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One World with Zain Asher
Hundreds Gather in Hostages Square Two Years After Attack; Soon: Canadian PM Carney to Meet Trump at the White House; Fiery Exchanges as AG Bondi Testifies to Senators; Illinois Pushes Back as Trump Moves to Deploy National Guard to Chicago; Pain of October 7 Features in Social Artistic Project. Aired 11a-12p ET
Aired October 07, 2025 - 11:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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ZAIN ASHER, CNN HOST, ONE WORLD: Today marks two years since the Hamas attack on Israel. "One World" starts right now. It is a day of
commemorations and mourning as Israel marks two years since Hamas is deadly attack. We are live for you at Hostage Square with the very latest.
Plus, Canada's Prime Minister needs a win in Washington to steady his nation's economy. We're also live at the White House ahead of a key meeting
with President Donald Trump. And new threats by President Trump to use the insurrection act if needed, to deploy National Guard troops to blue cities
and states.
-- live from New York. I'm Zain Asher. This is "One World". It has been two years since Hamas launched the deadliest terror attacks in Israeli history.
So, shocking in its brutality, it was met with immediate and unequivocal, global condemnation. Earlier, the nation came to a standstill as memorial
sirens rang out honoring the 1200 people who were killed and the 250 others kidnapped in that surprise attack.
Hundreds of Israelis also gathered in Hostage Square to mark the solemn anniversary. But 731 days later, the violence continues. The pain isn't
just being felt in Israel, but of course, in Gaza as well, where Palestinians have been enduring two years of relentless war triggered by
the Hamas massacre.
Health officials say that more than 67,000 people in Gaza have been killed in Israeli attacks, including more than 20,000 children and 10,000 women.
The devastation laid there by these two Stark before and after images, but perhaps for the first time, there may be a glimmer of hope that peace is
within reach.
Israeli and Hamas negotiators are in Egypt trying to reach an agreement based on U.S. President Donald Trump's ceasefire plan. CNN's Jeremy Diamond
joins us live now from Tel Aviv. Jeremy, the thing about the October 7th attacks back in 2023 just two years ago, is that they were unique.
They were unique in their cruelty, unique in their barbarity. When you think about what happened on that Saturday. Just explain to us how Israeli
society has been forever changed by October 7th.
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, that's right. And you know, it's two years now since Hamas militants stormed across the Gaza
border, killing nearly 1200 people, the majority of whom were civilians. People were slaughtered inside of their homes, inside of bomb shelters on
the sides of roads, and of course, at that Nova Music Festival in Southern Israel.
And more than 250 others were taken hostage inside of Gaza, and indeed, 48 of those are still being held hostage there today. And that means that even
though we are talking about a two-year anniversary, this is not just a commemoration, but also an opportunity for the families of those hostages
to continue raising those voices.
And I want to bring in here Gil Dickmann, who is the cousin of Carmel Gat. She was one of those more than 250 who were taken hostage on that day. She
was unfortunately killed by Hamas in captivity as Israeli forces closed in on their location, but Gil has been one of the most prominent voices in
this protest movement.
And you are continuing to advocate for hostages held there. What does this moment mean for you today?
GIL DICKMANN, COUSIN OF CARMEL GAT: Well, it's still unbelievable that it's been two years since that horrible day -- my aunt was actually killed that
day on October 7th.
[11:05:00]
I found the video on a telegram channel in my phone. Just two years ago, on October 7th, it's unbelievable that hostages are still there, held in
captivity after two years. It's like an entire day that lasts two years, and it's the day of the massacre. It's the most horrible day of in Israel's
history, and it lasts for two years now.
And we know because we lost Carmel after 328 days that no one of the hostages is safe there. They could die if the hostages that are no longer
alive may be lost in Gaza. And that's why we urge the Israeli government and we urge Donald Trump to move quickly towards a deal we know finally
there's a deal on the table.
We have to act quickly before it's too late for the hostages. Netanyahu thought that he had time and that he could just prolong this war again and
again and again to make it as long as he wants. And that's how we lost Carmel. That's how we lost 42 hostages who were taken alive and murdered in
captivity.
I would never forgive myself if it happens to even one more hostage that we lose and that we can still save.
DIAMOND: On this two-year anniversary. You know, there are these talks happening in Egypt right now to finally try and bring a close to all of
this, to the war in Gaza, to bring all of the hostages, home. How optimistic are you that this moment is different from the other moments
where we've also been close to a potential ceasefire?
DICKMANN: So, we as families try, most of the times not to be too optimistic, because we don't want to get our hopes up and then get
disappointed, like it happened. You know, with Carmel, we were so close so many times he was just hours away from coming back home and the ceasefire
collapsed.
They went back into fighting. We don't want this to happen again, but it feels different, mainly because Donald Trump said that he wants this over.
And when Trump said something that means the world should act accordingly, we know if it was only up to Netanyahu, he would just prolong this war.
