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One World with Zain Asher
Global Stocks Selloffs As U.S. And China Escalate Trade War; Trump's tariffs Shake Markets, Fuel Recession Fear; Trump Tariffs Expected To Raise Prices For Consumers; Local U.S. Furniture Store Braces For Impact Of New Tariffs; China Announces 34 Percent Reciprocal Tariff On U.S. Goods; Kansas City Grapples With Impact Of DOGE Layoffs; Feud Over Allowing New moms In Congress To Vote Remotely; ;Aired 12:00-1:00p ET
Aired April 04, 2025 - 12:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[12:00:27]
BIANNA GOLODRYGA, CNN ANCHOR: A highly uncertain outlook. Jerome Powell speaks out on how tariffs will affect the American economy. The second hour
of ONE WORLD starts right now.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Every country's called us. That's the beauty of what we do. We put ourselves in the driver's seat.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: Countries across the globe are scrambling to cope with Trump's new tariffs. If America's allies are in the hot seat, why do its
adversaries appear to be sitting quite pretty?
Also ahead, what will the tariffs mean for you? How your trip to the grocery store is likely to change.
And later.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PORTIA MOORE, MOM OF CHILDREN IN PHOTO THAT OBAMA PHOTOBOMBED: I was like, what did you say? And he was like, that's President Obama. And I was like,
oh my God.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: A moment you'll have to see to believe, President Obama photobombing a family portrait.
Hello, everyone. Live from New York, I'm Bianna Golodryga. Zain is off today. You are watching the second hour of ONE WORLD.
Global markets are down sharply on this last trading day of the week caused by Donald Trump's trade war.
President Trump arrived at his golf course in Florida a short time ago where he has made several social media posts in support of his tariffs.
Among them, he called on the U.S. Federal Reserve Chairman to cut interest rates to help the economy during uncertain times.
But just a few minutes ago, Jerome Powell says he's worried that tariffs will boost inflation.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JEROME POWELL, CHAIRMAN, U.S. FEDERAL RESERVE: Well, uncertainty remains elevated. It is now becoming clear that tariff increases will be
significantly larger than expected. And the same is likely to be true of the economic effects, which will include higher inflation and slower
growth.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: Well, China is among the nations responding to the swiftest to Trump's tariffs. Beijing has slapped a stiff 34 percent tariff on all
American goods sold there.
The U.S. Secretary of State says everyone needs to remain calm and that all of this will work itself out soon, even as he acknowledged that the markets
are crashing in response.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MARCO RUBIO, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: Their markets are reacting to a dramatic change in the global order in terms of trade.
Businesses around the world, including in trade and global trade, they just need to know what the rules are. Once they know what the rules are, they
will adjust to those rules.
The president rightly has concluded that the current status of global trade is bad for America and good for a bunch of other people. And he's going to
reset it. And he's absolutely right to do it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: But despite China's defiance, there are signs that some nations are bowing to Trump's pressure. Cambodia says that it will cut tariffs on
several U.S. products from 35 percent to just five percent.
And Trump says that he has spoken to the leader of Vietnam, who has also offered to cut tariffs on U.S. goods.
Well, his nations around the globe are adjusting to the tariff shockwave, a few countries escaped Trump's punitive treatment. Among those, quite
curious, Russia, Belarus, Cuba, and North Korea, some of the most heavily sanctioned countries, all surviving additional levies.
Moscow says that it was left untouched because they have no tangible trade with Washington due to sanctions. Sources say the White House defended
leaving those countries out because they are already facing extremely high tariffs. And any imposed sanctions preclude any meaningful trade.
Let's go to CNN's Jeff Zeleny joining us from Florida with more. As we noted, the president of its golf course there, while digging his heels in,
saying that his policies won't change, also touting two conversations that he's had with Asian leaders, Cambodia and Vietnam, and their willingness to
lower their tariffs in response.
I would imagine he's getting a lot of phone calls from world leaders who are worried.
JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF U.S. NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: There's no question that the White House and the administration has been fielding
calls from foreign leaders, as well as business leaders, both here in the United States and indeed around the world, about the tariff policy.
What's less clear is if there is room for a negotiation. Commerce secretary Howard Lutnick said yesterday, the president was not open to negotiation.
The president himself said when he was announcing these tariffs on Wednesday that this is a national emergency, not a time for negotiation.
However, if past his prologue, we know that the president does negotiating on these things. And as yours is saying, Bianna, there are some early
examples of that.
Just a short time ago, the president read out this call that he had with the leader of Vietnam. Let's take a look at it.
[12:05:03]
He said, I just had a very productive call with a To Lam (ph), the general secretary of the Communist Party of Vietnam who told me that Vietnam wants
to cut their tariffs down to zero if they're able to make an agreement with the U.S. So that is a question.
