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Quest Means Business
Recovery Of Travel Industry May Lie In Travel Corridors; Significant U.S. Agency Hack In FireEye Breach; Gaming Is The Megamarket Of The Future; Hawaii Opens New Travel Routes
Aired December 15, 2020 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[15:00:19]
RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS ANCHOR, QUEST MEANS BUSINESS: Sixty minutes of trading on Wall Street, an hour to go to see how things are moving in hopes
of a stimulus deal.
The Dow is now back above 30,000. It is a strong session. Just look at the way the momentum has grown throughout the course of the day. A little
wobble in the early morning or mid-morning, and then really the highs of the day, 30,200 not looking back. We'll update you with the Dow and the S&P
and the NASDAQ as we move forward.
And now, the markets as they look in the day so far. The United States is getting closer to a second COVID vaccine, and this may include a major
upgrade from the Pfizer version.
New York City's mayor says a new shutdown is likely on the way.
The White House is now taking a hard look at a suspected Russian cyberattack.
We are live in New York today. It is Tuesday. It's December the 15th. I'm Richard Quest, and yes, I mean business.
Good evening. Twenty four hours or so and the U.S. takes another step towards becoming the first country in the world with two COVID-19 vaccines.
A new F.D.A. documents says the Moderna vaccine is effective and safe. According to the F.D.A. and the C.D.C., yes, it could be authorized for
emergency use as soon as the end of this week, Friday. A short time ago, Moderna said its vaccine might even prevent coronavirus infections, not
just symptomatic diseases and that will be a major breakthrough in fighting the pandemic.
So the difference between Pfizer's which is in use, and Moderna's which is coming along. Here are the differences: the efficacy. Now they're roughly
the same. BioNTech-Pfizer, 95 percent; Moderna, 94 percent. Let's not argue about such small amounts, but the difference on storage.
Pfizer requires minus 60 to 80; Moderna, 15 to 25, much easier to manage. And the timeline, Pfizer requires two doses three weeks apart. Moderna,
slightly different, two doses four weeks apart. You take your choice on that.
As for the age group, 16 and over, 18 and over for Moderna.
Jacqueline Howard is with me for the CNN Health Desk. So Moderna by the weekend, by the look of it.
JACQUELINE HOWARD, CNN HEALTH REPORTER: That's right, things are moving quickly and this advisory committee meeting that's happening this Thursday.
They are a panel that provides recommendations to the U.S. Food and Drug Administration.
This committee is meeting on Thursday to make a recommendation on whether this vaccine should be authorized here in the United States. And as you
mentioned, Richard, if this authorization comes through, this will be the second COVID-19 vaccine authorized here in the United States. So it will be
a big deal, but there are some steps that have to happen.
First, that committee has to make the recommendation to the U.S. Food and Drug Administration, then the administration has to authorize the vaccine
and the story doesn't end there, Richard. What comes next is the United States will hear from its C.D.C., its Centers for Disease Control and
Prevention on its recommendation for the vaccine.
So those are some steps that we're expecting to happen this week. But if it all comes through by the end of this week, the United States could have two
vaccines -- Richard.
QUEST: Jacqueline, thank you. Jacqueline joining us from the CNN Center. Now, the reality is the U.S. will have two by the weekend. Britain has
already got one with a second on the way. Canada, likewise.
In Europe, Germany has run out of patience with E.U. regulators. It wants the regulators to authorize a vaccine by Christmas. However, the E.U. says
it is sticking to the original deadline, although it has agreed to bring up its consideration by the 21st of December.
Last Thursday, I asked the E.U. Health Commissioner what was taking so long. The Commissioner said, it's a collective choice.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STELLA KYRIAKIDES, EUROPEAN COMMISSION FOR HEALTH AND FOOD SAFETY: The decision to go with a conditional marketing authorization was a decision
taken by all 27 member states which could have gone with a -- which could have each gone with the Emergency Use Authorization, but we decided that we
would all move together for all 27 member states so that this vaccine, once it is authorized -- or vaccines once they are authorized -- they will be
available for all 27 member states at the same time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Joining me now, the epidemiologist, Neil Ferguson is with me from Oxford. Let's start with where that is. I mean, the Europeans -- I sort of
I'm getting weary with every regulator, telling me as if they are the only ones to do this, that they will not approve it until they are sure it is
safe to the nth degree et cetera et cetera et cetera.
[15:05:10]
QUEST: The Europeans have said so. But the fact is, the European regulator is behind the curve on this.
NEIL FERGUSON, EPIDEMIOLOGIST AND FORMER U.K. GOVERNMENT ADVISER ON COVID- 19: I mean, I think it's a different type of authorization, and clearly countries moving independently on their own will move slightly faster.
