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Quest Means Business
Fed Feuds with Treasury over Emergency Aid; Crisis Leaves Lasting Impact on Young Workers; Pfizer and BioNTech File for Emergency Vaccine Use in U.S.; Stay Home For The Holidays; President Appears To Talk About The Price Of Prescription Drugs; White House Trade Advisor Lauds Trump; Call To Earth: Kelp, The Wonder Underwater; Travel Industry Confident Travel Will Rebound. Aired 3-4p ET
Aired November 20, 2020 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[15:00:12]
RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS HOST: We made it to the end of the week. It is Friday and an hour left of trading on Wall Street. Look at the markets and
see how they are taking the variety, the undercurrents and noise that's happening. They are down. And the reasons are pretty clear to see.
The reasons are firstly, the U.S. Treasury seems to be in an all-out battle with the Fed over the coronavirus funds. The Treasury wants the money back,
the Fed says we'd rather you didn't. I'll speak to a former Fed governor.
Pfizer is filing for emergency authorization for its vaccine, clearest sign yet the end of the pandemic could be in sight. But of course, the numbers
are really dreadful in the U.S. and the business travel week of the year, TripAdvisor's CEO, how to rescue a Thanksgiving and indeed, a holiday
season wherever you may be.
Live from New York on Friday. It's November the 20th. I'm Richard Quest and I mean business.
Good evening. A most extraordinary spat has broken out between the U.S. Treasury and the Federal Reserve. It all concerns money that's been
allocated by the Fed, authorized by Congress for particular lending programs, and now the Treasury Secretary says I want it back.
The Trump administration wants to cut off emergency funding and is asking the Fed to return $455 billion of something known as the Main Street
Lending Program. It is unused funds, and it could cut the financial lifeline for U.S. businesses.
But really, what people are saying is it's tying the hands of President- elect Joe Biden, by removing, although little use, but still present lending facility. The Fed says the U.S. economy seems still strained and
vulnerable and would like -- and it says it would prefer to have available the full range of tools.
Steven Mnuchin, the U.S. Treasury Secretary says, well, no, not really. It's all done its purpose.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
STEVEN MNUCHIN, U.S. TREASURY SECRETARY: To the extent these need to be reactivated, we have over $800 billion of capacity. So, I consider that to
be a pretty good bazooka, and Congress trusted us with this money and we're going to follow the law. And now we're asking Congress, please go re-
appropriate this money for areas of the economy and people that really need it.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
QUEST: Randall Kroszner is with me, a former U.S. Federal Reserve governor. He joins me from London. All right. So you can with a blush and an honest
face say yes, this was going to expire at the end of the year and we would like you to reallocate it. But nobody believes that the real reason, do
they?
RANDALL KROSZNER, FORMER U.S. FEDERAL RESERVE GOVERNOR: So I don't know the internal motivations. But clearly there's a lot going on right now, whether
it's politics, whether it's economics, whether it's a pandemic, and so I think the key is, how is this going to affect the economy?
QUEST: Right, but Randall, how often can you remember the Federal Reserve in a statement, basically saying, no, we don't agree with you, Mister
Treasury Secretary, we would prefer you didn't do this?
KROSZNER: Yes, it's extraordinary, because we've never really had a situation before now where the Fed and Treasury were tied together doing
programs. So this is something that's a consequence of some of the reforms that came out of the financial crisis, where now when the Fed wants to do
programs, it has to get the authorization from the Treasury.
And it was inevitable that at some point, when you have to ask someone else to do something that you would typically be doing on your own, you're going
to have a different point of view.
QUEST: OK, but even if they do this, you told -- when you first answered, you said, it's really about the strength of the economy. I'll grant you the
strength is pretty good at the moment and this facility, the mainstream facility was slow to get started and wasn't used much.
But so much of the Feds' armory, is -- well we may not need it now, but the market knows we've got this weapon.
KROSZNER: Exactly. As Hank Paulson famously said, you want to keep the bazooka in your pocket and pull it out if you need it. And of course,
that's what the Fed would like to maintain these policies because exactly as you said, so far they haven't been used that much. They've been
restructuring them to try to make them a little bit more useful.
And so they would like to have that option available. Fortunately, the key programs for providing liquidity to the markets, the money market programs
are not affected by this and their ability to buy assets and keep interest rates low, fortunately, are not affected by this.
[15:05:23]
KROSZNER: So they still have a lot of other tools, but they would prefer to have these tools in addition. The key is, what is the best use of these
resources? Is it better to try to have them refocused on Paycheck Protection Plan policies or other policies for individuals and households
or continue to do it through debt?
