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Quest Means Business

Trump: Expect Good Meeting with Putin Tomorrow; Poroshenko: Kyiv's Sanctions on Me are a Political Move; Michelin-Starred Eleven Madison Park to Serve Meat Again; Interview with Latvian President Edgars Rinkevics; State of the Russian Economy on Eve of Alaska Summit; OpenAI's Rocky Rollout of GPT-5. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired August 14, 2025 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:10]

RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS": That's Meridian Equity, closing bell ringing on Wall Street. There you go. Start

'em young. That's what I say. Imbue them with capitalism right from the beginning and learn -- oh, and a good day, well, come on one -- oh, no,

sir. Do be careful hitting it so closely to the head. Please!

Could it be four? My goodness. Let the children have a go. Could it be an accident in the home? There they are. They're going to have a go. No,

they're not. Look at what the market has done. The market has been down. Then it came back. Now it looks like were just off a few points at the

close.

The markets, and there are so many events of the day that we need to put together on the eve of the Alaska Summit between Misters Trump and Putin.

Tonight on this program, the former Ukrainian President Poroshenko tells me his nation is keeping his fingers crossed for a ceasefire.

There is a backlash over ChatGPT. Users are complaining that its latest release has a poor personality and makes basic errors. I will tell you

about my experience with train times.

And the end of a great vegan experience -- experiment. The chef at Eleven Madison Park told me why he is putting meat back on the menu.

We are live in New York. It is Thursday. It is August, the 14th. I am Richard Quest and I mean business.

Good evening.

We begin with President Trump telling us he expects to have a good meeting with President Vladimir Putin of Russia. Give or take 24 hours to go before

they are due to meet in Anchorage, Alaska, and the U.S. President says he believes the peace between Mr. Putin and Ukraine's President Zelenskyy is

possible. He said it in the Oval Office when Mr. Trump said if things go well in Alaska, he will broker another meeting between the two or he will

broker a meeting, I should be more correct, accurate between the two meetings.

If he can get them in the same room at the same time, he believes that could bring the war to a close.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: We have a meeting with President Putin tomorrow. I think it is going to be a good

meeting, but the more important meeting will be the second meeting that we are having. We are going to have a meeting with President Putin, President

Zelenskyy, myself, and maybe we will bring some of the European leaders along, maybe not. I don't know, but it is going to be very important. We

are going to see what happens.

And I think President Putin will make peace. I think President Zelenskyy will make peace. We will see if they can get along and if they can, it will

be great.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

QUEST: Jim Sciutto is in Alaska.

Jim, good to see you, sir.

So this first meeting, President Trump has been very keen to emphasize, it is not about -- this first meeting is really just seeing what is possible,

and as he puts it, to, look, President Putin in the eye and tell him, you know, you don't do this and there will be some serious repercussions for

you from the United States.

JIM SCIUTTO CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yes, you know, Richard, I think the big question for the summit tomorrow is who has

moved more? Putin or Trump? Who has moved from their central positions is Putin ready to move off his maximalist positions, which are really were to

take all of Ukraine? Has Trump truly changed in terms of how he sees Putin?

We've seen some evolution over the last several weeks where Trump seems to be demanding more, seems more skeptical of Putin. He said that he says

that, he says that he has been frustrated, et cetera. Will he walk into the room and hear something he hasn't heard from Putin before, which is, well,

yes, actually, I am not going to go for the whole country. I am willing to give this much. Or is it possible that Trump has run out of patience with

this war and is going to apply more pressure on Ukraine to give up more of its territory to Putin to bring this to an end.

That's a real question and it is not clear because Trump has been such a moving target on Ukraine, as you know, going back years.

QUEST: So the reality is, and as we will hear later in our program, others like former President Poroshenko and others, they are worried that a land

for peace deal is going to be imposed upon Zelenskyy. But Trump is a realist. He knows he has to take people with him.

He is also -- you know, he does know his history and he knows that land for peace doesn't often work.

SCIUTTO: Well, Richard, here is the problem here, right? Is that sometimes President Trump's descriptions of this war are closer to Putin's than to

Europe's, right?

[16:05:12]

I mean, he repeats, even in his comments earlier this afternoon or this morning, Washington time said that all sides share blame in this war, that

includes Ukraine. He will not say and has not said Russia invaded, Russia is the aggressor.