I don't actually think it's going to make very much difference to the rollout. I mean, the thing which will limit the rollout of the vaccine is
not a week here or there in the authorization, it is the availability of stocks in the coming weeks and months and those have been predetermined by
the purchase orders, countries and blocs like the European Union have already placed.
QUEST: I guess, I sort of see the difference between the individual nations or Emergency Use Authorization, this collective approach that the
E.U. has taken. But I guess what I think about is that it doesn't suggest urgency.
I'm sure there is, but when you get all the other players, seemingly and obviously moving with great alacrity, Europe does not seem to have had that
same urgency.
FERGUSON: I'm not going to -- the U.K., as you well know, is finally leaving Europe on the end of this month. I'm not going to criticize another
regulator.
You'll be aware, there was a little bit of to and fro between the U.S. and the U.K. in terms of the speed of regulatory approval. I mean, different
countries and different blocs will have different rules.
I think the fact is that at the end of this year, beginning of January, which is when frankly, countries are going to start having significant
stocks, a number of vaccines will be approved both in Europe and in the United States and Canada.
QUEST: So let's just look at the way this pans out. We have a pretty awful January and February in the models that you've been looking at, it tells us
that this could be particularly grim, don't they?
FERGUSON: I mean, yes, we're heading into the bleak midwinter with a kind of hope of a more hopeful and warm spring ahead of us. I mean, it is
looking very challenging, not just in the United States. And though the trajectory of the epidemic there is particularly concerning, but frankly,
across Western Europe as well, where whilst I would say the growth rate of cases in the large European countries is somewhat slower, or flattened,
slightly declining in some, nevertheless, with high infection numbers and high numbers of deaths per day.
I think we have to get through the next few months and that will be challenging, frankly. I mean, you well know, particularly from the North
American context that people are sick to death of COVID. But if we don't maintain control, then we will face really substantial mortality before we
can roll out vaccine.
I mean, I think my own view is the U.S. is going to hit 400,000 deaths now regardless of what happens. The question is really does it hit 500,000
deaths before you can get enough vaccine into people's arms?
QUEST: What is that tipping point for -- to use the crude term "herd immunity" the sense in which isn't really that sense, but in the sense of
if sufficient numbers of people are vaccinated that even though there are still those that will cause problems by not being vaccinated, we can
breathe a sigh of relief.
FERGUSON: Yes, indeed. And thankfully, I mean, the vaccines -- the U.S. is now authorizing the messenger RNA vaccines have incredible efficacy and
from that point of view, beyond our wildest dreams, we hoped so much, but - - so they really will offer very high levels of immunity.
So in that context, we probably require somewhere between 60 and 70 percent of the population, to be immunized to have -- basically give herd immunity
to stop this epidemic transmitting, at least for a while.
Of course, we know nothing about the duration of protection any of the vaccines will give at the moment. It's quite likely a year, two years
later, we will need to re-vaccinate again.
But at that point, we'll have the next generation of vaccines, which hopefully will be even more effective.
QUEST: Yes. Is it your view that a fundamental event has taken place that we can't put the clock back and the reason I ask that is just what you
said. I think a lot of us must -- my naivete has thought well, maybe a vaccine every few years.
But if we're moving to a flu vaccine scenario, I mean, good grief. How the heck do we vaccinate the globe every year?
FERGUSON: It is a good question and to be honest, we don't know how frequently we will have to vaccinate and I suspect with the highest
efficacy vaccines, it'll be less frequently.
[15:10:07]
FERGUSON: But I mean, look, we've seen a new variant of the virus just emerge in the U.K., we don't yet know its properties, but it's concerning.
This virus will evolve over time and will continue to pose a threat and it's the most serious global pathogen to emerge, at least since the
emergence of HIV, some 40 to 50 years ago. So we're in uncharted territory in many ways.
But there is good news and the scientific community's response to this threat has been quite remarkable and this new generation of completely
novel messenger RNA vaccines, the first ever to be approved are showing remarkable efficacy. So, we have some things on our side.
QUEST: Lots of thoughts, and I was talking to some friends and colleagues in Africa, in Nigeria, and they made a very valid point. Yes, that's all
very nice for you up in the north and the rich north. When are we going to see the vaccines here?
And if I look at COVAX and the hope to have got to have bought two billion doses, and they're not even close, they're not even in the ballpark, we are
moving to a world of haves in another world of haves and have nots.
FERGUSON: I mean, I think this pandemic has highlighted the inequalities in the world, not just globally. But I completely agree with you, we have a
real issue in terms of the grasp bulk of the world's population not getting access to vaccines, frankly, not even next year.
