Return to Transcripts main page

Quest Means Business

Trump Holds up Transition as U.S. Virus Deaths Pass 250,000; U.S. Weekly Jobless Claim Rise for First Time in a Month; United and Virgin Atlantic Sees Bookings Slow as Cases Surge; Royal Opera House Ballet Goes Online; Greenspan Urges Nimble, Solid Thinking; QUEST MEANS BUSINESS Daily Round Up; Germany's Stringent Covid Measures Paying Off; South Africa's Efforts To Protect Her Oceans. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired November 19, 2020 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:17]

RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS HOST: Final hour of trading on Wall Street, 60 minutes to go, and the market -- well, you'll remember last night had a

very sharp fall towards the end. And today, I'm afraid because -- well, look down all day, but then, light at the end of the tunnel. We are up 37

points, very small movements. But you get an idea that the market is more cheerful this afternoon than it was yesterday.

Those are the markets, and these are the reasons why.

The German Finance Minister tells me it's time for Donald Trump to concede.

Meanwhile, chief executives are urging the U.S. President to start the Joe Biden transition.

Major cities are locking back down. Dr. Alan Greenspan lived through the Great Depression. Tonight, he tells CNN he has never seen anything like

this.

And on both sides of the Atlantic, two airlines, either side, United and Virgin, warning rising COVID cases hurting an industry that's already in

disaster and catastrophe.

Live from New York on Thursday, November the 19th. I'm Richard Quest. Yes, I mean business.

Good evening. We begin tonight with the tale of woe that is this the plight and fate seemingly of the U.S. post-election. Wherever you look, the news

does not seem to be good. For instance, the number of COVID cases is at a record as indeed is the death toll rising.

Also, the economic damage. The latest numbers show that that is growing when you look at unemployment claims.

The presidential transition is at a standstill. And now world leaders, as well as CEOs are urging Donald Trump to go through the smooth transition of

power, the transfer of power to mitigate this damage.

The winter surge is pushing the U.S. death toll higher, a quarter of a million people are dead 1,700 are dying each day. Donald Trump is refusing

to work with Biden's transition team and there you have Jamie Dimon, who says -- JPMorgan CEO is calling for a peaceful transition.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMIE DIMON, CEO, JPMORGAN: We need a peaceful transition. We had an election. We have a new President. We should have unity to that. We should

support that whether you like it or not what the election outcome, you should support the democracy because it is based on a system of faith and

trust.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

QUEST: Faith and trust. It was Ronald Reagan who said trust, but verify. In the case of the election, now world leaders are also saying the same thing.

A short while ago, I spoke exclusively to the German Finance Minister, Olaf Scholz who joined me from Berlin.

He was circumspect in what he said, but the message was undoubtedly clear. It's time for Donald Trump to recognize the reality concede and move on.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

OLAF SCHOLZ, GERMAN FINANCE MINISTER: Democratic states means fair and democratic elections, and this is what happened in the United States. All

the international people looking at these elections saw no evidence that there is something that was not right with this elections. So we can say

that Biden has the majority of the people and has a majority in the electorate.

And this means that it is absolutely clear that he is the next President and I hope that anyone understands that there is a time to tell this to

people, even if you are not the one that won.

QUEST: What do you look forward to with a Biden presidency? I mean, that you didn't have during the Trump presidency. And I know that, you know,

senior officials and government leaders like yourself are circumspect in public, but in private, there would have been much eyebrow raising and many

sort of sighs and shrugs of shoulders. So how will it change having a President Biden?

SCHOLZ: We should understand that the word we will live in in the midst of the century is a word of 10 billion people with many powers. It will be a

multipolar world, not just a bipolar as many think, and there will be nothing like a move from the bipolar world of the post worse times when it

was between the United States and the USSR and now it is about between the United States and China.

Now, there will be a lot of other nations that will look for their influence, it will be Russia still. It will be a lot of the other nations

from rising Asia. And so it is absolutely clear what we need is not just a multipolar world, but also multilateralism, and this is what could bring us

together. And also, I think that there is something which is that is of importance for Europe and for the United States.

[15:05:41]

SCHOLZ: We are democracies, we are representing the idea of freedom of people. And this means that we have to cooperate as we do with this

transatlantic cooperation and the NATO, and this will be of importance for the future and there is a chance for a new multilateral approach and there

is a chance for a new chapter of transatlantic cooperation.