As those tariffs are set to go into effect on Wednesday, next Wednesday, of course, the first round is expected to go into effect at midnight. How many
negotiations will there be?
But what this has caused is uncertainty in the market, you can see the financial markets here in the U.S., as well as around the world, have been
rattled by the uncertainty that all of this has created.
But most strikingly, the president this morning calling on the Federal Reserve Chair to lower interest rates. Of course, the Federal Reserve
operates independently. Jerome Powell has, in the past, suggested that he would not be taking guidance from the president. But he did warn of
sustained inflation to come because of these tariff policies.
Bianna.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. He warned of sustained inflation to come, slower growth, and perhaps elevated risk of higher unemployment, as well, all stemming
from the president's tariffs.
Jeff Zeleny, thank you so much.
Well, Trump's highest tariff is on one of the poorest nations in the world. The tiny African kingdom of Lesotho was hit with a 50 percent tariff. One
analyst says, it could demolish the country's economy entirely.
On Friday, official scramble to gather a delegation in hopes that meetings in Washington would lead to a deal. Locals are sounding the alarm.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TEBOHO KOBELI, QUANTUM APPAREL REPRESENTATIVE: We were supplying that market duty free. So now with the 50 percent high, it means it's
impossible. Remember, we are competing -- we are competing with other countries worldwide. So it is impossible.
PHATHELA MAMUTU, TEXTILE WORKER: I'm very worried about this happening from America. Well, 50 percent is not OK as well, because our job cannot finish
any time. Even the payment is cannot be OK. I'm very worried about this.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: In March, Donald Trump mocked Lesotho as a country, quote, nobody has ever heard of.
Well, the same goes that when America sneezes, the rest of the world catches a cold. Pity, shorthand, of course, to describe how changes in the
world's biggest economy ripple out to impact everyone else.
Well, as Paul Donovan, chief economist at UBS Global Wealth Management told CNN, quote, the U.S. isn't sneezing. The U.S. is hacking off one of its
limbs.
So let's take a closer look at how this could all ripple out. Diane Swonk is chief economist at the accounting giant, KPMG. She joins us now live
from Chicago.
So the good news, Diane, is that the economy was on solid footing here in the United States prior to just a few days ago. And you compare that to
where things were headed five years ago when we saw a similar selloff in the markets. And that was a complete shutdown due to COVID.
I guess the bad news is that the longer these tariffs are actually in place, the more self-fulfilling they will be and then cause lasting damage
on the economy. Just talk to us about some of your top concerns right now.
DIANE SWONK, CHIEF ECONOMIST, KPMG: So that's exactly it. And you're hearing what the worry is, is that tariffs are stagflationary. And this
could be the high watermark in employment for the year.
We've got not only the spillover effects of freezes and funding by the federal government to National Institutes of Health and a variety of other
high-level institutions.
Also, we're seeing the cuts in federal government employment, which result in about two cuts over time in the private sector as well. We start to see
the very beginning of that, but we haven't yet seen the full effects of that.
And then you get tariffs, which are stagflationary. And that's what you're hearing echoed in Chairman Powell's comments today as he says, listen,
we're in no hurry to cut rates. You know, financial markets are certainly melting down, finally taking into account the higher tariff scenario for
longer that we saw on April 2nd. That's important.
But also, it is very difficult to just go ahead and cut rates when the embers of inflation are still smoldering. And you're going to get an
additional bump in inflation due to tariffs. So the things that financial markets are struggling with, what used to be just a growth side where they
would see the Fed automatically cut, that is not as easy right now.
And Chairman Powell put out that out there, and he said, we're in no hurry on rate cuts. And that sort of started to scale back the market
expectations for rate cuts that the Fed can just come in and save the economy, given this kind of policy and how unique it is.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. And just look at Turkey as a case study of what happens when you try to artificially bring inflation down by cutting rates. It
instead actually does the opposite, which is one of the reasons, I believe, Fed Chair Powell says that they are in no rush at this point.
[12:10:11]
One of the factors heading into these tariffs being announced was uncertainty in the markets. That's what we continue to hear from
economists, from businesses, from different world leaders. And now we know what these tariffs are and they're still resulting in uncertainty because
as we note, the president at any given moment, is suggesting that he's willing to negotiate with country A, B or C. What does that do to
stability?
SWONK: Well, uncertainty is its own tax, that economic activity. It operates, I've often used it like a broken stop light at a busy
intersection. People don't know how to get across it and they go cautiously. Some do a U-turn and opt out entirely. That's what we're seeing
in real time.
We saw consumer spending has slowed, except for the scramble to get vehicles ahead of tariffs. We've seen businesses get very hesitant, their
optimism has plummeted along with consumer sentiment and worries about both higher inflation and job security.