But even within our countries, this pandemic has affected different communities very differently with the least fortunate being the worst
affected.
Many people point hopefully that, you know, build back better as it were being a political slogan, I think, used in the United States, but I think
it's been adopted more globally without a party political bent. That maybe this will be the opportunity to address some of those inequalities.
QUEST: Neil, thank you. I appreciate your time, sir. Thank you.
Now the vaccines will not arrive in time that we will have more shutdowns in the U.S. Ahead, the Chairman of Hard Rock International, and how
pandemic restrictions is affecting his business.
It is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Finally, U.S. lawmakers could be closing in on a stimulus deal as congressional leaders from both parties are set to meet within the hour and
that includes the top Senate Republican Mitch McConnell, who for the first time recognized Joe Biden as the President-elect.
Manu Raju is on Capitol Hill. Hallelujah. I mean, I heard what he said. He recognized, he congratulated Harris. He even made a sop to the fact that
both of them had been -- one was a member of the Senate, but really, a day late and a dollar short.
[15:15:26]
MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, this had taken some time to get there because he and a lot of other Republican senators
simply just do not want to upset the President, no matter what, even if it's plain in sight that Donald Trump lost this election and it was
official yesterday when the Electoral College voted to make Joe Biden the next President of the United States.
There's no denying reality, even if the President continues to deny reality and Mitch McConnell made that clear on the Senate floor today.
Now, one thing that he did not do, though, Richard is criticize the President's baseless theories as lies about the election. His
unsubstantiated claims that have simply not held up in court.
He did not criticize him at all and I just had a chance to ask Mitch McConnell, about whether he believes the President should continue to say
the election was stolen, it was rigged, and if the President should accept the results.
He didn't say any of that. He said, I'll let the President say what he wants to say. To me, the Electoral College was determinative and that's why
Joe Biden is the President-elect. So clearly not going as far as a lot of people would like in pushing back against the President.
QUEST: But I mean, okay, Mitch McConnell is an exceptionally experienced legislature, a politician, a wily politician of decades' experience. He
knows that obviously the damage that's being done to democracy in the United States.
At what point is he going to or his party going to start rebuilding this element of if the election was fair, to stop this nonsense.
RAJU: Well, they simply hope it goes away. And a lot of folks, of course, are concerned that it won't. The problem that's facing the Republicans
right now is twofold.
One, the Georgia Senate races in January 5th. They need President Trump and his supporters to come out in the polls to help them keep the Senate
majority.
The last thing Mitch McConnell wants is for the President to do something that could discourage the voters even more from coming out to the polls,
even as the President continues to baselessly claim that the election in Georgia was stolen from him, which it was not.
He also needs the President's support to ultimately sign a COVID relief deal, assuming they can get one, assuming it gets passed by the Congress,
as soon as this week, get that on his desk and get the President to sign it.
The concern, of course, with a Mercurial president like Donald Trump, who knows what he will do if he is at war with the Republican leaders and
that's the last thing that Mitch McConnell wants, so as a result, he's not criticizing this President. He is in fact praising the President,
acknowledging reality, but perhaps not going far enough here.
QUEST: And finally, the stimulus, I mean, any chance?
RAJU: I think there is a chance for a narrow proposal. There is that meeting you mentioned, in less than an hour at Nancy Pelosi's office, the
top congressional leaders along with the Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin are going to try to finalize this.
It is probably going to be a narrow deal. It will include money for small businesses, extension of jobless benefits, money for schools, vaccine
distribution money, but it won't include -- it almost certainly won't include state and local money, which Democrats wanted, lawsuit protections,
which is what Republicans wanted. And it won't be nearly the price tag that Nancy Pelosi has been pushing for months.
So it'll be a big concession on multiple fronts, but it appears headed in that direction. But of course, we've been here before and this could
quickly fall apart. So we'll see what happens at this meeting this afternoon -- Richard.
QUEST: We've got a second or two longer, I want to get your insight, Manu, as somebody who's been on Capitol Hill for a long time, and once Biden is
in office and once Trump is -- Georgia has gone off one way or the other. Is it likely that an element of comity, element of bipartisanship? I mean,
he worked with McConnell and he knows them all, and they all know each other. Is that likely at all?
RAJU: I think there's some possibility of doing some things together. But it's going to be incredibly challenging. The Senate and the House are both
narrowly divided right now in the new Congress. They're going to need bipartisan cooperation to get a lot of things done.
But at the same time, a lot of the Republicans are distrustful of what Joe Biden is almost certainly going to push. A lot of liberal Democrats will be
distrustful of Mitch McConnell in trying to get a deal with Joe Biden.