QUEST: If you were Chancellor Scholz, what would your message be to your counterpart, President Biden?

SCHOLZ: Let's work intensely on the question of transatlantic partnership. Let's understand the necessity of democracies to cooperate. I really

appreciate the new initiative for President-elect Biden that he will do something into this direction. I think this is exactly what is needed.

And let's work on the multilateral work. Yes, there will be different views on certain questions between the European Union and the United States. This

is nothing new.

The more important question is whether we always understand that the solution must be the pragmatic search for compromise.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: The German Finance Minister talking on the pragmatic necessities of the transition. Hillary Clinton is calling Donald Trump's refusal to engage

in a transition, she calls it potentially dangerous.

She was speaking to Alex Stubb who is the former Finnish Prime Minister. Alex is with me now on the line from Florence.

The former Secretary of State and presidential candidate was speaking to you and it's the first time that she has made comments about the election

in a public forum. So, what did she say particularly on this idea of the danger of a transition not going smoothly?

ALEX STUBB, FORMER FINNISH PRIME MINISTER: Yes, well, it was one where we were talking about the future of democracy. And both of us, I think,

attached a lot of importance to a smooth transition.

I mean, I think all of us have been looking at the concession speeches of the past of George Bush in the early 90s, to Clinton, or to John McCain to

President Obama and we simply have not seen that coming from Donald Trump, and I think anytime you are in a liberal democracy, you have to respect the

rules.

And once you've lost the election, it's time to start the session, and I think that was the message of Hillary Clinton.

QUEST: Let's have a listen to what the former Secretary of State, First Lady, so many titles that she had, let's hear what Mrs. Clinton had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: This is a terrible aberration and it sends a very troubling signal about the value that Donald

Trump and those who support him and enable him have for our democratic system.

And it's also unfortunately, potentially dangerous, you know, Biden has put together a world class team of advisers about COVID, and about the vaccine.

With no transition, they're not getting access to government information, government personnel in order to plan for the eventual rollout of a

vaccine, and it's going to cost lives.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

QUEST: Alex, the problem is, you and Mrs. Clinton are talking sort of the language of traditional politics and transition. Donald Trump, I mean, if

we've learned nothing, so far, he is a total disrupter who will blow up the bridge even before he has crossed it.

STUBB: Yes, I think is obviously quite a different cattle of fish. I mean, a democratic President, you knew what kind of foreign policy you've got.

When you had a Republican, you know what you got, but with Trump, it was all a big question mark.

But I think the key here is respect to the American Constitution, to respect the American laws and legislation, and to respect the election

results. I'm sure we're going to see a lot of twists and turns, but I'm quite confident believing in American institutions and having studied them

over the years, but a transition will take place on the 20th of January, Joe Biden will be inaugurated. It's not going to be a smooth transition, we

can see that already, but there will be a transition.

[15:10:12]

QUEST: Now you were listening, I hope to what the German Finance Minister, Olaf Scholz was saying. There is a real hope. And now you're no longer in

office, Alex, you can drop these sort of diplomatic niceties.

The reality, Alex is, privately politicians are wringing their hands in despair and horror. Publicly, they may say nice things, but you'll agree

that there is a feeling of, phew, the end is nigh, we might get back to something that we recognize.

STUBB: Yes, I think many of us were watching CNN day and night when the election results were coming out. Listen, Richard, I think we, human beings

have the tendency to do three things.

Number one, we over rationalize the past. Number two, we overdramatize the present. And number three, we underestimate the future.

And I think right now, there's a sigh of relief that we go back into American stability and foreign policy. It is not going to be the same old

world. It is going to be multipolar as opposed to unipolar, which we saw after the Cold War, and of course, bipolar during the Cold War.

So a certain sense of stability and back to sort of normal is the general feeling that I think a lot of leaders are having at the moment.

QUEST: Okay. How much long term damage has been done, not just by the transition, but the mere fact that the United States electors put Donald

Trump in in the first place? And even though Joe Biden might be in for the next four years, there is always the knowledge of every European leader

that the U.S. electorate could do it again and put him somebody similar, somebody extreme in once more.

Do you believe there'll be an element of kiss and make up, but there will always be crossing fingers and not full trust?

