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One World with Zain Asher
Soon: Trump To Welcome British PM To The White House; U.S. And U.K. Leaders Meet At The White House On Ukraine; Tate Brothers Leave Romania, Are Now In The U.S.; Oscar-Winning Actor Gene Hackman Dies At Age 95; Minerals At Forefront Of Potential Ukraine-U.S. Deal; USAID Workers Given 15 Minutes To Collect Belongings; Health Officials: Child Dies In West Texas. Aired 12-1p ET
Aired February 27, 2025 - 12:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[12:00:29]
ZAIN ASHER, CNN ANCHOR: Head-to-head, Donald Trump and Keir Starmer are set to meet at the White House at any moment.
BIANNA GOLODRYGA, CNN ANCHOR: ONE WORLD starts right now.
Critical and crucial. This hour, Donald Trump hosts the British Prime Minister, as we noted, at the White House any moment now.
ASHER: Also ahead, honoring a legend. We reflect on the unforgettable career of actor, Gene Hackman.
GOLODRYGA: And later, 108 years young. She says she doesn't feel a day over 20. Lucky woman. Her secret to a long and healthy life.
Hello, everyone. Live from New York, I'm Bianna Golodryga.
ASHER: And I'm Zain Asher. You are watching ONE WORLD.
U.S. President Donald Trump is getting ready to welcome the leader of America's closest traditional ally to the White House at any moment now.
British Prime Minister Keir Starmer is expected to arrive there in just a few minutes.
GOLODRYGA: But the tone between the two countries has recently shifted. And today's meeting could not only have major implications for the faltering
U.S. Transatlantic alliance but of course for the future of Ukraine as well.
ASHER: That's right. The prime minister wants to walk away with an American guarantee for Ukraine's security. Mr. Trump says, that's Europe's job, not
the U.S.'s, and he's not making any promises.
GOLODRYGA: CNN's Kevin Liptak joins us now live at the White House. A big test here for Prime Minister Keir Starmer. And unlike what we saw with
French President Macron, who does have a relationship and a rather good relationship with President Trump, a history there, these two men, not as
much, they've exchanged some phone conversations.
But it does appear, given what we saw take place this week in London, ahead of this meeting, the prime minister is coming with some deliverables.
KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yes. I think he is trying to build some goodwill heading into these talks. As you sort of referenced,
he's the next up at bat essentially to talk to Donald Trump to try and convince him that Ukraine belongs at the negotiating table, but also to try
and emphasize that Europe is prepared to shoulder some of the burden for securing Ukraine once the war there ends, but that he will need some
backing from the United States.
The U.S. will need to provide some military muscle in order for that setup to work. And I think the choreography here, the sequencing has all been
very intentional. Macron, obviously a friendly face, a familiar face for Donald Trump, able to talk about some of these things and push back on
Donald Trump in ways that don't necessarily leave him feeling cornered.
Starmer, it's a newer relationship. It is friendly so far, somewhat surprisingly, given their ideological differences, but Trump says that they
do have a good relationship. Starmer, just this week, announcing that Britain would up its defense spending to two and a half percent of its
economic output. That's something that Donald Trump has been asking for. He's doing it by cutting foreign aid programs. Obviously, that aligns with
Donald Trump as well.
And I think Starmer will want to get into a little bit more granular detail about what these European security guarantees in Ukraine might look like,
and sort of lay out exactly what the U.S. might be able to do.
He calls it a backstop to essentially allow Europe to go forward, because no one really thinks that Europe will be able to guarantee fully on its own
that the Russian aggression wouldn't continue after a peace deal. They will need the United States to help out with that.
And we were talking to American officials this morning to ask what exactly a backstop would look like that Trump could agree to, and they don't really
have any details on that. They say it will depend on what the peace agreement in Ukraine actually looks like before they can actually decide
how involved the U.S. will be.
But certainly, the red line has been troops on the ground in Ukraine. That is not something that Donald Trump is prepared to agree to. And so
inevitably, that will mean that Europe will have to pick up the slack there. And so it will be an important conversation for them.
You know, Donald Trump does have a history with British prime ministers. He feels an affinity to Britain. His mother was Scottish. I remember being at
the White House during his first term. His very first visitor was Theresa May. Things did seem like they were getting off to a good start then, but
obviously the relationship soured.
So, you know, there isn't necessarily a history of long-lasting relations with Trump. His feelings can kind of turn on a whim.
You know, I think we're seeing that with Ukraine as well. The question really is whether this string of visitors to the White House is having any
effect. I think you'd be hard-pressed right now to find anything that Donald Trump is saying that's different after these meetings than it was
before.
[12:05:10]
He hasn't backed off his position, for example, on how the war started. He hasn't backed off on his views towards Putin. And yesterday in the Cabinet
Room, he was very explicit that he didn't think the American security guarantees would be very strong.
