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One World with Zain Asher

Violence Erupts Across Mexico After Death Of "El Mencho"; Former U.K. Ambassador Peter Mandelson Arrested; Trump's Approval Ratings Hit A New Low Among Independents; Aired 12-1p ET

Aired February 23, 2026 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:00:31]

BIANNA GOLODRYGA, CNN ANCHOR: Paradise Lost. Tourists stuck in Mexico were being told to shelter in place. The second hour of "One World" starts right

now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you love your life, stay here. Don't go anywhere.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GOLODRYGA: Desperate to escape. One stranded tourist says, it's like the Twilight Zone. We are live in Mexico City with the latest.

Also ahead, arraignment pending. Nick Reiner faces murder charges in the death of his celebrity parents.

Plus.

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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hello?

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GOLODRYGA: Landlines. Remember those? They are making a comeback and one company CEO says it's what the kids really want. We'll tell you why and how

later this hour.

Hello, everyone. Live from New York, I'm Bianna Golodryga. Zain is off today. You are watching the second hour of "One World."

One of Mexico's most wanted men is dead, but his reign of terror continues. Tourists from around the world visiting Mexico have been advised to stay

indoors after Mexican Special Forces killed the cartel boss known as El Mencho on Sunday.

He led the Jalisco New Generation Cartel. Eight other cartel members were killed in Sunday's raid as well. And ensuing clashes also claimed the lives

of 25 national guardsmen in the state of Jalisco.

The violence didn't stop there. Across the country, gang members torched cars and burned businesses. The country's airports descended into chaos as

tourists then scramble to leave the country.

One tourist says, he's never seen this level of violence in Mexico before.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JIM BECK, AMERICAN TOURIST: We've been coming down here for almost 20 years. And we've always told people to come down and check it out because

you always feel safe here. We've never ever not felt safe. And today was the first day as we left the hotel to go up breakfast and saw all the

craziness going on and the violence and the smoke that we were actually terrified.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GOLODRYGA: Mexico's defense secretary deployed some 2,500 troops to help keep the peace and more violence could be on the way since we've been told

there's no clear line of succession after El Mencho, a fight for leadership, could ensue.

Let's get the very latest from Valeria Leon in Mexico City. And we see those scenes in Jalisco, Valeria, and wondering how things are playing out

now nearly 24 hours later.

VALERIA LEON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, actually, Mexican authorities say that they have now regained control following the way of cartel violence

that erupted after this operation against Nemesio Oseguera Cervantes, better known as El Mencho.

It was President Claudia Sheinbaum who praised this morning the Mexican military for carrying out the operation, calling it a significant

achievement for national security.

Meanwhile, Mexico's defense secretary has released new details about how authorities were able to locate and detain El Mencho.

According to the official, the first critical lead on these whereabouts emerged in Tapalpa, Jalisco, after intelligence units began tracking the

moments of a romantic partner linked to the cartel leader. And this is part of what the defense secretary said this morning about the details. Take a

listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GENERAL RICARDO TREVILLA TREJO, MEXICAN DEFENSE SECRETARY (through translator): Once the situation was under control, military medical

personnel went to the location where El Mencho and his security circle were, along with his two wounded bodyguards.

They determined it was necessary to evacuate them. They were in very serious condition. The helicopter was requested to land and transport them

to a medical facility in Jalisco.

El Mencho has two bodyguards and the wounded officer were transported. Unfortunately, they died en route.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEON: And that intelligence led to the military operation that resulted in his detention. And operation officials now described as one of the most

significant blows to organized crime in recent years.

Despite the government's insistence that order has been restored, security forces remain deployed in key areas as authorities continue monitoring for

any renewed retaliation in this place.

[12:05:03]

And also, the security was reinforcing Jalisco to prevent for further arrests, but the impact is still being felt. Classes have been canceled in

three Mexican states.

And for now, the government says control has been restored. But whether this operation. But whether this operation marks a turning point against

cartel violence, or the start of a new phase of instability remains to be seen.

As for this operation itself, Mexican officials emphasized that it was planned and carried out by Mexico's armed forces with the military leading

the detention and transport of El Mencho.

That's the latest information we have here in Mexico.

GOLODRYGA: All right. Valeria Leon, thank you so much.

We're joined now by Ana Maria Salazar. She's a Latin American political analyst who has served as deputy assistant defense secretary and policy

advisor to President Bill Clinton. Ana Maria, thank you so much for taking the time.

