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Quest Means Business
New British Prime Minister Promises An End To Political Dysfunction; New U.K. Prime Minister Faces Stretched Public Finances; Judge Puts Temporary Pause On Paramount-WBD Merger; World Cup Has Most Watched Halftime Show In History; Unity And Meaningful Change Themes Behind First Halftime Show; ZINELL: European Union's New Border Control System "Simply Too Slow". Aired 4-5p ET
Aired July 20, 2026 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:41]
RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS": Trading is finished on Wall Street. The bells rung and markets have come to a close.
The Dow Jones Industrials as you can see down 305. It was a miserable session across the board, but the triple stack shows a slightly different
story. It is not off as far and had actually been a little bit more optimistic as the session went on.
And those are the markets and the events of the day: Britain's new Prime Minister pledges to restore stability on his first day in office, and
promises a ten-year plan.
One of the biggest mergers in corporate history is on hold as a judge hits the pause button on Paramount's takeover of our parent company, WBD --
Warner Bros Discovery.
And World Cup history was made on Sunday. The first halftime show, at least for a FIFA World Cup. The company that made it happen, they will be with us
on the program tonight.
We are live in New York, Monday, July the 20th. I am Richard Quest back from Route 66, and I most certainly mean business.
Good evening. The United Kingdom's new Prime Minister is promising to deliver something that the U.K. hasn't seen for years: Political stability.
Andy Burnham, the former mayor of Manchester, he is now the Labour Party leader, and by definition, because Labour has the most seats in Parliament,
is the Prime Minister.
Today, he replaced Sir Keir Starmer at Number 10.
Prime Minister Burnham is the country's seventh prime minister in 10 years. He said the British public is tired of politics as usual and promised
sweeping changes.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDY BURNHAM, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: We will make this moment a circuit breaker for Britain, bringing forward the biggest changes in the last 40
years: A new political model and a new economic model.
We will change politics to make it more collaborative, more about problem solving than point-scoring and we will take power out of here and carry it
into every postcode in the land so that they can do more.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
QUEST: A new political model and a new economic model. Well, already happening. Mr. Burnham is turning to Sir Keir's former Defense Minister,
John Healey, as the new Finance Minister, the Chancellor of the Exchequer.
Ed Miliband, has been promoted to be the Foreign Secretary and Shabana Mahmood, she remains as Home Secretary, had been thought that she might go
to the Treasury.
Max Foster is with me. He is in Downing Street.
What do you understand a new political and a new economic model to mean?
MAX FOSTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It is interesting. I mean, definitely Andy Burnham spoken a lot about cost of living. It is going to focus -- a lot of
his premiership will focus on economy. Of course, we haven't had any detail on exactly what that means.
So, a great speech today. He went off script, but he hasn't given any detail about how he is going to distribute the finite resources that he has
in government.
It was a very interesting hearing John Healey get appointed because no one was suggesting him beforehand. Does say a lot about the secrecy around
Burnham and how he managed to keep that from leaking, but as you say, Mahmood was up for the job as far as most people were concerned,
representing the right of the party and Ed Miliband on the left was also the frontrunner. They ended up with consolation prizes effectively, but of
course you'll remember when Healey resigned from Starmer's government because he said essentially the Defense Department wasn't getting enough
money, he has also since then been very critical of the Treasury, saying, well, he basically criticized the Treasury orthodoxy, arguing it had become
a dead hand on dynamic government.
He is now within that Treasury. Wes Streeting is coming in. So that indicates that he is going to get a job.
[16:05:10 ]
He of course was another frontrunner to replace Keir Starmer, but decided not to run in the end, probably because he didn't have enough support and
ended up supporting Andy Burnham.
But all the big jobs have gone, so he is going to get something more junior if he chooses to take it.
But on, Healey going into the Treasury, Richard, he has now got to sort of live up to all the criticism of the Treasury he has made, and you can
assume he is going to give the Defense Department more money.
QUEST: Well, that was somewhat ironic if he didn't having resigned over exactly that point. But I am interested in what Burnham said. Basically, a
10-year plan is going to be put together over the next few months, but he was at pains to point out that he would be able to help the British people
more immediately on the affordability question, which he said he would address in the next few days.
Is he in danger of promising something to everyone?
FOSTER: Well, what his team are consistently pushing is that everything that he does is costed. So, we will wait to see how that plays out. You
know, if you take the Defense Department, for example, that's a huge amount of money that Healey was arguing for, for the Armed Forces, he has to find
that somewhere and there just isn't any money in the pot.