And I think that's where the rubber hits the road. That's really where the difference lies.
QUEST: OK, now, on the wider question of the economies. Now we've got the E.C.B. that's going to be meeting and the question there, I've been reading
your views on this, the question there is what they do in terms of -- I mean, do you go further negative? Do you increase your bond buying?
All of these, I mean, bond buying particularly will keep interest rates, it will keep the pressure on. But if the virus is running rampant, the Fed or
the E.C.B. or the Bank of England or the Bank of Japan can at best only mitigate.
KROSZNER: Exactly. There's only -- you know, Central Banks are really powerful, but they can't cure coronavirus, and so if you have a lockdown or
if you have people so frightened that they won't go out, they won't go to work, they won't go out to shop, they won't buy. It doesn't matter how low
interest rates go, it doesn't matter how many assets Central Banks purchase, the economy is not going to -- it is not going to perform well.
And that's where fiscal policy and health policy become crucial because that's how you save lives and save livelihoods. The Fed can only do so
much.
QUEST: Randall, we'll talk more. Thank you, sir. Enjoy your weekend as best one can in lockdown London, where you're in the U.K., I do mean England.
Thank you, sir.
Now the question of economic growth, JPMorgan is now saying in the U.S. Q1, it could actually be negative. It could be a contraction, and just about
everybody is agreeing that the winter will be grim.
The arrival of the vaccine will not make much difference to the next few months and for young people in particular, the prospect of further grim
times in darkened weather is grim, too. Simon Cullen reports from London.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SIMON CULLEN, JOURNALIST (voice-over): At the start of the year, Ben Olatunbosun's future was looking up. He just finished an IT course and was
interviewing for several jobs. But then the pandemic struck.
BEN OLATUNBOSUN: All the employers that I had lined up, they all had to kind of cancel their employment processes because of COVID. So, that kind
of left me back to square one.
I am still searching for jobs. I'm open to job opportunities, whether that's apprenticeships or unpaid work just to gain experience.
CULLEN (voice-over): It's a story young people are experiencing one way or another around the world.
In Greece, 30-year-old Nicholas Keliakopoulos (ph) is working in a supermarket, even though he is trained as a teacher.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Unfortunately, due to COVID-19, many schools have to lock down and as a consequence, no teaching staff were created from the
national lists of secondary education leaving many people unemployed.'
CULLEN (voice-over): According to Australia's independent economic agency, the Productivity Commission, the pandemic means young people are more
likely to struggle to find work, be forced to take lower wages or accept fewer hours, or work in jobs they are overqualified for.
CATHERINE DE FONTENAY, AUSTRALIAN PRODUCTIVITY COMMISSION: It means less savings. That means worse jobs, more chance of unemployment for quite a
long time.
CULLEN (voice-over): The effects of which are likely to linger long after the pandemic.
CULLEN (on camera): Economists warn many young people have depleted their savings and some are being forced to rely on the support of their parents.
But the generational divide goes much deeper. As governments around the world spend trillions of dollars to stem the economic fallout, its younger
workers who are likely to be disproportionately lumped with the bill for years to come.
DE FONTENAY: If you are a young person right now, you'd be feeling pretty bitter because you will be looking at a very tough job market as you're
looking for work. And likely you'll be looking at higher taxes over your lifetime to pay for the government policy during this COVID era.
CULLEN (voice-over): For those starting out in the job market, it can be an overwhelming prospect. Ben Olatunbosun says there's a lot of anxiety and
fear among people his age, about what the future holds, but he is trying to remain hopeful.
OLATUNBOSUN: I would say that it has been tough for me, but it's just something that I know that I just have to kind of cope with and get through
because I know that there is a light at the end of this dark tunnel.
CULLEN (voice-over): Regardless of when that light appears, this is a generation that will feel the economic consequences for years to come.
Simon Cullen, CNN, London.
[15:10:10]
QUEST: Professor Paul Romer is with me, the Nobel Prize winning economist. He joins me from New York University. Professor, good to talk to you, sir.
Thank you.
Now, the scenario that we are in, in terms of what needs to happen over the next three, four, five, six, seven months before we would see meaningful,
meaningful contributions from the vaccine, you're very much in the favor, still have a much wider testing regime?
PAUL ROMER, PROFESSOR OF ECONOMICS, NEW YORK UNIVERSITY: Yes. Yes. So I think there's three trends we've got to keep in mind here. One is the
politics of the current environment. The second is the health dynamics. And then finally, the economy.