So there is a very difficult line for both Biden and McConnell to navigate among their respective parties to get something done. And you add on top of
that, the House Republicans are going to be trying to take back the House Majority in 2022.
So they may not be as willing to give Joe Biden, say a victory in the run up to the midterm elections that year. So there are a lot of different
political considerations at play. But the big thing they have to get done, even if they get this COVID relief deal done this year, they are going to
have to do a big COVID relief bill probably in the beginning of next year, that'll be a top Joe Biden priority, in addition to getting all of his
Cabinet nominees confirmed. That's what Senate will have to worry about, too.
So we'll see if they're able to least get Republican cooperation on that and the Democrats can cut some deals here.
[15:20:34]
QUEST: Good to have you. Thank you, sir, I appreciate it. Thank you.
Now the first trickle of vaccines administered in the U.S. this week are reaching just a fraction of the country's population. Widespread
immunization, as you heard us talk about earlier, is not expected for months.
The Mayor of New York says the city's hospital rate is more than five and a half percent and tighter restrictions may be unavoidable.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAYOR BILL DE BLASIO (D), NEW YORK CITY: We are just on the verge of a huge breakthrough with the vaccine. But we're also dealing with a second
wave, we've got to beat it back. We've got to protect lives. We've got to protect our hospitals.
So I think unfortunately, I don't say it with anything but sorrow, but I do think it is needed, we're going to need to do some kind of shutdown in the
weeks ahead.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Some kind of shutdown in the weeks ahead. New Jersey's Governor is also saying his state is considering another shutdown. Jim Allen is
Chairman of Hard Rock International and joins me from Atlantic City in New Jersey.
I know you don't want to hear this. You don't want to hear it, shutdowns and the like, but wherever you look in your empire, governments and local
authorities are introducing greater restrictions. How difficult is it going to be for you?
JIM ALLEN, CHAIRMAN, HARD ROCK INTERNATIONAL: First of all, Richard, thanks for having me. You know, it's challenging. We were already seeing
this in Europe. We had reopened, you know, 25 to 30 cafes in gateway cities throughout Europe. And unfortunately, now they're virtually all closed
again.
So it's never good news, but we certainly anticipate it could happen, obviously, as we see a spike in COVID now hitting here in the northeast.
QUEST: So what are you going to do? I mean, for those, obviously, if you can't open, you can't open. And when you can open, it is outdoor dining or
it's outdoor this, or it's some variant thereof.
Are you funded and liquid that you can last through until herd immunity middle to late next year?
ALLEN: Yes, actually, overall, we are in good shape, but overall is defined as all of our businesses, which is not just Hard Rock Cafe. It's
the seminal gaming business. It's the regional casinos, it is our online sports betting, our online retail, and obviously our online gaming
businesses.
When we look at all of them, we will be fine. We will make it through '20 and '21 and again, we look for some real upside in 2022 and more
specifically 2023 in the restaurant business. So yes, we will make it, but it certainly has been a very intriguing year.
QUEST: This is why I mean, things like Hard Rock Digital, which you've announced basically a gaming venture, an online betting venture. It's why
these new ventures are crucial, in a sense, as revenue raises in the meantime.
ALLEN: Yes, you know, frankly, we started, you know, Hard Rock Interactive, you know, three and a half to four years ago. We've had some
great success. You know, with a little bit of humor, there certainly are different business models, but we actually make money in this space today;
frankly, some double digit EBITDA.
Many of these companies are losing hundreds and hundreds of millions of dollars, we took a little different approach. As we've now launched Hard
Rock Digital with our new partners, we really see that as the next step at maximizing our revenue, our EBITDA projections over the next three to five
years, which we believe, I think many of the analysts would concur that we're going to see a 30 to 35 percent of total gross gaming revenue in the
United States come from the digital aspect of online gaming and sports betting.
So it is the way of the future and we're real excited about the Hard Rock Digital release.
QUEST: How do you keep excited by restaurants, cafes, and hotels and all the other things, which is old school, and really never gets the same sort
of potential revenue/EBITDA that you ever get with gaming because the costs are so much greater of building bricks and mortar?
ALLEN: You know, one of the great things about the Hard Rock brand, you know, literally, you know, two billion plus media impressions last year, so
we know the brand is relevant.
And you know, the cafe's coming up on their 50-year anniversary next June, still are part of that. So we know it's very important to keep that
original foundation block in place. We're certainly not in an expansion mode where the cafe's even prior to COVID here domestically in the United
States.
[15:25:03]
ALLEN: On a global basis, frankly, we were doing between 15 and 25 cafe's a year through our licensing and franchise divisions and you know, they
really weren't doing well prior to COVID.
So the future is clearly you know, Big Box integrated, online destination resorts. But certainly the cafe's, you know, still do pretty amazingly well
when we look at its 50-year history.