As we heard there from Valeria, Mexico's defense secretary highlighted that a romantic partner's movements provided the final breakthrough for

authorities. But he also went on to say in credit, the U.S., for a lot of the information as well.

Given your experience at the Pentagon, how does that balance work between these two countries?

ANA MARIA SALAZAR, FORMER DEPUTY ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Well, it's a delicate balance, but it has been a very useful balance throughout --

throughout the years. And it has -- and, basically, it -- what the United States does in these types of situations is provide tactical information

that allows, in this case, the Mexican military to pinpoint exactly where El Mencho was.

And -- and it may be with, you know, intercepting communications. It may be with drones. I mean, I think there's a different ways of providing very

specific information to the Mexican Armed Forces.

But at the same time, there's always this kind of pressure by internal Mexican -- the -- the Mexican -- different Mexican politicians and

legislators questioning whether the Mexican army or the Mexican Armed Forces has been too close to the United States.

But in this case, it's -- it's very interesting. I think it's very important to highlight that the secretary of defense was very grateful in

term of assistance provided by the U.S. government in order to -- to detain and ultimately kill El Mencho.

GOLODRYGA: Was this just a situation where authorities in Mexico seized an opportunity? Because the timing of this does raise questions about the

pressure that we have seen on the Mexican government from the United States.

The United States has threatened to take unilateral measures to go after these cartels as well. So, just the significance here that along with U.S.

intelligence, Mexico was able to go after this leader and successfully take him out.

Does that take some of the pressure off of Claudia Sheinbaum now?

SALAZAR: Well, there's a lot of factors here. One, of course, absolutely President Donald Trump's new strategy to classify these -- these

organizations, including Cartel Jalisco Nueva Generacion that was headed by El Mencho, as terrorist groups clearly the pressure by the United States

played an important role.

But don't forget, we have the World Cup taking place in 180 days, it starts. And one of the areas where these played -- these games are going to

take place is in Jalisco, where El Mencho was ultimately captured and then -- and then killed.

So I mean, there was a lot of pressure also in terms of making sure that there was a process by which they could start, you know, reducing the

amount of violence and -- by these criminal organizations.

Now the question mark is, with the death of El Mencho, what is going to happen with this organization and whether we're going to start seeing more

violence in the upcoming weeks? I believe so.

But most likely what the Mexican government's going to try to do is to protect these areas. The cities where the World Cup is going to play.

Remember, we also have, you know -- spring break is just around the corner where thousands and thousands of Americans come to Mexico.

So there was a lot --

GOLODRYGA: Yes. Future tourism.

SALAZAR: Clearly, a lot of pressure by the Mexican -- huge for tourism.

So -- so, clearly, there was a lot of pressure by the U.S. government, but I think the Mexican government knew that if they were going to detain him

or -- and -- and try to start, you know, breaking apart this criminalization, it had to happen now.

GOLODRYGA: So in doing and playing out cost-benefit analysis, obviously knowing that there would be some sort of reprisals if the government

followed through on taking out somebody as powerful as El Mencho. I mean, do you think that ultimately this was worth it for the government to do? Or

do you think that we could see weeks, if not months, of instability and these types of violent attacks, which we already saw almost in coordination

in several parts of the country in response?

[12:10:08]

SALAZAR: You know, that's a really interesting question because one of the reasons why the Mexican government, I believe, was hesitant to -- to go

after El Mencho or El Chapo or -- or, you know, the heads of these extremely dangerous organizations that now the U.S. government classifies

as terrorist groups, is because of what happened yesterday.

I mean, more than -- more than 60 percent of the country was under alert. Almost 100 people were killed yesterday. And, of course, the image of

Mexico has clearly deteriorated. A lot of foreigners who have panicked and are going to think twice --

GOLODRYGA: Yes.

SALAZAR: -- before they come to Mexico. So they had to do it.

GOLODRYGA: All right. Ana Maria Salazar, we'll continue to follow this story. Thank you so much.

And more breaking news just into CNN, former U.K. ambassador to the U.S. Peter Mandelson has been arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public

office. Mandelson has been under scrutiny for his ties to convicted sex offender, Jeffrey Epstein.

Max Foster is in London with the very latest. And, Max, I guess following the arrest of former Prince Andrew last week, there were questions as to

whether we would see the same for Peter Mandelson, and now, we have our answer.

MAX FOSTER, CNN LONDON CORRESPONDENT: Yes. So, this actually investigation into Peter Mandelson was launched before Andrew, but they clearly got some

evidence with Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor before they did on Mandelson.

