Return to Transcripts main page
One World with Zain Asher
Israel Creates Buffer Zone Along Syrian Border; Epstein Prosecutor Fired; Attorney General Bondi Visiting Legendary Alcatraz Prison; Official: Migrants Deported by the U.S. to Eswatini Being Held in Correctional Facilities' Isolated Units; UK Doctor in Gaza Describes Battle to Keep Patients Alive; Trump: I Told Coca-Cola to Use "Real Cane Sugar in Coke". Aired 11a-12p ET
Aired July 17, 2025 - 11:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[11:00:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ZAIN ASHER, CNN HOST, ONE WORLD: A fragile ceasefire is in effect in Southern Syria.
BIANNA GOLODRYGA, CNN HOST, ONE WORLD: "One World" starts right now. As the ceasefire holds, Syria says it's withdrawing troops from the south after
days of deadly clashes that Israel says triggered military action.
ASHER: Plus, new numbers from CNN reveal that Democrats are much more energized than Republicans about next year's midterms.
GOLODRYGA: And another African country has taken migrants from the United States. We'll take a closer look at President Trump's push for third party
countries to accept deportees. Hello, everyone. Live from New York. I'm Bianna Golodryga.
ASHER: And I'm Zain Asher. You are watching "One World". Syria's President says his country is not afraid of war, but is choosing to put its people
above chaos and destruction.
GOLODRYGA: Yeah, Ahmed al-Sharaa spoke after his government announced a new truce with a Syrian minority group. Syria's armed forces are withdrawing
from the southern area of Suwayda after reaching an agreement with Druze leaders there following clashes over the weekend between Druze militia and
Bedouin tribes, forcing the government to intervene.
ASHER: Israel launched airstrikes in Damascus office, saying it would protect the Druze. And a short time ago, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin
Netanyahu said Israel will, quote, continue to act as necessary. Syria is condemning Israel for striking several government buildings in Damascus on
Wednesday, calling the attacks a dangerous escalation.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AHMED AL-SHARAA, SYRIAN PRESIDENT: Today as we face this challenge, we find ourselves in the heart of a battle aimed at preserving the unity of our
nation. The Israeli entity known for its repeated attempts to destabilize us and sow division, once again, seeks to turn our land into a battlefield
of chaos and to dismantle the fabric of our people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: U.S. Secretary of State, Marco Rubio, who has described the crisis as a misunderstanding, said that all parties involved have agreed on
specific steps to bring the situation to an end.
ASHER: More now from CNN's Jeremy Diamond, reporting from Jerusalem.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Israeli bombs rock, the Syrian capital of Damascus, striking the defense ministry in an
area near the presidential palace. At least 3 people were killed and 34 injured in the strikes, according to the country's health ministry.
The defense headquarters suffering a serious blow, but the true cost of these strikes may not yet be known, threatening to derail new U.S. brokered
security talks between Israel and Syria.
MARCO RUBIO, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: We think we're on our way towards a real de-escalation and then hopefully get back on track in helping Syria
build a country and arriving at a situation there in the Middle East is far more stable.
DIAMOND (voice-over): The attacks came after days of clashes in Syria's southern city of Suwayda between Bedouin tribes and the Druze community. A
religious minority whose members also live in Israel and Lebanon. Dozens of people have been killed in the clashes in recent days.
Syrian troops soon entered Suwayda with the government saying it was looking to stop the violence, but some Druze leaders saw the approach of
government forces as a threat. And so did Israel, which struck approaching Syrian tanks, rocket launchers and trucks carrying weapons, saying it was
acting to prevent a massacre against the Druze. But Israel isn't just striking to protect the Druze.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are committed to keeping Southwestern Syria a demilitarized zone.
DIAMOND (voice-over): Israeli troops captured this buffer zone between Syria and the Israeli occupied Golan Heights after the fall of the Assad
regime last year. But Israel has also demanded Syrian troops remain out of Southern Syria altogether. In Israeli held Golan Heights, the large Syrian
Druze community here is deeply impacted by attacks on the Druze in Suwayda.
FAEZ SHKEIR, ISRAELI DRUZE: My wife is in Syria. My uncles are from Syria, and my family is in Syria, and so either.
[11:05:00]
I don't like to see them being killed. They kicked them out of their homes. They robbed and burned their houses. But I can't do anything. It's very
hard on me.
DIAMOND (voice-over): That sense of helplessness driving hundreds of Druzes to take matters into their own hands, pouring across an Israeli security
fence and into the Syrian buffer zone on the road to Suwayda. Jeremy Diamond, CNN, Jerusalem.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GOLODRYGA: And we'll take a closer look at this developing story in our next hour with our guest, Dareen Khalifa, who's with the International
Crisis Group. Stay tuned for that interview in about an hour's time. In big changes to announce at the top of Ukraine's government.