At times, you'll hear Trump describe the territory Russia now occupies in Ukraine and he will say, well, Russia lost a lot of good men, a lot of good

soldiers for that territory, not acknowledging that Russia invaded and took that land by force.

So the question is, does he then take that view and turn to Zelenskyy and say, you've got to give up this land, by the way, you share some

responsibility for losing that -- for losing that land. That's an open question. And I do here, as you do, Richard, that fear from Ukrainian

members of Parliament and others who fear that Trump will apply more pressure on them than on Putin to end this war.

QUEST: Just a by word question, what's the weather like in Alaska? What are they flying into? Because Putin is flying across from Moscow.

SCIUTTO: You're right. That's a good question.

QUEST: You know, halfway --

SCIUTTO: It is chilly, it is cloudy. It has been a little rainy today. We were just speaking to someone who was saying it might clear. And if it does

clear, then you'll get a much better view of those mountains behind me than you have right now.

QUEST: Thank you, Jim. Lovely day in New York. Thank you. Good to see you, sir.

Now, Ukraine's former President Petro Poroshenko told me he is optimistic about the chances for a ceasefire, but he gave great detail about what he

expects from the meetings.

Poroshenko was elected in 2014 after Russia annexed Crimea and pro-Kremlin separatists declared independence in the East. He visited President Trump

in 2017, successfully resolved that conflict, and of course, eight years later, the things got worse.

The former President Poroshenko told me earlier Putin wants to take all of Ukraine, but Kyiv and its allies have ways to pressure him. I asked him

what his meeting would be ahead of tomorrow's meeting.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PETRO POROSHENKO, FORMER UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT: President Trump is a deal maker, and that would be not an easy job to have a negotiation with Putin,

who is a troublemaker. But I am an optimistic.

Richard, if you can imagine what's going on now here in Ukraine, all nation keeping fingers crossed, everybody count that we will reach the ceasefire

and I hope that Trump will deliver the position of the collective team, including Ukraine, including the European countries and including the

people of United States to Putin, I know that we can reach that.

QUEST: Do you fear that somehow Putin and Trump will come together with some deal? But that the Europeans will then have a hard decision whether to

go along with it or to give more aid and support to Ukraine? I guess I am asking, what do you want from the Europeans?

POROSHENKO: We should act unitedly. We have more than enough instrument to make a pressure on Putin, and I want to hear so-called theory of the Plan B

if Putin do not accept the demand to stop the war and to declare a ceasefire, it should be Plan B, which consists number one, weapon to

Ukraine. This is not only defensive weapon, I want to remind you that our first defensive weapon, I, as the President of Ukraine, received from

President Trump in the year 2017, but offensive weapon, long range missile that Putin understands that he will pay for this rejecting very high price.

Point number two, sanctions, including secondary sanctions, which stops Putin's ability to finance the war and he should have no any illusion that

he can buy his art of blah, blah, blah can postpone or suspend this sanction.

Point number three, this is the using of the assets -- frozen assets to support financial system, not for the account of the taxpayers money, but

for the Russian frozen assets.

Point number four, this is the security guarantee and the best security guarantee, no matter if would be member of NATO or not, Article V of NATO,

very similar with a Finnish style of the security guarantee before Finland start to be a member is absolutely excellent example.

[16:10:12]

And point number five, this is a support of reform, democracy and freedom of Ukraine because we need to have free and democratic country, not very

similar to Russia, autocratic.

QUEST: Let's talk about the fact that your current status, there are sanctions against you. There are a variety of investigations. And of

course, there is this Martial Law concerning traveling abroad.

You've said you want many of these restrictions, these martial law restrictions to be lifted so that you are freer to speak and to travel and

to be part of the process. Are you confident that President Zelenskyy will relent?

POROSHENKO: First of all, the whole world now with the decision of European Parliament, the decision of European Commission; with decision of the

Parliamentary Assembly Council of Europe, all the legal opinion said that this is unconstitutional extrajudicial sanction, illegal with a political

motivation, and the motivation for that was just to remove the political opponent and me, as a leader of the opposition.

We are now having absolutely no doubt, sanction immediately and now should be cancelled because this is an attack on the democracy.

The limits for the public activist, for the journalist, for any other limitation of democracy, just manipulated with the Martial Law should be

immediately lifted, including the stop for the travel opportunity and parliamentary diplomacy because with that situation, this is harmful for

Ukraine.