So, they've obviously had something has developed in this case to get to the point where they're able to arrest him.

Officers have arrested a 72-year-old man on suspicion of misconduct in public office. That's what the statement from the Metropolitan Police says.

They're saying he's a former government minister. He was arrested in Camden, which is north London. And he's been taken to a police station for

interview.

And they add that this follows search warrants at two addresses in Wiltshire and Camden. So, they are the two home, two places where Mandelson

lives.

So, they've gone through the homes and they've found evidence and now going to present to Mandelson and he's going to be interviewed. So, very similar

process to Andrew and exactly the same allegation as well, misconduct in public office.

So, allegations that when he was business secretary, Peter Mandelson was forwarding confidential market sensitive information to Jeffrey Epstein.

He's always denied any wrong doing much more fissiparously (ph), actually, than Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor.

And, you know -- you know, to emphasize, he hasn't been charged with anything yet. But clearly, the investigation has snowballed to the point

where they're able to -- to make an arrest.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. The fallout continues here. You'll be staying on top of all of this for us. Max Foster, appreciate you breaking in with this news.

And we'll be right back after a quick break.

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[12:15:35]

GOLODRYGA: All right. Back to our breaking news just into CNN, former U.K. ambassador to the United States, Peter Mandelson has been arrested on

suspicion of misconduct in public office.

Mandelson has been under scrutiny for his ties to convicted sex offender, Jeffrey Epstein. The scandal has roiled the British government. Mandelson

was appointed ambassador to Washington by Prime Minister Keir Starmer.

Over the last few weeks, Starmer has had to answer questions about Mandelson and his ties to Epstein. Last week, the former Prince Andrew was

arrested for suspicion of misconduct in public office.

We're going to have much more on this developing story in just a moment.

But first, U.S. President Donald Trump says that his State of the Union address tomorrow night will be a long speech because there is so much to

talk about.

But he'll face a public that is increasingly questioning his priorities. His approval rating has dipped to a new low among political independents.

Just 32 percent of Americans now say that Trump has had the right priorities. Sixty-eight percent say he hasn't paid enough attention to the

country's most important problems.

CNN's chief data cruncher, Harry Enten joins us now. Harry, just put this into perspective for us in terms of what we've seen from previous

presidents, especially as we've been approaching crucial midterm elections. Just where does Trump fare?

HARRY ENTEN, CNN CHIEF DATA ANALYST: Yes. And I will note, if he says it's going to be a very long speech, last year, which was not a State of the

Union, but was an address to a joint session of Congress, he went on for 99 minutes. That's more than an hour and a half. That is the longest such

address to a joint session of Congress ever.

The average is only about 55 minutes. He nearly doubled it. Oh, my goodness gracious. If he goes longer than that, I don't know what I'll do.

But in terms of the numbers, in terms of the numbers, I think the numbers here are all the word to describe them, record breaking. They are record

breaking for Donald Trump. What are we talking about?

OK. Trump's net approval rating before his different State of the Union addresses. You'll see right here his net approval. Look at that 27 points

below water. That is way lower than where he was in his final one of his first term when he was 10 points below water, way below 15 for 2019 and 15

for 2018. Look at that. More than 10 points lower, lower, lower, lower. How low can you go, the limbo? My goodness gracious.

Now, not just talking low for Donald Trump. We're talking low historically for this century when it comes to presidents at this point.

OK. 21st century, net approval for presidents just before their State of the Union addresses about at this point in the second term. You see it

right here, Donald Trump, 27 points below water. That is way below where Barack Obama was, 15 points below water, and way, way below where George W.

Bush was back in 2006 when he was 11 points below water.

Again, more than 10 points lower than either of his predecessors. Record breaking. That is the theme of this segment.

And, you know, to close it all out, you mentioned it at the top, independents. These are all comparisons in terms of before a State of the

Union address. But when it comes to independence, Donald Trump is breaking records for either of his presidencies.

Because take a look here. Hello. Trump's net approval rating among independents. A year ago, he was 13 points underwater. Look at where he is

now, Bianna. Look at this. He's 47 points underwater by far the lowest he has ever been according to our CNN polling.

And when you lose the center of the electorate, you lose the overall electorate. And that is why Donald Trump's numbers are so low. We have

what, about 20 inches of snow here in New York City. He is way underneath all that. He'd be just covered in snow at this point. That is how low he

is.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. He'd be down in one of the subway stations that I think --

ENTEN: Yes.

GOLODRYGA: -- he took that was still operating this morning --

ENTEN: There you go,

GOLODRYGA: -- here in New York City.

