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Quest Means Business
15 Killed in Attack Targeting Hanukkah Celebration In Sydney; Police: Son Of Rob And Michele Reiner Responsible For Deaths; Wizz Air Hits Customer Milestone Announces New Routes; Australian Leaders Vow To Tighten Gun Laws After Shooting; Australian Prime Minister: Massacre Was "Horrific Act Of Antisemitism"; Roomba Maker IRobot Files For Bankruptcy; Slice: United States Average Price For Large Cheese Pie Is $17. Aired 4-5p ET
Aired December 15, 2025 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:17]
RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS": Start of a new week together. You, me and the market and the closing bell is ringing
on Wall Street. Very small gains and losses over the course, started in the green, now in the red, but really not worth getting too excited about
bearing in mind where we are.
Lots of wait and see. Oh, and a quick gavel! Sort of a middle kind of gavel I think. Yes. Nothing to get too excited about, it is going to be -- I
think that is sort of weak as things start to close down and shut down and ready for the holidays, Christmas next week.
The headlines and the main events that you and I will chew over. Australia plans to tighten its gun laws after the Bondi Beach mass shooting.
Wizz Air celebrates its 60,000,000th passenger. The chief executive is with us tonight.
And pizzanomics, what the humble pizza can tell us about the state of the U.S. economy and what toppings do you like?
We are live tonight in New York, as always, it is Monday, it is December the 15th, middle of the month. I am Richard Quest and I mean business.
Good evening to you.
Of course, you and I, we are used to the relentless news cycle day in, day out. But even the last 48 hours have been particularly troubling. Three
violent tragedies unfolding over the weekend.
Firstly, first, the deadly shooting at Brown University in Rhode Island, where the killer is still on the loose. Hours later, a massacre unfolding
on Sydney's Bondi Beach, 15 dead and the Jewish community were the target, and then late last night, the news that the Hollywood director, Rob Reiner
and his wife were found dead at their Los Angeles home, and the tragedy on that one is particularly with the family connection.
We begin, though, in Australia, where the Prime Minister, Anthony Albanese, has been giving more details about the mass shooting that claimed 15 lives.
The Prime Minister said a father and his adult son opened fire on Hanukkah celebrations that were taking place along Bondi Beach. He said it was
motivated by extreme perversion of Islam.
The Prime Minister went on, the men were known to the Australian security services, but not thought to be part of a wider cell. CNN's Angus Watson
reports from Sydney.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANGUS WATSON, CNN SENIOR PRODUCER (voice over): the horrific violence against Sydney's Jewish community and crowds at Bondi Beach on Sunday, the
worst mass shooting in Australia since 1996.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's gunshots.
WATSON (voice over): When 35 people were killed by a lone gunman at Port Arthur in Tasmania. That attack prompted the center-right government of the
time to enact some of the world's strictest gun laws.
Rates of gun violence plummeted.
JOHN HOWARD, FORMER AUSTRALIAN PRIME MINISTER: And the whole country just reeled for days afterwards, and the overwhelming feeling was, this is
terrible. We had to do something about it.
A multi-million dollar buyback scheme was put in place with a short amnesty period before guns were made illegal, except under license, with strict
conditions.
Semiautomatic weapons like the one used at Port Arthur are completely banned, but the guns turned on children, families and the elderly as they
celebrated Hanukkah on Sunday were owned legally. A 50-year-old suspect killed at the scene held permits to six long-barreled guns.
Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albanese now says that one response to this tragedy must be to tighten gun laws further.
ANTHONY ALBANESE, AUSTRALIAN PRIME MINISTER: The government is prepared to take whatever action is necessary, included in that is the need for tougher
gun laws.
WATSON (voice over): The Australian government has shown it can legislate to curb gun violence. People here in Bondi are demanding an end to
antisemitism along with it.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: The Prime Minister is calling for unity in the wake of the shooting. He said, the Prime Minister is facing criticism at home and abroad for the
rise in antisemitism in Australia.
Israel's Prime Minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, has accused his Australian counterpart of ignoring the problem and linked it to Australia's recent
recognition of a Palestinian state.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER: Your government did nothing to stop the spread of antisemitism in Australia.
[16:05:10]
You did nothing to curb the cancer cells that were growing inside your country. You took no action. You let the disease spread and the result is
the horrific attacks on Jews we saw today.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Dionne Taylor is the communications manager for Australia's Israel and Jewish Affairs Council, and she joins me now from Sydney.
My first, of course condolences and our thoughts and of course, particularly if you have friends or family that were individually affected
or were involved.
But of course, the Jewish community in Sydney is not that large and therefore, I am guessing, everybody knows somebody who has been affected by
this.