The president appointed a new prime minister as part of a cabinet reshuffle. Yulia Svyrydenko says that she wants to boost domestic weapons
production and steady supplies for Ukrainian troops. Now, Ukraine also has a special envoy to the U.S., Olha Stefanishyna will now be in charge of
improving relations with the country.
ASHER: Meantime, the Senior U.S. Military Commander in Europe says the U.S. and NATO are working with Germany to get patriot missile systems to Ukraine
as quickly as possible. As comes as Trump's 50-day ultimatum for Vladimir Putin to pursue peace talks ticks down, and as Russia tightens its
stranglehold on the Ukrainian battlefield.
GOLODRYGA: Our Chief International Security Correspondent Nick Paton Walsh, joins us now. And Nick, I wanted to ask you earlier this week, when we were
speaking about this cabinet reshuffling inside Ukraine's government there, and what it signals, what more are we learning?
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, I mean, it does appear that with a new prime minister here and various
elements of reshuffling, particularly, it seems like a new diplomatic team in Washington that Kyiv Administration is trying to essentially reset their
relationship with the Trump White House.
Now that's been after a particularly complex series of months, it may well indeed be that they want to see a new ambassador in Washington to recast
this change in Trump's attitude towards Ukraine with a series of new faces that can potentially make the U.S. President feel like he's maybe dealing
with a renewed relationship here too.
Whether or not any of this translates into a significant change in the volume of weapons that Ukraine is able to get its hands on in the
forthcoming days or weeks is still unclear. There have been suggestions from President Trump that these patriot interceptors or batteries could be
days away from the hands of Ukraine.
Germany has been a little bit more, I think, conservative in terms of their delivery estimates, talking about German officials how there's days
required for decisions, and there may be months, indeed for manufacturers, but indeed also U.S. military officials now leaning into that and
suggesting they might be able to expedite all of that too.
But we're talking now about a particularly vital few weeks or few months now, in this 50-day period that President Donald Trump has set until
potentially. There are secondary sanctions against China or India for buying Russian energy, in which Russia may be able to execute what many are
perceiving to be their summer offensive.
Now, there have been indications over the past weeks or months that Russia's incremental gains are gathering pace, and indeed, some observers
have noticed that at three key towns on the Eastern Front, Pokrovsk, Kostyantynivka and indeed Kupiansk, there are signs that Russia is
beginning to maneuver around those Ukrainian military hubs and perhaps trying to execute what analysts would call a pincer movement.
Essentially moving around and cutting off a town through attacking the roads that form its supply line to it. Now it may well be that in the weeks
and months ahead, Russia tries to accentuate those gains move faster, harder and make a more strategic move on the front lines.
But the ultimate question people are going to be asking in the weeks and months ahead is if Putin has been trying to buy time with the diplomacy
that's led nowhere, frankly, some call it Sham on Moscow's part, over the past months, what has been the end goal of that? Have they been trying to
improve their position on the front lines?
Well, the moment in which those improvements must be realized is kind of upon Moscow now. And so, either in the weeks or months ahead, we are going
to see them able to use the what Ukraine says is the 160,000 Russian troops massing near the front lines to some kind of effect on the battlefield.
Or indeed, it will appear as though, potentially even Russia, after months of preparation delay diplomatically, is unable to affect a significant
change on those front lines. Well, that may indeed be an indicator of exactly what resources Moscow has left to deal on the battlefield and quite
what its appetite for future conflict indeed is.
ASHER: And Nick, just in terms of the patriot's sort of air defense systems. I mean, obviously they cannot be shipped soon enough.
[11:10:00]
Just walk us through how much of a game changer they could be on the battlefield because they're designed to intercept short range missiles,
ballistic missiles, cruise missiles. Just walk us through how it can actually affect things for Ukraine over the next 50 days or so.
WALSH: I mean, the patriots don't really change the battlefield. The patriots are more designed to stop Russian ballistic missiles hitting
longer range targets deeper inside Ukraine. Yes, indeed, it may use ballistic missiles on front line, high value targets, but really the
patriots, so expensive, so rare, are normally used to just intercept the fast-moving Kinzhal or other Russian ballistic missiles that normally hit
cities deep inside of Ukraine.
Ukraine cannot stress how urgently it needs more of those. This has been a pressing issue for months, and it's always been unclear what stocks of
interceptors they still have. They've wanted to get 10 batteries of patriot defender missile machines you're seeing there into play the suggestions
they may get even more than that, potentially and the recent discussion from President Donald Trump.
And that's what we get, this difference between the White House's ambitions and the reality what they're able to indeed deliver. But they urgently need
interceptors, and they need multiple different other types of weapon systems too to enable them to hit Russian targets close to the front line,
to wear down their command and control and military industrial infrastructure.
So, all of this is deeply important, but ultimately, the patriots are a long term, permanent demand that Ukraine is going to have to hold off the
Russian ballistic missiles that are a constant, nightly threat. They're more important, potentially a more complex demand they have to answer is,
how do they confront a Russian military whose manpower, ability to field troops into the frontlines way exceeds anything Russia, sorry, Ukraine will
be able to field in the forthcoming months, or indeed, years?
