I thought it was just something. Then I heard it again. I just ran onto the pew. And then I covered my head. My friend, Victor, like, saved me, though, because he laid on top of me. But he got hit.

UNKNOWN: Your friend laid on top of you?

HALSNE: Yeah. And he got hit.

UNKNOWN (voice-over): Is this something that you -- you practiced before?

HALSNE: Um, yeah. We -- we practice it, like, every month or I don't know. But, yeah, we -- we've never practiced it in the -- in the church, though.

UNKNOWN: Uh-hmm.

HALSNE: Only in school.

UNKNOWN: Uh-hmm.

HALSNE: So, it was really different.

UNKNOWN (voice-over): But it has to be probably the scariest thing of your life.

HALSNE: Yeah. It was super scary.

UNKNOWN: What do you want to say to your friend who helped protect you?

HALSNE: Um, he's really brave, and I hope he's good in the hospital.

UNKNOWN: Stand by. I'm with you.

UNKNOWN: Stand by.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: With me now, somebody who is a member of the community and alumni of the school, somebody who heard children in need and rushed to the scene. It's not a first responder. It is a member of the community. Patt Scallen is here with us. And Patt, just take me back to the moments just earlier today, which must seem surreal that it was today, this morning.

[23:10:01]

Take me back to what you heard, what you saw.

PATT SCALLEN, EYEWITNESS TO MINNEAPOLIS SCHOOL SHOOTING: Yeah. I was working. I live a half block from the school and the church. And I was working in my office. And I heard a few pops. I thought it -- I didn't think it was gunshots. But after the 10th round, I knew it was gunshots, and I knew where it was coming from. And I just felt the worst, and I just instinctively just said, I got to get up there.

COATES: You ran?

SCALLEN: I ran, yeah. I ran right to the -- right to the church. The church is first from my house.

COATES: I -- I -- I shudder to even ask the question, but what did you see when you got there?

SCALLEN: Interestingly, it was very eerie quiet. The first thing I saw was a magazine on the cement walkway, obviously, you know, from where the -- I assume where the shooter had used some of that ammunition. And then I -- I didn't touch that. I walked around to the front of the church. And it was right at that moment that children and everybody was coming out.

COATES: And the children, what were they like when you saw them?

SCALLEN: Well, it was -- it was chaotic. Panicked and chaotic. And there was blood. You know, not -- not a ton of blood, but kids -- certain kids -- some kids had more than others. And, for some reason, I focused on three, and two of them I knew were badly hurt. The other one I saw was bleeding from his -- his arm, but it turned out -- I don't think he was doing that bad. But I just felt that, especially with the two girls, that they were -- they were seriously hurt. And there was no -- no police or EMTs there at the time.

COATES: Oh, my God.

SCALLEN: And so, I just felt I just needed to stay there and help them.

COATES: And I understand you held the hand of one of the girls.

SCALLEN: She -- she asked me to hold her hand.

COATES: She asked? What did she say to you?

SCALLEN: She said -- well, she said, oh, I -- I -- I want my mom, mom and dad maybe, but I heard mom a lot more. And I reassured her that I would call her mom but, right now, it's important that you just stay calm and get medical attention, and that will be coming. And, you know, in the meantime, I said, I'm not going anywhere, I'll be right here with you. And she said, well, will you just please continue to hold my hand? And I said, absolutely. And I said, don't worry.

And then I was watching the girl with the shot in the neck. She was shot in the neck real close. And she was doing okay, but I was really worried about her.

COATES: Was she speaking at all?

SCALLEN: She was speaking. But then, towards the end, she -- thank God. It was -- I can't tell you what a relief it was to hear those sirens coming up. Normally, that isn't the case. But today, that was a godsend. And because she was claiming of some breathing problems. And then I continued to ask her about that.