You know, nothing has changed from Starmer's accounts, so he is going to have to start looking -- I mean, there is talk of wealth taxes, but a lot
of these things are speculative, and until we actually hear it from him, because as I say, he has got this very tight group and nothing seems to be
leaking from them.
QUEST: Max Foster in Downing Street.
Max, I am grateful. Thank you.
The British public has grown increasingly dissatisfied with their political leaders. That's the gist of what Burnham said. The economist looked at a
variety of polls to come up with these averages. It shows support for Labour. That's the red line dwindling to around 20 percent of voters over
the last year and a half.
John Rentoul is the chief political commentator for "The Independent." John is with me now.
You know, Andy Burnham did a very good job of trying to rally this idea of we are all British together and together, you know -- but at the same time,
he is making a lot of promises that will be hard to deliver upon.
JOHN RENTOUL, CHIEF POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, "THE INDEPENDENT": Oh, absolutely. I mean, Max put it very well. I mean, by appointing John Healey
as Chancellor, he is implying that he accepts that John Healey was right when he resigned from the government, that the government was not spending
enough on defense, so he has got to find billions more for defense spending over the next -- over the sort of planning period.
QUEST: Right.
RENTOUL: Plus, Andy Burnham has been spraying out implied promises to fix social care, which is a big problem. The care of the elderly. He wants to
make that an NHS-like service, which means the taxpayers are going to pay for it. He wants to deal with -- he wants to offer instant relief on the
cost of living. I mean by plucking money out of thin air presumably. I don't know quite how he is going to fund that.
And he is promising the biggest change in our politics for 40 years.
QUEST: But John --
RENTOUL: I mean, it is going to end in trouble.
QUEST: You're not the first person to have said that. Martin Wolf, writing in "The FT" was sort of very similarly saying, if he doesn't get his books
in order -- but here is the real challenge in a sense, if he manages to get his own M.P.s on his side, with his huge majority, he can wield that, even
though there are only a few more years till the next election.
If he manages to get his own party with him, he will be formidable at passing legislation.
RENTOUL: Well, yes, but I mean, Keir Starmer was theoretically in that position and the problem with Labour M.P.s is that they want to spend money
and they forced Keir Starmer to U-Turn on several important spending commitments, which meant that Rachel Reeves had to put taxes up by even
more than she had already done in her first budget.
So if John Healey and his first budget this autumn also puts taxes up by even more, I don't see that that's necessarily going to result in the
government being more popular.
QUEST: As a politician, though, is Andy Burnham more savvy and unlikely to make the sort of cataclysmic mistake of getting rid of the pensioners'
winter fuel allowance, which really, you know, there is an argument that would say Keir Starmer never really recovered after that. That and paying
off the public sector workers, buying them off.
[16:10:10]
RENTOUL: Yes. Well, yes, I mean, it is very difficult to see what else what else he could have done with the public sector workers. I mean, he had to -
- I mean, they should have attached terms and conditions to those settlements, obviously. But the winter fuel payment assumed huge symbolic
significance and I can't believe it is just that that the people were unhappy about, I think there was a much more sort of general unhappiness.
And I think it is just to do with the fact that the economy is not working very well. Taxes are extremely high. People are resentful about immigration
and I am not sure that Andy Burnham has got any answers to any of those problems.
QUEST: We will find out. You will help us over the years ahead.
Thank you, sir. I am grateful.
The new Prime Minister inherits a difficult economic landscape. The U.K.'s economy has struggled. Growth is mediocre. Many are feeling the cost of
living. Government borrowing costs are the highest amongst the G7 and Andy Burnham has to navigate without putting greater strain on the finances,
which are already stretched.
The IMF research note on Britain noted that gilts have risen above G7 peers, and that can be seen as investors losing confidence.
Mohamed El-Erian is with me.
Now, a new economic model. You know, whenever I hear as somebody saying phrases like that, grab your wallet and head for the hills. Do you know
what he means?
MOHAMED EL-ERIAN, ECONOMIST AND ADVISOR, ALLIANZ: I think I do. First, he means a greater emphasis on the implementation of growth policies. One of
the problems with the former government is that they spoke a lot about growth, but actually didn't sustain the implementation.
The other thing he means is regionalization of growth engines, so that the U.K. has more than one engine going forward, and then third, a greater
emphasis on targeted social spending. So I think of those three things as being a step further than what the Starmer government did, but also
maintaining fiscal responsibility.
QUEST: Can you do that? Regionalization, you know, it has been tried a number ten of the north and all of that. But at the end of the day, paying
the bills and keeping to Rachel Reeves' fiscal restraint -- fiscal promises.