All of that uncertainty is because of the nature of which we are seeing tariffs were literally with a stroke of a pet pen. They could be lifted or
levied given where we're at right now with executive orders.
But also what we don't know, given China's move today to retaliate, is there going to be more moves to retaliate and a tit for tat trade war that
could blossom and do something much more corrosive for the global economy. That's what we still don't know.
And what many traders were hoping and financial markets I think wrongly were expecting was all of a sudden we'd have certainty on April 2nd. And
instead, we are still in this very big world of uncertainty, which also undermines some of the very goals the administration is hoping to achieve.
And that is you need certainty to know whether or not tariffs are going to play in place or not. What is going to happen if you are going to even
consider onshoring.
And we know the economics of tariff show that the blow to welfare in the economy for the overall economy in most households is greater than any jobs
saved in protected sectors, because there's job losses elsewhere.
GOLODRYGA: This may sound wonky, but I know you can explain it to our viewers. Rightly so, so many are focused on the numbers, the Dow Jones
Industrial Average, the S&P 500, but talk to us about why it is so significant to pay attention to the bond market as well and how that is
responding to this news.
SWONK: So, so far, we've really seen this interesting move where the bond market has rallied and we saw bond yields come down because they're worried
about a global recession.
What they're not pricing in yet is this sort of what the pushback won, the bond market was also expecting to see what was going to go on. They thought
the Fed could just come in and save them.
Jay Powell pushed back on that today, as Chairman of the Fed, saying we are in no hurry at this moment in time to cut rates and that there are, you
know, rising both higher inflation risk and higher unemployment risks in the forecast, given where we stand today.
And I think that's very important because we've seen the bond market, the bond yields come down in response to this idea that there could be a
recession and we could see more rate cuts going forward. That is not fully reflecting what's going on in terms of the risk of a more stagflationary
economy.
And the Federal Reserve, like you mentioned, you know, with the Bank of Turkey and what happened there, the Federal Reserve has evoked the 1970s as
a cautionary tale many times in the months leading up to the ramping up of tariffs, because they were concerned about not repeating those kinds of
mistakes that have been made in other central banks and in the U.S. in the 1970s.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. I don't think many Americans went to the ballot box in booth in November thinking they'd be talking about stagflation just a few
months after the election, but here we are.
Diane Swonk, thank you so much.
SWONK: Thank you.
GOLODRYGA: Well, for some more perspective on the trade war and the market reaction, let's bring in CNN's chief data analyst Harry Enten. Harry, my
friend.
HARRY ENTEN, CNN CHIEF DATA ANALYST: Hello.
GOLODRYGA: Zain's not here, so it's just the two of us.
ENTEN: No, I know. Just the two of us. Yes, continue.
GOLODRYGA: So I don't think this is going to be a controversial question. People don't like these tariffs. That's obvious from your initial polling,
yes?
ENTEN: I mean, no kidding. They hate them. You know, I'll go to the -- I'll go to the blackboard here for a second and then we'll dive in on what the
heck's going on in the market.
[12:15:04]
I have looked at a ton of polling. The most recent polling, of course, was from CBS News. And how many Americans opposed these tariffs? Fifty-six
percent opposed the idea of tariffs. Generally speaking on all goods, on automobiles as well.
You look at poll after poll after poll. There is not a single poll that I can find in which a majority of Americans actually like the idea of
tariffing everyone. Maybe they like the idea of tariffing China, but not everyone.
And of course, one of the reasons that they dislike it is because of what it's doing in the market right now. And, you know, this to me says it all.
S&P 500 drops of at least five percent at this point in a presidency. There are only two figures on the screen going all the way back since the S&P 500
was created back in 1957. One of them was George W. Bush, right? There was an 18 percent drop in the market coming out of the dot-com bubble burst
back then.
Here, you see 10 percent. This number is no longer actually the correct number because the market's falling. Now we're talking about a drop of 14
percent based upon my real time math. You know I like doing it quick and fast.
And, of course, what is the key difference between the Trump drop and the Bush drop? I mentioned it earlier on that dot-com bubble burst. Bubble
burst. Here's the key difference. It's Donald Trump inherited a bull market. He inherited a bull market, right?
George Bush inherited a bear market or a market that was going bear because of the dot-com bubble burst. So Trump is the only one, the only president,
since the S&P 500 was created back in '57 to an inherited a bull market.
And then basically, although we're right on the precipice of it turning into a bear market. That is what is so unique about this.
And one little last thing for you, Bianna, you know, I hear a lot of people saying, oh, you know, it's the stock market. It doesn't represent the
economy, et cetera. That's true to some extent.
But you know, the majority of Americans are now involved in the stock market, either directly or indirectly, 62 percent of them are. This ain't
1974 anymore when it was just 23 percent because of 401(ks) because of Roth IRAs.
