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One World with Zain Asher

Fire Rips Through Hong Kong High-Rise Apartment Complex; Prosecutor Dismisses Georgia Election Interference Case; U.K.'s Reeves Unveils Fiscal Plan For Year Ahead; How Walmart Is Speeding Up Its Delivery Services; Twenty-Four Girls Abducted From Boarding School In Kebbi Freed; How The Teens Stole Christmas From A Family's Yard; Aired 12-1p ET

Aired November 26, 2025 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:00:08]

ZAIN ASHER, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Coming to you live from New York, I'm Zain Asher. My colleague, Bianna Golodryga is off today. You are watching

the second hour of "One World."

Hong Kong's deadliest fire in decades is still burning. It begin in the densely populated city where a massive blaze rips through a high-rise

apartment complex in the Northern Tai Po district. Authorities say at least 13 people have been killed. Firefighters say that scorching temperatures

and drifting debris are hindering efforts to reach people inside the apartments.

Footage from the scene shows flames and thick smoke billowing across multiple buildings, latching onto bamboo scaffolding and construction

netting that was enveloping the complex. Residents watched as flames and smoke funneled up from the complex. The fire leaving many people homeless

and in need of shelter.

Earlier, we spoke to CNN's Ivan Watson who's at the scene of the fire.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I can see a third ladder from a fire truck now spraying water on this side of the burning

towers. But I think there are more towers actually burning than I can see water hoses spraying on the towers from this side. I think there are --

there are five burning right now.

As you can see, there are dozens and dozens of fire trucks that are on the scene, but this is a -- a deadly fire and is on track to perhaps be one of

the deadliest that Hong Kong has seen in decades.

Among 13 people confirmed killed so far and dozens injured are one veteran firefighter who had nine years of experience, a 37-year-old man named Ho

Wai-ho, and the authorities have expressed condolences to his family at his loss right now.

But to just give you some context, this is a public housing development that was constructed in 1983. It's called Wang Fuk Court. And it had more

than 4,000 residents, nearly 2,000 apartments in there.

And it looks to me as if the towers of the public housing development are burning from the top, from the roof, down to the bottom floors. And there

are no signs of the fires being brought under control.

Now, I don't know from the live image that you're seeing, or perhaps Dan can show you, but there you can see some of the bamboo scaffolding that

sheets the left side of one of those towers. There were renovations going on around these towers when the fire broke out.

And Hong Kong does its construction traditionally with bamboo scaffolding, which is lighter. And I think that many would argue stronger in some

respects than steel, than metal scaffolding. But it may be that that contributed to the spread of the fire, which the authorities say got an

initial alert about a fire just before 3:00 P.M. local time on a ground floor area that was under renovation.

And as fire -- the fire departments were responding to it, it seems to have quickly spread to neighboring towers to the -- such a speed that by just

two hours later, this fireman had already been declared dead. And he was the leader of one of these fire trucks, an experienced officer.

Many of the residents would have been over 65 years old. I am hoping, I am praying, that people were evacuated in time to not have been caught in this

terrible inferno that has climbed up, at least four of these towers that I'm looking at right now, because even rescue, I think, is impossible to

imagine with these types of flames.

[12:05:04]

And I don't see ladders reaching up into the buildings on this side of the -- the towers. And this would be a deadly fire, the deadliest that I can

remember in Hong Kong. And I've lived here for 10 years, that has grown completely out of control here in Hong Kong's Tai Po district.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ASHER: All right. Let's bring in Guillermo Rein, professor of fire science at Imperial College. He joins us live now from London. Guillermo, thank you

so much for being with us.

Obviously, this is -- this is a -- a real tragedy, you know. And just in terms of the human aspects of all of this is very, very difficult to watch.

And, you know, just thinking about what people are going through who are trapped inside and people who are watching from the outside whose loved

ones may be trapped inside.

But on a more sort of clinical level, just in terms of how quickly this fire spread, which is surprising to a lot of people. What are the various

factors at play just in terms of the potential -- the -- this construction materials, the design the bamboo scaffolding, the wind speed, that sort of

thing. Give us your take on that.

GUILLERMO REIN, PROFESSOR OF FIRE SCIENCE, IMPERIAL COLLEGE: Yes. It's -- it's bad. It's -- it's really bad. I'm short of words to -- to try to tell

you how bad it is.

It seems to be the -- the scaffolding the bamboo scaffolding was major, if not the major part -- a major part of what we saw today. Losing a high-rise

building from top to bottom is a catastrophe.