Now, the triple lock is something else when it comes to pensions. That is also very expensive. Can he do it?
EL-ERIAN: He can, but there are going to be some really difficult decisions. And critically, Richard, he has to learn from the good, the bad
and the ugly of the previous government. The good is the notion of a growth mission and fiscal responsibility. The bad is the inability to translate a
growth mission into a comprehensive policy package that was applied in a consistent basis.
And the ugly and you heard about it, is this notion of the Treasury orthodoxy. This inclination of the U.K. apparatus to reduce economic policy
making, to narrow budget arithmetic. And every time that happens, we end up by getting the fiscal side right, but the growth side wrong and you and I
know you can't shrink to prosperity.
QUEST: I just wonder, this idea that the U.K. is ungovernable, the instability is inherent. It is all post-Brexit. And by the way, we didn't
hear anything from Andy Burnham on that in terms of Brexit or in terms of your E.U. or indeed on foreign policy yet. But do you buy this idea that
because of it all, the U.K. has become so unstable that it is almost ungovernable?
EL-ERIAN: I wouldn't go that far. I think had they avoided mistakes, you mentioned what I regard also as a big mistake, which is the first big
announcement from the government was on withdrawing the winter fuel subsidies. That was just silly politics. And then there was one mistake
after the other made, and the minute you start making mistakes, you're vulnerable.
The other big mistake, and I am not making a political judgment here, I am just making an economic statement, is to dismantle your main trading
relationship without having something to replace it.
Economists will tell you, be careful of dismantling something and have nothing to replace. You cannot replace something with nothing. And the U.K.
opted for Brexit without knowing what the alternative is.
So I think if there is an avoidance of mistakes, there is a pathway forward.
QUEST: Sir, we've kindly brought you in, so we are going to keep you here. You're doing double duty. I think it is what you economists call squeezing
the asset.
[16:15:10]
So we are going to squeeze the asset a little bit more because there is a bit more juice. We are talking about -- Mohamed and I will be discussing
prices -- oil prices -- particularly, this really knotty problem of why oil prices haven't gone up so harshly.
And also, Mohamed, I want to know from you your view on this idea that inflation -- we've passed the peak. Yes, arguably when it was $120.00 a
barrel, but we are still elevated at $90.00. It is all after the break.
QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: An American official is telling us that the U.S. is sending additional fighter jets to the Middle East as the conflict there seems to
be escalating.
President Trump has threatened retribution on Iran for the death of three U.S. service members who were killed in Jordan and Iraq over the weekend.
They are the first U.S. troops killed in the war since March.
Meanwhile, Tehran is stepping up its attacks on Kuwait, Bahrain and Jordan, countries with U.S. bases and traffic through the Strait of Hormuz has
declined amid tit-for-tat strikes.
Earlier, Brent crude briefly rose to $90.00, the first time it has been at that level. But as you can see, it fell back and WTI is considerably lower.
Gas prices in the United States have topped $4.00 a gallon for the second time since the Iran War started. There were some brief periods of relief
for consumers when a ceasefire had brought down prices sharply, and it helped bring down U.S. inflation to 3.5 percent.
The break in energy costs, also called inflation in Canada down to 2.8 from a 29-month high in May.
Mohamed is back with me, chief economic adviser to Allianz. Let's take this in two bits. Why do you think the oil price -- I mean, it is at $90.00.
They are fighting again. I know there is a lot of oil out there and gas out there, but not even going up to over a hundred. What's going on, do you
think?
EL-ERIAN: So the market has taken a lot of comfort from what happened previously, which it found more supplies. How did that happen? Well, as you
say, there was excessive supplies. Inventories were drawn down. So there was a buffer that was being used. And third, the U.S. proved very agile in
reorienting especially refined product.
[16:20:04]
And then on the demand side, Richard, we got the data last week from China. Their oil imports are down 40 percent. So you had what economists call
demand destruction.
So the good news is that some of this stuff continues, the bad news is inventories in particular are at levels that we haven't seen since the 80s.
QUEST: When do you say demand destruction from the Chinese? Is that as a result of lower demand for their products? What is driving that demand
destruction?
EL-ERIAN: So they also use inventories, but also they found ways to reduce domestic consumption, and as you know, they had moved quite a way towards
electrification. So structurally, they had more agility than many other countries.
QUEST: What do we make of this inflation number now coming down? Are you in the school that believes the worst has been seen? Even if we hover around
the $90.00 to $100.00 a barrel for the foreseeable future?
