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Quest Means Business
RFK, Jr. Grilled on Vaccines; Questions for Fed Nominee; Guggenheim Bilbao Chief
Aired September 04, 2025 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:12]
RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS": Closing bell ringing on Wall Street. The market is up very strongly. It is a beautiful
night here in Bilbao and we are inside the cultural heart of the city, the Guggenheim Museum, where the program comes from tonight.
The market is up. Yes, hit the bell! Bring trading to an end. There we go. Have you had any gavels? Well, one and a two and a one, two, three. Those
are the markets and these are the main events that we are talking about tonight.
A contentious hearing on capitol hill, RFK, Jr. spars with senators over his changes in U.S. vaccine policy.
Stephen Miran, Trump's nominee for Fed Governor, said he will return to his White House job after a stint at the Central Bank.
And the Director General of this stunning museum, we are so lucky tonight to be here at the Guggenheim. We are going to talk about the record
breaking number of visitors this summer and how to keep attracting new guests.
Live from Bilbao in Spain. It is Thursday, September the 4th. I am Richard Quest and yes, at the Guggenheim, I mean business.
Good evening from Bilbao or here, as they say in Basque Country, Gabon. So they tell me anyway, it is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS live tonight from one of
the world's cultural capitals and we are delighted to be here. It is all thanks to this building where we have been invited to come and where we
join you tonight. It is, of course, The Guggenheim Bilbao, which helped the city emerge from decades of political turbulence and economic decline.
They call it the Guggenheim Effect or the Bilbao Effect. It is now an art and culinary hotspot. So tonight on the program, we've got a pinchos board
of guests who are going to show us how to eat properly. We have the director general of the museum here in Bilbao and we have the Basque
Minister of Industry and Energy Transition, as well as the chefs from the Michelin-starred Nerua Restaurant.
I hope I pronounced that right, otherwise the food will be over me instead of in front of me.
We start though, with the news of the day, as we always must. A fiery Hearing On Capitol Hill as Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. appeared before the U.S.
Senate. The Health and Human Services Secretary faced hostile questions over his views on vaccines and the firing of the director for the CDC, as
well as increasing calls for him to resign.
Kennedy claims he has done nothing to limit access to vaccines, even though that's not always the case for the COVID-19 booster shot, for example.
Democrats and Republicans grilled the Secretary over contradictions, and that included the Republican doctor, Bill Cassidy.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. BILL CASSIDY (R-LA): Do you agree with me that the President -- that the President deserves a Nobel Prize for Operation Warp Speed?
ROBERT F. KENNEDY, JR., U.S. HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES SECRETARY: Yes. Absolutely, Senator.
CASSIDY: Let me ask you, but you just told Senator Bennet that COVID vaccine killed more people than COVID.
KENNEDY: Wait --
CASSIDY: That was a statement.
KENNEDY: I did not say that.
CASSIDY: I would say, effectively, we are denying people vaccine.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Senator Cantwell.
KENNEDY: You're wrong.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Now with me, Dr. Leana Wen, a former Baltimore Health Commissioner. I listened carefully to much of the testimony. There is no middle ground
here. The Secretary says he is basically improving America's health. Most of the panel said he is not. Where does it go from here?
DR. LEANA WEN, FORMER BALTIMORE HEALTH COMMISSIONER: Well, I find it hard to see how you could improve America's health by dismantling the public
health infrastructure, by sowing doubt into the people who work for federal health agencies, and by essentially turning science on its head.
The way that science is supposed to work is you have a hypothesis, you get data, you test the hypothesis, you're willing to admit if you're wrong. But
this is kind of the opposite of the approach that Secretary Kennedy takes, which is he seems to have a predetermined conclusion that vaccines are
somehow toxins and dangerous. And that he is cherry picking data to fit that conclusion and he is also choosing people who are in lockstep with
him. He has already fired all 17 members of the Advisory Committee to the CDC on immunization policy, and there are -- there have been massive
upheaval in the CDC itself with the CDC director being ousted, multiple senior leaders resigning.
[16:05:02]
And I think that we are seeing a situation where we will have effects on vaccine access. We are already seeing an increase in vaccine misinformation
being spread, including by Secretary Kennedy, for example. He was at best lukewarm when we had the worst measles outbreak in the U.S. in 30 years.
QUEST: But the Secretary gets to keep his job as long as he enjoys the support of President Trump and that seems to have been the Faustian bargain
that was done for Trump to be able to say, I've got a Kennedy on my team, so it doesn't at the moment look as if the Secretary is going to be
departing.
WEN: Well, I don't know, I certainly don't -- can't say that I know what is going on in President Trump's head. But by all accounts, they seem to have
a cozy relationship. It does appear, though, that there are factions with Republican lawmakers as you mentioned, and as we saw today in the hearing,
we saw prominent Republican lawmakers, including Senator Bill Cassidy, who is a physician himself, really express concerns about what this limitation
in vaccine access and this misinformation around vaccines is going to do.