DIONNE TAYLOR, COMMUNICATIONS MANAGER FOR AUSTRALIA'S ISRAEL AND JEWISH AFFAIRS COUNCIL: Yes, you're absolutely right and thank you for having me
on your program. We are just one degree of separation from each other, a very small community, mostly centered around the eastern suburbs, which is
where Bondi Beach is.
One of my colleagues, Arsen Ostrovsky, he is the head of the Sydney office of the Australia Israel Jewish Affairs Council, and he was struck in the
head with a bullet. Thankfully, he is okay. He is in hospital and he will make a full recovery, but it is very close to home, not just with the
people, but literally it is close to home. It is 10 minutes from where I live. It is where I go three, four times a week, both by myself, with my
family, with my friends, Bondi Beach is an absolute hub. We are devastated.
QUEST: It is not easy to talk about these matters, but bearing in mind your job and the scenario and the situation, the Prime Minister of Israel is now
very firmly pinning some responsibility, if not, I mean, I don't want to use the word "blame," responsibility for the environment on Australia's
Prime Minister and on the Australian government. Do you think that's fair?
TAYLOR: I do think that's fair and I hope that he listens.
For months, the Jewish community have been warning the government that rising antisemitism, when left unchecked, would lead to violence. We
started with hate speech. We started -- then it moved to graffiti, then public demonstrations, then arson attacks, and now murder.
We've said it is only a matter of time before someone loses their life. He would not listen to it, and now here we are. We are mourning the lives of
people who have lost from a little ten year old girl through to a Holocaust survivor that came to Australia to seek refuge and peace, and now look
where we are.
And this, by the way, is not just a problem for the jews. This is a problem for all of Australia. If you look just at the demographics of Bondi Beach
being an internationally recognized tourist destination, it attracts people from all over the world and on Sundays, particularly in the afternoon, it
is buzzing. People are on the beach, they're on the grass, which is where the Hanukkah festival was.
And people, you've seen the footage are running for their lives. These things don't happen in in Australia. They just don't.
QUEST: But, I guess the balancing act, of course, is -- and I am very familiar with Bondi, one of the most beautiful beaches, picture perfect.
But I guess the difficulty is how you can allow the freedom of expression to criticize Israel, to criticize Israel's response to October the 7th, at
the same time, do not open the Pandora's Box to extremism or to radicalism.
TAYLOR: Well, this is exactly what we've seen. It has festered -- snowball effect when it has gone unchecked and it has gone unregulated. So when we
see marches in our streets, both in Sydney and in Melbourne, where mass crowds are there, calling to globalize the intifada, that is exactly what
has happened. This is a prime example.
And I would hate to think that this happens in other parts of the world. Look at what's happened in Sydney. Do not let this happen anywhere else.
QUEST: What now has to happen in Australia, do you think? Because I mean, I guess of the fascinating parts about this, of course, is of course, the
hero of the hour is a Syrian man who has come to Australia fleeing, of course, from what was happening in Syria.
So now you really do have, in a sense, the full circle of the Middle East taking place here.
TAYLOR: Yes, we sure do and we are hundreds of thousands of kilometers away. We believe that the people, the terrorists who killed the 15 people
so far were radicalized and we need to look at tighter immigration laws, values based immigration, giving visas to the right people and Ahmed al-
Ahmed is an absolute hero.
I believe that at least $1 million has been raised for him, and he needs to be recognized for his extreme heroic efforts.
[16:10:19]
QUEST: Dionne, maybe it is not entirely -- we still wish you Chag Sameach for Hanukkah, it is the second night, of course.
TAYLOR: Thank you.
QUEST: Second night you'll be lighting your candles or you were last night, for us, of course.
TAYLOR: Well actually, we are in the third, yes, tonight --
QUEST: Yes.
TAYLOR: -- we light the third candle and we won't stop and we will shine brighter. The light dispels the darkness.
QUEST: Absolutely. And here in New York, of course, where it is still only Monday night, we will be lighting the second. Thank you for joining us
tonight, to you and your family. Thank you.
TAYLOR: Thank you. Have a good day!
QUEST: Now, Los Angeles Police say Rob and Michele Reiner's son is responsible for their deaths.
Nick Reiner is being held without bail after the legendary Hollywood director and his wife were found dead in their home on Sunday. Nick Reiner
has spoken over the years about his own struggles with drug abuse and homelessness.
Josh Campbell is in Los Angeles.
We don't know many details, but I mean, the horrificness of this is off the charts.
JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: It is, and a significant development in this ongoing investigation. As you mentioned, it is the
couple's son that police now have in custody booked on suspicion of murder.
I spoke with a law enforcement source last night who told me that after police came to the home and found the bodies of the couple, they then
interviewed a family member as part of this ongoing investigation. They were working throughout the night, Richard, building their case and again
making that announcement today that it is Nick Reiner who is now in custody.