STUBB: We know the former President of Finland, Martti Ahtisaari, a Nobel Peace Prize winner. He used to have a saying and still has that every

conflict can be resolved, and I believe in that.

But I do think as someone who believes in liberal democracy, globalization and social market economy that we have to take the American election

seriously. Remember, Donald Trump got 73 million votes -- 73 million Americans voted for what he stands for and the way in which he does foreign

policy.

And you know, if things are not sorted in the next four years, these 73 are going to come back with a vengeance. You know, Donald Trump is a very

shrewd populist, and I think he has changed the face of democracy in the United States and in the West. It's not exactly like we don't have our own,

how would I say macho men leaders in Europe either.

The European Council and sustained government are as we speak, talking about the rule of law in countries such as Hungary and Poland. So you know,

this problem is not going to go away. It's going to be amplified unless we address it.

QUEST: Alex, good to see you enjoying Florence in Italy. Always good to have you on the program. Alec Stubb joining me there. Thank you.

Now the markets. The markets are largely flat or they had been, but if you take a look, they have sort of turned around and headed up actually in the

last hour or two. So there's an element of optimism, but the movements are very small and it is really what they're talking about in the market today

is the weekly jobless claims and surging coronavirus cases.

Europe did not do a particularly good job in the markets. It depends, of course, if you're long or short, but Europe had a much more difficult

session on Thursday. There were all the markets were down. Investors are worried about another round of COVID shutdowns at the moment.

Now, when we come back in just, second part of the interview we had with the German Finance Minister, this time why he believes that his country is

on the right path when it's talking about how its handling the coronavirus and getting it under control and the European plan for this.

Also aviation continues under pressure. Two top CEOs both sides of the Atlantic, CEO of United, CEO of Virgin Atlantic on how they're coping on

what happens next, in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:16:51]

QUEST: United Airlines says that this spike in COVID cases is now being reflected and taking its toll on bookings. Bookings are down and

cancellations once again starting to rise. The United math to trim the schedule even more in the fourth quarter and already planning cuts of 55

percent.

The CEO, Scott Kirby, you'll remember I spoke to earlier in the week already knew how bad things were getting. He told me that bookings had

stalled.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SCOTT KIRBY, CEO, UNITED AIRLINES: We are seeing an impact from the third wave. Bookings were growing steadily every week and they've kind of flat-

lined, maybe even down slightly. But essentially they have flat-lined.

So they haven't really regressed like they did back in July in the second wave, but they've stopped going up.

Look, all that is -- it doesn't really matter for the long term. The long term is, as we said earlier, is about getting to the vaccine. And that's

how we're going to get to the other side of this crisis. We all along expected ups and downs. We are in one of the downs. This goes in waves and

we're at a peak right now. Hopefully, a peak, and hopefully we'll start to level off soon.

But that definitely impacts bookings.

QUEST: Have you now got sufficient liquidity to see you through whatever happens. I mean, you've virtually been -- I mean, talking about turn the

sofa upside down. You've found everything that you possibly can.

And related to that, two parts of the same question, would you expect that you won't have to make any further furloughs as the third wave comes?

KIRBY: So, we raised about 23 billion. United has been a leader around the world and it has some creative financing structures that made it through

the crisis. So I'm highly confident that we can make it through the crisis, but we're cutting deeply as we're going through, and we have people on

furlough that don't deserve to be on furlough, this is happening through no fault of their own.

And in order to be prepared to really fuel the economic recovery, I think there is going to be a big bounce back once there is a vaccine. We really

need all of our people here throughout the crisis ready to go, ready to participate. That's the economic argument to the government is, well, we

can survive the crisis, but we won't be as able to fuel the economic recovery without government support to get us through the rest of the

crisis.

QUEST: At what point will you start growing the root again? I mean, you're doing it in certain isolated cases. But you know what I mean. At what point

do you -- I mean, capacity is down heavily. What point do you start to really grow it?

KIRBY: It really depends on how long it takes the vaccines to be distributed and made available. My guess is that that is sometime in 2022.

Could be a little earlier? Could be a little later. It really depends on the vaccine.

QUEST: What was the worst day of cash burn? And second part of that, what did it feel like?

KIRBY: So the largest cash burn when this first started, we were still flying outside of a hundred percent of our schedule, 100 percent of our

costs, and revenue had gone down 98 percent. So it is something on the order of $100 million per day, and that was really scary.