COATES: And she was alert and talking --

SCALLEN: She was. COATES: -- even with the neck --

SCALLEN: Yeah. They both -- they both were. And the one with the bullet didn't talk much. She just responded to questions. But she was crying and in distress and, obviously, wanted her mom, too. But the young man that was there was so brave. They all were brave. But he just -- I keep asking him, are you okay? I'm okay, I'm okay. And -- and I know he did that to comfort those other girls and, you know, focus my attention to them. But they're just all such neat, wonderful kids.

COATES: Did you stay until the ambulance came and got those girls?

SCALLEN: Oh, absolutely. I wasn't going anywhere.

COATES: How did you -- how were you able to keep your head and your cool in that?

SCALLEN: You just do it. You know, it's adrenaline and it's just the right thing to do. And -- and, you know, that could have been my kids, my grandkid. My kids went to school here. It could have been them. I have two grandkids that are going to a Catholic school in Saint Paul. Could have been them. So, you just -- you just do it. It's just the right thing to do. I think anybody would do the same.

COATES: How -- has that hit you yet? What happened today?

SCALLEN: You know, not quite. I think it will. And everybody has been telling me to get ready for that. I mean, I saw some bad stuff, but I -- I would -- I would do it again.

COATES: How long, if you can even estimate, between the sirens coming and when you first got there? Was it -- I was talking a lot of minutes?

SCALLEN: It seemed like an eternity. But -- and that's not a knock on the police or the EMTs. I would -- I estimated about five to eight minutes. Maybe it was shorter, but it just seemed like it took forever. But that was just in my head. And I was just -- I just wanted them there right then. So --

COATES: Uh-hmm.

SCALLEN: But I think it was around five -- five to eight minutes.

COATES: Well, Patt Scallen, thank God you were there.

SCALLEN: Well --

COATES: And to think that you held their hands through it, what a good person. Thank you.

SCALLEN: She was -- she was a sweetheart. I'll never forget her. And I think she's going to be okay.

COATES: Yes. I hope so. SCALLEN: Yeah.

COATES: Thank you.

SCALLEN: Thank you, Laura. Nice to meet you.

[23:15:00]

COATES: I -- I want to turn to our law enforcement panel here. Thank you. I mean, can you -- first of all, I'm just taken aback. I'm joined now by John Miller, Mary Ellen O'Toole, and Mr. Swecker here. It's just -- Chris -- Chris Swecker.

I mean, it's -- I'm taken aback by what that would feel like. When we think about first responders, we think about our brave men and women in uniform who run towards danger. And we're also thinking about, in times like this, the heroics of the everyday person who are hearing something and running to that danger, even to hold a little girl's hand just to wait for help. I mean, it's -- it's just -- it's heart- wrenching and warming at the same time.

I want to bring you all in. John, let me begin with you here because the word motive is going to keep coming up in all of the conversations we're having. Talk to me a little bit about what it's like behind the scenes for law enforcement. When something like this happens, what are they looking for first?

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: First, they're looking for, is this the only person involved? So far, and that could change, but so far, in this case, that appears to be the answer, that he acted alone. It does not appear yet that there were any other people who knew about it. We'll find out later, that in the hindsight of all this, people will say, he said this or he said that, maybe I should have picked up on it. That is common in more than 80, 85% of these cases. But it appears he acted alone.

The second thing they're looking for is motive. In this case, the offender is dead. Motive has to come from what he left behind. He wrote a book in Cyrillic, which is an Eastern European alphabet, that they've spent the day translating. But most of what they've translated in that book is about suicidal ideology, why he was unhappy.

He wrote a letter in plain English to his friends and parents where he said he has been going through pain, he had been suicidal for years, he had been thinking about doing this, this shooting, this kind of shooting for a long time, and that he knew it was wrong, but that he didn't want to be around anymore.

So, none of that really told them much about motive, as you and I would mean it, which is why these victims? Why that place? And usually, and Mary Ellen will -- will back me up on this because most of what I know about this field I learned from her, is when you find out the motive, it won't make sense to you, it won't make sense to me because we're trying to attach rational thinking to an irrational act.