And frankly, we know what will happen. We've seen many examples in other countries of the return of preventable childhood illnesses. And I think it
is actually it is -- it is just -- it is mind blowing because on the one hand, Secretary Kennedy says, okay, he wants to focus on chronic diseases
and reduce the rate of chronic diseases. But I don't think the way you do that is by getting more people to fall ill from infectious diseases and
getting people to die earlier in life. You could cut chronic diseases that way, but surely that is not the recipe to better health.
QUEST: Doctor, grateful for you tonight. Thank you.
Now, an economic adviser to President Trump says he will act independently if he is appointed to the Federal Reserve. Stephen Miran has been picked by
the President to fill the vacancy on the Fed's Board of Governors. He told the senators he would take a leave of absence from the White House if
confirmed.
Senator John Kennedy, a Republican, then asked Miran whether he would act on the President's behalf.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOHN KENNEDY (R-LA): Are you Donald Trump's puppet?
STEPHEN MIRAN, TRUMP ECONOMIC ADVISER: Not at all. I am very independently minded, as shown by my willingness to stray from consensus and have out of
consensus views, and I believe that you know, I will continue to be as independent, you know, in my thinking process, if confirmed.
J. KENNEDY: We are going to hold you to that, Governor -- Future Governor.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Now, Miran does hold unconventional views. We've talked about them on this program, about the Fed. He laid them out in an article last year.
So, for instance, he wants The White House to have greater control over the board of governors, including the right to fire them at will.
He also says the governors should serve shorter terms. At the moment, it is 14 years set by law. To balance that, Marin says the regional Fed
presidents should have a say in monetary policy. They do. It is just on a rotating basis at the moment.
Paula Newton is with me.
The reality is, though the nature of Miran, he will be doing the President's business. He will return, he says, to The White House after he
has filled this unexpired term. So unusually for Fed governors, this is Paula, a classic revolving door.
PAULA NEWTON, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST AND CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely. And it is extraordinary that they believe, The White House and he believed that
even if this is a short term position, that he can continue to be on that leave of absence, right? That raised eyebrows on Capitol Hill, not just
among Democrats, but among Republicans as well.
There is a lot at stake here, though, Richard, in terms of if this is going to be a transformative few years for the Fed, because that is what is at
stake. Mr. Miran, that you see there is in line with the President knowing, wanting that this Federal Reserve is transformed in Trump's second term.
I want you to listen now to an incredibly contentious few minutes between Senator Elizabeth Warren and Mr. Miran. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. ELIZABETH WARREN (D-MA): I just need a yes or no. Did Donald Trump lose the 2020 presidential election?
MIRAN: Thank you, Senator Warren. Joe Biden was certified by Congress as the President of the United States.
WARREN: Right. So did Donald Trump lose that election?
MIRAN: As I just said, Joe Biden was certified.
WARREN: Did Donald Trump lose that election. Can you say the words Donald Trump lost that election? Are you independent enough to say that?
NEWTON: So, beyond the gotcha moment that you just saw there, the point is, he can be telling the truth about being independent, but he totally
believes, as you just pointed out, that this Federal Reserve needs to function differently and beyond the points that you made, I would make the
point that he also does not adhere to this, you know, really, what is religion among those on the Fed that the inflation rate should stay about
two percent.
He says, look, you can throw that out. At times, you need to juice the economy, which means you need to lower interest rates. And I think that is
the crucial thing about this Fed. Add to that, Lisa Cook, right, who Donald Trump has said that he is fired. We have just learned through AP reporting
that the Department of Justice has now opened an investigation into her among allegations of mortgage fraud. And if Donald Trump continues to
appoint people on that Federal Reserve voting members who do not believe perhaps that two percent should be a golden rule on inflation again in the
next three, three-and-a-half years, you could have a much different Federal Reserve here. And again, its independence comes into question.
QUEST: Paula is in New York, grateful. Thank you very much.
Now, President Trump has told Europe it must stop buying Russian oil. He also urged his counterparts to put economic pressure on China for funding
Russia's war efforts. According to a White House official, the United States President spoke to European leaders as the Coalition of the Willing,
you can see pictures here. They met in Paris. They discussed the use of secondary sanctions, which currently, of course, is against India and
particularly hitting countries that trade with Russia.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): We talked to President Trump today. We are grateful for his support. We discussed in
detail how to create conditions for peace. We have discussed various options. The most important is pressure.
Economic actions that will force Russia to stop the war. The key to peace is to deprive the Russian war machine of money, of resources.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Nick Paton Walsh is with me.
