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One World with Zain Asher
E.U., Ukraine, U.S. Talks Ahead Of Trump-Putin Meeting; Israeli Military Approves "Main Concept" For New Gaza Plan; Trump Vows To Remove Homeless From D.C. ; Mexico Expels 26 High-Ranking Cartel Members To The U.S.; The Importance Of Accurate And Unbiased Economic Statistics; "Godfather Of AI" Says Big Tech Putting Humanity At Risk. Aired 12-1p ET
Aired August 13, 2025 - 12:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[12:00:27]
BIANNA GOLODRYGA, CNN ANCHOR: The head of NATO says the ball is in Putin's court. Last-minute maneuvers as the clock ticks closer to Friday's historic
summit. The second hour of "One World" starts right now.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): Putin definitely does not want peace. He wants to occupy Ukraine and we all
understand that Putin cannot fool anyone.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: One voice, one wish, one will. Ukrainian President Zelenskyy calls for unity as mandatory evacuations get underway in parts of Ukraine.
Also ahead, the way of the future. The godfather of AI speaks out on how humanity can outsmart artificial intelligence.
And later.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAEL PHELPS, AMERICAN SWIMMER: It's what you do behind closed doors that no one sees, that gives you the opportunity to stand out on this field
every single week during the season and be great.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: Well, I'm inspired. Call him Coach Phelps. Why the swimming legend is stepping out of retirement to give the Baltimore Ravens some tips
and tricks.
Hi, everyone. Live from New York, I'm Bianna Golodryga. Zain is off today. You are watching the second hour of "One World."
Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy is making his position clear just two days before a summit in Alaska over the future of his country that he
wasn't invited to.
During a press conference in Berlin, following a virtual meeting with U.S. and European leaders, he reaffirmed that he will not surrender the Donbas
region. And he said if Russia won't agree to a truce, then sanctions against Moscow should be strengthened. Zelenskyy also praised the support
of Western leaders during that earlier call.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ZELENSKYY (through translator): Our mood is united and unified. It was very positive mood. All the partners demonstrated one voice, one wish, one will,
and one principle, and one vision.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: The White House, meantime, says Friday's summit in Anchorage will involve one-on-one talks between Donald Trump and Vladimir Putin and
it's describing the meeting as a listening tour.
But the Kremlin says that its war goals remain unchanged. It comes as Moscow is advancing in eastern Ukraine in an apparent push to gain as much
land and leverage before Friday's talks.
Earlier this week, local officials said Russian troops breached parts of Ukraine's front lines in the Donetsk region. But Kyiv says, they have not
established a foothold and do not have control of any new territory.
And Volodymyr Zelenskyy warns that Moscow is trying to create the distorted perception that Ukraine is losing.
CNN's Nick Paton Walsh joins me now live in Kyiv. And that is an important point because if President Trump, as he has in the past, gets any sort of
signaling, Nick, that Ukraine may be losing this war, it could perhaps serve as an advantage for Vladimir Putin going into these talks on Friday.
Just talk about what's at stake here for Ukraine and what you're hearing from Ukrainians there just days before this meeting.
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yes. I mean, I hate to call a chow of reality here, but in pretty much any measure
you take it, Ukraine is losing the war. It's losing territory slowly to Russia, not in ways that necessarily change the character of the conflict
yet, but the recent breakout to the north of Dobropillya, while it may be an infiltration of small Russian groups, it may be contained.
It's part panic because of the potential for this being the moment where Russia capitalizes on significant gains in its incremental advantages. But
be absolutely clear, the momentum that we've seen over recent weeks is of Russian advances.
Ukraine is having manpower issues. And so the notion of a ceasefire, very much the key plank of what European leaders were discussing today with
Ukraine's Volodymyr Zelenskyy does potentially arrest some of that forward momentum for Russia, which is a reason why Russia may indeed not want it.
A lot emerging after this extraordinary meeting between European leaders and Zelenskyy and President Trump and Vice President JD Vance. A lot of
separate positions. I should run through some of them.
German Chancellor Friedrich Merz, who welcomed Zelenskyy to Berlin, said it was clear that there could be some very consequential decisions being made
in Alaska on Friday. We've heard the White House downplay that as a listening exercise to feel Putin out, but clearly emerging from that call
with Trump.
The German Chancellor felt that big things could potentially happen as a result of Friday. And he's characterized their bid to speak to Trump as a
way to make sure that he's best prepared for success in Anchorage.
[12:05:05]
He also said, importantly, that the legal recognition of territory occupied by Russia in Ukraine is not on the table. That's an important clarification
because potentially that recognition seems to have slipped in to some of the negotiating rhetoric that's emerged from reporting on the Steve Witkoff
meeting with the Kremlin as well.