COATES: Mary Ellen, I want to bring you in on this because I want to try to unpack from what we know about this sort of psychosis and what this -- this profile might look like of the person who has done this. And there were even videos that were posted, I understand, as well.

But here's also what we know. They were -- the person was obsessed with mass shooters and politics and religion. The shooter published a manifesto online. They drew diagrams that match the layout. And, as John was talking about, they essentially wanted law enforcement to crack some sort of code from them as well. Walk me through what you're thinking about this person's profile.

MARY ELLEN O'TOOLE, FORMER SENIOR FBI PROFILER: Well, the first thing that struck me was how interested that he was in other shooters, how he copycat it from them, and how he took a little bit from Columbine. I worked on the Columbine case. He even took a little bit from Charles Whitman from 1966, which very few shooters are even aware of, took a little bit from him. He took a little bit from Cho. And he wove -- wove that all into his own -- into his own crime. So, he was pretty familiar with these shooters.

That tells me that he probably was immersed in their crimes, and he -- and he was using their information, what they did, to help him decide what he was going to incorporate into his crime. That's the power of these cases.

And what's so concerning to me is that, as upsetting as this case is, rest assured that there are some people right now that are looking at this crime, deciding on how they're going to do theirs better. That's the power of the copycat effect in these cases.

COATES: That puts a pit in all of our stomachs. I mean, Chris, the FBI, they're involved. They're investigating this as an act of domestic terrorism and hate crime, particularly, I'm sure, given the manifesto that's involved here. But how does the FBI, the bureau piece things together when, as we know, the police are lacking that magic word of a motive? Do they even need that to begin to try to piece together what's happening?

[23:19:57]

CHRIS SWECKER, FORMER FBI ASSISTANT DIRECTOR, CRIMINAL INVESTIGATION DIVISION: Not necessarily. The FBI will respond in these cases, and -- and they'll be looking for evidence of terrorism or -- when churches are involved, they'll look for some, you know, targeting of the -- a certain religion. And that -- you know, we saw that quite a bit in the -- in the 90s.

But they're -- they're there really to help. I mean, in a case like this, they have tremendous forensic capabilities, they have manpower, they have case management software that functions very well in a fast- moving setting like this where you've got a lot of information flowing in different directions and it needs to go to one place.

But all -- all of that, you know, their -- their role right now -- I -- this doesn't look like terrorism in the -- in the sort of traditional sense of the word. We may want to label it domestic terrorism, but that's very little solace to the families. I think slapping labels around at this point is not really productive. So, you know, the FBI is going to do whatever they need to do to help and support local law enforcement and what they're doing.

COATES: Obviously, the term terrorism, a legal term talking about acting in a way to try to persuade or compel a political result or influence policy or other matters of the government and beyond. So, I can see why terrifying something and someone in a community and terrorism can be distinct.

But John, we are learning that this shooter actually tried to barricade these people inside of the mass. How?

MILLER: You know, that is, to me, one of the most shocking aspects of a crime that has become so common that we start to take some of these elements for granted as pieces that come with it. This is something we haven't seen before.

I'm going to go to a piece of videotape here where he shows us a two by four that he is -- as he's preparing for this crime. This is what they slide between the emergency exit doors, and he spells it out, as he's showing us on this video that he released on a timer, exactly what he means by that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNKNOWN (voice-over): This will be for the emergency exit.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MILLER: So, he's talking about this is for the emergency exit. And that bar has a gas canister taped to the far end of it. And people described how the two by fours were placed through the door handle, so if people tried to flee, they would be trapped inside. He would have achieved full containment of his victim pool within that room, trapped behind those windows, as he continued to fire, to achieve maximum lethality, which is exactly how these shooters try to compete with each other for legacy.