We are working to determine whether he has attorney representation, but at this point, authorities haven't released any information, Richard, about
any possible motive.
QUEST: I was about to say, I mean, do we know any more -- without being prurient? Do we know any more details about what is alleged to have
happened here?
CAMPBELL: We don't know specifically. We have seen reports that Nick Reiner had suffered from potential addiction and mental health issues and so that
will be part of this investigation as well, to try to determine whether the what was some type of conflict that was going on at the moment, whether
this was something that may have been pre-planned and premeditated, so to speak. That's all what authorities are trying to get at right now.
We also don't know if he is cooperating with authorities. Sometimes in these cases, someone will confess if they've done something wrong. Other
times, you know, they refuse to talk, they get a lawyer, in which case authorities have to then try to find other ways to try to prove their case,
including going through with forensic teams through that residence, trying to look for a potential murder weapon, trying to again place him there at
the scene in proximity.
A lot of these wealthy homes now around L.A. also have significant video cameras as well, and so that would be also part of the investigation as
well to try to determine, did they capture anything on video that might point to when this was done and why?
QUEST: The level of shock must be again, extraordinary there?
CAMPBELL: Yes, yes. Absolutely.
QUEST: So what happens next? I mean, for Nick Reiner? I mean, I saw reports that a bail had been set, but at some, you know, $4 million or so. But he
has obviously not met that or he has been kept in custody.
CAMPBELL: That's right. Yes, and just actually moments ago, we got an update from the Los Angeles Police Department that there is now no bail in
this case, which means, you know, as you mentioned earlier in the day, it had been set at $4 million. That was in change.
So no, he won't be released pending a potential, you know, hearing, an initial appearance here. We do expect that police investigators in L.A.
will turn over their case to prosecutors tomorrow for potential charges, in which case that would start the process in earnest of actually prosecuting
this individual for these alleged crimes.
And so again, we are waiting for more details about what are the specific facts that they're using to hold him, that would presumably be in charging
documents that they would, you know, they would then release and we will see, you know, where it goes from here.
One thing we do know, Richard, is you know this well. I've been covering so many stories here out of L.A., Los Angeles Police Department is no stranger
to these high profile, high stress, high interest investigations, and so that's why we are told by them that they are going through this
methodically, trying to build their case, making it as strong as they can.
QUEST: Absolutely. If there is one area -- if there is one -- both district attorney and police department that knows how to do it in the full glare of
publicity, it is there.
Thank you, sir. I am grateful. Thank you.
CAMPBELL: Always, thanks.
QUEST: QUEST MEANS BUSINESS tonight. In a moment, the Chief Executive of Wizz Air, we are going to be discussing plans to launch a hub in Israel, a
return to Ukraine and just how many planes are still on the ground because of engine and supply chain issues that is holding back the expansion of one
of Europe's top carriers.
QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:17:33]
QUEST: Wizz Air just welcomed its 60,000,000th passenger, flying in Hungary. It hit the milestone on a recent flight from Budapest to Tallinn,
the very same route that launched the airline more than 20 years ago and the airline itself isn't planning on slowing down. Recently, revealed plans
for new routes and a base in Israel, and a return to Ukraine once the fighting stops. It was the largest non-Ukrainian carrier before the war
began.
Chief executive of Wizz is Joe Varadi. Joe is with me now.
Sir, it is always good to see you. Good evening to you in Budapest. Let's start, though, with the two developments. I mean, the decision to open in
Israel at the same time as you had closed the Abu Dhabi hub. And I know it is not apples and oranges or whether it is apples and oranges in a sense
that Abu Dhabi was a different -- it was a different setup et cetera, et cetera. But Israel is going to be quite a large base for you when it gets
up and running.
JOZSEF VARADI, CEO, WIZZ AIR: Well, good evening, Richard. Thank you for inviting me to your show.
Indeed, these are fascinating changes in the business. I think we have been elaborating on why we were closing Abu Dhabi. We had to do that because of
the changing set of circumstances with the regulators, also with the engines that we had on hand.
Israel is a very different story, very unrelated to Abu Dhabi. We are the largest inbound carrier to Israel, and we think we can take the next step
to lower cost of living for Israelis in order to benefit from the services of Israel, which is already the largest inbound carrier in the country.
QUEST: Your competitors, the low-cost carriers there, are already crying foul, saying your costs are not the same. You don't bear the same security
costs as they do, and that they are saying that they will be facing unfair competition when you start.
VARADI: Of course, this is not true. We have been operating to Israel for about ten years, with no incident, no events whatsoever, and we have been
very proud of what we've been able to achieve. I think we have been really an economic engine for Israel, not only creating low cost travel
opportunities for the Israelis and people who want to visit Israel, but also stimulating the market, creating a lot of jobs.