I think this new administration needs a quick win, showing everybody it can get the virus under control because that will give them the political cap
that will help them do other things it needs to do.
And the way to get the virus beaten, instead of just waiting for the vaccine is to implement a wider testing program that we have seen work
really well like the University of Illinois where they are testing 10,000 people a day, have kept the number of people infected down to a very low
level, but still they have kept it down at a level.
QUEST: Yes. Isn't it a bit late, sir, to be putting together large scale testing programs, which arguably, might not be able to get to scale? I
mean, we're nine months on, and here in New York, I'm sure you've seen as well. I was walking past City MD yesterday and the line to be tested was
the length of the block.
ROMER: Yes, well, it would have been better to act earlier, but better late than never. And this capacity for testing is something that we want to
develop anyway to deal with the next pandemic that we're going to face.
The other thing is, is that if you look at, say, the University of Illinois, they scaled up very quickly. We've got manufacturers who are
producing these antigen tests, which could be manufactured very quickly, with a big push, within, you know, a month we can see a dramatic progress.
The big hurdles right now are we have a government, which is either doing nothing or getting in the way. And unfortunately, the incoming President
can't get the government out of the way and get it to do something positive until after January.
QUEST: Now, this is my cynicism, not yours, sir, but if we suggest that Mnuchin's decision to ask for money back and close down Fed programs is
more political than economic, and if we also look at the difficulties of dealing with the transition in terms of testing, in terms of geopolitical,
are you concerned that lasting damage will be done to the U.S. economy by this transition fiasco.
ROMER: I am concerned, frankly. I think the Republicans seem to be in a mode where they want to destroy the effectiveness of the incoming
administration, they want this administration to fail. And so all of this opposition, the delayed transition, the challenges of legitimacy, all of
this are to destroy the political capital that will make it impossible for this administration to do anything.
And I think if you're an American, whether you're a Democrat or a Republican, everybody right now wants a government that actually works. So
given that the Republicans are trying to destroy the effectiveness of the new government, the new government has to be just laser focused on
political wins, including a big success right out of the gate on testing.
And there are things they could be doing. They could be making assurances and agreements right now with these manufacturers start ramping up your
protection. We'll give you, you know, our commitment, our personal word of honor that we will pay you but you need to get going now, don't wait until
I can give you an official presidential order after the inauguration.
QUEST: You heard the report earlier, it is a younger generation, and I am talking about the younger -- I am talking about right the way down to
school years, because they're the ones who have missing out on years for having an extremely disrupted education, then you've got the younger who
can't find jobs.
Those of our age, Professor, are sort of on the other side of the scale and on our way out, but do you think there will be lasting damage from a
generation a year or so, under this pandemic, or is there an opportunity to repair that damage?
[09:15:10]
ROMER: So far, there's been a lot of damage and it is unequal. The younger you are, the more you've been damaged, the poorer you are, the less
educated you are, the more you've been damaged is absolutely true.
But if we can get past the crisis, we can make investments to heal that damage, we can recover from that. But we do need to stay focused on that.
But to do that, we're going to have to have a government that actually can make some decisions to spend wisely and to invest in young people.
And if we've got an administration, which is broken and can't get anything done for four years, because of this kind of like, you know, like scorched
earth opposition, then then the harm will turn out to be permanent.
QUEST: Professor Romer, have a good weekend, one way or the other, as we get to it. Thank you, sir, for taking time and joining us.
The markets that are open and doing business, of course, it's the U.S. markets, the main indices, the Dow, the NASDAQ and the S&P 500.
The Dow was down as you can see and it is sharply down, it's bouncing around, you know, once the damage was done, with the exception maybe of a
little recovery. The NASDAQ edged higher, stocks fell over COVID and the Treasury machinations.
Pfizer is taking a major leap forward by announcing that now it said it is 95 percent effective. It's got the data. It's going for Emergency Use
Authorization. The first vaccine to so do in the United States.
And a strange week: the United States Thanksgiving, that's a very big holiday, travel holiday, but the CEO of TripAdvisor because even if you're
not traveling Thanksgiving, Christmas, Hanukkah, all the rest of them are ahead of us and you might want to travel for them. It's QUEST MEANS
BUSINESS Friday, so glad you're with me.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Breaking news to bring you. Pfizer and BioNTech have now officially filed with the F.D.A. in the United States for Emergency Use Authorization
for their vaccine for COVID.
They are the first company to apply in the U.S. for such authorization. And Pfizer says that once granted, well, then the vaccine could -- they could
begin distributing it as soon as next month.
