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Quest Means Business
Trump: Talks Between U.S. Envoy and Putin Highly Productive; Trump Announces Sweeping Tariffs on Indian Goods; U.S. to Impose 15 Percent Tariff on Nigeria Starting Thursday; Apple to Invest an Additional $100 Billion in U.S. Operations; Trump Intends to Meet Putin as Soon as Next Week; Novo Nordisk Warns of Layoffs Amid Growing Competition; NASA to Build Nuclear Reactor on Moon. Aired 4-5p ET
Aired August 06, 2025 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:22]
RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS": Muscles galore! Planet fitness ringing the closing bell. One, two, three. What we
would expect! A firm gavel from Colleen, the CEO of Planet Fitness, the gym chain, and the market gave back a lot of the gains over the course of the
session. But it was positive for most of the day, just sort of wimped out towards the end. A wimpy, a wimpy end to the day.
Those are the markets, the events that you and I need to talk about. President Trump told European leaders, he intends to meet Russian President
Vladimir Putin as early as next week. Two sources are familiar with that call.
Tim Cook is at the white house. Apple is expected to announce $100 billion investment within the hour.
And Nigeria's Trade Minister joins me live, navigating the treacherous international landscape of Trump tariffs.
Midweek, live from New York, Wednesday, August the 6th. I am Richard Quest and I mean business.
Good evening to you.
Donald Trump, President Trump has told European leaders that he plans to meet the Russian President, Vladimir Putin, potentially as soon as next
week. It would ideally be followed by a trilateral meeting, including Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelenskyy. Multiple sources are reporting
this.
It follows Mr. Trump's Special Envoy, Steve Witkoff, who saw President Putin on Wednesday. Earlier today, President Trump says the meeting was
highly productive, in his words.
Fred Pleitgen is in Moscow.
Fred, when you heard this, were you surprised this meeting -- I mean, we don't know where, we don't know when, but President Trump seems to be
putting it firmly on the table.
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, certainly he seems to be putting it firmly on the table. And yes, it certainly was
quite surprising, I think to many people, not the least of which is actually the Russians, who so far have not reacted to this at all.
We did, of course, stick our feelers out to the Russian government, to the Russian presidency, and so far have not gotten an answer. However, Richard,
I was just in touch with a European official who did confirm that President Trump did say that on a call with European leaders that he wants to meet
with Vladimir Putin face-to-face as early next week, and then for there possibly to be a trilateral meeting with Volodymyr Zelenskyy of Ukraine.
Now, all of this comes as this meeting today with Steve Witkoff and Vladimir Putin, the Russians also saying that it was very productive, they
believe, from their side. But the Russians saying that there were signals sent from the Trump administration and that they in turn sent signals back
to the Trump administration, but they didn't want to say any more than that before President Trump was fully briefed by Steve Witkoff, who is, of
course, right now on a plane back to the United States. So certainly it seems as though both sides are trying to get their messaging in order.
One of the things, Richard, that we've heard from the Russians in the past is that Vladimir Putin is open to a meeting with President Trump, but the
Russians have said that a meeting like that needs to be well prepared, and also, of course, that there are logistical hurdles as well.
Interesting to see whether or not those can be sorted out in a short period of time.
QUEST: I mean, there are two aspects to this. The first is just Trump and Putin themselves, but the idea that it would become trilateral for two
warring parties is really quite something else.
PLEITGEN: Well, it would really be quite something else, and one of the things, of course, that we have to keep in mind is that Volodymyr Zelenskyy
of Ukraine has said that he wants to meet face-to-face with Vladimir Putin. Of course, there were those talks that took place in Turkey, in Istanbul,
two rounds of which, with Russian negotiators and Ukrainian negotiators, and for the first round of talks, Volodymyr Zelenskyy actually showed up in
Istanbul and said Vladimir Putin should show up as well, and Putin obviously did not.
So it is something that President Trump has been trying to get going and something that the Ukrainians want as well. But of course, once again, it
is hard to see whether or not something like that could happen in the not too distant future, because while on many things, President Trump and
Vladimir Putin might agree, the President of Russia, the Ukraine conflict certainly seems to be things where the two sides are still very much at
loggerheads, where President Trump says that he wants an immediate ceasefire of 30 days, and the Russians are saying that they want longer
term negotiations with a wider peace deal to be put in place.
So whether or not that can be broached, and of course, as we know from summits like this, there is work that's done before those summits actually
took place. And in the end, the leaders get together and essentially just agree on the final details. But it certainly seems as though the three
sides and also the United States and Russia are still very much very far apart from agreeing how to end the conflict in Ukraine -- Richard.
[16:05:10]
QUEST: An enormous amount of late progress in a sense.
Fred Pleitgen, thank you.