And the fact that Donald Trump hears us, the people of Israel, he knows that we want this war to get to an end. We want to end this war. We want
the hostages more than anything else. The fact that Trump listens to us and hears us is meaningful. We actually, we sent a letter about and recommended
him for a Nobel Peace Prize.
I think if he gets these hostages back home, and if he ends this war, he definitely deserves the peace prize, and I hope he does so.
DIAMOND: And very quickly, you know what, why is it so important for Israelis to continue lifting their voices up right now, even as these
negotiations are still ongoing? You guys are still continuing to protest and to demonstrate.
DICKMANN: So, we know that the hostages in captivity hear us. They see us. It keeps them strong to know that we're fighting for them. Carmel -- then
heard me in captivity, and that made her feel that we're fighting for her. That was so important for her. And we know that the most powerful person on
earth, Donald Trump, listens to us.
He knows that most of the Israelis want this war to end, and actually, even most of Likud voters want this war to end. The war should know this, that
Israel does not represent a continuation of a war for eternity. We want this to end and for the hostages to come home. That's what we want.
DIAMOND: Gil Dickmann, thank you so much. And as Gil was just talking about, you know, we are two years later. This is a commemoration, but the
fight is very much still ongoing for the hostages. There are also families whose loved ones were killed on October 7th, who are still fighting for
answers and accountability.
A state commission of inquiry that has yet to actually be set up, and, of course, a fight overall for the future of Israel, what the direction of
this country is going to be two years on, from a moment that changed this country forever, Zain, Bianna.
ASHER: All right. Jeremy Diamond live for us. Thank you. A little bit later on the show, I'm speaking to Daniel Tchetchik. He's a Star Photographer and
Chief Editor of the Photography Blog at Haaretz newspaper. He divides his time between artistic projects and documentary assignments often.
Each approach inspires the other. So do stay tuned for that. And we are standing by this hour for a bilateral meeting between U.S. President Donald
Trump and the Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney. That's going to be taking place at the White House any moment now.
This will be Mark Carney's second visit to the Oval Office in five months. It comes at a time when the relationship between longtime allies have been
fractured by Mr. Trump's tariffs. Mr. Carney is under pressure at home to address the steep U.S. tariffs on cars, on steel and other key Canadian
exports that are certainly hurting its economy.
We will be live at the White House once again as soon as that happens. We'll bring you his arrival and the meeting live. Let's bring in CNN's
Kevin Liptak joining us live now from the White House as well. So just explain to us it's really difficult to resolve all of these issues, of
course, in a single day.
What are we expecting in terms of any kind of substantive outcome here, with this visit by Mark Carney and you know, just in terms of Canada's
leverage against the U.S.? What does that look like?
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KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yeah, and I think, frankly, expectations are pretty low that Mark Carney will be successful in getting
any of these tariffs eased on Canada. He is under a lot of pressure. Canada is the only member of the G7 who has not been able to broker a broader
trade agreement with the United States that allows some of these tariffs to come off.
I think if there is any outcome that he can hope for, it is that the discussions keep going that President Trump sort of understands the
economic hardships that this is placing on Canadians, but also to try and impart on the president some knowledge and understanding of how this is
affecting the United States.
You know, there is sort of a sense, I think, of betrayal in Canada, that their neighbor, their top trading partner, what had been quite a long-
standing good relationship has really soured since President Trump came into office, both because of the tariffs and because President Trump keeps
talking about wanting to annex Canada and make it the 51st state.
To really try and explain to the president that this is sort of a predicament that doesn't benefit either country. Now, when we talk about
the tariffs, the president has sort of piled them on top of each other. There's the 35 percent tariff that he says is punishment for allowing
fentanyl to cross the border, although in comparison to the U.S. southern border.
It's a minuscule amount that comes across from Canada. There are also these sectoral sanctions that the president has put in place on steel, aluminum,
autos and lumber. Now, in all of this, products that are covered by the USMCA, which is sort of the new NAFTA, the North American Trade Agreement,
are exempt from these tariffs. And what Mark Carney has said is that overall, the average tariff rate of Canadian products in the U.S. is only
about 5.6 percent.
And so, it's not an overwhelming amount, but it is having a potential effect on the economy there. You know, you've seen unemployment tick up,
cost of living tick up, and he is under pressure from his political rivals to try and get some relief from these tariffs. And you've seen his -- the
Conservative Leader in Canada Pierre Poilievre say that he was volunteering to come and negotiate directly with Trump, which would kind of be an
extraordinary move.
No one expects Carney to take him up on that, but it does kind of underscore the political pressures that Carney is facing here. The other
thing that is looming over all of these talks is the required review of USMCA, which comes, comes due next year. And the big question, I think, is
whether President Trump will maintain this multi-country agreement, or whether he'll try and strike bilateral agreements with Canada and with
Mexico.
And I think, sort of the desire of the Canadians is to try and keep this into a North American agreement. And so, anything that they can discuss
that can advance this, I think, will be good for Carney, good for Canada in their view. The two men have had a relatively cordial relationship.
This has not been colored by the acrimony that was evident with President Trump's relationship with Justin Trudeau, who is Carney's predecessor.