And we would just be doing more of it by establishing ourselves as a base carrier. We are working closely with the government, also with some other
stakeholders in the market to make sure that we are playing fairly and equitably, but we simply are just a more efficient carrier than any of the
local carriers there.
[16:20:16]
QUEST: Last week we had Willie Walsh on the program. Willie Walsh says he does -- he expects very slowly supply chain issues to get better, but he
was not at all optimistic in any way about it. How many aircrafts on the ground have you got at the moment?
VARADI: We've got 35 aircrafts on the ground. I think we start seeing some improvements because last time around, it was 45. Going into summer of
2026, we are expecting 25 aircraft on the ground. And by the end of 2027, we expect the whole fleet, being operated and flying.
So it is a slow motion, but it is happening and it is progressing and I am very hopeful that in the foreseeable future, in about two years, this issue
will get largely behind us.
QUEST: You see, that's what you're on the record as saying. It is once you've got the full fleet up and running, that the true power of Wizz Air
will be seen.
VARADI: Well, absolutely. Just imagine Wizz Air in two years from now. By that time, our entire fleet will be renewed and will be entirely new
technology, which gives the best economic performance, the best sustainability performance.
We are going to be upgrading from 180 seater A320 to a 239seater A321 aircraft, and all of these aircrafts will be flying. So imagine that, and
the performance coming out of that level of economic efficiency and environmental efficiency.
QUEST: So what do you believe is the natural perfect stage length for a Wizz Air flight? Because you and I have talked, you're not going long haul.
You're sort of going to be that sweet spot of short to medium haul where you get the maximum efficiencies of the route and the fuel and the costs.
What do you believe that is?
VARADI: Well, if you want me to say one number, a thousand miles, 1,600 kilometers. I think this is the sweet spot.
QUEST: And when we look at the future, let's talk about Ukraine, finally. I know neither of -- both airlines, neither of you are going to fly until it
is safe and there is a ceasefire, that's a given. Who will get there first? You or Michael at Ryanair?
VARADI: Look, we were the last airline leaving Ukraine, we are going to be the first airline returning to Ukraine. We had operating bases in Ukraine.
We will have operating bases in Ukraine going back to market. We believe that Wizz Air is best set to be the hometown carrier for the Ukrainians and
we will act accordingly.
You should be seeing us starting from a poor position to be the first, at the end of the race, to get to the market.
QUEST: We look forward to the race and we look forward to your return. Thank you as always, sir, for joining us. I am always grateful for your
time. Thank you.
VARADI: Thank you.
QUEST: Coming up, the police investigation at the shooting at Brown University say they have new information as the manhunt continues. We will
have the details in just a moment.
QUEST MEANS BUSINESS, good evening to you.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:26:30]
QUEST: Hello, I am Richard Quest. Together, we've got a lot more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. We will be live on Bondi Beach, where our local hero is
earning international praise for intervening in the mass shooting, and a company that introduced one of the first ever domestic robots is filing for
bankruptcy. We will only get to that after the news, because this is CNN and here, the news always comes first.
The son of the filmmaker, Rob Weiner and his wife, Michele, have been arrested in connection to their deaths. The couple was found dead on Sunday
at their home in Los Angeles. The police say 32-year-old Nick Reiner has been booked on suspicion of murder.
Rob Reiner was the acclaimed director of "This is Spinal Tap" and "When Harry Met Sally." His son has openly struggled with drug abuse.
Germany's Chancellor Friedrich Merz said a ceasefire between Russia and Ukraine now seems possible. President Trump is striking a cautious tone,
optimistic after speaking to Volodymyr Zelenskyy. Mr. Trump said the end of the war is closer now than ever, while acknowledging hurdles remain.
Australia is vowing to strengthen its already strict gun laws after the deadliest massacre in decades. Authorities say 15 people were killed when
two gunmen, a father and a son, opened fire as the crowd celebrated Hanukkah on Sydney's Bondi Beach.
The police killed one attacker at the scene, the other was being critically wounded.
Now, amidst the horror and the sadness, there is also that story of extraordinary, tremendous bravery. The video captured at the scene, which
some of you may find a little disturbing, but it is worth seeing because it shows a bystander risking his life, tackling one of the shooters.
He then wrestles the gun away from him. Just have a watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is a man.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh no!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: Now the hero, 43-year-old Ahmed al-Ahmed, the son of Syrian refugees and a father of two girls.
Lara Vella of Nine News Today is with me at Bondi Beach.
What extraordinary heroics. What's the mood? What's the reaction to that in Sydney and in Australia?