We here in London know about this in 2017, Grenfell Tower burn from the top to the bottom in -- in the facade fire. It's almost like the scaffolding

for renovation of these buildings. It -- it was like a facade. It was a temporal flannel facade to let -- that lead -- might have led to the loss

of six towers is -- is -- is unprecedented.

ASHER: Yes. Because in -- in London, in North Kensington with the Grenfell Tower fire, one of the sort of major lessons learned was, of course, the

external combustible cladding. And it appeared that, you know, that just in terms of the design of the building that -- that those who had constructed

the building had gone for a cheaper option and that may have led to more lives being lost.

For people who are unfortunately trapped in a situation like this and trapped on one of the higher floors, I mean, that experience must be so

frightening and panic-inducing. Because I imagine they're trapped in darkness. And I imagine that because of smoke, there's limited visibility.

There are probably people screaming. There are alarms going off. And -- and people probably have to decide.

I mean, obviously there's a lot of elderly people in this building. So I'm sure some people will have to make the very difficult unenviable decision

of where there are not to stay with loved ones or to try to escape and leave their loved ones behind.

Explain to us what people are -- are -- are experiencing right now.

REIN: Yes. So if anything -- if anyone was left in the towers and didn't have enough time to evacuate safely, we know from the Grenfell Tower fire

in London that they would be facing extreme situation with very difficult call to make of when to evacuate, how to evacuate, and with who to

evacuate.

Is -- is never -- no one is meant to take that decision. No one is meant to ever be in a situation like this is a catastrophe that the towers were

lost. It's a catastrophe that anyone had to maybe take a decision and have to evacuate while the building is burning maybe in a staircase that is full

of a smoke. Maybe having left loved ones behind is -- is -- is bad.

ASHER: Yes. So just in terms of tackling the fire at the upper levels. I mean out of the -- obviously, these are massively high-rise buildings. And

so I'm told that there are at least 30 stories here.

So just in terms of, you know, how the people who are trapped at the upper levels actually get out. I mean, you can see that when it comes to these

fire trucks and the hoses, there's -- there's physical constraints. These hoses and the ladders can only reach certain floors based on just some of

the video that I'm seeing here.

And then you have the situation whereby the elevators are not working which is typical when there's a fire. But, of course, you know, a lot of these

people are elderly, so they can't just sort of run down the staircase.

And as we talked about, the staircases are filled with smoke and -- and there's darkness. I mean, it's just -- just in terms of the process of

getting those people out quickly. What are the firefighters up against?

REIN: They are against really bad situations. Rescue will be very challenging. Rescue might have been recommended by the Hong Kong

authorities not to proceed, because you might have put the far brigade in an incredible danger situation.

[12:10:09]

Evacuation when a fire is propagating, flat to flat, room to room, through the staircase with toxic smoke is -- is very, very difficult.

What we know from the Grenfell Tower fire is that trying to go through the smoke is the only solution that they -- where they have a chance to.

ASHER: Yes. And with the Grenfell Tower fire, I mean, that I was just speaking to our -- our correspondent on the ground, is one of the hardest

parts of all of that was that people were actually told to stay put. And so the whole evacuation policy needed to be rethought after that because, of

course, if you're telling people to stay put in a fire, I mean, you know, a lot of people might have ended up being saved had they not have been given

that particular set of instructions.

Guillermo Rein, thank you so much for being -- go ahead. Go ahead.

REIN: Yes. I just wanted to say that in this case, the residents of the five towers that ignited later on, they had an opportunity of a warning,

early warning. And I -- I hope they took it.

It is not normal that a fire spread from one building to another, not from a high-rise building to another. I think it's the first time in history

that it goes from a high-rise to another high-rise.

But those residents that were seen the first tower burning, they -- I hope they took the chance to -- to evacuate.

ASHER: I hope so too. I -- I hope so too.

Guillermo Rein, thank you. Thank you for being with us. We're going to keep an eye on this story for you and bring you any updates on this --

REIN: Thank you.

ASHER: -- tragedy as soon as we get them.

All right. Now to another breaking news story we are following this hour. The case has been dismissed against U.S. President Donald Trump and 18 of

his political allies for allegedly trying to overturn the 2020 election results in Georgia.

New prosecutor Pete Skandalakis' decision comes just two weeks after he appointed himself to the position. The charges had ended in Trump's arrest

and the first and only mugshot of a U.S. president.

It all began after a recorded phone call of Trump urging Georgia officials to find the votes for him to win that particular state.

Joining us live now from Atlanta is U.S. attorney Michael Moore.