QUEST: Donald trump always says -- and you negotiated with him and you know him, Donald Trump always says that if he had won the last election, the one

he lost to Biden, that this was a war that should never have started, this war would never have started. Do you believe that to be true? And also, do

you believe if you had still been President, you would have been able to stave off Putin?

POROSHENKO: I hate the idea to command what would be if something happened, but I want to deliver you the information.

During my presidency, when Ukraine, since year 2014, do not have an army, a modern Armed Forces, we had a zero army capability, we do not have money.

We do not have a coalition. We have just a united team. And I have an honor to be the president of Ukraine, we avoid to the full size war for more than

five years, and this is, Chinese, it seems to me said that the winner is not those who win the war, but those who avoid the war.

And I am very much proud that during my presidency, we avoid using Minsk Agreement, using the position of our partner of the United States, of NATO,

we avoid the war. And this is just a demonstration that this is the art of diplomacy.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: Former Ukrainian President Poroshenko talking to me.

Now, the chief executive of Royal Caribbean, the cruise line will be after the break. He is aboard the company's new icon class cruise ship, the Star

of the Seas, which set sails this week. It is similar size to Icon of the Seas, there are differences, but it brings to a question of course, the

future of the cruise industry and the CEO, the man to answer will be with us after the break.

QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:16:39]

QUEST: The head chef of Eleven Madison Park says they are not going back to their old ways, but they are making a sizable change.

The post-pandemic vegan restaurant famously so, says that from October, some meat products are going to return to the menu. Three Michelin stars

made international headlines when it announced after the pandemic it would go fully vegan. Now I had a chance to try part of the menu last year.

You'll remember, I sat down with Chef Daniel Humm. He told me, removing meat products was more sustainable and allowed for more creativity.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DANIEL HUMM, CHEF, ELEVEN MADISON PARK: Creatively, I knew we could create a meal that was fully plant based, that was just as exquisite as before. I

think, it was also around the question of luxury and some of the things we perceive as luxurious are old ideas. And when we really looked into it,

they're not so luxurious anymore.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

QUEST: That was then.

Now, the chef says the restaurant is not financially sustainable as vegan only, and so he is bringing back meat products that he hopes will attract a

wider type of diner. He told me in an exclusive interview, they learned a lot from removing animal products and plant based will remain a priority,

but there will be animals on the menu.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

HUMM: We created a whole new language of food. Like we created milfoil without butter. We made ricotta with fermented almond milk. We made stocks

with Koji.

QUEST: But, but, but, but --

HUMM: We, today I feel like -- I've been anxious about the announcement. What people are going to say? Are they going to say he is a hypocrite? But

what I've learned is that, to truly push plant based cooking forward is to have a restaurant where everyone feels welcome at the table.

And I think the most hospitable way of doing that is to offer a choice, because at the core of what a restaurant is, that's the main goal, having

people eating together.

QUEST: I understand the rationale now, and the way I was reading it, you know, it is more inclusive if everyone can eat and not everybody wants to

eat a plant-based menu. How far was it driven by commercial reasons? After all, you know, the Q is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.

How far was it commercial?

HUMM: Yes, definitely. I think, you know, in the pandemic, the restaurant was shut down. I reconnected with the language of food very deeply, and it

felt like there was a moment to make a change.

I think my naivete proved to be an asset in this time, because if I would have known everything, I would have known now, I would have never had the

courage to do it.

QUEST: Right. So what was naivete has become reality in a sense.

HUMM: I think, you know what I didn't realize was that for a lot of people going to a plant-based restaurant wasn't a choice of cuisine, but it was

like a life's choice. And I thought it would be like, oh, let's have Italian or lets have Japanese tonight.

[16:20:18]

But it was a much deeper choice, and today I understand food is entangled in identity and people's beliefs.

QUEST: I am very impressed in the sense that you didn't let pride get in the way because you knew you were going to take a lot of crap from people

when you announced this.

You know --

HUMM: I mean --

QUEST: It is a famous restaurant. It is one of New York's most famous restaurants. You took an extremely brave, courageous decision, as they say,

after the pandemic. And now you're arguably taking another courageous -- you didn't let pride get in the way.

HUMM: Well, I just feel like we exhausted this chapter so much and as a creative, it started to be closing in rather than opening up, and I want to

open paths and not close paths.

QUEST: Have you decided then what the genre of food will be? Are we going back to good French rich sauces?