How do they manage to find a way to even those two particular sides up if we end up in a longer-term war of attrition. And there's a large question
too, of exactly how long can Moscow keep this war effort going? Many questions about how close to overheating its economy may be because of the
intense changes it's undergone because of this war effort.
So much moving here. But I think ultimate focus is going to be on exactly what Russia can achieve in the weeks and months ahead, until the weather
changes. The ground gets wet, and then winter sets in, roundabout, sort of late September or October. If I think many perceive if Ukraine gets through
that period of time without the strategic significant change at the front lines, then that may be perceived as a failure by Moscow, and that may
indeed change the Kremlin's tone internationally.
GOLODRYGA: Yeah, that manpower advantage that Russia has is something that no number of weapons could really fall in the face of. But at the same
time, we're also seeing Russia turning towards North Korea to have troops and their troops involved in the battlefield, as well as Russia is
continuing to really see a staggering number of troops lost as well. Nick Paton Walsh, thank you so much.
ASHER: Thank you, Nick.
GOLODRYGA: Well, in the face of threats and looming U.S. tariffs, Britain and Germany's leaders are looking to strengthen their European ties.
ASHER: Now you're looking at video of UK Prime Minister Keir Starmer, and he was alongside Friedrich Merz, the German Chancellor. They've now signed
a friendship treaty. There they are together, which covers a wide range of commitments from defense to transport as well.
This actually marks the latest effort from the UK to reset relations with the EU. I want to play you some of what the British Prime Minister had to
say a short time ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KEIR STARMER, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: And I see very much as evidence of the closeness of our relationship as it stands today, the strength of --
strength our joint approach, but also very much as a statement of intent, a statement of our ambition to work ever more closely together, closest of
allies, and whether that's on defense, security, trade, the economy, energy covers so much in this treaty.
And so, this is a really historic signing of a historic agreement. It's very, very good to welcome you here in order to do so.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: Well, Germany is now pledging to outlaw the facilitation of irregular migration to Britain by the end of the year as well.
ASHER: All right, still to come here on "One World". It is no secret that the U.S. is deeply divided when it comes to politics, but voters seem to
agree on one thing. Neither side is happy with how exactly their party is performing. We'll have a new CNN poll up next on that.
GOLODRYGA: Plus, Donald Trump keeps trying to make this Epstein case go away, but his MAGA base still wants answers. We'll have the latest
movements, including a federal prosecutor getting fired. Familiar last name, we'll tell you more in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[11:15:00]
ASHER: All right, House request to cancel $9 billion in federal funding that has already been congressionally approved is now headed the House,
where it faces a Friday deadline.
GOLODRYGA: Yeah, early Thursday morning, the Senate passed President Trump's DOGE bill, which requested a claw back of that funding. Now the
overwhelming majority of it was slated for foreign aid and the remainder for public broadcasting.
ASHER: While most Republican Senators embraced the spending cuts, some argued they undermined congressional authority. It's worth noting that
Trump created DOGE, which is a team within the administration that was actually never authorized by Congress by signing an executive order.
GOLODRYGA: Well, the midterm elections in the U.S. are still 16 months away, but a new CNN poll finds many voters are eager to get back to the
ballot box.
ASHER: Frustration with Trump has Democratic voters both eager to vote and also frustrated at their party's inability to counter the president. CNN's
Washington Bureau Chief David Chalian embraces it all down for us.
DAVID CHALIAN, CNN WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF: We're still a little over a year away, but we are in this 2026 midterm cycle, and we asked folks we try
to get a level of their motivation. So, among extremely motivated. That's what we're looking at here. People who say they are extremely motivated.
72 percent of Democrat or Democratic leaning independents say they are extremely motivated to vote in the midterm election. That I just want to
understand in prior to the presidential election, in October 24 -- that was only 62 percent among Democratic leaning voters.
So higher motivation now than we saw right before the presidential. And look at this, compared to the Republicans, it's a 22-point advantage. 50
percent of Republican and Republican leaning independents now say they're extremely motivated to vote, far lower than they were before the
presidential and far lower than Democrats are.
And I think this is important. That's the opportunity for Democrats. Can they capitalize on it? Is the question, and they are suffering record low
favorability numbers among the American people. So, if you look at overall favorability of the parties, neither party is in good standing with the
American people.
33 percent of Americans have a favorable view of the Republican Party. 28 percent of Americans have a favorable view of the Democratic Party. That 28
number historic low in our polling for Democrats. Clearly, voters are unhappy in our poll about unified Republican control, the House, the
Senate, the presidency.
[11:20:00]
And this is normal, whichever party has unified control, the party out of power usually benefits from that in an upcoming midterm election. What I
think we see is that Democrats, their favorability number is being driven down because of a negative view from their own partisans, from their own
Democrats.