It goes on and on, Nick, I mean, they want -- the President wants Europe to stop buying Russian oil. There is a reason why it does. They've put in
place caps on pricing, but the whole issue is fraught. And yet, seemingly, the President does not actually take any further measures. He just keeps
reminding everybody he is going to -- he might do it often, and he will. How do you make of it?
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: I mean, ultimately the tariffs placed against India are in effect now, don't appear
to have done things like, for example, stop Narendra Modi of India, turning up in Beijing to a summit where Russian President Vladimir Putin was
another guest of honor.
It hasn't appeared to have had the pressure on India to stop them buying Russian oil. Now, China is a much bigger, more important customer. The
threat of tariffs have had no effect on them either. And so what we are seeing over the past weeks is a test as to whether the concept of secondary
sanctions will indeed stop the money flowing into Russia's coffers from its oil sales. Putting the price cap aside now, yes, that was a mechanism in
place to limit Russian revenues, but still, it has brought the money coming into the point where Russia can continue very comfortably paying for its
invasion of Ukraine.
The pressure on Europe to stop buying Russian oil, well, this has been an anomaly, frankly, over past years. They still purchase relatively small
amounts. It is Hungary and Slovakia, Putin allies, who are doing a lot of the buying, but Europe does still buy a fair bit of gas from Moscow, too.
So a massively complex energy market out there, Richard. But again, I think Trump put in a spot here pressuring allies rather than those, perhaps, who
have the greater influence over the Kremlin.
QUEST: Do you think he was put out by the Beijing various summits? This is all -- I mean, that whole business with Putin, Putin even making a joke,
saying that the President -- U.S. President has a good sense of humor when he made that comment about them all meeting to conspire against -- I mean,
you know, you've looked at this so closely over so long, when you see all these pieces of the jigsaw come together in this way, how do you make it?
WALSH: Well, I mean, this was an extraordinary moment for Vladimir Putin. He essentially faced down Trump in Alaska, had a friendly meeting, gave him
nothing, left Trump, I think, perhaps bewildered that the force of his personality couldn't somehow bend the Kremlin head around and then Putin
goes and meets, frankly, the two countries who are paying for his war. China, with a very clear strategic desire to have Russia win, or certainly
not lose, and India, who simply need Russian hydrocarbons.
He had backing their clear, palpable, open backing for that continued war that must have put Trump out. He clearly is seeing very little progress. He
is threatening phase two, phase three against India, possibly other allies of Russia, but that isn't changing the calculus.
[16:15:04]
Putin offered to Zelenskyy, somewhat derisively, to come to Moscow if he wanted a bilateral summit. Absurd! And Zelenskyy turned that down today.
Richard, today we heard more from the European countries who say that they will provide a reassurance force to Ukraine in the event of a ceasefire.
Those security guarantees, it is about showing the Trump administration that Europe is willing to do something if there is peace. The U.S. seems to
want to back that with air power, but ultimately, what we don't have at this point is peace or a ceasefire at all, because Moscow are not
interested in that at this particular point.
They keep rejecting proposals and at this stage, too, Trump has not brought down the anvil, so to speak, of the hardest measures he can bring. I think
maybe he is perhaps embarrassed by how badly this has gone, maybe he wants to try and preserve some kind of relationship with Moscow for the future,
and there is still that complex interpersonal relationship he has with Putin that few can really fathom -- Richard.
QUEST: Nick Paton Walsh, thank you.
Now, it is not often you can pin a city's success or revival to just one building. Here in Bilbao, the Guggenheims have been credited with reviving
the economy. The director general, who is with me, Miren Arzalluz, will be talking about her plans, newly arrived at the museum.
After the break, we will discuss your plans.
QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: You can't really miss the Guggenheim. It is so positioned on this triangle of land pretty much wherever you are in the city, you get a
glimpse of it or a sliver or a full throttle view.
Well, the issue was the industrial decline which ravaged Europe in the late 20th Century, and Bilbao was a prime example of what was happening. The
city used to thrive on ship building and steel production, and then the economy shifted. Bilbao was in search of a new identity, and it found it in
a very different way.
The impact of the Guggenheim Museum that it has had on this city, some say it cannot be understated or overstated.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST (voice over): It is a building so distinct it has given economists a new phrase, the Bilbao Effect. It was inaugurated in 1997 by King Juan
Carlos.
[16:20:06]
Since then, the Guggenheim has been a turning point in the city's history. More than a million tourists a year have come to see the building and its
contents.
It has saved local businesses and revived the city's fortunes. The Bilbao Effect is the idea that investments in culture and bold architecture can
breathe new life into a dying economy.
QUEST (on camera): At the other end of town, a monument to Bilbao's economic past. It is called the Carola Crane -- giant. It was part of the
city's industrial heritage, heavy industry and shipbuilding.
Well, most of that is gone. The shipbuilding ended and the crane closed in 1987. Twelve years later, the Guggenheim opened, and these two monuments
now stand as symbols to Bilbao's economic future.