COATES: Mary Ellen, that was to your -- your larger point as well, about the -- the tragic and despicable nature of the copycat. The idea of trying to one up or try to improve upon that horror is -- is so unrelatable and mind-boggling to most people or it should be. But then there are his own words. And in writing that was obtained by the police, Mary Ellen, the shooter claimed extremist views are not the motive, saying, I do it to please myself, I do it because I am sick. What do you hear?

O'TOOLE: Well, I hear a number of things with him. And -- and with a lot of these people that leave behind a manifesto, I have to tell you, having read them and worked on these cases, many of them are not extremely insightful. In other words, can they pinpoint exactly why they're doing it? No, they can't.

But I will say this: Many of them, including somebody like even Charles Whitman back in 1966 and the Columbine shooters, I've never seen such hatred as existed in the Columbine shooters, and they didn't have enough life experiences to support that level of hatred. So, that whole concept of the -- of this hatred seems to be prominent with a lot of shooters.

And then you also have a phenomenon that we've seen in a lot of these shooters. And John, I heard you refer to this earlier today. And it's the injustice collecting. Their life is miserable.

But they're not going to accept the responsibility for it themselves, and they projected on to other people. So, they -- they then learned, I'm going to hate you because look at what you've done to my life. So, that takes a little bit of insight to really realize that. They may not realize exactly that, but they know how they feel.

But to get to a single motive, that's never going to happen because there are multiple reasons. These are equal opportunity haters.

COATES: You know, thinking about how the investigation is unfolding, Chris, we are learning that there is some, perhaps, personal connection that the shooter had to the school, that the mother of the shooter may have worked here in some capacity. How helpful is that for the investigation and especially in trying to understand, and I say not to understand to justify, but to understand from a law enforcement perspective?

[23:25:03]

SWECKER: Well, yeah, that -- that's often the case. I mean, it helps you understand the motive, what -- what drove this person to do this. But it's very often the case that there's a connection to the -- to the target, if you will. We saw that in Uvalde. We've seen it in Parkland. We -- we've seen it in many of the of these shootings. And, you know, I expected to see that really when this first surfaced. It helps us understand lessons learned. It helps us get a complete picture of what happened.

But, you know, we -- again, I go back to this -- this notion of red flags and -- and indicators. I do school security assessments and one of the things that you look for is, is there a ground radar in place? Are the counselors and the teachers and -- and the people that are close to this person tuned in and -- and are they willing to say something if they see something?

And in many cases, there are -- there are those red flags and those signs and signals that something is not right, in a -- in a malignant sort of way, and they don't report anything to anybody.

And I -- you know, I'm -- I'm a big proponent of the red flags laws, which will keep guns out of the hands of these types of individuals with the simple -- sort of the equivalent of a domestic violence restraining order type of process where you go to a magistrate and you just limit this person access to guns for a duration of time that -- that maybe gets them past that bad mental health period.

You know, I'm -- I'm not -- I don't want to get into the big gun control discussion, but I think there are many things that we can do to -- to learn lessons from this type of thing and -- and pass some laws. Some of the states have them right now. I'm -- I'm all for that.

COATES: Thank you all so much. We continue to unpack what has happened here just right behind me, just today during the first week of school, which should be a time of joy and friendship building and excitement. And community has turned to tragedy here. Why? The shooter, we're learning more about today.

Up next, we're going to talk to a chaplain, who helped to console the families when they learned of what had happened, next.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

O'HARA: This was a deliberate act of violence against innocent children and other people worshiping. The sheer cruelty and cowardice of firing into a church full of children is absolutely incomprehensible.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[23:30:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MATT DEBOER, PRINCIPAL, ANNUNCIATION CATHOLIC SCHOOL: We planned -- planned for this school year. We intentionally chose a theme from the prophet Jeremiah, chapter 29, a future filled with hope. There's nothing about today that can fill us with hope.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COATES: So many people reacting today to this horrific tragedy. First responders coming to the scene. But not all of them were in uniform. Many saw what was going on, heard what was going on, saw something unfolding, and raced to it.