The good thing for United is we've been ahead of the curve. We started planning for this the last weekend of February before anyone else did, the

weekend it first started appearing in Italy, and because of that we were ahead of the curve and by March 10th, we'd already raised $2 billion when

everyone else was saying this is probably not going to be that big of a deal.

[15:20:12]

QUEST: It just took over. You took over at the height of it.

KIRBY: Yes.

QUEST: There is a moment -- I've interviewed many airlines CEOs as you know. There's a moment when you sit in the chair, and I don't care if

you've been deputy, I don't have you been Chief Operating Officer. I don't care what role you've had before. But there is a moment when you sit in

that chair, as the CEO, and there really is nobody else to look at but yourself.

KIRBY: Yes.

QUEST: You look around and you see this going on. It's me now. What was it like?

KIRBY: You know, particularly in a crisis like this, it made the job a lot more meaningful, important and impactful. I did feel the weight of that,

particularly as I thought about our people. And that was by far the hardest element of this for me.

From the beginning, really all the way back to March, the course in the pandemic seemed almost inevitable to us. We were right down the middle of

the fairway on forecasting what was going to happen. We were never really surprised by the virus and the way it has progressed.

But what that meant was, I could see what that was going to mean to the people of United Airlines, and that was hard to think about what that

meant.

It was great that the government stepped in in the CARES Act 1, I appreciate their support. I mean, they saved the industry, they save tens

of thousands, hundreds of thousands of jobs. We do need that again.

But that was by far the hardest part, you know, coming into a job excited about the future. But having to get through this -- get through hell, to

quote another Churchill quote again, before we can move forward.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: Shai Weiss is with me now, the CEO of Virgin Atlantic. Shai, it's good to see you to talk about these and to get without the, if you like the

U.S. side of it, as seen from the European and from the -- specifically the U.K. side of it.

As the lockdown in Britain has bitten hard, whatever nascent recovery, not that it was much you were seeing must have been snuffed out. So how are you

now managing and coping?

SHAI WEISS, CEO OF VIRGIN ATLANTIC: Well, first of all, good evening, thank you for having me again. But yes, indeed, the lockdown the second lockdown

here in the U.K. has had an impact.

But throughout this period, we've actually continued to fly to many locations, and actually, the impact of the lockdown has been slightly less

severe than we anticipated. And actually, in the last few weeks, we've seen an uptick in the speed of booking, I guess part of it on the back of the

news of the vaccine, but also in the fact that people are now starting to plan for their Easter and summer holidays and with confidence that we'll be

around to serve them. They are indeed booking with us.

QUEST: Yes, because you've now put in place the necessary financing. So, you will get through this crisis and continue, unlike Norwegian, which of

course, it's highly questionable whether they will survive.

On the issue of vaccines. The cargo, and I know that you've put together a new pharma plan, do you hope to be part of the distribution, not just

obviously in the U.K., but taking that vaccine elsewhere, traveling it with your own planes?

WEISS: Well, actually, throughout this crisis, our cargo operations have been phenomenal, serving really our national health service, and of course,

distribution of medicine and PPE equipment. And of course, we all understand now that the vaccine when it is ready for distribution is only

one element of it.

But getting it to many nations will be a logistical issue, and we are right there at the forefront of that with our pharma specific products that we've

been putting in place for this situation, but also it started two to three years ago.

So yes, cargo operations are essential to the distribution of the vaccine. You know, its manufacturer, of course in the U.S. and Belgium, and Germany,

but if you are thinking where it needs to go, this is the largest product launch in the history of mankind. And you know, everybody should do

everything they can to support it. And of course, we're there to do that.

QUEST: Related to this, because travel in 2021 is going to be determined by one of two things. Have you been vaccinated? Or have you had a pre-

departure test? Where I -- I saw American and BA this week, we saw United, all putting in place pre-departure testing for the transatlantic. What are

you going to do?

WEISS: Well, first of all, I think while we're all ferocious competitors in the marketplace, I think our industry is united around the fact that we

need of course to do testing in the short to medium term in advance of the availability of a vaccine and of course for us, testing in the U.K. is a

big issue because in the U.K., as you know, there is a quarantine and corridors are the only way to really travel.