QUEST (voice over): Nestled in the heart of Basque Country, Bilbao is fiercely independent. For decades, that independence was at the center of a
bitter struggle.
Under General Franco's dictatorship, the Basque language and culture were strictly repressed. It fueled resentment and a drive for autonomy. The
separatist group, ETA responded with a violent campaign against the Spanish state.
ETA called it a fight for freedom. Madrid insisted it was terrorism. Hundreds of people were killed before ETA laid down its arms in 2011, and
later that decade disbanded.
DAVID HARLAND, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, CENTER FOR HUMANITARIAN DIALOGUE: ETA ends its declaration with the following word: "We have made this our last
decision in order to foster a new historical phase. ETA was born from the people and now it dissolves back into the people."
QUEST (voice over): The Basque Region is very much an important part of Spain, but locals still proudly celebrate their unique heritage.
The region is famous for its pinchos. These small snacks served on bread. They are designed to bring people together through shared flavors.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You have to put the bacalao and two olives, literally cover it, heat it, slow temperature and you need to be a master in moving
the pan for about two or three hours.
QUEST (voice over): Today, the city must reinvent itself once again. Housing costs have soared and Bilbao is vulnerable to climate change.
From steel and shipbuilding to museums, cuisine and culture, the city has weathered decline, a rebirth and is now facing a new set of challenges.
But, true to its Basque roots, Bilbao always finds a new and perhaps always arguably unexpected way to thrive.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: Now with me is Miren Arzalluz, the Director General here at the Guggenheim Museum.
First of all, thank you.
MIREN ARZALLUZ, DIRECTOR GENERAL, GUGGENHEIM BILBAO MUSEUM: Thank you.
QUEST: Thank you for letting us come and be here. It is magnificent to be here.
So you're relatively new. You joined earlier in the year. What was it about this place that attracted you to come here and want to come here?
ARZALLUZ: Well, it was a dream come true, I have to say. I myself am from Bilbao. I am a professional who has been working in different museums
around the world, and coming back home to work in such a symbolic and significant museum and with such a huge influence in the recent history of
this country, of the Basque Country, it is an honor and a huge and beautiful challenge.
QUEST: But you see, the problem is, you were handed a success of many years, and now people are saying, all right, everybody has heard of the
Bilbao Museum. It is all very famous. Bish-bash-bosh.
But what are you going to do? What is your plan?
ARZALLUZ: Well, I think there is a very beautiful road already marked for the future, which is, of course, this amazing museum that, I mean, we
announced earlier this week the figures for last summer. So we have the most amazing attendance figures.
We've had this year so far, the best attendance figures for the history of the museum so far in 28 years. So it is a very consolidated situation, and
we have to, I think, continue being this museum, which is at the same time very solidly rooted in this country, in Bilbao and in the Basque Country,
extremely well connected to its community and part of this thriving cultural life in Bilbao, in the Basque Country and at the same time, with
this big ambition and international appeal that is --
[16:25:12]
QUEST: Are they contradictory?
ARZALLUZ: No, they aren't.
QUEST: Is it -- well, hang on. You know, you get the tourists in, but at the same time, the locals both don't want so much tourists and in many
cases, so it is a controversial issue. How are you -- how do you balance the locals versus the foreigners like me?
ARZALLUZ: But it is not a -- you know, it is totally they can cohabit with no problem whatsoever and proof of it is the success of this museum. So
there has never been any contradiction or any problem in managing these two dimensions of this museum since the beginning of this project.
We have a very strong community of friends of the museum, and 96 percent of these friends of the museum, which is over 24,000 friends, are from the
Basque Country.
QUEST: Right.
ARZALLUZ: And then at the same time, we have a very strong community of over 400,000 followers from around the world. So --
QUEST: And the relationship with Guggenheim New York, I mean, it is a very big one. I mean, it is a very famous museum. And in some cases, you're very
famous now in your own right. People come to Bilbao to come to the museum and the food. You're obsessed by food.
ARZALLUZ: I am familiar with many, many other things. But yes, we are obsessed with food.
QUEST: Obsessed?
ARZALLUZ: Yes. Also in this museum, as you will show later in the show.
QUEST: Yes.
ARZALLUZ: Yes.
QUEST: Now, before we finish. You used to -- before you got this job, you were at the fashion museum -- one of the fashion museums in New York --
ARZALLUZ: Paris.
QUEST: In Paris.
Giorgio Armani passed away today, aged 91. There was an exhibition of Armani here at the turn of the century.
ARZALLUZ: In 2001.
QUEST: In 2001. What was his legacy do you think? Armani's? What do you think he gave us?
ARZALLUZ: Well, I think he is definitely one of the most influential fashion designers of the second half of the 20th Century and he literally
changed the shape of fashion with his very fluid deconstructed and natural lines that gave women precisely from the 1970s, 80s and 90s a new way of
empowering themselves.