So just in terms of the background of all of this, Fani Willis was essentially disqualified because of her relationship with a special

prosecutor and the conflict -- conflict of interest that arose from that, then you had Pete Skandalakis essentially appointing himself because it was

difficult to find another prosecutor.

And then now you have him essentially saying, you know, this case is going to be very difficult to sort of proceed with.

Explain the thought process. He's not necessarily commenting on the level of guilt or innocence that the U.S. president may have in all of this. It's

literally about how hard it would be for this case to actually move forward in a timely manner.

MICHAEL MOORE, FORMER U.S. ATTORNEY: Yes well I'm glad to be with you. I mean, the -- the decision that he made is spelled out in a pretty lengthy

attachment to his motion to have the cases dismissed.

And, you know, essentially he says look, you know, we've got the issues of whether or not a president might be immune. We have the issues of the

extraordinary resources that would be required to move this case forward.

We have the question of whether or not you can have a sitting president charged. And if we wait until he leaves office, is that fair to everyone

involved? And should we separate out the president from other individuals who are charged in the indictment?

You know, he goes through that analysis in some detail, but he also does point out that his analysis also hinges on whether or not people should be

criminally charged for exercising free speech.

And he -- he talks about that. He talks about that, you -- you know, the issue of whether or not it's actually a crime to -- to challenge an

election. It is, in fact, not a crime. Our system is set up to allow that.

And whether or not some of the people charged in this indictment had criminal intent, whether not to state as what they would be required to do

under law can prove that they had a criminal intent to -- to -- to move forward when they did these things.

And so he -- he really goes through it at some length to talk about, you know, why he -- he finds it. In fact, there's no case that should be

pursued. I mean, if you think about it he -- why would anybody want this case? It'd be like being hired to be the dog catcher and sort of clean up.

And I -- and I think at that point, he's simply saying, look, there's just nothing I can do. This case was too far gone. It was an overreach by the

original prosecution team to -- to charge this case in the manner they did.

And -- and so he's asking the court essentially to dismiss the charges without -- without saying, I completely find everybody's exonerated.

There's no been nothing wrong ever done. He's not saying that, but he is -- he does talk in some -- in some detail about, you know, why certain charges

were selected when he doesn't see a basis for that under law.

ASHER: This idea that no one in the United States is above the law, not even the U.S. president. On face value, I think that you as a lawyer would

agree with that, but isn't the answer actually a little bit more nuanced than that, based on what we're seeing?

[12:15:16]

MOORE: Yes. That's -- that's a debate amongst legal scholars and everybody else about who is above the law and who hit above the law. And in fact, the

courtrooms all over the country, you've had people who can afford a strong legal defense or strong representation by lawyers or strong plaintiff's

lawyers if they're arguing their side of the case or whatever.

And that's, you know, it seems sometimes that their access to justice, you know, that the -- the skids are more greased because they have the

resources to actually move forward with the case as opposed to being left, having to make decisions about a business decision and a financial decision

whether or not I can even afford to challenge the charges brought against me. So, you know, access to -- to the law is -- is something that'll be

debated for a long time.

But the problem in this case, I think, is that there was an overreach. And there was this effort to try to tie in the then former president based on

acts that -- that people found to be despicable, frankly, in -- in -- in some respects.

And that -- that has caused this case to be acquainted with, well, maybe people in the positions of privilege, you know, they -- they -- they have a

different standard when -- when they go to court.

But I don't know that you ought to take this case as an anomaly and really look at it as something that is president setting across the board. The

decisions that were made and the charging of this case, I think, there were -- there were a lot of errors done at the front end. There, obviously, some

-- some indiscretions that were happened throughout the proceedings of the case.

But this -- this was just an overreach. And, frankly, if the case was going to move forward in all the place that it should have been moved should have

gone forward was in the federal courts, as we saw with Judge Chutkan's case in D.C., where Jack Smith was moving forward, that's where a case against a

-- a president should be handled not by some locally elected district attorney in some state or county across the country.

And -- and that's -- that to me would have been a dangerous precedent that any D.A. anywhere it might bring charges against a former president or a

sitting president that they -- that they took issue with.

ASHER: Michael Moore, thank you so much for being with us. Happy Thanksgiving, by the way.

MOORE: Happy Thanksgiving to you.

ASHER: All right. Still to come on "One World."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I said, there would be no return to austerity and I meant it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ASHER: It's a big day on Britain's financial calendar. The U.K. budget has just been revealed. What it means for those caught in the cost of living

crisis.