And so I think, you know, we'll see how this meeting ends. In a lot of ways, this is sort of the precursor to the meeting that we'll see tomorrow
when Volodymyr Zelenskyy is here at the White House to sign that minerals deal. That will be an important moment.
But certainly, all of these leaders trying to impress on Trump the importance of having a Ukrainian involvement in these discussions as he
prepares to sit down with Vladimir Putin.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. At least a small win for President Zelenskyy, though, being the first between him and Vladimir Putin to visit this White House and
President Trump in the next few minutes. It's going to be a real test to the special relationship between the U.K. and the United States.
Kevin Liptak, thank you.
ASHER: Well, let's bring in Clare Sebastian joining us live now with more from reaction from London.
So, Clare, I'm sure you remember that press conference just a few days ago where Prime Minister Keir Starmer essentially announced a massive dramatic
increase in defense spending.
A lot of the questions that the reporters were asking in the room centered around whether or not Donald Trump was essentially setting the U.K.'s
foreign policy agenda, whether or not the U.K. was essentially having to twist itself into knots to manage this new American administration. Walk us
through that.
CLARE SEBASTIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. And I think that we did eventually get a sort of thinly veiled admission from Keir Starmer that the timing was
in fact not a coincidence, that all of this coming just two days before his meeting with President Trump was sort of carefully arranged that way.
But, obviously, the U.K. has been under pressure. It's a country that has shown a lot of leadership over Ukraine since the beginning of that war,
willing to supply various different types of weapons, be it tanks or, you know, other weapon systems first ahead of everyone else.
The U.K. recently took up the leadership of the Ramstein group format, the first country. This is the Ukraine Defense Contact Group that coordinates
military aid for Ukraine. They were the first country to chair that. The U.S. has previously chaired all of those meetings.
So I think given that there was a lot of pressure for the U.K. to put some real sort of financial muscle behind those pledges. But clearly, it does
help lay the groundwork for this meeting. So the comments, by the way, from Keir Starmer saying that President Trump has changed the conversation on
Ukraine. Some praise essentially for his approach to the war so far.
But this is a delicate balancing act. On the one hand, this is an opportunity for Starmer, right? This is part of the U.K.'s sort of years-
long push post-Brexit for relevance, part of its leadership on Ukraine. He has an opportunity to sort of step into a potential void that might be left
by the U.S. in Europe to show sort of leadership politically and militarily.
Well, at the same time part of the purpose of this trip is obviously to try to salvage this relationship, the special relationship between the U.K. and
the U.S. And, of course, the relationship with Europe and, as Kevin was outlining, crucially that commitment to Ukraine.
We did get some more details, by the way, from the U.K. Foreign Secretary, who's also in the U.S. right now, David Lammy, speaking to U.K.
broadcaster, ITV, this week. He said that the backstop that Keir Starmer has been talking about, that sort of supposed help from the U.S. when it
comes to these security guarantees for Ukraine. He said it could include troop deployments across Europe. That's not in Ukraine, but continued
presence of American troops in Europe, essentially so that, you know, worst-case scenario if Russian aggression spreads beyond Ukraine, a
commitment from the U.S. that it would still protect European NATO allies.
He also talked about air defenses. He talked about sanctions snapback, an idea that potentially the U.S. could promise to bring back sanctions if it
lifts them as part of a peace deal if that peace deal is violated and, of course, ongoing military aid.
So we don't know what that backstop could look like, but this is really at the centerpiece of these talks today. And I think it will be interesting to
watch how Keir Starmer manages a personal relationship with Trump. He is well aware that it is crucial to make a good impression and avoid any
semblance of falling out with the U.S. president.
ASHER: Clare Sebastian live for us there. Thank you so much.
GOLODRYGA: Well, staying in London, we're joined by Quentin Peel. He's an Associate Fellow at Chatham House's Europe Program, as well as a
commentator at the "Financial Times." Quentin, thank you so much for taking the time to join us today.
So given that the Prime Minister, prior to this trip to Washington, announced an increase in defense spending to match 2.5 percent of GDP over
the course of the next two years, and raising that over the course of the next decade, does that buy him credibility with Donald Trump, especially
when you couple that with a post-Brexit U.K., which may not have benefited the country financially and economically since they've left the E.U.? But
for Donald Trump's standpoint, he seems to usually direct a lot of his anger towards the E.U., viewing it as a competitor to the United States.
[12:10:19]
QUENTIN PEEL, ASSOCIATE FELLOW WITH THE EUROPE PROGRAM, CHATHAM HOUSE: Yes. Well, it's certainly a gesture towards Donald Trump, but I don't think
either the defense spending gesture or indeed the nice words that Keir Starmer has said about the importance of this peace initiative from Donald
Trump.
I don't think they're very dramatic. And I don't think that they really disguise the problem that Keir Starmer has got in trying to persuade Mr.
Trump to do something he doesn't want to do. That's to say to provide a real security backstop to more European assistance on the ground for
Ukraine to stop Russia prosecuting this war.