EL-ERIAN: If we hover around $90.00, I think the worst has been seen. There were three drivers -- tariffs, they are behind us; oil, you've had the
adjustment, there may be a bit more; and then the third element is the A.I.-related inflation. We don't talk enough about that. There are lots of
data centers being built. Those come with higher productivity down the road.
So if you're worried about inflation as a standalone problem, the bad parts of inflation are mostly behind us, and what is left is a better part
because it comes with higher supply down the road.
QUEST: I am not letting you off the hook here. You're going to have to nail your colors to the mast here, Mohamed. Where do you stand on this whole
productivity from A.I. gain? Is it Greenspan's internet productivity gains or do you see that it is not -- they are more illusory.
EL-ERIAN: The potential is even more than the Greenspan productivity gain, because it is not just a general purpose technology like electricity, but
it is what James Manyika of Google likes to say, it is an inventor of invention or if you want to use a technical term, recursive self-
improvement, it improves itself, so the productivity potential is huge.
The problem is we are so captivated, Richard, by those working on A.I. that we don't focus enough on working with A.I. adoption, diffusion.
So, I am potentially really enthusiastic it can be more than Greenspan, but I wish that more attention was being paid on the adoption element of this
equation.
QUEST: I am grateful that you are with us tonight, sir. Thank you very much. Mohamed El-Erian, a good friend of the program joining us tonight.
A U.S. judge has temporarily paused the merger of Paramount and CNN's parent company, Warner Bros Discovery, WBD. Twelve states requested the
delay as part of the legal challenge. The judge granted them a temporary restraining order, at least until early August, when the full case will be
heard.
Paramount says it is confident the states' antitrust lawsuit is without merit. Shares in both companies were lower and the price is $31.00 a share.
Now trading at $25.00.
Sara Fischer is with me.
Not only have we had this problem, though, of the share price, you've got this ticking time bomb that for every -- you know, by October, for every
quarter at October, Paramount has to pay $650 million or so to WBD. It is looking perhaps more likely that at least they will have to make one
payment.
SARA FISCHER, CNN SENIOR MEDIA ANALYST: Yes, I think that's probably right. And remember, another consequence of this delay, aside from the payment is
that you're buying time now, while this deal is not closed for regulators around the world to continue evaluating the deal.
So you can imagine, Richard, in the U.K., the Competition Markets Authority, they've said that they are probing this. The European Union is
taking a look at this.
If there is an injunction that is set forth and this deal pause happens longer than 14 days, you're giving all of those regulators time to probe
the deal. So, this is a very big problem for Paramount. They still feel confident that the deal will close, but it is going to continue to be very
messy.
QUEST: Really the focus is on how the Justice Department just waved it through. I mean, to our best-know and understanding, there was nowhere near
the rigor and scrutiny that previous ones -- and if you look at the case of the attorneys general, it is very much based -- it is not based on, you
know, Paramount is friends with Donald Trump. It is based on classic, as William Cohen writes, it is based on classic antitrust. This thing is too
big.
[16:25:07 ]
FISCHER: Absolutely. So there is all these people saying, oh, well, what Paramount's political leanings mean and for CNN, that's going to influence
the state attorneys general.
Richard, even if it did influence them, you can't put forth a serious antitrust lawsuit without addressing legacy antitrust issues. Notice how
this does not talk about streaming. Notice that this does not talk about data. This is all about markets that the Justice Department or the
antitrust regulators is used to evaluating, things like theatrical distribution studios and cable.
And so this lawsuit, I think it does make sense from an antitrust perspective. However, I am skeptical that the case is going to be super
strong for a few reasons. I mean, one, we allowed two major studios in 2019 to come together between Fox and Disney, the Amazon-MGM deal eventually
came together, so the studios bit is a little bit tougher. And then cable networks, you know, they are a legacy and dying medium, and it is hard to
say because we are on cable right here, but it is a tough argument to make. I think the Justice Department greenlighting this doesn't shock me and the
states trying to combat it also doesn't shock me because some of those states have people employed in their jurisdictions.
QUEST: But at the end of the day, what is that old joke about? No, sir. We are just arguing about the price. At the end of the day, doesn't it really
come down to -- is Paramount going to have to make some divestitures from the merged companies to get it through? Is this is just -- the things that
arguably the Justice Department would have done in previous times now, maybe this lawsuit might -- I mean, you know, to be fair to the Ellisons,
they've said that CNN will not be sold off. CNN is not a bargaining chip. Well, you know, let's wait and see how that goes down the road.
But at the end of the day, are we talking about the price to get this done?