The bottom line is this doesn't just hurt Wall Street, it hurts Main Street as well. And I think the American people saw it coming. And that was why,
as I pointed out at the beginning here, 56 percent opposed.
And then I have one little last question for you if we have time. Have you ever seen the movie "Back to School" with Rodney Dangerfield?
GOLODRYGA: Yes, of course.
ENTEN: Of course, right? He was Thornton Melon. And Thornton Melon was a secretly an expert diver. And I think that is exactly what's going on right
now. Thornton Melon could dive into the plunge we're currently going into at this particular point in the stock market. It's just no bueno for
anyone.
GOLODRYGA: No one's having fun. Can't even go into the weekend on a lighter note, Harry.
ENTEN: No. No.
GOLODRYGA: Nothing to smile about. Yes.
ENTEN: There's nothing to smile about. This is terrible. Everyone's losing money.
GOLODRYGA: No bueno. Harry Enten --
ENTEN: No Bueno.
GOLODRYGA: -- here's to better days soon.
ENTEN: Better days soon. Soon. No problem.
GOLODRYGA: Good to see you, my friend.
ENTEN: Nice to see you.
GOLODRYGA: Well, as the world grapples with the aftermath of President Trump's tariff plan, one of the big questions is, who will pay for them?
CNN's Richard Quest explains where consumers will feel the most impact.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS EDITOR AT LARGE: It is easy to think of tariffs on the big stuff, the automobiles, the dishwashers and the like.
But the truth is, most of us will feel our tariffs at places like this, the Heavenly Deli, where you buy your food and drink every single day.
Just look. Tariffs, tariffs, tariffs. A bottle of San Pellegrino. It comes from Italy within the E.U. Now I know this costs about five bucks here.
Tariff of 20 percent from the E.U. So you're talking about roughly a dollar or so.
Who's going to pay the dollar? The importer passes it to the distributor, the wholesaler. To the good lady at the desk then pass it on to me.
You then start looking at other things. Licorice from Australia. Now there's an election in Australia at the moment, Anthony Albanese is facing
the public. How is he going to explain how this $7.99 licorice is now suddenly 10 percent more expensive? What's it going to do to the sales?
You've got to buy a new charger. You can never have enough chargers. Of course, Heavenly sells chargers. The charger and the cable come to about 20
bucks. But these come from China and there is a 34 percent tariff on from China, 34 percent of 20 bucks. Do the mathematics yourself. Suddenly this
becomes more expensive.
And then you've got the little stuff. The ghost pepper spicy chicken flavor from Malaysia costs $2.99. It's described as "spicy madness". How about how
much madness once the 24 percent tariff goes on, and the 2.99 goes up.
[12:20:01]
As it says here, "flaming spicy madness". Are they talking about the food or the tariff?
Whichever way you look at it, everything's going up in some shape or form, and it really is just a question of who is going to eat the cost.
Richard Quest, CNN, at the deli in New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GOLODRYGA: Still to come for us.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our car is $50,000, now 25 percent. That's $12,500 more. That just became $62,500.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: We hear from Americans who say they're actually happy about President Trump's tariffs on imported cars and other goods.
Also ahead.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DANA BASH, CNN ANCHOR: When the Constitution was written, it was written by men for men.
REP. BRITTANY PETTERSEN (D-CO): You're right. This place is not built for young families and it's definitely not built to meet the needs of young
women.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: CNN's Dana Bash went to meet the new moms trying to change some old rules on Capitol Hill. That's just a little later this hour.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GOLODRYGA: Well, there's a broad consensus among economists that President Trump's tariffs will raise prices for U.S. consumers, but there are some
Americans who say they're actually happy about the tariffs.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I didn't vote for Trump, but I think tariffs actually might be a good idea, and here's why. We're in an incredibly vulnerable
position right now where we don't know how to make anything. We have to bring manufacturing back home so that we know how to make stuff. We cannot
just rely on the rest of the world to make everything for us.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It feels like the end game is bringing industry back to America. So I mean that's great for jobs.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In the long term, and hopefully it won't be, but more than a few months where it'll settle down and people will start to see the
wisdom of doing it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our car is $50,000, now 25 percent. That's $12,500 more. That just became $62,500 overnight.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: Small businesses across the U.S. are bracing for the impact of President Trump's tariffs. The head of a furniture company in Maryland says
if costs go up, his customers will bear the brunt of it all.
Brad Bell from ABC 7 News reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BRAD BELL, ABC 7 NEWS REPORTER (voice-over): A day after President Trump's tariff announcement at the United Furniture Warehouse Store in Bowie, they
are desperately trying to figure out what it will mean to them.
[12:25:03]
The general manager on non-stop calls with his buyers. The president of the company saying, there is no mystery about one thing.