Of course, the U.S. has shut down for people coming out of the U.K. and Europe and when you come back from the U.S., you have to enter quarantine.

So the only way to do this is pre-departure testing 72 hours pre-departure, and then either upon arrival just to give some comfort to our government.

Actually, in the recent study that we've commissioned together with other industry players, we've actually shown that anything is better than the

quarantine. So any testing regime will be so much more smart and good in terms of the efficacy, because people don't actually adhere to a 14-day

quarantine. Human behavior must be taken there.

[15:25:37]

WEISS: And we're really calling our governments to act now and this is all backed by the science which supports a testing regime pre-departure.

QUEST: Okay, but how far are you moving ready for it? I mean, the other airlines are, if you like, trialing it, testing it, putting it in place to

convince governments. Would you be ready to start such a regime? And are you intending to experiment with it?

WEISS: Indeed, and just to give you some indication. We have had real-life experience with testing. We've been testing our cabin crew who are flying

to Hong Kong and Shanghai and Lagos on a pre-departure basis at the airport at point of care and pre-departure and getting the knowledge of our crews.

And of course, we're working with our colleagues at Heathrow Airport, and Collinson, there's a ready-made trial and testing facilities at Heathrow,

which we of course, will be offering to our passengers. And we're actually calling on our government to allow us to do that and really remove the need

for quarantine as of December 2nd when the second lockdown is ready.

And the government here should be using the time to really get ready for the removal of the lockdown, and of course, removal of quarantine. But

everything we're doing is geared up towards those dates with capacity and knowledge and real-life experience.

QUEST: Shai, to end on a positive note, because every airline CEO we have on the program also tells us there will be opportunities post-pandemic,

everybody is preparing. They've got the cruise, they've got the planes, sort of rating to build back up again.

Where do you see the opportunities for Virgin Atlantic once things start to look more normal? Opportunities?

WEISS: Opportunities. Yes, and that's exactly what we're getting ready for. And I think all of us in the industry want to get out of this crisis like

everybody else in the world as soon as possible.

But for us, first of all, the first thing that we did is through the privately funded solvent recapitalization of Virgin Atlantic. We put

ourselves in a position where our cost base is in a good position for post- pandemic, of course, it's come at a devastating price in terms of job losses at Virgin Atlantic.

Second is our heritage is being innovative. And you know, the number one player in terms of customer satisfaction across the Atlantic. And we know

that leisure traffic will come ahead of business. And if you see recent announcements that we've done, including flying to St. Vincent, from June,

flying from both Manchester and Heathrow now to Pakistan for the friends and relative market.

So there are many opportunities, as long as we are disciplined in our cost base, as long as we survive the pandemic and get ready to really come back

for our passengers and for our people as they expect Virgin Atlantic to be.

QUEST: Good to have you, Shai. Shai Weiss is the CEO of Virgin Atlantic joining us. I appreciate it. Always good to have you on the program, Shai.

Thank you.

WEISS: Thank you.

QUEST: As we continue, Alan Greenspan is in his mid-90s. He lives through the Great Depression. And Dr. Greenspan, who was head of the Fed for more

than a decade says he has still never seen anything like what we're going through at the moment.

Julia Chatterley spoke to him. You'll hear the interview after the break. It is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. Good evening to you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:30:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest. There's more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS coming your way in just a moment.

We've still to hear from Alan Greenspan, the legendary Fed chair, who says he's never seen anything like what we're going through at the moment.

And the Royal Opera House is determined that the show should still go on. And you'll see the musical, beautiful results.

It's all after we've had the news headlines because this is CNN. And on this network, the news always comes first.

The U.S. state of Georgia, the authorities are set to release election audit results any moment now. Some 5 million presidential ballots have been

recounted by hand.

The results are expected to confirm Joe Biden's narrow victory over Donald Trump. The president has leveled baseless claims of voter fraud in Georgia

and other battleground states.

Mike Pompeo's become the first U.S. secretary of state to visit an Israeli settlement in the West Bank as well as the Golan Heights which is claimed

by Israel.

This controversial trip wasn't only symbolic, he also announced a policy change, saying goods imported from Israeli settlements would be labeled

"Made in Israel."

Political protests are continuing in Peru after the country swore in its third president in over a week. Francisco Sagasti is urging calm.

With only five months in office, he has a tall task, restoring faith in Peru's political system before elections which are meant to be held next

April.