So an important recognition there. Also, Zelenskyy reaffirmed that he will not be giving up parts of the Donetsk region to Russia as part of a deal.
So, it's simply not up for others to make those particular decisions.
The French president, well, he downplayed the very advances I was just talking about, saying how Pokrovsk has been in perilous situations like
this before and suggesting that this is not a tipping point.
I don't necessarily think it is, but it's certainly deeply concerning for many on the frontline to see in advance of this pace and the reflection of
the change of the kind of warfare we're dealing with, with drones really controlled territory and people trying to sneak between each other and
escape those drones.
A very different war from a year ago. But we're now heading into a key few days of preparation ahead of this particular Alaska meeting on Friday. I
asked one European official familiar with the contents of the call Trump just had, whether or not they felt there was still the threat of sanctions.
And they said certainly yes.
And they believe that the influence on Russia or potentially India being hit by secondary sanctions for its oil and gas purchases from Russia had
had a palpable effect.
We don't know exactly whether if Trump emerges from that Alaska meeting on Friday, feeling that Putin doesn't want a deal, that he may decide to slap
those sanctions on, it's unclear. And that's what the anxiety is all about.
So many concerns too from European officials simply about how they've been learning about the Kremlin's proposals for a peace plan after Putin met
with U.S. Special Envoy Steve Witkoff, one European diplomat called Witkoff's approach amateurish of an issue of the utmost importance.
Another one just suggested to me that indeed negotiation seems to be a lot clearer to understand if Witkoff is not involved with them. I paraphrased
there.
So, a lot of concerns about the simple details of what the Kremlin proposed and indeed what they may propose to Trump and Trump may agree with turn
down or report to his European allies in Ukraine to afterwards is the absence of Ukraine being there that has everyone whose Ukraine's ally
deeply concerned.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. And President Trump earlier this week saying that he will get a better understanding of what Vladimir Putin is willing and not
willing to do within just the first two minutes of this meeting on Friday. Long way to travel for just two minutes, but we'll see.
Nick Paton Walsh, thank you so much.
Well, Israel says its military chief has approved the main concept for its new attack plan in Gaza after 22 weeks of its war against Hamas -- 22
months after its war against Hamas. The announcement comes amid a deepening hunger crisis in the Palestinian enclave and days after Israel's security
cabinet called for a full Israeli takeover of Gaza City despite objections at home and condemnation from around the world.
Now, inside Israel, some human rights activists are protesting a controversial U.S. and Israeli-backed aid initiative. They want the Gaza
Humanitarian Foundation to be shut down.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ITAN VOLKOV, ISRAELI PROTESTER: We oppose every action that the Gaza Humanitarian Fund are doing. They must close now. Aid must flow to the 400
points that are existing with UNRWA and all the other agencies that are ready to do their work, so the food comes to everybody, not only young men
that are prepared to walk for eight miles, sleep outdoor and -- and run like mad men to catch, you know, a few things that are -- that are almost
nothing, you know, to help their families survive.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: Well, for more in the Middle East, as well as the Trump-Putin Summit, let's bring in John Bolton, he's a former national security advisor
serving under President Trump's first term. He's also a former U.S. ambassador to the U.N. Ambassador Bolton, welcome to the program.
So, let's start in the Middle East. Obviously, it's been a few days now since Prime Minister Netanyahu said that Israel will now be taking over
Gaza City in its attempt to squeeze Hamas and perhaps even full control over the enclave, its goals to defeat all of Hamas and bring the hostages
home. That test sparked condemnation from a number of countries, including Israel's allies.
President Trump, on the other hand, says that whatever president Netan -- or Prime Minister Netanyahu decides to do is up to him.
What do you make of the U.S. position as it relates to the war in Gaza right now?
JOHN BOLTON, FORMER U.S. NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: Well, I think it's the correct position. I think Israel said shortly after October the 7th that
its objective in Gaza was the elimination of Hamas as a military and political force.
And I think until that objective is achieved, the conditions for any improvement in Gaza, any kind of stability, any kind of long-term planning
simply don't exist. It's like saying, well, you've got cancer and what we're going to do is operate and we'll take out 90 percent of the cancer.
And we'll leave the other 10 percent. Well, what -- what do you think is going to happen if you do that?
[12:10:22]
So, it's a -- it's a long difficult process. But given the brutality that Hamas has shown with its own citizens throughout this conflict using them
as human shields and for propaganda purposes and anything else that suits Hamas' survival, I think that's where we are.
GOLODRYGA: Do you think that given the pushback that Prime Minister Netanyahu is facing, not only from international countries and -- and
capitals, but also from some of his former military chiefs and it looks like even his current chief of staff may be perhaps being pressured to do
something that he says he -- he doesn't think is an Israel's best interest or the IDF's best interest?