President Trump is making good on his threat to impose massive new tariffs on India, 25 percent. Now, that was the one that was already there. That is
to go into effect on Thursday, which is tomorrow. Almost that now in India. But then there will be an additional 25 percent later this month as a
punishment for India's reliance on Russian oil, so-called secondary sanctions. The desire is to stop India buying the fuel and slow down
Vladimir Putin's war machine as President Trump puts it. The total, 50 percent, the highest charge on goods from any single country.
There will be an exemption, which is critical and it is smartphones. And that is because companies like Apple moved production from China to India,
only to be clobbered for a second time, although not as this becomes --
Phil Mattingly is in Washington. Interesting use of sanctions here. Very interesting because this is different to say the Bolsonaro-Brazil, which
arguably is revenge and personal. This is sanctions for policy on secondary sanctions.
PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CHIEF U.S. DOMESTIC CORRESPONDENT: Yes and, Richard, we have spoken often in the past about the threat that secondary sanctions
pose, not just to Russia were they ever actually triggered by a U.S. administration, the Biden administration considered this for multiple years
and weren't willing to pull the trigger, but also for two countries specifically.
And that was India, as we are seeing in this case here, but also China, and I think it is very notable in terms of if you want to understand what was
going on behind-the-scenes and what President Trump is doing here, you should note that at this point, there have not been any secondary sanctions
targeting China yet, which has a much larger set of purchases on Russian energy than India does.
This was based on what I have been told from sources involved in the process, Richard, this was all about the trade agreement or lack thereof,
on a bilateral basis between the U.S. and India over the course of the last several weeks, really fell apart in the days leading up to that August 1st
deadline, and the reason why, I was told, is U.S. officials decided and frankly, the President specifically decided, that India was not willing to
drop tariffs on enough of their markets to provide access to U.S. producers.
The response to that was to essentially use this issue of secondary sanctions as a predicate, use it as the vehicle to ratchet up dramatically
those sanctions that you noted were already going to be at 25 percent, now, at 50 percent. I would note, they are giving them 21 days before they go
into effect, these specific secondary sanctions, that is an opening that the Trump administration hopes the Indian government will be able to pursue
for a potential deal, but we will see.
QUEST: Are you saying that this secondary set of secondary sanctions? You know what I mean, the next bit of 25 percent are essentially a Trojan horse
for a trade deal because of the fit of pique that hasn't been done.
MATTINGLY: My understanding is it was seen and is now being utilized as leverage without any question about it. I think that the President's threat
in his other deadline that he was weighing as Fred Pleitgen was just discussing about putting secondary sanctions on Russia as a stick to try
and make some progress on what had been no progress up to this point, those were real.
But my understanding is the President was weighing a more, I guess, calibrated or tailored set of sanctions targeting explicitly Russia. When
it came to India, this was explicitly about the fact that months of negotiations, some of which U.S. officials thought would almost certainly
lead to an outcome, had not and therefore the President wanted to act.
QUEST: So I think of the pictures of Modi and Trump and all the good words, I mean, nobody really can take this administration for granted or
friendship for granted. I mean, I am talking of -- thinking about, of course, Carney and Canada, and now you've got Modi and India.
There, as we are looking at pictures now, as you can see. This is quite an difficult environment for every country, particularly one like India.
MATTINGLY: There is no question about it and I don't know that there is another country, certainly not at scale as India, that put more effort into
trying to ensure they did not end up in this position from almost the inauguration day going forward.
The intensive deliberations on a very technical side, teams of technical officials, trade officials from both countries shuttling back and forth
between New Delhi and Washington over the course of the last couple of months, J.D. Vance in person, on the ground in India, making the case and
trying to clear the way forward, and what was so striking about it, one, I've heard from some officials that there was a lot of confusion on the
Indian side, that they didn't necessarily always know who to talk to. They didn't feel like there was enough bandwidth at certain agencies and certain
points of contact to make their points or to make their case as things were starting to fall apart.
[16:10:09]
But how much the other agreements that the President was able to sign off on in the lead up to that August 1st deadline animated his view that India
needed to be giving more when it came to tariffs and really kind of facilitated this moment where India is in a more difficult spot than almost
any other country, perhaps any other country other than China when it comes to their tariff level at this moment.
QUEST: I am grateful for you, sir. Thank you. Phil in Washington will watch.
The order states that tariffs are necessary and an appropriate way to punish India for buying Russian oil. Secondary sanctions could have a
serious impact on the global energy market. So far, the reaction has been muted. Brent is at about, well you can see the numbers there for yourself.
If the West does go full throttle on secondary sanctions, then we may see well a reaction in quite the opposite direction as things move forward on
that. That of course impacts the cost of everything.
Helima Croft is the global head of commodities at RBC Capital Markets. Good to see you.
There is a problem here. You were just telling me a moment or three ago, it is all a bit odd because actually Trump or the U.S. and certainly the E.U.
wanted India to buy this oil to help enforce their own price cap.