FISCHER: Okay. In the Biden administration, the antitrust regulators at the FTC and the DOJ said that we are not going to do remedies. We are either
going to sue to block a deal or we are going to let it through.
The Trump administration feels much more amenable to remedies, and we've seen them approve some deals like Nexstar-Tegna, with some divestitures and
things like that. The question, Richard becomes, what would you even divest? Right.
You can have two sorts of remedies -- a behavioral remedy which says you have to promise not to do something or structural remedy where you would
say, all right, you have to divest something to get this through.
If your main argument is that this combination of two studios is going to be bad for competition, what would you divest? Are you going to divest half
a studio? No.
Now, you could try to say that they should divest some cable networks. But if you take a look at what the states are arguing, the vast majority of
what they are putting their finger on, the pulse is the studio consolidation. I just don't know what you would divest in this situation.
QUEST: We will find out. It has got some legs to run there, Sara, and you'll be helping us understand it.
Good of you to pop in. Thank you very much. Grateful.
Now, I do need to bring you Paramount's response to this. As you might expect, Paramount says, "This merger is lawful, pro-competitive and will
benefit consumers, creators, workers, and the entertainment industry."
A reminder that the judge will hear the hearing on August the 3rd, I believe.
Coming up after the break, what it takes to get 350 performers on and off the stage in 11 minutes. The producer of FIFA's World Cup halftime show is
with me after the break. We are delighted to have him.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:31:56]
QUEST: Spain's football team's back home, and they are celebrating the World Cup championship in real style.
They return to Madrid. You know, they beat Argentina 1-0. It was a tense final, and fittingly, a hero's welcome, riding through the streets of the
capital in the ubiquitous open-air bus.
It wasn't only sports stars in the limelight. Top music acts took to the pitch for the World Cup's first half-time show. In 11 minutes, more than
350 performers, there was Madonna and The Muppets, participating in what was the most watched halftime show in history?
And Hugh Evans is the co-founder of Global Citizen, which produced the halftime show.
First of all, sir, thank you for being with us. I'm delighted after yesterday. I think -- were you surprised at the eyebrow raising and pearl
clutching, oh no, a halftime show! We don't do that sort of thing at the World Cup and FIFA, but you did, and you pulled it off.
HUGH EVANS, CO-FOUNDER, GLOBAL CITIZEN: Well, well, firstly, thank you, Richard. It really is an honor to be on your program today. So, thank you
for having me.
And I -- you know what, it's been amazing to see the response. You know, we were going into this, obviously, wanted to be incredibly respectful of the
game of football. That's why we condense it to 11 minutes. But I think the outcome has been extraordinary for the 2 billion people who tuned in all
around the world, it truly lit up the internet.
And so, was I surprised with the response? I think, what we were surprised is just how many people from all around the world embraced it. You know,
when you -- I saw today across all the entertainment press, just people saying, OK, you know, you managed to pull this off, and the whole world
came together as one.
And for me, the thing that mattered most was the fact that it actually made a difference. I didn't want to go into this unless it made a difference.
QUEST: Right. Now, I want -- you said -- you used the phrase there. In your words, not mine. You pulled it off, and I'm wondering, the pulling of it
off, do you think it was the children? Do you think it was The Muppets? Do you think it was all the various quirky bits that were wonderful glue in a
sense to hold together the stars, the Madonnas and the Shakiras of the world?
EVANS: It's such a -- such a beautiful question.
I think that yes, you had obviously the world's greatest artists from Madonna, Shakira with Burna Boy, BTS, Justin Bieber, and then you had
Coldplay. But as you say, I think it was the Gustavo Dudamel with, you know, obviously, the New York Philharmonic and the Simon Bolivar Orchestra
all the way from Venezuela. And then, you had alongside Shakira, the Ghetto Kids, and then alongside Coldplay you had PS22 choir from Staten Island in
New York.
So, I think you are right. There was this extraordinary glue, and then, you also had the Muppets and Sesame Street United for only the second time
since Jim Henson's passing.
[16:35:02]
And so, these elements all made it truly historic and had such a resounding impact for people all over the world. And I think that's what also made it
go so viral all over the Internet today.
QUEST: How -- what was the most difficult part? The single most difficult part. Now, it's over. Now it's over, and there is success in the rearview
mirror. What was the hardest bit?