Bill Gates is a world authority on the whole thing of vaccinations and tells CNN life could be back to normal by this time next year.
[15:20:02]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BILL GATES, CO-FOUNDER, BILL AND MELINDA GATES FOUNDATION: By next Thanksgiving, the vaccines, the great innovation there will have brought
this to an end. So, you know, one more round, probably six to eight months, we're asking people to make sacrifices to save a lot of lives and then
wearing the mask, which I don't consider that much of a sacrifice.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Dr. Richard Besser is with me, former director of the United States C.D.C. Center for Disease Control and Prevention, he joins me from
Princeton. He joins reverse Skype.
Dr. Besser, well, look, we can allow ourselves, I know, you'll agree, a moment of just quiet relief that there is another vaccine that's now going
for EUA. And although the tunnel may be long doctor, at least there is light at the end of it. Would you agree?
DR. RICHARD BESSER FORMER DIRECTOR OF THE UNITED STATES CENTER FOR DISEASE CONTROL AND PREVENTION: I would. You know, and I've been very cautious
throughout this, but the data we're hearing coming from these two vaccines is really exciting.
We need to let the F.D.A. here in the United States do their thing and review that data. And then there's an external advisory committee that will
review that as well and make the recommendation whether it should be approved.
But the data on these two vaccines far exceeds anything that people in public health were expecting. Vaccines that are 95 percent effective can be
true game changers and Bill Gates is right on target. You know, by next fall, we could be back to some semblance of normal. But there's a lot of
time between now and then and a lot we need to do if we want to save lives.
QUEST: Yes, this is where it gets tricky, isn't it? It doesn't matter whether we're in the U.S., the U.K., Australia, it doesn't really matter.
The point is we've got to get through winter.
Now, we've already got -- we've already got fatigue and we've got people believing the vaccines benefits will be sooner rather than reality. How do
you convince people that there is still a need to keep the pedal down on social distancing and the like?
BESSER: Well, it's really challenging and different countries have different challenges. Here in the United States, one of the biggest
challenges has been that at the political level, at the Federal level, there's never been a commitment to these measures that we know will save
lives: wearing masks, social distancing, and washing hands.
And here in the United States, our Congress hasn't come together to provide people with protections, many of which have run out and others that are
running out at the end of the year.
We could see tens of millions of people in America being evicted from their homes in January, in the middle of winter, during the midst of a raging
pandemic. And it doesn't have to be if Congress does their thing.
There are a lot of things that people have to do. But without the resources, we're going to continue to see black Americans, Latino
Americans, Native Americans, any lower income individuals who have to work to put food on the table, they are going to continue to suffer if they
don't get the support that they desperately need.
QUEST: But the one thing I see again, and again, on my travels around the world over the last few weeks is lots of people make good efforts. They
wear a mask in the street. They wear a mask when they walk into a shop.
And as soon as they get with somebody they know, and I don't mean in a bubble. I mean, just a casual friend in an office, off comes the mask. And
everybody carries on as if as if nothing was untoward. I don't know what argument you can advance that would make people more rigorous.
BESSER: Yes, you know, I don't think it's going to be an argument coming from, you know, public health science people like me. It has to become
something that's part of the culture where, you know, it becomes a stigma to not wear a mask. It would be like smoking in someone's face indoors.
And there, you know, I would turn to those people who understand pop culture and cultural shift to see how do we get that? How do we get it to
be the norm that you wear a mask, and if you take one off, it's like, whoa, can you believe what that person just did? They took their mask off right
in my face.
QUEST: Right. Now, finally, this is the how long is a piece of string question. So, I'll go for it anyway. When do you expect we will see
benefits from the vaccine? Let's say they start in December, as indeed with those vulnerable first line work of attack workers and so on and so on.
But at what point do you do you breathe a bit easier that a large number of people are vaccinated?
BESSER: I think like late spring, early summer, but that's you know, contingent.
The terrain is changing so quickly. There are so many other vaccines that are under trial? And so yes, we've got these two that are ramping up, but
we could have several more vaccine products that are coming forward and that would change the trajectory.
And we have to take a global perspective on this. Because if the vaccines are just wrapped up by the United States and other wealthy nations, we're
going to continue to see this pandemic rage around the world in lower income countries and that just shouldn't be.
We need to engage with World Health Organization and other global bodies to make sure that the distribution is fair and equitable.
[15:25:33]
QUEST: Doctor, is good to have you. Have a good weekend, sir. Thank you. We'll talk more again as this progresses. I appreciate it. Thank you.
BESSER: Thank you.