One of those people is with me right now. It is Chaplain Howard Dotson. And he was a hero today, racing to the scene. When he saw a swarm of police cars coming, got in his car and followed, believing that there was a mass casualty event and wanted to help. He is a missionary, and he's a health care chaplain at St. Constantine Ukrainian Catholic Church. Chaplain, thank you for being here.

HOWARD DOTSON, MISSIONARY AND HEALTHCARE CHAPLAIN, ST. CONSTANTINE UKRAINIAN CATHOLIC CHURCH: I'm a member of St. Constantine.

COATES: Yes.

DOTSON: But I'm a healthcare chaplain that has worked with crime victims. I've worked with over 100 family -- 100 families after homicide as a police chaplain. So, I wanted to make sure that the Catholic kids, once I heard it was a Catholic church, had the emotional and spiritual support. COATES: Walk me through what that was like when you arrived, knowing what had happened or watching it unfold. I understand that you spent a lot of time with the victims, the parents.

DOTSON: Parents and --

COATES: Can you tell us what that was like?

DOTSON: So, the parents and the children are being matched by grades. And the moms, just the tears. There are no words. You just hug the moms. And then I asked the teacher, get me some art supplies, because we use expressive therapies with Syrian refugee children, Ukrainian refugee children. Expressive therapies can help children cope with being exposed to trauma. So, we made little art circles for the kids, and the kids are making art.

And then I met the math or music teacher who told me that while the kids were going from the crime scene, the chapel, to the gymnasium, this holy spirit told her, let's sing this song, "Lord Prepare Me to be a Sanctuary."

COATES: And the children were singing?

DOTSON: Yeah. So, I asked people tonight, when you pray for these children, the bereaved, that you play that song from YouTube, "Lord Prepare Me to be a Sanctuary."

COATES: The mothers, the fathers trying to wait to be matched with their children, learning what has happened. I understand that you were beside the mothers.

DOTSON: Moms that lost their kids tonight.

COATES: God. I mean, what were they expressing to you?

DOTSON: They're -- they're in shock. And no mom should have to lose their child. We need to pound swords into plowshares. After evolving, when the kids walked out at the U.S. Bank Stadium, I led the reflection, and I had the kids chant Jesus' words from the Garden of Gethsemane when he healed the temple guard's ear.

[23:35:00]

He said, no more of this.

COATES: Did you --

DOTSON: We have to be peacemakers. We're to just pound swords in the plowshares. We had too many of these. I've seen too many tears. I'm tired of seeing moms lose their children.

COATES: What did you say to the mothers?

DOTSON: I told the mom and the child, God's head of protection is over you, God is protecting your heart and mind, and the great physician is going to be with you, and the great physician is with your classmates who are in the hospital right now.

COATES: I want to go back for a second to the idea of the art therapy that was in real motion. I mean, just thinking about the quick thinking of how to try to ease the minds of these children who were watching a tragedy unfold. Dare I say, we'll process this for a very long time.

DOTSON: Yeah.

COATES: What were the children doing in the immediate aftermath when you got there?

DOTSON: One of the kindergartners told me, I'm going to be an artist. In the glimmer of hope in the midst of all this this morning, the mother's pride and love, looking at her son making art when he wants to be an artist.

COATES: What were they -- I mean, I'm curious. After they've been through what they've been through and seen that moment, what were they drawing? What were they expressing?

DOTSON: One little girl drew hearts. Girls tend to draw hearts. Boys tend to draw -- draw trucks. But when they've been exposed to trauma, they're showing you what's going on inside. And you can see from the art those that need to be seen by a clinician.

COATES: Talk to me about the faith that -- I mean, you -- you came to make sure that there was that protection, as you said, over them. How do you help people to even maintain the faith? Obviously, those who are attending the school, perhaps self-selecting into a particular group that wants to have an educational system around their children that is based in religion and faith in part. How do you help them to continue that?