So, we said, you know, view of your own party favorably. Among Republican and Republican leaders, 76 percent view their own party favorably, but
among Democratic and Democratic leaders, only 58 percent view their own party favorably, so that Democrats have work to do within their own House
if they're going to improve their standing here.
ASHER: Many thanks to our David Chalian for breaking down those results for us.
GOLODRYGA: Well, Donald Trump clearly wants people to stop talking about the Epstein case, but it just keeps on making headlines. The Department of
Justice fired Maurene Comey, one of the prosecutors who worked on the Jeffrey Epstein sex trafficking case.
Comey is the daughter of Former FBI Director James Comey, who caught the ire of the president for probing links between Trump's 2016 campaign and
Russia. Now it's unclear if her firing had anything to do with the Epstein case.
ASHER: Trump is clearly frustrated that he is still being asked about Epstein and whether there is a list of clients that Epstein had. His new
line of attack is to blame Democrats, of course, for the whole thing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: It's all been a big hoax. It's perpetrated by the Democrats and some stupid Republicans and
foolish Republicans fall into the net.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ASHER: Despite Trump pointing finger at Democrats, it is really his MAGA base who seemed most concerned about learning more about Epstein. And a
growing number of Republican members of Congress are also asking for more information too. It may sound like another Hollywood story, but the Trump
Administration says it's for real.
The president wants to reopen the notorious Alcatraz prison off the coast of San Francisco. Attorney General Pam Bondi and Interior Secretary Doug
Burgum are visiting the Alcatraz historical site today, and they're expected to announce plans to restore and reopen the prison.
GOLODRYGA: Right, Alcatraz was closed 60 years ago due to its crumbling infrastructure. Some estimates say it will cost billions to restore it to
working condition. And there is skepticism that this announcement will actually lead to work being done on the prison itself.
For more, let's bring in CNN's Senior White House reporter Kevin Liptak. So, Kevin is this a surprise visit and wondering what role if any Pam Bondi
is, I would guess chaotic handling of the Epstein case here is playing into this decision to perhaps change topics.
KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yeah. I mean, if I wanted to avoid questions about how I was handling Jeffrey Epstein, I would probably
go to an island in the middle of the San Francisco Bay that's --
ASHER: -- reopen Alcatraz. That's a good idea. Why not, right?
LIPTAK: -- I think maybe this is a strategy. It was a surprise. We only learned about it this morning, although the president had made his plan to
reopen it known a couple of months ago, he says he wants to send the nation's most violent offenders to that prison. As you said, it could cost
potentially billions of dollars to rebuild.
He thinks of it as kind of a symbol of law enforcement, of security, but we should note the current national supermax prison in Colorado, there's never
been a prisoner who has escaped from it. Alcatraz, in the final years that it was open, actually did have a number of escapees who were never found.
It's not clear whether they died trying to swim to shore, or whether they're out living their life somewhere. I think the president clearly
wants to use this as a symbol, as someone who is very tough on law enforcement. It's not entirely clear how logistically feasible it is.
This island, as I mentioned, is covered in bird poop. It's a national sort of tourist site. It generates millions of dollars in tourist funds every
year, which is why I should mention Doug Burgum is there the interior secretary. It's currently run by the National Park Service.
We did hear earlier today from Nancy Pelosi, who obviously represents San Francisco. She has called this the president's quote, stupidest initiative
yet, and she said it should concern us all that clearly, the only intellectual resources the administration has drawn upon for this foolish
notion are decades old fictional Hollywood movies.
Although I would note the most famous movie about Alcatraz is about someone from escaping from it. So, I'm not sure that the president is entirely
basing his strategy on that Clint Eastwood movie "Escape from Alcatraz". But clearly, you know, this is a serious option that the president thinks
he has, and he seems intent on pursuing it.
ASHER: I haven't watched escape from -- have you --
GOLODRYGA: It's a good one.
ASHER: Have you, Kevin --
GOLODRYGA: It's a good one. I highly recommend it --
ASHER: How -- with your job so busy.
GOLODRYGA: -- because I'm older than you both.
[11:25:00]
ASHER: -- little bit touched --
GOLODRYGA: Kevin, we also touched on the Epstein scandal. We noted this is not one that is going away, and it has really irritated the president, even
taking him to lash out at his own base and supporters. And now this new narrative that this was all something that the Democrats concocted, is this
helping Trump, at this point to blame it on the Democrats?
LIPTAK: It's not helping him to blame it on the Democrats, and I don't think it's also helping him to call his own supporters weaklings or foolish
or stupid, which were all words that he used yesterday to describe some of these conservative activists, both on Capitol Hill or, you know, people who
have podcasts or on social media, those were the words he described to use them as they agitate for more information about this Epstein matter.
So clearly, this is not dying away in the way that the president had hoped. Obviously, calling it a democratic hoax is a strategy that he has used on
all manner of issues that are irritating him. He has called the Ukraine war, something that Biden started. He has called all of these
investigations into him democratic hoaxes.