HUMM: We are definitely not going back to glazing all the vegetables in butter, the mandatory chicken stock or demiglace or creme anglaise. Our

cooking has fundamentally changed. It has gotten better and more unique for it. We've made incredible progress and now I am excited to reintroduce some

animal products because we are also going to do it with a new way, with a different way.

QUEST: So will you incentivize plant-based? You know, by making that bit of the menu cheaper? Or if you go plant based, its only X, if you want me to,

then, it is going to cost you more. We are going to do this.

Something tells me you're not going to do that.

HUMM: Well, it has proven to us that cooking with vegetables has actually been expensive, but to your question about the finance of this whole thing,

we've been very successful filling our dining room, but it was hard. It proved to be hard to sell a corporate dinner for 30 or 50 people with a

strictly vegan menu. It is a very hard sell. And I think we all know that the margins for restaurants are razor thin. Private events is a lifeline.

So that has been definitely very challenging.

We have a team of over 200 employees, and for me to continue this mission, the business has to be financially sustainable. It is also line

aficionados. They think Grand Cru goes with meat, and so we definitely also have attracted less of that and wine sales as we know, is another important

part of running a restaurant in New York City in a prime location.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: That's Daniel Humm, the CEO, and of course, the head chef at Eleven Madison.

Now, Royal Caribbean has launched the second of its icon class cruise ships this week, the Star of the Seas. It is the sister ship to Icon of the Seas,

and they are essentially the two largest ever built. Anywhere between 5,000 to 7,000 passengers and all sorts of people on board.

Royal Caribbean says customers are responding to its offer of unique ships and destinations. Look at the share price. About 35 percent so far, year-

to-date and dramatically up from the pandemic.

Jason Liberty is the Chief Executive of Royal Caribbean. He is aboard the new ship, which is docked at the Bahamas.

Jason, it is good to see you.

I mean, this vast ship. You know, look when I've been in Miami and I've driven along the causeway and I pass Icon of the Seas, there is nothing

like the size of these. There are some who don't like them, there are those who love them, but there is no getting away from that fact, these new ships

have revolutionized the industry.

JASON LIBERTY, CHIEF EXECUTIVE, ROYAL CARIBBEAN: Yes, well, first, Richard, thank you for having me. I am here on Star of the Seas and we are also

docked here today at our private destination, perfect day at CocoCay in the Bahamas. And hopefully, Richard, when you were driving along the Causeway,

you were also drooling on wanting to have an opportunity to actually go out and experience the wonderful vacations that we deliver, and that Star of

the Seas gets delivered.

[16:25:02]

It is a large ship, that's for sure, but it is also a ship that delivers endless memories and experiences to many, many different segments of

generations.

QUEST: One of the interesting things about the segmenting of cruise ships now, of course, you also have Silver Seas, which are smaller ships, higher

end in a sense and I think that the segmenting of cruises is one of the key trends that you're going to see in the future, and that you may indeed have

to start subdividing brands more.

Is that something you're looking at?

LIBERTY: Yes, well, certainly what we try to do is be the leaders in each one of our segments. And so, Richard, as you commented, you know, we try to

lead or we lead in family. We lead in this premium, elevated space with Celebrity and also with Silver Sea. And the reality of it is, is the

consumer is looking for a more tailored experience based off of the vacation that they're looking for. And you see this segmentation also

occurring on land, which ultimately is what we are trying to do, is to more and more close the gap to land based vacation.

QUEST: Somewhat controversially, you made a change to the drinks policy aboard the ships. Now, when a passenger buys an all-inclusive, one of the

upper level packages, they must buy the same package for everyone in the cabin who is of legal drinking age, even if they have no intention of

drinking. In the past, as you know, there was exemptions to the rule.

You say too many people were abusing the policy, so you abolished it. But let's take me and my husband, I don't drink, he does. We now both have to

buy the package.

LIBERTY: Yes, well, I think you hit on the key point. One of the things that we've seen with our beverage package is a significant rise in the

abuse of the policy. So what we are doing is we are looking to see how do we address that. We've currently kind of paused the exceptions, but in

reality, you know, Richard, you know, we are -- no two guests or no guests is the same. No situation is the same. We are incredible listeners because

that listening helps us deliver these -- you know, the best vacation experiences in the world.

And so, it is something that we -- you know, that we continue to evaluate on how do we be able to manage it, especially after we saw such a rise in

the abuse of the policy.