ASHER: As you know, Quentin, we just had the elections in Germany, and the likely new chancellor of Germany is going to be Friedrich Merz, who
essentially came out and said that Europe has to become that much more independent from the U.S. because, in his words, and I'm paraphrasing here,
the U.S. no longer cares that much about Europe.
From your perspective, A, how much truth is there in that statement? And, B, based on that new reality, that new world order, how does Keir Starmer
navigate that as he approaches Donald Trump today?
PEEL: Well, it is Keir Starmer's problem that he wants to be close to America, but he also wants to get close to Europe. And what Friedrich Merz
just said in Germany, I believe, is actually what Keir Starmer really believes himself, but is not prepared to say it in public because he
doesn't want to offend Donald Trump.
That's to say, he knows that Donald Trump doesn't care anything like as much about European security as all his predecessors as American president
have done for many decades.
So really, Keir Starmer is trying to have his cake and eat it. He doesn't want to offend Donald Trump. But equally, he's got to tread a fine line in
trying to get closer to the rest of Europe, because if Donald Trump really does not believe in being the ultimate security backstop for NATO and for
Europe, then the Brits have put all their eggs in the wrong basket.
They've left the European Union, and NATO is not going to be anything like as strong as it used to be. It'll be the European Union that has to pick
up, if you like, the security problems of Europe. And the Brits are going to find that quite uncomfortable.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. And the U.K. has since this war began, really punched above its own weight, I believe, the third largest independent country in terms
of defensive support for Ukraine, following, of course, the United States then Germany.
You heard this week from the prime minister really spelling out the dangers of allowing Russia's aggression to continue and saying that it's a threat,
not only to Ukraine, but far beyond Ukraine's borders.
And that is an argument that had been repelled by U.S. officials. The vice president himself, in the past, called this a territorial dispute. Do you
think that we could see conflict between these two leaders in terms of the real threat that Vladimir Putin poses?
PEEL: I certainly think that the -- that Keir Starmer shares with all other British political leaders this deep mistrust of Vladimir Putin. And that's
something that Donald Trump does not appear to share. He appears to think that he can trust the word of Vladimir Putin.
Now that's a very profound difference. And it's one that they're going to somehow have to paper over if the U.S. is going to be prepared to provide
this security backup that Keir Starmer is seeking.
There is a deep difference, I think, in the view that they have of how much of a threat an aggressive Russia is to the wider security, really, not only
of Europe, but well beyond Europe because Donald Trump seems to share with Mr. Putin this idea that actually, it's power that matters and it's
exercising power in your own backyard.
So if Vladimir Putin, he might let have chunks of Ukraine, just as he would like Vladimir Putin to be perfectly happy if he were to annex Greenland or
even Canada.
[12:15:03]
GOLODRYGA: Yes. And President Trump constantly says that there's an ocean separating Europe from the United States, and this isn't something that
Europe obviously benefits from when it comes to the threat from Vladimir Putin.
Quentin Peel, thank you so much for joining us, and of course we will bring you that news conference and also the video of the prime minister once he
does arrive there at the White House for his meeting with the president.
ASHER: Thank you, Quentin.
All right. The Tate brothers have now arrived in Florida. The right-wing social media influencers were arrested in Romania three years ago for
alleged rape, human trafficking, money laundering. Prosecutors there allowed them to travel while they are still under investigation. Both men
are denying any wrongdoing.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. Andrew Tate racked up billions of views on TikTok with diatribes about male dominance, female submission and wealth.
ASHER: Nada Bashir is following this story for us from London.
So, Nada, we know that prosecutors approved a request in recent days to change the travel restrictions around the Tates. Do we know who made the
request? I mean, a lot of people are asking themselves, how on earth these men were allowed to leave Romania? What do we know?
NADA BASHIR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely a lot of speculation, particularly considering the fact that they are still facing charges, and
of course that legal proceedings are still ongoing. We've heard from the Romanian authorities saying that those legal obligations that they are
facing, except for, of course, now the travel restrictions, do remain in place.
The Tate brothers will both be expected to appear in Romania for court hearings. In fact, we're expecting to see one in late March as well.
But there has been a lot of speculation as to why exactly the prosecutors have decided now to lift that travel ban that was, of course, put in place
upon their arrest in 2022.
A lot of speculation around the possible connections with the Trump administration. Of course, both have been vocal supporters of the Trump
administration and of Donald Trump himself.
We have previously heard reporting from the "Financial Times," citing sources earlier this month that there had been some discussions between
White House officials and Romanian officials with the Trump administration essentially trying to press Romanian authorities to lift this travel
restriction, reportedly through phone calls, as well as a meeting between the Romanian foreign minister and Trump's special envoy during the Munich
Security Conference, which took place just over a week ago.
Now, the Romanian foreign ministry has denied that there was any such pressure from the Trump administration. But, of course, Romania's foreign
minister has acknowledged that there were discussions with U.S. officials with regards to the situation facing the Tate brothers.