HELIMA CROFT, GLOBAL HEAD OF COMMODITIES, RBC CAPITAL MARKETS: Certainly, if you go back to December 2022, when the G7 went forward with price caps,
essentially saying that you had to purchase Russian oil at $60.00 or below, this whole mechanism was designed to facilitate the flow of Russian barrels
that were now locked out of Europe, when Europe basically said, we are not taking any seaborne oil from Russia. The price caps were designed to ensure
that those barrels had a home, and the home was India, and India was perfectly happy to back up the truck and take a significant amount of
Russian oil.
Russian imports into India have actually climbed by over a million barrels since the start of the war, but again, this was by design. And hence, if
you listen to the statements coming out of the Indian government today, they are very, very angry when it comes to this energy dimension,
essentially saying like, wait a second, this is entirely unjustified.
So we do have to wait and see what happens on Friday, because on Friday that was a deadline for the hundred percent tariff. So are more tariffs
coming on India? Again, is this just a bargaining chip? Is this escalate to de-escalate?
But the one thing I would say is that President Trump is facing pressure from Congress to really go after Russian oil exports. So this could be a
multi-purpose move.
QUEST: But it is the way it is being done, I guess, the sort of the 25 percent plus the 25 percent. I mean, what -- you know, if -- let's just --
as the experts, ma'am, if India does -- well, first of all, do you expect them to stop purchasing Russian oil as a result? And if they did, what
would be the effect on the market?
CROFT: So the question is like, how serious is this measure? Now we are talking about secondary tariffs. Now tariffs are a different tool than
sanctions. I mean tariffs can be, you know, imposed and taken off within like hours. If you have something put in place by OFAC or if Congress goes
forward with secondary sanctions like they did on Iran, the unwind process can be more protracted.
And so the question is what is the duration of the measures that President Trump is talking about? That will impact the market in terms of like, is
this real? Is this rhetorical? But certainly if the United States was serious about getting India to reduce their Russian oil imports, they could
impose secondary sanctions on the two biggest Russian energy producers, Gazprom and Rosneft. They could do Iran-style sanctions. And because the
key Indian refineries are so integrated in global financial markets, you could probably get them to pare back their purchases if you wanted to.
QUEST: Right. Now, while I've got you, it is too good to waste the opportunity. All of these other sanctions on things like copper and all the
other commodities that are being -- they are designed to increase production at home. They are designed to shift production.
But are they going to work or are they just going to push up costs for domestic production and U.S. consumers?
CROFT: I mean, this becomes whole issues around supply chains, Richard, in terms of like, what does that do? Like let's even for example, take
something like domestic U.S. production of oil. I mean, when you put tariffs on steel, that does increase costs for U.S. producers at home.
So it all comes back to like what are your supply chain issues that you're dealing with?
QUEST: Right. But there is -- I was reading in my morning newspaper. There is a contradiction, isn't there, between drill baby drill and wanting a
higher price for oil because the more you drill, because the lower the price goes, and President Trump wants a lower price, then there is no
incentive to go into the Permian Basin and actually drill the more expensive oil.
[16:15:07]
CROFT: Well, we just had the announcement from the Diamondback CEO that they are not going forward with production increases, essentially saying
the market does not need more U.S. production at this point.
You have OPEC putting on more barrels. You don't need more U.S. barrels. So this is the challenge for President Trump. He wants $50.00 oil, but he
wants more U.S. production, not compatible.
QUEST: Well, I hope what is compatible is you coming back on QUEST MEANS BUSINESS in the future and helping us understand this, because commodities
are so important and we do need to understand. Thank you very much.
CROFT: Thank you.
QUEST: Now, as you and I continue our nightly digest of business and economics, President Trump is targeting U.S. trading partners, big and
small. Now, it is Nigeria's turn. The goods surplus with the United States is less than $2 billion. Now, never mind 15 percent tariff, anyway. There
you see the Nigerian Trade Minister. She will be with me after the break, joining me from Lagos.
QUEST MEANS BUSINESS, good evening to you.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: President Trump's 15 percent tariff on Nigeria will kick in at midnight Eastern Time. Trade between the two nations is almost in balance.
Look at that. You can see just about there.
The U.S. exported $4.3 billion worth of goods to Nigeria last year. Nigerian exports to the U.S., well, you can see the numbers for yourself.
Nigeria primarily sells oil, fertilizers to the United States. The tariffs threaten to slow down its economy. The World Bank says it expanded 3.4
percent. It was the best mark for Nigeria in a decade, besides the COVID recovery.
Jumoke Oduwole is the Nigerian Minister of Industry, Trade and Investment. The Minister is with me now from Lagos.
Minister, thank you. You know, look, nobody wanted to have a tariff number, but 15 percent was probably the best that anybody was going to get except
one or two exceptions, say for example, the U.K.