Harry Enten, sheesh. These are not good numbers.

ENTEN: No.

GOLODRYGA: He is somebody who will probably dismiss them. But we know he follows numbers and polls closely as well. I will be tuning in if for

nothing else, Harry, than seeing the U.S. men's hockey team, which --

ENTEN: Yes.

GOLODRYGA: -- the president seemed to invite. Hopefully that can be one of the -- the few areas where we can expect some bipartisan --

ENTEN: Unite some.

GOLODRYGA: -- support.

ENTEN: Jack Hughes, baby. Whoa.

GOLODRYGA: All right. That was a fun game to watch.

Harry Enten, thank you so much.

ENTEN: Thank you.

GOLODRYGA: All right. Let's turn to Chloe Jay, who is a solicitor back in the breaking news story as we've been telling you with Peter Mandelson

being arrested in the United Kingdom. Chloe, thank you so much for joining the program once again.

[12:20:59]

So, just talk about your reaction. I would assume that not a big surprise following the arrest of former Prince Andrew last week, though, as Max

Foster noted.

The investigation and inquiry into Peter Mandelson began even prior to former Prince Andrew's arrest. They clearly must have found some new

information.

CHLOE JAY, BRITISH SOLICITOR: Yes. It seems that they must have. I guess they've done a deeper dive into all of the documents that they have.

And it's obviously conceivable that there may have been something that has come out from the searches of -- of -- of Andrew's homes and properties.

And there's obviously something which has given them reasonable suspicion that an offense has been committed and so they've made an arrest.

GOLODRYGA: And so, what can we expect to see later? I would imagine now, is it the same protocol and process where he will be placed in a -- a prison

cell similar to what we saw with Prince Andrew, former Prince Andrew last week and then released within a matter of 12 to 24 hours?

JAY: I would have thought it will follow a similar process. Yes. So, he'll be in a police cell until the officers are ready to question him. He'll

then be taken into -- into an interview room and questioned.

I would expect them to be looking for a first account. So to put forward what they have and to see what his replies are and then either to bail or

release under investigation, as we saw with Andrew whilst they then go and conduct further inquiries to look into the information he may or may not

have given them and to -- and to interview or -- or ask other people for witness statements and documents, et cetera.

GOLODRYGA: And just talk about the severity of these alleged crimes in terms of passing along improperly sensitive government information, which

is what he is alleged to have done to Jeffrey Epstein.

So, this does not necessarily relate to the sex trafficking charges against Jeffrey Epstein in that investigation, but the mishandling similar, yes, to

the former Prince Andrew's charges.

JAY: Yes. So, yes, he's been arrested. I understand on misconduct in public office. Obviously, it's a suspicion at this time. No one's been charged

with anything, but that offense potentially carries life imprisonment as its maximum.

I wouldn't expect anyone to get life imprisonment for it, but it would be obviously considered a very serious crime because it covers -- it carries

that maximum statutory penalty.

And we need to obviously know what the consequences of the sharing of that information would be in order to assess the seriousness. And that's what a

court would be looking at if -- a big if, if he was convicted of this and they were looking to sentence him.

GOLODRYGA: A big if because correct me if I'm wrong, I don't think anyone in high government position as he was has ever been convicted or found

guilty of a similar charge.

So, just talk about the -- the statute in place that would be the high level that would need to be found that -- that he broke the law.

JAY: Yes. It's -- it's a complicated offense to prove. So, you're looking for willful neglect of a duty or an act of willfulness conduct. And that

act has to be serious enough to be an abuse of the trust that the public have placed in them in that position. And there has to be no reasonable

justification for it.

So, in order to prosecute successfully, you've got to prove all of those things. So, it could be that a document looks on the face of it very

incriminating, but the individual involved could provide an explanation that perhaps they believed they were assisting the country when they share

that information and that could be considered a reasonable justification for their actions. It just all depends on the factual scenario.

GOLODRYGA: And given that these alleged leaks took place between, I believe, 2008 and 2010 during the financial crisis at the time, what legal

hurdles will prosecutors be facing given for an alleged crime that -- that took place some 16 years ago?

JAY: So, there's no statute of limitations for this event. So, there is no, you know, significant hurdle for them. But obviously, any offense when

prosecuted a significant period of time after it's happened has -- has issues.

Witnesses forget things. Evidence can be lost. It's always harder to prove a case when a significant period of time has passed. So, they'll have to

look at all of those things when gathering the evidence.