Whether that's maintained today, of course, we'll see. But so far, they've been able to get on personally, that hasn't necessarily translated to any
trade or tariff relief for Canada.
ASHER: All right. Kevin Liptak, live for us there. Thank you so much. For more in terms of what's at stake for Canada, let's bring in Nanos Research
Founder and Chief Data Scientist Nik Nanos joins us live now from the Canadian capital, Ottawa. Nik, thank you so much for being with us.
Just in terms of which sectors are most exposed to U.S. tariffs, and which ones you anticipate will receive the most attention during this bilat
meeting. Just walk us through that.
NIK NANOS, CHIEF DATA SCIENTIST & FOUNDER OF NANOS RESEARCH: A lot of them have to do with those big industrial sectors, like the automotive sectors,
firmly in the sights of U.S. President Donald Trump, all those jobs in the Canada U.S. auto pact. Also, the steel industry, another kind of signature
industry where President Trump wants to kind of bring back jobs into America and in the steel industry.
You know, I think the one thing that they haven't been talking about is the one sector where Canada does have leverage, and that has to do with energy
and oil and the oil sands project in energy risk Alberta, which is in Western Canada. You know, the president has not really been talking a lot
about that.
And he's actually -- it's been a bit of a red line that any action on the part of the Canadians that might include tariffs or any retaliation that
includes energy, would really escalate things. But really, the Trump Administration seems to be focusing on those blue-collar jobs that really
Donald Trump wants to bring back into the American industrial heartland.
ASHER: How does Canada I mean this obviously, is very difficult to do, and I'm going to preface this question with that before I ask it, just in terms
of how realistic it would be for Canada to eventually, at some point in the medium term or the long term, diversify away from American markets to
reduce dependency on the U.S.
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What does that look like in the long term?
NANOS: It actually works both ways. You know, the fact of the matter is, is that Canada remains one of the largest customers of the United States. So,
you know, the thing is, is for the U.S. and Canadian economy, they are already intertwined significantly. And you know, the thing is, it's going
to be hard to unwind that.
The fact of the matter is, is that regardless of where we land on the trade and tariff front, the two economies will continue to work together and be
very important to each other. I think the big question is, is that if certain sectors of the economy, like the steel industry or the automotive
industry get crushed under tariffs from the U.S. Administration.
Where are the jobs going to come from for Canadians? And I think when it comes to diversification, it's not just trade diversification, but it's
basically economic diversification in terms of some sectors that really rely on stability in the trade relationship with the United States in order
for them to stay vibrant.
ASHER: And as I was saying to our report on the ground outside the White House, Kevin Liptak, you know, it's really difficult for there to be any
kind of substantive progress in just sort of one day, right? Obviously, it's the second time meeting Trump at the White House, but your
expectations have to be low.
But it is possible for Mark Carney to walk away with some kind of a concession, I guess, some kind of a small win. What would that look like?
What can he go back to the Canadian people to sell at home?
NANOS: The only way Mark Carney is going to have any kind of concession or win is if Donald Trump decides. The fact of the matter is, President Trump
is in the driver's seat. You know, the U.S. economy is 10 times the size of the Canadian economy, and Mark Carney, it's stepping into the lion's den.
The White House is the new lion's den for any global leader. I think a win or a positive outcome for Mark Carney would be to continue the process
that's in place the U.S., Canada, Mexico trade negotiations are starting the consultation process. If Mark Carney comes out of this, not with a
concession on tariffs, but just basically to say, hey, you know what?
We have a plan. There's a process for us to kind of work out the next phase of the trade relationship in North America, and that the U.S.
Administration is committed to the process. I think the fact that the Trump Administration initiated the consultation phase is a good sign, because
what it means is at least they're moving through the existing way to kind of deal with these trade irritants, but to think that Mark Carney is going
to win anything? No, I don't think so.
ASHER: OK.
NANOS: I --
ASHER: No optimism for me. Well, listen, we'll see, right? We'll see what happens, and we're going to have you back later on the show. Hopefully the
meeting is going to start in about five minutes.
NANOS: OK.
ASHER: And we're going to have you back to dissect all of that with us. Thank you. Nik Nanos, appreciate it. Once again, we are standing by for
that bilateral meeting to take place between the Canadian Prime Minister and Donald Trump. We will bring you those events at the White House as soon
as it happens.
He's set to arrive any moment now. All right. Up next on "One World", a combative U.S. Attorney General sits down before a Senate committee facing
tough questions from Democrats on the prosecution of Trump's political opponents, deployment of National Guards and the Epstein files.
And Illinois pushing back over guard troops in Chicago, where the White House says they're needed, and what Trump is now suggesting he might do if
the court blocks the deployment.
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ASHER: All right. U.S. Attorney General Pam Bondi is testifying on Capitol Hill right now. And it has been an unusually combative session, with Bondi
blasting Democrats from the outset for shutting down government. And Democrats firing back that she has turned the Department of Justice into a
political machine working to do Donald Trump's bidding.