But, of course, this has drawn a significant backlash. We've heard from a British lawyer representing some of the alleged victims of the Tate
brothers, who has described this as an outrage, as an embarrassment for Romanian authorities, and has said that there is clear evidence to support
the allegations laid against them.
As you mentioned, they are facing pretty serious charges, including rape, human trafficking, and money laundering.
We have also heard today from four British women who alleged that Andrew Tate raped and coercively controlled them. They spoke out today saying that
they felt re-traumatized upon hearing the news that they had been allowed to leave Romania and travel onwards to the U.S.
And, of course, within Romania, we've been hearing from politicians, one of whom describing this as tarnishing Romania's reputation. But, of course,
authorities there have been clear in underscoring that while in fact this travel ban has indeed been lifted, they are now in Florida as we've seen
just in the last hour, those legal obligations remain in place. They will be expected to fulfill those legal obligations.
But again, it remains to be seen whether or not the carriage of justice will be fully seen through given that they are now in the U.S.
ASHER: All right. Nada Bashir, thank you so much. Appreciate it.
GOLODRYGA: Coming up for us, how much time does it take to wrap up a life's work? Well, for USAID employees fired by Elon Musk, the answer is 15
minutes.
ASHER: And the U.S. sees its first measles death in a decade. We'll look at how fast the disease is spreading in West Texas.
GOLODRYGA: Plus, the shocking deaths of Gene Hackman and his wife. How one of Hollywood's most respected actors is being remembered.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[12:20:00]
GOLODRYGA: Fans around the world are mourning the passing of legendary actor, Gene Hackman.
ASHER: Yes. He and his wife, pianist, Betsy Arakawa, along with their dog, were found dead in their home in New Mexico on Wednesday. "The Associated
Press" reports they were likely dead for some time. And now the gas company is assisting in the investigation.
Police do not suspect any kind of foul play here. Elizabeth Wagmeister looks back at Hackman's life and wonderful legacy.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ELIZABETH WAGMEISTER, CNN ENTERTAINMENT CORRESPONDENT (voice-over: Gene Hackman was the blue-collar common man on screen. It was no act.
GENE HACKMAN, AMERICAN ACTOR: You know, I did a lot of things. I sold shoes, I drove a truck, drove a cab, I jerked sodas.
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): He grew up loving movies starring Jimmy Cagney and Edward G. Robinson.
HACKMAN: My mother and I were at a film once, and she said, I want to see you do that someday. And that was all that was needed.
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): At the Pasadena Playhouse, the aspiring actor met another young actor, Dustin Hoffman. The two were voted least likely to
succeed.
HACKMAN: Take a good look, Pop. I'm Buck Barrow.
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): That all changed when he was cast in "Bonnie and Clyde." Hackman was nominated for an Oscar, the first of numerous anti-hero
roles from the 1960s on.
The acclaim covered up a potential career disaster. He was fired from "The Graduate," starring his pal, Hoffman, after just two weeks as Mr. Robinson.
HACKMAN: I thought it was like the beginning of the end for me.
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): Hackman pressed on. A ski coach in "Downhill Racer," an astronaut in "Marooned," and a second best supporting actor
nomination for "I Never Sang for My Father."
There were tensions on set with father Melvyn Douglas who had wanted another co-star. In real life, Hackman's own father left the family when he
was just 13.
HACKMAN: When you decide to do a role, you choose both the good and the bad. That's happened to you and you try to make that come alive.
All right. Popeye's here. Put your hands on your heads. Get off the bar and get on the wall.
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): As fierce New York City police detective Popeye Doyle, a defiant Hackman burst through the screen in "The French
Connection." He didn't like playing a bigot beating up people.
HACKMAN: I wanted to be fired from that film the first couple of days because I was very uncomfortable.
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): Also testing his nerves, driving in one of the most famous car chases in movie history.
HACKMAN: They would go right down the street without any crowd control and it was really scary.
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): The role he wanted out of won him an Oscar for Best Actor in 1972. The award ignited a monumental film biography from "The
Poseidon Adventure."
HACKMAN: You need to stand aside and close that door to keep the air from coming in or you can try to stop me.
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): To "The Conversation."
HACKMAN: One sure fire rule that I have learned in this business is that I don't know anything about human nature. I don't know anything about
curiosity.
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): It wasn't always deadly serious. In "Young Frankenstein."
HACKMAN: What's your name? I didn't get that.
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): And there was "Superman."
[12:25:01]
HACKMAN: Oh, yes. Of course, you've been there. I do forget you. Get around, don't you?
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): Now a huge star, Hackman said he always liked the idea of Hollywood, but not the hoopla.
HACKMAN: Personality-wise, I don't fit in.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's been five years.
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): Hackman said his favorite film was the offbeat "Scarecrow" with Al Pacino, which was not a commercial hit.
HACKMAN: I don't care what the scoreboard says at the end of the game. In my book, we're going to be winners.