EVANS: Well, that's -- I'm going to be honest with you, Richard. It was the hardest project I've ever worked on in my life. And I was speaking with
Chris Martin this morning of Coldplay, and we were reflecting on that reality that we -- everyone involved, from the amazing producers like, you
know, Hamish Hamilton, who's produced more Super Bowl halftimes and more Olympic opening ceremonies than any director on the planet, through to Guy
Carrington, Ben Winston, the whole team that came together, everyone poured their heart and soul into this. And so, I think it's one of those projects
that now it's in the rearview mirror.
We are just happy that it's going to lead to the impact we wanted, which is that 400,000 kids, or the equivalent of five stadiums full of kids, are
going to get access to education as a result.
QUEST: Is it, and you're nailing your colors to your mast here, is it repeatable in four years' time, or is it a uniquely Americana phenomenon
that worked because these games were in America?
EVANS: Well, you know what?
You know we had -- we had all continents represented in the lineup except for Antarctica. So, this was a truly global affair.
I'm Australian and dual citizen with the United States. Some of our producers are from Britain, some of our producers are from Africa. Our team
is from all over the world, and so, I think that what we are seeing is that football is the world sport. It is the sport that truly does unite the
world.
And I think what we saw throughout the entire -- the entire World Cup is that we have far more in common than that which divides us. And so, yes, I
think in four years' time there could be another halftime. Maybe it would take a different tonality when it's not going to be in the United States
anymore. But I think what it provides is an opportunity when 2 billion people are united as one to actually make a difference.
QUEST: And here is a rhetorical question. Who do you think is oldy? You don't have to answer this one. Who do you think is older, The Muppets or
Madonna? Now, that is a question for you to be thinking about. I'll give you the answer after the break, a little bit later. Well, I'll tell you
now. It's actually The Muppets, did you know? The Muppets are 71 years old? So, there you are.
EVANS: The Muppets are. Well, I mean, they are -- they are legends. All of them are legends, honestly.
QUEST: They're absolutely. And you did it brilliantly yesterday. I was driving on Route 66, as we were finishing filming. We pulled over to watch
it. So, thank you sir.
EVANS: Oh wow! Thank you, Richard. You are awesome. That is so cool.
(CROSSTALK)
QUEST: And thank you. Thank you for joining us tonight. We appreciate it. Thank you.
Now, Europe's largest airline group is warning British travelers to prepare for long lines at airports. You know the story. It is -- it's this fiasco
of an E.U. border control system. My words, no one else is.
Ryanair says the hotspots are where they are seeing the worst delays. The reason there are no hotspots in Greece is because they have stopped
collecting biometric information from U.K. nationals. It is hit or miss, demonstrated by this traveler getting into Rome earlier this month.
What's to blame? Is it the kiosks which take too long to operate, or out of date? Sorry, out of service. A problem for the chief executive of Fraport
Greece, Alexander Zinell. Alexander is with me, managing 14 airports in Greece and its islands is with me now.
You are lucky. You are very lucky. The authorities decided to turn it off for the British visitors for the U.K. So, that's a huge weight off the
mind. But in a nutshell, what is wrong with this system?
ALEXANDER ZINELL, CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, FRAPORT GREECE: Good afternoon. Thank you for having me on the show. It's a great opportunity to explain a
bit what's happening with this system.
Now, we are not only lucky; we are, I think, very practical and pragmatic. The Greek government is extremely pragmatic. They understood that this
would not work throughout the summer, and that's why they turned off the biometric data for U.K. travelers.
What is wrong with the system? Per se, nothing is wrong with the system. It -- it's a good system to have. It's an effective and efficient border
management system that we all countries and all blocks should have. But it's not yet where it should be in terms of performance. It's simply too
slow.
It takes too much time to capture data at the point of border crossing, and that causes delays, because our facilities were never set up for these kind
of processing times.
QUEST: Right. But I would also argue that it is too complicated for the various -- there is a range of options when you get to the border.
[16:40:10]
Whether you are in Malaga or whether you're in Paris or whether you're, you're never sure what you're going to face. You are never sure, am I going
to have to do biometrics? I was in Malaga last week. There is just queues and machines and lines and signs, Schengen, non-Schengen. Those machines
for those people. Those machines over there for these people. Have you registered? Have you not registered? This is the reality of the chaos of
the situation.
ZINELL: I can only agree with you. It's -- this is what we are facing right now, because the system has -- no, it's not a system that has been designed
by airports. It has been designed by the European Commission for all member states, for the entire bloc.
So, what we are facing, we are, you know, collateral damage for a system that is not -- that has not been fit into the reality of airport and border
crossings.
(CROSSTALK)
QUEST: Right.