Even simple questions have turned into angry back and forth exchanges, like this moment where the Attorney General was asked about a bag of FBI -- a
bag of money FBI agents allegedly gave Donald Trump's Border Czar Tom Homan.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. SHELDON WHITEHOUSE (D-RI): What became of the $50,000 did the FBI get it back?
PAM BONDI, THEN-ATTORNEY GENERAL NOMINEE: Mr. Whitehouse, excuse me. Senator Whitehouse, you're welcome to talk to the FBI.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The report to you, can't you answer this question?
BONDI: Senator Whitehouse, you're welcome to discuss this with Director Patel.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did Homan keep the $50,000.
BONDI: As Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche recently stated.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right. Never mind.
BONDI: The investing Mr. Homan --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Never mind. I can see I'm not going to get a straight answer from you to a very simple question.
BONDI: -- FBI --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ASHER: Right, CNN's Justice Correspondent Evan Perez is on Capitol Hill for us. So, it was certainly combative, right? But we knew some of the topics
that were going to come up. Obviously, James Comey's indictment was one. The Epstein files was another. Just walk us through how Bondi responded to
those.
EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR U.S. JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, that gives you a little flavor of what it's been like in this hearing room. Democrats have
come ready with some of the questions that you talked about at the beginning, including the Epstein files and about the decision making of the
Justice Department to go after some of President Trump's political enemies, which he has openly called for.
She has declined to answer many of those questions, but she came very ready with a couple of very quick retorts, including, of course, blaming
Democrats for the current shutdown of the government, and also going after Democrats for not encouraging cities to cooperate with the president on
bringing in the National Guard to go after some of the crime problems that you see in Chicago and in other cities.
And she also defended the Justice Department against accusations that they are going after President Trump's political enemies and that this is all a
political ploy on the part of the department. Listen to this exchange with Senator Coons.
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SEN. CHRIS COONS (D-DE): What would you do if your career DOJ prosecutors came to you with a case to prosecute grounded in the facts and law, but the
White House directs you to drop the case.
BONDI: Senator, if I thought that would happen, I would not be sitting here today. That will not happen. Will not happen.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PEREZ: And the Attorney General has a lot of help from Republicans who are trying to turn the hearing into a weaponization claims of a different sort.
They say that their phone records were taken during the previous administration as part of the January 6th investigation, which is something
that we've all known about for a couple of years, Zain.
ASHER: And just in terms of another topic that we've been following closely, I mean this attack on vessels off the coast of Venezuela that were
allegedly, according to the Trump Administration, carrying narcotics headed towards the U.S. You know, a lot of people looked at that and said that was
a violation of international law, especially because there was limited evidence. Walk us through how that came up in these exchanges?
PEREZ: Right. And you know, what has been surprising is that some of the Republicans haven't really brought up this issue, because it is something
that has troubled some of the Republican members.
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And we haven't heard from Senator Rand Paul yet, so we may yet get some questions like that, but you know, certainly the issue of whether the
Department of Justice gave a legal opinion, which is something that we've reported here at CNN. They have given a legal opinion which says that the
president is authorized and it is constitutional for him to order the U.S. military to carry out extra judicial killings, essentially, of people who
are accused of trafficking narcotics in the Caribbean.
We've seen several of those incidents in the last few weeks. She declined to really discuss any of that. She says that's internal advice that she
gives to the president, and she will not discuss that, but it is something that is going to continue coming up, because it is not something that
Congress seems very comfortable with, certainly not Democrats and even a few Republicans.
That issue is not going to go away, despite the fact that today she is refusing to answer it, Zain.
ASHER: All right. Evan Perez, live for us there. Thank you so much. Right, the Mayor of Chicago says Donald Trump is undermining the constitution. His
comments come as Trump is pushing to send the National Guard to Chicago and Portland, Illinois and Oregon have sued to stop Trump's guard deployments.
And President Trump is now suggesting he might invoke the Insurrection Act if the courts block the deployments. Centuries old law gives a U.S.
President the power to deploy armed forces to suppress rebellions.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: So far, it hasn't been necessary, but we have an Insurrection Act for a reason. If I had to
enact it, I didn't. I do that. If people were being killed, and courts were holding us up, or governors or mayors were holding us up, sure I do that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ASHER: The key question now is whether Trump can justify a National Guard deployment because of the tense situation between federal officers and
protesters. CNN's Whitney Wild has that part of the story.
WHITNEY WILD, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT CORRESPONDENT: The Department of Homeland Security and Illinois officials have two completely different perspectives
on what is happening here. DHS believes that the National Guard is warranted. They point to protests at the broad view ICE facility.
This is an ICE processing center that's about 30 minutes west of Chicago, where we have seen clashes between protesters and federal agents. Further,
they point to a shooting that happened over the weekend, where they say their agents were boxed in by up to 10 vehicles that resulted in a
shooting.