[12:25:59]

GOLODRYGA: Does this suggest, again, we're not going -- we don't have much solid information at this point regarding what led ultimately to this

arrest, but the stemming, time-wise, both he and former Prince Andrew, following the release of additional batch of documents from the Epstein

files a few weeks ago, would you -- is it fair to say that there was likely something that was in those files that was released that led ultimately

authorities to find that they had collected enough information, enough evidence to make these arrests?

JAY: It would suggest that wouldn't it -- I mean, we -- we don't know. They aren't going to tell us. I wouldn't have thought what evidence they

currently have because they will be trying to preserve the integrity of the investigation.

But certainly that timeframe looks like something has come out of the latest release that has concerned them and led to these arrests. Yes.

GOLODRYGA: And just -- just if you can put into perspective for us the magnitude of these circumstances, the arrest of Peter Mandelson, a well-

known, high placed political figure for -- for many years in British politics, following back-to-back the arrest of former Prince Andrew, it's

hard to find a comparable scale of a crisis that -- that's really affecting the country right now from the royal family to -- to its politically

elected officials.

JAY: Yes, absolutely. The arrest of the former Prince Andrew is, you know, completely unprecedented.

If there was a prosecution to follow in the UK, it is the crown that prosecute any individual. So, it would literally be a prosecution by one

brother to another and it's completely unprecedented.

And, obviously, significantly, Peter Mandelson has been a -- a huge figure in British politics for decades and is also, yes, completely shocking, I

think, for the British public.

GOLODRYGA: Yes, and really question the stability of Keir Starmer's role as prime minister as well. It appeared that some of those concerns had been

quelled over the last few weeks, but this could very well bring the question of whether or not he has the support of his own party and

coalition going forward.

We'll continue to follow this story. Chloe Jay, thank you so much for the time.

We'll be right back with much more.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:30:40]

GOLODRYGA: All right. Let's remind you of our breaking news this hour. Former U.K. ambassador to the United States, Peter Mandelson, has been

arrested on suspicion of misconduct in public office.

Mandelson has been under scrutiny for his ties to convicted sex offender Jeffrey Epstein. Max Foster is in London with the latest. Max, what more

are we learning about this arrest?

FOSTER: Well, we saw him led from his home. We got a statement from the police, the Metropolitan Police, saying that he has been arrested and he's

being interviewed. This is misconduct charges, very similar to those that were faced by Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor.

The accusation being that back in the time of his -- when he was a government minister under Gordon Brown, he was sharing sensitive -- market-

sensitive government secrets effectively with Jeffrey Epstein, forwarding on reports and other allegations have come to light about sharing

information basically, which was meant to be internal, but may have been useful for Epstein.

Mandelson's been very clear, he denies all of these allegations and any sort of wrongdoing. But clearly, there have been investigations taking

place at Mandelson's homes. He has two of them and they've -- I don't know whether they completed those investigations, but they've been going on for

some time and they've clearly found something that has warranted this arrest.

So, he'll be asked questions about what they found, I'm sure, and then we'll hear a bit more later on. But this is -- this is really the part of

the Epstein scandal that's blown up in the U.K., which has really consumed Parliament because it's had knock-on effects, particularly for the prime

minister.

GOLODRYGA: No doubt. And we'll continue to be -- to be following that as more information comes in to us. Max, I know you'll stay on top of that.

Thank you.

Let's bring in Martin Farr, who's a senior lecturer in Contemporary British History at Newcastle University. Thank you so much for joining us.

And it does seem as if history is writing itself here in terms of finding another era in our modern history where you've seen figures this high up,

whether in the government, whether in the Royal Family that have been implicated in a scandal that continues to metastasize. Just your views.

MARTIN FARR, SENIOR LECTURER IN CONTEMPORARY BRITISH HISTORY, NEWCASTLE UNIVERSITY: Yes. I'm watching the footage now. It's -- it's really just

happened.

The big contrast with last week and Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor's arrest is this is in public. That was on the Sandringham estate. So, we heard about

it after the police released a statement.

This is in full view of the camera crews parked outside Mandelson's London house, anticipating this moment. It was expected whereas Andrew was

arrested originally. Mandelson was only questioned, now the arrest has taken place.

And the implications of this for the government are much more severe than was the case with Andrew's arrest last week.

GOLODRYGA: Explain how.

FARR: Because it was announced earlier today actually that the appointment of Mandelson as U.K. ambassador in the U.S., which is the most important

U.K. diplomatic post was undertaken by the prime minister. He said, not knowing the extent of Mandelson's relations with Epstein, ongoing relations

with Epstein after Epstein's conviction.