QUEST: Understood, sir, over tourism, that's one word for it, but managing tourism, the cruise industry is at the forefront of criticism in many ways

when large numbers of ships arrive in Dubrovnik or Venice or wherever, and we've seen more and more cities banning or restricting numbers.

Now I get it that you want to get ahead of the criticism. So how far -- what proposals do you think the industry needs to come forward with to

manage the growth of cruise industry, bearing in mind the status quo is unsustainable?

LIBERTY: Sure. Well, first and foremost, we are really trying to focus on how do we improve the communities that support us all around the world. We

go to a thousand different destinations, across our brands.

One of the key ways to help you know, deal with some of this concentration is to diversify where our ships go. And so we are keenly focused, not just

as a company, but also, I think as an industry to diversify, where the ships go and also how to play with different hours of the day to alleviate

some of that congestion, but also at the same time ensure that those communities are also prospering. The one I would thing I would say about

the cruise industry and some of this concentration is that it is -- you know, the cruise industry is more visible because the ships come in, but

the cruise industry is a very small pebble in all the sand of travel.

And so, you know, you know, we are trying to do our part by diversifying where we go and, and, and how we interact in those destinations.

QUEST: Thank you, Jason, for joining us. Next time we speak, let's be on board together.

LIBERTY: Sounds great.

QUEST: Looking forward to that. Thank you very much, sir. Beautiful ship.

As I say, I've seen the Icon and now looking forward to seeing the Stars. Thank you sir.

QUEST MEANS BUSINESS tonight from New York as Donald Trump and Vladimir Putin prepare to meet in Anchorage, Alaska, a very popular cruise

destination as well, I might add, but they won't be on a cruise ship. But I will be speaking to the President of Latvia. His thoughts -- there he is --

Mr. President, we will hear your thoughts on the path to peace in Ukraine and the worries that you have.

It is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:32:49]

QUEST: You're very welcome. A lot more Quest Means Business together. We're a day away from the Putin-Trump summit. And the president of Latvia will be

with me in a moment to lay out the stakes for the Baltic Nations. OpenAI says its latest version of ChatGPT has PhD level expertise. I shall start

calling it Dr. ChatGPT. So why is it making so many simple mistakes?

We'll get to all of those mistakes and more only after the headlines because this is CNN and on this network, the news always comes first.

President Trump believes Russian President Vladimir Putin is going to make a deal when the two meet on Friday in Alaska. The U.S. president says he

hopes to broker a meeting between Mr. Putin and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy, and that, of course, may include other European

leaders. He says he wasn't sure.

Britain is condemning Israel's plan to advance a highly controversial settlement in the occupied West Bank. It's calling it a flagrant breach of

international law. The Israeli Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich says the - - on settlement will permanently bury the idea of a Palestinian state, effectively splitting the West Bank in two.

The U.S. state of Tennessee is dealing with the aftermath of a deadly severe weather. The death toll is now four. Emergency crews found the body

of a man who'd been swept away by flood waters. Two victims include two adults and a child, and their car was crushed by a falling tree.

The U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio says Mr. Trump hopes to make some progress towards a ceasefire in Ukraine when he meets his Russian

counterpart. President Trump predicts the meeting has a 25 percent chance of failure, though he says Putin is going to make a deal. Also saying the

potential meeting that he hopes to broker between Mr. Putin and Mr. Zelenskyy could involve other European leaders. A member of the Russian

delegation heading to Alaska says the meeting is a step in the right direction.

[16:35:05]

Fred Pleitgen spoke to the Kremlin's economic envoy, Kirill Dmitriev, who talked to him in Moscow.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: President Trump has threatened severe consequences if there's no movement towards a

ceasefire. What's Russia hoping to get out of this meeting?

KIRILL DMITRIEV, KREMLIN ENVOY: Well, I think dialogue is very important, and I think it's a very positive meeting for the world because during Biden

administration, no dialogue was happening. So I think it's very important to hear Russian position directly. And there's lots of misunderstandings,

misinformation about the Russian position. And it's also a chance to sort of reset if the meeting goes well U.S.-Russia relations.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

QUEST: Latvia is one of the European nations watching closely for obvious reasons, sharing a vast border with Russia. You can see there. It's been

steadfast supporter of Ukraine. Latvia and other Baltic Nations insist peace can only come through consistent pressure on Russia to halt the war.

The Latvian president joins me now live from Riga.