LARA VELLA, NINE NEWS TODAY CORRESPONDENT: Richard, just unbelievable, isn't it, that in the last few days we have witnessed both the worst of our
country and the best of our country.
Australia is this morning a nation united in both shock and sorrow, following the worst terror attack on Australian soil.
Richard, I am joining you this morning live from Bondi's iconic boardwalk, which I am sure you have visited in the past and I have no doubt many of
your viewers will recognize as well.
Normally, on a summer's day, this place would be heaving with tourists and locals and the boardwalk would be scattered with things like towels and
surfboards.
This morning, though, it has instead been replaced by the floral tribute you may be able to see behind me this morning, which continues to grow. I
have seen many people coming down here this morning either laying some flowers or just taking a moment for themselves of quiet reflection.
No doubt in their minds, the 15 innocent lives that were taken by those two terrorists, the youngest victim, just ten years old. Her name is Matilda.
She is known for her gorgeous personality and her infectious smile. Among them well respected rabbis, we know a French national, even a Holocaust
survivor whose life was taken as a result of those two murderers.
[16:30:33]
But no doubt, Richard, also in their minds when they come down and pay their respects at these floral tribute sites, are, as you say, those
remarkable acts of bravery that we saw. Everyone from life savers coming to the rescue, using surfboards as stretchers, locals intervening and helping,
doing what they could. The scenes that we saw on Sunday, I think, all of us as a nation are still struggling to come to terms with.
And as the shock and the grief is still settling, well, now, of course, the political blame game is arising. We now have questions surrounding why our
intelligence agencies were not more closely monitoring the father and son assailants that were responsible, particularly the younger of the
offenders.
Now, that we know that he came to the attention of our security agents' agencies back in 2019 as a result of some of the online extremist material
that he was accessing.
(CROSSTALK)
QUEST: Right.
VELLA: And, of course, also, whether or not the prime minister and the government had been taking the rise and the threats of anti-Semitism more
seriously. But right now, at the moment, at the forefront of, really the highest level of conversations --
(CROSSTALK)
QUEST: OK.
VELLA: Whether or not we are going to reform our gun laws here in Australia as well.
QUEST: Right. But let's just -- let me just ask you about this criticism from Benjamin Netanyahu. Very blunt against the prime minister and the
government, saying, look, you allowed this to take this ferment of anti- Semitism to rise unchecked. And now, the Jewish community, and clearly believes that to be the case.
What is the general feeling on that score?
VELLA: Well, certainly, he didn't mince his words, and it was very pointed that attack on the Prime Minister Anthony Albanese. I think, it is an
unfair criticism to say that they have allowed this to go unchecked. I don't think that is fair.
However, there is a real spotlight and a real focus on at the moment now, why when we knew that there was going to be a large member of the Jewish
community gathering here in Bondi, perhaps, why there weren't -- where there wasn't a high level of a security presence here at that time. And, of
course, we do know that this rise of anti-Semitism has been simmering here in Australia.
I think some of the criticism laid towards the prime minister from Benjamin Netanyahu, has been a little harsh, but no doubt there are going to be
conversations moving forward, and no doubt there's going to be also some questions being raised from the Australia -- Australia's Jewish community,
as well, as how on earth this was able to happen right here in the middle of Bondi Beach.
QUEST: Lara, I'm grateful. Thank you very much. A beautiful -- a beautiful part of the world. Thank you for joining us this morning.
Now, in a moment, we will turn a completely different direction. The company behind the revolutionary Roomba robot has filed for bankruptcy. So,
why should something that seemed like such a good idea and everybody thought was rather cute and actually liked it? What's gone wrong?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:36:30]
QUEST: Authorities in the U.S. state of Rhode Island say they are analyzing your video in connection with the deadly mass shooting at Brown University,
where two students were killed and nine more injured at the Ivy League school. It all took place on Saturday, the third day of the manhunt.
John Miller is with me. Well, this is a conundrum, isn't it? I mean, to find, I'm guessing that they will find the murderer?
JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: Well, these cases almost always get solved, but in our experience, and you know
this from having covered them, they usually resolve in one of three ways, either the killer is confronted by police during the shooting and
neutralized, as they like to use that term. Sometimes, the active shooter will take their own life as police close in, and sometimes they surrender.
In this case, we had someone complete a shooting of this many people and then walk off the set and keep going. That's a little unusual, not
unprecedented, but a little unusual. And the idea that, in this day and age, where there is a camera every three feet, shooting from six different
directions. They are having real trouble finding a viable image that they could crowd source with the public to say, who knows this man.
QUEST: Interesting. So, what happens next in a sense?