Do you think this exhibits perhaps Netanyahu just trying to put additional pressure on Hamas or nonetheless? Do you actually think that this plan to
take over the entirety of the enclave is what we're about to see unfold?
BOLTON: Well, it certainly seems to be moving in that direction. I mean, I think a lot of the military former and current officers simply don't have
the political appreciation that to -- to -- to win the war. You need to win the war.
And, you know, the -- certainly, it's not something that the U.S. at least finds unusual in World War II. We expected unconditional surrender from
Nazi Germany and unconditional surrender from Imperial Japan.
GOLODRYGA: Ambassador Bolton -- Ambassador Bolton, I'm just going to put -- put us on pause for a second. The president is speaking now on these
conversations with Vladimir Putin coming up on Friday. I want to get your reaction after.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: No, it was always going to be I was going to meet with President Putin. And then after that, I'm going to
call the leaders and President Zelenskyy. I'm going to call President Zelenskyy. And then I'll call probably in that order the leaders.
There's a very good chance that we're going to have a second meeting, which will be more productive than the first, because the first is I'm going to
find out where we are and what we're doing.
Again, this is Biden's war. This isn't my war. He got us into this thing and it should have never happened. This war would have never happened to
our president.
But it is what it is. And I'm here to fix it. And I'm here to stop 6,000, 7,000 people last week, 7,213 people last week were killed, mostly
soldiers.
But missiles being lobbed into the towns don't exactly help either. But mostly soldiers and Ukrainian and Russian, the not American soldiers. But,
you know, if we can save a lot of lives, it'll be a great thing.
I've done -- I've done five -- I've stopped five wars in the last six months. And on top of that, we wiped out the nuclear capability of Iran.
Obliterated it. It's turned out to be a correct word, by the way, because, you know, some of the press said, well, maybe it was an obliteration. It
was obliteration.
And we're going to meet with, I would say the second meeting. If the first one goes OK, we'll have a quick second one. I would like to do it almost
immediately. And we'll have a quick second meeting between President Putin and President Zelenskyy and myself, if they'd like to have me there.
And that would be a meeting where maybe it could be absolutely work. But the first meeting will not work that out. It's certain great things can be
gained in the first. It's going to be a very important meeting, but it's setting the table for the second meeting.
I think the second meeting -- if the second meeting takes place. Now, there may be no second meeting, because if I feel that it's not appropriate to
have it, because I didn't get the answers that we have to have, then we're not going to have a second meeting.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you, sir. Thank you, sir. I didn't ask you. Go ahead, please, red dress.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I just wanted to ask you. Thank you, Mr. President. What -- what involved were you in the selection process of these honorees?
TRUMP: I would say I was about 98 percent involved. No, they all went through me. They came over Rick and Sergio (ph) and everybody. They said, I
turned down plenty. They were too woke. I turned -- I had a couple of wokesters.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: All right. Let's bring in Ambassador Bolton to respond to what we heard from President Trump really tempering expectations going into this
meeting on Friday, which raises the question of why this couldn't have been done over the phone if now the focus would be on a potential second meeting
between President Trump and President Zelenskyy and perhaps even President Trump. Your reaction.
[12:15:59]
BOLTON: Well, honestly, that's what I thought the arrangement was to begin with that there'd first be a meeting between Putin and Trump and then a
second meeting among the three of them, including Zelenskyy.
I think -- I think there was confusion, but in some circles, but that still looks like the same schedule we heard about originally.
The -- the question is, what Trump really thinks is going to happen in terms of the likelihood of success of -- of a ceasefire effort?
I -- I think what he's saying is, if I think that I can contribute to a ceasefire and get the Nobel Peace Prize, then I'll exert the time and
energy necessary to do it. But if I don't, then I'm pulling out. Maybe that means sanctions on Russia. Maybe it means aid to Ukraine. Maybe it just
means he gives up paying any attention to the situation. It's just it emerges just as murky, I think, as it was beforehand on that point.
GOLODRYGA: Well, President Trump seems to really pay attention to how the media, you know this more than most, how the media coverage -- covers these
types of negotiations and deals.
He once again noted and chided the media there for its coverage of the U.S. participating with Israel and its war in Iran.
But this morning, I'm sure you're aware of this as well, he took to social media to criticize the media's coverage of this upcoming summit with
Vladimir Putin. And specifically raised your name and said that those in the unfair media, they work against his meeting with Donald -- with
President Putin and "constantly quoting fired losers and really dumb people like John Bolton, who just said that even though the meeting is on American
soil, Putin has already won."
What's that all about, we are winning on everything? This isn't the first time he's attacked you on social media. But what do you make of this
specific post?
BOLTON: Well, I'm glad I'm still on his mind. Look, he -- he -- I think he recognizes that this meeting may have been set up too hastily. You know,
there's been a fair amount of reporting that Steve Witkoff didn't understand what Putin told him about the Russian peace plan.