Mr. President, whichever way we dress it up, the fundamental fear in Europe is that there'll be some spheres of influence carved up and pressure will

be brought to bear on Mr. Zelenskyy to give up land. You believe that would be a serious mistake.

EDGARS RINKEVICS, LATVIAN PRESIDENT: Well, thank you very much for having me. And first of all, I do hope that the meeting between President Trump

and Mr. Putin is going to bring a ceasefire. But when it comes to the long- term solution, just peace, then of course it is very important that President Zelenskyy and Ukraine is at the table and not on the table.

So I do believe that if we get a ceasefire and then we move towards meaningful discussions, then most probably we can have the kind of peace we

are talking, whether there is going to be a kind of territorial concessions. I do believe that's up to the Ukrainian people to decide.

QUEST: But do you believe that territorial concessions would be a mistake in rewarding aggression?

RINKEVICS: Well, indeed, I do believe that if we talk about some kind of territorial swap or concessions, then of course this can be seen as a

reward. At the same time the discussions that we have had in recent days at various levels, including President Trump, shows that he understands and

U.S. administration understands all the complexity, understands also the difficulties. There has been a very good, very frank discussion among

European leaders.

And I do hope that we will not see rushed decisions and that the process is going to be moving in a direction that would actually satisfy also the

Ukrainian side.

QUEST: President Poroshenko on this program a short while ago said that if the talks don't go well, if, and obviously everybody goes into it hoping

they will, but if they don't, there has to be a plan B, and that would require greater support, selling of arms, greater financial support,

greater commitment from the European Union. Are you prepared to put that forward at the European Council?

RINKEVICS: Yes, absolutely. I think that if we don't see the progress on the part of Russia, then definitely two points are very relevant here. One

is additional tariffs or sanctions against Russia and another more arms, more support for Ukraine. And actually we are talking here both NATO and

E.U.

QUEST: And the sequestration of Russian funds and being used to pay for both those missiles or that weaponry and costs of the war, you would be in

favor of that as well?

RINKEVICS: Absolutely. Actually, Latvian government, myself, have advocated for that for I think two or three years already since actually the war

started. And we do believe that would be the right decision if we see that there is no progress in the talks in Alaska. But let's wait and see how

those talks between President Trump and Mr. Putin are going to develop.

QUEST: See, the problem for Europe is that when the crisis happens, the Europeans always seem rather surprised that the worst case or a bad outcome

is coming their way. And when you look, for example, at the inability to get Hungary on board, I worry or question whether essentially the E.U. is

going to be looking for a coalition of the willing to do the hard lifting here.

[16:40:14]

RINKEVICS: Well, you know, at the end of the day, if you look at the history of decision-making in the European Union, all 27, and I want to

stress here, all 27 E.U. member states agree, yes, we have some drama. Yes, we have some issues. But at the end of the day, decisions are taken.

However, to speed up processes, yes, we have also the format that has been created. Coalition of the willing.

And if we can't do things fast enough at the European Union level, then we should of course use other instruments. But let's currently concentrate on

what the summit in Alaska is going to produce in coming actually two days. It's not very much left to wait for. However, I would say that I agree with

you that, of course, we also need to be prepared for any outcome, the positive one, but also the negative one, or so-called plan B as well.

QUEST: Mr. President, it's late in Riga, although I suspect you're used to these long and late hours. But I'm grateful that you've joined us tonight

on QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. Thank you, sir.

RINKEVICS: Thank you very much.

QUEST: And staying with this, of course, President Trump is threatening serious consequences if Russia doesn't come round to a deal. Tighter

sanctions, as you just heard the Latvian president talking about, are one of the options.

So what's that likely to look like? Here's CNN's Anna Cooban.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANNA COOBAN, CNN BUSINESS AND ECONOMICS CORRESPONDENT: When Russia invaded Ukraine in 2022, Western countries rushed to respond with tough economic

measures, targeting everything from trade to finance.

Russia is now the most sanctioned major economy in the world. And this had an instant economic impact. You can see that just after the invasion in

2022, Russian GDP plunged and Moscow was forced to take emergency measures to keep its economy going. Since then, the Russian economy has managed to

recover. But that's really down to two major factors.

So firstly, the country really switched to a wartime economy. Military spending has more than doubled since before the invasion and now accounts

for about 7 percent of Russian GDP. And then when Europe began sanctioning Russian energy in 2022, Russia focused on selling its barrels of oil to

Asia. China has bought around 47 percent of Russia's crude exports, while India has bought around 38 percent, with the oil and gas sector still

accounting for around one-fifth of Russian GDP.