Then, where things stand with America's attempt to finalize a peace deal to end the war in Ukraine, what Moscow and Kyiv are both saying.

Plus.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RACHEL REEVES, BRITISH FINANCE MINISTER: When you click buy, we can actually get it out of the internet onto a trailer and go into your house

within 30 minutes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ASHER: Last-minute holiday gift buying anyone? We take a look inside of a (INAUDIBLE) facility that is trying to make delivery speed its prime

selling point, also ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:20:57]

ASHER: Russia is pushing back on U.S. claims that a finalized Ukraine peace deal is within reach, and says it's premature to suggest the war is nearing

an end.

It comes as Moscow continues to make gains on the battlefield. And the U.N. Human Rights Monitor says that civilian casualties are rising. U.S.

President Trump's envoy, Special Envoy, Steve Witkoff, is expected to go to Moscow next week for talks with Vladimir Putin. And he may be joined by

Trump's son-in-law.

We're also learning about a phone call that Bloomberg published between two top Putin aides highlighting Russian's efforts to draft a plan that

enshrined its maximalist demands. It was later presented by the White House.

Earlier, one of those aides weighed in on the latest version of the proposal after Ukraine and its allies had suggested changes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

YUN USHAKOV, KREMLIN AIDE (through translator): During the meeting, there was a twist. The new U.S. representative on Ukraine also popped up. He met,

as I understand, with Ukrainian representatives likely as a part of a prearranged plan and also unexpectedly held talks with our representatives.

Some peace plan aspects can be viewed positively, but lots of them demand a separate discussion between experts.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ASHER: European officials strongly oppose the initial plan viewing it as way too favorable to Moscow, but the president of the European Commission

said the version agreed upon in discussions with the Ukrainian officials in Geneva show signs of compromise.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

URSULA VON DER LEYEN, PRESIDENT, EUROPEAN COMMISSION: After months of discussions, it is important that the work on an actual text started. Of

course, we know that much more effort is needed.

But I believe, thanks to the work of Ukraine, the United States and us Europeans, over the last few days in Geneva, we now have a starting point.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ASHER: Britain's finance minister, Rachel Reeves, has been facing a tough crowd.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Chancellor, is Christmas cancelled? Are you about to break your manifesto pledges?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ASHER: Reeves has been outlining the U.K.'s government's economic plan for the year ahead. It calls for about $34 billion in tax hikes. And minimum

wage is a key issue that's being given a bit of a boost to try to help low- paid workers coping with the cost of living. and the National Health Service wasn't left out.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REEVES: Today's budget builds on the choices that we have made since July last year to cut NHS waiting lists. To cut the cost of living. And to cut

debt and borrowing.

No doubt we will face opposition again, but I have yet to see a credible or a fairer alternative plan for working people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ASHER: Before Reeves could deliver her speech to Parliament, a few hours ago the U.K.'s budgetary watchdog mistakenly published his official

forecast on the plan early.

CNN's Anna Cooban joins us live now from London.

But just in terms of the actual plan itself, just explain to us how U.K. government is planning to balance the books for the year ahead, especially

just in terms of raising revenue particularly with these sort of slow and steady and not overt tax increases.

ANNA COOBAN CNN BUSINESS AND ECONOMICS REPORTER: Yes. And we've got this what's been referred to as a smorgasbord of tax rises. You've got hikes on

some savings property taxes. You've got a mansion tax, so-called mansion tax. And this is hiking taxes on properties worth over two million pounds.

But what Reeves didn't do was go for a really, a -- a full whack income tax hike. So this had been suggested, reported that she was considering this

earlier this week but received backlash, because doing so would have been a direct contradiction to a promise that the Labour Party made during its

election campaign last year.

So that with that reported U-turn with the publication of this Office for Budget Responsibility document before she announced her plans in

parliament, it all kind of coalesces into a bit of a crisis of credibility for this Labour government which is not doing particularly well in the

polls. And according to Deutsche Bank, this is the third largest tax hiking budget since 2010.

[12:25:05]

But Reeves is in a very difficult position, Zain. She's having to balance or play to multiple crowds not alienate her Labour MPs. Many of whom are

very disgruntled at the moment also not alienate voters. Businesses who are very disgruntled at having to pay for -- for a big tax bill in the last

year's budget.

But also investors who are quite nervous about the U.K.'s finances, about this ballooning debt pile, which Reeves herself has made it a real point to

try and get a handle on.

ASHER: All right. Anna Cooban, lived for us there. Thank you so much.