And yet, this summit, which I think has been convened and scheduled and is about to be held faster than any summit of comparable leaders in -- in
contemporary history may have been based on Steve Witkoff's misunderstanding of what Putin was actually up to.
So, if things are not what Witkoff reported back, it's certainly in Trump's interest to say, I'm just going to go and listen, I'll decide in two
minutes. It -- it could be a short summit if that's all he's going to do. I don't think it'll turn out that way. But I think he's nervous, perhaps,
that he jumped too soon to set this summit up.
GOLODRYGA: At this point, I talked about it with my Russia guest in the last hour. It seems like everyone has something to lose from this meeting
except for Vladimir Putin. I don't know if you agree with that, but if Putin walks away with nothing, he's still garnered global attention and
recognition coming to the United States for the first time since his second larger scale illegal invasion of Ukraine and -- and President Trump could
lose face here by Russia as we know continuing, in fact, advancing its bombardment on the battlefield and against civilians in Ukraine.
And, of course, Vladimir Putin -- Volodymyr Zelensky has the most at risk here. So, what is your interpretation of what -- what -- what's at stake
for Putin?
BOLTON: Well, I think the direction of travel for Putin is still pretty positive. He's got a meeting. He's got legitimacy. He's going to stand in
the center of world attention, shaking hands with the president of the United States. It's a picture that will be on the front page of every
newspaper in the world the day after.
He succeeded in keeping Zelenskyy and the Europeans and others out. So, it will just be a one-on-one with Trump and a one-on-one U.S.-Russia meeting.
And I think this is important because I think Putin's objective here is to reel Trump back in. I think he sees that for -- for intentionally or
otherwise he -- he pushed through the envelope of Trump's friendship with him. That at least is how Trump characterizes it. And he's going to apply
his KGB training to try and reel Trump back in and convincing that in fact he is serious about peace, although I don't think he is, but he's going to
try and convince Trump of that, and hope to make Trump as much an advocate for his plan as he can.
Now, there's no guarantee of success there, but he has the first mover advantage. I mean, this call they just had with Zelenskyy and the European
leaders, a virtual call for an hour, doesn't compare to what's going to happen in Anchorage on Friday.
GOLODRYGA: Quickly, if you were a betting man, what are the odds you think of this second meeting between President Trump and President Zelenskyy
directly?
BOLTON: Well, I think it depends on whether Putin can -- can work -- work his -- his magic again and get Trump back into line. If so, a big -- a huge
victory for Putin.
[12:20:08]
I think the most likely outcome is that it's very inconclusive and it's going to be open to question whether there will be a second meeting.
GOLODRYGA: All right. We'll be watching it all unfold. John Bolton living free in the president's mind, as always, thank you so much. Rent free
there.
All right. Well, moments ago, Trump also addressed the federal takeover of the Washington D.C. police while speaking at the Kennedy Center a few
moments ago.
National Guard troops patrolled the nation's capital and made 43 arrests last night according to U.S. attorney Jeanine Pirro.
Trump reiterated statements that he made earlier in the week that the city is dirty and unsafe. And he doubled down on his vow to remove the homeless
from the streets of the nation's capital.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Washington beautiful. We're going to redo roads. We're going to redo the medians, the pavers, and the medians all throughout the city. We're
going to take all the graffiti off. We're going to have to remove the tents and the people that are living in our parks. We're going to be redoing the
parks, the grasses and all. We're going to be going to Congress for a relatively small amount of money. And Lindsey and the Republicans are going
to be approving it. I don't.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: All right. Gabe Cohen joins us from Washington with more. And, Gabe, what -- what is the reaction been from residents, from tourists there
visiting the nation's capital and seeing the streets now patrolled by National Guardsmen?
I think we may have lost Gabe. We think we lost Gabe's signal there. We'll try to reconnect with him. Oh, Gabe, I hear you're back. That is not Gabe
that we're looking at right now, so those are the city streets of Washington D.C. If we can get a shot up of Gabe, that would be great.
GABE COHEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm on.
GOLODRYGA: OK. Much better. Gabe, I don't know if you were able to hear my question, but it's been about 24 hours since both tourists and residents --
COHEN: Yes.
GOLODRYGA: -- have seen the National Guard there on the streets. What are you hearing? What's the reaction been?
COHEN: Well, look, we could tell last night from the presence of the National Guard here on the mall that it was really more about visibility
than anything. We expect hundreds of National Guard soldiers to be out across D.C. in the coming days and weeks, but most of them are unarmed.
They're not expected to be making arrests, so that is really about visibility.
We're also though seeing FBI agents, DEA agents who are out working collaboratively with the local police department here. They will have more
of a hand in the actual law enforcement process.