QUEST: Do you collect all the Hard Rock mugs? I mean, if one more person I've come across who actually collects all, so I figured that the Chair
must collect them all.
ALLEN: No, but actually, Richard I do not. But what's amazing with Hard Rock is, I always joke, you know, try to go to an airport and not see
someone in a Hard Rock shirt or hat, whatever it may be.
But the reality is that our real collectors are the pin collectors and there are so many amazing variations, literally thousand variations of Hard
Rock pins on a global basis.
And about two weeks ago was my 20th year with Hard Rock and they actually created a pin for me. So that's about the only one I have in the collecting
category, but certainly, you know, Hard Rock pin collectors and our merchandise, and obviously, the world's largest collection of music
memorabilia is still alive and doing very well. That's the one thing COVID cannot affect.
QUEST: And the hotel where we are always staying in Davos became a Hard Rock and a Hard Rock up the mountain slopes.
Good to see you, Jim, thank you for taking time today, busy days and we appreciate your time. Thank you, sir.
ALLEN: Always a pleasure, Richard. Thank you for having us.
QUEST: Now coming up, the Russian hackers suspected of a massive cyberattack targeting the U.S. government, thousands of private businesses
may also have serious reasons to worry.
It is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS on a Tuesday.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Hello, I am Richard Quest. There's more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS in a moment. We're going to be talking about the White House as it is taking a
look, a hard look at what could be one of the most sophisticated Russian cyberattacks in years.
A head of AITA tells me the damaged airline industry is even worse than many had expected. You'll hear from him and the CEO of Hawaiian Airlines.
[15:30:08]
All is after new headlines. Because this is CNN and on the network, the news ways comes first.
And the world's top epidemiologist says the death toll from the COVID-19 pandemic could reach as high as 500,000 in the United States.
This week, total U.S. deaths passed 300,000 with new cases hitting record highs.
Speaking to me on this program, Imperial College Professor Neil Ferguson said U.S. deaths will soon exceed 400,000 even with a vaccine being rolled
out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NEIL FERGUSON, DIRECTOR, J-IDEA, IMPERIAL COLLEGE, LONDON: The U.S. is going to hit 400,000 deaths now, regardless of what happens. The question
is does it hit 500,000 deaths before you can get enough vaccine into people's arms?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: One day after his electoral college victory, President Elect Joe Biden's in Georgia where he's set to campaign for Democrat senate
candidates Jon Ossoff and Raphael Warnock who are facing run off elections against Republican opponents. The run-off is in three weeks from today.
The result will determine the balance of power in the senate.
Sources are telling CNN Biden has chosen the former Democratic rival Pete Buttigieg as his transportation secretary. Buttigieg dropped his own
presidential bid back in March. If confirmed, he would become the first openly gay U.S. cabinet secretary.
More than 300 Nigerian schoolboys are still unaccounted for after armed kidnappers targeted their boarding school.
An audio message said to be from the leader of Boko Haram claims the terror group was responsible for the abductions in northwestern Nigeria. CNN
can't verify the authenticity of the message.
Fashion mogul, Peter Nygard, has been indicted on charges of alleged sex trafficking. He was arrested in Canada at the request of U.S. authorities.
Prosecutors are accusing him of trafficking dozens of women, some of them under age, over the course of decades.
The new executive of Dubai Airport says he's seen a huge demand in travel from the United Kingdom after they opened a travel corridor last month.
Paul Griffith says he understands wider anxiety around travel though he hopes the vaccine may at last turn things around.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PAUL GRIFFITHS, CEO, DUBAI AIRPORTS: One of the things we're fighting at the moment is a lack of confidence in travel because people are worried
about quarantine, they're worried about the rules changing.
And having a vaccine which effectively means that people can travel with greater confidence is a huge step forward.
We are still requiring PCR tests on arrival from many countries but we've got 52 testing stations now so we can do that.
And since we opened the U.K. DXB travel corridor in the middle of November, we've seen an absolute surge in bookings from the U.K.
So I think the U.K. DXB travel corridor is a great example of where I think the world's heading toward recovery and we're very keen --
QUEST: Right.
GRIFFITHS: -- to be at the cutting edge of that.
QUEST: But there are really two phases, aren't there -- or three phases, we had the first phase. We're now going into sort of the interim phase
from vaccination until somewhere near herd immunity.
If you look forward to middle to late next year, do you imagine that a vaccination certificate will be required before you go to DXB?
GRIFFITHS: We're hoping not to make it a mandatory requirement because I think the testing and quarantine protocol will remain in place for those
who haven't been vaccinated.