DOTSON: For many Catholics, the cross has Jesus on the cross because of his loving sacrifice and the suffering, the suffering servant, and that we know this movement from Calvary to Easter sunrise. And we walk that dark valley as pilgrims of hope. And that's, in this year, the Catholic focus is being pilgrims of hope.

COATES: Hmm.

DOTSON: And so, I saw those glimmers of hope in the midst of this dark valley when that little boy wants to be an artist, when that music teacher wants the kids to sing --

COATES: Hmm.

DOTSON: -- that song. That's the triumph of the human spirit.

COATES: Yeah. I mean, I -- I certainly hope the triumph persists. This is a difficult time. Thank you for lending us your spirit and what you said to them today. I appreciate it.

DOTSON: And please play that song.

COATES: Thank you.

DOTSON: "Lord Prepare Me to be a Sanctuary."

COATES: I should know. And also, of course, the first American pope offering his condolences, saying that he's deeply saddened by what has happened here as well.

Up next, we're going to speak -- learn more about the officers who raced to the scene. They saved so many lives. Next.

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CARLA MALDORADO, PARENT OF STUDENTS AT ANNUNCIATION CATHOLIC SCHOOL: I'm so grateful to the staff and -- and the first responders. They did amazing. and I do believe that they saved lives today. And the -- the lives that were lost is -- is too much. One is too much. And it's just -- it's not okay.

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O'HARA: The dozens of officers that responded to this scene, um, many of them are deeply traumatized by what they saw, as are, obviously, all of the children, all of the staff members, Father Dennis, everyone who is at mass this morning.

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COATES: I'm live in Minneapolis, at Annunciation Catholic School, the site of a tragic horrific shooting, where a shooter claimed the lives of two children and wounding 14 others, including also adults.

I'm here now with somebody who has helped and led this city through tragedy, holding the hand of law enforcement and beyond. I'm talking about the former Minneapolis police chief, Medaria Arradondo. Thank you for being here this evening.

You know, I want to talk about what went right with law enforcement here because they were so brave. I understand that a father of one of the children who was there saw an officer running towards the shooter as they kept shooting.

MEDARIA ARRADONDO, FORMER CHIEF, MINNEAPOLIS POLICE DEPARTMENT: Yeah. So, unfortunately, since Columbine happened here in our -- our nation, you know, we've had to deal with these tragedies.

But one of the good things is law enforcement trains all the time, Laura, to respond to these active shooter events. And the Minneapolis Police Department, and I -- I can speak from it, they train all the time. Now, it's training that you hope you never have to actually put into practice, but they did.

Members of our -- our local state county folks, they all responded. And as Chief O'Hara said, you know, one of these officers, heard from a witness, where's the shooter? Where the sounds coming from? And they rushed towards it.

COATES: Hmm.

ARRADONDO: And so, this is still a very honorable and noble profession. The men and women in uniform, they're going to continue to respond to these. They're going to get there as fast as they can.

[23:45:00]

And in this case, we had local district squads who were nearby. They rushed here. They got here.

COATES: Yeah.

ARRADONDO: Local ambulance crews, Minneapolis Fire Department, our Hennepin County deputies. So, they showed up. They're continuing to lead in the professional manner that they are. And so --

COATES: The chief, when they do --

ARRADONDO: Yeah.

COATES: -- the trauma they see, it must take a toll.

ARRADONDO: Yep. Absolutely. And so, one of the things that they are also trained on is when you respond to these active shooter events, they know that the shooter is going to try to take out and -- and kill as many people as they possibly can in the time they have.

So, they're going to witness and see things that most of us will never want to ever experience to see. But they have to work through that, they have to neutralize the shooter, they have to save lives, and -- and that's what they're trained to do. But they're also human.

COATES: Yeah.

ARRADONDO: You know, we talk about the invisible injuries that the men and women who wear that badge suffer and carry. And so, I'm happy to also say that the law enforcement community around America is starting to remove the stigma of -- of mental health and start to talk about it more, get them resources, get their families resources.