The suspicion on the part of opponents of the government is that the prime minister knew and that he appointed Mandelson in the knowledge of this. And

when Mandelson's appointment exploded with the revelations in one of the most recent charges of Epstein files, the prime minister had been unclear,

at best or untruthful, at worst.

And so enormous amount will rest on what is released. So, a committee at the House of Commons has scrutinized the papers to ensure nothing is

sensitive or secret. And they've decided at the beginning of next week to release documents.

That will reveal the extent of the prime minister's knowledge of the appointment. And this investigation adds to the pressure on the prime

minister, who came through a challenge to his authority only two weeks ago very narrowly.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. And he seemed to have survived that. There were still questions as to how long he can continue to be in control in leading that

party.

And as prime minister, our Christiane Amanpour asked him exactly that at the Munich Security Conference. And -- and he was quite firm in his

response that he is not going anywhere and he's going to continue to fight for the British public in his role as prime minister and head of the Labour

Party.

Is there anything here, as you said perhaps more information will be coming out perhaps this was spurred on by the additional files that had been

released by the Department of Justice here a few weeks ago? Just how worried do you think that the prime minister should be at this point with

this arrest?

[12:35:18]

FARR: I think it was only over a temporary stay of his -- his fate, as it were. On Thursday in the U.K., there's a very important by-election taking

place in Manchester. There are national elections taking place in May. They were both thought to be moments which would be an even greater peril.

This announcement today is very significant because the police were not at all happy that much was in the public domain already. They've got an

investigation or they're planning on an investigation. They want this to be a private matter until they release -- until they charge Peter Mandelson to

make it a public affair.

They were very annoyed that one government minister had released his WhatsApp messages with Peter Mandelson. They were annoyed that this was in

the public domain. And it's no coincidence, I think, that the announcement of the documents being released in a few days' time has coincided with the

arrest of Mandelson.

And it all points to the situation being as serious as many observers thought when it was exploited earlier in the month.

GOLODRYGA: And the significance of this most likely being tied to the financial crisis that really sent ripple effects around the world and

brought down economies for months and years, actually, from 2008 to 2010 at its height.

Just the impact that -- that alone, that -- that he may have been trading off information, per private information, sensitive government information

with Jeffrey Epstein. The significance of that just within the moral fiber of British citizens who still recall that time and of uncertainty.

FARR: Oh, yes. We're still living with the consequences of the crash, because in all areas of public life and the social fabric and the appeal of

insurgent parties who promise a different outcome from those of established parties, and Mandelson was central to that.

Gordon Brown was prime minister and he brought Mandelson back from being a commissioner in Brussels for the European Union, a trade commissioner.

Despite Mandelson having already resigned twice under financial clouds in the Blair government, brought him back because he was thought to be so

talented and so integral to the government's ability to face the crisis to be Gordon Brown's number two.

And Gordon Brown has been absolutely vociferous in his demands that Mandelson is prosecuted for betraying -- I mean, during wartime, it will be

treason. I mean, he's under the same charge as Prince Andrew.

We don't think Prince Andrew has released secret or sensitive documents, as far as we know, but Mandelson certainly has. And for the Prime Minister's

deputy to be doing so for personal gain and with Jeffrey Epstein, of all people, it has all the ingredients of the most serious political crisis

imaginable.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. And former Prince Andrew being arrested and his draw here may be more salacious, but he was not one of the primary architects of the

new Labour project. He was not involved in the intricacies as much as you had Peter Mandelson really in terms of --

FARR: Absolutely.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. So -- so just talk about that and the role that he played in the government at the time.

FARR: And it's the same charge, misconduct in public affairs, misconduct in public -- public life. And it's a very hard charge to prosecute because it

has to demonstrate effect and demonstrate that the person has willfully brought their role into this repute.

Andrew was acting on behalf of the Queen in a rather ill-defined role as a trade envoy for 10 years between 2001 and 2011.

Mandelson, by contrast, was a minister of the crown, all leads to the crown in two very different routes. And as such was responsible for trade as

deputy prime minister.

And we -- we -- the evidence does suggest, not the one which is to prejudice in an investigation, that he was misleading his colleagues. He

was encouraging third parties, foreign parties, and was potentially benefiting financially from information which was to the detriment of his

government.

I can't think of an equivalent historically for a politician doing something like that. The closest scandals I can think of which were it's

brought down governments didn't involve this element of venality and of betrayal.