JUMOKE ODUWOLE, NIGERIAN MINISTER OF INDUSTRY, TRADE AND INVESTMENT: Thanks, Richard. Good to see you again.
So yes, 15 percent starting from 14 percent, Nigeria remains responsive when not reacting. We are focused on our reforms. We are focused on our
eight-point agenda of President Bola Ahmed Tinubu.
QUEST: But what effect do you believe it is going to have? Where will the strain be in the economy? Because the economy is -- I mean, if I look at
the exports, it is just about in balance. So where do you expect and anticipate difficulties?
[16:20:10]
ODUWOLE: Well, it is mostly an energy trading relationship. We are waiting to see what happens with AGOA in September. Non-oil exports are fertilizer,
lead, some cocoa and other commodities. There are other markets also, Richard. We are looking at our integration strategy across Africa with the
African Continental Free Trade Area, exports -- non-oil exports to the rest of Africa are up 24 percent year-on-year in Q1 this year. So the world is a
big place.
Yes, there is competitiveness coming into the U.S. market, but that we are also exploring other alternatives.
QUEST: What does that mean? Alternatives, as in?
ODUWOLE: Alternative markets -- we have relationships like for instance, urea fertilizer is in high demand in Brazil. Where we have trading
partnerships with China, with Japan, with the UAE, and so we continue to look for opportunities for our Nigerian businesses.
President Bola Ahmed Tinubu's agenda is really focused on bolstering Nigerian domestic investors and supporting them in market access and access
to capital.
QUEST: You see, this is one of the things that people are talking about that the Trump tariffs are going to in some way rewire global trade and
people like yourselves. And I know, for example, the Canadians are certainly looking for new markets. We will see more south-south trade. Well
see more horizontal trade as people try to replace over time, U.S. markets.
ODUWOLE: Certainly. Well, the U.S. will remain a strategic trading partner. We have our Commercial Investment Program, which we started in June of this
year, focusing on infrastructure, agriculture and digital trade. But like you said, we are exploring a lot of alternatives.
You'll recall when we discussed at Davos earlier this year, I told you we will be watching the body language and that the world is a big place. We do
have old friends and we certainly are making new friends.
QUEST: If we look at the economy, the Nigerian -- I always -- and you and I have talked about this before, the Nigerian economy is always one of such
enormous potential and one always wonders what it is going to take to reach that potential.
Certainly there have been huge improvements on things like transparency, corruption, you know, reasonable people can sort of say maybe not as much
as there should have been, but at least the movement has been in the right direction.
What more do you think needs to be done to help the Nigerian economy move to that next stage?
ODUWOLE: I always try to make the point, Richard, that the world potential is really quite overflowed when it comes to the Nigerian economy. What is
the Nigerian economy delivering now? A huge market proposition?
When I think about the investors and the amount of attention and attraction we've had, particularly this year, 2025, being an inflection point for this
economy, even the toughest critics will agree that President Bola Ahmed Tinubu has stabilized the economy, ethics, removal of subsidies. And you
know, you've seen our new tax infrastructure coming on board at the beginning of next year. That's a huge overhaul.
So monetary, fiscal and trade policy as well really aligned to deliver value for investors. We've had a lot of interest from different regions
across the world. We are also pushing actively across Africa and the domestic investors supporting them. So we are kind of moving in tandem in
concentric circles. West African region, the rest of Africa and the rest of the world.
QUEST: I am grateful, Minister, you and I need to talk more on QUEST MEANS BUSINESS and certainly we need to be doing one down in Lagos before not too
long. It would be lovely to be there. Thank you. Thank you for joining us tonight.
ODUWOLE: Thank you.
QUEST: Staying in Africa, people from Zambia and Malawi will soon have to post a bond of up to $15,000.00 to enter the United States.
According to the State Department. The pilot project aims to crack down on people who overstay their visas. The new measure will affect tourists and
business travelers from two of the world's poorest nations.
Larry Madowo is with me.
You know, Larry, at first blush, this sort of seems draconian, but it is based on a certain amount of evidence that people from those countries do
overstay their visas numerically more than other countries. So that's the rationale for it. How is it being received down in Nigeria?
LARRY MADOWO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So. Richard, many in Malawi and Zambia and across the continent consider this an effective visa ban. A lot of people
in Malawi and Zambia cannot afford $5,000.00, let alone $15,000.00 as a deposit just to get a U.S. visa.
[16:25:10]
And in the case of Malawi, it is the fourth poorest nation in the world. These are some of the world's poorest nations and Malawians right now only
get a three-month single entry U.S. visa. So if you're a regular traveler to the U.S. for business, you need to be putting up five or ten or fifteen
thousand dollars every time you apply for a visa and it is at the discretion of the visa officer.