I do though, Bianna, want to talk a little bit about what we just heard from the president because he did make news on several aspects of the
federalization of the local police department here that we have seen over the last couple days.
He mentioned a couple things, one, that it looks like they are planning to extend well beyond the 30 days that they initially called for this
federalization. And I do want to mention what you're hearing is actually a U.S. Park Police helicopter flying over my head right now so it gives you a
sense of the ramped up federal law enforcement presence here in the Downtown D.C. area.
But again, it looks like they are going to extend or at least they're planning on it. They may need congressional approval, though, the president
says he can do it with an executive order, an emergency order if need be, but they want to extend their federalization taking control of the
Metropolitan Police Department potentially long term.
He mentioned crime data in D.C. Remember, he and the White House have said that there is a violent crime emergency in Washington, that the numbers are
worse than they've ever been. But really the data that the police department here keeps has shown that violent crime is on the decline,
especially since 2023 when it was really spiking, when there was a serious violent crime issue in Washington.
Well, just a little while ago, we heard the president say that the data MPD keeps is fake essentially that they are cooking the books, and that in
reality, the numbers are worse than they've ever been.
He also criticized the mayor, Muriel Bowser, saying they have a good relationship the two of them, but that in reality, she is not really doing
her job.
We have heard in recent months, Mayor Bowser, really tempering her language, trying not to antagonize the president. She was a vocal critic of
his during the first term not during this term. She has really tried to back off, give the White House small wins because she does not want to
antagonize President Trump.
And yet right now, we are hearing the president essentially call her out and say the mayor in D.C. and local officials are not doing a good job.
They are not doing their jobs at all. We will see if her tone changes the way it did last night when we heard really her -- her -- her stiffest
criticism of him so far saying that what he is doing right now is an authoritarian push.
But even this morning, we heard the police chief and the mayor here say, well, maybe ramping up federal law enforcement resources could be a good
thing for the district.
Bianna, one key detail here is we really don't know who, at the end of the day, is going to be calling the shots in the days and weeks ahead. If the
federal government is just there to collaborate with the police department, because the mayor and police chief say they are still the ones in charge.
[12:25:09]
But if you ask the White House, they say Attorney General Pam Bondi and the head of the DEA, they are the ones who are in charge over the police
department.
So, there is a power struggle happening right now. All of that really significant news coming out of this press conference. Also, the president
saying D.C.'s push for statehood is ridiculous and it is not going to happen.
And I also want to mention, Bianna, he is saying that they are going to ask Congress for money to help with this law enforcement effort here in the
nation's capital.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. After withholding a billion dollars worth of funding for DC that could perhaps be addressing and maybe --
COHEN: That's right.
GOLODRYGA: -- even more efficiently addressing some of these really important issues.
Gabe Cohen, thank you.
Still to come for us, more on President Trump's choice to be the new head of the Bureau of Labor Statistics, who he is and why his nomination is
raising a lot of eyebrows.
And dozens of high-ranking members of Mexican drug cartels have been sent to the U.S. as part of an agreement between Mexico and Washington. We'll
break down what the implications of this deal are after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GOLODRYGA: Mexico has sent 26 high-ranking cartel figures to the United States in a deal struck with the Trump administration to ratchet up
pressure on drug smuggling criminal networks.
Mexico's Attorney General confirmed the transfer after the U.S. Department of Justice promised prosecutors would not seek the death penalty.
The U.S. has designated one of Mexico's most powerful cartels, the CJNG, as a terrorist organization.
Let's bring in Valeria Leon in Mexico City who's been tracking the story for us. And talk about the significance of this development, Valeria.
VALERIA LEON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Bianna, to be -- a part of this list, include the son-in-law of Ismael "El Mayo" Zambada, one of the
founders of the Sinaloa cartel who's also in U.S. custody.
And this morning, President Sheinbaum said that the transfer to the U.S. of these 26 members of drug cartel was for security reasons. And the suspects
were flown down north Tuesday.
And Mexico's Attorney General says that the handover only happened after the U.S. promised not to seek the death penalty.
[12:30:00]
And this move come in long step with ongoing negotiations between the two countries in the midst of near-constant tariff hike threats from the U.S.
on Mexican exports.
While Mexico has managed to fend off the round of tariffs by a month and a half, it's now tracking a more cooperative stance with the White House.
And about this transfer, even the U.S. embassy in Mexico emphasized that this new transfer of criminals, it was the U.S. ambassador to Mexico,
Ronald Johnson, who put out a message thanking Mexican President Claudia Sheinbaum yesterday, saying that he's deeply grateful to President
Sheinbaum and also her administration for demonstrating determination in the fight against organized crime.