But clearly, the world's got to get its head around what this new phase is and how we're going to monitor the difference between those who've been
vaccinated and those who haven't.
I'm old enough to remember the little yellow books we used to carry around when we traveled which said what vaccinations we had which was key to
getting into different countries; maybe we can go to a digital version of that.
But I think at the moment this is very much dependent on bilateral government to government agreements as we've done with our travel corridor.
QUEST: So is it going to be up to the airlines or the airport on this question of whether to seek vaccination? Because, obviously, we're all
familiar with Alan Joyce's comments about Quantas.
There the onus is on the airline. Can you see the onus -- and I know you don't want to -- but can you see the onus being moved to the airport?
GRIFFITHS: I don't think it should be either on the airline or the airport. I think it really should be down to the individual health
authorities of each country to specify what the protocol is.
The difficulty we've got at the moment -- there's no such thing as a global approach to this. And therefore, I think every country is approaching this
with a different degree of either risk mitigation or risk management.
[15:35:00]
So we have to rely, I think, on bilateral agreements between the relevant health authorities. And that will depend very much on what the testing
protocol has been, how each government has dealt with the pandemic and what the results are. To give that bilateral confidence at each end of the
route.
I don't think a requirement for a vaccination to board an airplane is actually the right way to go. It's going to be difficult to police, it's
going to be very restrictive.
And it probably may apply in countries like Australia where they have a particular approach but that's going be very problematic in other parts of
the world.
QUEST: Paul Griffiths of Dubai Airport.
Now Russian isn't commenting on a CNN Bellingcat investigation into the poisoning of one of the Kremlin's most prominent critics.
The opposition leader, Alexey Navalny, almost died after the August attack.
The investigation found that the elite Russian agents had tracked him for years.
Navalny spoke to Christiane Amanpour about what he thinks needs to be done following this investigation.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALEXEY NAVALNY, RUSSIAN OPPOSITION LEADER: I need very clear message from the president of United States -- not just me, I think it's not about me,
it's about using chemical weapon against civilians for killing political opponents.
And honestly, a reaction from Donald Trump was very disappointing because the only words he said -- it was let's talk about this later. And I think
it's actually not enough because this "later" never came.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: And meanwhile, getting new details on what could be the most sophisticated Russian-linked cyberattack on the U.S. government in years.
Experts say the damage is unclear but it is extensive. Top federal agencies using Solarwind software were targeted in a month's long campaign
including the Department of Homeland Security and possibly state..
Solarwind shares -- if you take a look at the market there, you might -- they're off (inaudible) say, seven-and-a-half percent, down $1.50.
Vivian Salama is our U.S. security correspondent in Washington.
So tell me, what's supposed to have happened here?
VIVIAN SALAMA, CNN U.S. SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Richard, we know that extensive, extensive breaches to numerous government agencies here in the
U.S.
And, essentially, what we found out is that cyber security firm called FireEye alerted American intelligence to the breach of several layers of
defenses over the weekend.
And as they started to look into it more and more, they discovered that several agencies, namely the commerce department here in Washington, the
agriculture department and the department of homeland security division that is in charge with protecting the country from cyber attacks were
attacked and breached in this attack.
Also, the government is looking into the possibility of breaches at the treasury department, the department of defense and the U.S. Postal Service.
Now this is not too shocking, Richard, because a lot of these agencies actually use the same software.
And the company that heads the software said that they believe that about 18,000 government and private users may have downloaded a Russian-laced
software download that essentially allowed these hackers to gain a foothold into the software of all of these agencies and make it so vulnerable.
And so right now U.S. government officials telling us privately that this does appear to (inaudible) Russian linked actors but really the government
publicly not saying that so far. Richard.
QUEST: OK. So, Vivian, two things here. Either the people who downloaded it were stupid and they did things that they weren't supposed to do or this
was so very clever that it was pretty much guaranteed that it would infect and infiltrate.
SALAMA: It's a little bit of both. Obviously, people have to be careful and especially when you're a government official, you have to do a lot of
due diligence with regard to any suspicious attachments that you might be getting.
QUEST: Right.
SALAMA: But also, what you said, the latter part is very much true. The forensics are so extensive in this investigation because of how
sophisticated this attack was.
And so definitely we're not dealing with amateurs here, Richard.
QUEST: Interesting. Thank you so much. Thank you. Now as we continue tonight, they call him the futurist in chief.
The man who's helping to bring the tech in tomorrow into the world today.
[15:40:00]
QUEST: Now in the past few moments on this program, you heard the chairman of Hard Rock International telling us that online gaming is helping offset
revenues missed out because of the pandemic. It's the savior in many ways.
And as a result, gaming stocks have been big winners this year.