And even that use of evidence of visa overstays, this cherry picking data, because Malawi and Zambia don't have the highest rates of visa overstays in
Africa, there are nine countries ahead of them, but this is how the U.S. State Department justifies it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TAMMY BRUCE, STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESPERSON: This targeted common sense measure reinforces the administration's commitment to U.S. Immigration Law
while deterring visa overstays.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MADOWO: So this is another roadblock for Africans looking to travel to the United States. Seven African countries already are under a travel ban.
There is this extra visa entry fee of $250.00, and now an extra five, ten or fifteen thousand , if you are considered at a high risk of visa
overstay. And they, Richard, can only enter or leave the U.S. through three airports -- Boston-Logan, JFK in New York or Washington Dulles. So it is a
very restrictive policy that just a lot of people cannot afford.
QUEST: I wonder, though, what is -- let's move from sort of, if you will, the words to the actions. There is nothing they can do about it. I mean, we
know President Trump has made clear in his previous administration what he thinks of many African nations. You know, you don't need me to remind you
of the phraseology he used. There is not much anyone can do about it. That's the way it is.
MADOWO: Nope, there is not much they can do, and which is the point here that these African countries have limited leverage in negotiating with the
United States. That is why the poor nations of South Sudan and Eswatini were forced to accept criminals, barbaric criminals that the U.S. Homeland
Security Department described them that their own countries refuse to accept them.
Countries like Cuba and Venezuela and other countries from other parts of the world that they ended up in Eswatini and South Sudan, at least in one
instance where an African country did negotiate, Rwanda did manage to agree to accept 250 migrants, but they have the right of refusal. They have to
accept the migrants before they're deported. So maybe they're not getting the criminals.
But in the grand scheme of things, the Africans have limited tools at their disposal in dealing with the mighty United States.
QUEST: Is there a resentment, just briefly, is there resentment on the continent?
MADOWO: There is a great deal of resentment. I've heard this phrase said a lot, that Africa is not a dumping ground for criminals. It is not a dumping
ground for migrants that their own countries will not accept. But under the circumstances, what else can they do -- Richard.
QUEST: Good to have you with us, Larry from Lagos this evening. Grateful. Thank you.
As we continue, Apple is set to announce another major investment in the United States, it's a $100 billion, the money and where it is going to be
spent in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:31:27]
QUEST: Hello, I'm Richard Quest. There's a lot more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. President Trump is preparing to announce another massive U.S. investment
from Apple. We're going to be at the White House in just a moment or three. NASA is fast-tracking plans to put a nuclear reactor on the moon in the
name of space exploration. We'll hear from an astronaut, Leroy Chiao, about the plan.
But only after the headlines because this is CNN, and here, the news comes first.
President Trump says he will double tariffs on India to 50 percent later this month as a punishment for importing Russian oil and gas. As trade
talks between the two countries have stalled already a 25 percent tariff on goods from India is set to go into effect a few hours from now.
Sources are telling us President Trump has told European leaders he intends to meet soon with both President Putin of Russia and President Zelenskyy of
Ukraine. It follows a meeting today between Mr. Putin and the U.S. Special Envoy Steve Witkoff. That meeting took place in Moscow. The President Trump
has described it as highly productive.
Five U.S. Army soldiers have been wounded in a shooting at the Fort Stewart Army Base in Georgia. Officials say the suspected gunman was an active duty
soldier assigned to the base. He is now in custody. The five soldiers wounded have now been taken to hospital.
It is a sizable amount of money. Apple is expected to announce a new investment of $100 billion in the U.S. President Trump will make the
announcement at the White House alongside the CEO Tim Cook. Apple's pledged earlier $500 billion towards things like data centers, chip production,
rare earth magnets, R&D and the like. Shares in Apple were 5 percent up.
Kevin Liptak is at the White House and the CNN media analyst Sara Fischer is also with me.
Just let's clarify first, Kevin, this hundred billion, is this on top of the $500 billion or including the $500?
KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: According to the White House, it is on top of the $500 billion. So bringing the total investments
that they've pledged this year to $600 billion. It's for what the White House is calling an Apple manufacturing program, essentially trying to
build some of their supply chain and bring their supply chain back to the U.S.
I think in reality, it's an attempt to get around some of the tariffs that President Trump has been threatening on companies like Apple that
manufacture so many of their products in Asia. You know, he has had this hot and cold relationship with Tim Cook, who will be here today. I just saw
him walking in the building. He is trying to get Tim Cook to build more iPhones and iPads and Macs in the United States.
It's not clear at all that that's what this investment will do. Apple has said that it's focusing its U.S. investments on building, for example, A.I.
technologies and plants around the U.S. They have said that the U.S. does not have the labor base. You know, the skilled engineering base to build
the products like iPhones in the U.S. and that doing that could potentially cause the cost of iPhones to double.
QUEST: Right.