MILLER: Well, I mean, they had a person of interest in custody yesterday, who they basically eliminated by investigating the forensics, the evidence,
making their comparisons and saying we've got to go in another direction. It appears we have the wrong person.
Now, you see, they are literally back out there, knocking the snow away, walking through the yards, looking, was there a gun tossed? Was there a
magazine that was tossed? Is there a cigarette butt that somebody, you know, left that could have DNA. They are going through the old tips that
they still have to cover, and they have got new tips, fresh ones in today about different people, different names. They are going to run all that to
ground the old-fashioned way.
In the meantime, they would really like to expand that Canvas for cameras and video to see, is there a clearer picture, because that is a way that is
proven time and time again to be effective.
QUEST: John, allow me to move you to Bondi Beach, if I may, into Australia. These -- I just need to get your perspective. This idea -- you've obviously
been listening to the coverage, and you will have heard this idea that Benjamin Netanyahu is now beating up on the prime minister of Australia,
saying, you did not -- you did not put the lid on the anti-Semitism, and this is what happens as a result of that. And you heard the graphic nature
of the criticism.
With your perspective, what do you make of that? Is that a valid, in a sense, criticism?
MILLER: Well, I think we are dealing with two different things here. It's impossible to say that this is not an anti-Semitic act. Jews were targeted
at a Jewish event for a Jewish holiday. It is what it is.
But I think the distinction here is that the atmosphere that Netanyahu is talking about in Australia, which you could talk about in France, which you
could talk about in Germany, which you could talk about in Great Britain, is this increasing amount of anti-Semitism that comes in the form of
graffiti, hate crimes, things that people say, physical attacks, one person or another.
[16:40:08]
This was an act of terrorism. Investigators found in that car, ISIS propaganda. We are told the -- an ISIS flag as it was described. These
people came armed to the teeth, father and son with six weapons, improvised explosive devices.
This was more than just an anti-Semitic attack. This is probably a by- product of what we have seen as ISIS propaganda has encouraged those on the listening end to put together simple attacks. And what have we seen? A
Christmas market plot that was thwarted in Germany.
The attack that started in Dearborn, Michigan, planned for multiple locations. Two individuals in New Jersey connected with them, another in
the state of Washington, talking to people overseas in Great Britain and Somalia. This is a global propaganda network.
And what happened in Australia, in all likelihood, is going to end up being one of those cases. So, yes, it's anti-Semitism, but it's also beyond that.
QUEST: John, I am so grateful. Thank you, sir. Thank you for joining us. Thank you.
MILLER: Thank you.
QUEST: To Hong Kong now, where the media tycoon, Jimmy Lai has been found guilty in a landmark national security trial in Hong Kong. He was one of
the highest profile critics of Beijing following a series of pro-democracy protests in Hong Kong.
He is been charged under the sweeping national security law that was put on place in 2020.
CNN's Kristie Lu Stout from Hong Kong reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KRISTIE LU STOUT, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): After 156 days, a verdict for Hong Kong media mogul Jimmy Lai, guilty of sedition and two counts of
colluding with foreign forces. Lai is the most high-profile critic of Beijing, charged under the national security law that was imposed on Hong
Kong in 2020.
The trial has been widely viewed as a measure of the city's shrinking freedoms under Chinese rule. Lai had pleaded not guilty to the charges.
LU STOUT: CNN was in court for the ruling, and Jimmy Lai appeared calm, wearing glasses, a blazer, and a light green sweater.
At one point, he raised his hand and smiled at his wife and one of his sons, who was sitting behind me in the gallery alongside Cardinal Joseph
Zen, another outspoken critic of the Chinese Communist Party. When the verdict was read aloud, Jimmy Lai, wearing headphones, looked straight
ahead, and there was complete silence in the court.
LU STOUT (voice over): Lai founded the now defunct Apple Daily, once Hong Kong's largest pro-democracy newspaper, which regularly challenged the
government.
He was a fixture at anti-government protests that brought Hong Kong to a standstill in 2014, and was considered by many as a father figure to Hong
Kong's pro-democracy movement.
JIMMY LAI, MEDIA TYCOON, HONG KONG: I think it's a good idea, anytime, any situation that you are in to fight for freedom. Because without freedom,
you have nothing left.
LU STOUT (voice over): Scores of people, many supporters of life, stood in line for a chance to witness the verdict. Some even sleeping overnight
outside the court building to secure a spot.
Security was tight, with police officers and vehicles out in force. The trial has attracted global scrutiny, with the U.S. and other countries
demanding Jimmy Lai's release.
Weeks before he was arrested, Lai appealed to U.S. President Donald Trump for help.
An administration official told CNN that Trump raised Lai's case with Chinese leader Xi Jinping, during their talks in South Korea earlier this
year.