So it is a -- you know, we couldn't understand fashion in the 20th Century without the huge contribution of Armani. And yes, as you said, this museum
organized a beautiful retrospective in 2001, and I visited this exhibition --
QUEST: Really?
ARZALLUZ: -- before actually becoming a historian specialized in fashion. This was the first fashion exhibition I ever saw within this museum in
Bilbao.
QUEST: If I have had said to you back then, Miren, by the way, you're going to become the Director General of the museum in about another 23 years'
time, you'd have said what?
ARZALLUZ: Well, I would have never believed you.
QUEST: I think you need -- listen, we are going to talk a lot about food because you have a one-star Michelin restaurant here.
ARZALLUZ: Yes.
QUEST: I think you need to have an exhibition about food.
ARZALLUZ: I agree.
QUEST: Oh, good. I've had --
ARZALLUZ: Art and food, maybe one day.
QUEST: Art and food, all right.
Well, thank you very much. You've allowed us -- have a have a ding of the bell.
Not many people get to ding the bell. Thank you very much indeed for joining us.
ARZALLUZ: Thank you very much.
QUEST: I appreciate it. Thank you.
Now, as we continue tonight, the fashion world we've just been talking about, mourning the passing of the legendary designer, Giorgio Armani. We
look back at how he began his business, revolutionizing the business world.
It is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. We are so lucky tonight. We are at the Guggenheim in Bilbao.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:31:37]
QUEST: Hello, I am Richard Quest. We have a great deal more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS to bring to your delectations this evening. I will be joined by
the Basque Minister of Industry, who will explain why the region has the highest GDP per capita in Spain. Interesting.
Michelin-starred restaurants are easy to come by, but the stars aren't easy. But the restaurants are. In fact, there is one inside this very
building. Two chefs -- two top chefs will join me. But only after we've had the news headlines, because this is CNN and on this network, in Bilbao, as
elsewhere, the news always comes first.
Top Senate Republicans won't say whether they have confidence in Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. as Health Secretary. It follows contentious hearings on
Capitol Hill, where the Secretary testified he didn't know how many people died from COVID-19. Secretary Kennedy also defended a recent shakeup at the
CDC.
Trans people in the united states could be declared mentally ill and banned from owning guns. It is one of the proposals, officials say are under
discussion at the Justice Department. The talks come after last week's shooting at a Minneapolis Catholic Church where two children were killed.
Police say it was carried out by a transgender woman.
A 5.6 magnitude earthquake has hit Northeastern Afghanistan. It is believed to be the strongest aftershock from Sunday's deadly 8.0 earthquake. The
Taliban say more than 2,200 people have died with wet weather and damaged roads making it difficult for rescuers to reach remote locations.
The world of fashion is mourning the death of Giorgio Armani. He died. He was 91. The legendary designer will be remembered for revolutionizing
business wear, in particular men's suits.
Armani swapped rigid and formal tailoring for a softer, more relaxed style and as more women began to enter the workplace, he created a style for
them, too, as we were hearing a moment ago.
After Richard Gere wore Armani in the 1980 film "American Gigolo," Hollywood took notice and a brand worth billions was born.
Valerie Steele is the director and the chief curator at the Museum of Fashion Institute of Technology in New York.
Valerie is with me now. What do you say? I mean, it is always very difficult on these occasions, but if you had to sum up the contribution,
which you do, what would it be?
VALERIE STEELE, DIRECTOR AND THE CHIEF CURATOR, MUSEUM OF FASHION INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY IN NEW YORK: I'd say he transformed menswear making it fluid
and sexy. Instead of being the man in the gray flannel suit or a stiff, boxy navy wool suit, he put you in something that was fluid, softer,
touchable, in a color that was indeterminate, something like a taupe or a greige. And in that way, he really created an entirely new look for men.
QUEST: And for women. What about women? What did he do there?
STEELE: Yes, he made women's clothes that looked empowering, but also glamorous in a kind of old Hollywood way.
[16:35:10]
QUEST: You know, when I think of the clothes and I think not only of the Armani main brand, but also the various sub brands that it spawned, it
created an entirely new -- I want to say casual formal look. It was the clothes that you didn't need to worry about what you were going to wear for
that particular --
STEELE: Yes.
QUEST: You know, you're going to dinner. What do I wear? I am going to a concert. What should I wear? I am going to visit friends. What should I
wear?
It was the clothes for all seasons.
STEELE: Yes and in fact, people talked about it that way. They didn't say, I am going to buy a business suit, or I am looking for a blazer. They said,
I am wearing Armani, and that was conveying that they were a sort of a hip, young, sexy person and he did it partly through these connections with
textile companies in Milan, where he was able to make luxury fashions in a manufacturing environment.