I think right now, the president is trying to look for an out here, and whether that's potentially the Justice Department releasing more
information on this, that's something he hasn't entirely ruled out, although he's discounted the prospect that any information that's released
could be, in his words, credible.
You have also heard the suggestion of a special counsel. That's something that Laura Loomer, the conspiracist, who is close with the president, who's
very frequently in the Oval Office, she has raised that idea. But when the president was asked about that yesterday, he said, quote, he has nothing to
do with it.
GOLODRYGA: All right, Senior White House Reporter Kevin Liptak, I'm assigning you --
ASHER: Yes. Homework is to watch.
LIPTAK: Yes.
ASHER: "Escape from Alcatraz".
GOLODRYGA: -- thank me --
LIPTAK: All right --
ASHER: And Bianna's homework is not to -- I was actually going to ask that question. I was going to ask you the question, but Bianna --
GOLODRYGA: After she slammed me for having the sensitivity over age. I took --
ASHER: Kevin, thank you.
LIPTAK: I don't know -- yeah.
ASHER: He's like, what the hell is going on with these girls. All right, still to come, the Trump Administration just sent another group of migrants
to a country they are not from, the landlocked African nation of Eswatini. We're going to discuss that just ahead.
GOLODRYGA: Plus, five people are being held in a Greek jail over the killing of a California professor, including his ex-wife and her boyfriend.
After the break, what prosecutors think is behind this murder.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[11:30:00]
ASHER: Welcome back to "One World". I'm Zain Asher.
GOLODRYGA: And I'm Bianna Golodryga. Here are some headlines we're watching today.
ASHER: Syria says it's withdrawing government troops from a flashpoint southern city after days of deadly sectarian clashes that triggered
military action from Israel. The Syrian government has announced a ceasefire with the Arab minority, Druze community, after intervention from
the United States.
GOLODRYGA: A massive fire ripped through a large shopping center in Eastern Iraq on Wednesday, at least 61 people, including children, were killed.
Dozens more were rescued. The five-story building had a restaurant and supermarket and had just opened a week ago.
ASHER: The Trump Administration is considering reopening the infamous Alcatraz prison. Attorney General Pam Bondi is visiting the prison today
and could announce reopening plans. Some estimates say it will cost billions to restore the dilapidated prison to working conditions.
GOLODRYGA: Greek police have charged five people in the murder of a U.S. based professor. A source tells CNN, four of the suspects have confessed to
their part in the killing. The fifth is the victim's ex-wife, who has denied any involvement. Now, the professor was shot dead while visiting
Athens to see his children and attending a custody hearing there.
ASHER: Let's bring in Elinda Labropoulou, who's following the story for us. So, Elinda, this obviously a very disturbing story. This is someone who was
shot multiple times at close range on July 4th, on obviously Independence Day. What would be Independence Day here in the U.S.?
Just explain what happened, what we know so far, what we know about those who have been arrested, and also a possible motive?
ELINDA LABROPOULOU, JOURNALIST: Well, let me describe the how this took place to begin with. The professor was on his way to visit his children at
their mother's home. He was gunned down very close to the woman's house by a person who was dressed in black, who came at very close range, gunned him
down and left the scene.
This was at a very central part of Athens, so there were a lot of witnesses, a lot of passersby that were obviously shocked to see what had
happened, and the professor fell dead almost instantly. We understand now there was a whole story to why the professor was there. He normally lives
in the U.S.
He was there to visit his children, who live with their mother, and there was a custody hearing the previous day. We understand that this is also
significant to what followed. What has happened today, after five people were detained, including the ex-wife, the children's mother and her current
boyfriend, along with three others, all five have now been charged with very serious criminal charges, including premeditated murder.
In the case of the ex-boyfriend of the current boyfriend and of a mother, appears to be charged as a moral accomplice to this. All five have been
given until Monday morning in order to prepare their plea and appear in front of the Greek authorities again. Now, the family, the professor's
family, has been asking for justice.
There's been a massive outpour of grief for the professor, and there is great concern also about the children? There were two 10-year-old twins.
Until now, their mother had the full custody. The father had visitation rights. They're now in the hands of the Greek authorities.
They hold U.S. and polish passports, and we're waiting to see what will the result be on Monday, from this court hearing.
ASHER: Right, Elinda Labropoulou, live for us. Thank you so much. The Trump Administration is fully exercising its expanded power to deport migrants to
nations they simply have no ties to. The Supreme Court recently gave the government broad power to do this with little notice.
The U.S. has sent migrants to third party countries like Guatemala, South Sudan, and of course, to that notorious prison in El Salvador.
GOLODRYGA: Now Eswatini says that it's holding five migrants deported by the U.S. in isolated units of the country's correctional facilities.
Eswatini is a landlocked nation east of South Africa.