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): He was the basketball coach in "Hoosiers," one of the best sports films ever made.
Hackman was nominated for an Oscar again for "Mississippi Burning."
HACKMAN: You smile when the bulldozer ran over the black kid's body? Get your --
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): He won Best Supporting Actor for "Unforgiven."
HACKMAN: When he fires that, take out your pistols and shoot him down like a mangy scoundrel he is.
It kind of puts a book into my career for me. I'm sure I'll do other films, but I can kind of relax as long as Dustin doesn't get another one.
Our country?
DUSTIN HOFFMAN, AMERICAN ACTOR: Yes.
HACKMAN: I didn't figure you were a patriot, Mr. Rohr.
WAGMEISTER (voice-over): Hackman finally did get to work with his lifelong friend in "Runaway Jury."
HACKMAN: I've loved every minute of my career. There's been, you know, tough times, of course, but I like the process so much.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ASHER: Welcome back to ONE WORLD, I'm Zain Asher.
GOLODRYGA: And I'm Bianna Golodryga.
Any minute now we expect British Prime Minister Keir Starmer to arrive at the White House with President Trump. Their meeting comes amid a noticeable
geopolitical shift with the U.S. Transatlantic alliance on unusually shaky ground now.
[12:30:09]
ASHER: The prime minister came to Washington seeking assurances that America will guarantee Ukraine's security three years after Russia's
unprovoked invasion. And he's calling for a U.S. backstop to possible European peacekeeping troops in Ukraine, warning it's the only way to stop
Moscow from attacking again.
But on Wednesday, Mr. Trump said that that is Europe's responsibility, not his.
GOLODRYGA: Meantime, Washington and Kyiv are trying to hammer out a deal of their own that would give the U.S. access to Ukraine's mineral wealth. A
senior U.S. administration official says it does not, however, contain any commitments for future American support to Ukraine.
ASHER: Zelenskyy is expected to discuss and potentially sign that deal when he comes to meet Donald Trump at the White House on Friday.
CNN's Nick Paton Walsh visited a titanium mining site in Ukraine and explains the complexities of this deal.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTENTIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: You joined me at a titanium mine in Zhytomyr to the west of Kyiv in Ukraine. A
critical earth mineral, some call it a rare-earth mineral.
And behind me is the huge volume of water used to blast into the ore. And you can see just them dropping off what they've scraped from one of the
huge basins here.
Look, this mine has its problems. Russian attacks on the electricity infrastructure here that keeps it running means sometimes they get three
hours functionality a day and the electricity is very expensive. All these elements really go into explaining how urgently Ukraine wants some kind of
investment, but also too, the complexity of how much money you might expect to get back from your immediate investment. They're not running on a profit
here at all.
And you also get a sense, I think, as well of exactly the scale of what Ukraine might potentially be able to offer here. Titanium used in so many
daily products that we have.
Now, the deal in question, which is most likely to be signed before or during the Friday visit to the White House by Ukraine's President Volodymyr
Zelenskyy, is not that specific. It is a framework. It talks about creating a reconstruction and investment fund for Ukraine. And it talks about
relevant resources. It doesn't specify what they are. It puts some things, says it won't be some things, but it says we'll define what is going to be
included in a later fund agreement. They'll start negotiating as soon as this first one is actually signed.
Complicated, yes, but I think that's a deliberate design to weave for two of the almost reconcilable positions we're really seeing here. President
Trump on one side saying, I want debt repaid and I want it repaid using these natural resources. Zelenskyy saying, I don't recognize any of that
money from the Biden administration as debt. It was grants and I want to see this turning into something about investing in Ukraine as well.
So that complexity really, I think, fudged around by this document that seems to get everyone over that obstacle. But that doesn't stop the major
focus of Friday, which is getting President Trump and President Zelenskyy in the same room together, healing that horrific 10 days ago rift that
began between them and enabling maybe the U.S.-Ukraine relationship to get back on an even keel.
But that's big keel itself, as indeed is turning something like this, massive as it is, into a profit that gets near the billions of dollars, the
half trillion dollars that President Trump initially said he wanted back from Ukraine.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: All right. Thanks to Nick Paton Walsh for that report.
Meantime, longtime employees of the U.S. Agency for International Development are being given just 15 minutes to collect their personal
belongings.
ASHER: Yes. The agency is effectively being shuttered by Elon Musk's DOGE cutbacks. More than 5,000 USAID workers have been put on leave or laid off
this week. They're dealing with a lot of frustration, a lot of confusion over there.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RANDY CHESTER, AMERICAN FOREIGN SERVICE ASSOCIATION: It's been quite tragic. I think there's been a lot of a lack of communication, in general,
about what's happening to USAID. Staff don't know day in and day out what they're supposed to do. We've had our emails. Most people have had their
email accounts shut off so they're getting notices third party from Facebook groups and from chat groups. So it's really a haphazard way to
tell people what to do and how to do it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: And staying in Washington, we're going to go just a few blocks away from there to the White House, where you now see Prime Minister Keir
Starmer arriving for his first face-to-face meeting with President Trump at the Oval Office.