And then even more democratic and inexpensive clothes, like for Emporio Armani and then he transformed the style of them and in the process made
Milan the new real fashion capital of Italy, replacing Rome and Florence.
QUEST: One of the fascinating parts is, although Armani was expensive, it wasn't offensively expensive.
STEELE: Exactly.
QUEST: And, you know, the Italian, French brands that are out of the range, but if you treated yourself, you could buy a piece or two and you didn't
have to save up until Christmas, three years hence.
STEELE: Yes. That's right. And people thought of them as investment dressing, although they were so -- the textiles were so soft and fine that
in fact they were somewhat fragile. But in any case, it was affordable luxury fashion
QUEST: All right, Valerie, I am grateful for you tonight. I appreciate it. Thank you for talking to me. Unfortunately, I don't have an Armani suit
that I could pop on this evening.
But anyway, as we continue tonight, the economy here in the Basque Region is one of the strongest in Spain. We've only got to see the tourists. We
got to see the restaurants and the sheer joie de vivre of the whole place. I will be speaking to a local Minister of Industry and Energy Transition on
what is driving that growth. It is not just the Bilbao Effect. There is an industry here that we need to talk about.
QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:40:49]
QUEST: The economic transformations here in Bilbao that we've been talking about have helped drive Spanish economic growth across the whole country.
But here is the interesting fact: The Basque Region has one of the highest GDP per capita in Spain, which is a very different turning point for a part
of the country once known for heavy industry and trade.
Now, through the museum and other investments, the economy is driven by a services sector and a very strong tourism -- the number of tourists.
Mikel Jauregi is the Minister of Industry and Energy Transition for the Basque Government.
Minister, good to see you, sir. Thank you for joining me tonight.
MIKEL JAUREGI, MINISTER OF INDUSTRY AND ENERGY TRANSITION FOR THE BASQUE GOVERNMENT: Hello!
QUEST: Wonderful!
JAUREGI: Wonderful, isn't it?
QUEST: Now, let me ask you, look, I come from a generation as a journalist, when I started, the word Basque was never used as a journalist unless it
had Basque separatists, ETA, and so when I arrived here and I see Basque this, Basque that, Basque flags, Basque cheesecake, Basque everything -- it
is quite a difference.
JAUREGI: It is quite a difference. What a transformation this country has had in the last 50 years and helped by this transformation in itself
physically. I think we are -- we have been able to reinvent ourselves and this museum is an actual physical demonstration of that reinvention.
QUEST: The economy here really took off after peace arrived.
JAUREGI: Yes.
QUEST: You had 2011, when peace arrived in 2018, '23 when, of course, they disband and that's a big difference. That's a major turning point here.
JAUREGI: That's a major difference because the terrorist group at the time was targeting businessmen, business people and that actually depressed the
growth that we could actually have. The fact that now we live in peace and we are a very export led economy, businesses have grown and we have a very
good environment for that.
We also have fiscal autonomy. We have full autonomy where we can raise our own taxes. We've been able to model the economy to one for pro-growth,
focusing on advanced manufacturing and also technology, not only tourism.
QUEST: No. You see, well, you say not only tourism, but tourism is a very significant part of the economy. Arguably, it could become too much of a
part of the economy. What do you think?
JAUREGI: Well, if we look at the statistics, 24 percent of the economy is still is manufacturing very similar to Germany. And if you look at the
advanced services that we've got related to the manufacturing, it is 40 percent of the economy. So we still have a very industrial heart in the
Basque Country.
QUEST: But you have to change that industry now, don't you?
JAUREGI: Absolutely.
QUEST: I mean, the shipbuilding is not there, but advanced A.I., all the various new industries that you're in competition with the rest of Spain
and Europe for. What have you got that makes it better?
JAUREGI: Well, we are top quartile in Europe when it comes to innovation and advanced manufacturing. And we have well players in the Basque Country
like Iberdrola in energy. We have in banking, BBVA. We also have companies like Talgo and CAF, which are major railway makers.
So we actually have a lot of big names which are investing and giving us the edge in terms of technology and industrial balance.
QUEST: How is the relationship now -- I suppose you'll say good, because you're the Minister, but between central government and regional
government.
JAUREGI: It has never been better.
QUEST: I thought you'd say that. I am not surprised.
JAUREGI: No, but there is a very good relationship.
QUEST: But as a central government often get -- I mean now, it seems to be in some difficulties. Do you plow your own way in a sense in the north?
JAUREGI: Well, we have always done so because (a) we are -- we have full autonomy from the rest of Spain.
QUEST: Right.
JAUREGI: As I said, we raise our own taxes which pay for our own hospitals, our own schools, our own police. So we have always had a bit of autonomy
there. However, we are complementary. We have a very good relationship with them. We still are the heartland, the industrial heartland in Spain and
they still look at us when it comes to advancing in manufacturing and in technology.