[11:35:00]
Now the U.S. says these migrants were quote, so uniquely barbaric that their home countries refused to take them back. A government spokesperson,
however, said they pose no threat.
ASHER: Joining us live now is Andrea Flores, Vice President of Immigration Policy and Campaigns with FWD.us in Washington.
Andrea, thank you so much for being with us. Obviously, there are a lot of people, particularly on the left, who find this story very disturbing for a
number of reasons. I mean, walk us through what we know about the kind of assurances or the exchange or the terms of this deal, as in, what is
Eswatini getting in return for taking these deported migrants?
And do we know anything about what these individuals were actually told about where they were being deported to and why?
ANDREA FLORES, VICE PRESIDENT OF IMMIGRATION POLICY & CAMPAIGNS WITH FWD.US: -- Thanks for having me. You know, first, anyone on any part of the
political spectrum should be very concerned about the increase in third country removals. Now, this is a practice that other administrations have
used before, but when they did, it was most often for one or two individuals in a very unique case, right.
A very unique diplomatic need to send them to a country that is not their country of origin. You saw some of that expand with their country removals
to Mexico. But even when it has expanded, there were diplomatic assurances that people would actually not face grave harms.
But what we're seeing now are not normal third country removals. So first, they've taken what the Supreme Court said, and we have no idea what type of
legal guidance they receive. We have no idea if it is factual or true that they are prioritizing these types of removals for people with criminal
convictions.
We also -- what I want to point out is this is not just a removal, right? So, the news reports are that they are being detained and imprisoned in a
third country. That has not happened, right? We saw it happen with El Salvador, which was, it still remains, a massive human rights violation
that the United States removed over 200 people without due process, and it's paying for another country to imprison them.
I'm very worried about this latest flight, because it looks like what happened in El Salvador is now happening in yet another country, and most
likely we are paying for that.
GOLODRYGA: So, a DHS spokesperson, Tricia McLaughlin wrote on X, a safe third country deportation flight to Eswatini in southern Africa has landed.
This flight took individuals, as we noted, described as so uniquely barbaric that their home countries refused to take them back.
The five deportees all have a criminal history, that was her post. So, what do you say to supporters of this policy who argue that this is just in
keeping with the U.S. government and President Trump's specific pledge that he campaigned on that now seems to be supported by the Supreme Court to
keep the United States and U.S. citizens safe?
FLORES: First, I would tell anyone that that tweet under that X post is not accurate, right? Because a safe third country is actually a real concept in
immigration and in international law that requires the United States to ensure that a country will actually keep people safe from harm.
And so, there's that first part right that is highly unusual, to just declare something a safe third country without going through procedures to
ensure basic human rights. But on the second piece, there is no one myself included, that is arguing against that people should be deported if they
have broken certain laws.
What I am arguing against, and what many immigration experts are arguing against is expansion of sending people to places where they are not from.
When people have served out their sentences the United States, it is common practice to then deport them back to their countries of origin.
But you have to start looking ahead. And what I would ask people who support this policy is to look ahead. We already know that this is an
administration who has sent over 200 people to a foreign prison without due process. If they are not providing due process, how can you trust that the
government is only targeting certain populations for these removals?
But the other thing that scares me is this disrupts international law in the sense that what is to protect an American citizen in another country
from not ending up on a third country removal, because the United States is now doing it so flagrantly. So, it's what could unfold.
It is also a reminder to everybody that you know, sound deportation policy sends people back to their countries of origin for a reason, because you
create more instability when you know you send people to places, they aren't from, that can actually increase the type of unauthorized migration
that people oppose.
ASHER: I mean, it's interesting, because obviously I'm from the UK, and in the UK, they did try this approach. They tried to sort of send migrants to
a third country that being Rwanda, and there were so many legal hurdles to that in the UK.
[11:40:00]
I mean obviously, it's not the case here in the U.S., and one of the reasons, as I'm sure you know, Andrea, in terms of why the Trump
Administration is pursuing third country removals as opposed to sending people back to their country of origin, is, primarily, is the factor of
deterrent, right?
If people think, I mean, this is how the administration is approaching it, people think that you know, if they are from another country and they break
the laws here, that the sort of punishment would be to go to or to be sent to a different country, then in their mind, that is going to act as a
deterrent. What do you make of that argument?
FLORES: So, deterrence has a place in every sort of legal scheme, right? You want to deter people from breaking certain laws. But deterrence can't
be the main objective of immigration policy, of which for this administration it is. So, I would push back to them and say, why are you
taking this expensive, extreme flight of people that most likely could have been returned to their countries of origin when your border numbers are the
lowest that we have seen in over a decade, right?
So, what is the deterrence for and who are you removing and why? So, you look at some of their other policy decisions recently, they are trying to
take legal status from over half a million people. You know, they took legal status away this last week, from Nicaraguans and Hondurans, who have
lived in the United States since the 1990s and all in the name of deterrence.