MARK STUART, PRESIDENT, REGENCY FURNITURE: The consumer always pays.
BELL (voice-over): Regency Furniture president, Mark Stuart, says most of their bedroom and dining room furniture comes from Vietnam. So do the
components for a postured furniture which are then assembled in the U.S. He points out that goods from that country are at least for now being hit with
a 46 percent tariff. Much if not all of that will have to be passed along to his customers.
STUART: At the end of the day, they pay all profits. They pay all tariffs, all taxes. It always lands on the consumer. Businesses are in business to
make money and to get the best values to the customers. And that's what we've always lived by.
BELL (voice-over): This woman, shopping for a sofa worries the prices will rise.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I just wouldn't be able to afford something if it goes up like that. And it's going to be bad for American people.
BELL (voice-over): Stuart says, he'll have to adapt.
STUART: We're continuing straight ahead with the business that we already have planned out for the next couple months. I don't see any change. We got
our warehouses full.
I think they might put on a beat the tariffs sale.
BELL (voice-over): In Bowie, Brad Bell, 7 News.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GOLODRYGA: Still to come for us, tariffs can be complex. That's why we're answering the most pressing questions about how these new taxes affect your
bottom line. That's just ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[12:30:11]
GOLODRYGA: The U.S. markets are down sharply for a second day, following President Trump's tariff announcement.
Now from Wall Street to Main Street, CNN's top economics reporters answer your frequently asked questions about tariffs.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MATT EGAN, CNN REPORTER: You all have a lot of questions for us about tariffs. We've got answers. Let's start with the basics. First off, what is
a tariff? Simply put, tariffs are taxes on goods from other countries. They've been around for centuries. They're often used to protect domestic
industries, workers, and they're also used to generate revenue.
VANESSA YURKEVICH, CNN BUSINESS AND POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: Ruth from the Midwest asks this, who pays the tariffs imposed by the White House, the
government or the foreign country? Even though the tariffs are on foreign countries, it is U.S. businesses that import products from those countries
that end up paying the tariff.
It could be the fact that some suppliers in those foreign countries eat the total cost of the tariff, but economists agree that's unlikely. The
suppliers will likely pass the tariff down to U.S. businesses who will ultimately pass that cost down to you.
EGAN: Jeremy from South Carolina wants to know, what should the average U.S. consumer expect to be affected by these tariffs?
Well, the first impact is you're going to see some significant changes to your 401(ks) and your investment portfolios because these tariffs have
caused major volatility on Wall Street.
You also may see higher prices on imports because companies, they typically pass along at least some of the costs of these tariffs to you and I as
consumers.
Here's the bottom line. The Tax Foundation estimates that the cost of these tariffs will be $2,100 per year to the typical family.
YURKEVICH: Isaac from Oregon asks, how much will cars go up? Hey, Isaac. So right now, there's a tariff in place on foreign cars imported into the U.S.
And according to Anderson Economic Group, they estimate that foreign brands like Lexus and BMW, prices of those cars, will rise by about $8,000 to
$20,000.
And then cars that are assembled here in the U.S. but use foreign parts could rise anywhere from $2,500 to $15,000.
PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CHIEF U.S. DOMESTIC CORRESPONDENT: So John from Florida asks, what does Trump hope to gain by imposing tariffs? And the question is
a little bit complicated but here's what I'd say upfront. Trump has made clear he wants fair trade. He believes trade deficits with most of these
countries are dramatically too large despite kind of how trade economics works.
The other thing too, revenue. He wants money for the United States and can finance his legislative agenda.
And then there's negotiating power. How those all actually net out in the end? Still an open question but those are the goals.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: Well, China is following through on its threatened retaliation to Donald Trump's tariffs. Just hours ago, Beijing slapped 34 percent
levies on goods imported from the United States. Here's what a Beijing resident thinks of the tariff turmoil.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SUMAMED ZHANG, BEIJING RESIDENT (through translator): After this round of Trump's tariff hikes, I believe China's economic circulation system will
become more robust. And in the future, when dealing with the impact of such tariffs, it will become more manageable.
After all, China has been engaged in this trade war with the U.S. for quite some time now. So tariffs are something we've grown accustomed to.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: China, Cambodia, and Vietnam are among the countries hit hardest by Trump's sweeping tariffs. But Cambodia's Commerce Minister says the
impact of those levies will be felt by U.S. consumers first.
Taiwan's government, meantime, is offering close to $3 billion to help bailout companies affected by the tariffs.
And this is what happened on the Asian exchanges earlier in the day. All of them, like those in the U.S. and Europe in the red.
Well, time now for The Exchange and a deep dive on China as Beijing steps up its trade fight with the U.S.
Joining me now is Lingling Wei, Chief China correspondent for "The Wall Street Journal." Lingling, thank you so much for taking the time.