And there's one place that's banking on further growth. It is in Dubai.
CNN's Anna Stewart reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
Dr. Noah Raford's job as Dubai's futurist in chief is to spot the next big thing in tech.
A key role in a city betting big on the likes of AI, block chain and V.R. for its economic development.
NOAH RAFORD, FUTURIST-IN-CHIEF, DUBAI: Our job is to help identify what is exciting, what is new, what has potential for Dubai's economy and for
Dubai's culture. And indeed, potentially for the UAE to help advance into the next generation of industry, of society. of technology.
ANNA STEWART, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Raford is at Dubai's GITEX conference, the only live in-person tech event of the year. And he's checking out some
of the world's most promising technologies.
Everything from autonomous robots to flying vehicles and virtual reality systems are on display.
But the next big tech to really change our lives? According to Raford, it's video games.
RAFORD: This might seem strange. Why do we think video games are the future? I like to say video games are the new Hollywood because today
video games are already three times larger than the film, television and music industries combined.
STEWART: Video gaming is a $150 billion plus industry with over 2.5 billion gamers world wide.
RAFORD: Now, that's exciting. But then it gets really exciting when you start to add on in-game economies.
Take Fortnite, for example, one of the world's most popular games. It's free to play and yet every month it makes hundreds of millions of dollars.
Why, what are people doing? They're buying clothes, they're buying guns, they're buying dances. They're buying fashion.
STEWART: Some 80 percent of gaming industry revenue comes from free to play games like Fortnite.
Raford says the gaming community has evolved into more than just a money- making machine.
It's become a culture where players can meet friends, express themselves and develop lifelong careers.
Dubai is part of the fastest growing regions in the gaming industry. Raford believes the future potential of gaming will soon disrupt societies
and economies around the world.
RAFORD: Ultimately, I firmly believe that the game's economy as in the economy that takes places in games -- from fashion to business creation to
intellectual property generation to just the exchange of services and goods -- is going to as big, if not bigger, than the physical economy.
STEWART: It's a growing economy, Raford says, Dubai is keeping an eye on.
[15:40:00]
And positioning itself to capitalize on in the near future.
STEWART (Voice Over): Anna Stewart, CNN.
RAFORD: I love it.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: Well, demand is heating up in Hawaii and its flight carriers now expanding routes across the U.S.
The CEO of Hawaiian Airlines joins me next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:45:00]
QUEST: Starting today, Tuesday, passengers on Delta and KLM can fly from Atlanta to Amsterdam without having to quarantine upon arrival.
The airline, Delta, says it's a travel corridor says it's a travel corridor with testing at its core.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PERRY CANTARUTTI, SVP, ALLIANCES & INTERNATIONAL, DELTA AIRLINES: The real key element here is testing.
And with these COVID-tested corridors that we're opening, all of the passengers on these flights will undergo a series of three tests as part of
their travel routine.
A test prior to departure, a test here in Atlanta immediately prior to boarding and then a test on arrival when they get to their destination
city.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Now this testing regime, rigorous testing, is old hat in Hawaii where they've been using testing for some time to boost demand.
So much so, Hawaiian Airlines is adding new routes to the mainland U.S. because the testing program allows people to avoid having to go into the
Hawaii quarantine, it's so rigorous.
Peter Ingram's with me, the CEO of Hawaiian Airlines. He joins me from Honolulu. It is always good to have you, Peter. Thank you for taking the
time.
So as you watch what Delta, United, British Airways and all the others are doing with their various testing routines, you're thinking been there, done
it, seen how it works, we've learned how it's done. What would you advise?
PETER INGRAM, CEO, HAWAIIAN AIRLINES: Aloha, Richard. It's good to be with you today. I think we're still learning as we go along.
As you say, we've have had a pre-travel testing program in place in Hawaii since October 15th.
It has allowed us to begin to open up travel again after a long dormant period where we had no alternatives to a 14-day quarantine from really the
beginning of April through mid-October.
And we have seen a recovery of demand.
There's still a lot of challenges working through verifying the credentials of people --
[15:50:00]
-- making sure that they get the appropriate tests from the appropriate provider.
But it is great to have an alternative that allows people to start traveling again and that has given us an opportunity to access demand
that's been missing for a lot of this year.
QUEST: Can you see yourself going with some of the common paths or travel paths that IATA's putting in place?
One of those schemes that is going to simplify the process of recognized testing sites, vaccination, distribution and all that.
INGRAM: I think there is a lot of merit to those schemes. And really, this is such a year of people trying to figure out what works and what
doesn't work.
And one of the challenges is from the stand point that the guest who is getting ready to travel, it's really difficult to understand what the rules
are and how I play by the rules.