Right to say you're not welcome here. What they're doing is not deterrence. What they're doing is trying to shrink the immigrant population United
States, whether legal, whether undocumented, and there's no scheme to that. There's no orderliness to that. And I think that's why you see public
opinion strongly disapprove of what's happening.
Because this isn't just about basic deterrence and trying to encourage people to follow the law. This is about something much different, and
trying to reduce immigration as a whole to the United States and in the United States.
ASHER: Andrea Flores live for us there. Thank you so much.
FLORES: Thank you.
GOLODRYGA: Well, doctor, who's made multiple visits to Gaza, says he's never seen conditions as dire as they are right now. Just ahead, a CNN
exclusive a surgeon provides a firsthand look at the humanitarian crisis inside Gaza's hospitals.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ASHER: A devastating scene of chaos and panic at an aid distribution site in Gaza.
[11:45:00]
GOLODRYGA: Yeah, at least 20 people were killed. Many of them trampled in a crowd rushed -- at a crowd crush at the Khan Yunis site, run by the
controversial Gaza Humanitarian Foundation. We want to warn you that the video we're about to show is disturbing.
ASHER: Palestinian Health Ministry says tear gas was fired on the crowd, triggering the crush. Officials for U.S.-Israeli backed aid group claim the
deadly surge was driven by what it calls armed agitators linked to Hamas. It is the first time the GHF has actually confirmed deaths at one of its
aid sites.
GOLODRYGA: Malnutrition is not only another major obstacle for Palestinians in Gaza; it's also adding to the enormous challenges facing doctors who are
working there.
ASHER: A British surgeon who has been working in Gaza is keeping a video diary for CNN. Nada Bashir has that. We want to warn you that some of the
images you're about to see are disturbing.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NICK MAYNARD, SURGEON AT MEDICAL AID FOR PALESTINIANS: I am just over halfway through my fall in Nasser Hospital Khan Yunis, and this is my third
trip out here since October the seventh, to Gaza. And it is much worse than previous visits.
NADA BASHIR, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Dr. Nick Maynard has been traveling in and out of Gaza for around 15 years. He's been recording diary
entries exclusively for CNN. Together with our own footage from inside the hospital, we have pieced together a first-hand look, the humanitarian
crisis unfolding inside Gaza's hospitals.
MAYNARD: There's a massive area of bombardment just the east of Khan Yunis, the whole operating theater was shaking.
BASHIR (voice-over): Doctors here are not just treating wounds from bombs and bullets. They are fighting to keep their weakest patients alive as
hunger spreads.
MAYNARD: Does it hurt? Where does it hurt? Where does it hurt? He's very sleepy, isn't he?
BASHIR (voice-over): A blockade imposed by Israel on the Gaza strip has thrown the enclaves, 2 million people into the midst of a catastrophic
hunger crisis. As a result, doctors warn Gaza's most vulnerable, including children, are starving to death.
MAYNARD: Maybe cry seeing them my tears, my eyes. Literally, the expression skin and bones doesn't do it justice there. They have no muscle mass at
all, every single rib visible.
BASHIR (voice-over): What we are about to show you is distressing. Baby Zainab (ph) is just five months old. Her sunken cheeks and wrinkled skin a
painful indicator of just how malnourished she is. Her helpless cries, almost too weak to hear.
MAYNARD: What is her weight?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- before at two months she was -- 2.5. She losing weight.
BASHIR (voice-over): Zainab (ph) is just one of so many babies now at risk of death in Gaza.
MAYNARD: There have been four newborn babies in the last couple of weeks who died as a direct result of malnutrition. Their mothers were too
malnourished to produce milk. There are inadequate amounts of formula feed. Healthcare workers who tried to bring in formula feed have had it
specifically confiscated by the Israeli border guards.
BASHIR (voice-over): In response to CNN, the Israeli government said it is working to allow and facilitate the transfer of humanitarian aid to the
residents of the Gaza Strip and is actively assisting these efforts, including the entry of food. But almost all the aid coming through is being
distributed by the controversial Gaza Humanitarian Foundation, which is backed by both the U.S. and Israel.
It's at these sites that hundreds of Palestinians have been killed as they desperately attempt to secure what little aid is being made available, many
of them suffering from injuries that Dr. Nick Maynard says indicate a pattern.
MAYNARD: One day they come in with gunshot wounds to the head. Another day, they come in with gunshot wounds to the neck. The other day, we had four
children admitted, all of whom had been shot in the genitals.
BASHIR (voice-over): CNN has reached out to the Israeli military, but has not yet received a response.
MAYNARD: All the families of these victims, they all tell exactly the same story. That is the Israeli soldiers shooting them and the quadcopters
shooting them.
BASHIR (voice-over): But after more than 21 months of constant bombardment and with at least 1400 medical workers killed during that time, according
to the group medical aid for Palestinians, fatigue and the fear of being targeted pervades.
MAYNARD: Some colleagues have lost 20 or 30 kilograms in weight. So, they are exhausted mentally, they're exhausted physically. They're hungry all
the time, but they cope.