QUEST: Now, the actual vaccine itself and it could be a key to boosting the global trade. Trade has suffered so badly, but now, it is starting to
recover.
One company that has seen the downturn but is also now benefiting is Maersk, the largest shipping group in the world. The CEO, join me and talk
to me about how they are preparing for the vaccine and what comes next?
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SOREN SKOU, CEO, MERSK: Well, first of all, I think it would be fantastic news, just for all of us as humans that we can get a vaccine because that
will put their world in a better in a better place.
I guess what the pandemic has shown us is that the consumers, you know, they can actually consume even if this society is in a lockdown because of
online trade. And we expect growth in global trade next year, on the basic assumption that there will be a vaccine, that there will be more stimulus
packages. And that we generally will be moving, if you will, in the right direction.
Fewer, fewer lock downs, and less hard restrictions. That's our base case scenario. And under that scenario, we expect volumes -- trade volumes to
grow back to where they were in 2019, a four to five percent uplift from where we are today in 2020. And that I think will be positive for our
sector.
QUEST: You're one of those companies that suffered obviously, during the pandemic, but the numbers show that actually your profits are up and even
on lower revenues, which suggests there was business -- there was good business to be done during the last few months.
SKOU: Well, you know, our business have benefited from the fact that a lot of the money that the consumers have not been spending on holiday travel
and restaurant visits and sport games has gone into buying more TV screens and sneakers and patio furniture and that's all goods that we can
transport.
So volumes have rebounded a lot in the third quarter after a very weak second quarter where we were hard hit by the pandemic. And that, of course,
we have benefited from.
QUEST: One of the things that is particularly disturbing at the moment and I know that you have been worried about this is the number of seamen who
basically can't get off ships. They are stuck, because when they get into port, either the country won't allow them to leave or the logistics of
getting replacement crews to those destinations is too great.
What are you doing about this?
SKOU: It has been a massive problem for us and it culminated in the summer, in July, actually 55 percent of our -- around 6,000 people that we have on
board the ships at any given time were actually out longer than their contract allowed them to be.
That number today is 15 percent, so we have been able to move the needle a lot, talking to authorities, getting governments involved, finding
solutions, and this is now today a widely recognized problem and we are getting good cooperation around the world to find solutions.
So we expect by the end of the year that we do not have any more, any seafarers on our ships that are out longer than the period that we have a
contract for.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: The CEO of Maersk talking to me.
After the break, now, President Trump, a short while ago made a statement at the White House. He didn't say anything particular and he refused to
answer any questions.
It's the first time we've seen the President on camera for a week. He still refuses to accept defeat in the general election. We will talk about it
after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:30:00]
QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest.
There's more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS coming your way in just a moment.
We'll hear about Thanksgiving. The CDC says don't travel while the CEO of TripAdvisor will be with us to update us on whether people are heeding that
warning.
And anyway, what does it mean for the rest? We're now entering the holiday season.
Also, Donald Trump, we saw him before the cameras. He was talking about health care, refused to take any questions. We will fact-check what he
actually said.
It will all follow after I've updated you with the news headlines. Because this -- well, you know where we're going here. This is CNN, and on this
network, the news always comes first.
Saudi Arabia's hosting the G-20 summit for the first time. It's a virtual meeting that began -- will begin this weekend. And at the top of the
agenda, combating COVID-19.
But also related to that, debt relief for poor nations and tackling climate change. President Trump's participation at this point is unclear.
Meanwhile, Donald Trump will meet at the White House soon with Republican lawmakers from Michigan, that's the state he lost to Joe Biden.
The president's claimed widespread voter fraud, he has not provided any evidence. And however has suggested Republicans in the state should choose
electors, so called electoral college electors themselves, and in doing so overturning the will of the people.
In another of those states, Georgia, is set to certify Joe Biden's win after a statewide audit. In the coming hours, Georgia's governor's expected
to speak and formally announce that the electoral votes will go to Biden.
Georgia's secretary of state's office says the process was complete and then back tracked.
In South Australia, the lockdown has been lifted earlier after learning that a COVID-positive person misled contact tracers. Now, the person was a
regular employee to a pizza restaurant but they told authorities they were only there briefly.
That had led officials to overestimate the outbreak of the contagion.
The Vatican's asking for an explanation from Instagram after the official account of Pope Francis liked a photograph of a scantily clad Brazilian
model.
There's no evidence, obviously, that the Pope, himself, had anything to do with it. The whole situation has, however, raised eyebrows.