All right. From the moment you click buy until a package hits your doorstep. Delivery speed has become the ultimate currency in today's

digitally wired holiday shopping season.

CNN's Vanessa Yurkevich takes us behind the scenes to see how Walmart is raising to keep up with escalating demand.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BARAT SMITH, VP OPERATIONS, WALMART U.S. SUPPLY CHAIN: We are in Greencastle, Pennsylvania, the home of one of our newest next-gen

facilities.

It is a 1.5 million square foot building. Massive building.

VANESSA YURKEVICH, CNN BUSINESS AND POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: Lots of things.

SMITH: We're all about speed in these fulfillment centers. Our goal is to get to your doorstep as fast as possible. When you click buy, we can

actually get it out of the internet, onto a trailer, going to your house within 30 minutes.

YURKEVICH (voice-over): In a world where shipping speed wins the day for consumers, Walmart is racing to be the fastest this holiday season.

YURKEVICH: People want things faster and faster. Are these next-gen fulfillment centers your answer to Amazon?

DAVID GUGGINA, CHIEF ECOMMERCE OFFICER, WALMART: In this respect, we're talking about speed. If we create a great customer experience, that drives

more orders and more orders drives density. And density allows us to lower our cost to operate.

So, yes, the next generation fulfillment centers, along with our vast 4,700 stores in the U.S, are our answer to helping customers get great value and

great convenience.

SMITH: The first step is unloading. And you can see the box is moving to what we call our second step, which is simply taking the items out of the

container and putting them into the tote.

YURKEVICH: And how many steps is it normally?

SMITH: So our other fulfillments have about a 12-step process.

YURKEVICH: Twelve.

SMITH: And we've simplified that down to five steps.

YURKEVICH (voice-over): Walmart heads into the holidays following another strong quarter. Revenue rose 5.8 percent, led by a 27 percent spike in e-

commerce.

But online or in-stores, every U.S. retailer this season is competing for wary shoppers.

YURKEVICH: Walmart says they are ready for a lot of your holiday ordering and spending. This fulfillment center in Greencastle, Pennsylvania says

that they can process 100,000 packages every single day.

The question is, are you the consumer going to be doing a lot of spending? There are tariffs, there's higher inflation, and there really is a lot of

economic uncertainty.

There's a lot of talk right now about affordability. How is that being discussed and -- and thought about when you are planning how to show up for

consumers?

GUGGINA: We're focused on saving people money so that they can live a better life. We focus on operating at everyday low cost so that we can

deliver everyday low prices on a consistent basis.

YURKEVICH (voice-over): There are four Walmart fulfillment centers like this one moving 50 percent of all volume. They're twice as productive as

its older facilities.

YURKEVICH: The movement I'm seeing, a lot of it's being done by the machines.

SMITH: It's absolutely --

YURKEVICH: Is that by design?

SMITH: That is 100 percent by design.

So if you ever received a box that might have been too big, a really small item in it.

YURKEVICH: Yes. Tiny item and a huge box.

SMITH: Really frustrating. This machine is taking the dimensions of the items that you just click buy on. We're building a custom made box for your

specific order.

YURKEVICH: I'm about to shift someone their very important product. I'm marrying the box that was made and the products that they ordered. So it's

all coming together right here.

Someone ordered a pulse oximeter. Very important, going into box.

SMITH: You don't forget to scan it.

YURKEVICH: Nope.

SMITH: It's all -- that's the scanner. There you go.

YURKEVICH: There we go. OK. Here.

SMITH: Now hit the button. Nice job.

YURKEVICH: I think I slowed down someone's delivery time by about 30 minutes. Apologies, whoever that was.

SMITH: I think -- I think we'll be OK.

YURKEVICH (voice-over): Walmart has been attracting more middle to higher income shoppers in the last few years. Its typical customer base, lower

income Americans, are also under pressure.

The company says it's trying to provide greater value where it can by cutting costs here.

SMITH: As soon as they leave this conveyor belt, they're going to a trailer and hitting your doorstep within the next day, same day, or even two-day

delivery.

YURKEVICH (voice-over): Vanessa Yurkevich, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ASHER: All right. Still to come, we'll have much more on Hong Kong's deadliest fire in decades and eyewitness tells us what he saw.

And horrific violence in Nigeria. The wife of a teacher murdered during a kidnapping attack on his school speaks to reporters. We'll hear her

account.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:30:41]

ASHER: All right. Welcome back to "One World." I'm Zain Asher. Let's turn back to our breaking new story.