Meanwhile, yesterday, the U.S. government updated its travel advisory for Mexico. It warns that 30 out of the 32 states face serious security issues,
including terrorism, crime, and kidnapping. Six states are at level four. This means, Bianna, the highest warning, which U.S. citizens are advised to
avoid completely.
And six more states are at level three, meaning, Americans should reconsider traveling to all of this while trump continues to threaten
Mexico with massive tariffs on its exports.
And President Claudia Sheinbaum has been more cooperative with her counterpart. In her press conference, she has stressed that Mexico will not
be subordinated to the U.S. government, would -- will remain open to continue cooperation with the Trump administration, if that means sending
more cartel leaders north as part of the security strategy driven from Washington. Bianna.
GOLODRYGA: Valeria Leon reporting from Mexico City. Thank you.
Still to come for us, inflation is at the top of mind for most American voters. We'll crunch the numbers with Harry Enten after the break. There he
is. Hi, Harry.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[12:35:44]
GOLODRYGA: Welcome back to "One World." I'm Bianna Golodryga.
While inflation remains a top concern for American voters, and new numbers show President Trump's performance on that is now worse than when he was
elected.
Let's bring in our data cruncher, our friend Harry Enten. And, Harry, remind me, I think that one of the main reasons that voters turned up and
supported Trump again for a second term was because of concern for inflation and bringing inflation down. So, this can't bode well for the
president.
HARRY ENTEN, CNN CHIEF DATA ANALYST: No, it's an abject disaster. I mean, you can go out trying by any product. You could go out here in New York,
you could go out in California, you could go out anywhere in these great United States of America, and inflation, of course, way higher the prices
of things.
And, look, this tells the entire story right here. Why did Donald Trump win in 2024? It was because he beat Kamala Harris on the key issue of
inflation.
Harris versus Trump, Trump was preferred by nine points. Look at where his net approval rating is today. Oh, my goodness gracious, down there, minus
25 points. He is swimming with the fishes.
And I'll tell you this much, if he doesn't solve this problem, that's what's going to end up happening to his presidency. It is going to go
adios, amigos, goodbye, see you later, because the issue of inflation is so important.
Now, of course, next year, we have a midterm election, and maybe there are some Republicans in the House who think, you know, I can escape the wrath
of the voters that they may have for Donald Trump because they don't feel he's solving the inflation problem.
Well, I have got a myth-busting thing for them, if they believe it. Take a look here. OK. Which party has trusted more in inflation? You go back to
last midterm in October of 2022. The polling show, the GOP, was preferred by 13 points.
Look at where we are now. Hello. Democrats are preferred by a point. That's a move of nearly 15 points.
All of a sudden, a key issue that helped drive the Republican majority in the House of Representatives, that helped drive Donald Trump right back to
the White House. Now, the voters are turning against Donald Trump. And they're turning against the Republican Party as well.
Now, of course, we're talking about inflation being the all-important issue that got Donald Trump reelected to the White House last year. Where does it
rank, though, now for the voters? I think this is so important to point out.
It's number one. It is number one. Thirty-four percent say the top issue for them right now is inflation. But look at what's number two. It's
basically an offshoot of that, right? It's the economy at 16 percent.
When you total it together, you're getting 50 percent of the public saying that the top issue for them right now is inflation of the economy.
Now, I rarely make promises that I can't keep, so I will make this promise to you right now, Bianna. If these numbers hold, there is a better chance
on God's green earth there is no chance that Republicans can hold on to the House of Representatives.
There is a better chance that I could possibly be mean to you than Republicans actually holding on to the House of Representatives. That's how
you know. That is how you know that these numbers are an abject disaster if they hold.
But of course, we still have what? About 15, 16 months until the midterm elections. So, we'll see where inflation actually ends up down the line.
GOLODRYGA: Your predictions are as good as gold, Harry. But we also know when it comes to inflation in some disappointing economic figures, it may
take months for that to really seep into the economy.
So, yes, we do have time, but not really. Not really. Those midterms will be here before we know it.
ENTEN: They'd be here before they know it. And you know what, as James Carville once said, it's the economy --
GOLODRYGA: I know where you're going.
ENTEN: You know where I'm going with this. But in this case, it's the economy smarty pants.
GOLODRYGA: Yes. I was going to say, we don't call each other stupid. There's no stupid in this House.
ENTEN: No.
GOLODRYGA: All right. Harry Enten, my genius friend. Always good to see you.
ENTEN: Right back at you.
GOLODRYGA: Well, Donald Trump has named E.J. Antoni to lead the Bureau of Labor Statistics.
Now, he recently fired the last head of the BLS after a revision in the jobs data that he didn't like. This has led to concern about future
statistics released by the federal government. The monthly jobs report is one of the most crucial and historic measurements about the state of the
U.S. economy. And Donald Trump's pick appears to be backing off of the notion of suspending that report. It's an idea that he had previously
floated.