[15:35:00]
QUEST: Donald Trump was in the briefing room a short while ago. We didn't bring it to you, but what he said, of course, was he was talking about
health care and he took no questions. No questions were asked.
Instead, the president was talking about new rules to lower prices of prescription drugs.
Remember, this is the president who during the height of the pandemic in the spring would do news conferences that lasted up to two hours.
The White House trade adviser, Peter Navarro, is still predicting a second term for Donald Trump, and he's praising Donald Trump's handling of the
economy and of course, issues of trade.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETER NAVARRO, WHITE HOUSE TRADE ADVISER: This will be -- mark my words here -- history books. The history books will note that the way we, as a
team here with the president in the lead, developed that vaccine, was one of America's finest hours in wartime. And we did that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Catherine Rampell, CNN's commentator (inaudible) -- you know Peter Navarro, very clever with words.
And when he says that history will judge it, the development of vaccine as one of man's finest hours, he's right on that bit, isn't he?
The way this vaccine's being developed -- of course, he's not telling the whole story when he says that, but the way the vaccine and Operation Warp
Speed was put together will be one of the finest of man's hours.
CATHERINE RAMPELL, CNN POLITICAL & ECONOMICS COMMENTATOR: It will be the finest of man's hours, certainly. It is a credit to the many scientists and
companies that have been working on this vaccine.
Whether or not the history books will remember this presidential administration's role in the handling of the coronavirus pandemic as well
as the development and, ultimately, distribution of the vaccine is quite a different question.
QUEST: And that's the fascinating part , Catherine, about the whole thing, isn't it? That they are passing the words to the point where you can't
disagree but obfuscating really -- obviously, they're misleading the true picture.
RAMPELL; Yes. I think really the issue here is -- again, credit to the administration for whatever resources they may have put behind Operation
Warp Speed even if ultimately the hard work was done by the scientists that Trump himself had had been denigrating throughout this process.
What I'm more concerned about happens to be his general handling of the pandemic, short of the vaccine. For example, the bungled response early on
in getting hospitals, governments, et cetera, the PPE that they needed, causing the public to believe that the pandemic itself might be a hoax,
that they shouldn't wear masks, politicizing masks. All of that.
But even on the vaccine itself, I'm quite concerned about how this administration has handled things including by increasing distrust in the
ultimate efficacy and safety of the vaccine.
Now if you look at survey responses from a month or so ago people said that they did not trust the vaccine, that they would not be first in line to
take it because they weren't sure it was going to be safe. They thought it might be politicized, released before it was indeed safe.
With Trump going out the door, some of those concerns -- if the vaccine becomes available under Trump's leadership may go out the window, right,
because he won't ultimately get the same amount of credit.
QUEST: Yes.
RAMPELL: And so the incentives won't be there. But beyond that, there's also the ultimate distribution of the vaccine.
QUEST: Sure.
RAMPELL: And that will happen under Trump's successor, predominantly. But by holding up the transition team, President Elect Biden's transition
team's access to the health officials and others who will be handling that, that could ultimately be a stain on this process.
QUEST: What do you make of this spat -- I was going to say spat, but I think it has to be more than that -- between the Fed and the treasury
secretary offer these lending facilities and clawing back of the money?
RAMPELL: I am very concerned about all of this. There are a number of reasons to believe that this outgoing administration may be kind of salting
the earth for its successor. Not just in terms of Mnuchin effectively saying these -- you have to -- we're recalling all of the money that has
been allocated for these lending facilities.
Also, the last-minute attempt to jam a gold bug rather onto the Federal Reserve as well as a renewed sense of fiscal hawkishness --
QUEST: Right.
RAMPELL: -- that is holding up any sort of talks for further fiscal relief for American families and businesses.
All of this, I think should be seen through a political lens. I ultimately hope that this administration, though, on its way out, will prioritize what
is good for the country, what is good for the economy.
[15:40:00]
But recent actions including Mnuchin, suggest that that may not be their highest priority.
QUEST: Have a good weekend, Catherine. Thank you for joining us. Much appreciate it.
RAMPELL: Thank you.
QUEST: Now how would you like a little seaweed pesto with your meal tonight?
Well, a kelp farm in Ireland is helping to keep marine life and local parks afloat. You'll hear about it as we "Call to Earth." After the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: "Call to Earth," CNN's program call to action to help save the environment and climate change.
And we hope, of course, you're joining in on this, sharing the stories of the people and the programs and the projects that you're involved with to
date.
And all this week, we've been looking at the food that we eat.