LIPTAK: And so that's not exactly what they're doing, even if it's what President Trump has been trying to press them to do for the last several
months.
QUEST: Sara, is this real? Is it going to happen? Do you think that it holds water?
SARA FISCHER, CNN MEDIA ANALYST: I definitely think the investment is real in part, Richard, because it's convenient. Apple needs to be making these
investments to stay ahead on the A.I. race and to stay ahead on the software race.
[16:35:03]
You'll take a look at Apple's earnings when it comes to hardware, and that's the thing that they're worried about with those tariffs abroad that
Kevin mentioned. Hardware sales have been slowing for Apple. They need to advance themselves when it comes to software sales. So I definitely think
the advancement in money is real.
What I don't think is real, I don't think, to Kevin's point, you're going to see any sort of U.S. manufacturing of iPhones, of Macs, of iPads any
time soon to disrupt the labor supply chain that they have abroad. Not only would it make iPhones so much more expensive for Americans, but it would
just completely kill Apple's bottom line in a way that they just would not be willing to risk.
QUEST: OK, but, Kevin, the president, and I mean to give him his fair due, he's come out day after day, week after week, companies, whether by
bludgeon, design, willingly, whatever, they are putting money into the United States.
LIPTAK: Yes. And not only companies but countries as well as he negotiates some of these trade deals. You've seen these investment announcements from
the E.U., from Japan. Now the fine print on a lot of those is very unclear. You know, the Japanese investment, the $500 billion investment fund.
QUEST: Right.
LIPTAK: The Japanese are describing it very differently than the way the president has been describing it. But I do think it's an example of how
these entities see a way to make good with President Trump as he wages some of these tariff wars.
QUEST: Right.
LIPTAK: And clearly, it's working in a lot of ways.
QUEST: I am on record as describing many of these trade deals besides the tariff headliners, almost like garbage because they are so wishy-washy on
details.
Sara, if this investment does go into R&D, A.I., if you will, the value added stuff, now that might not produce the jobs that he wants in the
manufacturing, but that is the seed corn for America's next generation of technology leadership.
FISCHER: That's correct. And we know that A.I. is a huge priority for President Trump. It's something that he has prioritized making
relationships with major A.I. companies, CEOs such as Sam Altman, Google's Satya Nadella, et cetera.
I'm glad that you brought up the jobs, though, Richard, because in the earlier announcement this year, the $500 billion announcement, they pledged
20,000 jobs as a part of that. In terms of reports about what we should expect tomorrow there, I don't think, is any plans to pledge any sort of
hiring in the U.S. And when you think about things like data centers, of course they require staffing, but it's not like you need dozens and dozens
of engineers to be managing them. Thousands of engineers.
And so I think that this is a little bit less about bringing American jobs back and more about bringing American ingenuity back. Ultimately, though, I
think it's just a great headline for Donald Trump and he'll settle with that.
QUEST: Sara, I'll say thank you to you for the moment. I'm going to stick with Kevin Liptak.
And so out of the blue, a meeting with Putin, potentially, and just for good measure, Zelenskyy might be there as well. And we heard the rationale
and the reasoning. And what's your gut on this?
LIPTAK: Yes, I think the president will be meeting with Putin sometime very quickly. I'm not sure it's going to happen next week, which is the timeline
that the president left open when he was talking to European counterparts and President Zelenskyy earlier today. That would be an extraordinarily
condensed timeline. You know, I've covered a lot of these summit meetings. They don't come together all that quickly. They don't have a location
nailed down, although they have been discussing a few options.
I think it's pretty clear, though, that President Trump sees an opening here. Something in that meeting, that Witkoff meeting in Moscow with Putin
earlier today, has given him a glimmer of hope that this war can be ended. What exactly that is, it's not clear. You know, Putin has not backed off
any of his maximalist demands to bring this war to an end. But it's very evident that Trump is in a hurry to get this all over with. And he does
want to meet with him very, very quickly.
QUEST: One point I just want to just raise with you. The President Trump we are seeing this time around, yes, of course, he's a lot more focused in
terms of he knows what he wants. It's not like the first administration, but he's also more engaged. If you remember the last administration of
having in his side office, watching television. Back to the residents early. He clearly was not enjoying the job.
This time, from everything were hearing, he's hands on and with it morning until night. Is that true?
LIPTAK: Yes. I mean, I would say he is still watching a lot of television, but I think the difference this time is he kind of knows the areas that he
wants to focus on. And I'm reminded of a conversation I had with an official maybe two months ago. They said the big difference between the
first term and this term is that President Trump doesn't want to wait for things. He doesn't want to wait for the messaging to be all put together.
[16:40:01]
He doesn't want to wait to socialize things with Capitol Hill. When he has his mind set on doing something, he's just going to do it. And you've seen
that kind of play out in the degrees and scenes of chaos that we've seen over the first months. But he is very intent, I think, on following through
on what he wants to do, whether it's building a ballroom on the South Lawn or trying to broker an end to the war in Ukraine. He's just going to do it
and sort of let the pieces fall where they may.