China's state broadcaster says that President Xi Jinping is sending his condolences to the victims of today's deadly fire in Hong Kong. At least 13

people have been killed. Firefighters say they're struggling to get to the upper floors of the apartment complex because of intense heat and falling

debris.

The buildings were cloaked in construction mesh and also bamboo scaffolding. More than 700 residents of the complex have been evacuated to

temporary shelters.

Earlier, my colleague Paula Newton spoke to Paul Marriott who was at the scene a short time after the blaze broke out. Paul is a teacher at Ting

Pong Secondary School.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL MARRIOTT, EYEWITNESS TO HONG KONG HIGH-RISE FIRE: We never really thought much about it. We just kind of thought it was probably just a hill

fire or maybe a bushfire. Someone was burning leaves or maybe a sacrifice or something and didn't really think twice about it.

And it wasn't until about an hour later, just before the end of school. I get a WhatsApp message from my wife and she says to me, oh, hey did you

know that on the news Tai Po, there's a big fire. And I'm like, oh, my gosh that fire outside, the billowing smoke that a huge trail. That must be it.

And wow. Yes. So it was to say the least it was shocking. It was really shocking. And by the time the school finished at 3:50 and all the kids went

out, when they all just looked at the -- the smoke. They got their phones and they were you know taking photos and videos it was just mad. It really

was.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[12:35:16]

ASHER: We are continuing to monitor the story and we'll bring you updates as and when we get them.

All right. Relief for some families in northwest Nigeria. Twenty-four girls who were abducted last week from their boarding school have been freed. You

see them here waiting to be officially received by their parents.

The attack happened the very early morning hours. The deputy principal of the school was actually shot dead. His wife spoke with reporters and

described seeing her husband murdered right in front of her. A warning that the account you're about to hear is very disturbing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): As they entered, they pulled their guns to shoot him. He pleaded, don't shoot me, allow me to stand up.

As he got up, he praised God, saying, Allah is the greatest. No God, but Allah and Muhammad is his messenger.

He urged me not to cry and to continue praising God. I joined him in his prayers. Then they pulled the trigger and shot him. As he felt, I

immediately rushed to touch him, but they pointed a gun at me and said, if you touch him, we will shoot you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ASHER: The attack in Kebbi was the third mass abduction in northern Nigeria in just a few days. And it's raised even more scrutiny on President Tinubu.

More than two and a half years in office and the violence and security problems that still plague the country.

Time now for "The Exchange." Joining me live is Dr. Allen Manasseh. He's been very critical of the government's approach to controlling the violence

and the kidnapping. In fact, his own family members were victims of the Chibok kidnappings in 2024 (ph). His cousins were kidnapped. Dr. Alan,

thank you so much for being with us.

I think a lot of people are wondering why the security --

DR. ALLEN MANASSEH, NATIONAL SPOKESPERSON, CHIBOK-KIBAKU COMMUNITY: Good evening.

ASHER: Of course. Why the security problems that have plagued Nigeria, since as long as I can remember it, still continue to occur. You think

about the fact that it's been over 11 years since the Chibok kidnappings of 2014. And now, we're still seeing hundreds of children kidnapped in

schools.

Just walk us through why this particular issue continues to pop up time and time again for Nigeria.

MANASSEH: Thank you. I think the bottom line is absence of leadership and the sincerity of purpose to end insurgency and more especially to end the -

- the surge of school children abduction in Nigeria.

This is 11 years plus since Chibok abduction happened in 2014. And that was the reason why the organization like Bring Back Our Girls came up and --

and -- and started advocating that unless action with all sense of urgency and sincerity of purpose, without any political correctness or any politics

being played in to ensure that every criminality and terrorism is exterminated from the soil of Nigeria. This abduction that happened in

Chibok is a symbol of what might follow in other parts of the country.

And we hold we want what our governments were busy trading blames, were busy looking at us like we were amplifying the voices of the terrorism more

instead of them to understand that we were calling them to action.

And because Chibok abduction was not treated with the sense of urgency and sincerity it deserves, it emboldens the terrorists to go to Dapchi then

after an abducted additional 110 school girls.

And how that Dapchi abduction was treated also gave the terrorists that involvement to see that our government is actually not sincere about ending

the terrorism in Nigeria.

Because if they could reach these abducted Dapchi girls somewhere dead upon a return and one was held back, and the government that was already out

talking about negotiating the rescue of the Dapchi girls did not deem it fit to ensure that there was consequences for keeping one girl back in the

den of the terrorist leadership.