They say they fired defensive shots at a woman who rammed their vehicle. Two people are facing charges in that case. That is the DHS perspective. In
Illinois, the among local leaders, both in Chicago and at the governor's level, look at this completely differently. And they say that these blow
ups are the direct result of really significant oversteps by DHS.
They say and Governor JB Pritzker used the word invasion. He says that this invasion by DHS here is causing more chaos. He says that is the goal here
is to create chaos and fear further Mayor Brandon Johnson is speaking out vocally against these efforts by DHS to come into the city to, as we've
seen over the last few weeks, to walk through the city in full gear to affect ICE operations throughout the city and throughout Illinois. Here's
more from Chicago Mayor Brandon Johnson.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRANDON JOHNSON, CHICAGO MAYOR: What this president is doing is illegal, it's unconstitutional and it's dangerous. This president wants to undermine
the very constitution that we fought and died and bled for, and it's incumbent upon all of us, and particularly the residents across this
country, is to fight back.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILD: Leaders here admit that they are somewhat constrained in what they can do, but they are doing everything that they can. First, as you
mentioned, the state is filing a lawsuit against the Trump Administration. They're seeking a temporary restraining order they have not yet received
that.
It is unclear if they ever will. The Department of Justice has until Wednesday night to respond to that. And then finally, Chicago Mayor Brandon
Johnson signed an executive order yesterday creating ICE free zones on city property as well as private business property. Back to you.
ASHER: Thanks to CNN's Whitney Wild for that report. Right, still to come, two years on from October 7th tax we'll speak to a photographer capturing
the trauma and resilience of those who suffered that day.
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ASHER: All right. Welcome back to "One World". I'm Zain Asher in New York. Here are some of the headlines we are watching today. Israelis are marking
a devastating anniversary today. Two years ago, Hamas militants stormed Southern Israel and launched a series of coordinated attacks, killing 1200
people and taking 251 others hostage.
Commemorations are being held in Israel and across the world. Official ceremonies will take place next week. Gaza ceasefire talks continue in
Egypt today, Qatar's Foreign Ministry says many details of Donald Trump's 20-point plan have yet to be addressed. Hamas has outlined its key demands
for deal.
Those include a permanent ceasefire. Israel withdrawing its military from Gaza, an unrestricted entry of humanitarian aid. A draft White House memo
suggests furloughed federal employees need not receive back pay. That's according to an administration officials on day seven of the U.S.
government shutdown.
It's unclear how seriously the idea is being considered, but it may generate significant controversy on Capitol Hill and with workers. 750,000
of them are expected to be furloughed. Authorities in Morocco are prosecuting dozens of people for taking part in a massive youth led
antigovernment protests that have gripped the country for more than a week.
Young Moroccans are demanding sweeping reforms in health care, education and social justice. They say those issues have been sidelined as the
government pours billions of dollars into 2030, FIFA World Cup preparations. All right, let's turn back to Israel now, where a nation is
remembering the events of two years ago, an already volatile region is in flux.
And the world is watching and waiting to see what happens next. It all started when Hamas launched the deadliest attack in Israeli history,
killing 1200 people, taking more than 250 others hostage, and setting off a sequence of violence that continues to this very day. October 7th, 2023 was
the worst massacre of Jews since the Holocaust.
[11:35:00]
And it triggered a catastrophic war. That has claimed the lives of more than 67,000 Palestinians as well, resulting in accusations of genocide
against Israel and creating a famine in parts of Gaza. According to the U.N. classifications, 460 deaths have been recorded as a result of
starvation and malnutrition.
It has also led to a dramatic regional geopolitical shift that will be felt for generations to come. Right now, in Israel, there is cautious optimism,
the remaining 20 hostages who are believed to be alive will be released all part of U.S. President Donald Trump's 20-point peace plan.
And in Gaza, Palestinians desperate for the bombs to stop falling, are also hopeful that Hamas and Israeli negotiators in Egypt. Will finally put an
end to this war that is now in its third year. The trauma of October 7th will not easily be healed, but art, art can certainly help people work
through pain.
That's the aim of a photography project called facing the sea. Looking at those who suffered on October 7th and the ensuing war, such as soldiers,
families of hostages or survivors of the Nova and Midburn festivals. Photographed and filmed entirely this year, the exhibition is the result of
a collaboration between Photographer Daniel Tchetchik and nonprofit organization My Wave, which uses surfing as a tool for self-discovery.
Each photo captures participants in the tools from the waves program, documenting their personal story of trauma resilience and their journey of
rehabilitation. The artist behind the work, Daniel Tchetchik, joins us live now. Daniel, thank you so much for being with us.
I was very much touched and moved by these photographs. We're going to talk about three on the show right now. And I just sort of think art is a very
powerful medium in terms of bearing witness, because when you think about the victims of October 7th, especially those who, of course, now deceased,
they cannot speak for themselves.
So, art becomes their voice. In this scenario, and if we could pull up the first photograph, you're actually showing a lot of people in the series of
photographs who may have lost family members, who have relatives who are taking hostage. Just talk to us about this particular photograph of this
woman.