There you see the president greeting the prime minister as the two are expected to walk in for their meeting. And if past is prologue here, as
this administration has laid out their chain of events for meetings. The press spray in the pool will be allowed to come in. And in just a few
moments, we will bring you over to the White House there for their meeting.
Meantime, let's go to Arlette Saenz, who is outside the USAID headquarters in Washington. So a tale of two Washingtons at this point. One, the
president meeting with the prime minister of the United Kingdom. Where you're standing, there are some supporters, standing behind you offering
their sympathies for those USAID workers who have been told they just have 15 minutes to collect their belongings and leave.
[12:35:17]
ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Bianna. For really the past four hours, we have seen a steady stream of USAID workers coming out of the
headquarters here where they have come to collect their belongings. These employees who were either terminated, laid off, or placed on
administrative leave, or were given specific windows, hours where they could come in and then are expected to clear out their belongings within 15
minutes.
The people have emerged with suitcases, carting boxes, and also tote bags with their items that they've come to collect, as now the agency and these
workers themselves are facing so much uncertainty about their future.
Now, as they've come out, we have heard rounds of applause from the supporters who have gathered here. As you can see behind me, there is now
this boxed wall of support where people can come and sign messages thanking so many of these workers for their service.
We spoke with one of those young workers, a woman who had been participating in the Presidential Management Fellowship Program, which was
eliminated via executive order by President Trump last week. Here is how she described the moment when she came back here to collect her belongings
today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SAENZ: So what was it like coming back here today?
JULIANE ALFEN, FIRES USAID EMPLOYEE: Heartbreaking. Walking in the building and seeing all the pictures of our projects being -- that were taking down,
work like getting children vaccines or providing food aid, things that really matter, being treated as if they're nothing, it's really hard to
see.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SAENZ: And, Bianna, I actually want to show you one visible sign of protest that we saw today. Earlier, when we arrived here, there was a black tape,
as you can still see there, covering the USAID logo outside of the headquarters. One worker who had been terminated last week, her and others
came and tore off that tape.
She told me that they still believe that the mission of USAID exists within many of the workers. They are holding out hope that there is somehow that
this foreign assistance will continue at a time of so much uncertainty for the agency, but she said not to count out these workers and not to count
out the work of USAID going forward.
GOLODRYGA: All right. Arlette Saenz for us. Thank you so much.
ASHER: All right. Time now for The Exchange. Let's begin with Keir Starmer, who literally we just saw there just arrived at the White House a few
moments ago to try to convince Donald Trump to give some security guarantees to Ukraine.
There he is, our senior politics reporter and fellow Brit, by the way. This is why, Stephen, you are the perfect person to talk to, fellow Brit living
in the United States.
So, Stephen, one of the good things about this meeting for Keir Starmer, one of the things that's working in his favor, is the fact that just a
couple of days ago we saw him make that announcement that the U.K. is going to be spending, I believe it was 13.7 additional billions of pounds on
defense.
Just in terms of Europe stepping up its defense overall, that is something that President Trump really wants to see. So that's something that, as he
approaches and goes into this meeting, that's something that's going to work in his favor. Walk us through that.
STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN POLITICS SENIOR REPORTER: I think so, but at the same time, the U.K. is saying it's going to spend 2.5 percent of GDP by
2027 on defense, which is higher than the NATO two percent target where it currently is.
Trump wants five percent spending from NATO members. Some people think he might probably be OK, perhaps, with, say, 3.5 percent total. So, Starmer is
still short of where Trump would like European nations to be.
But Pete Hegseth, the U.S. defense secretary, said this was a good step in the right direction. So he's done a lot to, I think, prepare the
atmospherics for this meeting.
But the fundamental problem that he's going to face is -- and there have been differences between British prime ministers and American presidents
before, despite the strength of special relationship, Suez Crisis in the '50s, for example, or there was tension between Margaret Thatcher and
Ronald Reagan over the Falkland Islands.
But there's never been a question of whether the U.S. president was on the same side as the British prime minister, dating right back to Winston
Churchill and Franklin Roosevelt in the Second World War. That is now in question.
The things that Stammer wants from Trump, security guarantees for Ukraine, an undertaking to still be the backstop for European security itself.
There's good indications, I think, that Trump isn't really interested in a lot of these things. His world view is completely different.
This week, the United States voted with Russia against condemning its aggression against Ukraine. So there's been a massive philosophical shift
in Washington, and that is the big challenge, I think, that Starmer faces this afternoon.
[12:40:09]
GOLODRYGA: Stephen, personal relationships aside, does President Trump view the U.K. separate from the EU, which it technically is? He constantly
bashes the E.U., even from an economic standpoint, as a trading threat to the United States, established to hurt the United States and that was their
sole purpose. That's constantly a refrain. We hear from him both in his first term and just this week as well.