QUEST: Kevin, Kevin Liptak at the White House, grateful.
This is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. I'm very glad to have you with us tonight.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: The drugmaker Novo Nordisk is warning of job cuts as competition to its weight loss drug, Wegovy, is heating up. It's part of why the company
has slashed its profit forecast. The shares in New York have dropped 35 percent over the last two weeks, and could face even more pressure from
threatened tariffs up to 250 percent.
Anna Cooban joins me from London.
A lot of this problem, as I understand it, is because of compounding. This is where in the U.S. people are making the drug or it's being made off
license or off label in a sense. And therefore it's eating into their profits. And also the ability to get this drug through national health
services. Tell me more.
ANNA COOBAN, CNN BUSINESS AND ECONOMICS CORRESPONDENT: Well, that was exactly the issue that Novo Nordisk has been spotlighting. So it's slashed
its profit forecasts last week down from what it expects to be a -- well, used to expect it to be a 24 percent increase in sales for this year down
to a 16 percent increase in sales.
Now, for any or for most companies, that sounds pretty robust, like pretty robust growth. But you have to remember that this company has been really
reigning supreme in this market for a number of years. But as you said, they are now really butting up against competition not only from rival drug
maker like Eli Lilly in the U.S., with its other weight loss drug, but also pharmacies that have been, as you say, compounding so essentially taking
similar ingredients, the same ingredients that are found in Ozempic and Wegovy and creating cheaper copycat drugs.
[16:45:12]
QUEST: The answer is what? Because a lot of the other manufacturers aren't being hit with the same problems. A lot of the other weight loss
manufacturers don't have that issue, or at least don't have it to the same extent. So what are they doing that Novo isn't?
COOBAN: As in what is Novo Nordisk doing that --
QUEST: Well, what I'm saying is, what do they do about this?
COOBAN: Well, what Novo Nordisk is trying to do is actually -- is going through legal channels. So they've launched various lawsuits against
pharmacies, against companies that they believe to be compounding in a way that is against the rules. So basically, the FDA has allowed for a short
period of time pharmacies to be creating these copycat drugs because there were shortages of Ozempic and Wegovy in the U.S.
But the acute shortages are now over. And so the FDA has given an end of May deadline for pharmacies to stop these copycats. But today, Novo Nordisk
came out to say that it expects that around a million Americans are still being prescribed, still using these copycats. So they're coming after them
through legal channels. And they're also today saying that they might cut jobs and finding other ways to cut costs.
QUEST: Anna, Anna Cooban in London. Grateful. Thank you.
QUEST MEANS BUSINESS tonight, NASA is fast-tracking plans to put a nuclear reactor on the moon. And that's before Russia or China can beat them to it,
in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: NASA is fast-tracking plans to put a nuclear reactor on the moon, and it's all in the name of space exploration. The NASA acting director has
announced that he's planning to do this. Sean Duffy says China and Russia have similar plans and could declare parts of the moon off limits. The
newly announced plan does not have a specified completion date.
Leroy Chiao is the retired NASA astronaut.
It's hard enough to build a nuclear reactor on earth. How on earth do they hope to do it in -- on the moon?
LEROY CHIAO, RETIRED NASA ASTRONAUT: This is not the first effort to make nuclear reactors for space. Of course, we've had not exactly reactors but
we've had plutonium sources that have provided energy for spacecraft, just like the Voyagers, which are still going, by the way, all these years, over
50 years later.
[16:50:05]
But this is a great idea because you want to put a small modular reactor similar to the ones being developed for the earth right now. And if you can
put some of those on the moon, that's a great power source solar panels, while simple, they have their drawbacks, especially in space and on the
moon. On the moon, depending on where you are, you're going to have about two weeks of day and then two weeks of night where it gets very cold,
right?
And so a reactor that can provide enough power to keep everything warm and alive through the night, that's going to be a huge advantage.
QUEST: The difficulty of getting these modules there installed and operational will be what?
CHIAO: Well, the idea of these small modular reactors is that they're going to be relatively simple compared to what we usually think of as an
earthbound nuclear reactor. And when I say small, I mean, they're, you know, they're measured in meters, right? Kind of a cubic, you know, in
cubic meters.
QUEST: Right.
CHIAO: Rather than in acres for a traditional power plant. Of course, these are much smaller. These are 100 kilowatt plants as opposed to a gigawatt
plant on the ground. Right? And so you would launch the whole thing in one piece and, you know, have it put down on the moon and then go through a
self-activation. So, you know, in principle, it sounds pretty simple. But of course the devil is in the details.