And recall back what happened for the following years we had Kankara, 200, 344. We had Jangebe, 317. We had Kuriga,in Kaduna, 289. And of recent, we

have the abduction of these girls in Maga in Kebbi state.

[12:40:04]

And as it is now, we have close to 2,000 still children missing, including the Chibok girls that were abducted in 2014. We still have about 90 of

them, including 26 of my family members, still missing. And -- and they are not anywhere, they are on the soil of Nigeria.

And some of them are still communicating. You know, we're those that were able to escape or rescue. But still, all we got from our government excuses

for why the terrorism is sustained, why the terrorism is sustained and it's lingering. And we are not getting the action that is needed to terminate

and to end the sense of -- the sense of urgency that will end this terrorism.

Now we are forced -- the children -- school children are forced to choose between going to school and staying alive, because you are not sure whether

you send your daughter or your -- your child to school today and tomorrow., you are getting the child back alive or being abducted.

This is the situation that is unacceptable. So we demand that our government check this seriously and end this surge of school attacks in

Nigeria.

ASHER: I mean, there's two things that play here. One is the rescuing of some of the children who have been kidnapped. But I think also equally as

important is preventing it to ensure that it doesn't continue happening.

One of the things that President Tinubu campaigned upon was, yes, obviously curing Nigeria's economic challenges but also the security issues, even

just beyond the sort of persistent kidnapping that continues to take place. We know that Nigeria has had a lot of security issues for a long period of

time now.

One of the -- one of the areas in which, you know, a lot of people are calling on the president to do better in is this idea of recruiting more

police officers, recruiting more soldiers.

The soldiers and the police officers in Nigeria often complain about not being paid properly. They don't -- they don't -- they're not paid well at

all. And also, they're dealing with an enemy that is much more nimble. They complain -- soldiers complain of fatigue after being deployed for long

periods of time.

I mean, there -- there needs to be a sort of systemic overhaul when it comes to Nigeria's security services. Talk to us a bit about that.

MANASSEH: Yes, absolutely, that is the point. And I -- I -- I quite agree with you, especially with the aspect of this fatigue.

Every day, I discuss with soldiers in my community, Chibok. There are soldiers that have stayed there for three, four, five years. And truly,

they are fatigued. They are tired. Some of them have stayed away from their family all these years.

And in addition, this is a country that is having over 900,000 square kilometers with lots of porous borders. And we have the numerical strength

of our armed forces combined, not commensurate with the population and the size of this country.

And this is also part of the point we've been calling since 2014 that we need to increase the numerical strength of our fighting forces. We need to

equip them in terms of capacity and capability. We need to develop the -- the intelligence gathering and intelligence sharing between in the

agencies.

And we need to strengthen the -- the -- the homeland security, especially the -- the -- the call that has been on point from all the states

governance asking for the creation of state police and even the district county police, so that people from the community can take charge of their

own house security. That is not done.

And this is actually affecting the prosecution of the war on terror. And aside that, the -- the multifaceted approach by the terrorists from all

angle and the increase in their number, you know, from Boko Haram group, I say group, we now have a splinter group, the ISWA, Islamic State West

Africa province. We -- we now have the new entrant Lakurawa. We have Ansaru. We have a lot of other criminal groups that are just assembling

themselves by just accessing arms and -- and -- and forming a group of the terrorists, terrorizing Nigeria from all front.

Therefore, our fighting forces have been overstretched truly. So it is right that an increase in the numerical strength of our fighting forces

need to be taken as all gentry and equip them in terms of arms and ammunition.

And that is why most of us are saying, Nigeria need to seek for support from all its partners in such a way that we will get the immediate arms,

ammunition to develop the capacity of our fighting forces so that the prosecution of the war on terror can be done once and for all.

Because unless something is done, Nigeria is going down because we are fighting these terrorists from all fronts. Forces schools to be closed now.

A lot of states are closing schools. A lot of federal laws are being closed. A lot of on government spaces in the country, and that is

unacceptable.

[12:45:17]

Therefore, increasing and developing the capability of our fighting forces is very critical in ending this terrorism.

ASHER: Yes. I mean, the sheer volume of the army and the police force that needs to be changed, but I mean it is still terrifying that 11 years after

Chibok that armed gunmen on motorbikes can shoot a deputy principal dead and essentially kidnapped -- kidnapped 303 children, many of them as young

as 10.

It is heart-wrenching to see that continue 11 years after Chibok. You would have hoped that the country would have learned a lot of lessons from what

happened in 2014.

Allen Manasseh, thank you so much for being with us.