Given that he was a supporter of Brexit, does he view the United Kingdom in a different lens?
COLLINSON: I think going back to that Brexit vote, not only was he a supporter, he actually claimed that he was the person that helped initiate
it. It's not true. But that is something that Trump believes.
So I think you're right to identify the fact that he does see the U.K. as somewhat different from Europe.
At the same time, and the U.K. actually has a more balanced trading relationship with the United States than Europe and the United States have.
At the same time, Trump sees nations through a prism of strength and weakness. And there's no doubt that the U.K. has less influence in the
world since Brexit, because it's less able to play its traditional role as helping to explain the E.U. to Americans and vice versa.
So I don't think necessarily that viewing the United Kingdom as out of Europe is going to help the U.K. that much, so.
And the other part of this, of course, is that Trump is preparing big sanctions, big tariffs against the European Union. If those were imposed,
the European economy is weakened, that will still have a knock-on effect on Britain. So, Starmer really doesn't want those tariffs to go into force.
And in many ways, if Trump weakens the European economy, that is opposite to another one of his priorities, which is getting European countries to
spend more on defense. It's going to be harder for them to raise their budgets on defense because they've got these massive social welfare
programs they're paying for if their economies go into the tank.
So there's a lot of contradictions here. So while Starmer is trying to present himself a little bit as a bridge between the E.U. and the U.S., the
problem is that Trump doesn't necessarily cross bridges. He often burns them down.
ASHER: That was a -- that was a good little analogy there, Stephen.
Just in terms of what we saw earlier in the week with President Macron coming to Washington and meeting with President Trump. Obviously, it was
sort of the same kind of theme, this idea that, you know, telling President Trump that he shouldn't cave into Vladimir Putin, that he should stand
shoulder to shoulder with Ukraine.
Based, though, on the Cabinet meeting that we saw yesterday. I didn't see any evidence that the meeting with President Macron, early in the week,
made any difference whatsoever to President Trump's line of thinking. Will Keir Starmer have better luck, do you think?
COLLINSON: I think you're right. I think it was a good, humid meeting. Perhaps it mended some of the atmospherics between the Europeans and the
United States. It didn't change Trump's mind on this question of security guarantees, which both Starmer and Macron want, if they're to send their
troops into Ukraine as part of an eventual peacekeeping force after any peace deal.
So it's one thing to have a good relationship with Trump. He is very deep- seated in many of his beliefs, and his belief is that Europe should stand on its own two feet.
I think the -- behind the scenes what Macron and Starmer are trying to do is to present something to Trump and this is, OK, you need a big win, you
need this peace deal. The only way to have a genuine peace deal is to have peacekeeping troops with U.S. security guarantees so that Putin doesn't
invade, because if Putin reignites the war after an eventual peace deal, that will make you, President Trump, look weak.
So they're trying to give him something and make him understand that by backing their solution, he will get much more out of it in the end, because
that basically is what it's about for Trump. He wants to be known as a peacemaker. He wants to win the Nobel Peace Prize.
So that's what they're trying to do. That's how they're trying to work in this gray area between the very black and white U.S., Ukrainian, European,
and Russian positions.
ASHER: Stephen Collinson, live for us. Thank you so much.
COLLINSON: Thanks.
ASHER: All right. On Wednesday, Elon Musk spoke at length about DOGE's efforts to reform and reduce the size of the U.S. federal government under
the Trump administration. Musk defended DOGE's admission, but also admitted that the group has made some mistakes early on. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ELON MUSK, PRESIDENTIAL ADVISER: We won't be perfect. But when we make a mistake, we'll fix it very quickly. So for example, with USAID, one of the
things we accidentally cancelled very briefly was Ebola. Ebola prevention. I think we all want Ebola prevention. So we restored the prevention
immediately.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[12:45:11]
GOLODRYGA: Just a flippant sort of approach to, yes, we kind of screwed up on Ebola, but we fixed it right away. Well, maybe not, because according to
"The Washington Post," current and former USAID officials claim that Musk's statement about Ebola programs is simply not true.
"The Post" reports a waiver was issued allowing USAID to respond to an Ebola outbreak in Uganda, but prevention efforts have not resumed.
Meantime, back here in the U.S., the measles outbreak in Texas keeps growing and has now turned deadly.
Ahead on CNN, what health authorities are saying about the spread of the disease?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GOLODRYGA: OK. We are keeping a close eye on Texas, where health officials say an unvaccinated school-aged child has died from measles. This is the
first reported measles death in the U.S. since 2015.
ASHER: Yes. And it comes as an outbreak linked to the town of Lubbock continues to grow with more than 20 -- 120 rather, confirmed cases. CNN's
Meg Tirrell is following the story for us.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MEG TIRRELL, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Texas health officials said yesterday at a press conference that they really weren't prepared to see a
death this early on in the outbreak, suggesting they expect this outbreak potentially to grow and to continue for some time.