ZINELL: It's as simple as that. It just takes the -- what you mentioned is exactly that. It takes -- it's too complicated. It takes too much time when
the passenger arrives at the border crossing.
If you look at other countries, whether it's the U.K., the U.S., Canada, they all capture all this information before the traveler even gets on the
plane.
So, you capture all this data. You process it. You send the traveler a number or a verification, and then, you travel, and then, you use a
machine, and you -- cross the border in seconds.
QUEST: I -- we are at the end of our due, but I refuse to end on a sour note of European bureaucracy and failure. Let's talk instead. Is it going
to be a good summer in Greece?
ZINELL: Oh, the summer is so far very, very good. Considering the fact that we have a war in Ukraine going into its fifth year, that we have a
difficult situation in the Eastern Mediterranean, we have a war and a military conflict in the Gulf.
Tourism in Greece is doing remarkably well. Very resilient.
(CROSSTALK)
QUEST: Right.
ZINELL: We are up 5.5 percent year to date. So, it's doing surprisingly well.
QUEST: I was going to ask you which is your favorite Greek island, but I realize that could cost you your job from all the other islands if we go
down that particular road.
Good to see you, sir.
ZINELL: You are very right. You are very right.
QUEST: Good to see you. Thank you for joining us tonight. And that is QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for the start of a new week. Delighted to be back with you.
I'm Richard Quest.
Whenever you are up to the hours ahead, I hope it is profitable.
Coming up next, World of Wonder at the birth of civilization in Turkiye.
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[16:46:19]
QUEST (voice over): Gobekli Tepe. Is this where it all began? It is good to be back in Turkey. This time, I'm visiting somewhere completely new. It's a
corner of the country where people first lived together around 12,000 years ago.
Gobekli Tepe is an archeological site located in southeastern Turkey. It's around 20 kilometers away from the nearest city, Sanliurfa. And for
archeologists, it's long been a place of great interest and importance, because of the discoveries and the clues into how life was lived centuries,
nay millennia ago. The people who lived here were amongst the first of civilization, so they say.
Now, while all this remains an active site, it's also becoming a place attracting visitors from around the world.
NECMI KARUL, LEAD ARCHEOLOGIST, TAS TEPELER PROJECT: Good morning.
QUEST (voice over): And I am here with the man who arguably knows more about this place than any other.
KARUL: It was most probably the big lakes.
QUEST: Right.
KARUL: During the Ice Age.
QUEST: Oh, that's a long time ago.
KARUL: Yes, long time ago.
Necmi Karul is one of the world's leading experts in prehistoric archeology. He runs this site, which means we are in for a real treat.
KARUL: To be honest, you are one of the lucky person, because I don't allow too many people to go.
OK, please, come in.
QUEST (voice over): My word. The first thing I wanted to know was what the people who first inhabited this place were doing here.
QUEST: What would they have used this space for?
KARUL: Some of our colleagues thinking these are the temples.
QUEST: Right.
KARUL: But I prefer to use the name -- the terms of the communal building or special building,
QUEST: Right.
QUEST: What a real treat! What a rare, rare treat.
12,000 years. I can't even imagine.
KARUL: You see it in a belt.
QUEST (voice over): From a man of great learning, I wanted to know what he wanted to know.
QUEST: What is the question that you would like answered?
KARUL: Of course, I would ask them if there is a hierarchy between inside of the society.
QUEST: Hierarchy, yes.
KARUL: Hierarchy is going to be the main question. I would like to answer also, know the relationship between the humans, between the groups, or any
-- is there any differences between men and women?
QUEST (voice over): Well, I was quizzing Necmi. Artful Andrew was clearly listening in. And when we had a quick break from the filming, he called
home, brilliantly describing his surroundings to his young children listening back in Britain.
ARTFUL ANDREW, RICHARD QUEST TEAM: They have got the first known symbols man ever made.
[16:50:04]
QUEST (voice over): Wonderful to see Artful bringing these marvels of the world to the next generation. And hopefully one day he'll bring them here,
and they will see it all in person.
ANDREW: Absolutely incredible place.
QUEST: Well, the pillars and the --
QUEST (voice over): Standing next to these incredible monuments and listening to Necmi's interpretation, mind-boggling.
QUEST: It is so overwhelming, I can't take it in.
QUEST (voice over): I moved away from the rest of my team for a few moments. I had to get my head around what all this means, if that's even
possible.
QUEST: The reality is, I don't think that my mind can conceive 12,000 years ago. Think about it. This was all here several thousand years before the
pyramids or Stonehenge. They sort of dance around the core question of whether this is the birth of civilization.