And tonight, we bring you seaweed. Well, it's seaweed from kelp. And the issue is how to grow it in a sustainable way and make it tasty as well.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER (Voice-over): This is Rathlin Island. It's the northernmost point of Northern Ireland, has a population of around 150
people and is the site of one of the U.K.'s few kelp farms.
And this is Kate Burns who founded Islander Rathlin Kelp after visiting kelp farms in Maine, USA.
KATE BURNS, FOUNDER, ISLANDER RATHLIN KELP: I just thought they were scientists doing something in a lab with seaweed. So it wasn't until I
think I saw it as a food product and then working with fishermen.
It was the working with fishermen is the thing that really clicked with me.
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Kelp is something of a wonder crop. It absorbs large amounts of CO2.
BURNS: Actually good for environment when you grow it. No fertilizers, no pesticides, herbicides.
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: It's nutritious. Kelp and other seaweeds have as much protein, gram by gram, as beef and are one of the few non-animal sources of
vitamin B12.
On top of that, growing presents beneficial ecosystems for marine life.
BURNS: To produce a food with such food value -- it's surprising how much chefs and most people talk about seaweed and seaweed in your food. But
actually, when you look for it in menus, when you look for it in shops, it's still not there.
[15:45:00]
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: The United Nations stated that seaweeds like kelp have unmatched potential in tackling global issues such as food insecurity
and climate change.
But growing them is not easy. Firstly, the conditions need to be right.
BURNS: Kelp likes to grow between 7 degrees and 12 degrees is ideal. But because of the Gulf Stream, we have sea temperatures here generally between
7 and 12, twelve months of the year.
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Kelp is not actually a plant but an algae. So baby kelp, or spores, have to be collected and grown to seed the kelp lines.
BURNS: So this is the lab-stroke-nursery and this is where we do the cultivation in here of the young kelp plants.
And these have been growing for about 35 days and the kelp plant is about two millimeters long.
Millions of kelp plants, and those are ready to go out to sea.
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Kelp is amongst the fastest growing organisms on earth. Some species can grow upwards of two feet per day.
BURNS: So we would grow our kelp lines usually about 100 meters. So you're talking about a ton of kelp coming off that. And so we maybe would have
somewhere between 15 and 20 ropes out.
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Although seaweed has been growing throughout history, the industry today is still fledgling but growing rapidly doubling in size
between 2005 and 2015. And it currently produces over 30 million tons a year.
But Burns thinks there are thousands of potential farmers in struggling fishing villages who could help expand the industry.
BURNS: I think what's really important is that we as a small community here have done something amazing. And we've proved it could work under the most
challenging circumstances and really with very little resources.
But we've created jobs and we've created an industry.
It needs to take off. It's such an important food stuff, such a sustainable food stuff and such a useful resource for coastal communities.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: "Call to Earth." Many projects that we are covering featuring and putting the spotlight on. And of course, the need to hear what you are up
to in your own projects.
Please, do tell us. Share them and share with the hashtag #calltoearth.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Next Thursday is Thanksgiving in the United States. It is the busiest travel time of the year for Americans.
[15:50:00]
But now, of course, the forecasts are that it will be less than half as normal. People will be going by road.
Bearing in mind, of course, the CDC says don't travel, stay at home, don't go and visit the relatives.
The drop is dramatic.
After months of cratering demand, industry leaders are cautiously optimistic.
Now we heard from several travel leaders during the course of the week.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SHAI WEISS, CEO, VIRGIN ATLANTIC: Actually, the last few weeks, we've seen an uptick in the speed of booking.
I guess part of it on the back of the news of the vaccine but also in the fact that people now are starting to plan for their Easter and summer
holidays. And with confidence that we'll be around to serve them, they are indeed booking with us.
SCOTT KIRBY, CEO, UNITED AIRLINES: We're going to eventually have a vaccines great news in the last two weeks on vaccine. But between now and
then it's important to start reopening our economies.
And we're hoping that a negative test could give confidence to governments around the world to let people come in and avoid the quarantine
requirements.
Because as you know, if there's a two-week quarantine, people simply aren't going to travel.
TIM CLARK, PRESIDENT, EMIRATES AIRLINES: -- (inaudible) see scale rollout of the vaccine unless something happens where its efficacy is challenged or
there are other bits and pieces that go on.
And as you continue through and as that happens, you will see demand for air travel grow, I believe, at pace.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: Steve Kaufer is with us, the TripAdvisor chief executive. Good to have you, sir, on a Friday. Thank you.
Now look, we've talked before throughout this. First of all, what's happening in the United States, in terms of those people heeding the advice
and those people not, what are you seeing?