They didn't share many details about the child who died. We know that they were school-age that they were unvaccinated, and they had been
hospitalized. This is the first death from measles in the United States in a decade since 2015.
And it's especially tragic because as these health officials emphasized yesterday, measles is a vaccine preventable disease with a vaccine that is
safe and effective and has been available for decades.
This outbreak now has grown to 124 cases in West Texas. There are a few more over the border in New Mexico. Eighteen people have been hospitalized.
The majority of these cases are school-age children, some even younger. We heard about one case in a baby who is too young to be vaccinated.
Also, the vast majority of these cases are unvaccinated. And we know that this area of West Texas has an especially low vaccination rate. And so it's
very concerning to officials that such a contagious disease is spreading there and we do expect to see more cases.
Now, Health Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. was asked about the measles outbreak yesterday during a cabinet meeting and he had this to say about
it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[12:50:07]
ROBERT KENNEDY, JR, U.S. HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES SECRETARY: Incidentally, there have been four measles outbreaks this year in this country. Last
year, there were 16. So it's not unusual. We have measles outbreaks every year.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TIRRELL: Those comments were dismaying to a lot of people in public health who point out that measles was eliminated in the U.S. in the year 2000.
And while we do still see outbreaks, we see a few dozen cases, at least in the U.S. every year. This has become so uncommon because of the vaccine in
most cases that many doctors say they've never even seen a case of measles.
But the Texas doctors noted yesterday that while that was even more the case about two decades ago, as vaccination rates have come down,
particularly in small pockets, small communities, as rates get lower, they have been starting to see more measles.
And so that's incredibly concerning. And, of course, the first death in a decade makes this situation, yes, unusual.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ASHER: All right. We just want to quickly update you on the death of Gene Hackman and his wife. Santa Fe authorities are saying that they did not
find any signs of a carbon monoxide leak or poisoning at their house. That they did not find any signs of a carbon monoxide leak, any kind of carbon
monoxide poisoning at their house.
Obviously, the mystery continues as to how this actor and his wife passed away. They were found dead in their home in New Mexico. The Oscar-winning
actor was 95 years old.
I mean, obviously this is a remarkable iconic actor beloved by so many.
GOLODRYGA: And such a bizarre way to lose his life at the age of 95 years old with his wife and dog there. We'll bring you any more information as it
develops. Meantime, we'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ASHER: All right. Imagine living through. 20 U.S. presidential administrations, the U.S. civil rights movement, and the moon landing, not
to mention the Second World War and the list goes on.
GOLODRYGA: That's a lot to write a book about. Meet Nesta Leeloo, a 108 years old. She's the retired seamstress, makes her home near Miami where
she's been talking about what keeps her going with reporter, Joan Murray.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOAN MURRAY, REPORTER (voice-over): At 108 years old, Nesta Leeloo still dances every chance she gets.
[12:55:00]
NESTA LEELOO, 108 YEARS OLD: I feel just the same, just as I was 20. No aches, no pain.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Demonstrating her leadership and commitment to service.
MURRAY (voice-over): Leeloo, a great, great grandmother was recognized as part of Women's History Month in Tamarac for her strength, optimism, and
perseverance.
MURRAY: I think everybody wants to know what would be the secret to surviving as long as you have.
N. LEELOO: I can't say. I never drank. I never smoked until I was an adult. I had a good, clean life.
MURRAY (voice-over): She grew up in Jamaica, one of 12 children. She moved to the States and raised six kids. Most were with her for the Tamarac
celebration and weighed in on their mother's longevity.
PRISCILLA ALEXANDER, NESTA LEELOO'S DAUGHTER: It was her upbringing as a child, and everything was on the land, cows, goats, and the food,
everything was planted.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A good heart and a tough head.
HENRIK LEELOO, NESTA LEELOO'S SON: It's a miracle, 108 years. I hope I can reach there too.
MURRAY (voice-over): A lifelong seamstress, Nesta Leeloo, still makes her own clothes and her children's outfits. But her superpower? You will never
guess.
N. LEELOO: I love to clean the kitchen.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, my gosh.
N. LEELOO: Because when you come out and see everything shining, it makes you feel good.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Good for you.
GOLODRYGA: Unbelievable.
ASHER: My favorite line though, I never smoked, I never drank until I was an adult.
GOLODRYGA: Until I was an adult.
ASHER: That is literally the best. I'm going to think about that.
GOLODRYGA: Oh, man, I'll have what she's having. Our thanks to Joan Murray for that reporting.
That is -- she looks amazing.
ASHER: And she still cleans the kitchen.
GOLODRYGA: Wow.
ASHER: She's doing better than me.
GOLODRYGA: Great genes.
ASHER: All right. Thank you so much. I'm Zain Asher. I appreciate you watching.
GOLODRYGA: And I'm Bianna Golodryga. "AMANPOUR" is up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[13:00:00]
END