Chinese authorities have warned repeatedly against foreign interference. Hong Kong's government insists that Lai has been given a fair trial, and
Beijing is backing that.
GUO JIAKUN, SPOKESMAN, CHINESE FOREIGN MINISTRY (through translator): The central government firmly supports the Hong Kong Special Administrative
Region in lawfully upholding national security and punishing criminal acts that endanger national security.
LU STOUT (voice over): Jimmy Lai has been in prison for the last five years. His family concerned that incarceration is taking its toll. The Hong
Kong government says Lai has been getting regular medical checkups and is receiving, "suitable treatment and care".
Lai left court in a prison van, he now awaits sentencing. Collusion with foreign forces is punishable by up to life in prison. At 78 years old, life
for Jimmy Lai would most likely mean life. Kristie Lu Stout, CNN, Hong Kong.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST: In a moment, we turn our attention to pizza, pizzanomics. All right. So, you've got your pizza, and ideally you want that one, but maybe that
one, but really, you're only prepared to pay for this one, and the slices are not what they use to be.
[16:45:00]
In a moment, the CEO of Slice talks about pizzanomics and why we are doing -- I mean, if this thing survives long enough. I love a slice of pizza.
After the break. QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: IRobot, the maker of the Roomba vacuum cleaners filed a bankruptcy. The company struggled ever since its sale to Amazon was mutually called off
last year. iRobot's value has collapsed as less expensive rivals hit the market, and it's particularly hard hit by tariffs, which the company says
costing $23 billion this year.
Clare Duffy is with me. This is awful. I mean, a good idea, everybody loves it, and the whole thing goes honorably wrong.
CLARE DUFFY, CNN BUSINESS AND TECH WRITER: Yes. Richard, it is kind of, I think, hard to remember what a big deal this was when the Roomba launched
in 2002. This felt like a huge futuristic invention that was getting us closer to a sort of Jetson style robot housekeeper, and felt like it was
going to usher in this new era of more helpful robotics for individuals.
And in some ways, I think the arc of this company sort of tells the story of just how far we still are from that vision coming to fruition. It really
was this failed Amazon acquisition that marked a turning point for the company. Amazon announced in 2022, plans to acquire I robot for $1.7
billion.
But European regulators did not like that plan. The two companies mutually decided to call off this deal last year. And despite the fact that Amazon
paid a $94 million breakup fee to iRobot, the company iRobot then had to lay off hundreds of employees, replaced its CEO. The company has been
trying to make a comeback this year by announcing new Roomba products, but as you said, tariffs have taken a massive hit to this company, and now, it
is announcing bankruptcy and plans to be acquired by its Chinese supplier, and of course, this will take its share price off the market.
But as you said there, the value has really just fallen off the cliff for this company this year.
QUEST: So, if I understand it rightly, the Europeans say you can't merge with Amazon, the company can't compete. So, I'm not quite sure what purpose
the Europeans decision makes. And everybody else, it's basically cheap competition that's done it in.
DUFFY: Yes. It is kind of a tricky question here. You know, would it have been better for Amazon to acquire this company? Of course, it would have
benefited Amazon's portfolio of home robotics. Amazon is a very powerful company. But on the flip side, you do question, is it better to have this
distressed company that then is going to take away, you know, options in the marketplace for consumers?
[16:50:08]
Roomba does say that it -- iRobot does say that it will continue to fulfill its obligations to consumers despite this bankruptcy proceeding. But I do
think it is an interesting question here of whether this was a successful call by European regulators.
QUEST: Interesting. Thank you. Thank you very much.
And we are talking pizza now from the cleaner bottles, right? Pizza is a quick, cheap, and reliable meal. What a monster, this is perfect any time
of the day or night, cold or after a night out on the town. What could be better.
Anyway, as prices are going higher, pizza is getting smaller, and company - - customers are ordering pies with less toppings or fewer slices.
So, for example, here, I've got a basic, I've got a straightforward cheese and tomato, a straightforward one. I've got bit with pepperoni, and I've
got a lot with a bit of chicken and cheese and all sorts of fancy bit at the top, it's the add-ons, like the extra cheese and chicken, that can push
the dollars up to $5 a slice. Even the average price for basic cheese pizzas increased 22 percent in the last five years.
Now, pizzerias are struggling to sell more than a plain slice. So, this one to run 275, it's a stretch from the old days of dollar a slice.
So, is pizza recession-proof, recession resistant, or neither?
Ilir Sela is the CEO of the pizza delivery app Slice is with me now.
What do you say, sir? We always thought of cookies and biscuits and cakes as being recession resistant, because people bought them anyway. So, tell
me about pizza.