And for many people, it reinforces their impression of Mandelson. And indeed, his reputation was always as this, quote, Prince of Darkness, this

third man figure, well connected, who could pull the strings and was slightly mysterious.

And this will reinforce their view. And your point is very significant. I think both of them, to most voters who don't really follow these things

especially closely, this simply represents an out of touch, out of -- an elite out of any concern for the public, run by different standards, who

think they're different from ordinary people.

And this kind of international elite, Mandelson and Andrew, and of course, actually, represent. And for that reason, they are -- they are a gift to

politicians and movements, whether the Republican movement in this country and anti-monarchist movement or reform U.K. on the right being the politics

or the green party on the left being the politics.

[12:40:09]

Greens are Republican reforms are saying that strain the swamp. Let's clear out the staples. It's a very powerful narrative. And it feeds into a public

who are already quite cynical and suspicious of those they see in power.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. And we should note that both Peter Mandelson and Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor have denied any wrongdoing here.

But your point is an important one in terms of how any opposition party may now use this to their advantage. What will you be watching for in the days

and weeks to come to see if one of them is able to successfully bring down, you know, perhaps even more people in the Labour Party, even -- even the

prime minister himself?

FARR: Friday morning, our time will know who's won the by-election in Manchester. And this is a by-election that the Labour Party, the governing

party, could have won, had they allowed Andy Burnham, the mayor of Manchester, to stand, but he was blocked by Keir Starmer. And Starmer

blocked him because he feared Burnham being in Parliament and being able to stand against him as leader of the Labour Party, and therefore prime

minister.

So, if Labour loses, and I think the chance of losing is more likely, as of this afternoon's events than it was this morning, he'll be blamed for that.

And there could be a challenge. He's -- he's actually -- he's secured in a small sense because the May elections are expected to be so disastrous for

the governing party that while would anyone take over, this close to them, much better to wait until afterwards and have a clean pair of hands.

But as we discussed before, every person who's likely to replace him in the Parliamentary Labour Party is tarnished by some association or other with

scandal, or with the perception of scandal, or with Jeffrey Epstein. And that's why he survived last time, and he may well survive this May

election, there's no one better.

But it's hardly an inspiring way for government to govern. And in the eyes of voters, it seems no different from the previous administration, which

was mired in scandal, and serves to discredit an entire political class. It's a very pessimistic narrative, one draws from these things.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. Hard to describe it any other way than you just did.

Martin Farr, thank you so much for the time. And we have new video showing you right now of the arrest of Peter Mandelson. That is earlier this

morning as he is brought in on his own will, it looks like. He's not being handcuffed or anything and placed behind -- placed in the backseat of a

car.

There are two officials who are with him at his home. We will continue to follow developments on this story and bring it to you after this quick

break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:45:21]

GOLODRYGA: All right. Let's remind you of our breaking news this hour. We've got new images, a former U.K. ambassador to the United States, Peter

Mandelson, being arrested in London on suspicion of misconduct in public office. Mandelson has been under scrutiny for his ties to convicted sex

offender, Jeffrey Epstein.

Let's bring in solicitor Mark Stephens. He's also a media law expert. Mark, it is good to see you.

So, to secure a conviction for misconduct in public office, one has to prove, the prosecution will have to prove that whatever misconduct was,

whatever sensitive information was -- do we still have Mark? Can you hear me? OK.

Whatever sensitive information was passed on, was done so willfully. Just talk about the high bar there. As you know, Mandelson has already denied

any wrongdoing.

All right. Mark, I believe you may have muted yourself. Can you try to unmute? Is that possible? OK.

Let's -- let's -- let's take another quick break. Sorry. We are dealing with breaking news here. We'll try to reconnect with Mark quickly and come

back to you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GOLODRYGA: All right. I believe that we have reconnected with solicitor Mark Stephens. He's also a media law expert. So no doubt you were unfazed

by this little technical glitch, especially in covering breaking news. Thank you for getting in front of the cameras so quickly for us.

MARK STEPHENS, SOLICITOR, HOWARD KENNEDY: No tool for that (ph).

GOLODRYGA: Let's pick up with my question in terms of the high threshold and bar that must be met with this particular charge for prosecutors in

terms of the misconduct in public office. You can only be found guilty and convicted of it if they are able to prove that this was willfully

conducted.

Just give us a sense of what you think their evidence that they've collected now, perhaps suggests and has on him and how Peter Mandelson may

respond.

[12:50:08]

STEPHENS: I think this is a serious moment. Let's not forget that, but it's important also to be precise. But between the U.K. and the U.S., we have

different routes to the same end, justice.