The U.S. Centers for Disease Control, the CDC, is recommending that Americans avoid travel over thanksgiving. It's the latest public health

warning against regular holiday travel for the celebrations as cases continue to surge around the United States.

The WHO is issuing a warning to Europe that it must remain vigilant throughout the winter months for the uptick in rising cases for

coronavirus.

New cases have dipped slightly in parts of the E.U., but the death toll itself is on the rise. Europe recorded more than 29,000 deaths last week.

That's one person dying every 17 seconds.

Christine Lagarde is urging E.U. leaders to break the budget impasse, saying coronavirus recovery funds are desperately needed. However, of

course, we know the E.U. is still locked over that.

The German finance minister says that tough measures that he and others are taking in Germany are paying off.

Olaf Scholz said that these measures are likely to remain in place for the foreseeable future.

[15:35:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OLAF SCHOLZ, GERMAN FINANCE MINISTER (On Camera): I am concerned because of the health situation and this is why we took these very hard measures and

decided that we would close restaurants and hotels and cultural and sports activities.

But I'm quite confident about the economic view to the future. We stabilized the economy with extra 14 billion euros just for the month of

November, and this will help that we can continue with our economic development which is better than we expected weeks and months ago.

QUEST: The growth has come back better than expected. But are you expecting to have to spend considerably more and therefore, borrow considerably more,

if the third -- second and third waves become more intense and last longer?

SCHOLZ: Right from the beginning, I discussed that we have to understand that this is a new normality which will be the case this year and the next

year.

And as long as the virus is going from man to man, we have to understand that this is a very difficult situation.

But we can organize to live with it if we have a strict plan. And the plan is to watch the situation and to decide as fast as possible and to take

strong decisions. And this is what we did and what we are willing to do.

QUEST: How much more do you expect to need to do?

SCHOLZ: My view is that we will have to look at the figures of the transmission rate of the virus and then we can take the next decisions. But

it looks like that all the measures we already took helped so that we are on the right path. This is the good thing we can say.

But there is nothing which someone can say about the next months because no one knows what the virus will do.

But the good message we have also is that there is really big progress in developing a vaccine, especially German companies were quite successful

producing a vaccine together with international partners. Not just for Germany and Europe but for the world as something that could help.

And I hope that all the companies working in this field will make a difference in our fight against the health crisis and in this way also the

economic crisis.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

QUEST: The German finance minister. Well, Alan Greenspan says he has never seen anything like it.

He was head of the Fed for nearly two decades and is a man known as "The Maestro" for his ability to play the markets. And now, he says that it

requires great policy direction for the future.

Julia Chatterley spoke to Dr. Greenspan about the way forward.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ALAN GREENSPAN, FORMER U.S. FEDERAL RESERVE CHAIR (On Camera): I've never seen a particular situation all during my professional experience, anything

like this.

Trying to forecast where a virus is going is, at this particular stage, very little more than a guess. And we have to adjust our forecasting and

our policies accordingly.

This is a very complex forecasting procedure and system. Largely because the issue of the virus is a very rare phenomenon, once in 100 years.

JULIA CHATTERLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT (On Camera): How long do you think it takes the U.S. economy to recover based on all the challenges we're facing

at this moment?

GREENSPAN (Voice Over): Depends on how quickly they get an operating solution to the virus problem.

I would scarcely say we're flying blind. We know a great deal and we know certainly that if we could bring the virus under control and keep it that

way, it is perfectly credible that those who are forecasting --

GREENSPAN (On Camera): -- that we'll be back to normal by the spring of next year, if not earlier, are not guessing, they're sensible judgments.

But it's still -- I would not consider it the most likely occurrence. In a situation like this, you always have to say, what could go wrong? The major

part of the solution here is going to be to get us back to where we were. And that could take a long time.

And I'm not convinced at all that we have enough information to know how to deal with this type of problem.

[15:40:00]

Without consequences negative to the overall structure of the society.

CHATTERLEY (On Camera): Define what you mean by detrimental impact to the structure of society?

GREENSPAN (On Camera): The outgoing president, if I may use a very particularly hot term was engaged in a number of things which I could have

done without.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: Alan Greenspan talking to Julia Chatterley.