Chief O'Hara said today, he's going to make sure, obviously, members of the Minneapolis Police Department have that, and the other law enforcement officers that responded will have those resources available to them.

COATES: We have more to talk with you about. I'm so glad that you're here. I'll continue to lean on your expertise. Up next, though, we're going to talk to a father of a Sandy Hook victim. Imagine what he's thinking tonight. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FREY: Don't just say this is about thoughts and prayers right now. These kids were literally praying. It was the first week of school. They were in a church.

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ANDERS HOLINE, FATHER: And I just, you know, selfishly was just, like, where are my girls? Where is June (ph) and all? That's all I could think about. And I couldn't find them. And it was -- it was awful.

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COATES: I'm joined now by someone who knows all too well the horror of what some of these families are going through tonight. The father of Emilie, who died 12 years ago in Sandy Hook, Robbie Parker joins us now. Robbie, I -- I hate to even ask what went through your mind today when you learned of this tragedy.

ROBBIE PARKER, FATHER OF EMILIE PARKER WHO WAS KILLED AT SANDY HOOK ELEMENTARY: I mean, every time I hear of these tragedies, my first thoughts are to the families that are most directly impacted. I have a very authentic and truthful perspective of what it is to be in their shoes and -- and understand what that feels like, and that's a perception and a feeling and an understanding that most people don't dare to even dream of what that's really like.

And so, I -- my heart goes out to them and where -- what they're going through, and -- and understanding what that community, what that school, like -- I mean, I've been there, and I know what that feels like. And that's -- that's where my first thoughts go to.

COATES: What are these families going through this evening, if you can try to share?

PARKER: I mean, the first thing that we need to understand is they need to grieve. This is going to be a national spotlight on them. And to grieve in a glass house is extremely invasive. And -- and the grief process is a very sacred process. And -- and they need that time.

There are so many times that we hear people say, this isn't the time to do anything. And that is true for these families. They need to grieve, and we need to let them start that process.

But there's always time for us to act. There's always time for us to be able to do something. There's never a time that we should pause on thinking about how we make our school safer, how we make our children safer. There's never a pause for that.

But let these families grieve. Let their families love them. Give them that space. Don't ask anything from them. They're not here to perpetuate anybody else's agenda right now. If they want to do that in the future, they can do that. But please, right now, let them grieve.

COATES: So important that you said that. And I understand completely. And that it doesn't let off the hook those who could be doing more to try to prevent such tragedies. What more could be being done right now?

PARKER: And that's the thing about this, is everybody has something that they can be doing, whether you're a parent that wants to join a school safety committee, whether you are, honestly, one of the politicians that enable these things to keep happening because of your political life that you're so worried about. If you're putting your political life ahead of that other people's real lives, in front of our children's lives, then your priorities are messed up, and you need to get on track.

And this isn't a fight that everybody talks about. There's an us versus them here, and that's really not how I look at this. This is a time where we come together. We share our ideas, we open up, we feel what needs to be felt.

And, honestly, if you're the type of person who -- who puts -- I would give anything and give up anything to keep my children safe. I've -- I sent my kids to first day of school today. But I would also give up anything to keep your children safe. And, unfortunately, I don't think that there's enough people that are willing to do that for other people.

And if -- if that's how you view this topic around guns and safety and stuff like that, then, honestly, you're not putting lives ahead of people and you're worshiping idols.

[23:54:54]

COATES: Robbie, your words hit home more than you know. And I applaud your ability to continue to help educate and illuminate for all of us, and to have that philosophy that they're all our children. Perhaps it's why we grieve so much as a nation that this has happened. Robbie Parker, thank you.

PARKER: Have a good evening. Thank you.

COATES: We have so much more ahead of the breaking news tonight of what has happened here just a few feet away in the first week of school. More in a moment.

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HALSNE: It was, like, shots fired. And then we kind of, like, got under the pews. We kind of -- they shot through the -- the stained- glass windows, I think. And it was really scary.

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