Her name is Mai, as I understand it, what are you depicting? What do you want the world to learn from this?
DANIEL TCHETCHIK, ARTIST & PHOTOGRAPHER: Yes, I would like to give about a 15 second introduction to the organization My Wave, which this is
obviously, as you stated correctly, a collaboration with them. It was founded by Yaron Waksman and Omer Tolichansky they've been running for more
than 10 years, dealing with at risk, youth and the disabled, and, of course, a lot with trauma, especially in the past two years.
And if we jump to your question regarding Mai, Mai is an incredible person that I met and photographed about six months ago. She lost her brother
Yotam about a year ago. It was on the border with Gaza, and I spent 20, 25 minutes photographing her together with her additional brother.
And it was just a very powerful experience to spend this time and this shared space together. And the most touching thing about also my work with
Mai, but with all the participants that they mentioned that this was literally part of the re-corporation process. This was part of the healing.
Some actually mentioned that this was kind of closing a circle for them. So, it's not just me photographing them. It's really kind of part of the
dealing with trauma, confronting the sea in our inner sea and our outer sea.
ASHER: I mean, I look into her eyes, and I can, if we can just pull up her photo again, I can see and I can feel her pain, particularly in her eyes. I
mean, you know what you're doing here is you're externalizing the pain of some of these victims in a way that words can never, ever express.
We have another photograph we want to show our audience, and this is of Yuval as I understand it obviously looking off into the distance. Just
explain to us what we're looking at here, and what she experienced as a result of October 7th.
TCHETCHIK: Well, you found his father was killed in captivity several months ago. He's still being held in Gaza. Her uncle and her life partner
were kidnapped, later returned in a deal with Hamas, and this was really toward the sunset. Yuval doesn't usually agree to be photographed.
I think there's also a very harsh portrayal of some of these victims in the media. It's always in these dark rooms with very dimly light atmosphere.
And here you can see the strength, the confrontation, also the fragility and also the pain, but also many aspects that I think are rarely seeing it
in the press, hopefully.
[11:40:00]
ASHER: You know, that's such a good point, because this is a very different backdrop from what we're used to using for some of these victims. I mean,
obviously you've got the water behind her. And, you know, I was looking at these photographs, and I was trying to sort of think about what the water
would symbolize in this scenario.
And obviously water, you know, represents a certain element of timelessness, there's continuity, there's renewal, there's life, there's
cleansing. Just explain to us why you chose this particular backdrop for these three individuals.
TCHETCHIK: For sure. So, I've been surfing for 30 years, so there's also this personal aspect I've had. I had a lot of challenges growing up and
going out into the sea and detaching yourself from land, and placing yourself in a place of confrontation, but it's also completely quiet and
surreal that you can spend time away from, you know, the daily life.
This is what I wanted to kind of create. There's a lot of emotion, there's fear, there's death, there's life, there's hope within the ocean. And these
are aspects that I also felt while surfing, but also kind of became a canvas for myself as an artist throughout the years that I've been
exploring the several and actually the endless metaphors that lie within this beautiful ocean.
ASHER: So powerful. And I just want to give a -- I want us to focus on the on the last photograph, because I really wanted to get in three at least.
And this is a man named Emmanuel.
TCHETCHIK: Yes.
ASHER: Can you tell us what he went through?
TCHETCHIK: Emmanuel was in the Midburn festival, which was festival that was adjacent to the Nova festival. Obviously, the Nova festival is the one
that the acclaimed festival for the horrific things that happened. But adjacent to that was the Midburn festival. Emmanuel saved several people,
obviously also himself.
And obviously all these participants are suffering from deep trauma and this recovery process through the waves, through this amazing organization,
this My Wave organization that really takes these people, these trauma survivors, and builds them up from a very difficult point to this place
that they have stability and continue to grow is just unbelievable to see and really a privilege to be a photographer that had the opportunity to
create this series.
ASHER: Yeah, I mean, you have to -- the three people that we just sort of saw there. I mean, you have to imagine that their sense of identity is
completely changed forever as a result of October 7th. I mean, everything that you thought you knew about who you are and your future and your life
and your relationship with others, and your understanding of your country and Israel.
I mean, all of it completely shifts as a result of what happens in one day. Daniel Tchetchik --
TCHETCHIK: Well, it's not -- sorry that I'm stopping you.
ASHER: No, go ahead. Go ahead.
TCHETCHIK: -- these participants, the story is not over. It's continuing. The hostages have not been returned yet. This is not something that we can
unfortunately talk about in the past. Hopefully within the coming days and weeks, this will be resolved, and the war will end, and the hostages will
be returned, because it's just been too much pain for too many people, for too long.
ASHER: Too much pain, too much pain. And listen, fingers crossed for these negotiations that are taking place right now. Daniel, thank you so much,
and thank you for showcasing your art with us today, we're very grateful for that. We right back with more after the short break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[11:45:00]
ASHER: Right, any moment now, U.S. President Donald Trump will greet the Canadian Prime Minister at the White House for a bilateral meeting. Trade
and tariffs are expected to top the agenda as Mark Carney visits the Oval Office for the second time this year.