We'll be right back with more after this short break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ASHER: Botswana Okavango Delta is made up of a vast network of waterways and islands that's created a region that's both remote and difficult to

reach by land. Air travel plays a central role in how people, goods and visitors move through the landscape.

In this month's Africa Insider, we take a look at Mack Air and the work it does across the Delta.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MIKE WEYL, MANAGING DIRECTOR, MACK AIR CHARTERS: Mack Air was started in 1994 by Stuart and Laura Mackay. From there, slowly built the company into

a leading air charter company of Botswana, specializing in non-scheduled services throughout the Okavango Delta.

ASH NEMANI, MACK AIR PILOT: This entire thing exists because of the Okavango Delta. So preservation of the Delta itself is what becomes

important. So now we have limited roads and we don't put tar in the Delta. We don't put cement down. So the best way for us to do to get people and

freight and all this in and out is with us.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We specialize around the Delta and non-scheduled services, meaning, we're basically an Uber of the Delta bouncing around

dropping off passengers, picking up passengers.

Basically our schedulers are chess players to constantly moving aircraft between different lodges. It's really a big chess sport and having

experienced staff has always made that a lot easier for us.

[12:50:13]

NEMANI: We are now at the easily 90-95 percent local pilots. So I'm of who we are very proud of. They have -- we've seen quite a few stars come up.

JOY MPHATO, MACK AIR: I didn't grow up wanting to fly. While I was in high school, I was doing athletics. I was running for the country.

So from time to time would fly out. So when we were flying, I got fascinated by flaps. So like, maybe I could try that out.

When you start your training, you have 50 hours of Delta orientation, getting to know the Delta. I'd already worked here, so I knew a little bit

about the Delta.

NEMANI: So flying out in the delta doesn't exactly operate like it would in other parts of Africa and let alone the rest of the world. So they have to

be trained specifically for each of the tasks.

MPHATO: You have elephants crossing while you're trying to land. You have birds on take-off, birds on landing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Pilots are the final piece in the execution. So we have an entire reservations team. We have a scheduling team. We have ground

operations, all work in coordination with each other to ensure that we can move passengers as effectively as possible and provide the best client

experience.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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ASHER: A family who lives in Minnesota had some of their Christmas decorations stolen. Ironically, it wasn't actually the Grinch who stole it.

Frankie McLister of our affiliate WCCO has the story of some teens and their mean green theft.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

A.J. MANSOUR, HIS FAMILY'S GRINCH INFLATABLE STOLEN FROM HIS YARD: We were upstairs just sitting around, and all of a sudden, we heard a bang. We

heard some tire squeal. I popped outside, checked the cars, didn't see any damage to the vehicles, but notice that Mr. Grinch was missing.

[12:55:02]

FRANKIE MCLISTER, REPORTER, WCCO NEWS (voice-over): The Ring camera rolled and confirmed this Osseo family's fear. A teenager's bear hug and their

Grinch quickly disappeared.

MANSOUR: And one got out, ran up, grabbed the inflatable, ripped it from the cord, ripped it from its stakes in the ground, ran back to the car, and

they sped off with their plunder.

MCLISTER (voice-over): They wondered if it was a trend, a prank, or just for fun.

MANSOUR: I think it was just a case where they're driving around town, they're bored, they see a target and they say, let's go grab it.

MCLISTER (voice-over): With the first Grinch deflated and done, came an act that would leave the Mansour family stunned.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We -- we heard that it might be a little kid that's missing their Grinch.

MANSOUR: They pulled out a new -- brand-new Grinch, new and improved Grinch.

MCLISTER (voice-over): A kind-hearted gift to ensure cheers stays in place, even in improvement with a familiar face.

MANSOUR: This one's about a foot taller. And this one also has Max, the Grinch's dog.

MCLISTER (voice-over): Justice served and not with charges pressed, but a stern talking to. And then his officers took care of the rest.

TODD KINTZI, LIEUTENANT OSSEO POLICE: For somebody to spend money on somebody they don't even know, that's -- that's a -- a great thing and

we're really proud of our officers for doing that.

MCLISTER (voice-over): From a Grinchy grab --

MANSOUR: Hopefully through this situation --

MCLISTER (voice-over): -- to a gift in return.

MANSOUR: -- and instead of doing that, they can see something like this highlighted and their hearts can grow three sizes that day.

MCLISTER (voice-over): In Osseo with photojournalist Nick Lunemann, Frankie McLister, WCCO News.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ASHER: And that does it for this hour of "One World." I'm Zain Asher. Appreciate you watching. "Amanpour" is up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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