QUEST: Are you as obsessed by food as everybody else is in this country?
JAUREGI: Well, you can only tell. Yes.
QUEST: I am not saying a word. Minister, thank you very much. What a magnificent moment. Thank you for inviting us. Thank you for letting us be
here.
JAUREGI: Thank you very much!
QUEST: We really --
JAUREGI: Our pleasure.
QUEST: Thank you.
JAUREGI: And come here not only for tourism, to invest as well.
QUEST: Oh, please. Thank you very much, indeed.
Now, the turnaround in Bilbao after many years of unrest, is quite remarkable as we were just talking about.
[16:45:08]
The revival has been fueled by a booming tourism industry and a local tour guide tells me he believes the Guggenheim Effect is just the beginning and
wait until you see the tattoo.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MARVIN BOCKER, BILBAO TOUR GUIDE: We suffered the Basque separatist group, ETA. People speaking here were afraid of coming in here and on the other
side, people understand Spain as a sunny country and it rains a lot here in Bilbao.
But definitely we have other aspects to offer, like amazing food, culture and identity.
QUEST: This was a major northern port town that suffered unemployment like everywhere else, but things have changed.
BOCKER: Well, Bilbao reached up to 38 percent of unemployment rates, so tough times in the 80s for sure. Last year, unemployment rate went down to
six percent in the Basque Country, and that's precisely due to the type of industry and also the new jobs that we are having due to the services, for
example, this amazing bar that we have in here -- hotels, cruise ships that are visiting us.
So the tourism infrastructure, as I said, is booming, literally.
QUEST: And what about the Bilbao Effect? The Guggenheim Effect? First of all, show me your arm.
BOCKER: Made of steel! Made of steel!
QUEST: I mean, you've actually got the tattoo.
BOCKER: Yes.
QUEST: Keep it up. You've actually got the tattoo of the Guggenheim on your -- how come?
BOCKER: Well, I am a tour guide of the museum, but for me, it is like the phoenix, like the mythological bird. This is the awakening of Bilbao from
its ashes. This is what has put us in the spotlight of the world.
Thanks to Frank Gehry, the magnificent architect who did that, and also all of the complementary services that we have nowadays here in Bilbao.
QUEST: But there has to be more in a place than just a museum. The museum can't lift the whole thing on its own.
BOCKER: Let's say the museum is the very start, the beginning. It is like a seat and when people come to Bilbao and discover a 10,000 year old culture
and identity preserved by our language, by our usage and customs, they just fall in love with it.
Plus, as we had that terrorism, it has maintained very genuine. You feel an authentic place here in Bilbao. I think that's a key point. To feel
authentic.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: Now that is a tattoo. Bilbao is known chiefly for two things. We've talked about the Guggenheim, where we are; and the city's food.
Now, put the two together. There is actually a one-star Michelin star restaurant inside this museum.
After the break, the chefs and the food from that restaurant joining us, two of the chefs, QUEST MEANS BUSINESS, Quest means food.
Oh, it is very good.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:50:27]
QUEST: The sheer amount of food in Bilbao, the number of Michelin-starred restaurants, San Sebastian, up the road has more per capita than anywhere
else and so it just goes on and on. They are obsessed.
And in fact, even in this very museum, there is a one star Michelin restaurant. With me are the chefs who are responsible.
Josean Alija is the Nerua executive chef. Good to have you, sir. Thank you very much.
They speak Spanish, we will get some great translation from Antonio Vazquez, who is the head chef, also with me.
You love food, don't you?
ANTONIO VAZQUEZ, NERUA HEAD CHEF: Of course. We love food here because I think it is the culture for the Basque Country that is meeting the point of
the people enjoying drinking, eating. I think it is the cultural hub roots here of the food and I mean, we work seasonal as well. I think it is very
important here.
QUEST: What is it? What sort of food do you cook here? Tell me what we have here.
VAZQUEZ: Well, we have the first thing we must have in the pinchos. Pinchos is very typical for the Basque Country.
QUEST: All right, pinchos, chef.
(CHEF JOSEAN ALIJA speaking in foreign language.)
VAZQUEZ: History pinchos, we call it cricket, in Spanish, very honest one. One of the first pinchos here in Bilbao, we made that.
QUEST: One is pinchos the same thing as tapas?
VAZQUEZ: No, no. It is impossible that it would be the same one. It is a different one. The special one is the pinchos.
(CHEF JOSEAN ALIJA speaking in foreign language.)
QUEST: You see, I've touched a very, very raw nerve here. The moment you mention pinchos and tapas, people get very angry. Right?
(CHEF JOSEAN ALIJA speaking in foreign language.)
VAZQUEZ: Yes. This is a typical glass. History, take the chiquito.
QUEST: You can't even give it a full glass.
VAZQUEZ: Yes. Of course, this is a heavy one.
(CHEF JOSEAN ALIJA speaking in foreign language.)