[11:50:00]
BASHIR (voice-over): And while doctors here work around the clock to save their patients from both bombs and bullets, their patients, they say, are
often then lost to hunger. Nada Bashir, CNN, London.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GOLODRYGA: President Donald Trump is touting a sweet deal with Coca Cola. He claims he has persuaded Coca Cola to change the sweetener in its
flagship drink. He says he's been speaking to the company about using real cane sugar in the United States, and that they've agreed.
ASHER: Yeah, American Coca Cola is currently made with high fructose corn syrup, while it's Mexican version and also, by the way, UK version is
actually made with cane sugar. The company switched to syrup decades ago, as it is much cheaper. Coca Cola has not confirmed the change, but says the
company appreciates President Trump's enthusiasm.
More on that let's go to Anna Stewart from London. Anna, you know, I have to say, as a Brit living in the U.S., I always am a little bit concerned
about why the ingredients in the same products are different in America oftentimes, compared to what we're used to in the UK, and --
GOLODRYGA: -- they're better in the UK is that what you're --
ASHER: Maybe some people might say it's a little bit --
GOLODRYGA: -- taste better in the UK as well.
ASHER: And it's not just --
ANNA STEWART, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I want to try the one in the U.S. now I'm in -- all of the different --
ASHER: -- what's been Coco Cola's reaction to what President Trump said, Anna?
STEWART: Well, here's the question. First of all, is this story true? Is it a big cola conspiracy? Clearly, the president has a very long to do list
this week. He's managed to squeeze this one in. The statement from Coca Cola was almost brushed off. I say it said we appreciate President Trump's
enthusiasm for the iconic Coca Cola brand.
More details on new innovative offerings within our range will be shared soon. And they later defended sort of the health of different types of
sugar, including high fructose corn syrup, because that's one of the arguments that's out there as to why perhaps Coca Cola should change its
recipe in the United States.
But according to President Trump and his Truth Social post, he doesn't really get into why he wants to change the recipe. He simply says it's just
better. Perhaps it's on taste, and perhaps that's something we all need to try be well up for a sort of taste test.
[11:55:00]
Now, interestingly, even though we don't know whether the story is completely true or not, it is causing something of a fizz in the markets. I
was intrigued to see some of the sort of big companies behind high fructose corn syrup to take a bit of a dive in markets ADM down.
Oh yeah, nearly 3 percent at this stage. And you then start to question, what will this mean in terms of those that produce corn, those that produce
sugar, corn producers, of course, in some of the big red states will not be very happy if this story is true. And also, I was thinking about sugar,
cane sugar, if the U.S. were to insist on Coca Cola changing the recipe.
If that were to happen, where is the U.S. going to get all of its sugar from? Because it makes lots, but not enough, in terms of its demand and the
biggest places that export, sorry, imports from Mexico and Brazil. Well, it's just threatened Brazil, but -- tariff come August, so it sounds like
Coca Cola could get a lot more expensive for you guys. If this story has any truth in it at all.
ASHER: I have to say Anna, one of the things I'm going to miss about you, because, by the way, Anna is about to go on maternity leave. We are so
happy.
GOLODRYGA: -- you will be back.
ASHER: We adore you. We adore you, and we are so happy.
STEWART: Thank you. Guys, I'll be missing you.
ASHER: Yes, you know she'll be thinking about --
GOLODRYGA: Thinking Coco Cola a while --
ASHER: Don't do it, but we are going to miss you. But obviously, congratulations. We are so happy for you. We weren't debating, we're all in
baby blue. Well, not baby blue, but blue. Are you having a boy?
STEWART: Baby girl, ladies.
ASHER: Oh, Baby girl. I'm a boy mom. I have got boys.
STEWART: -- will be watching.
ASHER: Yes --
GOLODRYGA: You know what? Take every single day of maternity leave. Enjoy it as much as we love work. Work will be here when you come back these
first few months with your baby is something you can never have back. So, enjoy it. Take the time bond.
ASHER: Sleep during the day, obviously lots of sleep, because you're not going to be sleeping at night. Let's be honest.
STEWART: Thanks guys.
GOLODRYGA: And watch us some time.
ASHER: -- always optimistic. Thank you.
GOLODRYGA: Best of luck. Congratulations.
ASHER: And I hope that the baby sleeping 12 hours a night by three months, that is my prayer for you.
GOLODRYGA: -- poke on your pink and your fingertips, and you know --
ASHER: -- so embarrassed. Oh my gosh.
GOLODRYGA: All right, wishing you all the best.
ASHER: Yes.
GOLODRYGA: Can't wait to see you again -- all the time.
STEWART: Thanks -- ladies. I'll see you soon.
ASHER: I think we are about to run over into the next hour.
GOLODRYGA: Yeah, Baby blip. Stay with us. We'll have more "One World" after the break. Remember those days?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[12:00:00]
END