After the break, "Call to Earth." And running with the sardines. How South Africa is protecting one of the greatest migrations you'll ever see. The

sardines.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

QUEST: And so to "Call to Earth." CNN's call to action on the environment and climate change.

This week, we're looking at the way we eat and the way food is produced. And it's to South Africa we travel where we look at the preservation of one

of nature's most important biomass migrations. The sardines.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KIRSTIE LU STOUT CNN CORRESPONDENT: Every year, along South Africa's east coast, millions of sardines form one of the planet's greatest biomass

migrations.

This is the sardine run, the greatest shoal on earth.

Usually a major tourist attraction, this year South African free diving champion, Beth Neale was one of the few people to capture this phenomenon

due to the COVID-19 pandemic.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BETH NEALE, FREE DIVER & CONSERVATIONIST (On Camera): I'm out of breath because I'm on a run with the sardines. Here on the beautiful South Coast.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STOUT (Voice Over): This abundance of life creates a food source for many predators, including humans.

Studies show changing weather patterns caused by climate change may threaten the sardine run.

[15:45:00]

One breath at a time, Neale hopes to inspire others to appreciate this amazing natural resource before it's too late.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NEALE (On Camera): So you're seeing the beauty of the sardine run and seeing the beauty of the underwater world. People start to understand how

connected everything is.

When you see something so beautiful, you're going to want to do more to be able to protect it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STOUT (Voice Over): Overfishing threatens shoals like this worldwide. The U.N. says one-third of commercial fish species are being overexploited.

The sardine run passes through some of South Africa's marine protected areas, or MPAs, where fishing is restricted giving marine life a chance to

recover.

Since 2019, South Africa has significantly increased its MPAs due to the efforts of conservationists like marine biologist professor, Kerry Sink.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KERRY SINK, MARINE BIOLOGIST: We went from 23 marine-protected areas to 42 now, so that's from north 0.4 percent to 5.4 percent of our ocean

territory.

The target at the moment for South Africa is to be at 10 percent.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STOUT (Voice Over): Over 70 percent of the world's surface is covered by the ocean and according to "Protected Planet," 7.56 percent of it is

protected. With the International Union for Conservation of Nature calling for that to be increased to 30 percent by the year 2030.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SINK (Voice Over): Marine protected areas are there so we can have options in the future. They help us to sustain our fisheries.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STOUT (Voice Over): Professor Sink also pioneered the country's sustainable seafood initiative in partnership with the WWF. The platform was created to

help consumers make more educated choices about the seafood they eat.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SINK (On Camera): The reason why it's really important to manage our fisheries well is because if we do that, we can fish forever.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STOUT (Voice Over): As mounting pressures on ocean resources continue to take their toll, South Africa's efforts in marine protection and

sustainable fishing offer a glimmer of hope to life under the ocean and the people who depend on it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SINK (On Camera): In a world with increasing pressure and increasing industrialization of the ocean, in a time of climate change where there's

even more uncertainty, you need that resilience. And that's why we need to do everything that we can do to have healthy oceans and healthy fish

stocks.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: Magnificent. What splendid video and photographs.

Well, we want more of those sort of stories and we also want to know what you're doing to help in terms of calling to earth, saving the environment.

Use the hashtag #calltoearth, join in.

After the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:50:00]

QUEST: The entertainment industry continues to be roiled in having to make major adaptions to the way they release movies.

"Wonder Woman 1984," for example, which is opting for a dual rollout -- it'll still debut in theaters on Christmas Day, but also on HBO Max.

Warner Media, of course, is CNN's parent company, and it's the same with HBO Max.

The movie industry's been shaken by COVID-19. Some are finding success on streaming alone. That was "Trolls World Tour" that went the streaming

route.

Disney's "Mulan" tried charging a premium on streaming. Now by doing that, they got mixed results.

"Tenet" tried to play the summer blockbuster and missed the box office targets by a mile.

The next experiment now is the new "Wonder Woman" with holiday releases usually huge. We just don't know. This will be a litmus test in many ways

for the major studios as they look into the early part of 2021.

And so those that are finding new ways on the live stage of creating entertainment and high culture.

The Royal Opera House is experimenting. As Anna Stewart, reports from London.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANNA STEWART, CNN CORRESPONDENT (Voice Over): The Royal Ballet had a spring in their step.