QUEST: Wow! All right, well, there we are. And then what do we have here? Because I am also told I am going to ruin this. Forgive me, because I am
going to turn it to the camera and everything is going to fall all over.
VAZQUEZ: Yes.
QUEST: So tell me what we have here.
VAZQUEZ: Because we are now in the season of the summer here, and, well, this is the tomatoes. We cooked the tomatoes and well, it is from here,
from the Basque Country, we have a parra, in the sphere of parra and the brine of green olives. It is going to be a very refreshing salad one.
QUEST: Do we have a fork or I -- here I am, thank you very much. Oh my goodness.
VAZQUEZ: This one is very --
QUEST: It is rather good.
VAZQUEZ: Is good?
QUEST: Do you make dishes here specifically because it is a museum? Do you adapt.
VAZQUEZ: Yes, of course this is art as well.
QUEST: Sorry?
VAZQUEZ: This is art as well. This is food. We do the same. We are thinking the food is posing in Nerua restaurant.
QUEST: What are you doing?
VAZQUEZ: Finish the plate this one. This plate is inspired with being the sun is here, very typical. The rice with the mussels and clams and it is
probably, that's a little bit different.
We have squid, a very fine one. We have the sauces, the clams, clam sauce, and we have the lobster one.
QUEST: Chef, why are there so many Michelin stars in this part of Spain?
(CHEF ANTONIO VAZQUEZ speaking in foreign language.)
QUEST: Yes.
(CHEF JOSEAN ALIJA speaking in foreign language.)
VAZQUEZ: The gastronomy inside the culture of the Basque Country.
(CHEF JOSEAN ALIJA speaking in foreign language.)
VAZQUEZ: And they all the important things is celebrating around the food in one table.
(CHEF JOSEAN ALIJA speaking in foreign language.)
VAZQUEZ: He said, we have a lot of Michelin star here, the important one is the Choco. Choco is a special place, just gastronomy inside. Yes, and in
the cooking all together.
QUEST: Right now, last question, I really want to know. So you're in this museum. It is fantastic. And your meals have to be works of art. What do
you do next?
What's next on your menu?
(CHEF ANTONIO VAZQUEZ speaking in foreign language.)
(CHEF JOSEAN ALIJA speaking in foreign language.)
QUEST: You're not going to tell me are you?
[16:55:10]
VAZQUEZ: I mean, it is a difficult question, this one because we are always working in the -- I know in the best level in the kitchen and we always do
the best of us being in the restaurant, you know?
QUEST: He is not going to tell me.
Thank you very much, Chef. I am going to taste it. Let me just taste this and make sure it is all right. It would be a shame not to.
This was a really good idea. Have a look at the markets, Chef. Thank you very much indeed.
JOSEAN ALIJA, NERUA CHEF: Thank you.
VAZQUEZ: You're welcome.
QUEST: Thank you very much indeed. Stay there. I shouldn't have started this.
Wall Street finished higher ahead of Friday's Jobs Report. The Dow Jones Industrials -- I probably need to have earned some investments to pay for
the meal here -- the Dow Jones picked up 350 points. The S&P extended its gain, up 0.8 percent. The NASDAQ saw the best, up nearly one percent. I
hope they don't give me the bell.
Look at the Dow 30. Excuse me. You'll see how they all did.
We will take a Profitable Moment after the break.
Chef, this is absolutely excellent. Thank you very much indeed.
ALIJA: Thank you. Enjoy!
QUEST: Oh well --
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: When we knew we were coming to Bilbao, being at the Guggenheim was an absolute must. Tonight's Profitable Moment, remember, we were at the
Guggenheim in New York, and now to have been invited and to be allowed to be here tonight.
You know, they talk about the Guggenheim Effect, the Bilbao Effect, this idea that somehow the museum has revitalized Bilbao. There is a lot of
truth in it. But Frank Gehry didn't do it on his own. The museum certainly has been the catalyst and the Sydney Opera House was given as an example of
what they wanted to do.
But you can't just build this and hope it is all going to come right. The big mistake everybody makes is thinking that just by putting up one of
these, you're going to succeed.
No, there has to be strategy that goes around it. If you're going to revitalize a city and you're going to put a piece of outrageous
architecture with magnificent museums, then there has to be more than just a good idea and a fancy drawing, and that's why it works here in Bilbao.
Everything is integrated -- the idea, the museum, the city, the regional government, the planning, the transport, the tourism.
This isn't just a one shot wonder, and that, I think, is why it has been so fortunate for us to be here tonight. The fact I've put on about three
kilos, simply the amount of food I've eaten is really quite something else.
To say they are obsessed by food here is a massive, massive understatement.
And that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for this Thursday night. I am Richard Quest in Bilbao.
Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, I hope it is profitable. I'll see you back in New York next week.
[17:00:38]
END