Mr. Trump has exposed tariffs on several imposed, rather tariffs on several key exports from Canada, and these are, of course, hurting the Canadian
economy. Let's bring in Nik Nanos, the Founder and Chief Data Scientist at Nanos Research. So, Nik, we are waiting for Canadian Prime Minister Mark
Carney to arrive at any moment now.
But just in terms of one thing that is going to work in Mark Carney's favor, that is his personal relationship with him. I mean, obviously it's
very different from Justin Trudeau right night and day. And just in terms of the fact that Mark Carney is somebody that Donald Trump respects, that
has to go a long way.
NANOS: Absolutely. And, you know, the thing is, I think, you know, Mark Carney and Donald Trump share one thing, you know, they're both in the
markets. Mark Carney is formerly of Goldman Sachs, in addition to being a central banker. And I'm sure for Donald Trump, he probably looks at Mark
Carney and goes, I kind of understand this kind of guy.
You know, he worked at Goldman Sachs. He's a deal maker. He's focused, he's intelligent and, you know, the thing is I think on that front, there is a
basis for a positive and cordial relationship, because there is individual and personal respect on that front between the two.
And, you know, the thing is, is that it takes, it's going to take time to build that relationship. Because the fact of the matter is, is that when
the previous Canadian Prime Minister, Justin Trudeau, was leading the country and dealing with Donald Trump. It was just ugly in terms of what
Donald Trump it was pretty clear that Donald Trump did not have a lot of time for the former prime minister.
And that Mark Carney is a much different person and is treated differently as a result.
ASHER: And to what extent will you know public pressures, and I mean, you know the opinions of ordinary Canadians, pressure from industry, pressure
from provincial governments in Canada, to what extent will all of that combine to sort of shape how Mark Carney shows up in this meeting?
NANOS: Well, you know, it's a real pressure cooker for Mark Carney and the Liberal Party in Canada right now, because in the latest tracking that
we've done, it's actually a statistical tie between the Carney Liberals and the Pierre Poilievre conservatives. So, there's a lot of pressure right
now.
The other thing that we do know is that Carney won the last federal election in Canada largely on the perception and his assertion that he
could navigate the Trump Administration and help manage the relationship, or at least better than the conservatives. The kicker right now is that the
same polling also suggests that time is running out, that Canadians are getting impatient.
They want to see some type of progress before the end of 2025. So, if Mark Carney by the end of 2025 doesn't come out with either a plan, certainty,
some sort of stability doesn't need to be a win, it'll make for a political risk for Mark Carney right now and the Liberal Party of Canada.
ASHER: How will the topic of, you know, Canada's concerns about the trajectory of the USMCA? How will that show up in this meeting, do you
think?
NANOS: Well, you know, the thing is, is that when we ask Canadians their top unprompted national issue of concern, Trump slash trade is either
always number one or always number two in terms of what Canadians are articulating. And you know, the thing is, is 90 percent of the Canadian
population lives within a one-hour drive of the U.S. border. Canadians are fixated on the U.S.
[11:50:00]
They are focused on and understand the importance of the U.S. to the Canadian economy and the importance of the binational relationship, and you
know, that's why it's such a high-risk game for Canada right now.
ASHER: And you know we are being told that it looks as though Mark Carney could be arriving any moment now. We're obviously going to watch the screen
very closely to see if Mark Carney does shop while we're speaking. But just in terms of how you touched on this earlier, about how this is going to be
different from Donald Trump's relationship with Mark Carney's predecessor? Can you sort of expand on that a bit?
NANOS: Yeah, well, you know the thing is, is that the same liberal party is in power in Canada, but it's very different under Justin Trudeau compared
to the current prime minister, Mark Carney. So, think of Justin Trudeau being very left wing on the ideological spectrum, even by Canadian
standards.
So just imagine, for your viewers, left wing in the United States. Think of left wing in Canada even further to the left. So, you look at Mark Carney,
you look at his professional background, you know, he's an economist by training. He's a central banker. He worked at Goldman Sachs.
The guy walks and talks like a conservative. So, you know, the thing is, is that he's been taking the party in a very different direction. He's been
focused on building infrastructure projects. He's been supportive of energy pipelines. He's canceled very unpopular carbon tax.
He's trying to break down interprovincial trade negotiation in interprovincial trade barriers within the country. So, think of all these
things that a conservative government would have done. So, you know, the thing is, is that for Donald Trump, when he's looking at the Carney
Administration, he's probably looking, or is looking at an administration that is much more conservative than the previous liberal government.
ASHER: What I think is interesting is one thing you touched on is that the issue of trade with the U.S. is a top priority for ordinary Canadians, and
the way that is showing up in Canadian actions is through literally boycotting the U.S., whether it's boycotting travel to the U.S.
We know that tourism from Canada is down in terms of also buying goods, buying American goods, that is also on the decline as well. I don't
anticipate that it's enough for the U.S. to actually feel but it still sends a strong statement, nonetheless.