And what common paths or one of those regimes could allow is a single clearinghouse where people can send their information in, know that it is
with a trusted carrier and use that back office support to verify that those tests correspond to the requirements of whatever destination you're
going to, be it Hawaii or anywhere else that is requiring testing. Or ultimately vaccines as an alternative to testing which is something that
we're obviously thinking about now.
QUEST: Listen to Alexander De Juniac who you know is the CEO and D.G. of IATA. I spoke to him this morning. He was quite blunt about the
situation.
Have a listen and we'll talk in a second.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALEXANDRE DE JUNIAC, CEO & DIRECTOR GENERAL, IATA: The crisis is lasting longer than we expected at the beginning. And is probably deeper than we
have expected before.
We thought at the beginning that the crisis could last a few months and that we will have a recovery or the beginning of a recovery during summer.
And the recovery stopped and even the traffic dropped again in September and October.
So, no, the impact of the crisis is really high.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Longer and deeper. And yet at the same time I notice you're doing Honolulu, Orlando starting next year. Honolulu, Austin next year.
Ontario, California, Long Beach.
So if this -- what I'm fascinating about with your airline is this balance of making sure you don't go out of business in the meantime but being
prepared for the new business when vaccination and things get back to normal.
INGRAM: Yes. I think that's what we've got to do, Richard, is we've got to be able to walk and chew gum at the same time.
Obviously, in the short term, things are very challenging and with cases continuing to rise on the mainland which is the source of so many of our
visitors, it is a difficult situation right now.
We're really looking forward to getting that under control and allowing us to see the continuation of the demand growth that we've seen since pre-
travel testing came in in October.
But we also have to look forward. We know that science is continuing to make advances to get the disease under control, vaccines this week are
starting to be distributed and injected into arms.
And that's going to create an environment where we see the opportunity for a really good recovery next year, gradually through the year.
But there may be some of the markets that we were flying to where the depth of demand is not what it was and that gave us an opportunity to go look at
some things that had been on our list for a while.
Like Orlando, like Boston, like Ontario and like Long Beach, Maui that we announced last week that gives us chance to broaden the network as we move
into that 2021 demand recovery that we do anticipate.
QUEST: Finally, briefly, Peter, do you think you're now in a position -- the next two months are going to be very difficult, next three months are
going to be difficult. Are you well funded, is your liquidity in place, your deep pocket ready; you can ride this out?
INGRAM: What's really gratifying for us is that we came into 2020 in a very strong liquidity position. We had cash on our balance sheet that was
above our target levels and that's proved invaluable this year.
We've been able the raise money in the private markets using our aircraft as collateral.
[15:55:00]
We had support through the Cares Act from the federal government and there is a potential for a little bit more of that coming this week depending on
what goes in Washington.
But we think we've done what we need to do to survive the crisis and now it is a matter of making sure we have a plan to recover and win on the back
side of this.
Understanding that there's still a little bit of road to cover before we're completely out of the woods.
QUEST: Good to talk to you, sir. Thank you. We'll keep in touch in the New Year as we get to find out what's happened. Thank you, I appreciate
it. As always.
INGRAM: Thank you very much.
QUEST: Now last few minute of trading on Wall Street. Very quick look at the Dow.
Vaccine and stimulus talks are what's absolutely powering this market. This outweighing the prospect of lockdowns which is a dampener.
There you are. We're over 30,000, that's holding those gains.
We will take a short break. A "Profitable Moment" after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Tonight's "Profitable Moment". On this program, Neil Ferguson game a very depressing warning.
One that if you stop for a second and think about it, it's fairly obvious. There will be 400,000 deaths in the United States before a vaccine has
sufficient efficacy and herd immunity as to make a difference, 400,000.
And he's even talking about a potential of 500,000 deaths.
And yet at the same time, you look at what's going on in Europe, Germany, hard lockdown. London tonight, it's being announced, tier three, the
strictest measures.
I can tell you, I live in New York and here in the United States, it's a different world, frankly.
Yes, California introduced some very strict measures and there's talk of further lockdowns. But so far, the best I can see of what's happened in
city is we can no longer have inside dining.
The gyms remain open and a lot of other thing remain open and I'm not quite sure what the meeting rules and restrictions are for various people over
the holiday period.
No, the reality is that the United States seems to have just decided we'll worry about it later on.
And whatever individual states may have done, there is just about zero leadership coming from the top at the moment.
Which is why we do end up with Neil Ferguson's 400,000 deaths at the same time as those in Europe are clamping down for Christmas.
No pleasure in saying it but that's the situation.
And that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight. I'm Richard Quest in New York.
Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, I hope it's profitable.
Good day on the Dow, the market's up heavily.
END