In America, you won't see an arrest until they're virtually ready for charge or perhaps even had a grand jury. Over here, we arrest to

investigate, which is very different, so we're doing it right at the start of the process.

And what the police are looking at are the emails that we've all seen from the DOJ release a week or so ago.

But in 2009, there was a memo intended to go to Gordon Brown, the then Prime Minister, with market-sensitive information. And the prosecutor is

now seeking to assemble evidence, having had a suspicion that he'll have to demonstrate, one, was it confidential information? And two, whether Epstein

had a legitimate reason to know about it.

And then, thirdly, that Peter Mandelson did so deliberately in a way, shared this information in a way which will essentially undermine public

trust.

These are offenses that go back to monarchs and the -- the history of bribing officials for favors and indulgences from the monarch. And so,

they're very ancient and fairly ill-defined offenses.

GOLODRYGA: And unlike many statutory crimes, we know the misconduct in public office does not formally have a statute of limitations. We're

talking about alleged crimes that -- that may have taken place some 16 years ago.

How could that hamper the investigation just from that standpoint alone in terms of gathering evidence, in terms of speaking to witnesses? Epstein

himself is no longer alive.

STEPHENS: I think what they'll be looking at is to seek to get an explanation from Peter Mandelson or Mandelson at this particular point in

time. And then they'll go away and scrutinize it.

So, they will look at whether or not there are any trades off the back of this by Epstein or indeed others. And if there were, why were they made at

the time they were?

So, I think it's much more easy to bring a case against, say, Peter Mandelson than Prince Andrew, because he was a minister of the crown. He

was bound by the civil service and ministerial codes, the conduct in public office. And it's far from clear that his conduct fell outside the code. And

so in the way that Prince Andrew might argue.

So, we do think that Peter Mandelson has a more difficult road to hoe than perhaps Prince Andrew would.

GOLODRYGA: Is there a lesser charge that he could have faced for this type of -- same type of action and discretion, perhaps, you know, reckless?

Because he may indeed argue that he was already trading on semi-public information.

STEPHENS: Yes, I think that's right. And I think that's the sort of issue that the police want to get nailed down at the beginning of their

investigation.

So, in England, essentially, what we do is we try and get the defendant's version of events early, and then we go away and try and gather evidence

which will either implicate or exculpate the individual in question.

So, we are at the beginning of this process. I imagine after a period of questioning, he will be released on bail. And he can be recalled for

further questioning at any time.

But it's quite a long way from here to actually bringing charges. And I think that's probably the surprise in all of this case.

GOLODRYGA: Yes.

STEPHENS: I think most people, by the very fact that there were so many crews outside this front door, expected him to be arrested shortly.

The question is, how long will that investigation take? And I suspect that's going to be, you know, six to nine months before we actually see any

charges or anything else out of this.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. Important for you to note for our viewers around the world, just the difference in -- in statutes and processes here from both legal

perspectives, the United States legal code, and that in the United Kingdom in terms of when an arrest can be made.

Mark Stephens, thank you so much.

Let's go to Max Foster with more in London. And, Max, we are learning that two of Mandelson's homes have been searched?

FOSTER: Yes, exactly. So, that started -- the formal investigation into Peter Mendelssohn started on the 3rd of February and they started searching

Mendelssohn's home.

So, you're seeing here his main home in North London. He also has another one in the countryside in Wiltshire. Those homes have been searched. And

then we get the arrest. So, you can assume that they've gathered evidence and they're now going to present that to Mandelson, who denies any

wrongdoing.

[12:55:17]

And as Mark was saying with very early on in this process, he hasn't been charged. He may well be advised, as is the case with the so-called white

collar crimes by a solicitor, not to comment, but they have to present all of this evidence to him for this process to continue.

But this is the part of the Epstein scandal that's blown up in the United Kingdom, which has really rocked Parliament and government circles, partly

because Mandelson was sacked last year by the prime minister once it became clear how deep his relationship with Epstein was.

And ever since then, the prime minister's judgment has been called into question about why he appointed Mandelson and whether or not he should have

done more to go into that vetting process.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. and this has evolved quickly for Peter Mandelson from just information about how close he was with Jeffrey Epstein and their

friendship to now perhaps illegal activity that he had been conducted -- conducting.

Max Foster, thank you so much.

And that does it for this hour of "One World." I'm Bianna Golodryga. Don't go anywhere. I'll be right back after a quick break with "Amanpour."

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[13:00:00]

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