STEVE KAUFER, CEO, TRIPADVISOR: Well, we certainly see Thanksgiving travel or projected Thanksgiving travel down, but probably not down enough.
I'm a travel CEO. I want people to get out and explore the world but now is actually not the right time to do it so I'm all for planning that trip in
the late spring, in the summer. That would be wonderful.
But now keep in mind your loved ones, your friends, your family and the fact that we really all want to get this under control. And that's the best
for travel today.
QUEST: And if we widen it out from the United States, then, of course, we're looking at -- throughout the rest of the world, you're talking about
Christmas, Diwali of course has been, but you're talking about all the other festivals that people celebrate.
And again, you'd have to make that same clarion call in other parts of the world at Christmas.
KAUFER: I absolutely do. And I want people to remember that travel will come back. People will get on the road again and have those magical trips.
We just need to do it safely.
So if -- no matter where you're going, domestic, international, all around the world, if you need to travel, hey, TripAdvisor can help you. We have a
travel safe initiative, over 100,000 different properties giving you great COVID-related information about what they're doing to help make it safe.
But you don't want to travel right now unless you have to.
QUEST: So are you gearing up? I want to end optimistic. I want to be optimistic today. Are you gearing up for -- I know the airlines are getting
ready -- for what you believe as the vaccine's efficacy, as we heard earlier today on this program, Dr. Besser -- as the vaccine's efficacy
starts to show fruit, then by next spring and summer, you could be off to the races?
KAUFER: I have no -- the vaccine news is just amazingly good. And coupled now with so many more already in trials, late stage trials. So that is
coming -- I can't say guaranteed -- but almost certainly so many of us are going to be able to get vaccinated in the beginning part of next year.
Super exciting.
When you think of spring and summer, I'm planning my trip. I have no doubt that the leisure travel industry is going to come roaring back because
we've all been cooped up for so long, we've got to get out.
QUEST: So --
KAUFER: And that's going to be great news for travel --
QUEST: The issue now becomes how, of course, you get the integrity of vaccine information and/or test because until people have tested, until we
get vaccines, people will still require tests.
Now, we've got CommonPass which is coming along. We've got a variety of ways in which airlines and governments are going to be able to access the
information, verified information, that people have the vaccine.
Is the vaccine the new yellow fever certificate that you and I are old enough to remember on a dusty piece of cardboard?
KAUFER: That's right. And that's going to be your passport, certainly, to travel internationally. Hopefully you could get on a plane even
domestically.
That certification, that proof -- I love your analogy of the yellow fever card -- that's what's going to get you everywhere.
[15:55:00]
I hope the world can come together and adopt a set of reasonable standards even if it's not just one maybe two or three but a handful that would give
consumers the confidence that, if they had this card, they're ready to go.
That card's digital. If that card is a set of tests that are labeled, all that's great.
QUEST: Steve, have a lovely weekend, have a good weekend. I appreciate your time, sir. Thank you.
KAUFER: Thank you.
QUEST: We will take a short break.
On the other side, it's a "Profitable Moment" ahead of the weekend.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: And tonight's "Profitable Moment." We've spent a lot of time this week talking about travel and tourism and airlines, as we always do on this
program.
And there's a reason for that.
I could give you the sort of official reason, that it is 10% of the global economy and it employs hundreds of millions, if not billions, several
billion people, one way or another.
But that's not the only reason. The reason we cover this in such detail is because you're interested in it. We know that.
We know that you want to travel, as indeed, Steve was saying, from TripAdvisor just then. We know you want to travel, we know you're waiting.
And that is why tonight this talk of the vaccine is so important. It is the vaccine that unlocks whatever comes next.
But we have to get there. And that's why we had Dr. Besser tonight, to remind us that if the long, cold winters of the Northern Hemisphere, we
have to stick to what we're doing.
If we stick to what we're doing not out of some pertinacious wish for hardship but because we can only get to the victory of vaccine if we manage
to live long enough to get there. Well, most of us will.
But for those who are vulnerable, it could be a very different matter.
And that's why it gives me great pleasure tonight as we talk about the vaccine to basically say -- that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight.
I'm Richard Quest in New York.
Whatever you're up to in the weekend ahead, I hope it is profitable. I'll see you on Monday.
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: This is CNN BREAKING NEWS>
JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST, THE LEAD: And welcome to THE LEAD. We begin today with the 2020 lead.
Two months from today, President Elect Joe Biden will become President Joe Biden.
That's right. Despite the Trump team's noise and the plotting and the shambolic and incompetent attempts to overturn.
END