QUEST (voice over): No one really wants to actually answer that question as a yes or no, but clearly something significant happened here.
These buildings, these properties, these were the beginning of our communities.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
QUEST (voice over): I never tire of visiting Istanbul. No matter the number of times I've been here, on every visit, this city reveals its capacity to
surprise. The boss for us. So much of life here is centered on this magnificent strait of water that divides Europe and Asia.
And to my amazement, they found something totally new for me to try.
ISIL, ISTANBUL-BASED PRODUCER: Thank you.
QUEST (voice over): Along with Isil and Artful, of course, we are all getting roped in to this one.
QUEST: I've never done this before. I'm looking forward to it in a sort of slightly terrifying way.
Go there, we go! Oh, well done. Well done, my dear.
ISIL: Thank you.
QUEST (voice over): Isil, our Istanbul-based producer, was bravely volunteered by the rest of us to go first.
QUEST: It looks jolly good fun.
ISIL: It's good fun. We will discover the Bosphorous together.
QUEST (voice over): Now, it is my turn.
QUEST: All these waves, oh! Likes from the ocean waves --
QUEST (voice over): This is different, novel, and provides a unique perspective of Istanbul.
QUEST: I'm exhausted. Oh. Oh, God, this is harder than it looks. This is such a wonderful workout.
ANDREW: It's like a spin class.
QUEST (voice over): Artful will only watch for so long before, yes, climb on board.
ANDREW: Hey, you are getting too close.
QUEST: It's wonderful. Absolutely wonderful.
ANDREW: At this stage, I don't know where Richard is going. He is going with the current, though. Bit worried he is going to end up in Europe side
of Istanbul. I'm heading back.
QUEST (voice over): Europe or Asia, take your pick. I made it back safely.
[16:55:00]
QUEST: Wasn't that fun?
ANDREW: That was really cool, actually.
QUEST: That was so cool. This is so much fun. I really enjoyed. I did love again in the heart.
QUEST (voice over): Over many memorable trips to Istanbul, on a visit four years ago, I met in person, Ahmet Kadioglu, the unofficial king of
Istanbul's world-famous spice market.
AHMET KADIOGLU, MANAGING PARTNER, HAYFENE The first time we met --
QUEST: Yes.
KADIOGLU: 2019.
QUEST: Yes.
KADIOGLU: And it was pandemic.
QUEST: Yes.
KADIOGLU: And we were thinking about if we are going to survive the pandemic.
And we are hoping that when it's all over, we will be open again with everyone.
The second time we met was post-pandemic. The e-commerce boom helped us rapidly grow, and we were doing so well. And now, we are --
QUEST (voice over): On this occasion, it was business of a different kind. I wanted to stock up my larder and enjoy some of my favorite Turkish tea.
QUEST: Where is the Turkish tea?
KADIOGLU: Oh, it's not (INAUDIBLE). Where is the Turkish tea, friends?
QUEST: The Turkish tea? Not too strong. Not too strong. Weak, weak, weak.
KADIOGLU: So, when you have a guest, the tea pretty much appears out of nowhere.
QUEST: And everyone thinks that's really nice.
KADIOGLU: Yes.
Since you are not against a friends, you have to ask for it.
QUEST: Oh, well, I did.
KADIOGLU: Yes.
QUEST: Because I remember from being here before, there is an entire industry within the market of Turkish tea.
KADIOGLU: Oh, the Turkish tea.
QUEST: It is such an institution. What a little strong for me. It's too strong. Weak Englishman.
I will put hairs on your chest.
KADIOGLU: Should I bring some milk for you?
QUEST (voice over): Ahmet is very astute. His knowledge of spices, second to none. So, which is his favorite?
KADIOGLU: This is called isot or urfa pepper.
QUEST: Right.
KADIOGLU: It's basically roasted chili pepper.
QUEST: Oh, do I taste it or do I just smell it?
KADIOGLU: I would taste it. This is my favorite spice in the world.
QUEST: Why?
KADIOGLU: It's very complicated, complex flavor that you can't taste in anything else. It's not very hot. It's a little bit hot.
QUEST (voice over): Hot! It nearly blew my head off.
Back to normal, and I set Ahmet a challenge. Could he create the perfect spice rub for my barbecues back home.
KADIOGLU: We'll put some cumin, not too much, not to overpower. Mild peppers to add the flavor without the heat. Let me put some garlic in it,
and let's put some onion as well.
A little bit of smoked mild paprika to add that barbecue taste. A little bit of turmeric to add some colors. This is class four taste: the spice
mix.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
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END