Antoni previously told Fox News Digital that the agency should publish only quarterly data, claiming the monthly report is unreliable and frequently
revised.
[12:40:05]
Here's what he said to another news channel late last year.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
E.J. ANOTNI, ECONOMIST: I want to say that there's anything nefarious going on at the Bureau of Labor Statistics, simply because I have no evidence of
that, to be clear.
However, just because you didn't make a -- a sin of -- of commission doesn't mean you haven't committed a sin of omission. And I think that's
what's going on here.
What I mean by that is there are serious problems in the -- the models and the methodologies at BLS, serious one.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: Time now for "The Exchange." Joining me is Justin Wolfers, professor of economics and public policy at the University of Michigan.
Justin, what is interesting and curious is the president hasn't been criticizing those numbers in previous revisions if they worked in the
economy's favor, if they worked in his favor. But now, we had numbers that didn't. And here we see the consequences of that in the firing of the BLS
commissioner and replacing her with E.J. Antoni.
First of all, your reaction to Antoni being the nominee here. I think a lot of people took to the internet, perhaps, to look up who this man was. Tell
us what they would find.
JUSTIN WOLFERS, PROFESSOR OF ECONOMICS AND PUBLIC POLICY, UNIVERSITY OF MICHIGAN: That he's a know-nothing, a do-nothing. He's unqualified and
manifestly unfit for the position.
This is a fellow who finished graduate school five years ago from one of the leading universities in Northern Central Illinois and has -- has never
had management experience, but is looking now to manage a bureau of 2,000 economists, perhaps the largest agglomeration of economists anywhere in the
world.
He's never worked on labor. He's never worked on statistics. And he's never run a bureau, which under Trump, I think makes him perfectly qualified to
run the Bureau of Labor Statistics.
More than that, he's shown an intense proclivity to either misunderstand or misrepresent statistics. This is someone with no mooring and no anchoring
to truth, but in complete submission to Trump and the president's will.
GOLODRYGA: And, look, you may have some that say we don't necessarily need to have Ivy School, you know, graduates, these sort of, you know, smarty
pants that think they know better than everybody else.
So, leaving even his education to the side, you're right to point out that there's not much experience in running an organization like BLS. And he has
a lot of criticism about the organization and -- and perhaps maybe that's what caught the president's eye in nominating him.
Can you just remind us of the importance that I think a lot of people here in the States and around the world take for granted in assuming that any
economic data that is produced by the U.S. government should be trusted and what happens when that trust fails?
WOLFERS: Yes. Economic data is the lifeblood of making decisions. The particular data that Antoni was talking about, nonfarm payrolls are the
most closely watched data series literally in the world.
They -- they form the basis of when the Federal Reserve decides whether to lower or raise interest rates. Billions of dollars are traded on Wall
Street based on this.
Companies around the country look to this to figure out which industries are doing well and which are doing poorly to figure out which parts of the
country they should open a new plant, where they'll be able to find skilled workers, which parts of the country have -- have workers shortages.
The BLS produces not just those data, it also produces the inflation data. This is really important because if the president decides he doesn't like
it -- you know, if inflation were to rise as a result of the tariffs and the president decided he was uncomfortable with that and Antoni just
revised the statistics down, that would mean that the folks on Social Security wouldn't get the annual rises in income they normally get to
compensate.
So these statistics are at the heart of so much of what we do. We take them for granted. They're sort of like the highway -- the -- the highway system,
but for decision-making.
GOLODRYGA: And this isn't all happening in a vacuum. We know that the president, since he's come into office even before, has been highly
critical of the independent Fed chair, Jay Powell, for not cutting interest rates sooner. It looks like they may be doing that in the months to come.
But that's, again, something that the president has been discussing for months.
Just now, this morning, he said that he has narrowed his list of successors and may even appoint -- name one, appoint one in a few months' time. So,
effectively, we'd have a shadow Fed chair. That on top of criticizing Goldman Sachs in saying they should replace their chief economist.
This happens, as I'm sure you heard Harry Enten talking about the number one concern for voters is the economy. He's underwater when it comes to
where inflation is. You put all this together, and that tells you what, Justin?
WOLFERS: I mean, it tells you that the president lied to the American people. He won an election based on his words, reducing the cost of living.
And the first thing he did was introduced a whole new series of taxes on goods that are imported from abroad. We call those taxes, of course,
tariffs.
[12:45:09]
He's messed with the Central Bank. This is a Central Bank that's tasked with keeping inflation down. He's called for cutting interest rates to
utterly absurd levels, levels that potentially would cause inflation to skyrocket.
So, yes, he said one thing during the campaign. It was one thing that won him a lot of portraits from the broader public, but he's done exactly the
opposite ever since.