So what was interesting is that in anticipation of a response from China, I think many analysts had expected something more measured, maybe even at a
lower rate. But the fact that these are 34 percent tariffs across the board is quite forceful in sending what message from President Xi to President
Trump in your view.
LINGLING WEI, CHIEF CHINA CORRESPONDENT, THE WALL STREET JOURNAL: Sure. It's great to be here.
What Beijing is sending to President Trump in his team is that China is not backing down. They are definitely building their own leverage in
anticipation and in hopes of any negotiations down the road.
You mentioned tariffs, 34 percent blanket tariffs on everything the United States is selling to China. And it doesn't stop there. China also has, you
know, blacklisted more American companies, initiated antitrust review, targeting DuPont China and also is trying to restrict the exports of
certain types of rare earth minerals.
[12:35:13]
It shows that China is also targeting the high-tech sector in the United States because a lot of those minerals are being used by technology firms
in the U.S. and also defense firms. So they are definitely doing all that to show -- to send a message that China is not surrendering to President
Trump's tariff moves. Yes, it's very aggressive from Beijing this time around.
GOLODRYGA: And to your point, China announced a slew of non-tariff measures as well and they include, just to give our audience a deeper sense, the
addition of seven types of rare earth minerals and related products to an export control list and effectively restricting U.S. access to those.
And it also added 11 American companies to any unreliable entity list which bans them from engaging in trade and investment in China.
To all of this, President Trump issued a short brief, perhaps slip-in response and that is that China played it wrong, they panicked. How is that
being interpreted in China?
WEI: So, you know, obviously, it's nighttime in China right now, no specific response from the government as of yet to President Trump's
remarks on social media.
But, you know, what we are really entering right now is a cycle of retaliation and counter-retaliation. That means the pathway toward any kind
of a near-term negotiation or near-term deal is becoming much less obvious.
And, you know, the Chinese calculation is that by retaliating against the Trump tariffs, China has to demonstrate China's ability to inflict pain on
U.S. companies, U.S. economies as well.
So right now, it's really, you know, their way of trying to send a message to President Trump and his administration. And we will see exactly when and
how, which side fills the pain first.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. Dangerous escalation in game of chicken, I guess, between two of the world's largest economies.
How much of a factor is TikTok in all of this here? The company is facing a deadline of tomorrow, I believe, to find a non-Chinese buyer. And President
Trump even said that he would consider a deal for TikTok from China if they agree to one. And then in return, lower some of these tariffs.
Is that something that you think China is focusing as heavily on as President Trump is?
WEI: I don't think China is that much focused on the TikTok issue. Their position has been clear that, you know, what the U.S. is trying to do is
equal to what they called, quote, commercial robbery.
And the Chinese are very adamant about not losing control, especially over the Chinese company's ownership of the algorithm that powers TikTok.
And given how much tension has already risen in the past few months, the Chinese have even less incentive to make any kind of compromise on TikTok.
They're going to really try to use this issue as leverage in any potential negotiations with the Trump administration.
But at this point, they're not focused on TikTok. And based on our conversations with Chinese officials, no, not much -- not much discussion,
you know, has taken place specifically related to TikTok.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. And leading up to these tariffs, there had been some speculation as to whether these two men would have a meeting sometime soon.
I'm not sure where that stands at this point.
Lingling Wei, chief China correspondent for "The Wall Street Journal." Thank you so much for coming on.
WEI: Thank you.
GOLODRYGA: And still to come on CNN, how one major U.S. city is coping with steep government layoffs driven by DOGE.
Plus, a little later, a feud on Capitol Hill over allowing new moms in Congress to vote remotely after birth. We'll meet the two lawmakers who say
they're fighting to give young families a voice.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[12:40:27]
GOLODRYGA: We're getting our first look at the U.S. labor market in March, a month when Elon Musk's DOGE drove waves of layoffs at federal agencies.
But in fact, the numbers show the economy added more jobs than expected, some 228,000. That's up by 11,000 from the previous month. But the
unemployment rate also ticked a bit higher to 4.2 percent from 4.1 percent in February.
While the U.S. adds more jobs, Kansas City is losing a number of federal government jobs cut by DOGE. CNN's Kayla Tausche spoke to some workers
impacted by the mass layoffs.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KAYLA TAUSCHE, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): More than a thousand miles from Washington, D.C., the impact of DOGE is hitting the
heartland.
In Kansas City, the federal government is the largest employer, a growing presence in recent years.
In Trump's first term, the Department of Agriculture relocated two divisions to the area to save money and move closer to farmers.
Now, USDA is among the many agencies scaling back here. All told job cuts are expected to be in the thousands.