Now the average Russian has been hit by shortages of Western goods, travel restrictions and rising prices but they have adapted. Copycat Western

brands have emerged, and a wartime surge in production has meant that unemployment is at a record low. But there are concerns that Russia's

apparent economic strength is actually just a mirage. In June, Russia's economy minister warned of a possible recession.

And it's that economic weakness that President Trump is capitalizing on when he threatens additional sanctions on Russia and those who purchase

Russian energy.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: What will those consequences be?

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: There will be consequences.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Sanctions, tariffs?

TRUMP: There will -- I don't have to say. There will be very severe consequences. Yes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOBAN: Analysts say that one of Putin's key aims in the Alaska talks will be to do just enough to avoid these additional sanctions. Expectations of a

peace deal are a way off.

Anna Cooban, CNN, London.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: As you and I continue our nightly conversation, economics, an ambitious plan to help South African fish thrive in its native waters once

again.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:46:59]

QUEST: They were once so plentiful. The annual migration churned the water into waves. It is the Clanwilliam sandfish and it's endemic to South

Africa's Western Cape. The problem is they've been declined for rapid for decades.

Well, today on "Call the Earth," we're going to meet the conservationists helping to restore this endangered species.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ZAIN ASHER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): From the nets and buckets, this may look like a fishing expedition. But Jeremy Shelton and Cecilia Cerilla

aren't here to haul in a big catch. They're here to save South Africa's disappearing sandfish.

DR. JEREMY SHELTON, CONSERVATION BIOLOGIST, FRESHWATER RESEARCH CENTRE: In South Africa freshwater fishes are the most threatened species group, and

the sandfish is the most endangered migratory fish. There's not just one threat. It's a combination of invasive species, water abstraction and

habitat degradation.

ASHER: This is the Biedouw, a tributary of the Doring River, it's one of the last known places where sandfish come to spawn.

SHELTON: After spawning the Biedouw is literally pulsing with baby sandfish, but within a few weeks, those numbers start to decrease. We have

invasive fish like bass and bluegill moving in, eating a lot of them. So what we're doing is coming in and rescuing as many of those little sandfish

as possible before they perish, moving them into sandfish sanctuaries where they can grow safely to adulthood, and then we can release them back into

the wild.

ASHER: A few years ago, young sandfish were introduced to this former agricultural dam turned sanctuary located at Bushman's Kloof Wilderness

Reserve.

SHELTON: This is the first time we've come back to this dam since 2021, and we set fyke nets, which are a passive way to collect fish from an aquatic

environment.

CECILIA CERRILLA, PHD CANDIDATE, UNIVERSITY OF CAPE TOWN: Here at Bushman's Kloof, we've got two sandfish sanctuary dams, and the fish in these dams

are happy they grow big.

ASHER: The nets will be left overnight to capture as many adult fish as possible to release back into their native waters.

SHELTON: We want mature fish coming out of these sanctuaries at a size where they are big enough to avoid being eaten by the invasive fish old

enough to breed themselves.

ASHER: A sunrise start for the team as they return to the sanctuary to check their nets.

SHELTON: Our first few nets didn't have too much, but then there was a net that was just full of beautiful 3-year-old sandfish just in perfect health,

thrashing in the water.

CERRILLA: So once they're out of the nets, now they're in buckets, and it's kind of a race against the clock to some extent to get them back into the

river.

SHELTON: Ready to go back into the wild.

The water quality in the dam and the river could be a bit different. So now we're on about 50-50 during water dam water gives them a chance to get used

to it.

ASHER: Before they're released into the Doring River, the fish are measured and tagged with tiny transponders.

[16:50:03]

SHELTON: Five years ago, when we started reintroducing sandfish back into the wild, we started using pet tags, and those tags allow us to determine

things like sandfish movement and survival and growth in the long term. We have this underwater antenna at the mouth of the Biedouw River, and that

allows us to detect any tagged fish that swims back up the Biedouw to spawn during the annual spawning migration.

ASHER: Since its inception, the Saving Sandfish Project has more than tripled the size of the spawning population.

CERRILLA: So far, it's been a relative success. What's been really interesting over the past few years is getting more and more data. When we

release these fish, we record the conditions in which they're released, which sanctuary dam do they come from, how big are they when they're

released, where are they released, what time of year. And so we can see which conditions are most favorable to a fish's return.