After months of preparation, they performed for their first live audience in early November.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEVIN O'HARE, DIRECTOR OF The ROYAL BALLET (On Camera): It was amazing, it was amazing. It was such a feeling for everybody in the whole house.

Everybody worked so hard to get us to this point. And so it was very bittersweet that it was our opening night but also our closing night.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STEWART (Voice Over): The next day marked the start of England's second national lockdown.

This time, the show will still go on, at least online.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEWART (On Camera): Tell me why you made this decision? Because surely, you could have furloughed the company.

O'HARE (On Camera): Yes, we could have. But it's just so important for them to do what they're trained to do and to be in the studios and rehearsing

together and performing.

It's their job, it's their life. They need to be here training. And we need to be performing for the public.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STEWART (Voice Over): We caught a dress rehearsal, the final stage of preparation before their live stream performance.

Behind the scenes, dancers have spent months training in bubbled pairs. Classes have been socially distanced, and they're tested twice a week.

Outside, London's West Emend is empty, its guild of theatres boarded up. Most theaters never reopened between lockdowns.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FIONA ALLAN, PRESIDENT, U.K. THEATRE (On Camera): There's there is a huge appetite for just the cultural experience. But we have no time frame yet as

to when we think we might be able to return to being viable businesses. And by viable businesses I mean able to operate without social distancing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STEWART (Voice Over): The U.K. government has a $2 billion arts recovery fund in place, a mix of loans and grants for struggling venues on top of

the renewed furlough scheme.

It's propping up venues of all sizes across the U.K. although not all have received money yet.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

O'HARE (Voice Over): The thing that I'm really most concerned about is the freelance workers because we rely on those amazing artists that come in and

design ballets, lighting designers, choreographers.

O'HARE (On Camera): That is the real worry, because they have slipped the net.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STEWART (Voice Over): More help may be needed for this sector. When the Royal Opera House can fling open its doors once again, less than half the

usual audience size will walk through them due to social distancing.

It's financially unsustainable, a high price for keeping culture alive during COVID.

Anna Stewart, CNN, London.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: Now, as sharp viewers will have noticed my "adaptions" which probably isn't a word and I can't find in the dictionary, I got caught up -

- "adaptations" is what I meant to say.

But there is always someone watching QUEST MEANS BUSINESS who keeps me on the linguistic, the right linguistic path.

Now, the markets, adaptive or otherwise, and how they've trended. Look at the Dow. I want you to look at Dow because we did see the Dow turn -- and

it was an interesting way in which -- what happened. We're now up just a fraction or so.

But the reason the Dow is up is largely because Chuck Schumer in the senate basically said he was more optimistic about getting a stimulus package

sooner rather than later.

[15:55:00]

And when he said it, the market went up. But it is only up 44 points, which is hardly anything to write home about.

Otherwise, look at the Dow, 30. Salesforce is off its session highs. Walmart, Chevron, United Healthcare all falling behind -- and United

Healthcare at the bottom, Salesforce at the top.

We'll take a short break and afterwards our "Profitable moment." QUEST MEANS BUSINESS, good evening.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

QUEST: Tonight's "Profitable Moment." And so, the transition saga goes on.

You heard tonight on our program from Alex Stubb, the former Finnish prime minister who is a true geopolitical expert, about the dangers with the

United States being in such -- in confusion over who will be the next president, at least as seen from Donald Trump's point of view.

And now you have CEOs saying it's time to move on. That the evidence is clear, Joe Biden won the election and Donald Trump needs to accept it.

Add that to foreign leaders, those like the German finance minister -- and remember these people are normally very circumspect what they say. But

they, too, know it's time to deal with Joe Biden and for Donald Trump to sort of indicate that's the way forward.

Which begs the question, bearing in mind that the Republicans have pulled out of their protests, their claims in Michigan, they're waiting for

Georgia's result which is expected not to have changed anything, Wisconsin's recount, partial recount, is due to get under way. Again, not

expected to change anything.

All of which raises the issue, what do the Republicans expect is going to happen? Where do they think that Donald Trump can suddenly pull this out of

the bag?

Yes, there's a can, but not a will. It can happen, it could happen. Anything could happen, but will it happen?

And in the meantime, everybody waits and watches, and the situation gets worse.

And that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight. I'm Richard Quest in New York.

Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, I hope it is profitable. The bell's ringing, the day's over.

END