QUINTON LUCAS, KANSAS CITY MAYOR: It's going to hurt the city. It's going to hurt the people a lot. It's going to hurt their families. And it's going
to hurt a lot of secondary businesses.
TAUSCHE (voice-over): Kansas City's democratic mayor says the city won't be able to absorb all the laid off workers.
LUCAS: We're not building a new 4,000-person factory to replace 4,000 jobs at the IRS at the same time. And frankly, these folks will have very
different skills.
TAUSCHE (voice-over): At Kauffman Stadium, Jason Buck has picked up bartending part-time. He used to manage fleets of government vehicles until
he was fired a month ago. The search for a new job was slow going.
JASON BUCK, GSA PROGRAM SUPPORT SPECIALIST: Get a spattering of interviews over the course of a month and, you know, I haven't really had any headway
on that.
TAUSCHE (voice-over): While we spoke with him, his manager called to say he'd been reinstated. He doesn't know for how long.
TAUSCHE: Do you worry that this is temporary?
BUCK: Absolutely. Yes. Yes. I don't know if I'm going back just to get -- be a part of a reduction in force at some point, or I have no idea what to
expect.
TAUSCHE: Daniel Scharfenberg worries his job is on the line, too. He joined the IRS 16 years ago. With two teenage kids, he's taken a second job to
save money.
DANIEL SCHARFENBERG, IRS EMPLOYEE: Some days, I get off work here and I go straight to the movie theater. I bring my work uniform with me and I
change, and I go straight to the movie theater and work there.
I'm 45 years old. I'm too old to be working two jobs.
TAUSCHE: The owner of Waterbird Coffee says business has picked up with federal workers ordered back to offices, but he fears it's short lived.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE, OWNER, WATERBIRD COFFEE: Definitely the mood just feels sort of different. Everything feels kind of stressful, uncertain. It just
kind of created this mood of anxiety overall.
[12:45:03]
TAUSCHE (voice-over): The layoffs will ripple through the economy. Many federal workers say they may have to sell their home. Others canceling
family vacations.
For each federal worker who loses their job, economists say the pullback in their spending could cost the city another one and a half jobs, multiplying
the effect on unemployment.
The Kansas City metro is blue, but polls show that voters in Missouri still largely support Trump.
Shannon Ellis leads the Treasury Employees Union here and says her members feel the cuts hitting close to home.
SHANNON ELLIS, CHAPTER PRESIDENT, NATIONAL TREASURE EMPLOYEES UNION: But I've had people approach me in this building and say, look, if I knew that
this was what was going to happen, that all these attacks on federal agencies, I would have voted a different way.
So you can't say that all Americans still support what's happening.
TAUSCHE: Republican Senator Josh Hawley was among the proponents of moving these agencies from Washington to states like Missouri. He told CNN that he
thinks the state's voters are largely supportive of the move to downsize.
The next major wave of federal layoffs is expected in mid-May, but employees say they expect to learn their fate in the next two weeks.
Even so, as we were leaving Kansas City, employees reached out to tell me about ongoing cuts at the Department of Health and Human Services with some
workers terminated on the spot. So this is happening in real time and with very real-world impact.
Back to you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GOLODRYGA: Our thanks to Kayla Tausche for that report.
Up next on ONE WORLD, photobombed by the president. The family picture that went viral. We'll show it to you. Well, there it is. We'll tell you the
backstory in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GOLODRYGA: Well, some new parents in the U.S. Congress are fighting to be able to vote remotely, and as they care for their newborn babies. And their
bipartisan plan is enjoying support from some rebel Republican colleagues. That's translated into an embarrassing defeat for House Speaker Mike
Johnson, who tried to kill their proposal.
U.S. President Donald Trump has split with Johnson on this as well, saying that he's in favor of proxy voting for new parents.
CNN's Dana Bash went to meet the new moms, trying to change some old rules on Capitol Hill.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PETTERSEN: Well, thank you all for caring about this.
BASH (voice-over): Sam's mother wishes her newborn baby could beat home in Colorado, not on Capitol Hill.
PETTERSEN: I rise today with my newborn Sam.
BASH (voice-over): But Sam's mother is Brittany Pettersen, a member of Congress.
PETTERSEN: Unfortunately, I wasn't given the opportunity to vote remotely after giving birth.
[12:50:04]
We went straight from my house to the U.S. House. So Sam's first outing was being on the House floor, which was wild.
BASH (voice-over): House rules require her to vote in person, but she and others want new parents in Congress to be able to vote remotely by proxy
for up to 12 weeks around the birth of a child.
PETTERSEN: It's about changing Congress and making it, you know, bringing it out of the dark ages and doing things that are in alignment with 2025,
you know. We should be able to be parents and still represent our constituents.
OK. I hear you.
BASH (voice-over): Pettersen is a Democrat. She teamed up with Republican, Anna Paulina Luna, who gave birth during her first term in Congress to her
son, Henry, who is now a year and a half old.