SHELTON: Once we've stabilized this population in the Biedouw, the next step really is to reclaim habitat for the species in the long term. I think

what really inspires me is the support that we've received from the communities in the area. All that fills me with a lot of hope and

enthusiasm for the future of the sandfish.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

QUEST: Gosh, that was fascinating. How interesting all that tagging of fish and then monitoring -- my word. I know. I need to know what you're doing.

You know what it is. Hashtag "Call to Earth."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

QUEST: An artificial intelligence upgrade that OpenAI CEO Sam Altman described as a PhD level has developers going back to school. OpenAI's new

ChatGPT-5 was released last week. Many users were quick to post examples of its failures to answer basic questions. Even Sam Altman said bugs in the

new system made it seem way dumber.

Now, the problem with rollout highlights the shortcomings of A.I. and leads into question OpenAI's ability to build a market consumer products.

Allison morrow joins us from New York.

Allison, I sort of, I'm betwixt and between here because, yes, everybody has got these examples of dumb questions and stupid things that it's done.

But I always feel like these are just carping, carping, meaning criticisms. You know, we're at the beginning of this thing. Of course, it's going to

take time.

[16:55:05]

ALLISON MORROW, CNN BUSINESS SENIOR WRITER: Totally. And I hear you on that. It was a lot of fun for just some of us nerds on the internet trying

to find the blind spots in the new ChatGPT. But as I tried to point out, I think this is a bigger problem that OpenAI has to fix, which is that it's

gotten very used to and very comfortable with hype. It hypes all of its products and all of its rollouts, and it has hyped the industry, the A.I.

industry, writ large, as the future of all technology and business.

QUEST: Right.

MORROW: It's going to upend everything. You know, Sam Altman has a very rose colored glasses view that it's going to cure diseases and benefit

everyone in the long term, as long as we do it right. You know, and he makes these kind of grand claims. And then it's not really backed up by the

technology that we've seen roll out so far. So these consumer products are just not really working for consumers yet.

QUEST: Right. You know --

MORROW: And that's the issue.

QUEST: I caught -- I mean, we've all got our favorite ChatGPT mistake story. I caught it out last week when it failed to tell me about a train

that I wanted to catch, and then when I asked about it, I said, look, you got it wrong. It said, yes, sorry. I pointed the torch too narrowly,

focusing on the most obvious, and didn't look what -- it's really good at self-flagellation, isn't it? Oh, mea culpa, I am the worst bit of nonsense

you'll ever come across.

MORROW: Yes, it does have a bit of a personality which some users really like. And the new ChatGPT-5, a lot of the complaints that some of the power

users were complaining about on Reddit is that the personality just went away, and it was much more terse and much more cold. And they didn't like

that. So some people like it, some people hate it.

QUEST: I loved your article recently on extortion and Nvidia and that -- it was an excellent piece that you wrote about that whole thing.

Thank you, Allison.

MORROW: Well, thank you.

QUEST: Being on the program tonight. Very grateful.

We will take a "Profitable Moment" after the break. QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

QUEST: Tonight's "Profitable Moment," we were talking with Allison there when ChatGPT admits it wrong, it really does when you catch it out. Oh, I'm

the worst bit of A.I. Oh, how can you forgive me? On and on it goes.

We had another really good bit of apologies, or at least honesty, with Daniel Humm of 11 Madison, who's decided to put meat back on his vegan

menu, essentially admitting that the economics of a restaurant requires him to have meat on the menu. Why? Because people don't want to go to a vegan -

- a vegan restaurant, or at least not enough people. And it's not inclusive because meat eaters don't want to go even though it may be a culinary

delight.

Now I can make lots of jokes about Daniel eating humble pie, and people have pointed out the hypocrisy of his position, but he hasn't been a Three

Star Michelin restauranteur and chef for all these years for nothing. From a high French brasserie to a vegan to now whatever will come next, this is

a man who really does know his onions, if you will. And yes, it will be exciting to see what they create at 11 Madison, the rest of the restaurant.

Now it's got meat on the menu again. You can bet your life we will be there, or at least I will be, bib in hand, to try it out.

And that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight. I'm Richard Quest in New York. Not with you tomorrow. Special programing, of course, with the summit.

Otherwise, whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, I hope it's profitable. I'll see you on Monday.

END