NANOS: And you know, it's one of the few things that an average Canadian do, can do and to send a message. You know, they can vote with their feet
or vote with their dollars in terms of where they go on vacation or what products that they buy. But you know, the thing is, is what the Americans
have to watch out for is, you know, Canadians are going to be hitting their defense, their NATO defense target, using American suppliers might not be
at the top of their list.
You know, Canadians will be spending on IT infrastructure and, you know, cloud technology and all that kind of stuff. And American suppliers might
not be at the top of the list. And you know, many of the governments in Canada have actually now articulated explicit by Canadian policies, kind of
like the buy American policies.
Well, now Canadian provincial governments and the federal government are looking at policies which promote and encourage a buy Canadian attitude,
which, you know, the thing is, is that, you know, it's just one of those things where it creates an extra complication. But these are the few levers
that Canada does have in the binational relationship.
ASHER: And we focus largely on how this issue of the worst thing, trade relations, or worsening relationships, relation between the U.S. and
Canada, how that's hurting Canada, but it also has an effect on the U.S. as well. When you think about the fact that 2.5 billion dollars' worth of
goods and services between the U.S. and Canada cross the border each day.
That is no small change. I mean, that is a huge amount. Explain to us, you know, how all of this affects the U.S. and backfires on the U.S. as well?
NANOS: Yeah. Well, it's a double-edged sword. So, think of it this way, because of the stable North American Free Trade Agreement between the
United States, Canada and Mexico, Canadian enterprises and foreign enterprises made investment decisions in the United States, thinking or
believing that in the long term, they would also be able to access the Canadian market and the Mexican market.
And there are probably some situations where there are distribution facilities in the United States that service Canada and Mexico that,
because of the risk, actually might be reshored back to Mexico or reshored back to Canada because they serve the Canadian market.
And you know, it's these types of decisions where companies invested in North America thinking that it was a stable, reliable place, and they
invested in plants in the United States. They invested in plants in Canada and Mexico. But that once that stability or reliability is taken out, then
those jobs, those American jobs, that are servicing Mexico and Canada can potentially also be at risk.
[11:55:00]
So, you know, the thing is, it's not as simple as to think that everything is going to benefit the United States. There will be parts of the United
States and employers that will be rethinking their supply chain in order to service the Canadian market and the Mexican market.
ASHER: And one important point to mention in terms of and it looks as though the Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney is pulling up right now. And
obviously Nik, as we've just talked about, the issue of trade, is hugely important. And obviously this comes at it couldn't be a worse time, really,
for U.S. and Canada economic relations.
This is Mark Carney's second meeting at the White House. There he is shaking hands with Donald Trump. This is his second meeting at the White
House so far this year. He's only, of course, been in office for a few months. His predecessor, Justin Trudeau, certainly did not have a good
relationship with Donald Trump, but Mark Carney might fare better.
And just in terms what we were speaking about as they walk in there to the White House, Nik is the fact that you have 60 percent of U.S. crude oil
imports coming from Canada, and 85 percent of U.S. electricity imports coming from Canada as well. So just to continue your point there, the
stakes are high for those on both sides of the border.
NANOS: Yeah, absolutely. And you know, the energy file is where Canada's strong. Let's face it, if the U.S. can't be friends with Canada. It can't
be friends with anyone. Like we are not a threat. We're neighbors. We're quite nice and polite. Like, the thing is, is that it sends a bad signal to
the world and doing business in the United States and doing business with the U.S., if we can't have a stable relationship between Canada and the
United States.
Because the fact of the matter is when you do polling among Americans, they're thinking, yeah, Iran is a problem, Iraq is a problem, China is a
problem. All these things are problems. What are we doing? Focusing on agitating and aggravating Canadians. And I think, you know, the fact of the
matter is for average Americans, they want jobs, but they also want stability when it comes to the economy
ASHER: And just quickly. I mean, obviously, you know, one of the things, one of the ways in which Donald Trump has continuously sort of taunted
Canada is through this idea of making Canada a 51st state. How does that show up in Canadian media? I mean, obviously, whether or not they actually
think he's going to try to do that or take it seriously, it still belies this undeniable sense of betrayal, nonetheless.
NANOS: Yeah, you know what, we're Canada, but it's still it riles up the fight in Irish in Canadians, whenever they hear something like that, they
know that the reality is, is that Canada will never realistically be the 51st state. And you know the thing is, is that it just shows a fundamental
lack of respect. Would the U.S. ever say that to Mexico?
Would they ever say that to Germany, that or any other country that they would, you know? But so, the thing is, is that that doesn't help the
relationship. You know what Canadians expect Donald Trump to be a tough negotiator, because that's who he is, and he's there to defend the
interests of the United States. But these other things that are said are not really necessary.
Right. Nik Nanos live for us there. Thank you so much. And stay with CNN, I'll have much more "One World" with my colleague and friend Bianna
Golodryga. She's just right here. She just walked into the room. After the short break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
END