REP. ANNA PAULINA LUNA (R-FL): It's effectively telling members of Congress to women specifically that you either have to choose between having a
family and representing your constituency, or you come up here and vote and put your life and your child's life at risk, depending on if there's
medical complications.
BASH (voice-over): Luna is bucking her Republican leadership by pushing for this rules change.
LUNA: I've gone to the speaker, both speakers, Kevin McCarthy and the current speaker on this. I've met with them. I've looked at the legality of
it. And they said that it was not constitutional because when the Constitution was written, it said that you must be present to establish a
quorum, right?
Well, in an effort to make sure that it's in line with the Constitution, we actually remove that. So this will simply allow you to vote, not to
establish the quorum.
BASH: When the Constitution was written, it was written by men, for men.
PETTERSEN: You're right. This place is not built for young families, and it's definitely not built to meet the needs of young women.
BASH (voice-over): Proxy House voting was allowed during the coronavirus pandemic, but House GOP leaders opposed returning to the practice.
BASH: The argument is that it was abused.
LUNA: Correct. But I would say that that in itself is not a good argument for this because we're siloing it. It's very specific. It is two female
members who have given birth and male members who have just had a child. Their spouse has given birth. And sometimes they need to be there for that
recovery process.
I mean, everything that we've campaigned on being pro-family, pro-life, yes, it's a massive slap in the face.
BASH (voice-over): In a statement to CNN, the House Republican leadership said, quote, we sympathize with our colleagues who face circumstances that
prevent them from being present, but proxy voting raises serious constitutional questions. It also changes more than two and a half
centuries of tradition, abuses the system, and creates the risk of a slippery slope toward more and more members casting votes remotely.
BASH: He's such a good baby.
PETTERSEN: He's -- yes.
LUNA: He's like, he's out. He's like --
PETTERSEN: Yes. He's making this look a lot easier than I can think.
BASH: We all know it is not easy.
PETTERSEN: We have life events that happen, and giving birth, having a baby. We want to make sure that those members still have a voice in
Congress because we don't want to lose the representation of parents who understand the struggles of -- that families are going through, who are
currently going through it and not what it was like so many years ago.
LUNA: Perspective is important.
BASH (voice-over): Luna was just the 12th sitting member of Congress in history to give birth Pettersen, the 13th.
BASH: You are in the minority, not the political minority, but the age minority.
PETTERSEN: Birthing age, minority.
My joke is that when you go to Congress in your 40s, you're young again.
LUNA: It's hard, and then you have to choose. And so that's why you see a lot of younger families not stay in Congress, which, you know, is
unfortunate, but that's why we're trying to reform.
PETTERSEN: Yes. We always when we -- when lose our voice.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GOLODRYGA: More power to them. Thanks to CNN's Dana Bash for reporting.
Well, the annual Cherry Blossom Festival in Washington, D.C. brings visitors from all over the world. The beautiful trees are in full bloom.
It's Mother Nature at her finest.
Now, other mothers also find them irresistible, especially as the backdrop for photographs of their young children.
Portia and Damien Moore brought their family for the perfect floral photograph. But what they got was an uninvited visitor. Damien says he
tried to tell his wife that former President Barack Obama was photobombing the shot, but she was clearly too busy trying to get the children to be
still and smile to really listen to what he was saying.
She told our Laura Coates about what happened.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MOORE: My husband was trying to tell me, but of course I'm like looking at my son, making sure -- he's 20 months old. So I'm like, do not run. Please
stay here and hold hands with your sister.
And so once they finished the shoot, I picked him up. I was like, what did you say? And he was like, that's President Obama. And I was like, oh my
God.
So I'm just happy. I mean, it's vicinity, right? Like I'm happy. Like we're like, can you even like look at him right there, 25 feet away at this point
of time?
[12:55:02]
And then I ran to Brianna, our photographer. I'm like, did we get him in the shoot? Like, did you catch him? And she like scrolls back on the camera
and we saw the picture. And it was that picture that's on the screen right now. We were like, ah, we got it. We screamed. I'm (INAUDIBLE). I didn't
even know.
But we were so excited that we actually got him in the photo. It's like, he didn't photobombed at all. We love it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: Portia's like, next time I listen to my husband. Now that picture went viral. Even President Obama commented, writing, Preston and
Belle, I hope you enjoyed peak bloom. My bad for stepping in the shot.
I love this story. It's such a great photo.
Now the former president also shared his own cherry blossom photos saying that it's fun to play tourists once in a while.
Such a beautiful time of the year in Washington, D.C. for sure.
Well that does it for this hour of ONE WORLD. Thanks so much for watching. I'm Bianna Golodryga. "Amanpour" is up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
END