QUEST: And the ability with the Russians and the Chinese probably trying to do the same thing. I mean, if it's good for one, then they'll all want to
do it for the same reasons. This idea that if someone gets there first, they could prevent others. Is that valid?
CHIAO: Well, the idea is if you put something like a nuclear reactor on the moon and then you declare kind of a safe zone saying, hey, within certain
kilometers or whatever of this reactor, you know, that's a danger zone and we would want everyone else to keep out of it, right? And so, in a way,
you're kind of staking a claim, you know, by putting something like a nuclear reactor down. So that is the concern or a concern of what Sean
Duffy was talking about is if Russia and or China put these things down.
They can declare these zones almost like claiming them. Right? And so we want to be able to do that before they get a chance to.
QUEST: Going back to the moon, which, as I understand it and put me right, please, the logic is we've got to go there first to really learn more about
long-term space habitation before we can embark to Mars and -- or wherever else we might want to go, because we've no -- we actually know quite a lot
about the moon.
CHIAO: Well, we do know a lot about the moon from the Apollo missions and unmanned missions before and after by not only us, but also by Russia, by
China and others. And so we do know a fair amount about the moon. But what we want to do before we launch things to Mars, because Mars is so far away,
the moon is the perfect place to develop and test hardware and even train astronauts to work in those kinds of reduced atmosphere, reduce gravity,
and very dusty environments.
The reason being, it's only three days away, right? If you have an issue, you can get your crew back in three days. Mars, on the other hand, is half
again as far away from the sun as the earth. And even when the planets are aligned, we typically talk about six-month one-way trips, right? So if you
have an issue, it's going to take you over a year to get your crew back. So you want to make sure everything is going to work.
So the moon is a great place to develop and test all that and train people up on these kinds of missions.
QUEST: Who will be first to go to the moon -- to Mars, do you think? Will it be somebody like a private organization, like an Elon Musk funded and
run? Will it be a governmental? Will it be China? Who do you think is going to be first on the way to Mars?
CHIAO: Well, I think SpaceX has made it clear they're going to Mars with or without anyone else. And ideally they would partner with NASA as they've
been partnering on the International Space Station. And in fact, of course, SpaceX has a contract to build a lunar lander based on its Starship
technology. So in an ideal case, we would leverage SpaceX's ability to innovate and to pivot very quickly, along with NASA's long history of
operational excellence and technical know-how.
QUEST: Right. Good to see you, sir. Thank you very much. Book me a ticket. And I look forward to being on board. Thank you, sir.
Now finally tonight, forget tariffs and sanctions. There's one bit of news and a date we've been anticipating at QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for the past
nine months.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: I have to ask.
ANNA STEWART, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I mean, I was wondering if anyone could see the wall behind my back.
QUEST: How long?
[16:55:01]
STEWART: I've still got another five or six weeks.
QUEST: This is maybe the last time I'll see you before the event.
STEWART: Of my own deadline.
QUEST: This will be the last time you and I will speak before the event. Godspeed, my dear.
STEWART: The big deadline.
QUEST: Everything goes well. Everything goes well.
STEWART: Thank you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Well, the event came. Anna and her husband have welcomed their baby girl Antigone. Antigone. I knew I was going to get that wrong. Now you've
got to try and learn how to spell it. Antigone. Last Wednesday. The family is all doing well, and Anna has got -- just look at that. Absolutely
wonderful. Best news of the week. The month so far.
Wall Street posted gains. She's not going to let me forget when she -- when she sees the video of me doing Antigone. I'm in deep trouble. Absolutely
deep trouble.
Gains. Gains. Gains. Growing U.S. trade pressure on India. The Dow closed 82 points higher, driven by a handful of positive earnings. McDonalds beats
on sales. It's up nearly 3 percent. Apple is up 5 percent. It's now just announcing this. And Disney is in the red. It's giving the NFL an equity
stake in the sports network ESPN.
A "Profitable Moment" after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Tonight's "Profitable Moment," when I've been in Africa talking to U.S. officials, they're very quick to point out how important Africa as a
continent is to the United States. But unfortunately, actions speak louder than words. And the idea of sending off immigrants to Sudan, the worst and
the criminals that nobody else will take, or indeed, as charging visas for up to 15,000 in deposits and high visa fees for people to come to the
United States, actions speak much louder than words.
And the reality is the perception in Africa is that the United States has now become very Africa unfriendly in a sense. A raft of policies now put in
place basically tells the continent they're not welcome to visit. Their business is not particularly welcome either. And frankly, the way the
tariffs regime has been put against Africa, some of the poorest countries in the world, well, they're not welcome to that, too.
It's going to take some time ultimately for the United States to repair that damage if they choose to do so. But for the moment, the message from
the United States seems to be, where does the biggest beast in the world sit? Wherever it wants to.
And that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight. I'm Richard Quest in New York. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, I hope it's profitable. I'll see
you tomorrow.
END