ILIR SELA, CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, SLICE: Yes, pizza remains a core part of every family's weekly habit. It is in America an institution. But
clearly, as you said, Richard, consumers are adjusting a little bit as they start feeling the pressure from an economic standpoint.
So, what we're seeing from Slice's data point is consumers adjusting in two ways. One is they will order every Friday night, which is the typical
weekly Friday pizza night, but the pizza will be smaller. So, instead of a large pie, they will downgrade to a smaller pie, or a medium cheese pizza.
And then, without a doubt, they are ordering less toppings, as the price of toppings has started to really scale up to, in some cases, as much as $6
per topping.
(CROSSTALK)
QUEST: Right. Now --
SELA: And so, consumers continue to love but it is certainly an adjustment.
QUEST: OK. So, where -- from the producer's point of view, from the restaurant or the pizzerias point of view, where is their extra costs
coming from? Is it -- is it input costs of the food, the cheese, the tariffs, and all of these sort of things, the cost of labor, the cost of
fuel? What's driven it up?
SELA: Yes, certainly, I think there are two major players. One is the cost of labor has gone up, as minimum wage continues to inch up, especially in
different states. You can see the price start reflecting that. As an example, while the national average is $17 for a cheese pizza, in
California, that number is over $20 -- as an example.
So, the labor constraints and the cost of labor is contributing to that. We also see, because of cost of labor, delivery fees are going up, and
therefore consumers are choosing to pick up their order more than waiting for delivery. And that is, pick up is the largest -- the fastest growing
cohort that we see from our data. But it's absolutely predominantly labor driven. And then, I would say secondary is the cost of actual product led
by the cost of cheese.
Folks may not know this, but cheese makes up over 70 percent of the cost of a pizza.
QUEST: Really? And, by the way, you've just answered the question I was about to say, why is California more expensive? And now, of course, it's
because of the labor cost, because of higher minimum wage.
On this other front of delivery, because, of course, slice, you have made your name, your reputation, and your whole business around this idea of
independent pizzerias using you either back end for sort of the ordering and they deliver it, or for the delivery mechanisms yourself.
But that's a reflection, I guess, of the -- of the commercialization of delivery from places like Uber Eats, which take a greater commission.
SELA: That's right. For Slice, we are -- the simple way to describe Slice is we give scale to independence. We bring them together so that they can
benefit from the economies of scale that large chains benefit from. 85 percent of the orders that are placed for delivery with Slice are delivered
by the staff of the pizza shop.
QUEST: Yes.
[16:55:08]
SELA: So, these are not third-party delivery orders.
We just make that experience a lot more efficient and more rewarding to the consumer. But yes, third party platforms, without a doubt, you can expect
menu prices to be marked up by even 30 percent more on those -- on those platforms.
QUEST: OK. As we come to an end, sir, I got to -- where is your favorite pizza? Who makes your favorite? Which local pizza here in New York.
I have to tell you the one near where I live in Chelsea, on the corner of where I live in, best pizza in the world. Best pizza in the world, and I
can't tell you where, obviously, because then everybody will be going there.
Where is for you? Where is the best pizza?
SELA: So, Richard, you answered the question, the best pizza is the one closest to you. That's the one that people grew up with, or the one that's
really the anchor of their neighborhood in the corner.
(CROSSTALK)
QUEST: All right. So --
SELA: For me, that's RIA Giovan (PH).
QUEST: Right. So, last question, is it a heresy? Should I be kicked out because I like Hawaiian pizza? I like pineapple on my pizza. And I know
this is something that highly controversial.
SELA: Very controversial, but the beauty of pizza is that you can have it however you want it, Richard.
And so, for folks who love pineapple on pizza, by all means, go for it, not for me.
QUEST: No.
SELA: But the beauty of pizza is that you can have it, I know you like it.
QUEST: Sir, the disgust in your face and your voice left nobody in any doubt as to what you think of my Hawaiian pizza.
I'm grateful to you, sir. We'll share a slice in 2026.
We will take a "PROFITABLE MOMENT" after the break. QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Tonight's a "PROFITABLE MOMENT", there is so much grim news around that I think tonight we just need to talk about pizza, frankly. And why?
Because when the day is really bad and when you are not sure what on earth is happening, and it's looking cold because it was left over from the night
before, but the microwave will soon put this thing right.
And whether or not you can afford the full pie or just a slice, when all said and done, there is something removed, a bit of a -- bit of a droop.
When all said and done, there is just something reassuring and the world might be OK, just for the moment, when you sit down and enjoy your little
slice of pizza, whatever you've got on it.
[17:00:07]
The cheese, the pineapple, don't you start. Or the pepperoni, just whatever it is. Everything is OK with the slice of pizza.
And that' QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for tonight, I'm Richard Quest in New York. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead --
Cold pizza is just as good.
END