GOLODRYGA: All right. Justin Wolfers, good to see you. As always. Give our best of Betsey. Appreciate the time.
WOLFERS: Thanks, mate.
GOLODRYGA: We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GOLODRYGA: Remember the "Terminator", a movie about artificial intelligence turning on humanity? Well, a pioneer who's been dubbed the godfather of AI
says that it really could happen, and the tech industry's attempts to keep us safe aren't working.
Nobel Prize-winning scientist Geoffrey Hinton said previously that there's a 10 to 20 percent chance AI could wipe out the human race.
According to him, leading tech companies are making a mistake in trying to keep AI models submissive to humans. Instead, Hinton says AI models should
have what he calls maternal instincts built into them, so that they really care about people.
Joining us now to break down all of this is our tech reporter Clare Duffy. So, not an easy topic to discuss, as people are watching, perhaps having
lunch, thinking that AI could one day wipe the human race off the face of the map.
But talk about what this Godfather of AI as many are calling him, what he's suggesting to do to make sure that doesn't happen.
CLARE DUFFY, CNN TECH REPORTER: Yes, Bianna. A lovely Wednesday morning, morning. Or evening morning about AI, ruining humanity, destroying
humanity.
But, look, Hinton is one of the leading voices, original voices in the AI space. And he has been increasingly warning about the need for more safety
measures.
In these -- these comments that he made yesterday, in particular taking a shot at the, quote, tech bros who are currently leading AI companies, who
he says are taking the wrong approach to this potential existential risk by trying to ensure humans remain dominant over AI systems.
And the way he puts it, if AI systems become smarter than humans, as many people predict they will, they'll be able to manipulate us and prioritize
their own interests and their ability to continue functioning over our needs.
And, look, we have seen some early examples of AI systems being manipulative and deceptive, although I will say many of those examples have
come from safety tests, limited safety tests by the AI companies.
[12:50:09]
But Hinton said that we need to start training AI models to be more like our mothers, so that they care about humans' well-being, even if they
become smarter and more powerful than us.
Let's take a quick listen to these comments that he made yesterday during an AI conference in Las Vegas.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: However, that's also a -- a big application of sort of independence, right, to say, I -- I will let this AI sort of parent me. Do
you -- do you think that's kind of the best possible outcome here?
GEOFFREY HINTON, "GODFATHER OF AI": I think that's the -- that's only good outcome. If it's not going to parent me, it's going to replace me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DUFFY: It's kind of a fascinating suggestion there. If AI is not going to parent me, it's going to suggest to replace me. He says, although it is not
clear, you know, from these comments how technically he would expect the tech companies to implement this kind of training.
And I will say too, there are a lot of experts in the space who disagree with Hinton about how existential this risk is from artificial
intelligence, but a pretty stark warning from such a prominent voice in the space, Bianna.
GOLODRYGA: No doubt. My takeaway is another reminder of just how important the job of being a mom really is.
Clare Duffy, thank you so much.
DUFFY: Thank you.
GOLODRYGA: And coming up for us.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PHELPS: Just walking in, you just feel like I -- I feel -- I feel energized.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: Olympic gold medalist Michael Phelps returns to his hometown of Baltimore with a brand-new mission. I love this story.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GOLODRYGA: Well, here's an interesting fact for you before we go. One-third of players on the Baltimore Ravens' pro football team don't know how to
swim. Or at least that used to be true before they made a call to the most successful Olympic swimmer of all time. Go big or go home, right? Of
course, we're talking about Michael Phelps, a Baltimore native himself.
Now, they're in the water, as you see, giving the team swimming lessons. Cornerback Marlon Humphrey made a viral video with his teammates asking
Phelps to help out once he realized so many of them were just not comfortable in the water.
Well, the Olympian was quick to answer the call.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PHELPS: For me, to be able to have this opportunity to hopefully allow some of the guys that might not feel comfortable or safe in the water, to give
them just that little extra.
Give the boys maybe a new tool, but also give them some extra confidence.
Drowning is the second highest cause of death for children under the age 14. For me, with my foundation, that's something that we're -- we're trying
to change.
[12:55:09]
Honestly, for me to get into the swimming pool, I was definitely afraid. I didn't want to put my face underneath.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GOLODRYGA: As a regular swimmer myself, I -- I love this story. You can see linebacker Roquan Smith getting some help there. Apparently one of the most
enthusiastic learners there.
Phelps' manager told "The Baltimore Review" she hasn't seen him so excited for anything in a long time. What a fantastic story. Maybe other NFL teams
will be calling Michael Phelps after that.
All right. That does it for this hour of one world. Thanks so much for watching. I'm Bianna Golodryga. "Amanpour" is up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[13:00:00]
END
